Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

Re: [MPD-5D] Washington DC Guardian Angels Patrols

Expand Messages
  • Celestine Lara
    this concerns me also. they might be detaining the right people that need to be detained at this time. but what oversight and accountability do they have?
    Message 1 of 11 , Feb 23, 2009
    • 0 Attachment
      this concerns me also.  they might be "detaining" the right people that need to be detained at this time.  but what oversight and accountability do they have?  they were not elected, they were not hired.  it is called slippery slope.  and it can lead to a vigilante.

      5d police, let's clear this up - do the guardians angels have special permission to detain people?  or is that also maybe called assault, battery or maybe kidnapping?

      vig⋅i⋅lan⋅te

      [vij-uh-lan-tee] Show IPA Pronunciation
      –noun
      1.a member of a vigilance committee.
      2.any person who takes the law into his or her own hands, as by avenging a crime.
      –adjective
      3.done violently and summarily, without recourse to lawful procedures: vigilante justice.


      please answer as i am a deeply concerned citizen. 

      and just FYI, i was for the road blocks in our neighborhood.  i greatly appreciate all the hard work that the police have done in the 5d.

      and before everyone gets mad at me, i am saying it CAN lead to problems.

      THANK YOU!!

      cl









      From: Art Corvelay <art.corvelay@...>
      To: MPD-5D@yahoogroups.com; mpd-1d <MPD-1D@yahoogroups.com>
      Sent: Monday, February 23, 2009 9:44:18 PM
      Subject: Re: [MPD-5D] Washington DC Guardian Angels Patrols

      i too am very concerned about this. why has no one from mpd responded
      to this question???

      i know that citizens can make citizens arrest for a few crimes
      committed in their presence (assault, etc) but am unaware that they
      have the right to detain someone for crime committed outside of their
      presence and based on a description heard.

      would this be kidnapping (forcing someone to not move freely without
      the proper authority)? if mpd continues to endorse/support this are
      they open to liability from lawsuits (guardian angels are provided
      with a police radio, according to a previous email, so mpd clearly
      endorses this).

      mpd please answer:

      -can private citizens detain people who match descriptions/ lookouts
      given by mpd without observing the crime, as below?
      -can private citizens make a citizens arrest for drug offenses and
      physically restrain persons for such, as below?
      -if either answer is no, will mpd pursue criminal investigations?

      some of the below actions sound very peculiar and i wonder about their
      legality...

      On Sat, Feb 21, 2009 at 3:20 PM, <DCReardon@aol. com> wrote:
      > A question...how are Guardian Angels legally allowed to "detain" people? In
      > the third example below it says they "detained" three individuals. What
      > exactly does this mean and where does this authority come from?
      >
      >
      > -----Original Message-----
      > From: midatlantic . <midatlantic@ guardianangels.. org>
      > To: midatlantic@ guardianangels. org
      > Sent: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 1:18 pm
      > Subject: [MPD-5D] Washington DC Guardian Angels Patrols
      >
      > Patrol Report: 2-2-2009
      >
      > At 2130 hours, Guardian Angels Jordan Estrada, Hassan Taylor and John Ayala
      > met up at China Town/Gallery Place to begin patrol. For the next two hours
      > we proceeded to patrol the 7th and H street area surrounding the Metro
      > Station exit.
      >
      > At approximately 2210 hours, we responded to a female assault victim who had
      > been struck in the head and was bleeding from the nose. We assisted
      > Metropolitan Police officers in creating a perimeter and facilitating
      > emergency vehicle access to the scene.
      >
      > At approximately 2230 hours, we posted up in front of the local McDonald's
      > where SPO Sgt. Johnson asked us for assistance in keeping teen groups from
      > loitering in and around the store. We provided him with backup.
      >
      > At approximately 2300 hours, we assisted in the search for the perpetrators
      > of an assault on a bus driver. We detained three individuals who met the
      > physical description of the suspects until the police could question them.
      >
      > At 2300 hours, we disbanded the patrol and all Angels headed home. While
      > heading home, at approximately 2350 hours, Angel Taylor observed a man
      > waiting to get onto the Red Line Metro towards Glenmont holding a wad of
      > money and a bag of marijuana. Taylor approached and detained the man, who
      > began to struggle, making as if to reach for a hidden weapon. Taylor was
      > able to restrain him until Metro Transit officer Leo ID number 5533 and
      > officer Vargess ID number 182 arrived on scene. The officers questioned and
      > searched him and found the bag of marijuana in his possession, along with a
      > knife, which he claimed he carried for self defense. Angel Taylor stayed on
      > scene until the officers completed the arrest.
      >
      > At approximately 0010 hours, I encountered a drunken, disorderly individual
      > while on the Orange Line heading toward Vienna. He made a number of
      > threatening comments and gestures towards me and other individuals. I talked
      > to him and managed to calm him down without a struggle. He produced a bottle
      > of alcohol. I informed him that he could not drink on the metro. He handed
      > me the bottle and I placed it on the seat next to him, ordering him to throw
      > it in the trash when we reached Vienna. The man, who identified himself as
      > Bobby Underwood began to talk loudly and threateningly. I told him to keep
      > his voice down, and he complied. Several minutes later, he got very close to
      > my face and resumed his hostile tone. I told him to return to his seat and
      > he complied.
      >
      > At approximately 0035 hours, we arrived at the Vienna Metro Station. The
      > passengers, who had witnessed the above interactions expressed their thanks
      > and appreciation as they left. Once alone on the platform, I told Mr.
      > Underwood to dispose of his alcohol. He complied with some hesitation. I
      > then escorted him back to the ticket gate. He claimed that he was dangerous,
      > and unless I called the police, he was going to do something. I had the
      > Metro official call the police while I continued to talk to him for the next
      > half hour, keeping him calm.
      >
      > At approximately 0100 hours, Metro Transit officer Sheffield arrived on
      > scene and told Mr. Underwood to take a cab to wherever he was going to spend
      > the night.
      >
      > At approximately 0115 hours, I saw officer Sheffield talking to Mr.
      > Underwood, who had climbed over the fence at the Vienna Metro Station and
      > was standing on a ledge two stories above the highway, threatening to jump
      > off and kill himself. Officer Sheffield and myself talked to Mr. Underwood
      > for fifteen minutes, keeping him from jumping until Fairfax police and fire
      > officials arrived. They quickly succeeded in talking Mr. Underwood down and
      > took him into custody at 0145 hours.
      >
      > The Guardian Angels of Madison
      >
      > http://video. aol.com/video- detail/the- guardian- angels-of- madison/21708109 41
      >
      >
      > John "Unique" Ayala
      > Director Of Operations
      > Washington DC
      > Guardian Angels
      > 202-359-0601
      > www.guardianangels. org
      >
      > Citizen and Police Officers
      > working together to make
      > a difference.
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > ____________ _________ _________ __
      > A Good Credit Score is 700 or Above. See yours in just 2 easy steps!
      >


    • k3
      I was interested in this question too. For example, if OJ had (a) called the police right away and (b) not brought a friend who carried a gun, would his
      Message 2 of 11 , Feb 23, 2009
      • 0 Attachment
        I was interested in this question too. For example, if OJ had (a)
        called the police right away and (b) not brought a friend who carried
        a gun, would his defense have held?

        Some of the answers are clear cut, eg, you can't detain someone for a
        minor crime unless you actually witnessed it. Others are nebulous. I
        found a good hypothetical example (from someone who clearly states
        he/she is not an attorney) at:
        http://legallad.quickanddirtytips.com/citizens-arrest-2.aspx

        My husband pointed out that part of the problem is what's
        "reasonable". If you see someone commit murder and tackle him and hold
        him for the cops, that's one thing. If you see someone with a bag of
        pot and tackle him, that's another ... especially if it turns out to
        be catnip.

        Performing an "any person's arrest" can put you in some serious legal
        jeopardy. For an ordinary citizen, this could be devastating. For an
        organization, it could be great publicity.

        I, too, am interested in local officials' take. Regarding the guy who
        had to be talked out of jumping ... I wonder how common complications
        like these are.

        Also, I found this interesting piece:
        http://www.susanallenforcongress.com/~wudukes/?p=26


        -----Original Message-----
        From: MPD-5D@yahoogroups.com [mailto:MPD-5D@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf
        Of
        Art Corvelay
        Sent: Monday, February 23, 2009 11:14 AM
        To: MPD-5D@yahoogroups.com; mpd-1d
        Subject: Re: [MPD-5D] Washington DC Guardian Angels Patrols


        i too am very concerned about this. why has no one from mpd responded
        to this question???

        i know that citizens can make citizens arrest for a few crimes
        committed in their presence (assault, etc) but am unaware that they
        have the right to detain someone for crime committed outside of their
        presence and based on a description heard.

        would this be kidnapping (forcing someone to not move freely without
        the proper authority)? if mpd continues to endorse/support this are
        they open to liability from lawsuits (guardian angels are provided
        with a police radio, according to a previous email, so mpd clearly
        endorses this).

        mpd please answer:

        -can private citizens detain people who match descriptions/lookouts
        given by mpd without observing the crime, as below?
        -can private citizens make a citizens arrest for drug offenses and
        physically restrain persons for such, as below?
        -if either answer is no, will mpd pursue criminal investigations?

        some of the below actions sound very peculiar and i wonder about their
        legality...
      • midatlantic .
        To the Concerned Residents, The Guardian Angels are all volunteers and are in the community to assist residents and act as eyes and ears for the police. We
        Message 3 of 11 , Feb 23, 2009
        • 0 Attachment
          To the Concerned Residents,
           
          The Guardian Angels are all volunteers and are in the community to assist residents and act as eyes and ears for the police.  We either have full time jobs or in school and spend our spare time giving back to the community.  We dare to care.  The police cannot do it alone; everyone must pitch in and help with reducing crime.
           
          Just recently on 14th & Parkwood Streets, a homeless man was beaten and stomped and went into a comma for a few days.  Witnesses were standing around during this ordeal and no one did nothing to assist him.  The entire beating was videotaped by a neighborhood store surveillance camera.  He passed away due to his injuries. If bystanders had reported this to the police immediately, this young man could possibly be still alive today. 
           
          I have answered your questions below.
          Do the guardians angels have special permission to detain people?  or is that also maybe called assault, battery or maybe kidnapping? and it can lead to a vigilante. 
          The Guardian Angels are not vigilantes.  We abide by the law and we are not judge, jury and executioner.  We have no special powers, and are no different from anyone else out on the street, except we are trained to work as a team.and we train in citizens arrest procedures.  We are also trained in first aid, which is hardly a vigilante type activity.  We are against violence.  Our aim is to help people who are in danger and act as a visual deterrent to crime.  It is the right and duty of all responsible people to help others.  The right to intervene to save someone's life is given to all of us by the laws of the country.


          Some of the answers are clear cut, eg, you can't detain someone for a minor crime unless you actually witnessed it

          The difference between making a citizens arrest and detainment:

          • A person who voluntarily remains where they are and agrees to answer questions is referred to as "detained".  Detainment means they are consenting to stay until the police arrive.  
          • Arrest means you are holding a person against their will.  

          When the lookout came over the air for the seven young men who assaulted the metro bus driver (X2 bus line) on 7th & H Sts NW, we saw some young men who fit the description. We informed dispatch that we were on 7th Street between G & H and have in our view some young men that fit the description.  We politely asked the young men to wait until the police arrive because they fit the description of suspects of a crime that had just occured.  We are aware that if the crime is a misdemeanor and we did not witness it, then we have no power to hold them against their will.


          When can a Guardian Angel make an arrest?

          a. For a misdemeanor crime - providing the Guardian Angel witnessed the crime being committed.
          b. For a felony crime - If the Guardian Angels either witnessed a crime or has reasonable cause to believe the suspect committed it.  The Guardian Angels does not have to witness the crime in order to make a citizens arrest on a suspect.

          If MPD continues to endorse/support this are they open to liability from lawsuits
          The Guardian Angels are responsible for their actions not the police. We have been working with police and have been involved in the fight against violent street crime for 30 years around the world and we have never been sued for our actions.  We have a great relationship with the police. They recognize the value of what we are doing.  Preventing street crime is not just a job for the police. In fact, it is not a job at all.  It is a moral duty that everyone look after each other and help if someone is being attacked or get involved if we see a crime.  



          John "Unique" Ayala
          Director Of Operations
          Washington DC
          Guardian Angels
          202-359-0601
          www.guardianangels.org

          Guardian Angels and Police Officers
          working together to make
          a difference

        • RobbyCU
          I am sure the GA s do good work in some circumstances, but I d rather leave the policing to the actual police. I see law enforcement primary as an inherently
          Message 4 of 11 , Feb 23, 2009
          • 0 Attachment

            I am sure the GA's do good work in some circumstances, but I'd rather leave the policing to the actual police. I see law enforcement primary as an inherently governmental function. I don't doubt the GA's effectiveness, but reading this really raised the hair on the back of my neck.   I can't imagine any situation that I would allow myself of any person in my care to be "detained" by any one other than a law enforcement official. I believe in community policing, but this seems to go too far.

            This is my personal opinion and I know there are others that believe differently and we will agree to disagree.

            In my neighborhood, I know that what's solved most crimes has been people coming forward.  To the end that the GAs and other groups help facilitate an environment that people feel comfortable coming forward there should be appreciation. However, regular, hardnosed, and very much appreciated community policing by DC's finest is responsible for the crime reduction.

            5D should be celebrated for their hard work and this accomplishment.

            As a resident, thank you very much 5D.

            -Robby
             
            ______________________________________________
            "Change will not come if we wait for some other person or some other time. We are the ones we've been waiting for. We are the change that we seek."

            President Barack Obama



            From: midatlantic . <midatlantic@...>
            To: midatlantic@...
            Sent: Monday, February 23, 2009 9:48:46 PM
            Subject: [MPD-5D] Washington DC Guardian Angels Patrols

            To the Concerned Residents,
             
            The Guardian Angels are all volunteers and are in the community to assist residents and act as eyes and ears for the police.  We either have full time jobs or in school and spend our spare time giving back to the community.  We dare to care.  The police cannot do it alone; everyone must pitch in and help with reducing crime.
             
            Just recently on 14th & Parkwood Streets, a homeless man was beaten and stomped and went into a comma for a few days.  Witnesses were standing around during this ordeal and no one did nothing to assist him.  The entire beating was videotaped by a neighborhood store surveillance camera.  He passed away due to his injuries. If bystanders had reported this to the police immediately, this young man could possibly be still alive today. 
             
            I have answered your questions below.
            Do the guardians angels have special permission to detain people?  or is that also maybe called assault, battery or maybe kidnapping? and it can lead to a vigilante. 
            The Guardian Angels are not vigilantes.  We abide by the law and we are not judge, jury and executioner.  We have no special powers, and are no different from anyone else out on the street, except we are trained to work as a team.and we train in citizens arrest procedures.  We are also trained in first aid, which is hardly a vigilante type activity.  We are against violence.  Our aim is to help people who are in danger and act as a visual deterrent to crime.  It is the right and duty of all responsible people to help others.  The right to intervene to save someone's life is given to all of us by the laws of the country.


            Some of the answers are clear cut, eg, you can't detain someone for a minor crime unless you actually witnessed it

            The difference between making a citizens arrest and detainment:

            • A person who voluntarily remains where they are and agrees to answer questions is referred to as "detained".  Detainment means they are consenting to stay until the police arrive.  
            • Arrest means you are holding a person against their will.  

            When the lookout came over the air for the seven young men who assaulted the metro bus driver (X2 bus line) on 7th & H Sts NW, we saw some young men who fit the description. We informed dispatch that we were on 7th Street between G & H and have in our view some young men that fit the description.  We politely asked the young men to wait until the police arrive because they fit the description of suspects of a crime that had just occured.  We are aware that if the crime is a misdemeanor and we did not witness it, then we have no power to hold them against their will.


            When can a Guardian Angel make an arrest?

            a. For a misdemeanor crime - providing the Guardian Angel witnessed the crime being committed.
            b. For a felony crime - If the Guardian Angels either witnessed a crime or has reasonable cause to believe the suspect committed it.  The Guardian Angels does not have to witness the crime in order to make a citizens arrest on a suspect.

            If MPD continues to endorse/support this are they open to liability from lawsuits
            The Guardian Angels are responsible for their actions not the police. We have been working with police and have been involved in the fight against violent street crime for 30 years around the world and we have never been sued for our actions.  We have a great relationship with the police. They recognize the value of what we are doing.  Preventing street crime is not just a job for the police. In fact, it is not a job at all.  It is a moral duty that everyone look after each other and help if someone is being attacked or get involved if we see a crime.  



            John "Unique" Ayala
            Director Of Operations
            Washington DC
            Guardian Angels
            202-359-0601
            www.guardianangels.org

            Guardian Angels and Police Officers
            working together to make
            a difference



          • DCReardon@AOL.COM
            Thank you for providing all this clarifying information. ... From: midatlantic . To: midatlantic@guardianangels.org Sent: Mon,
            Message 5 of 11 , Feb 24, 2009
            • 0 Attachment
              Thank you for providing all this clarifying information.


              -----Original Message-----
              From: midatlantic . <midatlantic@...>
              To: midatlantic@...
              Sent: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 9:48 pm
              Subject: [MPD-5D] Washington DC Guardian Angels Patrols

              To the Concerned Residents,
               
              The Guardian Angels are all volunteers and are in the community to assist residents and act as eyes and ears for the police.  We either have full time jobs or in school and spend our spare time giving back to the community.  We dare to care.  The police cannot do it alone; everyone must pitch in and help with reducing crime.
               
              Just recently on 14th & Parkwood Streets, a homeless man was beaten and stomped and went into a comma for a few days.  Witnesses were standing around during this ordeal and no one did nothing to assist him.  The entire beating was videotaped by a neighborhood store surveillance camera.  He passed away due to his injuries. If bystanders had reported this to the police immediately, this young man could possibly be still alive today. 
               
              I have answered your questions below.
              Do the guardians angels have special permission to detain people?  or is that also maybe called assault, battery or maybe kidnapping? and it can lead to a vigilante. 
              The Guardian Angels are not vigilantes.  We abide by the law and we are not judge, jury and executioner.  We have no special powers, and are no different from anyone else out on the street, except we are trained to work as a team.and we train in citizens arrest procedures.  We are also trained in first aid, which is hardly a vigilante type activity.  We are against violence.  Our aim is to help people who are in danger and act as a visual deterrent to crime.  It is the right and duty of all responsible people to help others.  The right to intervene to save someone's life is given to all of us by the laws of the country.


              Some of the answers are clear cut, eg, you can't detain someone for a minor crime unless you actually witnessed it
              The difference between making a citizens arrest and detainment:
              • A person who voluntarily remains where they are and agrees to answer questions is referred to as "detained".  Detainment means they are consenting to stay until the police arrive.  
              • Arrest means you are holding a person against their will.  
              When the lookout came over the air for the seven young men who assaulted the metro bus driver (X2 bus line) on 7th & H Sts NW, we saw some young men who fit the description. We informed dispatch that we were on 7th Street between G & H and have in our view some young men that fit the description.  We politely asked the young men to wait until the police arrive because they fit the description of suspects of a crime that had just occured.  We are aware that if the crime is a misdemeanor and we did not witness it, then we have no power to hold them against their will.

              When can a Guardian Angel make an arrest?

              a. For a misdemeanor crime - providing the Guardian Angel witnessed the crime being committed.
              b. For a felony crime - If the Guardian Angels either witnessed a crime or has reasonable cause to believe the suspect committed it.  The Guardian Angels does not have to witness the crime in order to make a citizens arrest on a suspect.

              If MPD continues to endorse/support this are they open to liability from lawsuits
              The Guardian Angels are responsible for their actions not the police. We have been working with police and have been involved in the fight against violent street crime for 30 years around the world and we have never been sued for our actions.  We have a great relationship with the police. They recognize the value of what we are doing.  Preventing street crime is not just a job for the police. In fact, it is not a job at all.  It is a moral duty that everyone look after each other and help if someone is being attacked or get involved if we see a crime.  



              John "Unique" Ayala
              Director Of Operations
              Washington DC
              Guardian Angels
              202-359-0601
              www.guardianangels.org

              Guardian Angels and Police Officers
              working together to make
              a difference



            • khenderson029@aol.com
              When we began our citizen safety patrols back in 1999 we walked with the police and we still walk with the police. The Guardian Angels responded to our need
              Message 6 of 11 , Feb 24, 2009
              • 0 Attachment
                When we began our citizen safety patrols back in 1999 we walked with the police and we still walk with the police. The Guardian Angels responded to our need for greater resources in 2007 and we now walk with the police and Guardian Angels. I applaud the Guardian Angels for the work they have done in our community, communities throughout our country and internationally.
                 
                The reality is that our police cannot be everywhere at all times to prevent crime. As citizens we must do our part to assist in keeping our communities safe. It helps to pick up the phone and call the police when we need them; however, even that is not enough. Safe communities do not just happen, they are made. We must do our part to send a strong message that our community will not tolerate crime, underscoring strict attention to signposts of neglect, like trash and graffiti. It is much easier to maintain a safe community from the beginning than to reclaim a community from criminals and it requires that we all roll up our sleeves to fix the problem. Making phone calls to the police or other government entities is frankly not enough; we need a multifaceted strategy that includes all of the entities, plus citizen involvement. Our community is a testament that the multifaceted strategy works.
                 
                Kathy Henderson


                A Good Credit Score is 700 or Above. See yours in just 2 easy steps!
              • Deborah Golden
                This information is not consistent with the legal information that Commander Greeene sent around yesterday. It appears that the Guardian Angels think they have
                Message 7 of 11 , Feb 24, 2009
                • 0 Attachment
                  This information is not consistent with the legal information that Commander Greeene sent around yesterday.
                  It appears that the Guardian Angels think they have citizens arrest powers that they do not. I would hope that anyone thinking of working with the GA would get compentant legal advice before doing something that will surely subject them to legal liability.
                   
                  I also hope that the MPD is not relying on the assurance from the GA that there is no city liability. I would think that the OAG's office should carefully evaluate the posibilities, so that we tax payers are not possibly paying for a mistake here.
                   
                  -Deborah Golden
                  On Mon, Feb 23, 2009 at 9:48 PM, midatlantic . <midatlantic@...> wrote:

                  To the Concerned Residents,

                   
                  The Guardian Angels are all volunteers and are in the community to assist residents and act as eyes and ears for the police.  We either have full time jobs or in school and spend our spare time giving back to the community.  We dare to care.  The police cannot do it alone; everyone must pitch in and help with reducing crime.
                   
                  Just recently on 14th & Parkwood Streets, a homeless man was beaten and stomped and went into a comma for a few days.  Witnesses were standing around during this ordeal and no one did nothing to assist him.  The entire beating was videotaped by a neighborhood store surveillance camera.  He passed away due to his injuries. If bystanders had reported this to the police immediately, this young man could possibly be still alive today. 
                   
                  I have answered your questions below.
                  Do the guardians angels have special permission to detain people?  or is that also maybe called assault, battery or maybe kidnapping? and it can lead to a vigilante. 
                  The Guardian Angels are not vigilantes.  We abide by the law and we are not judge, jury and executioner.  We have no special powers, and are no different from anyone else out on the street, except we are trained to work as a team.and we train in citizens arrest procedures.  We are also trained in first aid, which is hardly a vigilante type activity.  We are against violence.  Our aim is to help people who are in danger and act as a visual deterrent to crime.  It is the right and duty of all responsible people to help others.  The right to intervene to save someone's life is given to all of us by the laws of the country.


                  Some of the answers are clear cut, eg, you can't detain someone for a minor crime unless you actually witnessed it

                  The difference between making a citizens arrest and detainment:

                  • A person who voluntarily remains where they are and agrees to answer questions is referred to as "detained".  Detainment means they are consenting to stay until the police arrive.  
                  • Arrest means you are holding a person against their will.  

                  When the lookout came over the air for the seven young men who assaulted the metro bus driver (X2 bus line) on 7th & H Sts NW, we saw some young men who fit the description. We informed dispatch that we were on 7th Street between G & H and have in our view some young men that fit the description.  We politely asked the young men to wait until the police arrive because they fit the description of suspects of a crime that had just occured.  We are aware that if the crime is a misdemeanor and we did not witness it, then we have no power to hold them against their will.


                  When can a Guardian Angel make an arrest?

                  a. For a misdemeanor crime - providing the Guardian Angel witnessed the crime being committed.
                  b. For a felony crime - If the Guardian Angels either witnessed a crime or has reasonable cause to believe the suspect committed it.  The Guardian Angels does not have to witness the crime in order to make a citizens arrest on a suspect.

                  If MPD continues to endorse/support this are they open to liability from lawsuits
                  The Guardian Angels are responsible for their actions not the police. We have been working with police and have been involved in the fight against violent street crime for 30 years around the world and we have never been sued for our actions.  We have a great relationship with the police. They recognize the value of what we are doing.  Preventing street crime is not just a job for the police. In fact, it is not a job at all.  It is a moral duty that everyone look after each other and help if someone is being attacked or get involved if we see a crime.  



                  John "Unique" Ayala
                  Director Of Operations
                  Washington DC
                  Guardian Angels
                  202-359-0601
                  www.guardianangels.org

                  Guardian Angels and Police Officers
                  working together to make
                  a difference


                • RobbyCU
                  Thank you Ms. Golden I second that. Perhaps they are on the right side of the law, but at best the area is gray. The reality is that a citizen can ignore a
                  Message 8 of 11 , Feb 24, 2009
                  • 0 Attachment
                    Thank you Ms. Golden I second that. Perhaps they are on the right side of the law, but at best the area is gray. The reality is that a citizen can ignore a citizen's arrest, or request for detainment.  One can not so freely disobey a police request or requirement (order).   And even then a citizen has the right not to incriminate him or herself.

                    I am sure the GA's have done some good, they have vids of them taking back mean streets all over the nation. And there are also complaints.  The truth is somewhere in the middle.


                    Active and engaged citizens that cooperate with the police and work to improve their neighborhoods will be what sustainably saves the day.

                    The key is sustained change.

                    We deserve nothing, but the best quality of life. To get there we must work very hard at it. It means many of us will have to start working with and talking to the police.  It means working with young people to  end the anti snitching frame of mind that many hold close.

                    Can we get there, yes we can.

                    -Robby
                     
                    ______________________________________________
                    "Change will not come if we wait for some other person or some other time. We are the ones we've been waiting for. We are the change that we seek."

                    President Barack Obama



                    From: Deborah Golden <deb.golden@...>
                    To: MPD-5D@yahoogroups.com
                    Sent: Tuesday, February 24, 2009 11:42:59 AM
                    Subject: Re: [MPD-5D] Washington DC Guardian Angels Patrols

                    This information is not consistent with the legal information that Commander Greeene sent around yesterday.
                    It appears that the Guardian Angels think they have citizens arrest powers that they do not. I would hope that anyone thinking of working with the GA would get compentant legal advice before doing something that will surely subject them to legal liability.
                     
                    I also hope that the MPD is not relying on the assurance from the GA that there is no city liability. I would think that the OAG's office should carefully evaluate the posibilities, so that we tax payers are not possibly paying for a mistake here.
                     
                    -Deborah Golden
                    On Mon, Feb 23, 2009 at 9:48 PM, midatlantic . <midatlantic@...> wrote:

                    To the Concerned Residents,

                     
                    The Guardian Angels are all volunteers and are in the community to assist residents and act as eyes and ears for the police.  We either have full time jobs or in school and spend our spare time giving back to the community.  We dare to care.  The police cannot do it alone; everyone must pitch in and help with reducing crime.
                     
                    Just recently on 14th & Parkwood Streets, a homeless man was beaten and stomped and went into a comma for a few days.  Witnesses were standing around during this ordeal and no one did nothing to assist him.  The entire beating was videotaped by a neighborhood store surveillance camera.  He passed away due to his injuries. If bystanders had reported this to the police immediately, this young man could possibly be still alive today. 
                     
                    I have answered your questions below.
                    Do the guardians angels have special permission to detain people?  or is that also maybe called assault, battery or maybe kidnapping? and it can lead to a vigilante. 
                    The Guardian Angels are not vigilantes.  We abide by the law and we are not judge, jury and executioner.  We have no special powers, and are no different from anyone else out on the street, except we are trained to work as a team.and we train in citizens arrest procedures.  We are also trained in first aid, which is hardly a vigilante type activity.  We are against violence.  Our aim is to help people who are in danger and act as a visual deterrent to crime.  It is the right and duty of all responsible people to help others.  The right to intervene to save someone's life is given to all of us by the laws of the country.


                    Some of the answers are clear cut, eg, you can't detain someone for a minor crime unless you actually witnessed it

                    The difference between making a citizens arrest and detainment:

                    • A person who voluntarily remains where they are and agrees to answer questions is referred to as "detained".  Detainment means they are consenting to stay until the police arrive.  
                    • Arrest means you are holding a person against their will.  

                    When the lookout came over the air for the seven young men who assaulted the metro bus driver (X2 bus line) on 7th & H Sts NW, we saw some young men who fit the description. We informed dispatch that we were on 7th Street between G & H and have in our view some young men that fit the description.  We politely asked the young men to wait until the police arrive because they fit the description of suspects of a crime that had just occured.  We are aware that if the crime is a misdemeanor and we did not witness it, then we have no power to hold them against their will.


                    When can a Guardian Angel make an arrest?

                    a. For a misdemeanor crime - providing the Guardian Angel witnessed the crime being committed.
                    b. For a felony crime - If the Guardian Angels either witnessed a crime or has reasonable cause to believe the suspect committed it.  The Guardian Angels does not have to witness the crime in order to make a citizens arrest on a suspect.

                    If MPD continues to endorse/support this are they open to liability from lawsuits
                    The Guardian Angels are responsible for their actions not the police. We have been working with police and have been involved in the fight against violent street crime for 30 years around the world and we have never been sued for our actions.  We have a great relationship with the police. They recognize the value of what we are doing.  Preventing street crime is not just a job for the police. In fact, it is not a job at all.  It is a moral duty that everyone look after each other and help if someone is being attacked or get involved if we see a crime.  



                    John "Unique" Ayala
                    Director Of Operations
                    Washington DC
                    Guardian Angels
                    202-359-0601
                    www.guardianangels.org

                    Guardian Angels and Police Officers
                    working together to make
                    a difference




                  Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.