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Re: Malankara Orthodox Syrian Christian [ MOSC ] Group Devils get frustrated.

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  • Philip Oommen
    Dear Shibu Please Study Bible, open your spiritual eyes,wake up your inner man and follow God.Then you wake up the spiritually dormant church for God.Otherwise
    Message 1 of 20 , Nov 7, 2006
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      Dear Shibu
      Please Study Bible, open your spiritual eyes,wake up your inner man and follow God.Then you wake up the spiritually dormant church for God.Otherwise you will live in ignorance and church will vanish. Its time that every orthodox family should wake up before Satan overcomes families and church.
      Sincerely
      Phili
    • Thomas Varghese
      Dear Philip Oomman You may not have raised this point, If you have listned to the sermons our bishops gave during the perunal. H.E mor severios after evening
      Message 2 of 20 , Nov 7, 2006
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        Dear Philip Oomman

        You may not have raised this point, If you have listned to the
        sermons our bishops gave during the perunal. H.E mor severios after
        evening namaskaram on 1st and H.E mor Irenios after holy qurbana on
        2nd clearly said what should be the aim of 'theerthadanam'. the
        points you raised like helping poor people etc are amply stressed by
        these holy fathers. H.E mor severios who is the president of Sleeba
        dasa samooham stressed the plight of poor 'converted' orthodox
        christian in our church. Mor Irenios stressed the need of Mission .
        Surely the Money raised during this perunal will help our church to
        do all these things.
        And during Perunal a large number of hindus used to come to the
        church and used to pray. Is it the first step in our mission
        activities?


        'Neethimane Neethimanennu karuthi sweekarikkunnavarku neethimante
        prathipbhalam labhikkum'

        Thomas varghese
        St.George Orthodox church Karakkal
      • Philip Oommen
        Dear Ronnie With all respect I tell you that I feel sorry when I see ignorance of people. You watch qurbana inParumala. Some people relax in back seats until
        Message 3 of 20 , Nov 8, 2006
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          Dear Ronnie
          With all respect I tell you that I feel sorry when I see ignorance of people. You watch qurbana inParumala. Some people relax in back seats until the end of Qurbana. But as soon as achens come with censor for intercessory prayer at the relic's thronos back seaters rush to the small thronos in the church.
          Being a christian won't you feel sorry when you see innocent people give importance to relic worship than Holy Qurabana and priests keep silence. I feel sorry for them(people and priests).

          May God save them
          Sincerely
          Philip
        • Philip Oommen
          Dear Thomas Vargese Thanks for your email. I have great affection for you.I write to clarify some of your doubts. We live in the 21st century. Satan attacks
          Message 4 of 20 , Nov 8, 2006
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            Dear Thomas Vargese
            Thanks for your email. I have great affection for you.I write to clarify some of your doubts.
            We live in the 21st century. Satan attacks church and Christian families.We must allow Holy Spirit work in our church and families. He will teach us the right way. Theerthadanam and other things are non Christain traditions.It will not save souls.
            Young generation wants Jesusn not perunals and rituals.Create a zeal for Jesus and Church in them. They should know who God the Father,Jesus the saviour and Holy Spirit our comforter and intercessor are. Without that theerthadanam,and rituals have no meaning.
            Follow Jesus and Apostles according to the word.

            God doesn't want money from idol worship gain and prostitutes (study old testment). He is not pleased in the sacrifice or offering of ungodly people. He accepts freewill offering with cheerful hearts.The donor should know that he is giving to God. He doesn't want money from saint's tomb offering box.. There are rules for offering gifts to God.You must separate money for God. Any gift to God is Holy.Tell God that I do it out of my free will and cheerful heart. I haven't taken any money for my need in my difficulties.(Study Old testment for details). Giving to the poor also is not through tomb treasury.Alms giving is a righteous act.

            One day someone mentioned to HG Osthathios Thirumeni that millions of rupees aid from an agency was available for mission/charity work. First thing he asked was who was the donor. The donor had no proper identification.Immediately he refused to accept even the idea of dealing with the agency and said we wants money from Holy Spirit inspired people only.

            Unsaved souls of nonchrisitans will curse Christians who hid truth of Salvation from them.We are Christains who are supposed to tell Gospel to people and bring them to the family of God.Hindus come and pray at Parumala since they think Jesus is one of the 33 crores gods in the world. If they know Jesus is the only way to God, non Christains will join church. Unfortunately there is no one to tell them the truth.(we need only money).That is why Sukumar Azhikode asked religious leaders to show God to people and not their rituals. Our CM asked leaders what is the benefit of religions if they can't change the minds of their own people. Can you respond to these comments as a member of Orthodox church of 2000 years old. My comment is that 2000 yr old Orthodox church failed to show Jesus to people in Kerala. People don't know who Jesus is. All these 2000 years we carried out virtual rituals and saint worship.
            We must preach,teachTrue Gospel, not traditional fables.Perunal is not a way of preaching Jesus or conversion. Did any one preach crucified Jesus to the 1000s of people who attended the Perunal. NO.What Perunal doing is creating "a cool with 7 UP" feeling. It does't help anyone get saved and follow Jesus.Can you name 10 people who stopped drinking and beating wives after perunal.Can you name 10 mother in laws who vowed that they would love the daughter in laws as they love their sons.I challenge let them testify in the forum. Did any any bishop tell I will work for peace with JOC.That is why tell 99% of tomb worshippers who come there are fake worshippers who will not change for God. Then what is the benfit of Perunals?
            If you don't follow Jesus,your life is worthless.That is what church has to teach people.

            "Neethimane Neethimanennu karuthi sweekarikkunnavarku neethimante
            prathipbhalam labhikkum". is a teaching of old fathers born before 1940. They taught that if you receive Parumala thirumeni (worship, burn candle etc at the tomb) Thirumeni will give rewards to his worshippers.In my younger days,one thirumeni came and preached in our church that if Parumala Thirumeni were not born Orthodox church would have vanished.Many peple don't know who is the real thirumeni. He was a humble servant of God with power of Holy Spirit. He never told any one that 50 years after his death, church should declare him saint and pick up his bones and relics to distribute to all orthodox church, in order to supply needs of millions of my worshippers. These are all man made actions for money making. Holy Spirit is the only comforter and fortress of a beliver, Thirumeni taught.He applied in his life what he prayed and preached.
            Jesus told disciples that people who receive their teaching of salvation would get the same reward as the disciples.(Mathew 10). Believers will get excellent rewards. Nonbelievers will get punishment only.We should not twist word of God to get money from innocent and ignorant worshippers. I feel sorry that Parumala Church becomes a meeting place of fake and innocent worshippers. Fake worshippers cheat innocent people to steal money in the name God and Thirumeni. There is no justification to get money in this way for God.
            Follow Jesus and save your family and our church. Until Our (IOC,JOC,RCC etc) Church becomes MY(Jesus's) Church, we should strive for improvement.Jesus said MY Church not St.Peters's church or Thomas's or Pauls' church
            Sincerely
            Philip
          • bindusirs
            Phillip, If you dont want to interceed in Mar Gregorios name dont do it. There is no compulsion. But you cannot forbid orthodox faithful from interceeding in
            Message 5 of 20 , Nov 10, 2006
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              Phillip,
              If you dont want to interceed in Mar Gregorios name dont do it. There
              is no compulsion. But you cannot forbid orthodox faithful from
              interceeding in his name. Time and again we have explained to you that
              we pray only to God and not any saint.

              Yrs
              Bindu Scaria, IRS
              Group Moderator : MOSC Group
            • Philip Oommen
              Dear Moderator Please study 1 Cor 6:9-11.Idol worship is one of the 9 deadly sins (means people who do such things will not inherit God s kingdom. Christians
              Message 6 of 20 , Nov 10, 2006
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                Dear Moderator
                Please study 1 Cor 6:9-11.Idol worship is one of the 9 deadly sins (means people who do such things will not inherit God's kingdom. Christians are sanctified and justified by the name of Jesus and Holy Spirit.
                We call passed away people by name.Mar Gregorios/Mar Geevarugese/ you are blessed.You are stopping war/you are our help.Your prayer is our fortress.so and so.
                Study bible. Did Jesus or Apsotles call any passed away saint until AD 100. NO.They have not allowed any one to talk to passed away people.

                Let me ask you a simple example.You are married to your husband. He is the head of the family. Do you obey your beloved rich husband or your beloved father or mother or sister or brother because they brought you up? . 100% you will obey your husband uncondtionally.With your marriage, you ended your trust with parents. Just imagine that you tell your parents by phone, Papa,Mumy, you are my whole in all.You are blessed.I trust in you for all my needs.(means I don't have 100% trust in my beloved husband). If your beloved husband hears your tel.communication, your husband would say to stay with your parents for the rest of your life. So also with God.He is jealous.
                Jesus is the head of church.Obey Him and follow Him is our unconditional duty because we are bought by His precious blood and we are temple of Holy Spirit.(Study 1 Cor.6:19)
                .We have a Christin covenant which teaches that Christ and Holy Spirits will take us to eternity. Babylonian tradition of getting connected to dead people through tombs and bones is evil.Tomb is not an ISD booth (Interworld Subscriber to Deadpeople).Study Rev 15. Angels worship Jesus " You (Jesus) are worthy of all praises. We must do the same in our churches and homes. I wish Malanakara Christains send evangelists to Russia,Gulf,Ethiopia etc and save ignorant Christians for God. If one million Muslims were converted in the middle east and Africa by protestant evangelists like Benny Hinn and Pat Robertson in five years, why can't traditional churches convert 100 people worldwide in a year. We need God's strategy to run God's business on earth.
                Sincerely
                Philip
              • moscelder
                Phillip, I think you are missing the point. Comparing a bag of Gold with a bag of potatoes is no comparison. It is true that God is a jealous God . But He is
                Message 7 of 20 , Nov 11, 2006
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                  Phillip, I think you are missing the point. Comparing a bag of Gold
                  with a bag of potatoes is no comparison. It is true that God is a
                  jealous God . But He is hearing the prayers of all , including the
                  passed away. You quote from the Bible , like a Pharisee but your
                  mind is like that of a Saducce full of 21st century technologies,
                  which deny the power of God. Did you not read that God is the God of
                  living and not the God of dead. So Parumala thirumeni lives in the
                  presence of God and as such he sees God and God hears him.

                  Intercession to saints is accepted in the Bible when the Apostle
                  says " Precious in His sight is the memory of his saints" Then when
                  a miracle happens its God who is glorified . For it is written "when
                  He shall come to be glorified in his saints, and to be marvelled at
                  in all them that believed (because our testimony unto you was
                  believed) in that day". Parumala thirumeni lived a ideal christian
                  life. So did St. George. Did you not read of the miracle reported by
                  one of our member when a son was born to him. That member gave glory
                  to God <<Message #5083 >>. Ofcourse we do have some members who over stress the saint. But that is not the entire community or church view point.

                  I think your problem is that you hate the church and some members.
                  But I assure you that the Church loves you and so do we all . I will
                  pray for you invoking the intercession of our beloved mother Mary.
                  " May God give you peace".

                  Yours
                  Itoop Korah
                • poovathumkalachen
                  Dear Mr Philip Oommen, You wrote: Let me ask you a simple example.You are married to your husband. He is the head of the family. Do you obey your beloved
                  Message 8 of 20 , Nov 11, 2006
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                    Dear Mr Philip Oommen,

                    You wrote: " Let me ask you a simple example.You are married to
                    your husband. He is the head of the family. Do you obey your
                    beloved rich husband or your beloved father or mother or sister or
                    brother because they brought you up? . 100% you will obey your
                    husband uncondtionally.With your marriage, you ended your trust with
                    parents……" Mr. Philip Oommen, what happened to you? Do you advise
                    the wives to disobey their husbands? Have you ever read words of
                    Jesus Christ? Matt. 19:4-6 "Haven't you read," he replied, "that at
                    the beginning the Creator `made them male and female,'and said, `For
                    this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to
                    his wife, and the two will become one flesh'? So they are no longer
                    two, but one." Besides the Letter of St. Paul to Ephesians 5:22-33.
                    These passages will help you to find out the mystery of married
                    life. According to Orthodox teaching married is not merely a
                    contract. It is a mystery (sacrament). Through the holy sacrament of
                    marriage, husband and wife metaphysically unite together and they
                    are one. If the husband or wife is rich or poor, it is not the
                    criterion of their oneness. However, through the marriage, a wife or
                    a husband never denies their parents. As a married man and a priest,
                    I know this fact. Do not repeat such nonsense, please.

                    Fr. Jose Thomas
                  • Philip Oommen
                    Thanks for your email. On the Perunal day, how many orthodox people in your church stood up and testified God supplied in needs. I am sure none. They how can
                    Message 9 of 20 , Nov 13, 2006
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                      Thanks for your email. On the Perunal day, how many orthodox people in your church stood up and testified God supplied in needs. I am sure none. They how can you say God's name was glorified for his love and afection. In ecuminical meetings, a orthodox woman stands up first and testifies that God gave me a child after 10 years. In the orhodox church same person testifies that through intercession of Parumala Thirumeni I got a baby. Then you will see a crowd of people rush to the tomb and then money collection window.
                      I will show orthodox people standing que in front of tomb and then asking petecostal pastors for prayer. My question is can't we teach truth to our children,can't we show the right way to children. How long we will walk between tomb and Holy Spirit for true comfort?
                      It is not the question, if dead people are living in the presence of God or not.Question is who taught us to pray to the souls.Its a deadly sin.Study Deutronmy.Did Disciples practice deadworship and intercession. NO.Then why should we do deadworship. What I am trying to say is that we must accpet the fact and teach in the church that Holy Spirit is the true comforter of a believer. Trust in the tombs and relics will separate us from Holy Spirit.
                      Sincerely
                      Philip

                      moscelder <itkorah@...> wrote:
                      Phillip, I think you are missing the point. Comparing a bag of Gold
                      with a bag of potatoes is no comparison. It is true that God is a
                      jealous God . But He is hearing the prayers of all , including the
                      passed away. You quote from the Bible , like a Pharisee but your
                      mind is like that of a Saducce full of 21st century technologies,
                      which deny the power of God. Did you not read that God is the God of
                      living and not the God of dead. So Parumala thirumeni lives in the
                      presence of God and as such he sees God and God hears him.

                      Intercession to saints is accepted in the Bible when the Apostle
                      says " Precious in His sight is the memory of his saints" Then when
                      a miracle happens its God who is glorified . For it is written "when
                      He shall come to be glorified in his saints, and to be marvelled at
                      in all them that believed (because our testimony unto you was
                      believed) in that day". Parumala thirumeni lived a ideal christian
                      life. So did St. George. Did you not read of the miracle reported by
                      one of our member when a son was born to him. That member gave glory
                      to God <<Message #5083 >>. Ofcourse we do have some members who over stress the saint. But that is not the entire community or church view point.

                      I think your problem is that you hate the church and some members.
                      But I assure you that the Church loves you and so do we all . I will
                      pray for you invoking the intercession of our beloved mother Mary.
                      " May God give you peace".

                      Yours
                      Itoop Korah
                    • Cherian, Cherry
                      Just on a slight tangent in a lighter vein; I wonder what grudge Philip Oomen is nursing towards Babylon . The term Babylonian seems to be his pet club for
                      Message 10 of 20 , Nov 14, 2006
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                        Just on a slight tangent in a lighter vein; I wonder what grudge Philip
                        Oomen is nursing towards 'Babylon'. The term 'Babylonian' seems to be
                        his pet club for bulldozing debating opponents albeit very little
                        success. . Anything not conforming to Philip's perceived logic,
                        standards and views gets instantly dubbed as 'Babylonian'. Did anyone
                        from the present day 'Babylonian' region take Philip for a ride of his
                        life?





                        + Prayers +





                        Cherian



                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      • Philip Oommen
                        Dear Cherian Thanks for your email. Babylonian worships will be destroyed by God at the end of period of 7 year tribulation.(Rev.18:9). That is why Bible
                        Message 11 of 20 , Nov 14, 2006
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                          Dear Cherian

                          Thanks for your email. Babylonian worships will be destroyed by God at the end of period of 7 year tribulation.(Rev.18:9). That is why Bible teaches people to follow Jesus and apostles.Anything less or more will separate people from God and drive to eternal death(hell). Before Rev 18:9 destruction happens, millions would fall into her traps.Again and again I tell, I boast on Jesus and His teaching for salvation.

                          Sincerely
                          Philip
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