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freestyle questions

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  • Sue Cole
    I looked at the website you had and I would consider that more of a suminagashi method because the inks/paints are not moved once they are dropped in. If you
    Message 1 of 13 , Oct 27, 2013
      I looked at the website you had and I would consider that more of a suminagashi method because the inks/paints are not moved once they are dropped in.  If you will check in the archives, you will find several notes on Pernille's work.  There's a youtube video also where she talks about her work.  It looks like she makes the original designs, then somehow digitizes them on to the wood, since they are all the same in appearance.

      To do the work that's in Write Robinson's work, you would need a very large tank on a stable surface.
      HTH
      Sue
    • irisnevins
      I have seen this done with Latex house paints! Exactly. On plain water. I think you need to work fast as I recall because it starts to air dry. It works well
      Message 2 of 13 , Oct 28, 2013
        I have seen this done with Latex house paints! Exactly. On plain water. I think you need to work fast as I recall because it starts to air dry. It works well on fabrics and wood. I tried it with someone once, long ago.
        Iris Nevins
        www.marblingpaper.com



        On 10/28/13, Sue Cole<akartisan@...> wrote:




        I looked at the website you had and I would consider that more of a suminagashi method because the inks/paints are not moved once they are dropped in. If you will check in the archives, you will find several notes on Pernille's work. There's a youtube video also where she talks about her work. It looks like she makes the original designs, then somehow digitizes them on to the wood, since they are all the same in appearance.


        To do the work that's in Write Robinson's work, you would need a very large tank on a stable surface.
        HTH
        Sue
      • kyruane
        Thanks for the responses! I ve tried Latex on water, with poor results. The colors were very washed out, despite using high quality paint and thinning with
        Message 3 of 13 , Oct 28, 2013

          Thanks for the responses!


          I've tried Latex on water, with poor results. The colors were very washed out, despite using high quality paint and thinning with latex conditioner. I feel like I've tried everything, but just cannot replicate this look! Perhaps my tank is just too small (20x26) to encourage the rings of color to flow and compress properly. 


          If I were to thin the size (I work on Carrageenan), would I still be able to float the paints, while adding to the fluidity of the size? Should I try different pigments (currently using Goldens and Galen Berry's acrylics)? I've studied Pernille's videos and website closely, and I know she's working on thickened size, though it doesn't seem as thick as mine is. Just can't figure out what she's using for pigments! Tried to contact her, but no luck. 


          And while I'm throwing out questions; it looks as though I'm going to need to travel to receive marbling instruction as there are no marblers in the Bay Area who teach. Please let me know if you teach courses, when and where. Thanks!

          ---In Marbling@yahoogroups.com, <marbling@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

          I have seen this done with Latex house paints! Exactly. On plain water. I think you need to work fast as I recall because it starts to air dry. It works well on fabrics and wood. I tried it with someone once, long ago.
          Iris Nevins
          www.marblingpaper.com



          On 10/28/13, Sue Cole<akartisan@...> wrote:




          I looked at the website you had and I would consider that more of a suminagashi method because the inks/paints are not moved once they are dropped in. If you will check in the archives, you will find several notes on Pernille's work. There's a youtube video also where she talks about her work. It looks like she makes the original designs, then somehow digitizes them on to the wood, since they are all the same in appearance.


          To do the work that's in Write Robinson's work, you would need a very large tank on a stable surface.
          HTH
          Sue
        • irisnevins
          As far as I could tell the paint we used was not thinned... Iris Nevins www.marblingpaper.com On 10/28/13, Karen.ruane@gmail.com wrote: Thanks for the
          Message 4 of 13 , Oct 28, 2013
            As far as I could tell the paint we used was not thinned...
            Iris Nevins
            www.marblingpaper.com


            On 10/28/13, Karen.ruane@... wrote:





            Thanks for the responses!




            I've tried Latex on water, with poor results. The colors were very washed out, despite using high quality paint and thinning with latex conditioner. I feel like I've tried everything, but just cannot replicate this look! Perhaps my tank is just too small (20x26) to encourage the rings of color to flow and compress properly.




            If I were to thin the size (I work on Carrageenan), would I still be able to float the paints, while adding to the fluidity of the size? Should I try different pigments (currently using Goldens and Galen Berry's acrylics)? I've studied Pernille's videos and website closely, and I know she's working on thickened size, though it doesn't seem as thick as mine is. Just can't figure out what she's using for pigments! Tried to contact her, but no luck.


            And while I'm throwing out questions; it looks as though I'm going to need to travel to receive marbling instruction as there are no marblers in the Bay Area who teach. Please let me know if you teach courses, when and where. Thanks!

            ---In Marbling@yahoogroups.com, <marbling@yahoogroups.com> wrote:


            I have seen this done with Latex house paints! Exactly. On plain water. I think you need to work fast as I recall because it starts to air dry. It works well on fabrics and wood. I tried it with someone once, long ago.
            Iris Nevins
            www.marblingpaper.com




            On 10/28/13, Sue Cole<akartisan@...> wrote:




            I looked at the website you had and I would consider that more of a suminagashi method because the inks/paints are not moved once they are dropped in. If you will check in the archives, you will find several notes on Pernille's work. There's a youtube video also where she talks about her work. It looks like she makes the original designs, then somehow digitizes them on to the wood, since they are all the same in appearance.


            To do the work that's in Write Robinson's work, you would need a very large tank on a stable surface.
            HTH
            Sue
          • Laura Sims
            Karen, When I teach I sometimes share a method I call sudo-sumi since I m acrylics.  I add some methyl cellulose to plain water to give the water a little
            Message 5 of 13 , Oct 29, 2013
              Karen,
              When I teach I sometimes share a method I call sudo-sumi since I'm acrylics.  I add some methyl cellulose to plain water to give the water a little "body" then using a dropper or sumi brush alternate Golden (1part paint, 1 part GAC 800 if on paper and 1 to 2 parts water) with Flow Release (15 to 30 drops per cup of water).  Print on calligrapher's rice paper, mulberry paper or  alummed paper/fabric. The tray we use in class is a 28 quart storage container that is approx. 17 x 23 x 6 inches so your container should be fine.  

              With time to plan ahead I invite you to consider Arrowmont School of Arts and Crafts October 2014 to take a class with me (arrowmont.org).  It is going to be a great class with the added bonus of a little shared time with the class next door that will be exploring surface treatments on fabrics.  The teacher, Karen Tunnell, is an accomplished quilter and former marbling/hydro-printing student of mine.  She has combined all of her skills to create some fantastic art quilts using the marbled fabric as the foundation for some of her imagery.  Check out Karen's website.  As for samples of some of my hydro-printing go to archives and/or accessories at www.indigostonestudio.com.  I'll have new work up this winter with fresh imagery on natural dyed backgrounds.  Though I also do other surface design techniques marbling has been my first and longest love since being introduced to it in 1985.  

              Best,
              Laura Sims


              On Monday, October 28, 2013 11:28 PM, irisnevins <irisnevins@...> wrote:
               
              As far as I could tell the paint we used was not thinned...
              Iris Nevins
              www.marblingpaper.com


              On 10/28/13, Karen.ruane@... wrote:



              Thanks for the responses!

              I've tried Latex on water, with poor results. The colors were very washed out, despite using high quality paint and thinning with latex conditioner. I feel like I've tried everything, but just cannot replicate this look! Perhaps my tank is just too small (20x26) to encourage the rings of color to flow and compress properly.

              If I were to thin the size (I work on Carrageenan), would I still be able to float the paints, while adding to the fluidity of the size? Should I try different pigments (currently using Goldens and Galen Berry's acrylics)? I've studied Pernille's videos and website closely, and I know she's working on thickened size, though it doesn't seem as thick as mine is. Just can't figure out what she's using for pigments! Tried to contact her, but no luck.

              And while I'm throwing out questions; it looks as though I'm going to need to travel to receive marbling instruction as there are no marblers in the Bay Area who teach. Please let me know if you teach courses, when and where. Thanks!

              ---In Marbling@yahoogroups.com, <marbling@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

              I have seen this done with Latex house paints! Exactly. On plain water. I think you need to work fast as I recall because it starts to air dry. It works well on fabrics and wood. I tried it with someone once, long ago.
              Iris Nevins
              www.marblingpaper.com

              On 10/28/13, Sue Cole<akartisan@...> wrote:



              I looked at the website you had and I would consider that more of a suminagashi method because the inks/paints are not moved once they are dropped in. If you will check in the archives, you will find several notes on Pernille's work. There's a youtube video also where she talks about her work. It looks like she makes the original designs, then somehow digitizes them on to the wood, since they are all the same in appearance.

              To do the work that's in Write Robinson's work, you would need a very large tank on a stable surface.
              HTH
              Sue



            • kyruane
              Thanks Laura, this is very helpful. Do you think it would work with thinned carrageenan? And when you print on rice paper, do you alum? I will definitely look
              Message 6 of 13 , Oct 29, 2013

                Thanks Laura, this is very helpful. Do you think it would work with thinned carrageenan? And when you print on rice paper, do you alum?


                I will definitely look into a workshop at Arrowmont. Don't know if I can wait a whole year, I'm totally obsessed! 



                ---In Marbling@yahoogroups.com, <marbling@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

                Karen,
                When I teach I sometimes share a method I call sudo-sumi since I'm acrylics.  I add some methyl cellulose to plain water to give the water a little "body" then using a dropper or sumi brush alternate Golden (1part paint, 1 part GAC 800 if on paper and 1 to 2 parts water) with Flow Release (15 to 30 drops per cup of water).  Print on calligrapher's rice paper, mulberry paper or  alummed paper/fabric. The tray we use in class is a 28 quart storage container that is approx. 17 x 23 x 6 inches so your container should be fine.  

                With time to plan ahead I invite you to consider Arrowmont School of Arts and Crafts October 2014 to take a class with me (arrowmont.org).  It is going to be a great class with the added bonus of a little shared time with the class next door that will be exploring surface treatments on fabrics.  The teacher, Karen Tunnell, is an accomplished quilter and former marbling/hydro-printing student of mine.  She has combined all of her skills to create some fantastic art quilts using the marbled fabric as the foundation for some of her imagery.  Check out Karen's website.  As for samples of some of my hydro-printing go to archives and/or accessories at www.indigostonestudio.com.  I'll have new work up this winter with fresh imagery on natural dyed backgrounds.  Though I also do other surface design techniques marbling has been my first and longest love since being introduced to it in 1985.  

                Best,
                Laura Sims


                On Monday, October 28, 2013 11:28 PM, irisnevins <irisnevins@...> wrote:
                 
                As far as I could tell the paint we used was not thinned...
                Iris Nevins
                www.marblingpaper.com


                On 10/28/13, Karen.ruane@... wrote:



                Thanks for the responses!

                I've tried Latex on water, with poor results. The colors were very washed out, despite using high quality paint and thinning with latex conditioner. I feel like I've tried everything, but just cannot replicate this look! Perhaps my tank is just too small (20x26) to encourage the rings of color to flow and compress properly.

                If I were to thin the size (I work on Carrageenan), would I still be able to float the paints, while adding to the fluidity of the size? Should I try different pigments (currently using Goldens and Galen Berry's acrylics)? I've studied Pernille's videos and website closely, and I know she's working on thickened size, though it doesn't seem as thick as mine is. Just can't figure out what she's using for pigments! Tried to contact her, but no luck.

                And while I'm throwing out questions; it looks as though I'm going to need to travel to receive marbling instruction as there are no marblers in the Bay Area who teach. Please let me know if you teach courses, when and where. Thanks!

                ---In Marbling@yahoogroups.com, <marbling@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

                I have seen this done with Latex house paints! Exactly. On plain water. I think you need to work fast as I recall because it starts to air dry. It works well on fabrics and wood. I tried it with someone once, long ago.
                Iris Nevins
                www.marblingpaper.com

                On 10/28/13, Sue Cole<akartisan@...> wrote:



                I looked at the website you had and I would consider that more of a suminagashi method because the inks/paints are not moved once they are dropped in. If you will check in the archives, you will find several notes on Pernille's work. There's a youtube video also where she talks about her work. It looks like she makes the original designs, then somehow digitizes them on to the wood, since they are all the same in appearance.

                To do the work that's in Write Robinson's work, you would need a very large tank on a stable surface.
                HTH
                Sue



              • Laura Sims
                You can try thinned carrageenan.  It should work.  As Sue responded if you are going to do more authentic suminagashi you can use sumi calligraphy ink on
                Message 7 of 13 , Oct 29, 2013
                  You can try thinned carrageenan.  It should work.  As Sue responded if you are going to do more authentic suminagashi you can use sumi calligraphy ink on plain water with sumi brushes.  Other surfactants that will work are tea tree oil in water and a pine resin surfactant that Colophon Book Arts might still sell.  The rice (general term) or kozo paper doesn't need alum.  Once you lay down the sheet you may want to put a dowel under one side edge of the paper to pick it up to prevent the paper from pulling apart. 

                  Best,
                  Laura


                  On Tuesday, October 29, 2013 1:16 PM, "Karen.ruane@..." <Karen.ruane@...> wrote:
                   
                  Thanks Laura, this is very helpful. Do you think it would work with thinned carrageenan? And when you print on rice paper, do you alum?

                  I will definitely look into a workshop at Arrowmont. Don't know if I can wait a whole year, I'm totally obsessed! 


                  ---In Marbling@yahoogroups.com, <marbling@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

                  Karen,
                  When I teach I sometimes share a method I call sudo-sumi since I'm acrylics.  I add some methyl cellulose to plain water to give the water a little "body" then using a dropper or sumi brush alternate Golden (1part paint, 1 part GAC 800 if on paper and 1 to 2 parts water) with Flow Release (15 to 30 drops per cup of water).  Print on calligrapher's rice paper, mulberry paper or  alummed paper/fabric. The tray we use in class is a 28 quart storage container that is approx. 17 x 23 x 6 inches so your container should be fine.  

                  With time to plan ahead I invite you to consider Arrowmont School of Arts and Crafts October 2014 to take a class with me (arrowmont.org).  It is going to be a great class with the added bonus of a little shared time with the class next door that will be exploring surface treatments on fabrics.  The teacher, Karen Tunnell, is an accomplished quilter and former marbling/hydro-printing student of mine.  She has combined all of her skills to create some fantastic art quilts using the marbled fabric as the foundation for some of her imagery.  Check out Karen's website.  As for samples of some of my hydro-printing go to archives and/or accessories at www.indigostonestudio.com.  I'll have new work up this winter with fresh imagery on natural dyed backgrounds.  Though I also do other surface design techniques marbling has been my first and longest love since being introduced to it in 1985.  

                  Best,
                  Laura Sims


                  On Monday, October 28, 2013 11:28 PM, irisnevins <irisnevins@...> wrote:
                   
                  As far as I could tell the paint we used was not thinned...
                  Iris Nevins
                  www.marblingpaper.com


                  On 10/28/13, Karen.ruane@... wrote:



                  Thanks for the responses!

                  I've tried Latex on water, with poor results. The colors were very washed out, despite using high quality paint and thinning with latex conditioner. I feel like I've tried everything, but just cannot replicate this look! Perhaps my tank is just too small (20x26) to encourage the rings of color to flow and compress properly.

                  If I were to thin the size (I work on Carrageenan), would I still be able to float the paints, while adding to the fluidity of the size? Should I try different pigments (currently using Goldens and Galen Berry's acrylics)? I've studied Pernille's videos and website closely, and I know she's working on thickened size, though it doesn't seem as thick as mine is. Just can't figure out what she's using for pigments! Tried to contact her, but no luck.

                  And while I'm throwing out questions; it looks as though I'm going to need to travel to receive marbling instruction as there are no marblers in the Bay Area who teach. Please let me know if you teach courses, when and where. Thanks!

                  ---In Marbling@yahoogroups.com, <marbling@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

                  I have seen this done with Latex house paints! Exactly. On plain water. I think you need to work fast as I recall because it starts to air dry. It works well on fabrics and wood. I tried it with someone once, long ago.
                  Iris Nevins
                  www.marblingpaper.com

                  On 10/28/13, Sue Cole<akartisan@...> wrote:



                  I looked at the website you had and I would consider that more of a suminagashi method because the inks/paints are not moved once they are dropped in. If you will check in the archives, you will find several notes on Pernille's work. There's a youtube video also where she talks about her work. It looks like she makes the original designs, then somehow digitizes them on to the wood, since they are all the same in appearance.

                  To do the work that's in Write Robinson's work, you would need a very large tank on a stable surface.
                  HTH
                  Sue





                • Elsje
                  hi Laura, Authentic suminagashi you can do with OX GALL (I have read somewhere but I not yet tried.) I also use DREFT yellow, DISH WASH SOAP Can you give me an
                  Message 8 of 13 , Oct 31, 2013

                    hi Laura,

                     

                    Authentic suminagashi you can do with OX GALL

                    (I have read somewhere but I not yet tried.)

                     

                    I also use DREFT yellow, DISH WASH SOAP

                     

                    Can you give me an idea how much

                    TEA TREE OIL  you use in water ?

                    1 drip and 1 liter water ...

                    or

                    1 drip tea tree oil in a glass (150 cc) of water?

                     

                    xxxelsje

                     

                    Van: Marbling@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Marbling@yahoogroups.com] Namens Laura Sims
                    Verzonden: woensdag 30 oktober 2013 3:14
                    Aan: Marbling@yahoogroups.com
                    Onderwerp: Re: Re: RE: Re: [Marbling] freestyle questions

                     

                     

                    As Sue responded if you are going to do more authentic suminagashi you can use sumi calligraphy ink on plain water with sumi brushes.  Other surfactants that will work are tea tree oil in water.

                     

                    Best,

                    Laura

                     

                  • Elsje
                    hi elsje, I tried 2 drip tea tree oil in a glass of water and it works mmmmm it is worth a study it is an exiting moment to see the reaction xxxe Van:
                    Message 9 of 13 , Nov 3, 2013

                      hi elsje,

                      I tried 2 drip tea tree oil in a glass of water

                      and it works

                      mmmmm it is worth a study

                      it is an exiting moment to see the reaction

                      xxxe

                       

                      Van: Marbling@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Marbling@yahoogroups.com] Namens Elsje
                      Verzonden: donderdag 31 oktober 2013 16:16
                      Aan: Marbling@yahoogroups.com
                      Onderwerp: [Marbling] authentic suminagashi

                       

                       

                      hi Laura,

                       

                      Authentic suminagashi you can do with OX GALL

                      (I have read somewhere but I not yet tried.)

                       

                      I also use DREFT yellow, DISH WASH SOAP

                       

                      Can you give me an idea how much

                      TEA TREE OIL  you use in water ?

                      1 drip and 1 liter water ...

                      or

                      1 drip tea tree oil in a glass (150 cc) of water?

                       

                      xxxelsje

                       

                      Van: Marbling@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Marbling@yahoogroups.com] Namens Laura Sims
                      Verzonden: woensdag 30 oktober 2013 3:14
                      Aan: Marbling@yahoogroups.com
                      Onderwerp: Re: Re: RE: Re: [Marbling] freestyle questions

                       

                       

                      As Sue responded if you are going to do more authentic suminagashi you can use sumi calligraphy ink on plain water with sumi brushes.  Other surfactants that will work are tea tree oil in water.

                       

                      Best,

                      Laura

                       

                    • Laura Sims
                      I ve been getting ready for a show and haven t been online for a few days.  Glad you went ahead and started experimenting with the tea tree oil and water
                      Message 10 of 13 , Nov 3, 2013
                        I've been getting ready for a show and haven't been online for a few days.  Glad you went ahead and started experimenting with the tea tree oil and water solution.  Like other surfactants you can make it stronger or weaker according to need.  When I start experimenting I start with a 1/4 cup of water, add a drop, test, drop and test until I get the spread I want.  I usually keep a stronger and weaker concentration to use as needed.  

                        Don Guyot wrote a how to book about suminagashi many years ago.  Nancy Morain (sp?) at Colophon Book Arts may still carry copies.  Of course there is some interesting info online.  

                        Best,
                        Laura


                        On Sunday, November 3, 2013 3:05 AM, Elsje <ploegevd@...> wrote:
                         
                        hi elsje,
                        I tried 2 drip tea tree oil in a glass of water
                        and it works
                        mmmmm it is worth a study
                        it is an exiting moment to see the reaction
                        xxxe
                         
                        Van: Marbling@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Marbling@yahoogroups.com] Namens Elsje
                        Verzonden: donderdag 31 oktober 2013 16:16
                        Aan: Marbling@yahoogroups.com
                        Onderwerp: [Marbling] authentic suminagashi
                         
                         
                        hi Laura,
                         
                        Authentic suminagashi you can do with OX GALL
                        (I have read somewhere but I not yet tried.)
                         
                        I also use DREFT yellow, DISH WASH SOAP
                         
                        Can you give me an idea how much
                        TEA TREE OIL  you use in water ?
                        1 drip and 1 liter water ...
                        or
                        1 drip tea tree oil in a glass (150 cc) of water?
                         
                        xxxelsje
                         
                        Van: Marbling@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Marbling@yahoogroups.com] Namens Laura Sims
                        Verzonden: woensdag 30 oktober 2013 3:14
                        Aan: Marbling@yahoogroups.com
                        Onderwerp: Re: Re: RE: Re: [Marbling] freestyle questions
                         
                         
                        As Sue responded if you are going to do more authentic suminagashi you can use sumi calligraphy ink on plain water with sumi brushes.  Other surfactants that will work are tea tree oil in water.
                         
                        Best,
                        Laura
                         


                      • waistlonghair
                        As a newbie to marbling I was reading about the tea tree oil in water.....is this so that you can use paints that don t float please? Sorry to sound a bit
                        Message 11 of 13 , Feb 4, 2014

                          As a newbie to marbling I was reading about the tea tree oil in water.....is this so that you can use paints that don't float please? Sorry to sound a bit stupid but mixing up floating liquid is very messy and if there is an easier way, then I would be interested.

                          Thank you

                          Brenda 

                        • Bob & Joan Newman
                          Sent from my iPad
                          Message 12 of 13 , Feb 7, 2014
                            Sent from my iPad
                          • waistlonghair
                            Hi got a message from you but it was blank....sent from your ipad.....can you send again please Brenda
                            Message 13 of 13 , Feb 8, 2014

                              Hi got a message from you but it was blank....sent from your ipad.....can you send again please

                              Brenda

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