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Re: [LutheransLookingEast] Irenaeus, the Fall, and the Image ofGod

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  • Richard K. Futrell
    Ben, You know your stuff! I have yet to read book 4 in this translation. So what you are saying is that my understanding of the loss of the image of God does
    Message 1 of 15 , Jul 5, 2011
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      Ben,

      You know your stuff! I have yet to read book 4 in this translation. So what you are saying is that my understanding of the loss of the image of God does not purport with Irenaeus'. Fair enough--and you make your case with that rather soundly.

      So with Irenaeus, loss of God's image does not mean what I take it to mean. That seems to be the case (I'll wait until I get through book 4).

      So with Ireneaus, he is saying we lost the image, but the ramifcations of that are different than I hold the ramifications to be. (And your assessment of my position, if you were doing that, is not what I hold it all to be, but that's OK, for I didn't spell all that out).

      I also at some later time plan to read Wingren's take on Irenaeus.


      Rich

      BTW; Thank you for taking tiem to write lenghty posts opn this as needed to continue the conversation in a good way. That's refreshing.


      --
      Rich Futrell, Pastor
      Shepherd of the Hills Lutheran Church, Kimberling City, MO
      http://sothl.com

      Where we receive and confess the faith of the Church (in and with the Augsburg Confession): The faith once delivered to the saints, the faith of Christ Jesus, His Word of the Gospel, His full forgiveness of sins, His flesh and blood given and poured out for us, and His gracious gift of life for body, soul, and spirit.
    • Benjamin Harju
      Rich, I apologize if I took the wording of your description of St. Irenaeus s position too far into distortion. It would be good conversation to read your
      Message 2 of 15 , Jul 5, 2011
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        Rich,

        I apologize if I took the wording of your description of St. Irenaeus's
        position too far into distortion. It would be good conversation to read
        your full take on St. Irenaeus's position, but in the context of this list
        it might be more fruitful to discuss the image and likeness of God in
        Lutheran and Orthodox terms, and place St. Irenaeus in those contexts, as
        Randall Hay did. I especially like how Randall demonstrates that Orthodox
        teaching is a matter for the entire Church Catholic, not just what one
        teacher says as if that's that.

        In Christ,
        Benjamin Harju

        On Tue, Jul 5, 2011 at 10:56 PM, Richard K. Futrell <
        PastorFutrell@...> wrote:

        > **
        >
        >
        > Ben,
        >
        > You know your stuff! I have yet to read book 4 in this translation. So what
        > you are saying is that my understanding of the loss of the image of God does
        > not purport with Irenaeus'. Fair enough--and you make your case with that
        > rather soundly.
        >
        > So with Irenaeus, loss of God's image does not mean what I take it to mean.
        > That seems to be the case (I'll wait until I get through book 4).
        >
        > So with Ireneaus, he is saying we lost the image, but the ramifcations of
        > that are different than I hold the ramifications to be. (And your assessment
        > of my position, if you were doing that, is not what I hold it all to be, but
        > that's OK, for I didn't spell all that out).
        >
        > I also at some later time plan to read Wingren's take on Irenaeus.
        >
        > Rich
        >
        > BTW; Thank you for taking tiem to write lenghty posts opn this as needed to
        > continue the conversation in a good way. That's refreshing.
        >
        > --
        >
        > Rich Futrell, Pastor
        > Shepherd of the Hills Lutheran Church, Kimberling City, MO
        > http://sothl.com
        >
        > Where we receive and confess the faith of the Church (in and with the
        > Augsburg Confession): The faith once delivered to the saints, the faith of
        > Christ Jesus, His Word of the Gospel, His full forgiveness of sins, His
        > flesh and blood given and poured out for us, and His gracious gift of life
        > for body, soul, and spirit.
        >
        >
        >


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