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"Middle Eastern" DNA

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  • Sam
    What are we to make of Middle Eastern dna. My Family Finder on FTDNA indicated I have 30.8% Middle Eastern dna. Frankly, I was astounded at the high percentage
    Message 1 of 16 , Aug 13, 2013
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      What are we to make of Middle Eastern dna. My Family Finder on FTDNA indicated I have 30.8% Middle Eastern dna. Frankly, I was astounded at the high percentage given that I am a descendant of old Hispano families here in NM.
      Is this an indicator of semitic, possibly "Crypto-Jewish" heritage that has been the cause of considerable controversy here? Does it point to Moorish heritage from the Iberian peninsula?
      I know a number of Hispanos here have a high percentage of Middle Eastern dna reported but I haven't seen the issue directly addressed.
      Can anyone shed some light on this?
      Sam Dominguez
    • sangerjaime@...
      Sam, My understanding per the book With ALL Arms by Carl Laurence Duaine, Monclova Coahuila was the staging ground by Onate for his expeditions to New Mexico
      Message 2 of 16 , Aug 13, 2013
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        Sam,

        My understanding per the book "With ALL Arms" by Carl Laurence Duaine, Monclova Coahuila was the staging ground by Onate for his expeditions to New Mexico in the 1590's.  Monclova, back then was know as a Sephardic haven.  I think there were two failed expeditions  to NM, prior to the successful one in 1598.  Many of the colonists in these initial failed settlements returned to Monclova.  I relay this to all because my Rendon line hails from Monclova via Caderetya and Cerralvo Nuevo Leon since circa 1570. My FTDNA autosomal results show 32% Middle Eastern, broken down further to Jewish and Palestinian ancestry.  My paternal Hernandez Y is Semitic-E1b1b1a1a  (V12).  May I ask you Sam, what is your haplogroup/haplotype? 

        Thanks,

        Jaime Rendon Hernandez


        -----Original Message-----
        From: Sam <sfdoming@...>
        To: MexicoDNAProject <MexicoDNAProject@yahoogroups.com>
        Sent: Tue, Aug 13, 2013 8:35 am
        Subject: [MexicoDNAProject] "Middle Eastern" DNA

         
        What are we to make of Middle Eastern dna. My Family Finder on FTDNA indicated I have 30.8% Middle Eastern dna. Frankly, I was astounded at the high percentage given that I am a descendant of old Hispano families here in NM.
        Is this an indicator of semitic, possibly "Crypto-Jewish" heritage that has been the cause of considerable controversy here? Does it point to Moorish heritage from the Iberian peninsula?
        I know a number of Hispanos here have a high percentage of Middle Eastern dna reported but I haven't seen the issue directly addressed.
        Can anyone shed some light on this?
        Sam Dominguez

      • Samuel Dominguez
        Thanks, Jaime. My Dominguez Y is R1b1 (R-SRY2627) and my MTDNA is Haplo A which traces to Bernardina Vasquez, a mestiza, who was married to an Onate soldier
        Message 3 of 16 , Aug 13, 2013
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          Thanks, Jaime. My Dominguez Y is R1b1 (R-SRY2627) and my MTDNA is Haplo A which traces to Bernardina Vasquez, a mestiza, who was married to an Onate soldier (speaking of Onate).
          Sam
           


        • sangerjaime@...
          Same here Sam. My MTDNA is A. If you have not read the book by Duaine, it is a must read for researchers of Northeast Mexico, Southeast Texas and New Mexico.
          Message 4 of 16 , Aug 13, 2013
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            Same here Sam.  My MTDNA is A.  If you have not read the book by Duaine, it is a must read for researchers of Northeast Mexico, Southeast Texas and New Mexico.

            -----Original Message-----
            From: Samuel Dominguez <sfdoming@...>
            To: MexicoDNAProject <MexicoDNAProject@yahoogroups.com>
            Sent: Tue, Aug 13, 2013 9:12 am
            Subject: Re: [MexicoDNAProject] "Middle Eastern" DNA

             
            Thanks, Jaime. My Dominguez Y is R1b1 (R-SRY2627) and my MTDNA is Haplo A which traces to Bernardina Vasquez, a mestiza, who was married to an Onate soldier (speaking of Onate).
            Sam
             


          • Samuel Dominguez
            I very much appreciate the referral. I will get a copy. S
            Message 5 of 16 , Aug 13, 2013
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              I very much appreciate the referral. I will get a copy.
              S
               

               
            • idiganthro1
              I have what may be a dumb question regarding the Middle Eastern results in population finder. My breakdown is 52.21% European (French, Finnish, Orcadian,
              Message 6 of 16 , Aug 14, 2013
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                I have what may be a dumb question regarding the "Middle Eastern" results in population finder.

                My breakdown is
                52.21% European (French, Finnish, Orcadian, Russian)
                14.68 Native American (Mayan, Columbian)
                33.13% Middle Eastern (Adygei, Jewish)

                With such a large Middle Eastern component why aren't any of my family finder matches Middle Eastern or Jewish? The most common seem to be German, English and Mexican with NONE listing Middle Eastern or Jewish origins. Approximately 36-40% of all my matches are Mexican. Is this because of a disproportunate number of people testing from certain ethnic groups?

                Thanks,
                Annette

                P.S. I am an adoptee with little info about my background. I was told bio-mom was European (English/German- obviously correct) and now it seems bio-dad was Mexican instead of Italian as I'd been told. Wish I had more info to help put all these pieces together!

                --- In MexicoDNAProject@yahoogroups.com, "Sam" <sfdoming@...> wrote:
                >
                > What are we to make of Middle Eastern dna. My Family Finder on FTDNA indicated I have 30.8% Middle Eastern dna. Frankly, I was astounded at the high percentage given that I am a descendant of old Hispano families here in NM.
                > Is this an indicator of semitic, possibly "Crypto-Jewish" heritage that has been the cause of considerable controversy here? Does it point to Moorish heritage from the Iberian peninsula?
                > I know a number of Hispanos here have a high percentage of Middle Eastern dna reported but I haven't seen the issue directly addressed.
                > Can anyone shed some light on this?
                > Sam Dominguez
                >
              • sangerjaime@...
                Annette, I do not think FTDNA allows one to access the ethnic percenages of your Fact Finder cousins? Those autosomal cousins would have to voluntarily share
                Message 7 of 16 , Aug 14, 2013
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                  Annette,

                  I do not think FTDNA allows one to access the ethnic percenages of your Fact Finder cousins?  Those autosomal cousins would have to voluntarily share that with you, I would think. 

                  Jaime


                  -----Original Message-----
                  From: idiganthro1 <idiganthro@...>
                  To: MexicoDNAProject <MexicoDNAProject@yahoogroups.com>
                  Sent: Wed, Aug 14, 2013 6:15 am
                  Subject: [MexicoDNAProject] Re: "Middle Eastern" DNA

                   
                  I have what may be a dumb question regarding the "Middle Eastern" results in population finder.

                  My breakdown is
                  52.21% European (French, Finnish, Orcadian, Russian)
                  14.68 Native American (Mayan, Columbian)
                  33.13% Middle Eastern (Adygei, Jewish)

                  With such a large Middle Eastern component why aren't any of my family finder matches Middle Eastern or Jewish? The most common seem to be German, English and Mexican with NONE listing Middle Eastern or Jewish origins. Approximately 36-40% of all my matches are Mexican. Is this because of a disproportunate number of people testing from certain ethnic groups?

                  Thanks,
                  Annette

                  P.S. I am an adoptee with little info about my background. I was told bio-mom was European (English/German- obviously correct) and now it seems bio-dad was Mexican instead of Italian as I'd been told. Wish I had more info to help put all these pieces together!

                  --- In MexicoDNAProject@yahoogroups.com, "Sam" <sfdoming@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > What are we to make of Middle Eastern dna. My Family Finder on FTDNA indicated I have 30.8% Middle Eastern dna. Frankly, I was astounded at the high percentage given that I am a descendant of old Hispano families here in NM.
                  > Is this an indicator of semitic, possibly "Crypto-Jewish" heritage that has been the cause of considerable controversy here? Does it point to Moorish heritage from the Iberian peninsula?
                  > I know a number of Hispanos here have a high percentage of Middle Eastern dna reported but I haven't seen the issue directly addressed.
                  > Can anyone shed some light on this?
                  > Sam Dominguez
                  >

                • idiganthro1
                  Correct, but of those that do list their heritage or at least ancestral family names, none are apparantly ME or Jewish. Maybe I m thinking too literally.
                  Message 8 of 16 , Aug 14, 2013
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                    Correct, but of those that do list their heritage or at least ancestral family names, none are apparantly ME or Jewish. Maybe I'm thinking too literally.

                    --- In MexicoDNAProject@yahoogroups.com, sangerjaime@... wrote:
                    >
                    >
                    > Annette,
                    >
                    > I do not think FTDNA allows one to access the ethnic percenages of your Fact Finder cousins? Those autosomal cousins would have to voluntarily share that with you, I would think.
                    >
                    > Jaime
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > -----Original Message-----
                    > From: idiganthro1 <idiganthro@...>
                    > To: MexicoDNAProject <MexicoDNAProject@yahoogroups.com>
                    > Sent: Wed, Aug 14, 2013 6:15 am
                    > Subject: [MexicoDNAProject] Re: "Middle Eastern" DNA
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > I have what may be a dumb question regarding the "Middle Eastern" results in population finder.
                    >
                    > My breakdown is
                    > 52.21% European (French, Finnish, Orcadian, Russian)
                    > 14.68 Native American (Mayan, Columbian)
                    > 33.13% Middle Eastern (Adygei, Jewish)
                    >
                    > With such a large Middle Eastern component why aren't any of my family finder matches Middle Eastern or Jewish? The most common seem to be German, English and Mexican with NONE listing Middle Eastern or Jewish origins. Approximately 36-40% of all my matches are Mexican. Is this because of a disproportunate number of people testing from certain ethnic groups?
                    >
                    > Thanks,
                    > Annette
                    >
                    > P.S. I am an adoptee with little info about my background. I was told bio-mom was European (English/German- obviously correct) and now it seems bio-dad was Mexican instead of Italian as I'd been told. Wish I had more info to help put all these pieces together!
                    >
                    > --- In MexicoDNAProject@yahoogroups.com, "Sam" <sfdoming@> wrote:
                    > >
                    > > What are we to make of Middle Eastern dna. My Family Finder on FTDNA indicated I have 30.8% Middle Eastern dna. Frankly, I was astounded at the high percentage given that I am a descendant of old Hispano families here in NM.
                    > > Is this an indicator of semitic, possibly "Crypto-Jewish" heritage that has been the cause of considerable controversy here? Does it point to Moorish heritage from the Iberian peninsula?
                    > > I know a number of Hispanos here have a high percentage of Middle Eastern dna reported but I haven't seen the issue directly addressed.
                    > > Can anyone shed some light on this?
                    > > Sam Dominguez
                    > >
                    >
                  • sangerjaime@...
                    Some of your Mexican cousins, may be descendants of Crypto Jews, (the forbidden people) that were expelled from Spain in 1492. Although Mexico was a Spanish
                    Message 9 of 16 , Aug 14, 2013
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                      Some of your Mexican cousins, may be descendants of Crypto Jews, (the forbidden people) that were expelled from Spain in 1492. Although Mexico was a Spanish held territory, these people felt that they would be safe from the Spanish Inquisition by coming to  New Spain. Many of them became Catholic in the New World to keep their identity hidden.   I guess the vestiges of an alleged negative past may still persist today!!

                      Jaime



                      -----Original Message-----
                      From: idiganthro1 <idiganthro@...>
                      To: MexicoDNAProject <MexicoDNAProject@yahoogroups.com>
                      Sent: Wed, Aug 14, 2013 7:12 am
                      Subject: [MexicoDNAProject] Re: "Middle Eastern" DNA

                       
                      Correct, but of those that do list their heritage or at least ancestral family names, none are apparantly ME or Jewish. Maybe I'm thinking too literally.

                      --- In MexicoDNAProject@yahoogroups.com, sangerjaime@... wrote:
                      >
                      >
                      > Annette,
                      >
                      > I do not think FTDNA allows one to access the ethnic percenages of your Fact Finder cousins? Those autosomal cousins would have to voluntarily share that with you, I would think.
                      >
                      > Jaime
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > -----Original Message-----
                      > From: idiganthro1 <idiganthro@...>
                      > To: MexicoDNAProject <MexicoDNAProject@yahoogroups.com>
                      > Sent: Wed, Aug 14, 2013 6:15 am
                      > Subject: [MexicoDNAProject] Re: "Middle Eastern" DNA
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > I have what may be a dumb question regarding the "Middle Eastern" results in population finder.
                      >
                      > My breakdown is
                      > 52.21% European (French, Finnish, Orcadian, Russian)
                      > 14.68 Native American (Mayan, Columbian)
                      > 33.13% Middle Eastern (Adygei, Jewish)
                      >
                      > With such a large Middle Eastern component why aren't any of my family finder matches Middle Eastern or Jewish? The most common seem to be German, English and Mexican with NONE listing Middle Eastern or Jewish origins. Approximately 36-40% of all my matches are Mexican. Is this because of a disproportunate number of people testing from certain ethnic groups?
                      >
                      > Thanks,
                      > Annette
                      >
                      > P.S. I am an adoptee with little info about my background. I was told bio-mom was European (English/German- obviously correct) and now it seems bio-dad was Mexican instead of Italian as I'd been told. Wish I had more info to help put all these pieces together!
                      >
                      > --- In MexicoDNAProject@yahoogroups.com, "Sam" <sfdoming@> wrote:
                      > >
                      > > What are we to make of Middle Eastern dna. My Family Finder on FTDNA indicated I have 30.8% Middle Eastern dna. Frankly, I was astounded at the high percentage given that I am a descendant of old Hispano families here in NM.
                      > > Is this an indicator of semitic, possibly "Crypto-Jewish" heritage that has been the cause of considerable controversy here? Does it point to Moorish heritage from the Iberian peninsula?
                      > > I know a number of Hispanos here have a high percentage of Middle Eastern dna reported but I haven't seen the issue directly addressed.
                      > > Can anyone shed some light on this?
                      > > Sam Dominguez
                      > >
                      >

                    • Joel Peres
                      Annette, If you test w/ 23andme, I would bet money that you would match more then several Ashkenazim, most Mexicans do. At first over 2 years ago I had little
                      Message 10 of 16 , Aug 14, 2013
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                        Annette, If you test w/ 23andme, I would bet money that you would match more then several Ashkenazim, most Mexicans do.  At first over 2 years ago I had little or no Jewish matches @ FTDNA's Family Finder, however, they've begun to accumulate.  FTDNA focuses on the last 6 generations, most Mexicans don't have any practicing Jews in our families within the last 6 generations (120-180 years ago).  However, most of us had at least some Moorish & Sephardic ancestors prior to 1492.   23andme has a very large autosomal database, so its also a numbers game. 



                        On Wed, Aug 14, 2013 at 7:33 AM, <sangerjaime@...> wrote:
                         

                        Some of your Mexican cousins, may be descendants of Crypto Jews, (the forbidden people) that were expelled from Spain in 1492. Although Mexico was a Spanish held territory, these people felt that they would be safe from the Spanish Inquisition by coming to  New Spain. Many of them became Catholic in the New World to keep their identity hidden.   I guess the vestiges of an alleged negative past may still persist today!!

                        Jaime




                        -----Original Message-----
                        From: idiganthro1 <idiganthro@...>
                        To: MexicoDNAProject <MexicoDNAProject@yahoogroups.com>
                        Sent: Wed, Aug 14, 2013 7:12 am
                        Subject: [MexicoDNAProject] Re: "Middle Eastern" DNA

                         
                        Correct, but of those that do list their heritage or at least ancestral family names, none are apparantly ME or Jewish. Maybe I'm thinking too literally.

                        --- In MexicoDNAProject@yahoogroups.com, sangerjaime@... wrote:
                        >
                        >
                        > Annette,
                        >
                        > I do not think FTDNA allows one to access the ethnic percenages of your Fact Finder cousins? Those autosomal cousins would have to voluntarily share that with you, I would think.
                        >
                        > Jaime
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > -----Original Message-----
                        > From: idiganthro1 <idiganthro@...>
                        > To: MexicoDNAProject <MexicoDNAProject@yahoogroups.com>
                        > Sent: Wed, Aug 14, 2013 6:15 am
                        > Subject: [MexicoDNAProject] Re: "Middle Eastern" DNA
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > I have what may be a dumb question regarding the "Middle Eastern" results in population finder.
                        >
                        > My breakdown is
                        > 52.21% European (French, Finnish, Orcadian, Russian)
                        > 14.68 Native American (Mayan, Columbian)
                        > 33.13% Middle Eastern (Adygei, Jewish)
                        >
                        > With such a large Middle Eastern component why aren't any of my family finder matches Middle Eastern or Jewish? The most common seem to be German, English and Mexican with NONE listing Middle Eastern or Jewish origins. Approximately 36-40% of all my matches are Mexican. Is this because of a disproportunate number of people testing from certain ethnic groups?
                        >
                        > Thanks,
                        > Annette
                        >
                        > P.S. I am an adoptee with little info about my background. I was told bio-mom was European (English/German- obviously correct) and now it seems bio-dad was Mexican instead of Italian as I'd been told. Wish I had more info to help put all these pieces together!
                        >
                        > --- In MexicoDNAProject@yahoogroups.com, "Sam" <sfdoming@> wrote:
                        > >
                        > > What are we to make of Middle Eastern dna. My Family Finder on FTDNA indicated I have 30.8% Middle Eastern dna. Frankly, I was astounded at the high percentage given that I am a descendant of old Hispano families here in NM.
                        > > Is this an indicator of semitic, possibly "Crypto-Jewish" heritage that has been the cause of considerable controversy here? Does it point to Moorish heritage from the Iberian peninsula?
                        > > I know a number of Hispanos here have a high percentage of Middle Eastern dna reported but I haven't seen the issue directly addressed.
                        > > Can anyone shed some light on this?
                        > > Sam Dominguez
                        > >
                        >


                      • Heriberto Escamilla
                        Hi Annette, I had the same question a few weeks. FTDNA reports 29% Middle Eastern DNA, while 23andme reports a very small percentage. I recall Gary noting that
                        Message 11 of 16 , Aug 14, 2013
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                          Hi Annette, I had the same question a few weeks. FTDNA reports 29% Middle Eastern DNA, while 23andme reports a very small percentage. I recall Gary noting that 23andme uses information from self-report surveys (which go back only two generations) to make this assignment, while FTDNA uses scientific papers or population research. I believe that is how it goes. I think the self reports can be erroneous sometimes.

                          It seems to me that 23andme has a European "bias", due in part to the makeup of the database?

                          I just finished reading Zealot by Aslan Reza, The author, who is Moslem appeared on Fox news a few weeks ago and the book shot up into the best sellers. The book is an attempt to describe the "historical" Jesus, but in it the author also provides some ideas about the formation of the early Christian Church. He, as do others, contend that Christianity grew among the Hellenistic Jews and then Jews that became Roman citizens.  They were still Jews, Semitic, but now embracing a religion that would eventually come to dominate Europe. Because Jews and his followers were revolutionaries a and continued to be persecuted, the Greek speaking Jews tended to distance themselves from this origin. They were in every sense, converts from Judaism to the a new religion.

                          But a little story...last week, at a men's retreat, I met a young man from Monterrey Nuevo Leon. As this is where I am from we started talking about the area and history. I noted, it's Sephardic origins and he immediately pulls out a Star of David he hanging around his neck. He told me that half of his family was Catholic and the other half was practicing Jew. He said that to this day, there is tension between the two factions and the Jewish side is very cautious and protective about their practice. So this young ma still lives this tension to this day.

                          Anyway, hope you have a great day

                          Beto



                          From: Joel Peres <joelfrancisperes@...>
                          To: "MexicoDNAProject@yahoogroups.com" <MexicoDNAProject@yahoogroups.com>
                          Sent: Wednesday, August 14, 2013 7:49 AM
                          Subject: Re: [MexicoDNAProject] Re: "Middle Eastern" DNA

                           
                          Annette, If you test w/ 23andme, I would bet money that you would match more then several Ashkenazim, most Mexicans do.  At first over 2 years ago I had little or no Jewish matches @ FTDNA's Family Finder, however, they've begun to accumulate.  FTDNA focuses on the last 6 generations, most Mexicans don't have any practicing Jews in our families within the last 6 generations (120-180 years ago).  However, most of us had at least some Moorish & Sephardic ancestors prior to 1492.   23andme has a very large autosomal database, so its also a numbers game. 



                          On Wed, Aug 14, 2013 at 7:33 AM, <sangerjaime@...> wrote:
                           
                          Some of your Mexican cousins, may be descendants of Crypto Jews, (the forbidden people) that were expelled from Spain in 1492. Although Mexico was a Spanish held territory, these people felt that they would be safe from the Spanish Inquisition by coming to  New Spain. Many of them became Catholic in the New World to keep their identity hidden.   I guess the vestiges of an alleged negative past may still persist today!!

                          Jaime



                          -----Original Message-----
                          From: idiganthro1 <idiganthro@...>
                          To: MexicoDNAProject <MexicoDNAProject@yahoogroups.com>
                          Sent: Wed, Aug 14, 2013 7:12 am
                          Subject: [MexicoDNAProject] Re: "Middle Eastern" DNA

                           
                          Correct, but of those that do list their heritage or at least ancestral family names, none are apparantly ME or Jewish. Maybe I'm thinking too literally.

                          --- In MexicoDNAProject@yahoogroups.com, sangerjaime@... wrote:
                          >
                          >
                          > Annette,
                          >
                          > I do not think FTDNA allows one to access the ethnic percenages of your Fact Finder cousins? Those autosomal cousins would have to voluntarily share that with you, I would think.
                          >
                          > Jaime
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > -----Original Message-----
                          > From: idiganthro1 <idiganthro@...>
                          > To: MexicoDNAProject <MexicoDNAProject@yahoogroups.com>
                          > Sent: Wed, Aug 14, 2013 6:15 am
                          > Subject: [MexicoDNAProject] Re: "Middle Eastern" DNA
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > I have what may be a dumb question regarding the "Middle Eastern" results in population finder.
                          >
                          > My breakdown is
                          > 52.21% European (French, Finnish, Orcadian, Russian)
                          > 14.68 Native American (Mayan, Columbian)
                          > 33.13% Middle Eastern (Adygei, Jewish)
                          >
                          > With such a large Middle Eastern component why aren't any of my family finder matches Middle Eastern or Jewish? The most common seem to be German, English and Mexican with NONE listing Middle Eastern or Jewish origins. Approximately 36-40% of all my matches are Mexican. Is this because of a disproportunate number of people testing from certain ethnic groups?
                          >
                          > Thanks,
                          > Annette
                          >
                          > P.S. I am an adoptee with little info about my background. I was told bio-mom was European (English/German- obviously correct) and now it seems bio-dad was Mexican instead of Italian as I'd been told. Wish I had more info to help put all these pieces together!
                          >
                          > --- In MexicoDNAProject@yahoogroups.com, "Sam" <sfdoming@> wrote:
                          > >
                          > > What are we to make of Middle Eastern dna. My Family Finder on FTDNA indicated I have 30.8% Middle Eastern dna. Frankly, I was astounded at the high percentage given that I am a descendant of old Hispano families here in NM.
                          > > Is this an indicator of semitic, possibly "Crypto-Jewish" heritage that has been the cause of considerable controversy here? Does it point to Moorish heritage from the Iberian peninsula?
                          > > I know a number of Hispanos here have a high percentage of Middle Eastern dna reported but I haven't seen the issue directly addressed.
                          > > Can anyone shed some light on this?
                          > > Sam Dominguez
                          > >
                          >




                        • idiganthro1
                          Correct, but of those that do list their heritage or at least ancestral family names, none are apparantly ME or Jewish. Maybe I m thinking too literally.
                          Message 12 of 16 , Aug 14, 2013
                          • 0 Attachment
                            Correct, but of those that do list their heritage or at least ancestral family names, none are apparantly ME or Jewish. Maybe I'm thinking too literally.

                            --- In MexicoDNAProject@yahoogroups.com, sangerjaime@... wrote:
                            >
                            >
                            > Annette,
                            >
                            > I do not think FTDNA allows one to access the ethnic percenages of your Fact Finder cousins? Those autosomal cousins would have to voluntarily share that with you, I would think.
                            >
                            > Jaime
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            > -----Original Message-----
                            > From: idiganthro1 <idiganthro@...>
                            > To: MexicoDNAProject <MexicoDNAProject@yahoogroups.com>
                            > Sent: Wed, Aug 14, 2013 6:15 am
                            > Subject: [MexicoDNAProject] Re: "Middle Eastern" DNA
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            > I have what may be a dumb question regarding the "Middle Eastern" results in population finder.
                            >
                            > My breakdown is
                            > 52.21% European (French, Finnish, Orcadian, Russian)
                            > 14.68 Native American (Mayan, Columbian)
                            > 33.13% Middle Eastern (Adygei, Jewish)
                            >
                            > With such a large Middle Eastern component why aren't any of my family finder matches Middle Eastern or Jewish? The most common seem to be German, English and Mexican with NONE listing Middle Eastern or Jewish origins. Approximately 36-40% of all my matches are Mexican. Is this because of a disproportunate number of people testing from certain ethnic groups?
                            >
                            > Thanks,
                            > Annette
                            >
                            > P.S. I am an adoptee with little info about my background. I was told bio-mom was European (English/German- obviously correct) and now it seems bio-dad was Mexican instead of Italian as I'd been told. Wish I had more info to help put all these pieces together!
                            >
                            > --- In MexicoDNAProject@yahoogroups.com, "Sam" <sfdoming@> wrote:
                            > >
                            > > What are we to make of Middle Eastern dna. My Family Finder on FTDNA indicated I have 30.8% Middle Eastern dna. Frankly, I was astounded at the high percentage given that I am a descendant of old Hispano families here in NM.
                            > > Is this an indicator of semitic, possibly "Crypto-Jewish" heritage that has been the cause of considerable controversy here? Does it point to Moorish heritage from the Iberian peninsula?
                            > > I know a number of Hispanos here have a high percentage of Middle Eastern dna reported but I haven't seen the issue directly addressed.
                            > > Can anyone shed some light on this?
                            > > Sam Dominguez
                            > >
                            >
                          • idiganthro1
                            Thanks for all the responses. Obviously I need to do some more reading and studying- both of history and how DNA works. I will be testing with 23andme soon as
                            Message 13 of 16 , Aug 14, 2013
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                              Thanks for all the responses. Obviously I need to do some more reading and studying- both of history and how DNA works.

                              I will be testing with 23andme soon as well.

                              Well, I was very worried my DNA results would be "boring" and that is certainly not the case! I'm excited and dying to know more!


                              --- In MexicoDNAProject@yahoogroups.com, Heriberto Escamilla <betoescamilla@...> wrote:
                              >
                              > Hi Annette, I had the same question a few weeks. FTDNA reports 29% Middle Eastern DNA, while 23andme reports a very small percentage. I recall Gary noting that 23andme uses information from self-report surveys (which go back only two generations) to make this assignment, while FTDNA uses scientific papers or population research. I believe that is how it goes. I think the self reports can be erroneous sometimes.
                              >
                              > It seems to me that 23andme has a European "bias", due in part to the makeup of the database?
                              >
                              > I just finished reading Zealot by Aslan Reza, The author, who is Moslem appeared on Fox news a few weeks ago and the book shot up into the best sellers. The book is an attempt to describe the "historical" Jesus, but in it the author also provides some ideas about the formation of the early Christian Church. He, as do others, contend that Christianity grew among the Hellenistic Jews and then Jews that became Roman citizens.  They were still Jews, Semitic, but now embracing a religion that would eventually come to dominate Europe. Because Jews and his followers were revolutionaries a and continued to be persecuted, the Greek speaking Jews tended to distance themselves from this origin. They were in every sense, converts from Judaism to the a new religion.
                              >
                              > But a little story...last week, at a men's retreat, I met a young man from Monterrey Nuevo Leon. As this is where I am from we started talking about the area and history. I noted, it's Sephardic origins and he immediately pulls out a Star of David he hanging around his neck. He told me that half of his family was Catholic and the other half was practicing Jew. He said that to this day, there is tension between the two factions and the Jewish side is very cautious and protective about their practice. So this young ma still lives this tension to this day.
                              >
                              > Anyway, hope you have a great day
                              >
                              > Beto
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              > ________________________________
                              > From: Joel Peres <joelfrancisperes@...>
                              > To: "MexicoDNAProject@yahoogroups.com" <MexicoDNAProject@yahoogroups.com>
                              > Sent: Wednesday, August 14, 2013 7:49 AM
                              > Subject: Re: [MexicoDNAProject] Re: "Middle Eastern" DNA
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >  
                              > Annette, If you test w/ 23andme, I would bet money that you would match more then several Ashkenazim, most Mexicans do.  At first over 2 years ago I had little or no Jewish matches @ FTDNA's Family Finder, however, they've begun to accumulate.  FTDNA focuses on the last 6 generations, most Mexicans don't have any practicing Jews in our families within the last 6 generations (120-180 years ago).  However, most of us had at least some Moorish & Sephardic ancestors prior to 1492.   23andme has a very large autosomal database, so its also a numbers game. 
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              > On Wed, Aug 14, 2013 at 7:33 AM, <sangerjaime@...> wrote:
                              >
                              >
                              > > 
                              > >Some of your Mexican cousins, may be descendants of Crypto Jews, (the forbidden people) that were expelled from Spain in 1492. Although Mexico was a Spanish held territory, these people felt that they would be safe from the Spanish Inquisition by coming to  New Spain. Many of them became Catholic in the New World to keep their identity hidden.   I guess the vestiges of an alleged negative past may still persist today!!
                              > >
                              > >Jaime
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >-----Original Message-----
                              > >From: idiganthro1 <idiganthro@...>
                              > >To: MexicoDNAProject <MexicoDNAProject@yahoogroups.com>
                              > >
                              > >Sent: Wed, Aug 14, 2013 7:12 am
                              > >Subject: [MexicoDNAProject] Re: "Middle Eastern" DNA
                              > >
                              > >
                              > > 
                              > >Correct, but of those that do list their heritage or at least ancestral family names, none are apparantly ME or Jewish. Maybe I'm thinking too literally.
                              > >
                              > >--- In MexicoDNAProject@yahoogroups.com, sangerjaime@ wrote:
                              > >>
                              > >>
                              > >> Annette,
                              > >>
                              > >> I do not think FTDNA allows one to access the ethnic percenages of your Fact Finder cousins? Those autosomal cousins would have to voluntarily share that with you, I would think.
                              > >>
                              > >> Jaime
                              > >>
                              > >>
                              > >>
                              > >>
                              > >>
                              > >> -----Original Message-----
                              > >> From: idiganthro1 <idiganthro@>
                              > >> To: MexicoDNAProject <MexicoDNAProject@yahoogroups.com>
                              > >> Sent: Wed, Aug 14, 2013 6:15 am
                              > >> Subject: [MexicoDNAProject] Re: "Middle Eastern" DNA
                              > >>
                              > >>
                              > >>
                              > >>
                              > >>
                              > >>
                              > >> I have what may be a dumb question regarding the "Middle Eastern" results in population finder.
                              > >>
                              > >> My breakdown is
                              > >> 52.21% European (French, Finnish, Orcadian, Russian)
                              > >> 14.68 Native American (Mayan, Columbian)
                              > >> 33.13% Middle Eastern (Adygei, Jewish)
                              > >>
                              > >> With such a large Middle Eastern component why aren't any of my family finder matches Middle Eastern or Jewish? The most common seem to be German, English and Mexican with NONE listing Middle Eastern or Jewish origins. Approximately 36-40% of all my matches are Mexican. Is this because of a disproportunate number of people testing from certain ethnic groups?
                              > >>
                              > >> Thanks,
                              > >> Annette
                              > >>
                              > >> P.S. I am an adoptee with little info about my background. I was told bio-mom was European (English/German- obviously correct) and now it seems bio-dad was Mexican instead of Italian as I'd been told. Wish I had more info to help put all these pieces together!
                              > >>
                              > >> --- In MexicoDNAProject@yahoogroups.com, "Sam" <sfdoming@> wrote:
                              > >> >
                              > >> > What are we to make of Middle Eastern dna. My Family Finder on FTDNA indicated I have 30.8% Middle Eastern dna. Frankly, I was astounded at the high percentage given that I am a descendant of old Hispano families here in NM.
                              > >> > Is this an indicator of semitic, possibly "Crypto-Jewish" heritage that has been the cause of considerable controversy here? Does it point to Moorish heritage from the Iberian peninsula?
                              > >> > I know a number of Hispanos here have a high percentage of Middle Eastern dna reported but I haven't seen the issue directly addressed.
                              > >> > Can anyone shed some light on this?
                              > >> > Sam Dominguez
                              > >> >
                              > >>
                              > >
                              > >
                              >
                            • Samuel Dominguez
                              I appreciate all the input on Middle Eastern dna. Just as an aside, we also did a FTDNA Family Finder on my northern Italian wife. She came out around 70%
                              Message 14 of 16 , Aug 14, 2013
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                                I appreciate all the input on Middle Eastern dna. Just as an aside, we also did a FTDNA Family Finder on my northern Italian wife. She came out around 70% "northern European" and around 30% "Middle Eastern". So, except for my Native American ancestry our dna looked very similar. She is 1st generation Italian and a dual Italian citizen so she has no dna from the Americas.
                                Sam
                                 

                                 


                                From: idiganthro1 <idiganthro@...>
                                To: MexicoDNAProject@yahoogroups.com
                                Sent: Wednesday, August 14, 2013 10:39 AM
                                Subject: [MexicoDNAProject] Re: "Middle Eastern" DNA

                                 
                                Correct, but of those that do list their heritage or at least ancestral family names, none are apparantly ME or Jewish. Maybe I'm thinking too literally.

                                --- In MexicoDNAProject@yahoogroups.com, sangerjaime@... wrote:
                                >
                                >
                                > Annette,
                                >
                                > I do not think FTDNA allows one to access the ethnic percenages of your Fact Finder cousins? Those autosomal cousins would have to voluntarily share that with you, I would think.
                                >
                                > Jaime
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                > -----Original Message-----
                                > From: idiganthro1 <idiganthro@...>
                                > To: MexicoDNAProject <MexicoDNAProject@yahoogroups.com>
                                > Sent: Wed, Aug 14, 2013 6:15 am
                                > Subject: [MexicoDNAProject] Re: "Middle Eastern" DNA
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                > I have what may be a dumb question regarding the "Middle Eastern" results in population finder.
                                >
                                > My breakdown is
                                > 52.21% European (French, Finnish, Orcadian, Russian)
                                > 14.68 Native American (Mayan, Columbian)
                                > 33.13% Middle Eastern (Adygei, Jewish)
                                >
                                > With such a large Middle Eastern component why aren't any of my family finder matches Middle Eastern or Jewish? The most common seem to be German, English and Mexican with NONE listing Middle Eastern or Jewish origins. Approximately 36-40% of all my matches are Mexican. Is this because of a disproportunate number of people testing from certain ethnic groups?
                                >
                                > Thanks,
                                > Annette
                                >
                                > P.S. I am an adoptee with little info about my background. I was told bio-mom was European (English/German- obviously correct) and now it seems bio-dad was Mexican instead of Italian as I'd been told. Wish I had more info to help put all these pieces together!
                                >
                                > --- In MexicoDNAProject@yahoogroups.com, "Sam" <sfdoming@> wrote:
                                > >
                                > > What are we to make of Middle Eastern dna. My Family Finder on FTDNA indicated I have 30.8% Middle Eastern dna. Frankly, I was astounded at the high percentage given that I am a descendant of old Hispano families here in NM.
                                > > Is this an indicator of semitic, possibly "Crypto-Jewish" heritage that has been the cause of considerable controversy here? Does it point to Moorish heritage from the Iberian peninsula?
                                > > I know a number of Hispanos here have a high percentage of Middle Eastern dna reported but I haven't seen the issue directly addressed.
                                > > Can anyone shed some light on this?
                                > > Sam Dominguez
                                > >
                                >



                              • mexr1b@att.net
                                Almost all Europeans have the Mediterranean component as can be seen with the National Geographic Geno 2.0 project reference populations. There are other
                                Message 15 of 16 , Aug 14, 2013
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                                  Almost all Europeans have the Mediterranean component as can be seen with the National Geographic Geno 2.0 project reference populations. There are other populations that have it also. It is hard to tie it to a specific ethnic group. Tuscans, Greeks, and Sardinians have even more of the Mediterranean component than Iberians do.

                                  https://genographic.nationalgeographic.com/overview-of-regions-and-closest-populations/reference-populations/

                                  ALTAIAN (SIBERIAN) 2%
                                  BRITISH (UNITED KINGDOM) 33%
                                  BULGRIANS 47%
                                  DANISH 30%
                                  EGYPTIAN 35%
                                  FINNISH 17%
                                  GEORGIAN 61%
                                  GERMAN 36%
                                  GREEK 54%
                                  IBERIAN 48%
                                  IRANIAN 42%
                                  KUWAITI 57%
                                  LEBANESE 66%
                                  MEXICAN 28%
                                  ROMANIAN 43%
                                  RUSSIAN 25%
                                  SARDINIAN 67%
                                  TUSCAN 54%

                                  Now if you go to the National Geographic Geno 2.0 Regions Overview you will find this information.

                                  Using a method of analysis that infers ancestral source populations, we have discovered nine ancestral regions that combine to make up everyone's genome. Everyone has a mix of these components ranging from 0% to 100% due to interaction between these regions of the world over the past 50,000 years. Native Americans have their own group, as do Oceanians and the Khoisan people of southern Africa. In these places it is possible to have 100% of the respective region. Everyone else in the world is a mix of these components, reflecting ancient and modern migration patterns.

                                  Mediterranean: This component is found at highest frequencies in southern Europe and the Levant—people from Sardinia, Italy, Greece, Lebanon, Egypt and Tunisia in our reference populations. While not limited to these groups, it is found at lower frequencies throughout the rest of Europe, the Middle East, Central and South Asia, due to these populations traveling through this region on their journeys and retaining that in their DNA. This component is likely the signal of the Neolithic population expansion from the Middle East, beginning around 8,000 years ago, likely from the western part of the Fertile Crescent.

                                  https://genographic.nationalgeographic.com/overview-of-regions-and-closest-populations/regions/




                                  --- In MexicoDNAProject@yahoogroups.com, "Sam" wrote:
                                  >
                                  > What are we to make of Middle Eastern dna. My Family Finder on FTDNA indicated I have 30.8% Middle Eastern dna. Frankly, I was astounded at the high percentage given that I am a descendant of old Hispano families here in NM.
                                  > Is this an indicator of semitic, possibly "Crypto-Jewish" heritage that has been the cause of considerable controversy here? Does it point to Moorish heritage from the Iberian peninsula?
                                  > I know a number of Hispanos here have a high percentage of Middle Eastern dna reported but I haven't seen the issue directly addressed.
                                  > Can anyone shed some light on this?
                                  > Sam Dominguez
                                  >
                                • JOEL SR
                                  Hola Amigos:   Cultural sharing of la musica. IL Divo The Promise .  Four singers one American, one Spaniard, one French and one Italian. Great music. Joel
                                  Message 16 of 16 , Aug 14, 2013
                                  • 0 Attachment
                                    Hola Amigos:
                                     
                                    Cultural sharing of la musica. IL Divo "The Promise".  Four singers one American, one Spaniard, one French and one Italian. Great music.
                                     
                                    Joel
                                    From: Samuel Dominguez <sfdoming@...>
                                    To: "MexicoDNAProject@yahoogroups.com" <MexicoDNAProject@yahoogroups.com>
                                    Sent: Wednesday, August 14, 2013 12:50 PM
                                    Subject: Re: [MexicoDNAProject] Re: "Middle Eastern" DNA
                                     
                                    I appreciate all the input on Middle Eastern dna. Just as an aside, we also did a FTDNA Family Finder on my northern Italian wife. She came out around 70% "northern European" and around 30% "Middle Eastern". So, except for my Native American ancestry our dna looked very similar. She is 1st generation Italian and a dual Italian citizen so she has no dna from the Americas.
                                    Sam
                                     

                                     
                                    From: idiganthro1 <idiganthro@...>
                                    To: MexicoDNAProject@yahoogroups.com
                                    Sent: Wednesday, August 14, 2013 10:39 AM
                                    Subject: [MexicoDNAProject] Re: "Middle Eastern" DNA
                                     
                                    Correct, but of those that do list their heritage or at least ancestral family names, none are apparantly ME or Jewish. Maybe I'm thinking too literally. --- In mailto:MexicoDNAProject%40yahoogroups.com, sangerjaime@... wrote: > > > Annette, > > I do not think FTDNA allows one to access the ethnic percenages of your Fact Finder cousins? Those autosomal cousins would have to voluntarily share that with you, I would think. > > Jaime > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: idiganthro1 <idiganthro@...> > To: MexicoDNAProject <mailto:MexicoDNAProject%40yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Wed, Aug 14, 2013 6:15 am > Subject: [MexicoDNAProject] Re: "Middle Eastern" DNA > > > > > > > I have what may be a dumb question regarding the "Middle Eastern" results in population finder. > > My breakdown is > 52.21% European (French, Finnish, Orcadian, Russian) > 14.68 Native American (Mayan, Columbian) > 33.13% Middle Eastern (Adygei, Jewish) > > With such a large Middle Eastern component why aren't any of my family finder matches Middle Eastern or Jewish? The most common seem to be German, English and Mexican with NONE listing Middle Eastern or Jewish origins. Approximately 36-40% of all my matches are Mexican. Is this because of a disproportunate number of people testing from certain ethnic groups? > > Thanks, > Annette > > P.S. I am an adoptee with little info about my background. I was told bio-mom was European (English/German- obviously correct) and now it seems bio-dad was Mexican instead of Italian as I'd been told. Wish I had more info to help put all these pieces together! > > --- In mailto:MexicoDNAProject%40yahoogroups.com, "Sam" <sfdoming@> wrote: > > > > What are we to make of Middle Eastern dna. My Family Finder on FTDNA indicated I have 30.8% Middle Eastern dna. Frankly, I was astounded at the high percentage given that I am a descendant of old Hispano families here in NM. > > Is this an indicator of semitic, possibly "Crypto-Jewish" heritage that has been the cause of considerable controversy here? Does it point to Moorish heritage from the Iberian peninsula? > > I know a number of Hispanos here have a high percentage of Middle Eastern dna reported but I haven't seen the issue directly addressed. > > Can anyone shed some light on this? > > Sam Dominguez > > >
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