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Computer software to show projected sides

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  • Dave Cannell
    I trying to draw up plans for a boat that I have minimal demensions for. This boat does NOT have slab sides, the beam at the bottom of the hull is narrower
    Message 1 of 16 , Sep 20, 2005
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      I trying to draw up plans for a boat that I have minimal demensions for.
      This boat does NOT have slab sides, the beam at the bottom of the hull is
      narrower than at the top and neither the bow or stern transoms are as wide
      as the max beam.

      I'm looking for some software that will be able to show be the 'developed'
      dimensions of the sides, what the ply will look like flat so I can cut it
      out and then bend it into place.

      Thanks, Dave
      --
    • Ron Schroeder
      Try: http://www.carlsondesign.com/#Fun_Shareware Hulls.exe will do what you want. Ron ... From: Dave Cannell To:
      Message 2 of 16 , Sep 20, 2005
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        Try: http://www.carlsondesign.com/#Fun_Shareware

        Hulls.exe will do what you want.

        Ron

        ----- Original Message -----
        From: "Dave Cannell" <dcannell@...>
        To: <Michalak@yahoogroups.com>
        Sent: Tuesday, September 20, 2005 7:43 AM
        Subject: [Michalak] Computer software to show projected sides


        > I trying to draw up plans for a boat that I have minimal demensions for.
        > This boat does NOT have slab sides, the beam at the bottom of the hull is
        > narrower than at the top and neither the bow or stern transoms are as wide
        > as the max beam.
        >
        > I'm looking for some software that will be able to show be the 'developed'
        > dimensions of the sides, what the ply will look like flat so I can cut it
        > out and then bend it into place.
        >
        > Thanks, Dave
      • Stefan Probst
        ... If you only need the panels developed and can live with Hulls limitations (in your case probably not many), then you can go with Hulls. Quick to learn. If
        Message 3 of 16 , Sep 20, 2005
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          --- Dave Cannell <dcannell@v...> wrote:
          > I'm looking for some software that will be able to show be the
          > 'developed' dimensions of the sides, what the ply will look like
          > flat so I can cut it out and then bend it into place.

          If you only need the panels developed and can live with Hulls'
          limitations (in your case probably not many), then you can go with
          Hulls. Quick to learn. If you need more, including colour print of the
          panels (e.g. to make a nice model), then you might try FREE!ship.

          http://www.freeship.org/
          Download from:
          https://sourceforge.net/project/showfiles.php?group_id=140466

          Stefan
        • Bruce Hallman
          ... I have used Hulls.exe to build a couple boats and more than a dozen models. Very steep learning curve, but once you get over the hump, it is a quick and
          Message 4 of 16 , Sep 20, 2005
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            > Hulls.exe will do what you want.
            > Ron

            I have used Hulls.exe to build a couple boats and
            more than a dozen models. Very steep learning
            curve, but once you get over the hump, it is a
            quick and effective way to get the expanded
            panel and frame dimensions for boat hulls.

            I recommend learning the program by working
            with models. I print the panel layouts to
            Manila cardboard, cut with scissors, and taped
            together models as a way to develop and
            prototype various hull shapes.

            http://community.webshots.com/photo/347045741/347045741GUeBxT
            http://community.webshots.com/photo/343515300/343515300PpRbka
            http://community.webshots.com/photo/360982713/360984211SnIwsx
            http://community.webshots.com/photo/373315342/373315342FUYhMP
          • john h wright
            Looking at the pictures, You sure have got more than your two cents worth from Hulls! Is the ballast to scale also? I can t imagine not building a model of
            Message 5 of 16 , Sep 20, 2005
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              Looking at the pictures, You sure have got more than your two cents
              worth from Hulls! Is the ballast to scale also? I can't imagine not
              building a model of any boat that I propose to build. It is so easy to
              do with the real heavy paper. My printer does not like it but will
              tolerate it.

              On Tue, 20 Sep 2005 08:44:28 -0700 Bruce Hallman <bruce@...>
              writes:
              > Hulls.exe will do what you want.
              > Ron

              I have used Hulls.exe to build a couple boats and
              more than a dozen models. Very steep learning
              curve, but once you get over the hump, it is a
              quick and effective way to get the expanded
              panel and frame dimensions for boat hulls.

              I recommend learning the program by working
              with models. I print the panel layouts to
              Manila cardboard, cut with scissors, and taped
              together models as a way to develop and
              prototype various hull shapes.

              http://community.webshots.com/photo/347045741/347045741GUeBxT
              http://community.webshots.com/photo/343515300/343515300PpRbka
              http://community.webshots.com/photo/360982713/360984211SnIwsx
              http://community.webshots.com/photo/373315342/373315342FUYhMP




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            • Bruce Hallman
              ... Yes, more or less, just add coinage until she settles down to a reasonable waterline. Hulls will make the calculations of the displacement at any given
              Message 6 of 16 , Sep 20, 2005
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                > worth from Hulls! Is the ballast to scale also?

                Yes, more or less, just add coinage until she settles
                down to a reasonable waterline. Hulls will make the
                calculations of the displacement at any given waterline.

                > My printer does not like it but will
                > tolerate it.

                My laser printer has a 'back door' that allows
                card stock to run straight through, but Manila
                stock [salvaged from old file folders] actually
                will run through the normal curved path.
                [HP Laserjet 4000]

                One revelation I had while prototyping hull shapes,
                is that 'being a boat' is not magical. If it *looks*
                like a boat, it *is* a boat. Another was; that building
                lapstrake hulls with epoxy [and no sheathing] can
                be just a quick or quicker than boxy plywood boats.
              • john h wright
                One revelation I had while prototyping hull shapes, is that being a boat is not magical. If it *looks* like a boat, it *is* a boat. Another was; that
                Message 7 of 16 , Sep 20, 2005
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                  One revelation I had while prototyping hull shapes,
                  is that 'being a boat' is not magical. If it *looks*
                  like a boat, it *is* a boat. Another was; that building
                  lapstrake hulls with epoxy [and no sheathing] can
                  be just a quick or quicker than boxy plywood boats.


                  Bruce Hallman, Yes! Boats are very loving and forgiving if taken care of
                  but, damn, they can sure bite when mistreated! I have watched and read
                  you for a few months and value your contributions to this boating
                  community.

                  Thanks for the hint! I love the looks and shape of lapstrake and have
                  dismissed it as requiring more skill and patients than available around
                  here. == I will give it a try! I have never build a boat from a plan
                  (not counting PDRacer) and now is a good time to start!



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                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • robrohdeszudy
                  ... That s intriguing. I ve never built glued lapstrake. Can you tell us more about how it s as quick or quicker than nail & glue or stitch & tape? I can
                  Message 8 of 16 , Sep 21, 2005
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                    > like a boat, it *is* a boat. Another was; that building
                    > lapstrake hulls with epoxy [and no sheathing] can
                    > be just a quick or quicker than boxy plywood boats.

                    That's intriguing. I've never built glued lapstrake. Can you tell us
                    more about how it's as quick or quicker than nail & glue or stitch &
                    tape? I can almost imagine how that might be true (more cuts but
                    less "glop" to grind off), but I'm not quite there.
                    --Rob
                  • Bruce Hallman
                    ... The reason it can be faster is that the laps can lap and allow you to work to a lower accuracy (1 +/-) [and thereby work more quickly] versus a plywood
                    Message 9 of 16 , Sep 21, 2005
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                      > > lapstrake hulls with epoxy [and no sheathing] can
                      > > be just a quick or quicker than boxy plywood boats.
                      >
                      > That's intriguing. I've never built glued lapstrake. Can you tell us
                      > more about how it's as quick or quicker than nail & glue or stitch &
                      > tape?
                      > --Rob

                      The reason it can be faster is that the laps can 'lap' and allow
                      you to work to a lower accuracy (1"+/-) [and thereby work
                      more quickly] versus a plywood panel boat that require
                      accurances more like 1/4" +/-.

                      Also, omitting the fiberglass sheathing saves 50% of the time
                      (or more!) plus it avoids the sanding which I hate!
                      You get a lighter weight boat too, without sheathing.

                      Here is a plywood lapstrake boat I just built in 44 manhours.
                      Started May 29 finished June 12, 2005..

                      http://community.webshots.com/photo/360982713/373315342FUYhMP
                      http://community.webshots.com/album/360982713bZwutE

                      Of course, if you build a plywood lapstrake boat to 1/4" accuracy
                      with fiberglass sheathing, it WOULD take longer.

                      To my eye at least, I don't see 1 inch errors in a curvy boat.
                      Indeed, if you look at the photos you can spot a 2 inch error
                      I made in the laps of the strakes port versus starboard, but
                      most people can't see that error, and it certainly doesn't impair
                      the function of the boat.
                    • Chris Hill
                      ... I figured it was on purpose! I thought now why did he do that? and had come up with at least one plausible reason... CH
                      Message 10 of 16 , Sep 21, 2005
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                        On Wednesday, September 21, 2005, at 03:50 PM, Bruce Hallman wrote:
                        >
                        > Indeed, if you look at the photos you can spot a 2 inch error
                        > I made in the laps of the strakes port versus starboard, but
                        > most people can't see that error, and it certainly doesn't impair
                        > the function of the boat.

                        I figured it was on purpose! I thought "now why did he do that?" and
                        had come up with at least one plausible reason...

                        CH


                        ************************************************************************
                        Christopher E. Hill
                        Biology Department
                        Coastal Carolina University
                        Conway, SC 29528-1954
                        chill AT coastal.edu
                        http://kingfish.coastal.edu/biology/faculty/chill.htm
                      • Bruce Hallman
                        ... Well, it was on purpose. I was deliberately in a hurry!
                        Message 11 of 16 , Sep 21, 2005
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                          > I figured it was on purpose!

                          Well, it was on purpose. I was deliberately in a hurry!
                        • john h wright
                          Bruce, Thank you for the picture links. Now I have to figure out what to build! On Wed, 21 Sep 2005 12:50:10 -0700 Bruce Hallman
                          Message 12 of 16 , Sep 21, 2005
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                            Bruce, Thank you for the picture links. Now I have to figure out
                            what to build!

                            On Wed, 21 Sep 2005 12:50:10 -0700 Bruce Hallman <bruce@...>
                            writes:
                            > > lapstrake hulls with epoxy [and no sheathing] can
                            > > be just a quick or quicker than boxy plywood boats.
                            >
                            > That's intriguing. I've never built glued lapstrake. Can you tell us
                            > more about how it's as quick or quicker than nail & glue or stitch &
                            > tape?
                            > --Rob

                            The reason it can be faster is that the laps can 'lap' and allow
                            you to work to a lower accuracy (1"+/-) [and thereby work
                            more quickly] versus a plywood panel boat that require
                            accurances more like 1/4" +/-.

                            Also, omitting the fiberglass sheathing saves 50% of the time
                            (or more!) plus it avoids the sanding which I hate!
                            You get a lighter weight boat too, without sheathing.

                            Here is a plywood lapstrake boat I just built in 44 manhours.
                            Started May 29 finished June 12, 2005..

                            http://community.webshots.com/photo/360982713/373315342FUYhMP
                            http://community.webshots.com/album/360982713bZwutE

                            Of course, if you build a plywood lapstrake boat to 1/4" accuracy
                            with fiberglass sheathing, it WOULD take longer.

                            To my eye at least, I don't see 1 inch errors in a curvy boat.
                            Indeed, if you look at the photos you can spot a 2 inch error
                            I made in the laps of the strakes port versus starboard, but
                            most people can't see that error, and it certainly doesn't impair
                            the function of the boat.




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                          • robrohdeszudy
                            Good to hear it! I ve been toying with making a Herreshoff 17 for years. Maybe now I ll do it. I was gonna build a Batto (Culler Otter), but I think the
                            Message 13 of 16 , Sep 22, 2005
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                              Good to hear it! I've been toying with making a Herreshoff 17 for
                              years. Maybe now I'll do it. I was gonna build a Batto (Culler
                              Otter), but I think the Herreshoff 17 might be as fast or faster AND
                              allow a passenger.

                              So...the nitty gritty:

                              What are the dimensions of your boat including weight
                              What plywood did you use
                              Any thoughts on the performance?

                              Thanks!!!
                              --Rob

                              --- In Michalak@yahoogroups.com, Bruce Hallman <bruce@h...> wrote:
                              > > > lapstrake hulls with epoxy [and no sheathing] can
                              > > > be just a quick or quicker than boxy plywood boats.
                              > >
                              > > That's intriguing. I've never built glued lapstrake. Can you
                              tell us
                              > > more about how it's as quick or quicker than nail & glue or
                              stitch &
                              > > tape?
                              > > --Rob
                              >
                              > The reason it can be faster is that the laps can 'lap' and allow
                              > you to work to a lower accuracy (1"+/-) [and thereby work
                              > more quickly] versus a plywood panel boat that require
                              > accurances more like 1/4" +/-.
                              >
                              > Also, omitting the fiberglass sheathing saves 50% of the time
                              > (or more!) plus it avoids the sanding which I hate!
                              > You get a lighter weight boat too, without sheathing.
                              >
                              > Here is a plywood lapstrake boat I just built in 44 manhours.
                              > Started May 29 finished June 12, 2005..
                              >
                              > http://community.webshots.com/photo/360982713/373315342FUYhMP
                              > http://community.webshots.com/album/360982713bZwutE
                              >
                              > Of course, if you build a plywood lapstrake boat to 1/4" accuracy
                              > with fiberglass sheathing, it WOULD take longer.
                              >
                              > To my eye at least, I don't see 1 inch errors in a curvy boat.
                              > Indeed, if you look at the photos you can spot a 2 inch error
                              > I made in the laps of the strakes port versus starboard, but
                              > most people can't see that error, and it certainly doesn't impair
                              > the function of the boat.
                            • Dave Cannell
                              Just want to thank everyone for the feedback on this subject. I ve been playing with Hulls a bit. Haven t gotten anything useful yet but I have produced some
                              Message 14 of 16 , Sep 22, 2005
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                                Just want to thank everyone for the feedback on this subject. I've been
                                playing with Hulls a bit. Haven't gotten anything useful yet but I have
                                produced some interesting shapes 8-)

                                Pirate_Dave
                                --
                                ><> dcannell@... <><
                                ><> go fly a kite <><
                                ><> and may the wind at your back not be your own... <><
                                ----------------------------------------------------------------------
                              • Chris Hill
                                ... OK, so if you don t sheath the bottom in glass and epoxy, what do you do - just prime and paint? What kind of paint? I m hoping that the vireo14 I m
                                Message 15 of 16 , Oct 4, 2005
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                                  On Wednesday, September 21, 2005, at 03:50 PM, Bruce Hallman wrote:
                                  >
                                  > Also, omitting the fiberglass sheathing saves 50% of the time
                                  > (or more!) plus it avoids the sanding which I hate!
                                  > You get a lighter weight boat too, without sheathing.

                                  OK, so if you don't sheath the bottom in glass and epoxy, what do you
                                  do - just prime and paint? What kind of paint? I'm hoping that the
                                  vireo14 I'm building lasts a while, and was planning on sheathing the
                                  bottom with 4 oz. glass, but would consider skipping that if I were
                                  confident that the primer and paint (over cheap 1/4" lauan) would be
                                  sufficiently watertight.

                                  Chris
                                • wilhelm7.geo
                                  Hello, I built my Piccup Pram of 5mm-1/4 luann. I glassed the bottom panels using polyester resin (relatively cheaper than epoxy) but not the bilge boards.
                                  Message 16 of 16 , Oct 4, 2005
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                                    Hello,

                                    I built my Piccup Pram of 5mm-1/4" luann. I glassed the bottom panels
                                    using polyester resin (relatively cheaper than epoxy) but not the
                                    bilge boards. The bilge panels wept on the water. I then took it home
                                    and glassed the bilges up to the side joints. No more weeping. So I'm
                                    saying that cheapo luann will weep in constant exposure to a body of
                                    water. I have not had the problem with 1/4" fir ply on my Musicbox2's
                                    sides which are painted with gray polyester porch/floor paint. Either
                                    glass the bottom or build with fir plywood. That's my two cents.

                                    Will


                                    --- In Michalak@yahoogroups.com, Chris Hill <chill@c...> wrote:
                                    >
                                    > On Wednesday, September 21, 2005, at 03:50 PM, Bruce Hallman wrote:
                                    > >
                                    > > Also, omitting the fiberglass sheathing saves 50% of the time
                                    > > (or more!) plus it avoids the sanding which I hate!
                                    > > You get a lighter weight boat too, without sheathing.
                                    >
                                    > OK, so if you don't sheath the bottom in glass and epoxy, what do you
                                    > do - just prime and paint? What kind of paint? I'm hoping that the
                                    > vireo14 I'm building lasts a while, and was planning on sheathing the
                                    > bottom with 4 oz. glass, but would consider skipping that if I were
                                    > confident that the primer and paint (over cheap 1/4" lauan) would be
                                    > sufficiently watertight.
                                    >
                                    > Chris
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