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Alternative sizes

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  • Luiseach@aol.com
    Has anyone in the group tried marbling on other sizes--not methyl cellulose or carrageenan? One of Diane Maurer s books has instructions for a psyllium seed
    Message 1 of 10 , Dec 27, 2006
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      Has anyone in the group tried marbling on other sizes--not methyl cellulose
      or carrageenan? One of Diane Maurer's books has instructions for a psyllium
      seed size as well as a gelatin based size and I know that marblers in Turkey
      and that region traditionally used a gum size. I'm in a mood to experiment,
      but if anyone has experience to offer, I'd love to hear about it.

      Lucinda in rainy southern California


      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Guffey
      Hi Lucinda, Many years ago (like about 25) I used sodium alginate...but that was when I was marbling with oil paints rather than acrylics, and that was what
      Message 2 of 10 , Dec 27, 2006
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        Hi Lucinda,

        Many years ago (like about 25) I used sodium alginate...but that was when I was marbling with oil paints rather than acrylics, and that was what worked best for oil paints. Since I switched to acrylics I've only used carrageenan. There are two types of carrageenan...the dried seaweed type that you have to boil and strain, and then the "blender" type which is in granular form. Peggy Skycraft passed on the best advice that you do not have to make your blender carrageenan the night before, but can mix it as needed. An emersion blender works best...just mix and wait a few minutes for the bubbles to settle and "you're good to go."

        d. guffey



        ----- Original Message -----
        From: Luiseach@...
        To: Marbling@yahoogroups.com
        Sent: Wednesday, December 27, 2006 7:10 AM
        Subject: [Marbling] Alternative sizes


        Has anyone in the group tried marbling on other sizes--not methyl cellulose
        or carrageenan? One of Diane Maurer's books has instructions for a psyllium
        seed size as well as a gelatin based size and I know that marblers in Turkey
        and that region traditionally used a gum size. I'm in a mood to experiment,
        but if anyone has experience to offer, I'd love to hear about it.

        Lucinda in rainy southern California

        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • luannesews2001
        I m using blender size now and I like it (except for the cost of carrageenan, of course) and I d discovered that you can use the size as soon as the bubbles
        Message 3 of 10 , Dec 27, 2006
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          I'm using "blender size" now and I like it (except for the cost of
          carrageenan, of course) and I'd discovered that you can use the size as
          soon as the bubbles settle if you start with room temperature water.
          Have you ever tried sodium alginate with acrylics or water colors?
          It's certainly nice slimy stuff.

          Lu

          >
          > Hi Lucinda,
          >
          > Many years ago (like about 25) I used sodium alginate...but that was
          when I was marbling with oil paints rather than acrylics, and that was
          what worked best for oil paints. Since I switched to acrylics I've
          only used carrageenan. There are two types of carrageenan...the dried
          seaweed type that you have to boil and strain, and then the "blender"
          type which is in granular form. Peggy Skycraft passed on the best
          advice that you do not have to make your blender carrageenan the night
          before, but can mix it as needed. An emersion blender works
          best...just mix and wait a few minutes for the bubbles to settle
          and "you're good to go."
          >
          > d. guffey
        • irisnevins
          I know that s true about making up the size right before.... But keep in mind it is best to get a large blender, that holds two quarts (Walmart is where mine
          Message 4 of 10 , Dec 27, 2006
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            I know that's true about making up the size right before.... But keep in mind it is best to get a large blender, that holds two quarts (Walmart is where mine is from) and I would suggest one TBS (rounded if in hard water area, needs a bit more to gel) blended in two quarts hot tap water ( I know many won't use it, but I have always made tap water work with great results no matter where... only exception is if it has a water softener on it, then use bottled water) until all lumps are gone. Just don't add the extra quart as you would if blending with a quart of water. I do find doing it hot works better.... and I still would wait an hour after pouring it into the tray, to bring to room temperature.

            I used to marble this way, but find, it's just a little better if it sits overnight. Just my personal experience for the places I have marbled. But sure, if I have to marble all of a sudden, I do make the size an hour ahead and just get to it. Blending with hot water and the larger amount of water, it makes the size pretty near perfect. I do like the luxury of rolling out of bed and having the size ready to go in the morning though. Dolores is right though about this!

            Iris Nevins
            www.marblingpaper.com<http://www.marblingpaper.com/>
            ----- Original Message -----
            From: Guffey<mailto:dguff@...>
            To: Marbling@yahoogroups.com<mailto:Marbling@yahoogroups.com>
            Sent: Wednesday, December 27, 2006 10:59 AM
            Subject: Re: [Marbling] Alternative sizes


            Hi Lucinda,

            Many years ago (like about 25) I used sodium alginate...but that was when I was marbling with oil paints rather than acrylics, and that was what worked best for oil paints. Since I switched to acrylics I've only used carrageenan. There are two types of carrageenan...the dried seaweed type that you have to boil and strain, and then the "blender" type which is in granular form. Peggy Skycraft passed on the best advice that you do not have to make your blender carrageenan the night before, but can mix it as needed. An emersion blender works best...just mix and wait a few minutes for the bubbles to settle and "you're good to go."

            d. guffey



            ----- Original Message -----
            From: Luiseach@...<mailto:Luiseach@...>
            To: Marbling@yahoogroups.com<mailto:Marbling@yahoogroups.com>
            Sent: Wednesday, December 27, 2006 7:10 AM
            Subject: [Marbling] Alternative sizes


            Has anyone in the group tried marbling on other sizes--not methyl cellulose
            or carrageenan? One of Diane Maurer's books has instructions for a psyllium
            seed size as well as a gelatin based size and I know that marblers in Turkey
            and that region traditionally used a gum size. I'm in a mood to experiment,
            but if anyone has experience to offer, I'd love to hear about it.

            Lucinda in rainy southern California

            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




            Yahoo! Groups Links





            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • luannesews2001
            I have an immersion blender for doing smaller batches and a boat motor mixer blades on a long shaft that fits my big drill for doing larger batches. Both of
            Message 5 of 10 , Dec 27, 2006
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              I have an immersion blender for doing smaller batches and a "boat
              motor" mixer blades on a long shaft that fits my big drill for doing
              larger batches. Both of them work well, but the immersion blender
              takes longer and seems to leave more bubbles in the size.

              Lucinda

              --- In Marbling@yahoogroups.com, "irisnevins" <irisnevins@...> wrote:
              >
              > I know that's true about making up the size right before.... But
              keep in mind it is best to get a large blender, that holds two quarts
              (Walmart is where mine is from) and I would suggest one TBS (rounded
              if in hard water area, needs a bit more to gel) blended in two quarts
              hot tap water ( I know many won't use it, but I have always made tap
              water work with great results no matter where... only exception is if
              it has a water softener on it, then use bottled water) until all
              lumps are gone. Just don't add the extra quart as you would if
              blending with a quart of water. I do find doing it hot works
              better.... and I still would wait an hour after pouring it into the
              tray, to bring to room temperature.
              >
              > I used to marble this way, but find, it's just a little better if
              it sits overnight. Just my personal experience for the places I have
              marbled. But sure, if I have to marble all of a sudden, I do make the
              size an hour ahead and just get to it. Blending with hot water and
              the larger amount of water, it makes the size pretty near perfect. I
              do like the luxury of rolling out of bed and having the size ready to
              go in the morning though. Dolores is right though about this!
              >
              > Iris Nevins
              > www.marblingpaper.com<http://www.marblingpaper.com/>
              > ----- Original Message -----
            • irisnevins
              I never had luck with the immersion blenders either. I like my big Walmart one, I think it s a Sunbeam or something, not near it right now. many makers have
              Message 6 of 10 , Dec 27, 2006
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                I never had luck with the immersion blenders either. I like my big Walmart one, I think it's a Sunbeam or something, not near it right now. many makers have bigger models. Even if yours takes 6 cups it helps, then add 2 cups water after.

                Iris Nevins
                www.marblingpaper.com
                ----- Original Message -----
                From: luannesews2001<mailto:Luiseach@...>
                To: Marbling@yahoogroups.com<mailto:Marbling@yahoogroups.com>
                Sent: Wednesday, December 27, 2006 5:14 PM
                Subject: [Marbling] Mixing methods, was Alternative sizes


                I have an immersion blender for doing smaller batches and a "boat
                motor" mixer blades on a long shaft that fits my big drill for doing
                larger batches. Both of them work well, but the immersion blender
                takes longer and seems to leave more bubbles in the size.

                Lucinda

                --- In Marbling@yahoogroups.com<mailto:Marbling@yahoogroups.com>, "irisnevins" <irisnevins@...> wrote:
                >
                > I know that's true about making up the size right before.... But
                keep in mind it is best to get a large blender, that holds two quarts
                (Walmart is where mine is from) and I would suggest one TBS (rounded
                if in hard water area, needs a bit more to gel) blended in two quarts
                hot tap water ( I know many won't use it, but I have always made tap
                water work with great results no matter where... only exception is if
                it has a water softener on it, then use bottled water) until all
                lumps are gone. Just don't add the extra quart as you would if
                blending with a quart of water. I do find doing it hot works
                better.... and I still would wait an hour after pouring it into the
                tray, to bring to room temperature.
                >
                > I used to marble this way, but find, it's just a little better if
                it sits overnight. Just my personal experience for the places I have
                marbled. But sure, if I have to marble all of a sudden, I do make the
                size an hour ahead and just get to it. Blending with hot water and
                the larger amount of water, it makes the size pretty near perfect. I
                do like the luxury of rolling out of bed and having the size ready to
                go in the morning though. Dolores is right though about this!
                >
                > Iris Nevins
                > www.marblingpaper.com<http://www.marblingpaper.com/<http://www.marblingpaper.com<http://www.marblingpaper.com/>>
                > ----- Original Message -----





                Yahoo! Groups Links





                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • Angela Drake
                When I first learned how to marble in Germany, I used boxed wallpaper paste. It came in powdered form and I added warm water. It performed very closely to
                Message 7 of 10 , Dec 28, 2006
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                  When I first learned how to marble in Germany, I used boxed wallpaper paste.
                  It came in powdered form and I added warm water. It performed very closely
                  to carrageenan - the control wasn't as fine but good for teaching beginners
                  and children or for practicing new technique. I can't find the same product
                  in the US but perhaps things have changed in the past ten years. I wish I
                  knew what the ingredients were but I'm afraid I can't remember! Maybe
                  someone living in Germany would know?

                  Angie
                • hamburgerbuntpapier_de
                  It depends on when you learned with wallpaper paste. Wallpaper paste of old was (methyl-)cellulose. Since the 1970ies, more and more additives have
                  Message 8 of 10 , Dec 28, 2006
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                    It depends on when you learned with wallpaper paste. Wallpaper paste of old was
                    (methyl-)cellulose. Since the 1970ies, more and more additives have 'contaminated' it,
                    meaning polyvenyl, fungicides, softeners and other undesirable stuff. Now it is next to
                    impossible to find mc-wallpaper paste. Using pure mc would be the safe alternative.

                    Apart from that no one can say for sure what the additives do to the paper in the long run,
                    none of them is what I'd like on my hands, let alone on the hands of children.

                    Susanne Krause


                    --- In Marbling@yahoogroups.com, Angela Drake <angiedrake@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > When I first learned how to marble in Germany, I used boxed wallpaper paste.
                    > It came in powdered form and I added warm water. It performed very closely
                    > to carrageenan - the control wasn't as fine but good for teaching beginners
                    > and children or for practicing new technique. I can't find the same product
                    > in the US but perhaps things have changed in the past ten years. I wish I
                    > knew what the ingredients were but I'm afraid I can't remember! Maybe
                    > someone living in Germany would know?
                    >
                    > Angie
                    >
                  • Maria Vernersson
                    Hi all What is an emersion blender??? maria
                    Message 9 of 10 , Dec 29, 2006
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                      Hi all

                      What is an emersion blender???

                      maria
                    • Lavinia Adler
                      I almost asked this myself, Maria, but decided to google it. Turns out it s a hand held, wand-like implement with fairly small blades. They range greatly in
                      Message 10 of 10 , Dec 29, 2006
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                        I almost asked this myself, Maria, but decided to google it. Turns out
                        it's a hand held, wand-like implement with fairly small blades. They
                        range greatly in price, 'though I imagine for purposes of blending size
                        you wouldn't need anything fancy. I'm hitting the stores today to see
                        some "in person".

                        Lavinia

                        On Fri, 29 Dec 2006 11:00:20 +0100 "Maria Vernersson"
                        <maria.vernersson@...> writes:

                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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