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Re: [Marbling] new

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  • Laura Sims
    Dear Hallee, Welcome to the group. One paper that works well is Neenah Classic Laid manufactured in Wisconsin. I get it from a southeastern distributor called
    Message 1 of 7 , May 18, 2001
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      Dear Hallee,

      Welcome to the group.

      One paper that works well is Neenah Classic Laid manufactured in Wisconsin.  I get it from a southeastern distributor called Dillard Paper Company.  

      I personally like to use the sponge method for paper since I marble with damp paper, making it more flexible.  I seperate every stack of 10 alummed sheets  with hard board and press them under cinder blocks for an hour before using. With the acrylics I use, Golden, I have to use a higher concentration alum than some people (1 Tbl. to 1 cup) to get it to bond well.

      As for fabric I use 1/2 concentration (1/2 cup to 1 gallon).  I rinse the fabric, but it will still have methyl cellulose in it.  Once it has dried and I heat set it, I will soak the fabrics in water for about an hour so that the MC will disperse into the water and the fabric will again have a soft hand.

      Best, Laura

       

      >From: hhumler@...
      >Reply-To: Marbling@yahoogroups.com
      >To: Marbling@yahoogroups.com
      >Subject: [Marbling] new
      >Date: Fri, 18 May 2001 00:25:34 -0000
      >
      >finally I've read all 600 messages and feel
      >comfortable asking questions!
      > I've been marbling about 7 years. A
      >friend took a class and then showed me. I
      >plunged right in (beginner's lack of
      >knowledge that so many others have
      >problems!) I was a Home Ec teacher at the
      >time and marbled lengths of fabric with my
      >students to make into boxer shorts and
      >duffle bags. I later developed a crafts class
      >and marbling paper and then making books
      >with that paper was a very popular unit.
      >I've since left teaching but not marbling.
      >Now I marble mostly paper but still fabric
      >for duffles and scarves. I've never used
      >anything but methyl cel and ProChem
      >marbling colors and really have no
      >complaints at all. Any problems I have are
      >with my lack of innate color sense - I
      >really struggle with choosing colors to use
      >and also mixing colors.
      > I was so pleased to stumble on this
      >group. I'd like to ask a few questions that
      >don't really seem to have gotten answers in
      >past postings. If they were answered, it
      >seems they went to the questioner thru
      >private e-mail, where I think public
      >posting would have been great - anyway -
      >the questions are -
      > 1. I use 60lb. drawing paper with
      >great results - what specifically do others
      >use? Sources?
      > 2. I dip my paper in alum - quick,
      >easy and no complaints other than a little
      >cockling but I'd like to know the advantages
      >of sponging it on.
      > 3. Rinsing fabric - how much of the
      >methyl cel is it really necessary to get off
      >the first time. For me it seems to act as a
      >stain if I don't get it all off, but that seems
      >to take away some of the color intensity.
      > I'm happy to join the ranks of so many
      >famous people - I have heard of so many of
      >you in my research. I'd be honored to get
      >answers from all!
      > Hallee Humler
      >
      >


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    • Jan Walker
      ... I really like the Loew-Cornell rice paper. Sheets 12x18, sold in packages at AC Moore craft stores for about $10 (US). It is soft but strong and also a
      Message 2 of 7 , May 18, 2001
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        > 1. I use 60lb. drawing paper with
        >great results - what specifically do others
        >use? Sources?

        I really like the Loew-Cornell rice paper. Sheets 12x18, sold in packages
        at AC Moore craft stores for about $10 (US). It is soft but strong and
        also a clean lively white.

        > 2. I dip my paper in alum - quick,
        >easy and no complaints other than a little
        >cockling but I'd like to know the advantages
        >of sponging it on.

        It probably just relates to how much acid residue end up in the paper.
        Probably more from dipping. Sponging on the other hand can be used for
        aesthetic purposes -- when it isn't done evenly, you get extra textured
        effects from the alum hit and miss. (Yes, you get to decide for yourself
        whether this is an advantage or not.)

        > 3. Rinsing fabric - how much of the
        >methyl cel is it really necessary to get off
        >the first time. For me it seems to act as a
        >stain if I don't get it all off, but that seems
        >to take away some of the color intensity.

        By "the first time" I'm guessing that you mean before heat setting the
        paints. I'd say get off as much as practical. The stain you refer to has
        also happened to me with carrageenan. I think I impatiently tried to iron
        the piece while it was still damp so that I could overmarble. The fabric
        picked up yellowy brown marks. Most books say that most paints will set on
        fabric with time, not just with heat. Maybe if you let the fabric sit
        ??some amount of time until the acrylic resins cured, then you could wash
        out more methylcel residue without getting stains or losing color? this is
        purely speculation, not knowing enough about acrylic paints on fabric to be
        authoritative.

        Have fun. And if you run into sources of wisdom on the issues of color
        choice, please post!!
        Jan
      • hhumler@together.net
        ... thanks for the helpful email. clarification,please. Is residual acid good or bad? Thanks for your time hallee
        Message 3 of 7 , May 18, 2001
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          > > 2. I dip my paper in alum - quick,
          > >easy and no complaints other than a little
          > >cockling but I'd like to know the advantages of sponging it on.
          >
          > It probably just relates to how much acid residue end up in the paper.
          > Probably more from dipping. Sponging on the other hand can be used for

          thanks for the helpful email.
          clarification,please. Is residual acid good
          or bad?
          Thanks for your time
          hallee
        • irisnevins
          Some people say the alum residue is bad, others say it preserves paper. True enough, a lot of 100 year old+ books, the covers have deteriorated the paper text
          Message 4 of 7 , May 19, 2001
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            Some people say the alum residue is bad, others say it preserves paper.
            True enough, a lot of 100 year old+ books, the covers have deteriorated the
            paper text block has crumbled, and the marbled papers are intact.

            You can, by the way, get away with 1/2 strength alum solution in most
            cases. Sometimes less, depending on the paper if you are worried about it.

            I always found that quickly sponging was way, way quicker and less messy
            than dipping. You just need to get used to it.

            Iris Nevins
          • serra guney
            Dear the marbling group member, If there is any place to buy from, I suggest you the natural earth colours to use at marbling. It is the only way to get the
            Message 5 of 7 , Jul 12 2:09 AM
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              Dear the marbling group member,

              If there is any place to buy from, I suggest you the natural earth colours
              to use at marbling. It is the only way to get the best result on the
              traditional Turkish Marbling.

              If you want, I can give you some instructions about the places in Istanbul.

              Good Luck on your working
              Serra Guney

              >From: molliann@...
              >Reply-To: Marbling@yahoogroups.com
              >To: Marbling@yahoogroups.com
              >Subject: [Marbling] new
              >Date: Wed, 11 Jul 2001 17:40:55 -0000
              >
              >My elementery students have learned suminagashi and
              >attempted to marbel paper using starch. This next year I would
              >like to introduce the students to Turkish marbling. Please give
              >any suggestions on products to use, best place to buy them, and
              >the paper. Do I have to alum the paper before the students use
              >it?
              >Origin of Marbling? Turkey?
              >

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            • J Dolphin
              Indeed the pages are an absolute delight to read and see! Jill ... From: Tevfik Alparslan BABAOGLU To:
              Message 6 of 7 , Jul 14 3:55 AM
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                Indeed the pages are an absolute delight to read and see!
                Jill
                ----- Original Message -----
                From: "Tevfik Alparslan BABAOGLU" <info@...>
                To: <Marbling@yahoogroups.com>
                Sent: Saturday, July 14, 2001 3:47 AM
                Subject: [Marbling] Re: new


                > Hi,
                >
                > If you want detailed information on Turkish marbling, I would suggest
                > you to visit www.geleneksel-ebru.com where you can find all the
                > details of what you are looking for. We don't have a habit of aluming
                > the paper prior to marbling here in Turkey.
                >
                > Best regards
                >
                > Alparslan
                >
                >
                >
                > --- In Marbling@y..., molliann@a... wrote:
                > > My elementery students have learned suminagashi and
                > > attempted to marbel paper using starch. This next year I would
                > > like to introduce the students to Turkish marbling. Please give
                > > any suggestions on products to use, best place to buy them, and
                > > the paper. Do I have to alum the paper before the students use
                > > it?
                > > Origin of Marbling? Turkey?
                >
                >
                >
                >
                > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                >
                >
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