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marbling silk and cotton

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  • Sue Cole
    I was pre-washing them because Dharma said to as I recall, but I m always looking for shortcuts, so will try just putting them in the alum solution. I DON T
    Message 1 of 9 , Feb 11, 2011
    • 0 Attachment
      I was pre-washing them because Dharma said to as I recall, but I'm always
      looking for shortcuts, so will try just putting them in the alum solution.
      I DON"T prewash them before dyeing them. I use a process where I pwet them,
      put green label silk dyes on them and cook them for 4-6 minuted in the
      microwave in a ventilated tupperware container. If you want more specific
      info, let me know.

      For the long scarves, I have a "helper" made of two clamps on an upside down
      U pice of wood nailed to one end of the tank, but the bandannas so far have
      needed a human helper.

      The only time I've had a failure was when I tried to marble black silk
      scarves - it barely even showed up on them and I was really disappointed
      with them. I usually use flat crepe from Dharma because the design shows on
      both sides and they feel nice.

      I just tried some Jacquard airbrush opaque red for marbling and it came out
      the reddest of any paint I have used so far. Red is the one color I have
      the most trouble with - it comes out pink or orange. Iris would probably
      have some advice on this. I believe she makes her own paints.

      I mix the size to a little thinner than pancake syrup and the paint to about
      the consistency of 2% milk, although in the summer, I'm constantly adjusting
      them because I do the marbling in a tent outside in my yard and we have
      little humidity, so things can evaporate quickly here.

      Here is the link for Mimi's dvd: http://www.marbling.com/ It's very good.
      Also, if you go to www.youtube.com there are lots of videos. Put either
      ebru or marbling in the search box. Sometimes you get ones on marbled
      nails, but keep looking. I eve found one on marbling electric guitars from
      England one time. My favorite though is this one from Australia:
      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=54OILOfT1bs also it has wonderful music from
      singing bowl. They use oil colors, and do huge pieces of cloth, but
      otherwise it's the same. There are lots more links to the right when you go
      there.

      Yes, marbling is addictive, and is different to different people.

      Also, I still have not figured out a way to do christmas ornament balls -
      marbling them on the outside of the ball. Maybe it's just too slick of a
      surface. There are lots of examples of marbling on the inside of clear
      glass ones, but I was hoping to do it on the metallic ones. Guess not, or
      maybe that could be a challenge to someone.

      Also,Diane Maurer has several very good books on marbling and paste paper:
      http://www.dianemaurer.com/

      I just found this one:
      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EwCavLLlM6w&feature=related I don't remember
      that being on there before. You can see the consistency of the size when
      she stirs things. My scarf tray is not quite that wide, but it is that long
      and looks similar.

      Here are two more:

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M_vYehXdppI&NR=1

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vk-Ta7ichz4&feature=related

      Now I need to get off the computer.
      Sue
      Good luck and keep trying.


      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • irisnevins
      Red can be a difficult color, it s why I stick with the cadmium, even though I no longer sell it. People are too lawsuit crazy when they hear heavy metals .
      Message 2 of 9 , Feb 12, 2011
      • 0 Attachment
        Red can be a difficult color, it's why I stick with the cadmium, even though I no longer sell it. People are too lawsuit crazy when they hear "heavy metals". Two of my suppliers stopped carrying it after some legal issues. You can still get it, but I was buying in bulk wholesale, it is very expensive at the 2 oz. level, or even by the pound from a retailer. I just use it for myself now, having bought out the remainder of supplies the second distributor had laying around. I find vermillion and rose madder spread way too much even without dispersant, and that is not "added extra" dispersant, because I make the paint from the actual pigment with none. All I can say is keep trying reds until something works. The only other option is to put the red down first and then use dispersant enough in the following colors to squish it down brighter and redder.

        As for marbling on black or dark fabric, if you add some white to the colors it will make them opaque rather than transparent and they show more. I also use a fair bit of white, for a contrast color, the same way I use black on a white or lighter background.

        Iris Nevins
        wwwmarblingpaper.com
        ----- Original Message -----
        From: Sue Cole<mailto:akartisan@...>
        To: Marbling@yahoogroups.com<mailto:Marbling@yahoogroups.com>
        Sent: Saturday, February 12, 2011 1:18 AM
        Subject: [Marbling] marbling silk and cotton


        I was pre-washing them because Dharma said to as I recall, but I'm always
        looking for shortcuts, so will try just putting them in the alum solution.
        I DON"T prewash them before dyeing them. I use a process where I pwet them,
        put green label silk dyes on them and cook them for 4-6 minuted in the
        microwave in a ventilated tupperware container. If you want more specific
        info, let me know.

        For the long scarves, I have a "helper" made of two clamps on an upside down
        U pice of wood nailed to one end of the tank, but the bandannas so far have
        needed a human helper.

        The only time I've had a failure was when I tried to marble black silk
        scarves - it barely even showed up on them and I was really disappointed
        with them. I usually use flat crepe from Dharma because the design shows on
        both sides and they feel nice.

        I just tried some Jacquard airbrush opaque red for marbling and it came out
        the reddest of any paint I have used so far. Red is the one color I have
        the most trouble with - it comes out pink or orange. Iris would probably
        have some advice on this. I believe she makes her own paints.

        I mix the size to a little thinner than pancake syrup and the paint to about
        the consistency of 2% milk, although in the summer, I'm constantly adjusting
        them because I do the marbling in a tent outside in my yard and we have
        little humidity, so things can evaporate quickly here.

        Here is the link for Mimi's dvd: http://www.marbling.com/<http://www.marbling.com/> It's very good.
        Also, if you go to www.youtube.com<http://www.youtube.com/> there are lots of videos. Put either
        ebru or marbling in the search box. Sometimes you get ones on marbled
        nails, but keep looking. I eve found one on marbling electric guitars from
        England one time. My favorite though is this one from Australia:
        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=54OILOfT1bs<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=54OILOfT1bs> also it has wonderful music from
        singing bowl. They use oil colors, and do huge pieces of cloth, but
        otherwise it's the same. There are lots more links to the right when you go
        there.

        Yes, marbling is addictive, and is different to different people.

        Also, I still have not figured out a way to do christmas ornament balls -
        marbling them on the outside of the ball. Maybe it's just too slick of a
        surface. There are lots of examples of marbling on the inside of clear
        glass ones, but I was hoping to do it on the metallic ones. Guess not, or
        maybe that could be a challenge to someone.

        Also,Diane Maurer has several very good books on marbling and paste paper:
        http://www.dianemaurer.com/<http://www.dianemaurer.com/>

        I just found this one:
        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EwCavLLlM6w&feature=related<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EwCavLLlM6w&feature=related> I don't remember
        that being on there before. You can see the consistency of the size when
        she stirs things. My scarf tray is not quite that wide, but it is that long
        and looks similar.

        Here are two more:

        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M_vYehXdppI&NR=1<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M_vYehXdppI&NR=1>

        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vk-Ta7ichz4&feature=related<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vk-Ta7ichz4&feature=related>

        Now I need to get off the computer.
        Sue
        Good luck and keep trying.


        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



        ------------------------------------

        Yahoo! Groups Links





        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • marines bengoa
        I don t have any problems with red. Could it be because I use water colored paints? ________________________________ From: irisnevins
        Message 3 of 9 , Feb 12, 2011
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          I don't have any problems with red. Could it be because I use water colored
          paints?




          ________________________________
          From: irisnevins <irisnevins@...>
          To: Marbling@yahoogroups.com
          Sent: Sat, February 12, 2011 8:32:57 AM
          Subject: Re: [Marbling] marbling silk and cotton

           
          Red can be a difficult color, it's why I stick with the cadmium, even though I
          no longer sell it. People are too lawsuit crazy when they hear "heavy metals".
          Two of my suppliers stopped carrying it after some legal issues. You can still
          get it, but I was buying in bulk wholesale, it is very expensive at the 2 oz.
          level, or even by the pound from a retailer. I just use it for myself now,
          having bought out the remainder of supplies the second distributor had laying
          around. I find vermillion and rose madder spread way too much even without
          dispersant, and that is not "added extra" dispersant, because I make the paint
          from the actual pigment with none. All I can say is keep trying reds until
          something works. The only other option is to put the red down first and then use
          dispersant enough in the following colors to squish it down brighter and redder.


          As for marbling on black or dark fabric, if you add some white to the colors it
          will make them opaque rather than transparent and they show more. I also use a
          fair bit of white, for a contrast color, the same way I use black on a white or
          lighter background.

          Iris Nevins
          wwwmarblingpaper.com
          ----- Original Message -----
          From: Sue Cole<mailto:akartisan@...>
          To: Marbling@yahoogroups.com<mailto:Marbling@yahoogroups.com>
          Sent: Saturday, February 12, 2011 1:18 AM
          Subject: [Marbling] marbling silk and cotton

          I was pre-washing them because Dharma said to as I recall, but I'm always
          looking for shortcuts, so will try just putting them in the alum solution.
          I DON"T prewash them before dyeing them. I use a process where I pwet them,
          put green label silk dyes on them and cook them for 4-6 minuted in the
          microwave in a ventilated tupperware container. If you want more specific
          info, let me know.

          For the long scarves, I have a "helper" made of two clamps on an upside down
          U pice of wood nailed to one end of the tank, but the bandannas so far have
          needed a human helper.

          The only time I've had a failure was when I tried to marble black silk
          scarves - it barely even showed up on them and I was really disappointed
          with them. I usually use flat crepe from Dharma because the design shows on
          both sides and they feel nice.

          I just tried some Jacquard airbrush opaque red for marbling and it came out
          the reddest of any paint I have used so far. Red is the one color I have
          the most trouble with - it comes out pink or orange. Iris would probably
          have some advice on this. I believe she makes her own paints.

          I mix the size to a little thinner than pancake syrup and the paint to about
          the consistency of 2% milk, although in the summer, I'm constantly adjusting
          them because I do the marbling in a tent outside in my yard and we have
          little humidity, so things can evaporate quickly here.

          Here is the link for Mimi's dvd:
          http://www.marbling.com/<http://www.marbling.com/> It's very good.
          Also, if you go to www.youtube.com<http://www.youtube.com/> there are lots of
          videos. Put either
          ebru or marbling in the search box. Sometimes you get ones on marbled
          nails, but keep looking. I eve found one on marbling electric guitars from
          England one time. My favorite though is this one from Australia:
          http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=54OILOfT1bs<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=54OILOfT1bs>
          also it has wonderful music from
          singing bowl. They use oil colors, and do huge pieces of cloth, but
          otherwise it's the same. There are lots more links to the right when you go
          there.

          Yes, marbling is addictive, and is different to different people.

          Also, I still have not figured out a way to do christmas ornament balls -
          marbling them on the outside of the ball. Maybe it's just too slick of a
          surface. There are lots of examples of marbling on the inside of clear
          glass ones, but I was hoping to do it on the metallic ones. Guess not, or
          maybe that could be a challenge to someone.

          Also,Diane Maurer has several very good books on marbling and paste paper:
          http://www.dianemaurer.com/<http://www.dianemaurer.com/>

          I just found this one:
          http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EwCavLLlM6w&feature=related<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EwCavLLlM6w&feature=related>
          I don't remember
          that being on there before. You can see the consistency of the size when
          she stirs things. My scarf tray is not quite that wide, but it is that long
          and looks similar.

          Here are two more:

          http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M_vYehXdppI&NR=1<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M_vYehXdppI&NR=1>


          http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vk-Ta7ichz4&feature=related<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vk-Ta7ichz4&feature=related>


          Now I need to get off the computer.
          Sue
          Good luck and keep trying.

          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

          ------------------------------------

          Yahoo! Groups Links

          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]







          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • irisnevins
          It s not the paint type or brand, it s the particular pigment. Is it cadmium red? That works great. Most pigments are not friendly to marbling. Iris Nevins
          Message 4 of 9 , Feb 12, 2011
          • 0 Attachment
            It's not the paint type or brand, it's the particular pigment. Is it cadmium red? That works great. Most pigments are not friendly to marbling.
            Iris Nevins
            www.marblingpaper.com<http://www.marblingpaper.com/>

            ----- Original Message -----
            From: marines bengoa<mailto:mbengoaduprey@...>
            To: Marbling@yahoogroups.com<mailto:Marbling@yahoogroups.com>
            Sent: Saturday, February 12, 2011 9:10 AM
            Subject: Re: [Marbling] marbling silk and cotton


            I don't have any problems with red. Could it be because I use water colored
            paints?




            ________________________________
            From: irisnevins <irisnevins@...<mailto:irisnevins@...>>
            To: Marbling@yahoogroups.com<mailto:Marbling@yahoogroups.com>
            Sent: Sat, February 12, 2011 8:32:57 AM
            Subject: Re: [Marbling] marbling silk and cotton


            Red can be a difficult color, it's why I stick with the cadmium, even though I
            no longer sell it. People are too lawsuit crazy when they hear "heavy metals".
            Two of my suppliers stopped carrying it after some legal issues. You can still
            get it, but I was buying in bulk wholesale, it is very expensive at the 2 oz.
            level, or even by the pound from a retailer. I just use it for myself now,
            having bought out the remainder of supplies the second distributor had laying
            around. I find vermillion and rose madder spread way too much even without
            dispersant, and that is not "added extra" dispersant, because I make the paint
            from the actual pigment with none. All I can say is keep trying reds until
            something works. The only other option is to put the red down first and then use
            dispersant enough in the following colors to squish it down brighter and redder.


            As for marbling on black or dark fabric, if you add some white to the colors it
            will make them opaque rather than transparent and they show more. I also use a
            fair bit of white, for a contrast color, the same way I use black on a white or
            lighter background.

            Iris Nevins
            wwwmarblingpaper.com
            ----- Original Message -----
            From: Sue Cole<mailto:akartisan@...<mailto:akartisan@...>>
            To: Marbling@yahoogroups.com<mailto:Marbling@yahoogroups.com<mailto:Marbling@yahoogroups.com%3Cmailto:Marbling@yahoogroups.com>>
            Sent: Saturday, February 12, 2011 1:18 AM
            Subject: [Marbling] marbling silk and cotton

            I was pre-washing them because Dharma said to as I recall, but I'm always
            looking for shortcuts, so will try just putting them in the alum solution.
            I DON"T prewash them before dyeing them. I use a process where I pwet them,
            put green label silk dyes on them and cook them for 4-6 minuted in the
            microwave in a ventilated tupperware container. If you want more specific
            info, let me know.

            For the long scarves, I have a "helper" made of two clamps on an upside down
            U pice of wood nailed to one end of the tank, but the bandannas so far have
            needed a human helper.

            The only time I've had a failure was when I tried to marble black silk
            scarves - it barely even showed up on them and I was really disappointed
            with them. I usually use flat crepe from Dharma because the design shows on
            both sides and they feel nice.

            I just tried some Jacquard airbrush opaque red for marbling and it came out
            the reddest of any paint I have used so far. Red is the one color I have
            the most trouble with - it comes out pink or orange. Iris would probably
            have some advice on this. I believe she makes her own paints.

            I mix the size to a little thinner than pancake syrup and the paint to about
            the consistency of 2% milk, although in the summer, I'm constantly adjusting
            them because I do the marbling in a tent outside in my yard and we have
            little humidity, so things can evaporate quickly here.

            Here is the link for Mimi's dvd:
            http://www.marbling.com/<http://www.marbling.com/<http://www.marbling.com/%3Chttp://www.marbling.com/>> It's very good.
            Also, if you go to www.youtube.com<http://www.youtube.com/<http://www.youtube.com%3chttp//www.youtube.com/>> there are lots of
            videos. Put either
            ebru or marbling in the search box. Sometimes you get ones on marbled
            nails, but keep looking. I eve found one on marbling electric guitars from
            England one time. My favorite though is this one from Australia:
            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=54OILOfT1bs<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=54OILOfT1bs<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=54OILOfT1bs<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=54OILOfT1bs>>
            also it has wonderful music from
            singing bowl. They use oil colors, and do huge pieces of cloth, but
            otherwise it's the same. There are lots more links to the right when you go
            there.

            Yes, marbling is addictive, and is different to different people.

            Also, I still have not figured out a way to do christmas ornament balls -
            marbling them on the outside of the ball. Maybe it's just too slick of a
            surface. There are lots of examples of marbling on the inside of clear
            glass ones, but I was hoping to do it on the metallic ones. Guess not, or
            maybe that could be a challenge to someone.

            Also,Diane Maurer has several very good books on marbling and paste paper:
            http://www.dianemaurer.com/<http://www.dianemaurer.com/<http://www.dianemaurer.com/%3Chttp://www.dianemaurer.com/>>

            I just found this one:
            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EwCavLLlM6w&feature=related<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EwCavLLlM6w&feature=related<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EwCavLLlM6w&feature=related<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EwCavLLlM6w&feature=related>>
            I don't remember
            that being on there before. You can see the consistency of the size when
            she stirs things. My scarf tray is not quite that wide, but it is that long
            and looks similar.

            Here are two more:

            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M_vYehXdppI&NR=1<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M_vYehXdppI&NR=1<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M_vYehXdppI&NR=1<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M_vYehXdppI&NR=1>>


            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vk-Ta7ichz4&feature=related<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vk-Ta7ichz4&feature=related<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vk-Ta7ichz4&feature=related<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vk-Ta7ichz4&feature=related>>


            Now I need to get off the computer.
            Sue
            Good luck and keep trying.

            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

            ------------------------------------

            Yahoo! Groups Links

            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]







            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



            ------------------------------------

            Yahoo! Groups Links





            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • Deluwiel Xox
            I m going to try methocel to compare to the carageenan to see how my Jacquard and Spectralite colors respond.  Waiting to receive my order.  If I m still not
            Message 5 of 9 , Feb 13, 2011
            • 0 Attachment
              I'm going to try methocel to compare to the carageenan to see how my Jacquard and Spectralite colors respond.  Waiting to receive my order.  If I'm still not getting what I want I'll give the Golden acrylics a whirl.

              I've also tried marbling on black silk and the colors simply don't show up.  Even opaque white comes out gray.  I'll try mixing white in with the other colors and see what happens. 

              I'm curious about the use of oil color.  I had ordered some solvent-based ink in the three primary colors: http://www.kardsandkrafts.co.uk/art-materials-marbling-inks.irc?id=35248&pg=2%c2%a0%c2%a0 But when I would drop one color it would instantly disperse, appearing
              to completely disappear.  Subsequent drops would float, but when I went
              to swirl the colors it had formed a skin on top of the size and my tool
              just dragged and pulled it all off.  What's up with that?


              I'm going to cut swatches of habotai to
              experiment on rather than using my scarves.  I also ordered the Peggy
              Skycraft DVD from Dharma.

              I'll keep plugging away - the process fascinates me, and I love that every result is like a little surprise!

               --- On Fri, 2/11/11, Sue Cole <akartisan@...> wrote:

              From: Sue Cole <akartisan@...>
              Subject: [Marbling] marbling silk and cotton
              To: Marbling@yahoogroups.com
              Date: Friday, February 11, 2011, 11:18 PM







               









              I was pre-washing them because Dharma said to as I recall, but I'm always

              looking for shortcuts, so will try just putting them in the alum solution.

              I DON"T prewash them before dyeing them. I use a process where I pwet them,

              put green label silk dyes on them and cook them for 4-6 minuted in the

              microwave in a ventilated tupperware container. If you want more specific

              info, let me know.



              For the long scarves, I have a "helper" made of two clamps on an upside down

              U pice of wood nailed to one end of the tank, but the bandannas so far have

              needed a human helper.



              The only time I've had a failure was when I tried to marble black silk

              scarves - it barely even showed up on them and I was really disappointed

              with them. I usually use flat crepe from Dharma because the design shows on

              both sides and they feel nice.



              I just tried some Jacquard airbrush opaque red for marbling and it came out

              the reddest of any paint I have used so far. Red is the one color I have

              the most trouble with - it comes out pink or orange. Iris would probably

              have some advice on this. I believe she makes her own paints.



              I mix the size to a little thinner than pancake syrup and the paint to about

              the consistency of 2% milk, although in the summer, I'm constantly adjusting

              them because I do the marbling in a tent outside in my yard and we have

              little humidity, so things can evaporate quickly here.



              Here is the link for Mimi's dvd: http://www.marbling.com/ It's very good.

              Also, if you go to www.youtube.com there are lots of videos. Put either

              ebru or marbling in the search box. Sometimes you get ones on marbled

              nails, but keep looking. I eve found one on marbling electric guitars from

              England one time. My favorite though is this one from Australia:

              http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=54OILOfT1bs also it has wonderful music from

              singing bowl. They use oil colors, and do huge pieces of cloth, but

              otherwise it's the same. There are lots more links to the right when you go

              there.



              Yes, marbling is addictive, and is different to different people.



              Also, I still have not figured out a way to do christmas ornament balls -

              marbling them on the outside of the ball. Maybe it's just too slick of a

              surface. There are lots of examples of marbling on the inside of clear

              glass ones, but I was hoping to do it on the metallic ones. Guess not, or

              maybe that could be a challenge to someone.



              Also,Diane Maurer has several very good books on marbling and paste paper:

              http://www.dianemaurer.com/



              I just found this one:

              http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EwCavLLlM6w&feature=related I don't remember

              that being on there before. You can see the consistency of the size when

              she stirs things. My scarf tray is not quite that wide, but it is that long

              and looks similar.



              Here are two more:



              http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M_vYehXdppI&NR=1



              http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vk-Ta7ichz4&feature=related



              Now I need to get off the computer.

              Sue

              Good luck and keep trying.



              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

























              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • Laura Sims
              I will look forward to hearing how the Jacquard s work for you on methocel.  I have used Golden fluid acrylics for over 20 years and get my most saturated red
              Message 6 of 9 , Feb 17, 2011
              • 0 Attachment
                I will look forward to hearing how the Jacquard's work for you on methocel.  I have used Golden fluid acrylics for over 20 years and get my most saturated red with their Pyrrole Red.  I also use it earlier to get concentrated veins of red as accents.  However, Golden does have a cadmium red available that I've not used.  As for marbling on black , metalic paints work well.  By adding a bit of  titanium white or buff  to some of the other colors they will become more opaque.  (Most likely you are using organic pigments that have a stained glass property.)  Also creating concentrated veins of color makes a big difference.  If you use a surfactant to create clear "windows" you get more contrast with the black fabric.  At some point you may want to pursue dyeing your fabric before marbling it.

                Best,
                Laura Sims
                indigostonestudio.com


                --- On Sun, 2/13/11, Deluwiel Xox <deluwiel1209@...> wrote:

                From: Deluwiel Xox <deluwiel1209@...>
                Subject: Re:
                [Marbling] marbling silk and cotton
                To: Marbling@yahoogroups.com
                Date: Sunday, February 13, 2011, 11:49 AM







                 









                I'm going to try methocel to compare to the carageenan to see how my Jacquard and Spectralite colors respond.  Waiting to receive my order.  If I'm still not getting what I want I'll give the Golden acrylics a whirl.



                I've also tried marbling on black silk and the colors simply don't show up.  Even opaque white comes out gray.  I'll try mixing white in with the other colors and see what happens. 



                I'm curious about the use of oil color.  I had ordered some solvent-based ink in the three primary colors: http://www.kardsandkrafts.co.uk/art-materials-marbling-inks.irc?id=35248&pg=2%c2%a0%c2%a0 But when I would drop one color it would instantly disperse, appearing

                to completely disappear.  Subsequent drops would float, but when I went

                to swirl the colors it had formed a skin on top of the size and my tool

                just dragged and pulled it all off.  What's up with that?



                I'm going to cut swatches of habotai to

                experiment on rather than using my scarves.  I also ordered the Peggy

                Skycraft DVD from Dharma.



                I'll keep plugging away - the process fascinates me, and I love that every result is like a little surprise!



                 --- On Fri, 2/11/11, Sue Cole <akartisan@...> wrote:



                From: Sue Cole <akartisan@...>

                Subject: [Marbling] marbling silk and cotton

                To: Marbling@yahoogroups.com

                Date: Friday, February 11, 2011, 11:18 PM



                 



                I was pre-washing them because Dharma said to as I recall, but I'm always



                looking for shortcuts, so will try just putting them in the alum solution.



                I DON"T prewash them before dyeing them. I use a process where I pwet them,



                put green label silk dyes on them and cook them for 4-6 minuted in the



                microwave in a ventilated tupperware container. If you want more specific



                info, let me know.



                For the long scarves, I have a "helper" made of two clamps on an upside down



                U pice of wood nailed to one end of the tank, but the bandannas so far have



                needed a human helper.



                The only time I've had a failure was when I tried to marble black silk



                scarves - it barely even showed up on them and I was really disappointed



                with them. I usually use flat crepe from Dharma because the design shows on



                both sides and they feel nice.



                I just tried some Jacquard airbrush opaque red for marbling and it came out



                the reddest of any paint I have used so far. Red is the one color I have



                the most trouble with - it comes out pink or orange. Iris would probably



                have some advice on this. I believe she makes her own paints.



                I mix the size to a little thinner than pancake syrup and the paint to about



                the consistency of 2% milk, although in the summer, I'm constantly adjusting



                them because I do the marbling in a tent outside in my yard and we have



                little humidity, so things can evaporate quickly here.



                Here is the link for Mimi's dvd: http://www.marbling.com/ It's very good.



                Also, if you go to www.youtube.com there are lots of videos. Put either



                ebru or marbling in the search box. Sometimes you get ones on marbled



                nails, but keep looking. I eve found one on marbling electric guitars from



                England one time. My favorite though is this one from Australia:



                http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=54OILOfT1bs also it has wonderful music from



                singing bowl. They use oil colors, and do huge pieces of cloth, but



                otherwise it's the same. There are lots more links to the right when you go



                there.



                Yes, marbling is addictive, and is different to different people.



                Also, I still have not figured out a way to do christmas ornament balls -



                marbling them on the outside of the ball. Maybe it's just too slick of a



                surface. There are lots of examples of marbling on the inside of clear



                glass ones, but I was hoping to do it on the metallic ones. Guess not, or



                maybe that could be a challenge to someone.



                Also,Diane Maurer has several very good books on marbling and paste paper:



                http://www.dianemaurer.com/



                I just found this one:



                http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EwCavLLlM6w&feature=related I don't remember



                that being on there before. You can see the consistency of the size when



                she stirs things. My scarf tray is not quite that wide, but it is that long



                and looks similar.



                Here are two more:



                http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M_vYehXdppI&NR=1



                http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vk-Ta7ichz4&feature=related



                Now I need to get off the computer.



                Sue



                Good luck and keep trying.



                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

























                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • irisnevins
                Yes Laura...that s something that is such a habit with me, making holes or windows in a design, with gall water for paper or a little diluted Photo-Flo for
                Message 7 of 9 , Feb 17, 2011
                • 0 Attachment
                  Yes Laura...that's something that is such a habit with me, making holes or windows in a design, with gall water for paper or a little diluted Photo-Flo for acrylics, that I forgot to even mention it. I do it all the time, it adds "pop" and life and contrast! You can add too much though and make the color run... needs a bit of experimenting!

                  Also sometimes people esp. beginners make the mistake of thinking more and more color piled on will give a darker or denser shade. What it does after that "just enough" line is crossed, is make paints sink or run off, thus giving a paler shade. This leaves people confused. A bit more water to dilute or dispersant for a thinner application often allows a denser color. it's a thought I may elaborate on for a future article!
                  Iris
                  ----- Original Message -----
                  From: Laura Sims<mailto:indigostone2@...>
                  To: Marbling@yahoogroups.com<mailto:Marbling@yahoogroups.com>
                  Sent: Thursday, February 17, 2011 11:39 AM
                  Subject: Re: [Marbling] marbling silk and cotton


                  I will look forward to hearing how the Jacquard's work for you on methocel. I have used Golden fluid acrylics for over 20 years and get my most saturated red with their Pyrrole Red. I also use it earlier to get concentrated veins of red as accents. However, Golden does have a cadmium red available that I've not used. As for marbling on black , metalic paints work well. By adding a bit of titanium white or buff to some of the other colors they will become more opaque. (Most likely you are using organic pigments that have a stained glass property.) Also creating concentrated veins of color makes a big difference. If you use a surfactant to create clear "windows" you get more contrast with the black fabric. At some point you may want to pursue dyeing your fabric before marbling it.

                  Best,
                  Laura Sims
                  indigostonestudio.com


                  --- On Sun, 2/13/11, Deluwiel Xox <deluwiel1209@...<mailto:deluwiel1209@...>> wrote:

                  From: Deluwiel Xox <deluwiel1209@...<mailto:deluwiel1209@...>>
                  Subject: Re:
                  [Marbling] marbling silk and cotton
                  To: Marbling@yahoogroups.com<mailto:Marbling@yahoogroups.com>
                  Date: Sunday, February 13, 2011, 11:49 AM

















                  I'm going to try methocel to compare to the carageenan to see how my Jacquard and Spectralite colors respond. Waiting to receive my order. If I'm still not getting what I want I'll give the Golden acrylics a whirl.



                  I've also tried marbling on black silk and the colors simply don't show up. Even opaque white comes out gray. I'll try mixing white in with the other colors and see what happens.



                  I'm curious about the use of oil color. I had ordered some solvent-based ink in the three primary colors: http://www.kardsandkrafts.co.uk/art-materials-marbling-inks.irc?id=35248&pg=2<http://www.kardsandkrafts.co.uk/art-materials-marbling-inks.irc?id=35248&pg=2> But when I would drop one color it would instantly disperse, appearing

                  to completely disappear. Subsequent drops would float, but when I went

                  to swirl the colors it had formed a skin on top of the size and my tool

                  just dragged and pulled it all off. What's up with that?



                  I'm going to cut swatches of habotai to

                  experiment on rather than using my scarves. I also ordered the Peggy

                  Skycraft DVD from Dharma.



                  I'll keep plugging away - the process fascinates me, and I love that every result is like a little surprise!



                  --- On Fri, 2/11/11, Sue Cole <akartisan@...<mailto:akartisan@...>> wrote:



                  From: Sue Cole <akartisan@...<mailto:akartisan@...>>

                  Subject: [Marbling] marbling silk and cotton

                  To: Marbling@yahoogroups.com<mailto:Marbling@yahoogroups.com>

                  Date: Friday, February 11, 2011, 11:18 PM







                  I was pre-washing them because Dharma said to as I recall, but I'm always



                  looking for shortcuts, so will try just putting them in the alum solution.



                  I DON"T prewash them before dyeing them. I use a process where I pwet them,



                  put green label silk dyes on them and cook them for 4-6 minuted in the



                  microwave in a ventilated tupperware container. If you want more specific



                  info, let me know.



                  For the long scarves, I have a "helper" made of two clamps on an upside down



                  U pice of wood nailed to one end of the tank, but the bandannas so far have



                  needed a human helper.



                  The only time I've had a failure was when I tried to marble black silk



                  scarves - it barely even showed up on them and I was really disappointed



                  with them. I usually use flat crepe from Dharma because the design shows on



                  both sides and they feel nice.



                  I just tried some Jacquard airbrush opaque red for marbling and it came out



                  the reddest of any paint I have used so far. Red is the one color I have



                  the most trouble with - it comes out pink or orange. Iris would probably



                  have some advice on this. I believe she makes her own paints.



                  I mix the size to a little thinner than pancake syrup and the paint to about



                  the consistency of 2% milk, although in the summer, I'm constantly adjusting



                  them because I do the marbling in a tent outside in my yard and we have



                  little humidity, so things can evaporate quickly here.



                  Here is the link for Mimi's dvd: http://www.marbling.com/<http://www.marbling.com/> It's very good.



                  Also, if you go to www.youtube.com<http://www.youtube.com/> there are lots of videos. Put either



                  ebru or marbling in the search box. Sometimes you get ones on marbled



                  nails, but keep looking. I eve found one on marbling electric guitars from



                  England one time. My favorite though is this one from Australia:



                  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=54OILOfT1bs<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=54OILOfT1bs> also it has wonderful music from



                  singing bowl. They use oil colors, and do huge pieces of cloth, but



                  otherwise it's the same. There are lots more links to the right when you go



                  there.



                  Yes, marbling is addictive, and is different to different people.



                  Also, I still have not figured out a way to do christmas ornament balls -



                  marbling them on the outside of the ball. Maybe it's just too slick of a



                  surface. There are lots of examples of marbling on the inside of clear



                  glass ones, but I was hoping to do it on the metallic ones. Guess not, or



                  maybe that could be a challenge to someone.



                  Also,Diane Maurer has several very good books on marbling and paste paper:



                  http://www.dianemaurer.com/<http://www.dianemaurer.com/>



                  I just found this one:



                  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EwCavLLlM6w&feature=related<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EwCavLLlM6w&feature=related> I don't remember



                  that being on there before. You can see the consistency of the size when



                  she stirs things. My scarf tray is not quite that wide, but it is that long



                  and looks similar.



                  Here are two more:



                  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M_vYehXdppI&NR=1<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M_vYehXdppI&NR=1>



                  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vk-Ta7ichz4&feature=related<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vk-Ta7ichz4&feature=related>



                  Now I need to get off the computer.



                  Sue



                  Good luck and keep trying.



                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

























                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



                  ------------------------------------

                  Yahoo! Groups Links





                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • irisnevins
                  PS... in my other life as a Celtic Harper and Guitarist.... we often say the spaces are as important as the notes. In the case of marbling I feel the same. The
                  Message 8 of 9 , Feb 17, 2011
                  • 0 Attachment
                    PS... in my other life as a Celtic Harper and Guitarist.... we often say the spaces are as important as the notes. In the case of marbling I feel the same. The contrast adds a lot.

                    Iris Nevins
                    www.marblingpaper.com<http://www.marblingpaper.com/>

                    ----- Original Message -----
                    From: Laura Sims<mailto:indigostone2@...>
                    To: Marbling@yahoogroups.com<mailto:Marbling@yahoogroups.com>
                    Sent: Thursday, February 17, 2011 11:39 AM
                    Subject: Re: [Marbling] marbling silk and cotton


                    I will look forward to hearing how the Jacquard's work for you on methocel. I have used Golden fluid acrylics for over 20 years and get my most saturated red with their Pyrrole Red. I also use it earlier to get concentrated veins of red as accents. However, Golden does have a cadmium red available that I've not used. As for marbling on black , metalic paints work well. By adding a bit of titanium white or buff to some of the other colors they will become more opaque. (Most likely you are using organic pigments that have a stained glass property.) Also creating concentrated veins of color makes a big difference. If you use a surfactant to create clear "windows" you get more contrast with the black fabric. At some point you may want to pursue dyeing your fabric before marbling it.

                    Best,
                    Laura Sims
                    indigostonestudio.com


                    --- On Sun, 2/13/11, Deluwiel Xox <deluwiel1209@...<mailto:deluwiel1209@...>> wrote:

                    From: Deluwiel Xox <deluwiel1209@...<mailto:deluwiel1209@...>>
                    Subject: Re:
                    [Marbling] marbling silk and cotton
                    To: Marbling@yahoogroups.com<mailto:Marbling@yahoogroups.com>
                    Date: Sunday, February 13, 2011, 11:49 AM

















                    I'm going to try methocel to compare to the carageenan to see how my Jacquard and Spectralite colors respond. Waiting to receive my order. If I'm still not getting what I want I'll give the Golden acrylics a whirl.



                    I've also tried marbling on black silk and the colors simply don't show up. Even opaque white comes out gray. I'll try mixing white in with the other colors and see what happens.



                    I'm curious about the use of oil color. I had ordered some solvent-based ink in the three primary colors: http://www.kardsandkrafts.co.uk/art-materials-marbling-inks.irc?id=35248&pg=2<http://www.kardsandkrafts.co.uk/art-materials-marbling-inks.irc?id=35248&pg=2> But when I would drop one color it would instantly disperse, appearing

                    to completely disappear. Subsequent drops would float, but when I went

                    to swirl the colors it had formed a skin on top of the size and my tool

                    just dragged and pulled it all off. What's up with that?



                    I'm going to cut swatches of habotai to

                    experiment on rather than using my scarves. I also ordered the Peggy

                    Skycraft DVD from Dharma.



                    I'll keep plugging away - the process fascinates me, and I love that every result is like a little surprise!



                    --- On Fri, 2/11/11, Sue Cole <akartisan@...<mailto:akartisan@...>> wrote:



                    From: Sue Cole <akartisan@...<mailto:akartisan@...>>

                    Subject: [Marbling] marbling silk and cotton

                    To: Marbling@yahoogroups.com<mailto:Marbling@yahoogroups.com>

                    Date: Friday, February 11, 2011, 11:18 PM







                    I was pre-washing them because Dharma said to as I recall, but I'm always



                    looking for shortcuts, so will try just putting them in the alum solution.



                    I DON"T prewash them before dyeing them. I use a process where I pwet them,



                    put green label silk dyes on them and cook them for 4-6 minuted in the



                    microwave in a ventilated tupperware container. If you want more specific



                    info, let me know.



                    For the long scarves, I have a "helper" made of two clamps on an upside down



                    U pice of wood nailed to one end of the tank, but the bandannas so far have



                    needed a human helper.



                    The only time I've had a failure was when I tried to marble black silk



                    scarves - it barely even showed up on them and I was really disappointed



                    with them. I usually use flat crepe from Dharma because the design shows on



                    both sides and they feel nice.



                    I just tried some Jacquard airbrush opaque red for marbling and it came out



                    the reddest of any paint I have used so far. Red is the one color I have



                    the most trouble with - it comes out pink or orange. Iris would probably



                    have some advice on this. I believe she makes her own paints.



                    I mix the size to a little thinner than pancake syrup and the paint to about



                    the consistency of 2% milk, although in the summer, I'm constantly adjusting



                    them because I do the marbling in a tent outside in my yard and we have



                    little humidity, so things can evaporate quickly here.



                    Here is the link for Mimi's dvd: http://www.marbling.com/<http://www.marbling.com/> It's very good.



                    Also, if you go to www.youtube.com<http://www.youtube.com/> there are lots of videos. Put either



                    ebru or marbling in the search box. Sometimes you get ones on marbled



                    nails, but keep looking. I eve found one on marbling electric guitars from



                    England one time. My favorite though is this one from Australia:



                    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=54OILOfT1bs<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=54OILOfT1bs> also it has wonderful music from



                    singing bowl. They use oil colors, and do huge pieces of cloth, but



                    otherwise it's the same. There are lots more links to the right when you go



                    there.



                    Yes, marbling is addictive, and is different to different people.



                    Also, I still have not figured out a way to do christmas ornament balls -



                    marbling them on the outside of the ball. Maybe it's just too slick of a



                    surface. There are lots of examples of marbling on the inside of clear



                    glass ones, but I was hoping to do it on the metallic ones. Guess not, or



                    maybe that could be a challenge to someone.



                    Also,Diane Maurer has several very good books on marbling and paste paper:



                    http://www.dianemaurer.com/<http://www.dianemaurer.com/>



                    I just found this one:



                    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EwCavLLlM6w&feature=related<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EwCavLLlM6w&feature=related> I don't remember



                    that being on there before. You can see the consistency of the size when



                    she stirs things. My scarf tray is not quite that wide, but it is that long



                    and looks similar.



                    Here are two more:



                    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M_vYehXdppI&NR=1<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M_vYehXdppI&NR=1>



                    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vk-Ta7ichz4&feature=related<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vk-Ta7ichz4&feature=related>



                    Now I need to get off the computer.



                    Sue



                    Good luck and keep trying.



                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

























                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



                    ------------------------------------

                    Yahoo! Groups Links





                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  • Deluwiel Xox
                    Well, the Jacquard colors work beautifully on my methocel size.  I like the ease of mixing it up better and since I can t devote entire days to marbling (I
                    Message 9 of 9 , Feb 18, 2011
                    • 0 Attachment
                      Well, the Jacquard colors work beautifully on my methocel size.  I like the ease of mixing it up better and since I can't devote entire days to marbling (I wish!) the fact that it lasts longer than the carageenan makes it a more sensible choice.  I did watch an instructional DVD by Peggy Skycraft and she gave a good demonstration of the desired viscosity of the size, and I finally think I got that problem solved (I've concluded that the source of most of my color problems was that I mixed the size too thin).  Also, actually watching a marbler in action was worth 10,000 words to me!  I'm mixing custom colors in cups rather than using them right out of the bottle and they have so much more depth.  Very excited with my first results since making these adjustments.

                      Laura - I went to your website and your scarves are simply stunning!  Now that I can get my colors more intense and bright, I'll definitely be trying marbling over dye.  I'll be playing with the negative space technique also.  So many possibilities there!

                      Iris, your papers are incredible!  The more I see the more I love this art.  Thanks to all for sharing your expertise with a novice...

                      Deb

                      --- On Thu, 2/17/11, irisnevins <irisnevins@...> wrote:

                      From: irisnevins <irisnevins@...>
                      Subject: Re: [Marbling] marbling silk and cotton
                      To: Marbling@yahoogroups.com
                      Date: Thursday, February 17, 2011, 11:33 AM







                       









                      Yes Laura...that's something that is such a habit with me, making holes or windows in a design, with gall water for paper or a little diluted Photo-Flo for acrylics, that I forgot to even mention it. I do it all the time, it adds "pop" and life and contrast! You can add too much though and make the color run... needs a bit of experimenting!



                      Also sometimes people esp. beginners make the mistake of thinking more and more color piled on will give a darker or denser shade. What it does after that "just enough" line is crossed, is make paints sink or run off, thus giving a paler shade. This leaves people confused. A bit more water to dilute or dispersant for a thinner application often allows a denser color. it's a thought I may elaborate on for a future article!

                      Iris

                      ----- Original Message -----

                      From: Laura Sims<mailto:indigostone2@...>

                      To: Marbling@yahoogroups.com<mailto:Marbling@yahoogroups.com>

                      Sent: Thursday, February 17, 2011 11:39 AM

                      Subject: Re: [Marbling] marbling silk and cotton



                      I will look forward to hearing how the Jacquard's work for you on methocel. I have used Golden fluid acrylics for over 20 years and get my most saturated red with their Pyrrole Red. I also use it earlier to get concentrated veins of red as accents. However, Golden does have a cadmium red available that I've not used. As for marbling on black , metalic paints work well. By adding a bit of titanium white or buff to some of the other colors they will become more opaque. (Most likely you are using organic pigments that have a stained glass property.) Also creating concentrated veins of color makes a big difference. If you use a surfactant to create clear "windows" you get more contrast with the black fabric. At some point you may want to pursue dyeing your fabric before marbling it.



                      Best,

                      Laura Sims

                      indigostonestudio.com



                      --- On Sun, 2/13/11, Deluwiel Xox <deluwiel1209@...<mailto:deluwiel1209@...>> wrote:



                      From: Deluwiel Xox <deluwiel1209@...<mailto:deluwiel1209@...>>

                      Subject: Re:

                      [Marbling] marbling silk and cotton

                      To: Marbling@yahoogroups.com<mailto:Marbling@yahoogroups.com>

                      Date: Sunday, February 13, 2011, 11:49 AM



                      I'm going to try methocel to compare to the carageenan to see how my Jacquard and Spectralite colors respond. Waiting to receive my order. If I'm still not getting what I want I'll give the Golden acrylics a whirl.



                      I've also tried marbling on black silk and the colors simply don't show up. Even opaque white comes out gray. I'll try mixing white in with the other colors and see what happens.



                      I'm curious about the use of oil color. I had ordered some solvent-based ink in the three primary colors: http://www.kardsandkrafts.co.uk/art-materials-marbling-inks.irc?id=35248&pg=2<http://www.kardsandkrafts.co.uk/art-materials-marbling-inks.irc?id=35248&pg=2> But when I would drop one color it would instantly disperse, appearing



                      to completely disappear. Subsequent drops would float, but when I went



                      to swirl the colors it had formed a skin on top of the size and my tool



                      just dragged and pulled it all off. What's up with that?



                      I'm going to cut swatches of habotai to



                      experiment on rather than using my scarves. I also ordered the Peggy



                      Skycraft DVD from Dharma.



                      I'll keep plugging away - the process fascinates me, and I love that every result is like a little surprise!



                      --- On Fri, 2/11/11, Sue Cole <akartisan@...<mailto:akartisan@...>> wrote:



                      From: Sue Cole <akartisan@...<mailto:akartisan@...>>



                      Subject: [Marbling] marbling silk and cotton



                      To: Marbling@yahoogroups.com<mailto:Marbling@yahoogroups.com>



                      Date: Friday, February 11, 2011, 11:18 PM



                      I was pre-washing them because Dharma said to as I recall, but I'm always



                      looking for shortcuts, so will try just putting them in the alum solution.



                      I DON"T prewash them before dyeing them. I use a process where I pwet them,



                      put green label silk dyes on them and cook them for 4-6 minuted in the



                      microwave in a ventilated tupperware container. If you want more specific



                      info, let me know.



                      For the long scarves, I have a "helper" made of two clamps on an upside down



                      U pice of wood nailed to one end of the tank, but the bandannas so far have



                      needed a human helper.



                      The only time I've had a failure was when I tried to marble black silk



                      scarves - it barely even showed up on them and I was really disappointed



                      with them. I usually use flat crepe from Dharma because the design shows on



                      both sides and they feel nice.



                      I just tried some Jacquard airbrush opaque red for marbling and it came out



                      the reddest of any paint I have used so far. Red is the one color I have



                      the most trouble with - it comes out pink or orange. Iris would probably



                      have some advice on this. I believe she makes her own paints.



                      I mix the size to a little thinner than pancake syrup and the paint to about



                      the consistency of 2% milk, although in the summer, I'm constantly adjusting



                      them because I do the marbling in a tent outside in my yard and we have



                      little humidity, so things can evaporate quickly here.



                      Here is the link for Mimi's dvd: http://www.marbling.com/<http://www.marbling.com/> It's very good.



                      Also, if you go to www.youtube.com<http://www.youtube.com/> there are lots of videos. Put either



                      ebru or marbling in the search box. Sometimes you get ones on marbled



                      nails, but keep looking. I eve found one on marbling electric guitars from



                      England one time. My favorite though is this one from Australia:



                      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=54OILOfT1bs<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=54OILOfT1bs> also it has wonderful music from



                      singing bowl. They use oil colors, and do huge pieces of cloth, but



                      otherwise it's the same. There are lots more links to the right when you go



                      there.



                      Yes, marbling is addictive, and is different to different people.



                      Also, I still have not figured out a way to do christmas ornament balls -



                      marbling them on the outside of the ball. Maybe it's just too slick of a



                      surface. There are lots of examples of marbling on the inside of clear



                      glass ones, but I was hoping to do it on the metallic ones. Guess not, or



                      maybe that could be a challenge to someone.



                      Also,Diane Maurer has several very good books on marbling and paste paper:



                      http://www.dianemaurer.com/<http://www.dianemaurer.com/>



                      I just found this one:



                      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EwCavLLlM6w&feature=related<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EwCavLLlM6w&feature=related> I don't remember



                      that being on there before. You can see the consistency of the size when



                      she stirs things. My scarf tray is not quite that wide, but it is that long



                      and looks similar.



                      Here are two more:



                      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M_vYehXdppI&NR=1<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M_vYehXdppI&NR=1>



                      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vk-Ta7ichz4&feature=related<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vk-Ta7ichz4&feature=related>



                      Now I need to get off the computer.



                      Sue



                      Good luck and keep trying.



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