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Re: [Marbling] Marbling society

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  • Gail MacKenzie
    Dear Jake, Thank you for your excellent presentation of a very good idea. I also don t believe that membership should have anything associated with
    Message 1 of 3 , Nov 11, 2001
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      Re: [Marbling] Marbling society Dear Jake,

      Thank you for your excellent presentation of a very good idea.  I also don't believe that membership should have anything associated with "Accreditation".

      Thanks to Laura for rekindling the idea and to E-MAIL!! I volunteer to be of whatever help I can be.

      Best wishes,

      Gail MacKenzie

      From: Jake Benson <jemiljan@...>
      Reply-To: Marbling@yahoogroups.com
      Date: Sun, 11 Nov 2001 13:41:48 -0400
      To: <Marbling@yahoogroups.com>
      Subject: [Marbling] Marbling society


      As I recall, the attempt to start a Marbler's Society at the San Francisco
      Gathering was brought up.  Unfortunately, this attempt was presented
      together with the idea that this organization should somehow be a
      "Professional Association" for "Accredited Marblers",who would be
      "certified" through a "professional board" (i.e. accredited "Masters", a
      highly subjective, and often abused word in my own opinion).

      The negative reaction to this proposal was passionate and highly charged.
      Many felt that the attempt to "accredit" marbling would dampen creativity.
      The notion that we had to stop "unprofessional" marblers out there in the
      world from teaching other people seemed to me overly paranoid.

      Had the idea been presented without the issue of accreditation, it would
      have likely been more successful.   Other organizations such as the Guild of
      Book Workers has broached the issue of accreditation, often put forward on
      the part of professional binders and restorers who want some kind of
      mechanism in place to ensure consistent quality and professionalism.  This
      proposal has been met with much the same reaction reaction.  In this case,
      Book Artists feel that they would be deemed as "unprofessional", because
      they often employ techniques that might constitute "Book Art" , but don't
      actually do traditional bookbinding.

      If we approach the issue of forming a Marbler's Society, I would advise that
      we should steer clear of this thorny issue of accreditation.  A person's
      work speaks for itself.  Such an organization should be a focal point ,
      bringing people together with a  common interest, not something divisive and
      hierarchical.

      At that time in San Fransisco, I suggested  that the formation of such an
      organization would not only help promote marbling in general, but also help
      someone like myself in researching historic marbling.  Given the
      preoccupation with the accreditation issue, the issue I raised was barely
      noticed.   Some institutions that have historic pieces in their collections
      are set up to work with academic scholars.  The institution in question
      verifies what the person is doing, and then allows them access.  Some
      institutions are very restrictive in their policy one example is Dumbarton
      Oaks in Washington DC- you just don't walk in there and ask to look at their
      books.  As I'm an "independant" person researching this subject, having some
      kind of organization might help open doors that are otherwise closed.
      Having a Non Profit Organization could clear the way to obatin grant funding
      that would pay for the rights and reproduction fees and issues when
      documenting historical marbling, allowing all of us to view the contents of
      a collection in a digital format.  It's expensive, but doable.

      This idea has enormous potential.  At the San Francisco gathering, most of
      us didn't have email.  That's changed.  Applying for Non Profit status would
      allow us to apply for grant funding, and perhaps go on to obtain our own Web
      Server.  This way we can mount a comprehensive web site that features
      marbling, individual marbler's pages, a historical catalog of images, and a
      comprehensive bibliography in many languages.  It would allow for discussion
      groups and forums like the one we have now, but may even host bulletin
      boards devoted to specific themes and discussions within marbling.  For
      example, we could have separate Suminagashi, Fabric marbling, Paper marbling
      forums, or even a Turkish language discussion group, or a "history' bulletin
      board.

      At the same time, we might be able to have space on the server to sponsor
      the web pages of individual marblers at a reduced cost.  this could allow
      for money to come in and pay for  the service, and the money would go to
      marbling, rather than AOL, Compuserve, Microsoft etc....

      Let's develop this idea.  If we have something in place by the time of the
      Gathering, we have something to build on for the future.

      Jake Benson        

         


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    • Franklyn Smith
      Hi, The idea of a marbling guild was broached by Polly Fox and Patti Schleicher at San Francisco. Following the Gathering a number of people were asked by
      Message 2 of 3 , Nov 12, 2001
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        Hi,
        The idea of a marbling guild was broached by Polly Fox and Patti Schleicher at
        San Francisco. Following the Gathering a number of people were asked by Polly
        (by the way is anyone in touch with Polly or does anyone know how to reach her)
        to form a committee to consider the idea.
        Central to the idea was optional accreditation of teachers. There was never any
        thought of accreditation of marblers in general or making accreditation
        mandatory. Several conference calls were held but most committee members were so
        highly concerned that it not be "elitist", highly fearful of the possibly
        divisive results, and the reactions received were so hysterical (we were called,
        among other things, "the marbling gestapo") that the committee disbanded and
        abandoned the attempt.
        I'm certain that no one who was on that committee would ever try again.
        Lots of luck, but certainly forget any form of accreditation.

        Shealgh Smith

        Jake Benson wrote:

        > As I recall, the attempt to start a Marbler's Society at the San Francisco
        > Gathering was brought up. Unfortunately, this attempt was presented
        > together with the idea that this organization should somehow be a
        > "Professional Association" for "Accredited Marblers",who would be
        > "certified" through a "professional board" (i.e. accredited "Masters", a
        > highly subjective, and often abused word in my own opinion).
        >
        > The negative reaction to this proposal was passionate and highly charged.
        > Many felt that the attempt to "accredit" marbling would dampen creativity.
        > The notion that we had to stop "unprofessional" marblers out there in the
        > world from teaching other people seemed to me overly paranoid.
        >
        > Had the idea been presented without the issue of accreditation, it would
        > have likely been more successful. Other organizations such as the Guild of
        > Book Workers has broached the issue of accreditation, often put forward on
        > the part of professional binders and restorers who want some kind of
        > mechanism in place to ensure consistent quality and professionalism. This
        > proposal has been met with much the same reaction reaction. In this case,
        > Book Artists feel that they would be deemed as "unprofessional", because
        > they often employ techniques that might constitute "Book Art" , but don't
        > actually do traditional bookbinding.
        >
        > If we approach the issue of forming a Marbler's Society, I would advise that
        > we should steer clear of this thorny issue of accreditation. A person's
        > work speaks for itself. Such an organization should be a focal point ,
        > bringing people together with a common interest, not something divisive and
        > hierarchical.
        >
        > At that time in San Fransisco, I suggested that the formation of such an
        > organization would not only help promote marbling in general, but also help
        > someone like myself in researching historic marbling. Given the
        > preoccupation with the accreditation issue, the issue I raised was barely
        > noticed. Some institutions that have historic pieces in their collections
        > are set up to work with academic scholars. The institution in question
        > verifies what the person is doing, and then allows them access. Some
        > institutions are very restrictive in their policy one example is Dumbarton
        > Oaks in Washington DC- you just don't walk in there and ask to look at their
        > books. As I'm an "independant" person researching this subject, having some
        > kind of organization might help open doors that are otherwise closed.
        > Having a Non Profit Organization could clear the way to obatin grant funding
        > that would pay for the rights and reproduction fees and issues when
        > documenting historical marbling, allowing all of us to view the contents of
        > a collection in a digital format. It's expensive, but doable.
        >
        > This idea has enormous potential. At the San Francisco gathering, most of
        > us didn't have email. That's changed. Applying for Non Profit status would
        > allow us to apply for grant funding, and perhaps go on to obtain our own Web
        > Server. This way we can mount a comprehensive web site that features
        > marbling, individual marbler's pages, a historical catalog of images, and a
        > comprehensive bibliography in many languages. It would allow for discussion
        > groups and forums like the one we have now, but may even host bulletin
        > boards devoted to specific themes and discussions within marbling. For
        > example, we could have separate Suminagashi, Fabric marbling, Paper marbling
        > forums, or even a Turkish language discussion group, or a "history' bulletin
        > board.
        >
        > At the same time, we might be able to have space on the server to sponsor
        > the web pages of individual marblers at a reduced cost. this could allow
        > for money to come in and pay for the service, and the money would go to
        > marbling, rather than AOL, Compuserve, Microsoft etc....
        >
        > Let's develop this idea. If we have something in place by the time of the
        > Gathering, we have something to build on for the future.
        >
        > Jake Benson
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
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