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[MOB-Montana] Ferruginous Hawk at Kona Bridge, duck pics

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  • Jeff Marks
    Thomas and Martin, First, the hawk is a Red-tailed, not a Ferruginous. Second, the ducks (both are odd, not just the hybrid ) are some kind of domestic
    Message 1 of 7 , Apr 20, 2013
      Thomas and Martin,
       
      First, the hawk is a Red-tailed, not a Ferruginous.
       
      Second, the ducks (both are odd, not just the "hybrid") are some kind of domestic strain, I think.
       
      Google "domestic duck" and click on the images and you'll find some that look very much like them.
       
      Jeff
       
      *******************
      Jeff Marks
      4241 SE Liebe Street
      Portland, OR 97206
      503-774-4783
      Birds of Montana Project
      http://mtaudubon.org/
      *******************
      ----- Original Message -----
      From: Thomas
      Sent: Saturday, April 20, 2013 5:39 PM
      Subject: [MOB-Montana] Ferruginous Hawk at Kona Bridge

       

      MOBsters,

      While birding around Missoula today Katie Heath and I checked the area around Kona Bridge and Big Flat for the Harris's Hawk that Kristi DuBois reported, no luck, but we did observe a first year Ferruginous Hawk on the evergreen trees planted along the road North and East of the bridge, this bird was also observed in the same location on Wednesday 4/17(images posted to album T. Kallmeyer). Also had 7 FOY Violet-green Swallows observed from the river access by the bridge.

      The day started well with a Ruffed Grouse flying up and perching on the railing of our deck as I drank my morning coffee in the hot tub!

      Good Birding,
      Thomas Kallmeyer

      Dodd Ranch, Missoula, US-MT
      Apr 20, 2013 7:17 AM - 8:44 AM
      Protocol: Traveling
      1.2 mile(s)
      Comments: Submitted from BirdLog World for Android v1.7
      17 species

      Ruffed Grouse 1
      Wild Turkey 3
      Killdeer 2
      Belted Kingfisher 1
      Northern Flicker (Red-shafted) 2
      Steller's Jay 3
      Tree Swallow 1
      Black-capped Chickadee 14
      Mountain Chickadee 2
      Red-breasted Nuthatch 2
      Pacific Wren 1
      Ruby-crowned Kinglet 2
      American Robin 8
      European Starling 8
      Song Sparrow 3
      Dark-eyed Junco (Oregon) 2
      Red-winged Blackbird 5

      View this checklist online at http://ebird.org/ebird/view/checklist?subID=S13814466

      This report was generated automatically by eBird v3 (http://ebird.org)

      Rollercoaster and Deschamps Roads, Missoula, US-MT
      Apr 20, 2013 10:58 AM - 12:02 PM
      Protocol: Traveling
      4.8 mile(s)
      Comments: Submitted from BirdLog World for Android v1.7
      16 species

      Canada Goose 2
      Mallard 2
      Turkey Vulture 3
      Golden Eagle 2
      Northern Harrier 1
      Bald Eagle 3
      Red-tailed Hawk 3
      Killdeer 1
      Northern Flicker (Red-shafted) 1
      American Kestrel 1
      Black-billed Magpie 1
      American Robin 3
      European Starling 264
      Red-winged Blackbird 19
      Western Meadowlark 3
      House Finch 4

      View this checklist online at http://ebird.org/ebird/view/checklist?subID=S13815231

      This report was generated automatically by eBird v3 (http://ebird.org)

      Kona Bridge, Missoula, US-MT
      Apr 20, 2013 12:03 PM - 12:47 PM
      Protocol: Traveling
      0.2 mile(s)
      Comments: Submitted from BirdLog World for Android v1.7
      12 species

      Canada Goose 13
      Mallard 2
      Great Blue Heron 1
      Osprey 2
      Red-tailed Hawk 1
      Ferruginous Hawk 1 1 st year. N and E of bridge along roadside.
      Eurasian Collared-Dove 2
      Belted Kingfisher 2
      Black-billed Magpie 2
      Violet-green Swallow 7
      American Robin 2
      Red-winged Blackbird 2

      View this checklist online at http://ebird.org/ebird/view/checklist?subID=S13815767

      This report was generated automatically by eBird v3 (http://ebird.org)

      Frenchtown Pond, Missoula, US-MT
      Apr 20, 2013 2:01 PM
      Protocol: Incidental
      Comments: Submitted from BirdLog World for Android v1.7
      2 species

      Bufflehead 2
      Common Merganser 1

      View this checklist online at http://ebird.org/ebird/view/checklist?subID=S13817532

      This report was generated automatically by eBird v3 (http://ebird.org)

    • Thomas
      Jeff, Given that part of the stated purpose of our group is to provide a forum for birders of all levels to increase their knowledge and skill , I would
      Message 2 of 7 , Apr 20, 2013
        Jeff,

        Given that part of the stated purpose of our group is to "provide a forum for birders of all levels to increase their knowledge and skill", I would appreciate it if you would elaborate on the Red-tailed Hawk that I misidentified as a Ferruginous Hawk so that others don't make the same mistake in the future. It is very close to the illustration and description in Sibley's for a first year Ferruginous.

        I also believe that it is courteous to reply to separate posts respectively, as I believe each poster has demonstrated that they've expended a considerable amount of time, energy and consideration before making their decisions part of the public realm.

        Cheers,
        Thomas

        --- In MOB-Montana@yahoogroups.com, "Jeff Marks" <jeff17_marks@...> wrote:
        >
        > Thomas and Martin,
        >
        > First, the hawk is a Red-tailed, not a Ferruginous.
        >
        > Second, the ducks (both are odd, not just the "hybrid") are some kind of domestic strain, I think.
        >
        > Google "domestic duck" and click on the images and you'll find some that look very much like them.
        >
        > Jeff
        >
        > *******************
        > Jeff Marks
        > 4241 SE Liebe Street
        > Portland, OR 97206
        > 503-774-4783
        > Birds of Montana Project
        > http://mtaudubon.org/<http://mtaudubon.org/>
        > *******************
        > ----- Original Message -----
        > From: Thomas<mailto:tarnsnet@...>
        > To: MOB-Montana@yahoogroups.com<mailto:MOB-Montana@yahoogroups.com>
        > Sent: Saturday, April 20, 2013 5:39 PM
        > Subject: [MOB-Montana] Ferruginous Hawk at Kona Bridge
        >
        >
        >
        > MOBsters,
        >
        > While birding around Missoula today Katie Heath and I checked the area around Kona Bridge and Big Flat for the Harris's Hawk that Kristi DuBois reported, no luck, but we did observe a first year Ferruginous Hawk on the evergreen trees planted along the road North and East of the bridge, this bird was also observed in the same location on Wednesday 4/17(images posted to album T. Kallmeyer). Also had 7 FOY Violet-green Swallows observed from the river access by the bridge.
        >
        > The day started well with a Ruffed Grouse flying up and perching on the railing of our deck as I drank my morning coffee in the hot tub!
        >
        > Good Birding,
        > Thomas Kallmeyer
        >
        > Dodd Ranch, Missoula, US-MT
        > Apr 20, 2013 7:17 AM - 8:44 AM
        > Protocol: Traveling
        > 1.2 mile(s)
        > Comments: Submitted from BirdLog World for Android v1.7
        > 17 species
        >
        > Ruffed Grouse 1
        > Wild Turkey 3
        > Killdeer 2
        > Belted Kingfisher 1
        > Northern Flicker (Red-shafted) 2
        > Steller's Jay 3
        > Tree Swallow 1
        > Black-capped Chickadee 14
        > Mountain Chickadee 2
        > Red-breasted Nuthatch 2
        > Pacific Wren 1
        > Ruby-crowned Kinglet 2
        > American Robin 8
        > European Starling 8
        > Song Sparrow 3
        > Dark-eyed Junco (Oregon) 2
        > Red-winged Blackbird 5
        >
        > View this checklist online at http://ebird.org/ebird/view/checklist?subID=S13814466<http://ebird.org/ebird/view/checklist?subID=S13814466>
        >
        > This report was generated automatically by eBird v3 (http://ebird.org<http://ebird.org/>)
        >
        > Rollercoaster and Deschamps Roads, Missoula, US-MT
        > Apr 20, 2013 10:58 AM - 12:02 PM
        > Protocol: Traveling
        > 4.8 mile(s)
        > Comments: Submitted from BirdLog World for Android v1.7
        > 16 species
        >
        > Canada Goose 2
        > Mallard 2
        > Turkey Vulture 3
        > Golden Eagle 2
        > Northern Harrier 1
        > Bald Eagle 3
        > Red-tailed Hawk 3
        > Killdeer 1
        > Northern Flicker (Red-shafted) 1
        > American Kestrel 1
        > Black-billed Magpie 1
        > American Robin 3
        > European Starling 264
        > Red-winged Blackbird 19
        > Western Meadowlark 3
        > House Finch 4
        >
        > View this checklist online at http://ebird.org/ebird/view/checklist?subID=S13815231<http://ebird.org/ebird/view/checklist?subID=S13815231>
        >
        > This report was generated automatically by eBird v3 (http://ebird.org<http://ebird.org/>)
        >
        > Kona Bridge, Missoula, US-MT
        > Apr 20, 2013 12:03 PM - 12:47 PM
        > Protocol: Traveling
        > 0.2 mile(s)
        > Comments: Submitted from BirdLog World for Android v1.7
        > 12 species
        >
        > Canada Goose 13
        > Mallard 2
        > Great Blue Heron 1
        > Osprey 2
        > Red-tailed Hawk 1
        > Ferruginous Hawk 1 1 st year. N and E of bridge along roadside.
        > Eurasian Collared-Dove 2
        > Belted Kingfisher 2
        > Black-billed Magpie 2
        > Violet-green Swallow 7
        > American Robin 2
        > Red-winged Blackbird 2
        >
        > View this checklist online at http://ebird.org/ebird/view/checklist?subID=S13815767<http://ebird.org/ebird/view/checklist?subID=S13815767>
        >
        > This report was generated automatically by eBird v3 (http://ebird.org<http://ebird.org/>)
        >
        > Frenchtown Pond, Missoula, US-MT
        > Apr 20, 2013 2:01 PM
        > Protocol: Incidental
        > Comments: Submitted from BirdLog World for Android v1.7
        > 2 species
        >
        > Bufflehead 2
        > Common Merganser 1
        >
        > View this checklist online at http://ebird.org/ebird/view/checklist?subID=S13817532<http://ebird.org/ebird/view/checklist?subID=S13817532>
        >
        > This report was generated automatically by eBird v3 (http://ebird.org<http://ebird.org/>)
        >
      • Kristi DuBois
        Hi Thomas, Your picture where the bird is taking flight shows that it has naked legs above the feet. Ferruginous hawks would have feathers going all the way
        Message 3 of 7 , Apr 20, 2013
          Hi Thomas,

          Your picture where the bird is taking flight shows that it has naked legs above the feet.  Ferruginous hawks would have feathers going all the way down the leg to the feet.  There are other tricks, but this one is the main one that's visible in your photos.

          Hawks are very tricky, given all the color variations, subadult versus adult plumages, and such.  It's an easy mistake to make.

          You're not alone.  I have mis-identified a lot of hawks, and had to eat my words many times.  Subadult buteo hawks are very tricky.

          By the way, your flight picture of that hawk is quite lovely--nice job!

          I went back to Kona Bridge on Friday, but did not see the Harris's hawk.  Wonder where it will turn up next?

          Kristi DuBois
          Missoula

          At 09:29 PM 4/20/2013, you wrote:
           

          Jeff,

          Given that part of the stated purpose of our group is to "provide a forum for birders of all levels to increase their knowledge and skill", I would appreciate it if you would elaborate on the Red-tailed Hawk that I misidentified as a Ferruginous Hawk so that others don't make the same mistake in the future. It is very close to the illustration and description in Sibley's for a first year Ferruginous.

          I also believe that it is courteous to reply to separate posts respectively, as I believe each poster has demonstrated that they've expended a considerable amount of time, energy and consideration before making their decisions part of the public realm.

          Cheers,
          Thomas

          --- In MOB-Montana@yahoogroups.com, "Jeff Marks" <jeff17_marks@...> wrote:
          >
          > Thomas and Martin,
          >
          > First, the hawk is a Red-tailed, not a Ferruginous.
          >
          > Second, the ducks (both are odd, not just the "hybrid") are some kind of domestic strain, I think.
          >
          > Google "domestic duck" and click on the images and you'll find some that look very much like them.
          >
          > Jeff
          >
          > *******************
          > Jeff Marks
          > 4241 SE Liebe Street
          > Portland, OR 97206
          > 503-774-4783
          > Birds of Montana Project
          > http://mtaudubon.org/ < http://mtaudubon.org/>
          > *******************
          > ----- Original Message -----
          > From: Thomas< mailto:tarnsnet@...>
          > To: MOB-Montana@yahoogroups.com < mailto:MOB-Montana@yahoogroups.com>
          > Sent: Saturday, April 20, 2013 5:39 PM
          > Subject: [MOB-Montana] Ferruginous Hawk at Kona Bridge
          >
          >
          >
          > MOBsters,
          >
          > While birding around Missoula today Katie Heath and I checked the area around Kona Bridge and Big Flat for the Harris's Hawk that Kristi DuBois reported, no luck, but we did observe a first year Ferruginous Hawk on the evergreen trees planted along the road North and East of the bridge, this bird was also observed in the same location on Wednesday 4/17(images posted to album T. Kallmeyer). Also had 7 FOY Violet-green Swallows observed from the river access by the bridge.
          >
          > The day started well with a Ruffed Grouse flying up and perching on the railing of our deck as I drank my morning coffee in the hot tub!
          >
          > Good Birding,
          > Thomas Kallmeyer
          >
          > Dodd Ranch, Missoula, US-MT
          > Apr 20, 2013 7:17 AM - 8:44 AM
          > Protocol: Traveling
          > 1.2 mile(s)
          > Comments: Submitted from BirdLog World for Android v1.7
          > 17 species
          >
          > Ruffed Grouse 1
          > Wild Turkey 3
          > Killdeer 2
          > Belted Kingfisher 1
          > Northern Flicker (Red-shafted) 2
          > Steller's Jay 3
          > Tree Swallow 1
          > Black-capped Chickadee 14
          > Mountain Chickadee 2
          > Red-breasted Nuthatch 2
          > Pacific Wren 1
          > Ruby-crowned Kinglet 2
          > American Robin 8
          > European Starling 8
          > Song Sparrow 3
          > Dark-eyed Junco (Oregon) 2
          > Red-winged Blackbird 5
          >
          > View this checklist online at http://ebird.org/ebird/view/checklist?subID=S13814466 < http://ebird.org/ebird/view/checklist?subID=S13814466>
          >
          > This report was generated automatically by eBird v3 (http://ebird.org <http://ebird.org/ >)
          >
          > Rollercoaster and Deschamps Roads, Missoula, US-MT
          > Apr 20, 2013 10:58 AM - 12:02 PM
          > Protocol: Traveling
          > 4.8 mile(s)
          > Comments: Submitted from BirdLog World for Android v1.7
          > 16 species
          >
          > Canada Goose 2
          > Mallard 2
          > Turkey Vulture 3
          > Golden Eagle 2
          > Northern Harrier 1
          > Bald Eagle 3
          > Red-tailed Hawk 3
          > Killdeer 1
          > Northern Flicker (Red-shafted) 1
          > American Kestrel 1
          > Black-billed Magpie 1
          > American Robin 3
          > European Starling 264
          > Red-winged Blackbird 19
          > Western Meadowlark 3
          > House Finch 4
          >
          > View this checklist online at http://ebird.org/ebird/view/checklist?subID=S13815231 < http://ebird.org/ebird/view/checklist?subID=S13815231>
          >
          > This report was generated automatically by eBird v3 (http://ebird.org <http://ebird.org/ >)
          >
          > Kona Bridge, Missoula, US-MT
          > Apr 20, 2013 12:03 PM - 12:47 PM
          > Protocol: Traveling
          > 0.2 mile(s)
          > Comments: Submitted from BirdLog World for Android v1.7
          > 12 species
          >
          > Canada Goose 13
          > Mallard 2
          > Great Blue Heron 1
          > Osprey 2
          > Red-tailed Hawk 1
          > Ferruginous Hawk 1 1 st year. N and E of bridge along roadside.
          > Eurasian Collared-Dove 2
          > Belted Kingfisher 2
          > Black-billed Magpie 2
          > Violet-green Swallow 7
          > American Robin 2
          > Red-winged Blackbird 2
          >
          > View this checklist online at http://ebird.org/ebird/view/checklist?subID=S13815767 < http://ebird.org/ebird/view/checklist?subID=S13815767>
          >
          > This report was generated automatically by eBird v3 (http://ebird.org <http://ebird.org/ >)
          >
          > Frenchtown Pond, Missoula, US-MT
          > Apr 20, 2013 2:01 PM
          > Protocol: Incidental
          > Comments: Submitted from BirdLog World for Android v1.7
          > 2 species
          >
          > Bufflehead 2
          > Common Merganser 1
          >
          > View this checklist online at http://ebird.org/ebird/view/checklist?subID=S13817532 < http://ebird.org/ebird/view/checklist?subID=S13817532>
          >
          > This report was generated automatically by eBird v3 (http://ebird.org <http://ebird.org/ >)
          >

        • Jeff Marks
          Thomas, Sorry for my terse post earlier. Before now, I ve had only a few minutes to spare for answering emails and scanning mob. The light iris and completely
          Message 4 of 7 , Apr 20, 2013
            Thomas,
             
            Sorry for my terse post earlier.  Before now, I've had only a few minutes to spare for answering emails and scanning mob.  
             
            The light iris and completely barred tail without extensive red identify it as a yearling (that is, hatched last year).  The well-defined belly band and lack of an extensive gape point to Redtail, and the lack of extensive white on the tail pretty much rules out Ferruginous.  Kristi is of course correct about lack of the tarsus feathering ruling out Ferruginous, but determining whether the tarsus is feathered often is not possible without a scope on a perched bird.  By far the best field mark, diagnostic for Redtail, is the dark bar on the underside of the leading edge of the wing, which is readily apparent in your flight shot.
             
            No shame is misidentifying a buteo, especially in the West.  Show me a person who says they can identify all the hawks they see, and I'll show you a person who more than likely is not being completely honest, the gods of raptor id, like Bill Clark, excepted.
             
            Jeff
             
            *******************
            Jeff Marks
            4241 SE Liebe Street
            Portland, OR 97206
            503-774-4783
            Birds of Montana Project
            http://mtaudubon.org/
            *******************
            ----- Original Message -----
            From: Thomas
            Sent: Saturday, April 20, 2013 8:29 PM
            Subject: [MOB-Montana] Re: Ferruginous Hawk at Kona Bridge, duck pics

             

            Jeff,

            Given that part of the stated purpose of our group is to "provide a forum for birders of all levels to increase their knowledge and skill", I would appreciate it if you would elaborate on the Red-tailed Hawk that I misidentified as a Ferruginous Hawk so that others don't make the same mistake in the future. It is very close to the illustration and description in Sibley's for a first year Ferruginous.

            I also believe that it is courteous to reply to separate posts respectively, as I believe each poster has demonstrated that they've expended a considerable amount of time, energy and consideration before making their decisions part of the public realm.

            Cheers,
            Thomas

            --- In MOB-Montana@yahoogroups.com, "Jeff Marks" <jeff17_marks@...> wrote:
            >
            > Thomas and Martin,
            >
            > First, the hawk is a Red-tailed, not a Ferruginous.
            >
            > Second, the ducks (both are odd, not just the "hybrid") are some kind of domestic strain, I think.
            >
            > Google "domestic duck" and click on the images and you'll find some that look very much like them.
            >
            > Jeff
            >
            > *******************
            > Jeff Marks
            > 4241 SE Liebe Street
            > Portland, OR 97206
            > 503-774-4783
            > Birds of Montana Project
            > http://mtaudubon.org/<http://mtaudubon.org/>
            > *******************
            > ----- Original Message -----
            > From: Thomas<mailto:tarnsnet@...>
            > To: MOB-Montana@yahoogroups.com<mailto:MOB-Montana@yahoogroups.com>
            > Sent: Saturday, April 20, 2013 5:39 PM
            > Subject: [MOB-Montana] Ferruginous Hawk at Kona Bridge
            >
            >
            >
            > MOBsters,
            >
            > While birding around Missoula today Katie Heath and I checked the area around Kona Bridge and Big Flat for the Harris's Hawk that Kristi DuBois reported, no luck, but we did observe a first year Ferruginous Hawk on the evergreen trees planted along the road North and East of the bridge, this bird was also observed in the same location on Wednesday 4/17(images posted to album T. Kallmeyer). Also had 7 FOY Violet-green Swallows observed from the river access by the bridge.
            >
            > The day started well with a Ruffed Grouse flying up and perching on the railing of our deck as I drank my morning coffee in the hot tub!
            >
            > Good Birding,
            > Thomas Kallmeyer
            >
            > Dodd Ranch, Missoula, US-MT
            > Apr 20, 2013 7:17 AM - 8:44 AM
            > Protocol: Traveling
            > 1.2 mile(s)
            > Comments: Submitted from BirdLog World for Android v1.7
            > 17 species
            >
            > Ruffed Grouse 1
            > Wild Turkey 3
            > Killdeer 2
            > Belted Kingfisher 1
            > Northern Flicker (Red-shafted) 2
            > Steller's Jay 3
            > Tree Swallow 1
            > Black-capped Chickadee 14
            > Mountain Chickadee 2
            > Red-breasted Nuthatch 2
            > Pacific Wren 1
            > Ruby-crowned Kinglet 2
            > American Robin 8
            > European Starling 8
            > Song Sparrow 3
            > Dark-eyed Junco (Oregon) 2
            > Red-winged Blackbird 5
            >
            > View this checklist online at http://ebird.org/ebird/view/checklist?subID=S13814466<http://ebird.org/ebird/view/checklist?subID=S13814466>
            >
            > This report was generated automatically by eBird v3 (http://ebird.org<http://ebird.org/>)
            >
            > Rollercoaster and Deschamps Roads, Missoula, US-MT
            > Apr 20, 2013 10:58 AM - 12:02 PM
            > Protocol: Traveling
            > 4.8 mile(s)
            > Comments: Submitted from BirdLog World for Android v1.7
            > 16 species
            >
            > Canada Goose 2
            > Mallard 2
            > Turkey Vulture 3
            > Golden Eagle 2
            > Northern Harrier 1
            > Bald Eagle 3
            > Red-tailed Hawk 3
            > Killdeer 1
            > Northern Flicker (Red-shafted) 1
            > American Kestrel 1
            > Black-billed Magpie 1
            > American Robin 3
            > European Starling 264
            > Red-winged Blackbird 19
            > Western Meadowlark 3
            > House Finch 4
            >
            > View this checklist online at http://ebird.org/ebird/view/checklist?subID=S13815231<http://ebird.org/ebird/view/checklist?subID=S13815231>
            >
            > This report was generated automatically by eBird v3 (http://ebird.org<http://ebird.org/>)
            >
            > Kona Bridge, Missoula, US-MT
            > Apr 20, 2013 12:03 PM - 12:47 PM
            > Protocol: Traveling
            > 0.2 mile(s)
            > Comments: Submitted from BirdLog World for Android v1.7
            > 12 species
            >
            > Canada Goose 13
            > Mallard 2
            > Great Blue Heron 1
            > Osprey 2
            > Red-tailed Hawk 1
            > Ferruginous Hawk 1 1 st year. N and E of bridge along roadside.
            > Eurasian Collared-Dove 2
            > Belted Kingfisher 2
            > Black-billed Magpie 2
            > Violet-green Swallow 7
            > American Robin 2
            > Red-winged Blackbird 2
            >
            > View this checklist online at http://ebird.org/ebird/view/checklist?subID=S13815767<http://ebird.org/ebird/view/checklist?subID=S13815767>
            >
            > This report was generated automatically by eBird v3 (http://ebird.org<http://ebird.org/>)
            >
            > Frenchtown Pond, Missoula, US-MT
            > Apr 20, 2013 2:01 PM
            > Protocol: Incidental
            > Comments: Submitted from BirdLog World for Android v1.7
            > 2 species
            >
            > Bufflehead 2
            > Common Merganser 1
            >
            > View this checklist online at http://ebird.org/ebird/view/checklist?subID=S13817532<http://ebird.org/ebird/view/checklist?subID=S13817532>
            >
            > This report was generated automatically by eBird v3 (http://ebird.org<http://ebird.org/>)
            >

          • Thomas
            Kristi, Thanks for the advice and the compliment! Thomas
            Message 5 of 7 , Apr 21, 2013
              Kristi,

              Thanks for the advice and the compliment!

              Thomas
            • Thomas
              Jeff, No worries! Thank you very much for taking a moment with this comprehensive reply, I completely enjoyed reading it, it s this kind of conversation that
              Message 6 of 7 , Apr 21, 2013
                Jeff,

                No worries! Thank you very much for taking a moment with this comprehensive reply, I completely enjoyed reading it, it's this kind of conversation that takes identification beyond the level of the field guide. There's nothing like a good lesson learned to improve identification skills.

                Good Birding,

                Thomas

                --- In MOB-Montana@yahoogroups.com, "Jeff Marks" <jeff17_marks@...> wrote:
                >
                > Thomas,
                >
                > Sorry for my terse post earlier. Before now, I've had only a few minutes to spare for answering emails and scanning mob.
                >
                > The light iris and completely barred tail without extensive red identify it as a yearling (that is, hatched last year). The well-defined belly band and lack of an extensive gape point to Redtail, and the lack of extensive white on the tail pretty much rules out Ferruginous. Kristi is of course correct about lack of the tarsus feathering ruling out Ferruginous, but determining whether the tarsus is feathered often is not possible without a scope on a perched bird. By far the best field mark, diagnostic for Redtail, is the dark bar on the underside of the leading edge of the wing, which is readily apparent in your flight shot.
                >
                > No shame is misidentifying a buteo, especially in the West. Show me a person who says they can identify all the hawks they see, and I'll show you a person who more than likely is not being completely honest, the gods of raptor id, like Bill Clark, excepted.
                >
                > Jeff
                >
                > *******************
                > Jeff Marks
                > 4241 SE Liebe Street
                > Portland, OR 97206
                > 503-774-4783
                > Birds of Montana Project
                > http://mtaudubon.org/<http://mtaudubon.org/>
                > *******************
                > ----- Original Message -----
                > From: Thomas<mailto:tarnsnet@...>
                > To: MOB-Montana@yahoogroups.com<mailto:MOB-Montana@yahoogroups.com>
                > Sent: Saturday, April 20, 2013 8:29 PM
                > Subject: [MOB-Montana] Re: Ferruginous Hawk at Kona Bridge, duck pics
                >
                >
                >
                > Jeff,
                >
                > Given that part of the stated purpose of our group is to "provide a forum for birders of all levels to increase their knowledge and skill", I would appreciate it if you would elaborate on the Red-tailed Hawk that I misidentified as a Ferruginous Hawk so that others don't make the same mistake in the future. It is very close to the illustration and description in Sibley's for a first year Ferruginous.
                >
                > I also believe that it is courteous to reply to separate posts respectively, as I believe each poster has demonstrated that they've expended a considerable amount of time, energy and consideration before making their decisions part of the public realm.
                >
                > Cheers,
                > Thomas
                >
                > --- In MOB-Montana@yahoogroups.com<mailto:MOB-Montana%40yahoogroups.com>, "Jeff Marks" <jeff17_marks@> wrote:
                > >
                > > Thomas and Martin,
                > >
                > > First, the hawk is a Red-tailed, not a Ferruginous.
                > >
                > > Second, the ducks (both are odd, not just the "hybrid") are some kind of domestic strain, I think.
                > >
                > > Google "domestic duck" and click on the images and you'll find some that look very much like them.
                > >
                > > Jeff
                > >
                > > *******************
                > > Jeff Marks
                > > 4241 SE Liebe Street
                > > Portland, OR 97206
                > > 503-774-4783
                > > Birds of Montana Project
                > > http://mtaudubon.org/<http://mtaudubon.org/><http://mtaudubon.org/<http://mtaudubon.org/>>
                > > *******************
                > > ----- Original Message -----
                > > From: Thomas<mailto:tarnsnet@>
                > > To: MOB-Montana@yahoogroups.com<mailto:MOB-Montana%40yahoogroups.com><mailto:MOB-Montana@yahoogroups.com<mailto:MOB-Montana%40yahoogroups.com>>
                > > Sent: Saturday, April 20, 2013 5:39 PM
                > > Subject: [MOB-Montana] Ferruginous Hawk at Kona Bridge
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > > MOBsters,
                > >
                > > While birding around Missoula today Katie Heath and I checked the area around Kona Bridge and Big Flat for the Harris's Hawk that Kristi DuBois reported, no luck, but we did observe a first year Ferruginous Hawk on the evergreen trees planted along the road North and East of the bridge, this bird was also observed in the same location on Wednesday 4/17(images posted to album T. Kallmeyer). Also had 7 FOY Violet-green Swallows observed from the river access by the bridge.
                > >
                > > The day started well with a Ruffed Grouse flying up and perching on the railing of our deck as I drank my morning coffee in the hot tub!
                > >
                > > Good Birding,
                > > Thomas Kallmeyer
                > >
                > > Dodd Ranch, Missoula, US-MT
                > > Apr 20, 2013 7:17 AM - 8:44 AM
                > > Protocol: Traveling
                > > 1.2 mile(s)
                > > Comments: Submitted from BirdLog World for Android v1.7
                > > 17 species
                > >
                > > Ruffed Grouse 1
                > > Wild Turkey 3
                > > Killdeer 2
                > > Belted Kingfisher 1
                > > Northern Flicker (Red-shafted) 2
                > > Steller's Jay 3
                > > Tree Swallow 1
                > > Black-capped Chickadee 14
                > > Mountain Chickadee 2
                > > Red-breasted Nuthatch 2
                > > Pacific Wren 1
                > > Ruby-crowned Kinglet 2
                > > American Robin 8
                > > European Starling 8
                > > Song Sparrow 3
                > > Dark-eyed Junco (Oregon) 2
                > > Red-winged Blackbird 5
                > >
                > > View this checklist online at http://ebird.org/ebird/view/checklist?subID=S13814466<http://ebird.org/ebird/view/checklist?subID=S13814466><http://ebird.org/ebird/view/checklist?subID=S13814466<http://ebird.org/ebird/view/checklist?subID=S13814466>>
                > >
                > > This report was generated automatically by eBird v3 (http://ebird.org<http://ebird.org/><http://ebird.org/<http://ebird.org/>>)
                > >
                > > Rollercoaster and Deschamps Roads, Missoula, US-MT
                > > Apr 20, 2013 10:58 AM - 12:02 PM
                > > Protocol: Traveling
                > > 4.8 mile(s)
                > > Comments: Submitted from BirdLog World for Android v1.7
                > > 16 species
                > >
                > > Canada Goose 2
                > > Mallard 2
                > > Turkey Vulture 3
                > > Golden Eagle 2
                > > Northern Harrier 1
                > > Bald Eagle 3
                > > Red-tailed Hawk 3
                > > Killdeer 1
                > > Northern Flicker (Red-shafted) 1
                > > American Kestrel 1
                > > Black-billed Magpie 1
                > > American Robin 3
                > > European Starling 264
                > > Red-winged Blackbird 19
                > > Western Meadowlark 3
                > > House Finch 4
                > >
                > > View this checklist online at http://ebird.org/ebird/view/checklist?subID=S13815231<http://ebird.org/ebird/view/checklist?subID=S13815231><http://ebird.org/ebird/view/checklist?subID=S13815231<http://ebird.org/ebird/view/checklist?subID=S13815231>>
                > >
                > > This report was generated automatically by eBird v3 (http://ebird.org<http://ebird.org/><http://ebird.org/<http://ebird.org/>>)
                > >
                > > Kona Bridge, Missoula, US-MT
                > > Apr 20, 2013 12:03 PM - 12:47 PM
                > > Protocol: Traveling
                > > 0.2 mile(s)
                > > Comments: Submitted from BirdLog World for Android v1.7
                > > 12 species
                > >
                > > Canada Goose 13
                > > Mallard 2
                > > Great Blue Heron 1
                > > Osprey 2
                > > Red-tailed Hawk 1
                > > Ferruginous Hawk 1 1 st year. N and E of bridge along roadside.
                > > Eurasian Collared-Dove 2
                > > Belted Kingfisher 2
                > > Black-billed Magpie 2
                > > Violet-green Swallow 7
                > > American Robin 2
                > > Red-winged Blackbird 2
                > >
                > > View this checklist online at http://ebird.org/ebird/view/checklist?subID=S13815767<http://ebird.org/ebird/view/checklist?subID=S13815767><http://ebird.org/ebird/view/checklist?subID=S13815767<http://ebird.org/ebird/view/checklist?subID=S13815767>>
                > >
                > > This report was generated automatically by eBird v3 (http://ebird.org<http://ebird.org/><http://ebird.org/<http://ebird.org/>>)
                > >
                > > Frenchtown Pond, Missoula, US-MT
                > > Apr 20, 2013 2:01 PM
                > > Protocol: Incidental
                > > Comments: Submitted from BirdLog World for Android v1.7
                > > 2 species
                > >
                > > Bufflehead 2
                > > Common Merganser 1
                > >
                > > View this checklist online at http://ebird.org/ebird/view/checklist?subID=S13817532<http://ebird.org/ebird/view/checklist?subID=S13817532><http://ebird.org/ebird/view/checklist?subID=S13817532<http://ebird.org/ebird/view/checklist?subID=S13817532>>
                > >
                > > This report was generated automatically by eBird v3 (http://ebird.org<http://ebird.org/><http://ebird.org/<http://ebird.org/>>)
                > >
                >
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