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RE: [LutheransLookingEast] An Orthodox "Dogmatics?" (ignore previous false post)

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  • Pastor
    As a former Lutheran pastor, I would recommend Augsburg and Constantinople: the Correspondence between the Tubingen Theologians and Patriarch Jeremiah II of
    Message 1 of 8 , Sep 25, 2013
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    • Christopher Orr
      Ware s The Orthodox Church and The Orthodox Way are also very good introductions that get into more than just the basics. Christopher
      Message 2 of 8 , Sep 25, 2013
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        Ware's "The Orthodox Church" and "The Orthodox Way" are also very good introductions that get into more than just the basics.

        Christopher


        On Wed, Sep 25, 2013 at 8:43 AM, <revcatherwood@...> wrote:
         

        Brothers and sisters,
        Does anyone know of an Orthodox "Dogmatics" volume, or something similar to Pieper or Mueller or even Koehler's "Summary of Christian Doctrine? (I've found this the briefest, yet best/most concise)" I would like to get a little deeper into an understanding of where East/Lutheranism differs, and something like this would be helpful, systematically.
        I have seen many online sources, however, I like books. To hold. I would like something I can carry around, and not on my tablet. I like to make notes in the margins. I am old fashioned.
        Can anyone point me in a direction, or is a Dogmatics book inherently Lutheran? What do they use at the Orthodox seminaries? HELP. Thanks in advance.

        In Christ, and Him crucified,
        Robb


      • Christopher Orr
        Apart from Orthodoxy simply not being as systematic as legacy Latin and German churches, it s also important to remember that anglophone Orthodoxy is minuscule
        Message 3 of 8 , Sep 25, 2013
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          Apart from Orthodoxy simply not being as systematic as legacy Latin and German churches, it's also important to remember that anglophone Orthodoxy is minuscule when compared with world Orthodoxy (the second largest Christian communion after the Roman Catholic church).  If you have facility in modern Greek, Russian, or Romanian, you may want to look at resources available in those languages, as well.  There may also be a decent amount of material available in French, which would have been used as an academic language in both the Orthodox church in the Levant (Antioch) as well as in the Russian church, before the Revolution/Civil War as well as in the emigration following it.

          Christopher



          On Wed, Sep 25, 2013 at 8:43 AM, <revcatherwood@...> wrote:
           

          Brothers and sisters,
          Does anyone know of an Orthodox "Dogmatics" volume, or something similar to Pieper or Mueller or even Koehler's "Summary of Christian Doctrine? (I've found this the briefest, yet best/most concise)" I would like to get a little deeper into an understanding of where East/Lutheranism differs, and something like this would be helpful, systematically.
          I have seen many online sources, however, I like books. To hold. I would like something I can carry around, and not on my tablet. I like to make notes in the margins. I am old fashioned.
          Can anyone point me in a direction, or is a Dogmatics book inherently Lutheran? What do they use at the Orthodox seminaries? HELP. Thanks in advance.

          In Christ, and Him crucified,
          Robb


        • Fr John W Fenton
          As background for why Orthodoxy is not as systematic historically, perhaps my little offering may be of interest. You may locate it in written form here:
          Message 4 of 8 , Sep 25, 2013
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            As background for why Orthodoxy is not as systematic historically, perhaps my little offering may be of interest. You may locate it in written form here: http://www.holyincarnation.org/pub/Creeds%20&%20Confessions%20in%20Orthodoxy.pdf. The same paper was also a podcast entitled “Orthodox Confessions of Faith” offered here: http://www.ancientfaith.com/specials/lutheran_colloquium.

             

            Also, I’ve always found Meyendorff’s “Byzantine Theology” helpful.

             

             

             

             

            Fr. John W. Fenton

            Priest, Holy Incarnation Orthodox Church

            1385 Goddard Rd * Lincoln Park MI 48146

            313.282.6153

             

             

             

             

            From: LutheransLookingEast@yahoogroups.com [mailto:LutheransLookingEast@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Christopher Orr
            Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 2:04 PM
            To: LutheransLookingEast@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: Re: [LutheransLookingEast] An Orthodox &quot;Dogmatics?&quot; (ignore previous false post)

             

             

            Apart from Orthodoxy simply not being as systematic as legacy Latin and German churches, it's also important to remember that anglophone Orthodoxy is minuscule when compared with world Orthodoxy (the second largest Christian communion after the Roman Catholic church).  If you have facility in modern Greek, Russian, or Romanian, you may want to look at resources available in those languages, as well.  There may also be a decent amount of material available in French, which would have been used as an academic language in both the Orthodox church in the Levant (Antioch) as well as in the Russian church, before the Revolution/Civil War as well as in the emigration following it.

             

            Christopher

             

             

            On Wed, Sep 25, 2013 at 8:43 AM, <revcatherwood@...> wrote:

             

            Brothers and sisters,
            Does anyone know of an Orthodox "Dogmatics" volume, or something similar to Pieper or Mueller or even Koehler's "Summary of Christian Doctrine? (I've found this the briefest, yet best/most concise)" I would like to get a little deeper into an understanding of where East/Lutheranism differs, and something like this would be helpful, systematically.
            I have seen many online sources, however, I like books. To hold. I would like something I can carry around, and not on my tablet. I like to make notes in the margins. I am old fashioned.
            Can anyone point me in a direction, or is a Dogmatics book inherently Lutheran? What do they use at the Orthodox seminaries? HELP. Thanks in advance.

            In Christ, and Him crucified,
            Robb

             


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          • randall hay
            Those are exactly the two texts I would recommend.  Orthodox dogma is more about establishing the foundation that allows the spiritual life to blossom than
            Message 5 of 8 , Sep 25, 2013
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              Those are exactly the two texts I would recommend.  Orthodox dogma is more about establishing the foundation that allows the spiritual life to blossom than setting out definitions over against other groups...these two books reflect this approach.

              St John of Damascus's work is available in the PNF volume...it's shorter, but sometimes a bit harder to grasp for those unfamiliar with Orthodox theology...and while rather disorganized by our standards it is an astonishing treasure.  You can read it a hundred times and always get something new out of it.

              Randy



              From: Christopher Orr <xcjorr@...>
              To: LutheransLookingEast@yahoogroups.com
              Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2013 10:03 AM
              Subject: Re: [LutheransLookingEast] An Orthodox "Dogmatics?" (ignore previous false post)

               
              "Orthodox Dogmatic Theology" by Michael Pomazansky (St Herman's Press) is probably as close as one would find to what you are looking for.
              Met. Hilarion Alfeyev's second volume in his "Orthodox Christianity" series is something like what you are asking for, though not as systematic:
              http://www.svspress.com/orthodox-christianity-volume-ii-doctrine-and-teaching-of-the-orthodox-church/
              The place to start is St John of Damascus' "Exact Exposition".
              The liturgical cycle of services and how the various fixed and moveable pieces interact with each other is also important.  For instance, the care shown in distinguishing between the worship due to God and the veneration due to the Mother of God and the saints is seen in the way the Church doxologizes with the Trinity and Christ alone, how Feasts of the Lord always 'outrank' and displace Feasts of the Mother of God and the saints, how veneration of saints is accomplished by first making the sign of the cross of Christ, and how the Mother of God is allow always portrayed with her Son (not apart from Him as if she was holy apart from Him).
              Christopher Orr
              On Sep 25, 2013 8:44 AM, <revcatherwood@...> wrote:
               
              Brothers and sisters,
              Does anyone know of an Orthodox "Dogmatics" volume, or something similar to Pieper or Mueller or even Koehler's "Summary of Christian Doctrine? (I've found this the briefest, yet best/most concise)" I would like to get a little deeper into an understanding of where East/Lutheranism differs, and something like this would be helpful, systematically.
              I have seen many online sources, however, I like books. To hold. I would like something I can carry around, and not on my tablet. I like to make notes in the margins. I am old fashioned.
              Can anyone point me in a direction, or is a Dogmatics book inherently Lutheran? What do they use at the Orthodox seminaries? HELP. Thanks in advance.

              In Christ, and Him crucified,
              Robb


            • Christopher Orr
              Perhaps papers from this Association s past symposia are available for you (I m sure most were not presented in English, however):
              Message 6 of 8 , Oct 1, 2013
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                Perhaps papers from this Association's past symposia are available for you (I'm sure most were not presented in English, however):

                http://www.svots.edu/headlines/dr-peter-bouteneff-participates-international-theological-conference

                Christopher

                On Sep 25, 2013 8:44 AM, <revcatherwood@...> wrote:
                 

                Brothers and sisters,
                Does anyone know of an Orthodox "Dogmatics" volume, or something similar to Pieper or Mueller or even Koehler's "Summary of Christian Doctrine? (I've found this the briefest, yet best/most concise)" I would like to get a little deeper into an understanding of where East/Lutheranism differs, and something like this would be helpful, systematically.
                I have seen many online sources, however, I like books. To hold. I would like something I can carry around, and not on my tablet. I like to make notes in the margins. I am old fashioned.
                Can anyone point me in a direction, or is a Dogmatics book inherently Lutheran? What do they use at the Orthodox seminaries? HELP. Thanks in advance.

                In Christ, and Him crucified,
                Robb

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