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Re: [MCVictimsEU] Re: John Allman analysis

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  • M. Hosny
    Dear John (UK), Our strategy should be directed towards unity & joint action. It is not only about How to get there..it is about WHOM are we facing. This is
    Message 1 of 17 , Nov 18 4:06 AM
      Dear John (UK),
       
      Our strategy should be directed towards unity & joint action. It is not only about How to get there..it is about WHOM are we facing.
       
      This is where we need to agree on the strategy and the tactics.
       
      We need to counter the Special services claims that "these people are delusional". This will be by numbers, photos and history of victims and as Monika said testimonials from others. Contact info of victims should be available.
       
      Derrick Robinson is working on a good project ( a book of victims stories).
       
       
      That is why I call upon everyone to send me their stories to make a book readable by people. This will be a blow to the special services.
       
      I do NOT wish to email Harlan or Juliaanne. They were on the list when I clicked "REPLY EVERYONE"
       
      As for Robert Duncan work, it is clear that his technical education in Artificial Intelligence from Harvard and an MBA from Darmouth is demonstrated in his analysis of the challenges we face, and EXPOSING their tactics. Lets focus on our moving forward and less on him. Discrediting him will fail because facts are facts!!!
       
      To everyone: Please send me a story in the format I requested.
       
      I will get this book done and will try to get it published in Canada, the Arab world, the former USSR, Venezuela and Iran. 
       
      In fraternitate,
      Moe Hosny
      519 784 6822


      John Allman <John_W_Allman@...> wrote:
      Dear Moe
       
      It isn't sensible for us to keep on spamming, with copies of our internal debates and polemics, friendly politicians like Patsy Sorensen and Caroline Lucas, nor for us to spam Harlan Girard and Julianne McKinney, who have expressly asked not to be spammed, so I've taken all four of them, and several others, off the Cc list.
       
      I thought your email to Jean raises certain questions as to what on earth you meant.
       
      For example, who does "not have a policy" (you say)?
       
      A policy on what?
       
      Who amongst us has the "assignment" of "disabling our movement"?
       
      To whom has Robert Duncan caused "real damage"?  What damage has he caused those people?  Who has "discredited" him, in retaliation, and how have they managed to do this?  (I think Duncan has discredited himself.)
       
      You also say that we don't have a strategy, but I certainly do have a strategy, and have already told you what a large part of my personal strategy is.  See http://wmamw. com/Goals2. htm again.  David Bromhall also has a strategy, regarding lobbying in Europe, into which I buy completely.  Monika Stoces has a strategy too, into which I also buy completely, as does Jean Verstratten, to whom your "fraternal" comments were addressed.
       
      The main disagreements aren't about strategy.  They are about mere tactics.
       
      I reject the tactics of using false names, even whilst striving to become public figures so that we can better-publicise the cause.  I reject the tactic of attempting character assassinations of those who ask us for evidence of academic qualifications we claim to hold.  I reject the tactics of embracing falsehood perceived to be "positive", and of disdaining truth perceived to be "negative".  I reject the tactic of sending our "stories" to all and sundry, unsolicited, what I call "spam activism".  I reject the tactic of stiffling healthy debate as to what our strategy or our tactics ought to be, by appeals for "unity".
       
      I praise the tactic Jean Verstratten employed, drafting his "alarmed citizens" petition, collecting signatures, and seeking out chinks in the armour of the establishment through which to post copies of that declaration, asking for something specific to be done about the problem, different in each application of the petition, and within the competence of the officials approached.  I praise the tactic of commissioning and publishing learned papers that document the technological feasibility nowadays of the abuses we are forced unjustly to endure.  I praise the tactic which Monika and Danny deploid, in founding FEDAME.  I praise Monika's tactic of enlisting Patsy Sorensen's help.
       
      I am not ashamed of the tactics I have used myself, and am using.  As examples, I entered electoral politics briefly during 2005, and thus got on radio and TV in front of millions.  I am an advocate for TIs within the faith community to which I belong - the very faith community that was at the forefront of opposition (successful) to the Atlantic slave trade, and (unsuccessful) to the rise of The Third Reich.  And whenever I don't have to wear a collar and tie, I wear t-shirt emblazoned "Ban Mind Weapons .org".
       
      John
       
       
       
       
      ----- Original Message -----
      From: M. Hosny
      Sent: Saturday, November 17, 2007 5:15 PM
      Subject: Re: [MCVictimsEU] Re: we do NOT have a policy

      The problem Mr. Verstraaten is we do NOT have a policy!!
       
      No planning!!
       
      No strategy!!
       
      Furthermore, there are among us those whose assignment is disabling the movement.
       
      Robert Duncan is not a perp.!!! why? because he caused them damage, real damage!!
       
      so they had to discredit him!!
       
      Lets make a nice book, with stories, photos, contact info., tel. numbers, evidence from Pravda and other publications! !!
       
      and we would send it to the press and politicians
       
      So there would be no angry UNCOORDINATED LETTERS!!
       
      In fraternitate,
      Moe Hosny


      Monika Stoces <monika.stoces@ telenet.be> wrote:
      Jean voor alle duidelijkheid
      teksten over cryptocratien, onzichtbare energien paranormale wapens en supra normale bronnen
       
      snap nu eens dat dat onze geloofwaardighied misschien meer ondermijnt dan een eerlijke kwade maar DUIDELIJKE discussie over wat er gaande is....
      Ik denk niet dat dr Robert Duncan bv onze geloofwaardigheid ondermijnt BV
      en gezien ik weinigen ertoe krijg iets zinnigs te schrijven, moet ik wel via groeps mail naar de snuggerdere individuen
      HET IS ONS ALLEN BELANG
      DAT IEMAND IETS DOET
      EN DAT ONZE BOODSCHAP DUIDELIJK IS
       
      vaagheid zal ons dus geen goed doen !!!!!!
      VANDAAR IS NAAST WEGEVING ER EEN ACUUT MENSENRECHTEN POROBLEEM MET MENSEN DIE ALS PROEFKONIJN DIENEN
      24 OP 24
      EN DIE MOETEN ALS SLACHTOFFER NIET ZELF EEN WETGEVING GAAN OPSTELLEN
      EN NOG EENS BEWIJZEN DAT ZE NORMAAL ZIJN
      EN BEWIJZEN WIE DIT DOET EN HOE
      WANT DAT VRAAGT MEN ONS DUS ALLEMAAL
       
      SLACHOFFERS VAN EEN MISDAAD
      HEBBEN RECHT OM KLACHT NEER TE LEGGEN ZONDER BANG TE MOETNE ZIJN DAT ZE NAAR DE PSYCHIATIRIE VERWEZEN WORDEN LANG VOOR HUN KLACHT ZELFS MAAR GELEZEN WORDT
       
      MEN NOEMT DIT EEN INDIVIDUEEL PROBLEEM
      OMDAT MEN DENKT DAT WE ZOT ZIJN
       
      REALISME IS DAT INZIEN  IPV VAN DE BBODSCHAP TE MILDEREN
      EN OP DE REXST KWAAD TE ZIJN DAT ZE NIET REAGEREN
       
      HET UITBLIJVEN VAN ELKE REACTIE
       
      IS  OMDAT MEN DENKT DAT WE ZOT ZIJN
      DAT IS ALLES
       
      ZO IS HET PUNT ANDER LIJN
      GE WAART OOK KWAAD OP IEDEREEN DIE NIET REAGEERT
      MAAR ZE GELOVEN NIET DAT MENSEN WORDEN AANGEVALLEN
      HOEVEEL TEKSTEN GE OOK STUURT OVER TECHNOLOGIE
       
      DEZE GRUWEL GELOVEN ZE NIET
      HOE ONOZEL OP EEN GELOOF AFGAAN OOK IS
      ZEKER NU
       
       
       
      ----- Original Message -----
      Sent: Friday, November 16, 2007 11:56 PM
      Subject: Re: Mrs. Nelly Maes, chairwoman of the Flemish Peace Institute

      Hove (Belgium) Nov. 16, 2007
      Dear Co-victims and or Co-resisters,
      Since a few years I had been corresponding with Mrs. Nelly Maes, previous M.P. and chairwoman of the Flemish Peace Institute, which was created by (Flemish) law.
      Last time I sent to her 1)the Declaration of Concerned Citizens, 2) a few ideas about a possible national (in this case Belgian) law that would be inspired e.g. by Paragraph 27 of Resolution A40005/1999 of the European Parliament, 3) a list with addresses where more information can be found. 
      Mrs. Maes replied that she would propose to the Council of the Institute to pass my documentation to the Scientific Secretariat of the Institute for further study.
      This to me seems to be the right way.  You yourself could have written to the Flemish Peace Institute in order to support my demand for an examination and for a law.  This was not done.  Instead all sort of copies of rather personal and even angry letters reached Nelly Maes (some of them being in Dutch = Flemish).  This, surely, will have a negative effect.  Hence, please remove this person from your mailing list.  
      Thank You,
      Jean
      ----- Original Message -----
      Sent: Wednesday, November 14, 2007 5:23 AM
      Subject: RE: "You are weakening our noble movement by these negative tendencies!"

      Confession is good for the soul, I've heard.  Don't think of it as falling on your sword, however.  Think of it as castling your king.
       
      Meanwhile, ...do you think I might possibly be removed from this mailing list?
       
      Julianne

      "R. Duncan" <duncan@higherorder. com> wrote:
      Dear John A. and others whose full time jobs are accusing,
       
      I have been trying to confess for a long time. I am a perp. I am paid by the US government to conduct psychological experiments on you. I am deceitful sometimes and I am wrong sometimes. I even accidentally tell you a truth now and then. But they dock my pay when that happens.

      So, now that you have a full confession. Can we move on and have constructive conversations even knowing that I am trying to hurt you through intentional bad information and theories? Greed is what drives me. I get extra-CIA pay when I can lead you towards irrational and unfounded belief systems.  Perhaps it is good mental exercise to be able to critically reason while knowing that a sophisticated perp like myself is guiding you away from God and truth intentionally?
       
      Perhaps like with evolution theory, we should separate church and state. Use one as a personal guidance and an information drug to inspire you, and the other that has proven more useful in predicting the immediate future and to explain the physical world where brain chemistry and the mind intersect. Always be skeptical of information that you read. This should not be something new. However, personally attacking someone shows a lack of ability to understand the science and argue on that basis. We are back to the Christian inquisitions and will get nowhere. Just assume in every email  that you are required to think for yourself and not be lazy wanting to rely on someone’s reputation. In fact, in a perfect intelligent meritocracy, where no names were attached to information exchanges, you would have to learn to do this.

      Why does thinking and arguing in a professional exchange about this topic in a scientific and strategic manner, pain you so much? Why do you spend so much time talking about the useless and nonsensical aspects? Get over your classicism and take everyone as if they have something important to say. Filter, don’t respond negatively. I for one have nearly fully given up my defense research and public speaking because of the constant barrage of negativity. I found that I can help more people and other groups with other problems who are more grateful of my sacrifices. You aren’t winning allies or friends and you haven’t figured it out that negativity is highly infectious and the most obvious quality to instill into people and groups to isolate and disassemble them. If you haven’t figured out just the very basic psychological strategies being used against a group assembling by reading military and CIA methods, you haven’t progressed in this chess game at all. This is why I have lost hope.
       
       
       
       
       
       
      -----Original Message-----
      From: M. Hosny [mailto:moe_ hosny@yahoo. ca]
      Sent:
      Tuesday, November 13, 2007 7:30 PM
      To: John Allman
      Cc: duncan@higherorder. com; 'Julianne McKinney'; 'M. Hosny'; 'Monika Stoces'; robalandes@telus. net; 'Thea Vangossum'; soleilmavis@ yahoo.com; rudyrud2004@ yayoo.fr; 'MAES Nelly'; julgilliam1@ riversongs. tv; johnfinch@excite. com; info@freedomfchs. com; info@advocaat- dumoulin. be; 'Harlan Girard'; 'Annemarie Gielen'; 'Adams Elisabeth'; eleanor@shoestringr adio.net; dcr618@...; 'Petrit Demo'; 'CCHR'; CarolineLucas@ GreenMEPs. org.uk; ACLA@americancognit ivelibertiesasso c.org; 'jean verstraeten' ; patsy.sorensen@ payoke.be; MCVictimsEU@ yahoogroups. com; 'GUELCHER Ernst'; peterpm@xs4all. nl; mcactivism@yahoogro ups.com; 'Pam Farnsworth'; 'Anna Bisetti'; John McMurtrey
      Subject: Re: "You are weakening our noble movement by these negative tendencies!"
       
      Dear John (United Kingdom),
       
      Robert Duncan's contributions to exposing terror wil be historical.
       
      In Fraternitate,
      Moe

      John Allman <John_W_Allman@ hotmail.com> wrote:
      Dear Moe
       
      My comments about Robert Duncan were based upon facts (at the time), and were addressed to John McMurtrey.  It is surprising that you have chosen to publicise those commment rather widely, and long after they were written, considering that you consider the comments to be indicative of tendencies of mine that you call "negative".  Was that wise of you?
       
      Classifying statements as either "positive" or "negative" is commonplace amongst those whose worldview does not equip them to regard whether statements are true or false as of paramount importance.
       
      What weakens our movement, and makes it in part an ignoble movement, is indifference to the truth.  In fact, the bible predicts the present torture, and says that God will allow it to happen, because mankind refuses to love the truth.  I didn't set out to broadcast widely and for a prolonged period that, despite perhaps being (I insinuated) suspect, mad, secretive and/or deceitful, Robert might nevertheless have sent us a link worth asking John to evaluate.
       
      I am not in the least bit happy that you have republished my comments.  Still less am I happy that the factual record establishes that Robert could be any or all of the things I said he might be.  I wish it were not so.  I am very disappointed that such comments should be rejected as "negative", rather than acclaimed because they express the truth.
       
      John
       
       
      ----- Original Message -----
      From: M. Hosny
      Sent: Monday, November 12, 2007 4:17 AM
      Subject: Why personal attacks against Dr. Duncan
       
      Mr. Allman,
       
      You are weakening our noble movement by these negative tendencies!
       
      May the Lord guide us all (spiritually not religiously! ! )
       
      In fraternitate,
      Moe Hosny


      John Allman <John_W_Allman@ hotmail.com> wrote:
      Dear John

      The donor Dunc at higher order whatever is suspect for any number of reasons I needn't go into tonight.  All the same, his suggested new source http://diss. kib.ki.se/ 2005/91-7140- 429-5/thesis. pdf might still be worthwhile your reading, in case there's anything new there which we who are serious and sane can cite, documenting to academic standards the feasubilty of, and perhaps thus ending for a while, the abuses we suffer.

      Dunc, however mad, and however deceitful or secretive he might to date seem to be, might not after all turn out to be a perp or a deliberate liar.  (Let's hope not!)  He could be merely be the sort of idiot who gives a stupid radio interview in which he actually agrees on air that there might indeed be software enough already to give Mr Adolf Hitler (the real one) a type of immortality, after all these years.  (I kid you not!)
      John


      ----- Original Message -----
      From: R. Duncan
      To: 'Julianne McKinney' ; 'M. Hosny' ; 'Monika Stoces' ; 'John Allman'
      Cc: robalandes@telus. net ; 'Thea Vangossum' ; soleilmavis@ yahoo.com ; rudyrud2004@ yayoo.fr ; 'MAES Nelly' ; moe_hosny@yahoo. ca ; julgilliam1@ riversongs. tv ; johnfinch@excite. com ; info@freedomfchs. com ; info@advocaat- dumoulin. be ; 'Harlan Girard' ; 'Annemarie Gielen' ; 'Adams Elisabeth' ; eleanor@shoestringr adio.net ; dcr618@... ; 'Petrit Demo' ; 'CCHR' ; CarolineLucas@ GreenMEPs. org.uk ; ACLA@americancognit ivelibertiesasso c.org ; 'jean verstraeten' ; patsy.sorensen@ payoke.be ; MCVictimsEU@ yahoogroups. com ; 'GUELCHER Ernst' ; peterpm@xs4all. nl ; mcactivism@yahoogro ups.com ; 'Pam Farnsworth' ; 'Anna Bisetti'
      Sent: Sunday, November 11, 2007 11:26 PM
      Subject: Behavioral science


      Research from Grace:

      Stress conditioning the human subjects allows for manipulation at a precognitive level. Stalking, financially depleting, torture, and isolation all induce war time like stresses on the human psyche. This increases the dopamine and other neurotransmitters released during a stressful condition which in turn decreases the subject’s ability to use higher level cognitive functions before reacting.

      Here is a paper on the FBI’s research into these effects.


      Dr. Carl Jensen
      Senior Researcher, RAND Corporation; and former Supervisory Special Agent,
      FBI Academy Behavioral Science Unit  

      http://diss. kib.ki.se/ 2005/91-7140- 429-5/thesis. pdf


      -----Original Message-----
      From: Julianne McKinney [mailto:juliannemck inney@yahoo. com]
      Sent:
      Sunday, November 11, 2007 1:42 PM
      To: M. Hosny; Monika Stoces; John Allman
      Cc: robalandes@telus. net; Thea Vangossum; soleilmavis@ yahoo.com; rudyrud2004@ yayoo.fr; MAES Nelly; moe_hosny@yahoo. ca; julgilliam1@ riversongs. tv; johnfinch@excite. com; info@freedomfchs. com; info@advocaat- dumoulin. be; Harlan Girard; Annemarie Gielen; Adams Elisabeth; eleanor@shoestringr adio.net; duncan@higherorder. com; dcr618@...; Petrit Demo; CCHR; CarolineLucas@ GreenMEPs. org.uk; ACLA@americancognit ivelibertiesasso c.org; jean verstraeten; patsy.sorensen@ payoke.be; MCVictimsEU@ yahoogroups. com; GUELCHER Ernst; peterpm@xs4all. nl; mcactivism@yahoogro ups.com; Pam Farnsworth; Anna Bisetti
      Subject: Re: [mcactivism] Mind Control + Agents

      Oh, but you are mistaken, Moe.  According to the latest theories, those cantalopes and tomatoes in your shopping cart popped out of the 9th Dimension.  Your friend didn't see them being replaced, so OBVIOUSLY they came from a parallel dimension.

      The lesson to be learned in this?  Keep an eye on your shopping cart.  And CERTAINLY don't grab someone else's shopping cart thinking it might be your own.  And THEN, ...just get on with your life.

      This is so inane.

      Julianne

      "M. Hosny" <moe_hosny@yahoo. ca> wrote:
      Dear Julianne,

      A high ranking Canadian politician told me: "it is good you know they are doing this to you"

      Therefore, I request you to consider two factors:

      1- Some people by nature are more easily manipulated than others!

      2- If you are unaware of the aggression against you, you will be manipulated more easily!

      So some of the neighbours acting weirdly do not know what is being done to them. But as the expert Dr. Duncan said, you cannot rule out that some neighbours or others are paid to act weirdly in your presence.

      I was with a friend at an
      Ottawa food store. The friend saw me put the watermelon and lettuce in the cart. Melon was replaced by cantaloupe and lettuce by tomatoes and so forth. Now this is NOT mind control. This is someone paid by the Special Services.

      In fraternitate,
      Moe Hosny


      Julianne McKinney <juliannemckinney@ yahoo.com> wrote:
      Jesus once said, "Forgive them Father, for they know not what they do."  No doubt he saw the same thing.  Roboticized mobs. 

      In which case, Monika, you might simply follow this divine Historical Precedent, forgive everyone for not knowing what they are doing, ignore what is going on, and get on with your life.

      OR, another way of looking at it is that we are all living in some type of semi-hellish purgatory and that things will get better only after we die and move on to a higher plane of existence.  In which case, Monika, you might simply ignore what is going on and wait until you die, so that you can move on to your next plane of existence.

      Now, if you would be so kind as to remove me from this mailing list, I will happily spare you any further silly analogies.

      Julianne



      Monika Stoces <monika.stoces@ telenet.be> wrote:
      >From "Philosophers Explore The matrix" (edited by C Grau)
      How do we know that our thoughts are not being manipulated, and that our perception of reality are accurate? The matrix makes these doubts stand out vividly. (Julia driver)

      Julianne wrote: "Monika is saying, in effect, that people are unnecessary artifacts in these organized-stalking and electronic-harassme nt operations because everything has been "roboticized, " ...if there is such a word. "

       about this,
      Yes i am saying that ..only pleeeeeeeeease understand "exactly" how i mean it.....:-)
       peole are not "just robitized".. .(what could be the right word in english?)
      something that controls the whole planet, can be only computerguided. ....
      ofcourse computers are installed and controlled by people yes sure....
      but those people are NOT THE PEOPLE LIKE our neigbours or the ones we see making street theaTher or making gestures at us. (because that is remotely controlled)

      its done very very well  !!!!!!!!!!!! !
      creates powerfull illusions and it's "consious", IT IS ARTIFICIAL INTELIGENCE !!!!!!!!!!!! !!! (or something that behaves that way at least, touring-machine- like)
      that is why its much more clever (read "processes data much faster and preciser" than humans ever can)
      and controls MANY PEOPLE AT ONCE IN INTERACTION

      Very inporant in this manipulation in "real time" is that EACH PERSON IS MANIPULATED TO UNDERSTAND AND JUDGE THE SITUATION TOTALLY DIFFERENTLY (meaning of words, sentences, situations, symbols ect ect)
      that is the way the system causes confusion... .
      this manipulation is so powerfull and goes so fast that the person has no time to think well and only reacts to the stimulus , that looks perfectly like his own... !!!!   (maybe afterward he will ask himself "strange , why was i so sure?)
      Like that it can be used on people without their knowlegde, they will absolutely not "recognize" to be manipulated
      they will be sure they juged the situation correctly while they did not

      so i dont really mean that people are  ONLY robots when they act
      ONLY THEY MEAN ALL THE TIME SOMETHING ELSE THAN WE DO UNDERSTAND (its ment to be that way, its manipulated that way)

      This has to do with the fact that this technologie understands language, and DETERMINES about THE MEANING we understand a word a sentence and even a total situation  !!!!!!!!!!!! !!  (misjudging situations is one of the favorit things this technolgy does with all of us;  and ofcourse in wartime that is a very important thing to use !!!
      WE CANNOT UNDERSTAND IT DIFFERENTLY THAN THE SYSTEM WANTS US ,only after we can realize how things went)

      it determines also what others say and what we say on certain moments, we cannot feel the difference (forced speech) or see the difference on others, they dont even feel it themselves.. ...
      we only can afterwards each time think , nothing else...
      only we can draw conclusion we cannot feel this technologie making us think or speak or look at something or even "love someone".... .(after a while the victim gets to know it, and "recognizes" easier when its manipulation. ..)..

      it very very very well done
      its fascinating by itself how this can fool EVERYBODY
      WITHOUT EXEPTION     ALSO THE CLEVER ONES !!!!!!!!!!   the psychatrists, scientists doktors ect ect

      also all this tells us
      THAT ITS ONE BIG SYSTEM WORL WIDE   IN INTERACTION
      THIS CONCLUSION IS CONFORMINED BY THE STATISTICAL EXPLOSION WORLD WIDE IN 2000 OF MANY NEW VICTIMS A YEAR
      Does this sounds logical???
      look at it altogether !!!!!

      that explains why nobody knows this, and everybody thinks, ( read :  "misjudges the situation")   that we are mentally ill.
      so simple is it , so geniously is it
      for god sake its the hugest crime of the century
      realistic is that its done very very well, other wise they would not let us run around and write to authorities !!!!!!!!!!
      they let us do that, because its a part of the game , manipulating everybody, to ignore it, without even thinking about what we in fact are trying to tell



      greets Monika

      ----- Original Message -----
      From: Julianne McKinney
      To: John Allman ; Monika Stoces
      Cc: robalandes@telus. net ; Thea Vangossum ; soleilmavis@ yahoo.com ; rudyrud2004@ yayoo.fr ; MAES Nelly ; moe_hosny@yahoo. ca ; julgilliam1@ riversongs. tv ; johnfinch@excite. com ; info@freedomfchs. com ; info@advocaat- dumoulin. be ; Harlan Girard ; Annemarie Gielen ; Adams Elisabeth ; eleanor@shoestringr adio.net ; duncan@higherorder. com ; dcr618@... ; Petrit Demo ; CCHR ; CarolineLucas@ GreenMEPs. org.uk ; ACLA@americancognit ivelibertiesasso c.org ; jean verstraeten ; patsy.sorensen@ payoke.be ; MCVictimsEU@ yahoogroups. com ; GUELCHER Ernst ; peterpm@xs4all. nl ; mcactivism@yahoogro ups.com ; Pam Farnsworth ; Anna Bisetti
      Sent: Saturday, November 10, 2007 3:31 AM
      Subject: Re: [mcactivism] action against neighbors about NEIGHBOURS AS "ROBOTS" AND "ROBOTS CREATING STREET THEATHRE"

      Could you remove me from this mailing list, please? This discussion is becoming silly. Monika is saying, in effect, that people are unnecessary artifacts in these organized-stalking and electronic-harassme nt operations because everything has been "roboticized, " ...if there is such a word.

      I'm not interesting in joining a "The Emperor Has No Clothes" Club. I've sent my dissenting viewpoint directly to Monika and will leave it at that.

      Thank you.

      Julianne



      John Allman <John_W_Allman@ hotmail.com> wrote:
      Dear Monika

      Although your English is still not perfect, I agree with the general gist of what I think you are saying, in the main: (1) that things are not always as they seem; (2) that for one to accuse one's neighbours of complicity in the general conspiracy to inflict e-harassment tends to be discrediting, as well as, on most occasions, being unlikely to be accurate; and (3) that it must surely be a goal of the perps to induce targeted individuals' mistakenly and self-discreditingly ' to accuse their neighbours of knowingly being perps.

      One night, roughly six years ago, I heard, as clear as a bell, the sound of somebody marching in jackboots along the gravel driveway that ran from the front of my then home, along the side of the building, into my back garden. Did I open the door, to catch sight of the local perp? No! Why not? Was it because I was frightened of the local perp who was marching in jackboots outside my home? No, it was because I knew full well that there was no the gravel driveway that runs from the front of my then home, along the side of the building, into the back garden! I could tell that what I seemed to hear happening outside my home wasn't really happening at all, merely from what I knew about the local environment - there wasn't any gravel. It was a powerful illusion, which, annoyingly to the perps, I did not allow to develop into a powerful delusion, because I took a "reality check" on my subjective impressions.

      Only a few weeks ago, I heard the sound of s stone hitting my window. Did I look out of my window, to see, if possible, who had thrown the stone? No! Why not? Because I know that the V2K weapons can create such sounds. In a bored sort of way, I wondered whether or not a local perp had been bribed to throw a stone against my window, and decided that I simply didn't care whether I was hearing the real sound of a stone, or an artificial sound produced with V2K weapons that was calculated to create the false impression that a stone had been thrown at my window. I couldn't be bothered to pay enough attention to the perps' attention-seeking behaviour to find out what was really happening outside, or not.

      John


      ----- Original Message -----
      From: Monika Stoces
      To: peterpm@xs4all. nl ; mcactivism@yahoogro ups.com ; Pam Farnsworth
      Cc: robalandes@telus. net ; Thea Vangossum ; soleilmavis@ yahoo.com ; rudyrud2004@ yayoo.fr ; MAES Nelly ; moe_hosny@yahoo. ca ; julgilliam1@ riversongs. tv ; juliannemckinney@ yahoo.com ; johnfinch@excite. com ; info@freedomfchs. com ; info@advocaat- dumoulin. be ; Harlan Girard ; Annemarie Gielen ; Adams Elisabeth ; eleanor@shoestringr adio.net ; duncan@higherorder. com ; dcr618@... ; Petrit Demo ; CCHR ; CarolineLucas@ GreenMEPs. org.uk ; ACLA@americancognit ivelibertiesasso c.org ; jean verstraeten ; patsy.sorensen@ payoke.be ; MCVictimsEU@ yahoogroups. com ; GUELCHER Ernst
      Sent: Friday, November 09, 2007 12:32 PM
      Subject: Re: [mcactivism] action against neighbors about NEIGHBOURS AS "ROBOTS" AND "ROBOTS CREATING STREET THEATHRE"


      i think making us believe neighbours are involved is just a way to make us believe something which is not the case so that we sound delusional.. ..and are not to be taken seriously... to not complain about the real crime : human experimentation.

      ill explain, imagine you don’t know about anything and your neighbour tell you are harassing him while its not true....You will get impression he is crazy...

      second question : why so many people do think its the neighbours?
      and why the noise really comes from upstairs? HOW ITS DONE IN FACT;

      answer: BECAUSE THIS TECHNOLOGIE IS GOOD ENOUGH TO
      robotisize PEOPLE WITHOUT THEIR KNOWLEDGE
      AND THAT IS WHAT THEY DO WITH THE NEIGBORS TO MAKE THEM MAKE NOICE RIGHT ABOVE YOUR HEAD AT THE RIGHT MOMENT AS IF THEY KNOW WHAT YOU ARE DOING OR WHERE YOU ARE;;;;

      THIS TECHNOL

      (Message over 64 KB, truncated)
    • jean verstraeten
      Beste Annemarie, Ik stuurde u indertijd een dossier met documentatie over wat men bijvoorbeeld folteren op afstand kan noemen. Sinds 2005 zond ik ook geregeld
      Message 2 of 17 , Nov 20 12:20 PM
        Beste Annemarie,
         
        Ik stuurde u indertijd een dossier met documentatie over wat men bijvoorbeeld folteren op afstand kan noemen.  Sinds 2005 zond ik ook geregeld waardevolle studies aan Pax Christi over dit onderwerp.   Maar ik plaatste uw e-mailadres op geen enkele mailingljist, nooit.
         
        Ik doe van dit berichtje wel een kopie aan MCVictimsEU toekomen, in de hoop dat men uw adres zal verwijderen.  
         
        In Pace,
        Jean 
        ----- Original Message -----
        Sent: Tuesday, November 20, 2007 2:33 PM
        Subject: Re: Mrs. Nelly Maes, chairwoman of the Flemish Peace Institute

        Beste Jean,

        Ik krijg nu al een hele tijd mails in mijn mailbox over de materie waar uw organisatie en anderen mee bezig zijn. De laatste tijd is de hoeveelheid echter te groot geworden. Zou u mij kunnen verwijderen uit uw mailinglijst?

        Hartelijk dank om dit in orde te brengen.

        Met vriendelijke groeten,

        Annemarie Gielen
        At 23:56 16/11/2007, you wrote:

        Hove (Belgium) Nov. 16, 2007<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" />

         

        Dear Co-victims and or Co-resisters,

         

        Since a few years I had been corresponding with Mrs. Nelly Maes, previous M.P. and chairwoman of the Flemish Peace Institute, which was created by (Flemish) law.

         

        Last time I sent to her 1)the Declaration of Concerned Citizens, 2) a few ideas about a possible national (in this case Belgian) law that would be inspired e.g. by Paragraph 27 of Resolution A40005/1999 of the European Parliament, 3) a list with addresses where more information can be found. 

         

        Mrs. Maes replied that she would propose to the Council of the Institute to pass my documentation to the Scientific Secretariat of the Institute for further study.

         

        This to me seems to be the right way.  You yourself could have written to the Flemish Peace Institute in order to support my demand for an examination and for a law.  This was not done.  Instead all sort of copies of rather personal and even angry letters reached Nelly Maes (some of them being in Dutch = Flemish).  This, surely, will have a negative effect.  Hence, please remove this person from your mailing list.  

         

        Thank You,

        Jean

         

         
        ----- Original Message -----
        From: Julianne McKinney
        To: duncan@... ; 'M. Hosny' ; 'John Allman'
        Cc: 'Julianne McKinney' ; 'Monika Stoces' ; robalandes@... ; 'Thea Vangossum' ; soleilmavis@... ; rudyrud2004@... ; 'MAES Nelly' ; johnfinch@... ; info@... ; info@... ; julgilliam1@... ; 'Harlan Girard' ; 'Annemarie Gielen' ; 'Adams Elisabeth' ; eleanor@... ; dcr618@... ; 'Petrit Demo' ; 'CCHR' ; CarolineLucas@... ; ACLA@... ; 'jean verstraeten' ; patsy.sorensen@... ; MCVictimsEU@yahoogroups.com ; 'GUELCHER Ernst' ; peterpm@... ; mcactivism@yahoogroups.com ; 'Pam Farnsworth' ; 'Anna Bisetti' ; 'John McMurtrey'
        Sent: Wednesday, November 14, 2007 5:23 AM
        Subject: RE: "You are weakening our noble movement by these negative tendencies!"

        Confession is good for the soul, I've heard.  Don't think of it as falling on your sword, however.  Think of it as castling your king.

         
        Meanwhile, ...do you think I might possibly be removed from this mailing list?

         
        Julianne

        "R. Duncan" <duncan@... > wrote:
        Dear John A. and others whose full time jobs are accusing,

         
        I have been trying to confess for a long time. I am a perp. I am paid by the US government to conduct psychological experiments on you. I am deceitful sometimes and I am wrong sometimes. I even accidentally tell you a truth now and then. But they dock my pay when that happens.

        So, now that you have a full confession. Can we move on and have constructive conversations even knowing that I am trying to hurt you through intentional bad information and theories? Greed is what drives me. I get extra-CIA pay when I can lead you towards irrational and unfounded belief systems.  Perhaps it is good mental exercise to be able to critically reason while knowing that a sophisticated perp like myself is guiding you away from God and truth intentionally?

         
        Perhaps like with evolution theory, we should separate church and state. Use one as a personal guidance and an information drug to inspire you, and the other that has proven more useful in predicting the immediate future and to explain the physical world where brain chemistry and the mind intersect. Always be skeptical of information that you read. This should not be something new. However, personally attacking someone shows a lack of ability to understand the science and argue on that basis. We are back to the Christian inquisitions and will get nowhere. Just assume in every email  that you are required to think for yourself and not be lazy wanting to rely on someone’s reputation. In fact, in a perfect intelligent meritocracy, where no names were attached to information exchanges, you would have to learn to do this.

        Why does thinking and arguing in a professional exchange about this topic in a scientific and strategic manner, pain you so much? Why do you spend so much time talking about the useless and nonsensical aspects? Get over your classicism and take everyone as if they have something important to say. Filter, don’t respond negatively. I for one have nearly fully given up my defense research and public speaking because of the constant barrage of negativity. I found that I can help more people and other groups with other problems who are more grateful of my sacrifices. You aren’t winning allies or friends and you haven’t figured it out that negativity is highly infectious and the most obvious quality to instill into people and groups to isolate and disassemble them. If you haven’t figured out just the very basic psychological strategies being used against a group assembling by reading military and CIA methods, you haven’t progressed in this chess game at all. This is why I have lost hope.

         

         

         

         

         

         
        -----Original Message-----
        From: M. Hosny [ mailto:moe_hosny@...]
        Sent: Tuesday, November 13, 2007 7:30 PM
        To: John Allman
        Cc: duncan@...; 'Julianne McKinney'; 'M. Hosny'; 'Monika Stoces'; robalandes@...; 'Thea Vangossum'; soleilmavis@...; rudyrud2004@...; 'MAES Nelly'; julgilliam1@...; johnfinch@...; info@...; info@...; 'Harlan Girard'; 'Annemarie Gielen'; 'Adams Elisabeth'; eleanor@...; dcr618@...; 'Petrit Demo'; 'CCHR'; CarolineLucas@...; ACLA@...; 'jean verstraeten'; patsy.sorensen@...; MCVictimsEU@yahoogroups.com; 'GUELCHER Ernst'; peterpm@...; mcactivism@yahoogroups.com; 'Pam Farnsworth'; 'Anna Bisetti'; John McMurtrey
        Subject: Re: "You are weakening our noble movement by these negative tendencies!"

         
        Dear John (United Kingdom),

         
        Robert Duncan's contributions to exposing terror wil be historical.

         
        In Fraternitate,
        Moe


        John Allman <John_W_Allman@...> wrote:
        Dear Moe

         
        My comments about Robert Duncan were based upon facts (at the time), and were addressed to John McMurtrey.  It is surprising that you have chosen to publicise those commment rather widely, and long after they were written, considering that you consider the comments to be indicative of tendencies of mine that you call "negative".  Was that wise of you?

         
        Classifying statements as either "positive" or "negative" is commonplace amongst those whose worldview does not equip them to regard whether statements are true or false as of paramount importance.

         
        What weakens our movement, and makes it in part an ignoble movement, is indifference to the truth.  In fact, the bible predicts the present torture, and says that God will allow it to happen, because mankind refuses to love the truth.  I didn't set out to broadcast widely and for a prolonged period that, despite perhaps being (I insinuated) suspect, mad, secretive and/or deceitful, Robert might nevertheless have sent us a link worth asking John to evaluate.

         
        I am not in the least bit happy that you have republished my comments.  Still less am I happy that the factual record establishes that Robert could be any or all of the things I said he might be.  I wish it were not so.  I am very disappointed that such comments should be rejected as "negative", rather than acclaimed because they express the truth.

         
        John

         

        ----- Original Message -----
        From: M. Hosny
        To: John Allman ; John McMurtrey
        Cc: duncan@... ; 'Julianne McKinney' ; 'M. Hosny' ; 'Monika Stoces' ; robalandes@... ; 'Thea Vangossum' ; soleilmavis@... ; rudyrud2004@... ; 'MAES Nelly' ; julgilliam1@... ; johnfinch@... ; info@... ; info@... ; 'Harlan Girard' ; 'Annemarie Gielen' ; 'Adams Elisabeth' ; eleanor@... ; dcr618@... ; 'Petrit Demo' ; 'CCHR' ; CarolineLucas@... ; ACLA@... ; 'jean verstraeten' ; patsy.sorensen@... ; MCVictimsEU@yahoogroups.com ; 'GUELCHER Ernst' ; peterpm@... ; mcactivism@yahoogroups.com ; 'Pam Farnsworth' ; 'Anna Bisetti'
        Sent: Monday, November 12, 2007 4:17 AM
        Subject: Why personal attacks against Dr. Duncan

         
        Mr. Allman,

         
        You are weakening our noble movement by these negative tendencies!

         
        May the Lord guide us all (spiritually not religiously!! )

         
        In fraternitate,
        Moe Hosny


        John Allman < John_W_Allman@...> wrote:
        Dear John

        The donor Dunc at higher order whatever is suspect for any number of reasons I needn't go into tonight.  All the same, his suggested new source http://diss.kib.ki.se/2005/91-7140-429-5/thesis.pdf might still be worthwhile your reading, in case there's anything new there which we who are serious and sane can cite, documenting to academic standards the feasubilty of, and perhaps thus ending for a while, the abuses we suffer.

        Dunc, however mad, and however deceitful or secretive he might to date seem to be, might not after all turn out to be a perp or a deliberate liar.  (Let's hope not!)  He could be merely be the sort of idiot who gives a stupid radio interview in which he actually agrees on air that there might indeed be software enough already to give Mr Adolf Hitler (the real one) a type of immortality, after all these years.  (I kid you not!)
        John


        ----- Original Message -----
        From: R. Duncan
        To: 'Julianne McKinney' ; 'M. Hosny' ; 'Monika Stoces' ; 'John Allman'
        Cc: robalandes@... ; 'Thea Vangossum' ; soleilmavis@... ; rudyrud2004@... ; 'MAES Nelly' ; moe_hosny@... ; julgilliam1@... ; johnfinch@... ; info@... ; info@... ; 'Harlan Girard' ; 'Annemarie Gielen' ; 'Adams Elisabeth' ; eleanor@... ; dcr618@... ; 'Petrit Demo' ; 'CCHR' ; CarolineLucas@... ; ACLA@... ; 'jean verstraeten' ; patsy.sorensen@... ; MCVictimsEU@yahoogroups.com ; 'GUELCHER Ernst' ; peterpm@... ; mcactivism@yahoogroups.com ; 'Pam Farnsworth' ; 'Anna Bisetti'
        Sent: Sunday, November 11, 2007 11:26 PM
        Subject: Behavioral science


        Research from Grace:

        Stress conditioning the human subjects allows for manipulation at a precognitive level. Stalking, financially depleting, torture, and isolation all induce war time like stresses on the human psyche. This increases the dopamine and other neurotransmitters released during a stressful condition which in turn decreases the subject’s ability to use higher level cognitive functions before reacting.

        Here is a paper on the FBI’s research into these effects.


        Dr. Carl Jensen
        Senior Researcher, RAND Corporation; and former Supervisory Special Agent,
        FBI Academy Behavioral Science Unit  

        http://diss.kib.ki.se/2005/91-7140-429-5/thesis.pdf


        -----Original Message-----
        From: Julianne McKinney [ mailto:juliannemckinney@...]
        Sent: Sunday, November 11, 2007 1:42 PM
        To: M. Hosny; Monika Stoces; John Allman
        Cc: robalandes@...; Thea Vangossum; soleilmavis@...; rudyrud2004@...; MAES Nelly; moe_hosny@...; julgilliam1@...; johnfinch@...; info@...; info@...; Harlan Girard; Annemarie Gielen; Adams Elisabeth; eleanor@...; duncan@...; dcr618@...; Petrit Demo; CCHR; CarolineLucas@...; ACLA@...; jean verstraeten; patsy.sorensen@...; MCVictimsEU@yahoogroups.com; GUELCHER Ernst; peterpm@...; mcactivism@yahoogroups.com; Pam Farnsworth; Anna Bisetti
        Subject: Re: [mcactivism] Mind Control + Agents

        Oh, but you are mistaken, Moe.  According to the latest theories, those cantalopes and tomatoes in your shopping cart popped out of the 9th Dimension.  Your friend didn't see them being replaced, so OBVIOUSLY they came from a parallel dimension.

        The lesson to be learned in this?  Keep an eye on your shopping cart.  And CERTAINLY don't grab someone else's shopping cart thinking it might be your own.  And THEN, ...just get on with your life.

        This is so inane.

        Julianne

        "M. Hosny" <moe_hosny@...> wrote:
        Dear Julianne,

        A high ranking Canadian politician told me: "it is good you know they are doing this to you"

        Therefore, I request you to consider two factors:

        1- Some people by nature are more easily manipulated than others!

        2- If you are unaware of the aggression against you, you will be manipulated more easily!

        So some of the neighbours acting weirdly do not know what is being done to them. But as the expert Dr. Duncan said, you cannot rule out that some neighbours or others are paid to act weirdly in your presence.

        I was with a friend at an Ottawa food store. The friend saw me put the watermelon and lettuce in the cart. Melon was replaced by cantaloupe and lettuce by tomatoes and so forth. Now this is NOT mind control. This is someone paid by the Special Services.

        In fraternitate,
        Moe Hosny


        Julianne McKinney <juliannemckinney@...> wrote:
        Jesus once said, "Forgive them Father, for they know not what they do."  No doubt he saw the same thing.  Roboticized mobs. 

        In which case, Monika, you might simply follow this divine Historical Precedent, forgive everyone for not knowing what they are doing, ignore what is going on, and get on with your life.

        OR, another way of looking at it is that we are all living in some type of semi-hellish purgatory and that things will get better only after we die and move on to a higher plane of existence.  In which case, Monika, you might simply ignore what is going on and wait until you die, so that you can move on to your next plane of existence.

        Now, if you would be so kind as to remove me from this mailing list, I will happily spare you any further silly analogies.

        Julianne



        Monika Stoces <monika.stoces@...> wrote:
        >From "Philosophers Explore The matrix" (edited by C Grau)
        How do we know that our thoughts are not being manipulated, and that our perception of reality are accurate? The matrix makes these doubts stand out vividly. (Julia driver)

        Julianne wrote: "Monika is saying, in effect, that people are unnecessary artifacts in these organized-stalking and electronic-harassment operations because everything has been "roboticized," ...if there is such a word. "

         about this,
        Yes i am saying that ...only pleeeeeeeeease understand "exactly" how i mean it.....:-)
         peole are not "just robitized"...(what could be the right word in english?)
        something that controls the whole planet, can be only computerguided.....
        ofcourse computers are installed and controlled by people yes sure....
        but those people are NOT THE PEOPLE LIKE our neigbours or the ones we see making street theaTher or making gestures at us. (because that is remotely controlled)

        its done very very well  !!!!!!!!!!!!!
        creates powerfull illusions and it's "consious", IT IS ARTIFICIAL INTELIGENCE !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! (or something that behaves that way at least, touring-machine-like)
        that is why its much more clever (read "processes data much faster and preciser" than humans ever can)
        and controls MANY PEOPLE AT ONCE IN INTERACTION

        Very inporant in this manipulation in "real time" is that EACH PERSON IS MANIPULATED TO UNDERSTAND AND JUDGE THE SITUATION TOTALLY DIFFERENTLY (meaning of words, sentences, situations, symbols ect ect)
        that is the way the system causes confusion....
        this manipulation is so powerfull and goes so fast that the person has no time to think well and only reacts to the stimulus , that looks perfectly like his own... !!!!   (maybe afterward he will ask himself "strange , why was i so sure?)
        Like that it can be used on people without their knowlegde, they will absolutely not "recognize" to be manipulated
        they will be sure they juged the situation correctly while they did not

        so i dont really mean that people are  ONLY robots when they act
        ONLY THEY MEAN ALL THE TIME SOMETHING ELSE THAN WE DO UNDERSTAND (its ment to be that way, its manipulated that way)

        This has to do with the fact that this technologie understands language, and DETERMINES about THE MEANING we understand a word a sentence and even a total situation  !!!!!!!!!!!!!!  (misjudging situations is one of the favorit things this technolgy does with all of us;  and ofcourse in wartime that is a very important thing to use !!!
        WE CANNOT UNDERSTAND IT DIFFERENTLY THAN THE SYSTEM WANTS US ,only after we can realize how things went)

        it determines also what others say and what we say on certain moments, we cannot feel the difference (forced speech) or see the difference on others, they dont even feel it themselves.....
        we only can afterwards each time think , nothing else...
        only we can draw conclusion we cannot feel this technologie making us think or speak or look at something or even "love someone".....(after a while the victim gets to know it, and "recognizes" easier when its manipulation...)..

        it very very very well done
        its fascinating by itself how this can fool EVERYBODY
        WITHOUT EXEPTION     ALSO THE CLEVER ONES !!!!!!!!!!   the psychatrists, scientists doktors ect ect

        also all this tells us
        THAT ITS ONE BIG SYSTEM WORL WIDE   IN INTERACTION
        THIS CONCLUSION IS CONFORMINED BY THE STATISTICAL EXPLOSION WORLD WIDE IN 2000 OF MANY NEW VICTIMS A YEAR
        Does this sounds logical???
        look at it altogether !!!!!

        that explains why nobody knows this, and everybody thinks, ( read :  "misjudges the situation")   that we are mentally ill.
        so simple is it , so geniously is it
        for god sake its the hugest crime of the century
        realistic is that its done very very well, other wise they would not let us run around and write to authorities !!!!!!!!!!
        they let us do that, because its a part of the game , manipulating everybody, to ignore it, without even thinking about what we in fact are trying to tell



        greets Monika

        ----- Original Message -----
        From: Julianne McKinney
        To: John Allman ; Monika Stoces
        Cc: robalandes@... ; Thea Vangossum ; soleilmavis@... ; rudyrud2004@... ; MAES Nelly ; moe_hosny@... ; julgilliam1@... ; johnfinch@... ; info@... ; info@... ; Harlan Girard ; Annemarie Gielen ; Adams Elisabeth ; eleanor@... ; duncan@... ; dcr618@... ; Petrit Demo ; CCHR ; CarolineLucas@... ; ACLA@... ; jean verstraeten ; patsy.sorensen@... ; MCVictimsEU@yahoogroups.com ; GUELCHER Ernst ; peterpm@... ; mcactivism@yahoogroups.com ; Pam Farnsworth ; Anna Bisetti
        Sent: Saturday, November 10, 2007 3:31 AM
        Subject: Re: [mcactivism] action against neighbors about NEIGHBOURS AS "ROBOTS" AND "ROBOTS CREATING STREET THEATHRE"

        Could you remove me from this mailing list, please? This discussion is becoming silly. Monika is saying, in effect, that people are unnecessary artifacts in these organized-stalking and electronic-harassment operations because everything has been "roboticized," ...if there is such a word.

        I'm not interesting in joining a "The Emperor Has No Clothes" Club. I've sent my dissenting viewpoint directly to Monika and will leave it at that.

        Thank you.

        Julianne



        John Allman <John_W_Allman@...> wrote:
        Dear Monika

        Although your English is still not perfect, I agree with the general gist of what I think you are saying, in the main: (1) that things are not always as they seem; (2) that for one to accuse one's neighbours of complicity in the general conspiracy to inflict e-harassment tends to be discrediting, as well as, on most occasions, being unlikely to be accurate; and (3) that it must surely be a goal of the perps to induce targeted individuals' mistakenly and self-discreditingly' to accuse their neighbours of knowingly being perps.

        One night, roughly six years ago, I heard, as clear as a bell, the sound of somebody marching in jackboots along the gravel driveway that ran from the front of my then home, along the side of the building, into my back garden. Did I open the door, to catch sight of the local perp? No! Why not? Was it because I was frightened of the local perp who was marching in jackboots outside my home? No, it was because I knew full well that there was no the gravel driveway that runs from the front of my then home, along the side of the building, into the back garden! I could tell that what I seemed to hear happening outside my home wasn't really happening at all, merely from what I knew about the local environment - there wasn't any gravel. It was a powerful illusion, which, annoyingly to the perps, I did not allow to develop into a powerful delusion, because I took a "reality check" on my subjective impressions.

        Only a few weeks ago, I heard the sound of s stone hitting my window. Did I look out of my window, to see, if possible, who had thrown the stone? No! Why not? Because I know that the V2K weapons can create such sounds. In a bored sort of way, I wondered whether or not a local perp had been bribed to throw a stone against my window, and decided that I simply didn't care whether I was hearing the real sound of a stone, or an artificial sound produced with V2K weapons that was calculated to create the false impression that a stone had been thrown at my window. I couldn't be bothered to pay enough attention to the perps' attention-seeking behaviour to find out what was really happening outside, or not.

        John


        ----- Original Message -----
        From: Monika Stoces
        To: peterpm@... ; mcactivism@yahoogroups.com ; Pam Farnsworth
        Cc: robalandes@... ; Thea Vangossum ; soleilmavis@... ; rudyrud2004@... ; MAES Nelly ; moe_hosny@... ; julgilliam1@... ; juliannemckinney@... ; johnfinch@... ; info@... ; info@... ; Harlan Girard ; Annemarie Gielen ; Adams Elisabeth ; eleanor@... ; duncan@... ; dcr618@... ; Petrit Demo ; CCHR ; CarolineLucas@... ; ACLA@... ; jean verstraeten ; patsy.sorensen@... ; MCVictimsEU@yahoogroups.com ; GUELCHER Ernst
        Sent: Friday, November 09, 2007 12:32 PM
        Subject: Re: [mcactivism] action against neighbors about NEIGHBOURS AS "ROBOTS" AND "ROBOTS CREATING STREET THEATHRE"


        i think making us believe neighbours are involved is just a way to make us believe something which is not the case so that we sound delusional....and are not to be taken seriously...to not complain about the real crime : human experimentation.

        ill explain, imagine you don’t know about anything and your neighbour tell you are harassing him while its not true....You will get impression he is crazy...

        second question : why so many people do think its the neighbours?
        and why the noise really comes from upstairs? HOW ITS DONE IN FACT;

        answer: BECAUSE THIS TECHNOLOGIE IS GOOD ENOUGH TO
        robotisize PEOPLE WITHOUT THEIR KNOWLEDGE
        AND THAT IS WHAT THEY DO WITH THE NEIGBORS TO MAKE THEM MAKE NOICE RIGHT ABOVE YOUR HEAD AT THE RIGHT MOMENT AS IF THEY KNOW WHAT YOU ARE DOING OR WHERE YOU ARE;;;;

        THIS TECHNOLOGIE IS ABLE TO ROBOTESIZE (complete remote control) HUMANS WITHOUT THEIR KNOWDLEGDE IN INTERANCTION with others AND MAKES THEM "ACT AS IF", WHILE THEY ARE ABSOLUTE NOT AWARE SOMEMTHING IS GOING ON at all.
        (essential trick to create street theatre, gang stalking , impression neighbours are involved or friends talk and act as if they know about it ect ect)

        THAT IS I THINK THE REASON WHY ALL THOSE PEOPLE AROUND US MAKE GESTURES TO US AND follow us ect ect ITS ONE OF THE POSSIBLE ILLUSSIONS CREATED TO MAKE BELIEVE BY THE VICTIM THAT IS ALL

        comments ofcourse welcome, its good to understand how they fool us ! :-)
        the technologie is made for that first of all....
        Because we may not be credible witnesses and tell nicely all the same....
        so they make us tell (read "make us believe" something else each.
        so we waste our time on discussing details like who is doing it to me personally?
        Its not personal, its a crime on sic biljon people.....
        experimenting with neurotechnology

        nice greets Monika

        ps the crime is very well done !!!
        its also one of the biggest crimes in history !!!
        that is why its so perfect and why we can do so little !!!

        ----- Original Message -----
        From: Pam Farnsworth
        To: mcactivism@yahoogroups.com
        Sent: Thursday, November 08, 2007 2:15 PM
        Subject: Fw: [mcactivism] action against neighbors


        These V2K etc criminals are constantly making sounds like dropping billiard balls and pins and other childish sounds from what sounds like directly above my head on the roof, and there is not a soul there. It is the criminals and their usage of what the US secret service already admitted to using, (weapons to kill us remotely and frustrate us to death. Laugh at them, I do).

        Pam Farnsworth
        404.484.0944
        epam1a@...

        ----- Original Message -----
        From: H Vyuj
        To: mcactivism@yahoogroups.com
        Sent: Thursday, November 08, 2007 5:55 AM
        Subject: [mcactivism] action against neighbors

        i have lodged a complaint one year ago, an action against person unknown: i had rung at the door of the neighbor next floor and got the conviction that the person who opened and answered me was not the least involved with the sleep disruptions and privacy mockery i was experiencing. Yet the noise and signals really seemed from above my head...
        The complaint has been filed away as a 'non criminal case'. I later lived in a flat at the last floor, and never the noise above my head has been worse. I had little doubt the neighbors left of my flat were involved (they may not have been the exact authors of the noise, however), but the noise came from above my (last) floor, so whom to speak to? I have sent a complaint which was not registered.
        If you ever had some consistent cause for it, like night din, have you confronted the alleged neighbor, and/or lodged a complaint?

        __________________________________________________
        Do You Yahoo!?
        Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
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        Annemarie Gielen
        Dienst Geweldpreventie/ Oost-Europa
        Dienst Vredesvorming
        Pax Christi Vlaanderen
        Italiëlei 98A
        2000 Antwerpen
        Tel: +32 (0)3 225.10.00
        Fax: +32 (0)3 225.07.99
        annemarie.gielen@...
        www.paxchristi.be       

      • stocesmonika
        hOI jEAN I RECIEVED THE MESSEGAE TOO AND I REMOVED ANNNEMARIE FROM THE MAIN MAILLIST SURE ALSO I DID WITH NELLY MAES; still i did send her in duth shortly a
        Message 3 of 17 , Nov 20 12:33 PM
          hOI jEAN I RECIEVED THE MESSEGAE TOO AND I REMOVED ANNNEMARIE FROM
          THE MAIN MAILLIST SURE ALSO I DID WITH NELLY MAES;
          still i did send her in duth shortly a kind explenation, aside of
          apoligies for the huge amount of mails. what i send to her below, a
          polite demand for help.
          greets much Monika

          Ik zal dat doen je van de maillijkst halen.
          sorry voor de overlast , ik probeer maar op de één of andere manier
          hiervoor aandacht te krijgen, zoals iederen van ons.

          Mag ik iets vragen? Komt het bij iemand op dat dit om een reeel en
          acuut probleem gaat? Of lijkt het voor buitenstaanders zo absurd dat
          het onmoge lijk waar kan zijn?
          Ik vraag dit gewoon, omdat het zo moeilijk in te schatten is wat
          mensen hiervan denken, gezien ze het niet geloven, en niet
          antwoorden. Meestal denken ze dat we gek zijn of zoiets.
          Dit geld voor iedereen hoor, men denkt dat we gek zijn

          Ik las ook maanden terug je reactie over die man die jou twee jaar
          terug een dossier bracht dat "bovennnatuurlijk klonk", ze is zeer
          begrijpelijk, de slachtoffers doen soms wel raar , schamen zich en
          zijn uiteenlopende mensen dus verklaren het soms als god of psy-
          krachten ...

          Men heeft maanden "foutmeldingen" op mijn pc gesimuleerd...zodat ik
          maar bleef herinstalleren en zo...toen verdween mijn mail, mijn
          fotos, dan verscheen "dit is een test" en ik kreeg hoofdpijn, begon
          over te geven, kreeg een orgasme spontaan, en hoorde "in mijn hoofd"
          dat het om een "experiment" ging...En later verscheen op mijn pc ook
          nog dat "deze dingen" die men dus niet ziet, grove politieke
          inplicaties konden hebben (waardoor ik eerst dacht dat men aan een
          preventie campagne bezig was of iets...

          In paniek liep ik naar iedereen die ik kende, en tot mijn gruwel
          stelde ik vast dat men het niet geloofde...simpel men dacht dat ik
          was gek geworden,
          Intussen is alles in orde, behalve dat ik dit "weet" en ook "voel"
          dag in dag uit , en honderden lotgenoten ken wereldwijd. en zie hoe
          raar het is dat bij niemand opkomt dat dit echt gebeurt, want
          achteraf bezien, het lag voor de hand dat men met onzichbare wapens
          voor niksvermoedende mensen , moest oefenen op ...niksvermoedende
          mensen !

          Eens men de technologie kent (wat het doet en hoe het voelt) ,
          herkent men ze ook meteen....indien niet, kan men met
          het "niksvermoedende slachtoffer eender wat doen" en komt bij niemand
          op dat het om effecten van manipulatie wapens gaat !

          Ik zal je van de lijst halen , en hoop ondanks de mailoverlast, dat
          je ook nuttige info hebt gekregen tussen de mails door...en een idee
          hebt gekregen van het verhaal een beetje...

          Moest je iemand weten die dit van dichtbij wil bekijken, tenslotte
          oordeelt iedereen op afstand naar gelang de rare verhalen op
          internet...Het is een ingewikkkeld probleem, en het is heel goed
          gedaan !! De aantijgingen zijn toch wel heel ernstig om af te gaan op
          verhalen op het internet....(lang niet iedereen zet zijn verhaal daar
          natuurlijk :)
          Moest je eender welk idee hebben, aub, laat het ons weten, we
          ontvangen het met open armen. Eerlijk
          Het gaat echt wel om historische mensenrechtenschendingen....maar ja,
          niemand gelooft het...

          Vriendelijk groetjes Monika





          --- In MCVictimsEU@yahoogroups.com, "jean verstraeten"
          <verstraeten.jean@...> wrote:
          >
          > Beste Annemarie,
          >
          > Ik stuurde u indertijd een dossier met documentatie over wat men
          bijvoorbeeld folteren op afstand kan noemen. Sinds 2005 zond ik ook
          geregeld waardevolle studies aan Pax Christi over dit onderwerp.
          Maar ik plaatste uw e-mailadres op geen enkele mailingljist, nooit.
          >
          > Ik doe van dit berichtje wel een kopie aan MCVictimsEU toekomen, in
          de hoop dat men uw adres zal verwijderen.
          >
          > In Pace,
          > Jean
          > ----- Original Message -----
          > From: Annemarie Gielen
          > To: jean verstraeten
          > Sent: Tuesday, November 20, 2007 2:33 PM
          > Subject: Re: Mrs. Nelly Maes, chairwoman of the Flemish Peace
          Institute
          >
          >
          > Beste Jean,
          >
          > Ik krijg nu al een hele tijd mails in mijn mailbox over de
          materie waar uw organisatie en anderen mee bezig zijn. De laatste
          tijd is de hoeveelheid echter te groot geworden. Zou u mij kunnen
          verwijderen uit uw mailinglijst?
          >
          > Hartelijk dank om dit in orde te brengen.
          >
          > Met vriendelijke groeten,
          >
          > Annemarie Gielen
          > At 23:56 16/11/2007, you wrote:
          >
          >
          > Hove (Belgium) Nov. 16, 2007<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns
          = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" />
          >
          >
          >
          > Dear Co-victims and or Co-resisters,
          >
          >
          >
          > Since a few years I had been corresponding with Mrs. Nelly
          Maes, previous M.P. and chairwoman of the Flemish Peace Institute,
          which was created by (Flemish) law.
          >
          >
          >
          > Last time I sent to her 1)the Declaration of Concerned
          Citizens, 2) a few ideas about a possible national (in this case
          Belgian) law that would be inspired e.g. by Paragraph 27 of
          Resolution A40005/1999 of the European Parliament, 3) a list with
          addresses where more information can be found.
          >
          >
          >
          > Mrs. Maes replied that she would propose to the Council of the
          Institute to pass my documentation to the Scientific Secretariat of
          the Institute for further study.
          >
          >
          >
          > This to me seems to be the right way. You yourself could have
          written to the Flemish Peace Institute in order to support my demand
          for an examination and for a law. This was not done. Instead all
          sort of copies of rather personal and even angry letters reached
          Nelly Maes (some of them being in Dutch = Flemish). This, surely,
          will have a negative effect. Hence, please remove this person from
          your mailing list.
          >
          >
          >
          > Thank You,
          >
          > Jean
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > ----- Original Message -----
          >
          > From: Julianne McKinney
          >
          > To: duncan@... ; 'M. Hosny' ; 'John Allman'
          >
          > Cc: 'Julianne McKinney' ; 'Monika Stoces' ;
          robalandes@... ; 'Thea Vangossum' ; soleilmavis@... ;
          rudyrud2004@... ; 'MAES Nelly' ; johnfinch@... ; info@... ;
          info@... ; julgilliam1@... ; 'Harlan Girard' ; 'Annemarie
          Gielen' ; 'Adams Elisabeth' ; eleanor@... ; dcr618@... ; 'Petrit
          Demo' ; 'CCHR' ; CarolineLucas@... ; ACLA@... ; 'jean verstraeten' ;
          patsy.sorensen@... ; MCVictimsEU@yahoogroups.com ; 'GUELCHER Ernst' ;
          peterpm@... ; mcactivism@yahoogroups.com ; 'Pam Farnsworth' ; 'Anna
          Bisetti' ; 'John McMurtrey'
          >
          > Sent: Wednesday, November 14, 2007 5:23 AM
          >
          > Subject: RE: "You are weakening our noble movement by these
          negative tendencies!"
          >
          >
          > Confession is good for the soul, I've heard. Don't think of
          it as falling on your sword, however. Think of it as castling your
          king.
          >
          >
          >
          > Meanwhile, ...do you think I might possibly be removed from
          this mailing list?
          >
          >
          >
          > Julianne
          >
          >
          > "R. Duncan" <duncan@... > wrote:
          >
          > Dear John A. and others whose full time jobs are accusing,
          >
          >
          >
          > I have been trying to confess for a long time. I am a perp.
          I am paid by the US government to conduct psychological experiments
          on you. I am deceitful sometimes and I am wrong sometimes. I even
          accidentally tell you a truth now and then. But they dock my pay when
          that happens.
          >
          >
          > So, now that you have a full confession. Can we move on and
          have constructive conversations even knowing that I am trying to hurt
          you through intentional bad information and theories? Greed is what
          drives me. I get extra-CIA pay when I can lead you towards irrational
          and unfounded belief systems. Perhaps it is good mental exercise to
          be able to critically reason while knowing that a sophisticated perp
          like myself is guiding you away from God and truth intentionally?
          >
          >
          >
          > Perhaps like with evolution theory, we should separate
          church and state. Use one as a personal guidance and an information
          drug to inspire you, and the other that has proven more useful in
          predicting the immediate future and to explain the physical world
          where brain chemistry and the mind intersect. Always be skeptical of
          information that you read. This should not be something new. However,
          personally attacking someone shows a lack of ability to understand
          the science and argue on that basis. We are back to the Christian
          inquisitions and will get nowhere. Just assume in every email that
          you are required to think for yourself and not be lazy wanting to
          rely on someone's reputation. In fact, in a perfect intelligent
          meritocracy, where no names were attached to information exchanges,
          you would have to learn to do this.
          >
          >
          > Why does thinking and arguing in a professional exchange
          about this topic in a scientific and strategic manner, pain you so
          much? Why do you spend so much time talking about the useless and
          nonsensical aspects? Get over your classicism and take everyone as if
          they have something important to say. Filter, don't respond
          negatively. I for one have nearly fully given up my defense research
          and public speaking because of the constant barrage of negativity. I
          found that I can help more people and other groups with other
          problems who are more grateful of my sacrifices. You aren't winning
          allies or friends and you haven't figured it out that negativity is
          highly infectious and the most obvious quality to instill into people
          and groups to isolate and disassemble them. If you haven't figured
          out just the very basic psychological strategies being used against a
          group assembling by reading military and CIA methods, you haven't
          progressed in this chess game at all. This is why I have lost hope.
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > -----Original Message-----
          >
          > From: M. Hosny [ mailto:moe_hosny@...]
          >
          > Sent: Tuesday, November 13, 2007 7:30 PM
          >
          > To: John Allman
          >
          > Cc: duncan@...; 'Julianne McKinney'; 'M. Hosny'; 'Monika
          Stoces'; robalandes@...; 'Thea Vangossum'; soleilmavis@...;
          rudyrud2004@...; 'MAES Nelly'; julgilliam1@...; johnfinch@...;
          info@...; info@...; 'Harlan Girard'; 'Annemarie Gielen'; 'Adams
          Elisabeth'; eleanor@...; dcr618@...; 'Petrit Demo'; 'CCHR';
          CarolineLucas@...; ACLA@...; 'jean verstraeten'; patsy.sorensen@...;
          MCVictimsEU@yahoogroups.com; 'GUELCHER Ernst'; peterpm@...;
          mcactivism@yahoogroups.com; 'Pam Farnsworth'; 'Anna Bisetti'; John
          McMurtrey
          >
          > Subject: Re: "You are weakening our noble movement by these
          negative tendencies!"
          >
          >
          >
          > Dear John (United Kingdom),
          >
          >
          >
          > Robert Duncan's contributions to exposing terror wil be
          historical.
          >
          >
          >
          > In Fraternitate,
          >
          > Moe
          >
          >
          > John Allman <John_W_Allman@...> wrote:
          >
          > Dear Moe
          >
          >
          >
          > My comments about Robert Duncan were based upon facts (at
          the time), and were addressed to John McMurtrey. It is surprising
          that you have chosen to publicise those commment rather widely, and
          long after they were written, considering that you consider the
          comments to be indicative of tendencies of mine that you
          call "negative". Was that wise of you?
          >
          >
          >
          > Classifying statements as either "positive" or "negative"
          is commonplace amongst those whose worldview does not equip them to
          regard whether statements are true or false as of paramount
          importance.
          >
          >
          >
          > What weakens our movement, and makes it in part an
          ignoble movement, is indifference to the truth. In fact, the bible
          predicts the present torture, and says that God will allow it to
          happen, because mankind refuses to love the truth. I didn't set out
          to broadcast widely and for a prolonged period that, despite perhaps
          being (I insinuated) suspect, mad, secretive and/or deceitful, Robert
          might nevertheless have sent us a link worth asking John to evaluate.
          >
          >
          >
          > I am not in the least bit happy that you have republished
          my comments. Still less am I happy that the factual record
          establishes that Robert could be any or all of the things I said he
          might be. I wish it were not so. I am very disappointed that such
          comments should be rejected as "negative", rather than acclaimed
          because they express the truth.
          >
          >
          >
          > John
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > ----- Original Message -----
          >
          > From: M. Hosny
          >
          > To: John Allman ; John McMurtrey
          >
          > Cc: duncan@... ; 'Julianne McKinney' ; 'M.
          Hosny' ; 'Monika Stoces' ; robalandes@... ; 'Thea Vangossum' ;
          soleilmavis@... ; rudyrud2004@... ; 'MAES Nelly' ; julgilliam1@... ;
          johnfinch@... ; info@... ; info@... ; 'Harlan Girard' ; 'Annemarie
          Gielen' ; 'Adams Elisabeth' ; eleanor@... ; dcr618@... ; 'Petrit
          Demo' ; 'CCHR' ; CarolineLucas@... ; ACLA@... ; 'jean verstraeten' ;
          patsy.sorensen@... ; MCVictimsEU@yahoogroups.com ; 'GUELCHER Ernst' ;
          peterpm@... ; mcactivism@yahoogroups.com ; 'Pam Farnsworth' ; 'Anna
          Bisetti'
          >
          > Sent: Monday, November 12, 2007 4:17 AM
          >
          > Subject: Why personal attacks against Dr. Duncan
          >
          >
          >
          > Mr. Allman,
          >
          >
          >
          > You are weakening our noble movement by these negative
          tendencies!
          >
          >
          >
          > May the Lord guide us all (spiritually not
          religiously!! )
          >
          >
          >
          > In fraternitate,
          >
          > Moe Hosny
          >
          >
          >
          > John Allman < John_W_Allman@...> wrote:
          >
          > Dear John
          >
          >
          > The donor Dunc at higher order whatever is suspect
          for any number of reasons I needn't go into tonight. All the same,
          his suggested new source http://diss.kib.ki.se/2005/91-7140-429-
          5/thesis.pdf might still be worthwhile your reading, in case there's
          anything new there which we who are serious and sane can cite,
          documenting to academic standards the feasubilty of, and perhaps thus
          ending for a while, the abuses we suffer.
          >
          >
          > Dunc, however mad, and however deceitful or secretive
          he might to date seem to be, might not after all turn out to be a
          perp or a deliberate liar. (Let's hope not!) He could be merely be
          the sort of idiot who gives a stupid radio interview in which he
          actually agrees on air that there might indeed be software enough
          already to give Mr Adolf Hitler (the real one) a type of immortality,
          after all these years. (I kid you not!)
          >
          > John
          >
          >
          >
          > ----- Original Message -----
          >
          > From: R. Duncan
          >
          > To: 'Julianne McKinney' ; 'M. Hosny' ; 'Monika
          Stoces' ; 'John Allman'
          >
          > Cc: robalandes@... ; 'Thea Vangossum' ;
          soleilmavis@... ; rudyrud2004@... ; 'MAES Nelly' ; moe_hosny@... ;
          julgilliam1@... ; johnfinch@... ; info@... ; info@... ; 'Harlan
          Girard' ; 'Annemarie Gielen' ; 'Adams Elisabeth' ; eleanor@... ;
          dcr618@... ; 'Petrit Demo' ; 'CCHR' ; CarolineLucas@... ;
          ACLA@... ; 'jean verstraeten' ; patsy.sorensen@... ;
          MCVictimsEU@yahoogroups.com ; 'GUELCHER Ernst' ; peterpm@... ;
          mcactivism@yahoogroups.com ; 'Pam Farnsworth' ; 'Anna Bisetti'
          >
          > Sent: Sunday, November 11, 2007 11:26 PM
          >
          > Subject: Behavioral science
          >
          >
          >
          > Research from Grace:
          >
          >
          > Stress conditioning the human subjects allows for
          manipulation at a precognitive level. Stalking, financially
          depleting, torture, and isolation all induce war time like stresses
          on the human psyche. This increases the dopamine and other
          neurotransmitters released during a stressful condition which in turn
          decreases the subject's ability to use higher level cognitive
          functions before reacting.
          >
          >
          > Here is a paper on the FBI's research into these
          effects.
          >
          >
          >
          > Dr. Carl Jensen
          >
          > Senior Researcher, RAND Corporation; and former
          Supervisory Special Agent,
          >
          > FBI Academy Behavioral Science Unit
          >
          >
          > http://diss.kib.ki.se/2005/91-7140-429-5/thesis.pdf
          >
          >
          >
          > -----Original Message-----
          >
          > From: Julianne McKinney [
          mailto:juliannemckinney@...]
          >
          > Sent: Sunday, November 11, 2007 1:42 PM
          >
          > To: M. Hosny; Monika Stoces; John Allman
          >
          > Cc: robalandes@...; Thea Vangossum; soleilmavis@...;
          rudyrud2004@...; MAES Nelly; moe_hosny@...; julgilliam1@...;
          johnfinch@...; info@...; info@...; Harlan Girard; Annemarie Gielen;
          Adams Elisabeth; eleanor@...; duncan@...; dcr618@...; Petrit Demo;
          CCHR; CarolineLucas@...; ACLA@...; jean verstraeten;
          patsy.sorensen@...; MCVictimsEU@yahoogroups.com; GUELCHER Ernst;
          peterpm@...; mcactivism@yahoogroups.com; Pam Farnsworth; Anna Bisetti
          >
          > Subject: Re: [mcactivism] Mind Control + Agents
          >
          >
          > Oh, but you are mistaken, Moe. According to the
          latest theories, those cantalopes and tomatoes in your shopping cart
          popped out of the 9th Dimension. Your friend didn't see them being
          replaced, so OBVIOUSLY they came from a parallel dimension.
          >
          >
          > The lesson to be learned in this? Keep an eye on
          your shopping cart. And CERTAINLY don't grab someone else's shopping
          cart thinking it might be your own. And THEN, ...just get on with
          your life.
          >
          >
          > This is so inane.
          >
          >
          > Julianne
          >
          >
          > "M. Hosny" <moe_hosny@...> wrote:
          >
          > Dear Julianne,
          >
          >
          > A high ranking Canadian politician told me: "it is
          good you know they are doing this to you"
          >
          >
          > Therefore, I request you to consider two factors:
          >
          >
          > 1- Some people by nature are more easily manipulated
          than others!
          >
          >
          > 2- If you are unaware of the aggression against you,
          you will be manipulated more easily!
          >
          >
          > So some of the neighbours acting weirdly do not know
          what is being done to them. But as the expert Dr. Duncan said, you
          cannot rule out that some neighbours or others are paid to act
          weirdly in your presence.
          >
          >
          > I was with a friend at an Ottawa food store. The
          friend saw me put the watermelon and lettuce in the cart. Melon was
          replaced by cantaloupe and lettuce by tomatoes and so forth. Now this
          is NOT mind control. This is someone paid by the Special Services.
          >
          >
          > In fraternitate,
          >
          > Moe Hosny
          >
          >
          >
          > Julianne McKinney <juliannemckinney@...> wrote:
          >
          > Jesus once said, "Forgive them Father, for they know
          not what they do." No doubt he saw the same thing. Roboticized
          mobs.
          >
          >
          > In which case, Monika, you might simply follow this
          divine Historical Precedent, forgive everyone for not knowing what
          they are doing, ignore what is going on, and get on with your life.
          >
          >
          > OR, another way of looking at it is that we are all
          living in some type of semi-hellish purgatory and that things will
          get better only after we die and move on to a higher plane of
          existence. In which case, Monika, you might simply ignore what is
          going on and wait until you die, so that you can move on to your next
          plane of existence.
          >
          >
          > Now, if you would be so kind as to remove me from
          this mailing list, I will happily spare you any further silly
          analogies.
          >
          >
          > Julianne
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > Monika Stoces <monika.stoces@...> wrote:
          >
          > >From "Philosophers Explore The matrix" (edited by C
          Grau)
          >
          > How do we know that our thoughts are not being
          manipulated, and that our perception of reality are accurate? The
          matrix makes these doubts stand out vividly. (Julia driver)
          >
          >
          > Julianne wrote: "Monika is saying, in effect, that
          people are unnecessary artifacts in these organized-stalking and
          electronic-harassment operations because everything has
          been "roboticized," ...if there is such a word. "
          >
          >
          > about this,
          >
          > Yes i am saying that ...only pleeeeeeeeease
          understand "exactly" how i mean it.....:-)
          >
          > peole are not "just robitized"...(what could be the
          right word in english?)
          >
          > something that controls the whole planet, can be only
          computerguided.....
          >
          > ofcourse computers are installed and controlled by
          people yes sure....
          >
          > but those people are NOT THE PEOPLE LIKE our
          neigbours or the ones we see making street theaTher or making
          gestures at us. (because that is remotely controlled)
          >
          >
          > its done very very well !!!!!!!!!!!!!
          >
          > creates powerfull illusions and it's "consious", IT
          IS ARTIFICIAL INTELIGENCE !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! (or something that behaves
          that way at least, touring-machine-like)
          >
          > that is why its much more clever (read "processes
          data much faster and preciser" than humans ever can)
          >
          > and controls MANY PEOPLE AT ONCE IN INTERACTION
          >
          >
          > Very inporant in this manipulation in "real time" is
          that EACH PERSON IS MANIPULATED TO UNDERSTAND AND JUDGE THE SITUATION
          TOTALLY DIFFERENTLY (meaning of words, sentences, situations, symbols
          ect ect)
          >
          > that is the way the system causes confusion....
          >
          > this manipulation is so powerfull and goes so fast
          that the person has no time to think well and only reacts to the
          stimulus , that looks perfectly like his own... !!!! (maybe
          afterward he will ask himself "strange , why was i so sure?)
          >
          > Like that it can be used on people without their
          knowlegde, they will absolutely not "recognize" to be manipulated
          >
          > they will be sure they juged the situation correctly
          while they did not
          >
          >
          > so i dont really mean that people are ONLY robots
          when they act
          >
          > ONLY THEY MEAN ALL THE TIME SOMETHING ELSE THAN WE DO
          UNDERSTAND (its ment to be that way, its manipulated that way)
          >
          >
          > This has to do with the fact that this technologie
          understands language, and DETERMINES about THE MEANING we understand
          a word a sentence and even a total situation !!!!!!!!!!!!!!
          (misjudging situations is one of the favorit things this technolgy
          does with all of us; and ofcourse in wartime that is a very
          important thing to use !!!
          >
          > WE CANNOT UNDERSTAND IT DIFFERENTLY THAN THE SYSTEM
          WANTS US ,only after we can realize how things went)
          >
          >
          > it determines also what others say and what we say on
          certain moments, we cannot feel the difference (forced speech) or see
          the difference on others, they dont even feel it themselves.....
          >
          > we only can afterwards each time think , nothing
          else...
          >
          > only we can draw conclusion we cannot feel this
          technologie making us think or speak or look at something or
          even "love someone".....(after a while the victim gets to know it,
          and "recognizes" easier when its manipulation...)..
          >
          >
          > it very very very well done
          >
          > its fascinating by itself how this can fool EVERYBODY
          >
          > WITHOUT EXEPTION ALSO THE CLEVER
          ONES !!!!!!!!!! the psychatrists, scientists doktors ect ect
          >
          >
          > also all this tells us
          >
          > THAT ITS ONE BIG SYSTEM WORL WIDE IN INTERACTION
          >
          > THIS CONCLUSION IS CONFORMINED BY THE STATISTICAL
          EXPLOSION WORLD WIDE IN 2000 OF MANY NEW VICTIMS A YEAR
          >
          > Does this sounds logical???
          >
          > look at it altogether !!!!!
          >
          >
          > that explains why nobody knows this, and everybody
          thinks, ( read : "misjudges the situation") that we are mentally
          ill.
          >
          > so simple is it , so geniously is it
          >
          > for god sake its the hugest crime of the century
          >
          > realistic is that its done very very well, other wise
          they would not let us run around and write to authorities !!!!!!!!!!
          >
          > they let us do that, because its a part of the game ,
          manipulating everybody, to ignore it, without even thinking about
          what we in fact are trying to tell
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > greets Monika
          >
          >
          > ----- Original Message -----
          >
          > From: Julianne McKinney
          >
          > To: John Allman ; Monika Stoces
          >
          > Cc: robalandes@... ; Thea Vangossum ;
          soleilmavis@... ; rudyrud2004@... ; MAES Nelly ; moe_hosny@... ;
          julgilliam1@... ; johnfinch@... ; info@... ; info@... ; Harlan
          Girard ; Annemarie Gielen ; Adams Elisabeth ; eleanor@... ;
          duncan@... ; dcr618@... ; Petrit Demo ; CCHR ; CarolineLucas@... ;
          ACLA@... ; jean verstraeten ; patsy.sorensen@... ;
          MCVictimsEU@yahoogroups.com ; GUELCHER Ernst ; peterpm@... ;
          mcactivism@yahoogroups.com ; Pam Farnsworth ; Anna Bisetti
          >
          > Sent: Saturday, November 10, 2007 3:31 AM
          >
          > Subject: Re: [mcactivism] action against neighbors
          about NEIGHBOURS AS "ROBOTS" AND "ROBOTS CREATING STREET THEATHRE"
          >
          >
          > Could you remove me from this mailing list, please?
          This discussion is becoming silly. Monika is saying, in effect, that
          people are unnecessary artifacts in these organized-stalking and
          electronic-harassment operations because everything has
          been "roboticized," ...if there is such a word.
          >
          >
          > I'm not interesting in joining a "The Emperor Has No
          Clothes" Club. I've sent my dissenting viewpoint directly to Monika
          and will leave it at that.
          >
          >
          > Thank you.
          >
          >
          > Julianne
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > John Allman <John_W_Allman@...> wrote:
          >
          > Dear Monika
          >
          >
          > Although your English is still not perfect, I agree
          with the general gist of what I think you are saying, in the main:
          (1) that things are not always as they seem; (2) that for one to
          accuse one's neighbours of complicity in the general conspiracy to
          inflict e-harassment tends to be discrediting, as well as, on most
          occasions, being unlikely to be accurate; and (3) that it must surely
          be a goal of the perps to induce targeted individuals' mistakenly and
          self-discreditingly' to accuse their neighbours of knowingly being
          perps.
          >
          >
          > One night, roughly six years ago, I heard, as clear
          as a bell, the sound of somebody marching in jackboots along the
          gravel driveway that ran from the front of my then home, along the
          side of the building, into my back garden. Did I open the door, to
          catch sight of the local perp? No! Why not? Was it because I was
          frightened of the local perp who was marching in jackboots outside my
          home? No, it was because I knew full well that there was no the
          gravel driveway that runs from the front of my then home, along the
          side of the building, into the back garden! I could tell that what I
          seemed to hear happening outside my home wasn't really happening at
          all, merely from what I knew about the local environment - there
          wasn't any gravel. It was a powerful illusion, which, annoyingly to
          the perps, I did not allow to develop into a powerful delusion,
          because I took a "reality check" on my subjective impressions.
          >
          >
          > Only a few weeks ago, I heard the sound of s stone
          hitting my window. Did I look out of my window, to see, if possible,
          who had thrown the stone? No! Why not? Because I know that the V2K
          weapons can create such sounds. In a bored sort of way, I wondered
          whether or not a local perp had been bribed to throw a stone against
          my window, and decided that I simply didn't care whether I was
          hearing the real sound of a stone, or an artificial sound produced
          with V2K weapons that was calculated to create the false impression
          that a stone had been thrown at my window. I couldn't be bothered to
          pay enough attention to the perps' attention-seeking behaviour to
          find out what was really happening outside, or not.
          >
          >
          > John
          >
          >
          >
          > ----- Original Message -----
          >
          > From: Monika Stoces
          >
          > To: peterpm@... ; mcactivism@yahoogroups.com ; Pam
          Farnsworth
          >
          > Cc: robalandes@... ; Thea Vangossum ;
          soleilmavis@... ; rudyrud2004@... ; MAES Nelly ; moe_hosny@... ;
          julgilliam1@... ; juliannemckinney@... ; johnfinch@... ; info@... ;
          info@... ; Harlan Girard ; Annemarie Gielen ; Adams Elisabeth ;
          eleanor@... ; duncan@... ; dcr618@... ; Petrit Demo ; CCHR ;
          CarolineLucas@... ; ACLA@... ; jean verstraeten ;
          patsy.sorensen@... ; MCVictimsEU@yahoogroups.com ; GUELCHER Ernst
          >
          > Sent: Friday, November 09, 2007 12:32 PM
          >
          > Subject: Re: [mcactivism] action against neighbors
          about NEIGHBOURS AS "ROBOTS" AND "ROBOTS CREATING STREET THEATHRE"
          >
          >
          >
          > i think making us believe neighbours are involved is
          just a way to make us believe something which is not the case so that
          we sound delusional....and are not to be taken seriously...to not
          complain about the real crime : human experimentation.
          >
          >
          > ill explain, imagine you don't know about anything
          and your neighbour tell you are harassing him while its not
          true....You will get impression he is crazy...
          >
          >
          > second question : why so many people do think its the
          neighbours?
          >
          > and why the noise really comes from upstairs? HOW ITS
          DONE IN FACT;
          >
          >
          > answer: BECAUSE THIS TECHNOLOGIE IS GOOD ENOUGH TO
          >
          > robotisize PEOPLE WITHOUT THEIR KNOWLEDGE
          >
          > AND THAT IS WHAT THEY DO WITH THE NEIGBORS TO MAKE
          THEM MAKE NOICE RIGHT ABOVE YOUR HEAD AT THE RIGHT MOMENT AS IF THEY
          KNOW WHAT YOU ARE DOING OR WHERE YOU ARE;;;;
          >
          >
          > THIS TECHNOLOGIE IS ABLE TO ROBOTESIZE (complete
          remote control) HUMANS WITHOUT THEIR KNOWDLEGDE IN INTERANCTION with
          others AND MAKES THEM "ACT AS IF", WHILE THEY ARE ABSOLUTE NOT AWARE
          SOMEMTHING IS GOING ON at all.
          >
          > (essential trick to create street theatre, gang
          stalking , impression neighbours are involved or friends talk and act
          as if they know about it ect ect)
          >
          >
          > THAT IS I THINK THE REASON WHY ALL THOSE PEOPLE
          AROUND US MAKE GESTURES TO US AND follow us ect ect ITS ONE OF THE
          POSSIBLE ILLUSSIONS CREATED TO MAKE BELIEVE BY THE VICTIM THAT IS ALL
          >
          >
          > comments ofcourse welcome, its good to understand how
          they fool us ! :-)
          >
          > the technologie is made for that first of all....
          >
          > Because we may not be credible witnesses and tell
          nicely all the same....
          >
          > so they make us tell (read "make us believe"
          something else each.
          >
          > so we waste our time on discussing details like who
          is doing it to me personally?
          >
          > Its not personal, its a crime on sic biljon
          people.....
          >
          > experimenting with neurotechnology
          >
          >
          > nice greets Monika
          >
          >
          > ps the crime is very well done !!!
          >
          > its also one of the biggest crimes in history !!!
          >
          > that is why its so perfect and why we can do so
          little !!!
          >
          >
          > ----- Original Message -----
          >
          > From: Pam Farnsworth
          >
          > To: mcactivism@yahoogroups.com
          >
          > Sent: Thursday, November 08, 2007 2:15 PM
          >
          > Subject: Fw: [mcactivism] action against neighbors
          >
          >
          >
          > These V2K etc criminals are constantly making sounds
          like dropping billiard balls and pins and other childish sounds from
          what sounds like directly above my head on the roof, and there is not
          a soul there. It is the criminals and their usage of what the US
          secret service already admitted to using, (weapons to kill us
          remotely and frustrate us to death. Laugh at them, I do).
          >
          >
          > Pam Farnsworth
          >
          > 404.484.0944
          >
          > epam1a@...
          >
          >
          > ----- Original Message -----
          >
          > From: H Vyuj
          >
          > To: mcactivism@yahoogroups.com
          >
          > Sent: Thursday, November 08, 2007 5:55 AM
          >
          > Subject: [mcactivism] action against neighbors
          >
          >
          > i have lodged a complaint one year ago, an action
          against person unknown: i had rung at the door of the neighbor next
          floor and got the conviction that the person who opened and answered
          me was not the least involved with the sleep disruptions and privacy
          mockery i was experiencing. Yet the noise and signals really seemed
          from above my head...
          >
          > The complaint has been filed away as a 'non criminal
          case'. I later lived in a flat at the last floor, and never the noise
          above my head has been worse. I had little doubt the neighbors left
          of my flat were involved (they may not have been the exact authors of
          the noise, however), but the noise came from above my (last) floor,
          so whom to speak to? I have sent a complaint which was not
          registered.
          >
          > If you ever had some consistent cause for it, like
          night din, have you confronted the alleged neighbor, and/or lodged a
          complaint?
          >
          >
          > __________________________________________________
          >
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          > __________________________________________________
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          >
          > Annemarie Gielen
          > Dienst Geweldpreventie/ Oost-Europa
          > Dienst Vredesvorming
          > Pax Christi Vlaanderen
          > Italiëlei 98A
          > 2000 Antwerpen
          > Tel: +32 (0)3 225.10.00
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          > annemarie.gielen@...
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          >
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