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Norton Ghost - NTFS drive image from ext3 partition to new drive?

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  • pennhavn
    I am a new LinkStation HGLAN 250 owner and a total noob regarding Linux. Despite a fair amount of searching I haven t been able to answer this question. I hope
    Message 1 of 13 , Nov 18, 2005
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      I am a new LinkStation HGLAN 250 owner and a total noob regarding
      Linux. Despite a fair amount of searching I haven't been able to
      answer this question. I hope someone here can help.

      I currently use Norton Ghost to back up my Win XP machine to a USB
      hard drive formatted as FAT32. I want to move the USB backup drive
      away from the PC and attach it to my new LinkStation HG250 located in
      another room.

      So here is the question. Suppose I use Norton Ghost (9.0) to place a
      backup image of my Win XP machine's primary partition on a USB drive
      connected to my LinkStation (and formatted by the LinkStation to
      ext3). If necessary, can Norton Ghost restore the NTFS image file from
      the ext3 drive (which would be temporarily installed in my Windows
      machine) to a new NTFS drive?
    • James Ronald
      I would say no... I use ghost 2003 to backup computers to a mapped drive letter on a SAMBA server. From there I can restore individual files easily. If I
      Message 2 of 13 , Nov 18, 2005
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        I would say no... I use ghost 2003 to backup computers to a mapped drive
        letter on a SAMBA server. From there I can restore individual files easily.
        If I need to rebuild from a windows system from a backup I either use a
        bootable ghost disk with drivers (PITA) or stick the drive to be restored
        into a working windows machine with ghost installed and restore the image
        that way. JR

        ----- Original Message -----
        From: "pennhavn" <pennhaven@...>
        To: <LinkStation_General@yahoogroups.com>
        Sent: Friday, November 18, 2005 3:40 PM
        Subject: [LinkStation_General] Norton Ghost - NTFS drive image from ext3
        partition to new drive?


        >I am a new LinkStation HGLAN 250 owner and a total noob regarding
        > Linux. Despite a fair amount of searching I haven't been able to
        > answer this question. I hope someone here can help.
        >
        > I currently use Norton Ghost to back up my Win XP machine to a USB
        > hard drive formatted as FAT32. I want to move the USB backup drive
        > away from the PC and attach it to my new LinkStation HG250 located in
        > another room.
        >
        > So here is the question. Suppose I use Norton Ghost (9.0) to place a
        > backup image of my Win XP machine's primary partition on a USB drive
        > connected to my LinkStation (and formatted by the LinkStation to
        > ext3). If necessary, can Norton Ghost restore the NTFS image file from
        > the ext3 drive (which would be temporarily installed in my Windows
        > machine) to a new NTFS drive?
      • pennhavn
        ... drive ... easily. ... restored ... image ... I m not sure you quite understand my question. I know that either a working PC with Ghost installed or a Ghost
        Message 3 of 13 , Nov 18, 2005
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          --- In LinkStation_General@yahoogroups.com, "James Ronald"
          <jronald@c...> wrote:
          >
          > I would say no... I use ghost 2003 to backup computers to a mapped
          drive
          > letter on a SAMBA server. From there I can restore individual files
          easily.
          > If I need to rebuild from a windows system from a backup I either use a
          > bootable ghost disk with drivers (PITA) or stick the drive to be
          restored
          > into a working windows machine with ghost installed and restore the
          image
          > that way. JR
          >

          I'm not sure you quite understand my question. I know that either a
          working PC with Ghost installed or a Ghost boot disk are required to
          perform a partition restore. That is how I would have to go about
          restoring a primary partition regardless of the disk format. My
          question is whether Norton Ghost (running from a boot disk, for
          example) can read an image file of an NTFS partition from an ext3
          formatted drive and restore that NTFS image to a new drive.
        • James Stewart
          I ve never used Ghost, but assuming you are creating a hard drive image that would appear as a single large file over on the EXT3 drive, then in order you read
          Message 4 of 13 , Nov 18, 2005
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            I've never used Ghost, but assuming you are creating a hard drive
            image that would appear as a single large file over on the EXT3 drive,
            then in order you read the drive on a Windows machine you would have
            to install an EXT3 driver for Windows. There actually are some!
            Actually they usually are EXT2 drivers, but they should work fine.
            They also only give you read-only access to the drive, but that should
            work fine for what you are doing.

            If Ghost will work through a Samba (Windows network) share (which I
            think is what someone was suggesting) then you could just restore
            through the network, at a much slower rate.

            Anyway, here are some links to EXT2/3 drivers

            http://sourceforge.net/projects/ext2fsd
            http://uranus.it.swin.edu.au/~jn/linux/ext2ifs.htm
            http://www.fs-driver.org/

            --- In LinkStation_General@yahoogroups.com, "pennhavn"
            <pennhaven@t...> wrote:
            >
            > I am a new LinkStation HGLAN 250 owner and a total noob regarding
            > Linux. Despite a fair amount of searching I haven't been able to
            > answer this question. I hope someone here can help.
            >
            > I currently use Norton Ghost to back up my Win XP machine to a USB
            > hard drive formatted as FAT32. I want to move the USB backup drive
            > away from the PC and attach it to my new LinkStation HG250 located in
            > another room.
            >
            > So here is the question. Suppose I use Norton Ghost (9.0) to place a
            > backup image of my Win XP machine's primary partition on a USB drive
            > connected to my LinkStation (and formatted by the LinkStation to
            > ext3). If necessary, can Norton Ghost restore the NTFS image file from
            > the ext3 drive (which would be temporarily installed in my Windows
            > machine) to a new NTFS drive?
            >
          • shamael_2097
            ... Hmm...I doubt it because windows doesn t like ext3. However, I know for example that Partition Magic can look into ext3 partitions (though not mount them),
            Message 5 of 13 , Nov 18, 2005
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              > I'm not sure you quite understand my question. I know that either a
              > working PC with Ghost installed or a Ghost boot disk are required to
              > perform a partition restore. That is how I would have to go about
              > restoring a primary partition regardless of the disk format. My
              > question is whether Norton Ghost (running from a boot disk, for
              > example) can read an image file of an NTFS partition from an ext3
              > formatted drive and restore that NTFS image to a new drive.
              >

              Hmm...I doubt it because windows doesn't like ext3. However, I know
              for example that Partition Magic can look into ext3 partitions (though
              not mount them), so Ghost *might* be able to do something similar.
              I think you should check with the Ghost manual.

              If you can't restore that way though, you can still modify the
              linkstation to accept fat32 usb drives.

              Another option (but somebody with better unix skills should confirm
              it) would be to use dd to backup your ntfs drives. Since they don't
              have to be mounted, dd shouldn't complain about the foreign format.
              All you need would be a linux live-cd (knoppix for example).
            • haberschnasel
              ... With my version of the Ghost Boot Disk, there is only a MS-compatible DOS on it, some other files and a ghost executable. Mine does not come with any
              Message 6 of 13 , Nov 19, 2005
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                --- In LinkStation_General@yahoogroups.com, "James Stewart"
                <wartstew@y...> wrote:
                >
                > I've never used Ghost, but assuming you are creating a hard drive
                > image that would appear as a single large file over on the EXT3 drive,
                > then in order you read the drive on a Windows machine you would have
                > to install an EXT3 driver for Windows. There actually are some!
                > Actually they usually are EXT2 drivers, but they should work fine.
                > They also only give you read-only access to the drive, but that should
                > work fine for what you are doing.
                >
                > If Ghost will work through a Samba (Windows network) share (which I
                > think is what someone was suggesting) then you could just restore
                > through the network, at a much slower rate.
                >
                > Anyway, here are some links to EXT2/3 drivers
                >
                > http://sourceforge.net/projects/ext2fsd
                > http://uranus.it.swin.edu.au/~jn/linux/ext2ifs.htm
                > http://www.fs-driver.org/
                >
                > --- In LinkStation_General@yahoogroups.com, "pennhavn"
                > <pennhaven@t...> wrote:
                > >
                > > I am a new LinkStation HGLAN 250 owner and a total noob regarding
                > > Linux. Despite a fair amount of searching I haven't been able to
                > > answer this question. I hope someone here can help.
                > >
                > > I currently use Norton Ghost to back up my Win XP machine to a USB
                > > hard drive formatted as FAT32. I want to move the USB backup drive
                > > away from the PC and attach it to my new LinkStation HG250 located in
                > > another room.
                > >
                > > So here is the question. Suppose I use Norton Ghost (9.0) to place a
                > > backup image of my Win XP machine's primary partition on a USB drive
                > > connected to my LinkStation (and formatted by the LinkStation to
                > > ext3). If necessary, can Norton Ghost restore the NTFS image file from
                > > the ext3 drive (which would be temporarily installed in my Windows
                > > machine) to a new NTFS drive?
                > >

                With my version of the Ghost Boot Disk, there is only a MS-compatible
                DOS on it, some other files and a ghost executable. Mine does not come
                with any ext2/ext3 or usb drivers. Your will have to find ext2/ext3
                and usb drivers for this DOS or for MS-DOS (if they exist) and create
                your own boot disk (Ghost itself is only one executable file).

                IMHO your best choice would be to switch from Ghost to Acronis
                TrueImage. With TrueImage, you'll have a Linux boot CD such that it
                can read from an ext2/ext3 USB drive without any problems. It also
                supports incremental backups to network drives (I never used it,
                though), from a running windows. Moreover it supports writing on
                ext2/3, such that you can attach your drive directly to the computer
                for a fast, full backup.

                Best,
                h.
              • pennhavn
                ... Thanks much, that pretty well confirms what I had suspected. Fearing this, a switch to TrueImage already had been my Plan B . However, before I go this
                Message 7 of 13 , Nov 19, 2005
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                  --- In LinkStation_General@yahoogroups.com, "haberschnasel"
                  <haberschnasel@y...> wrote:
                  >
                  > With my version of the Ghost Boot Disk, there is only a MS-compatible
                  > DOS on it, some other files and a ghost executable. Mine does not come
                  > with any ext2/ext3 or usb drivers. Your will have to find ext2/ext3
                  > and usb drivers for this DOS or for MS-DOS (if they exist) and create
                  > your own boot disk (Ghost itself is only one executable file).
                  >
                  > IMHO your best choice would be to switch from Ghost to Acronis
                  > TrueImage. With TrueImage, you'll have a Linux boot CD such that it
                  > can read from an ext2/ext3 USB drive without any problems. It also
                  > supports incremental backups to network drives (I never used it,
                  > though), from a running windows. Moreover it supports writing on
                  > ext2/3, such that you can attach your drive directly to the computer
                  > for a fast, full backup.
                  >
                  > Best,
                  > h.
                  >
                  Thanks much, that pretty well confirms what I had suspected. Fearing
                  this, a switch to TrueImage already had been my "Plan B". However,
                  before I go this route I need to confirm that the TrueImage Linux boot
                  CD can not only read ext3 but also restore an NTFS partition.
                • pennhavn
                  ... The manual states only the Norton Ghost is supported on ... Linux ext3... partitions . Searching the Symantec site yields nothing regarding what this
                  Message 8 of 13 , Nov 19, 2005
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                    --- In LinkStation_General@yahoogroups.com, "shamael_2097"
                    <shamael_2097@v...> wrote:
                    >
                    > Hmm...I doubt it because windows doesn't like ext3. However, I know
                    > for example that Partition Magic can look into ext3 partitions (though
                    > not mount them), so Ghost *might* be able to do something similar.
                    > I think you should check with the Ghost manual.

                    The manual states only the Norton Ghost "is supported on ... Linux
                    ext3... partitions". Searching the Symantec site yields nothing
                    regarding what this means in terms of reading an ext3 drive with a
                    Ghost boot disk or recovery CD, etc.

                    > If you can't restore that way though, you can still modify the
                    > linkstation to accept fat32 usb drives.

                    That was my first thought. But as I said I am Linux illiterate and it
                    seems that I can't even Telnet into the HGLAN 250 with the latest
                    official Buffalo firmware 1.42, that I have already installed. I was
                    tempted to install an openlink firmware, but haven't because:
                    1. Buffalo had promissed improved firmware support for media server
                    functionality - which is my primary use of the LT.
                    2. I do not want to risk "bricking" my LS which already has a lot of
                    media content and it seems HG owners flashing unofficial firmware are
                    having this issue.
                    3. So if I do go to an openlink firmware, it will not be until there
                    is one that includes the enhancements Buffalo is promissing, and I am
                    sure that the "bricking" issue has been solved.

                    However, if I am overlooking a simpler way to allow the LinkStation to
                    read and write to USB FAT32 drives, please advise, as that would
                    definitely solve my Ghost issue.

                    > Another option (but somebody with better unix skills should confirm
                    > it) would be to use dd to backup your ntfs drives. Since they don't
                    > have to be mounted, dd shouldn't complain about the foreign format.
                    > All you need would be a linux live-cd (knoppix for example).

                    This is beyond my knowledge of Linux (zero), and likely beyond the
                    amount of time and effort I want to put into this.

                    Thanks for your thoughtful response.
                  • haberschnasel
                    ... I am shure it does. I boot with the Acronis linux CD to backup my XP partition to an external drive and I can (at least it is offered to me, but till now
                    Message 9 of 13 , Nov 20, 2005
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                      --- In LinkStation_General@yahoogroups.com, "pennhavn"
                      <pennhaven@t...> wrote:
                      > Thanks much, that pretty well confirms what I had suspected. Fearing
                      > this, a switch to TrueImage already had been my "Plan B". However,
                      > before I go this route I need to confirm that the TrueImage Linux boot
                      > CD can not only read ext3 but also restore an NTFS partition.

                      I am shure it does. I boot with the Acronis linux CD to backup my XP
                      partition to an external drive and I can (at least it is offered to
                      me, but 'till now there was no need to try it out) restore this
                      partition, of course.

                      But you may want to check the documentation and/or download the free
                      trial:
                      http://www.acronis.com/homecomputing/products/trueimage/features.html

                      Best,
                      h.
                    • pennhavn
                      ... Thanks much H. Here are some findings, in case anyone else wants to use their LinkStation for PC partition backup images. I downloaded the latest True
                      Message 10 of 13 , Nov 26, 2005
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                        --- In LinkStation_General@yahoogroups.com, "haberschnasel"
                        <haberschnasel@y...> wrote:
                        >
                        > --- In LinkStation_General@yahoogroups.com, "pennhavn"
                        > <pennhaven@t...> wrote:
                        > > Thanks much, that pretty well confirms what I had suspected. Fearing
                        > > this, a switch to TrueImage already had been my "Plan B". However,
                        > > before I go this route I need to confirm that the TrueImage Linux boot
                        > > CD can not only read ext3 but also restore an NTFS partition.
                        >
                        > I am shure it does. I boot with the Acronis linux CD to backup my XP
                        > partition to an external drive and I can (at least it is offered to
                        > me, but 'till now there was no need to try it out) restore this
                        > partition, of course.
                        >
                        > But you may want to check the documentation and/or download the free
                        > trial:
                        > http://www.acronis.com/homecomputing/products/trueimage/features.html
                        >
                        > Best,
                        > h.

                        Thanks much H.

                        Here are some findings, in case anyone else wants to use their
                        LinkStation for PC partition backup images.

                        I downloaded the latest True Image 9 to do some testing. From what I
                        have seen it appears to work as you reported. Generally I was
                        impressed with True Image since it has a much more intuitive user
                        interface than Ghost 9. This is especially true for the recovery boot CD.

                        Unfortunately I also found TI 9 still has some bugs that need to be
                        worked out before I will purchase it. While it seems to work fine for
                        creating a backup image of a complete partition, it freezes up tight
                        when I try to use it's folder / file imaging feature. Too bad, as that
                        would be a great way to back up only data folders. My backup strategy
                        is to back up my data files frequently, but only create a backup of
                        the primary partition image every week or after major software
                        installations.

                        I still do not know, one way or the other, whether the Ghost recovery
                        disk will read an ext3 drive that is attached directly to the PC, but
                        I plan to find out eventually. In the mean time I have a work around.
                        After some testing it is clear that the Ghost recovery disk can read
                        an image from the LinkStation over the network. (This requires running
                        a utility on the recovery disk to map the LinkStation drive, while
                        True Image's much slicker recovery disk performs the local network
                        mapping transparently.) Since Ghost can access the LinkStation it
                        should also be able to read a USB drive attached to the LinkStation.

                        So I plan to attach my USB drive to the LinkStation, let the LS
                        reformat it as ext3 and back up the LinkStation to the USB drive. This
                        way I will have backup images of my PC's primary partition on both the
                        LinkStation and the USB drive. As long as the LinkStation is operable
                        I should be able to restore from either drive. Once I have this set up
                        I will test Ghost with the USB drive connected directly to the PC. If
                        this does not work, when I get ambitious I may go so far as to remove
                        the drive from the USB enclosure and connect it to the EIDE interface
                        in the computer, and test it this way, as it would be nice to know
                        that I can restore directly from the ext3 drive without using the
                        LinkStation.
                      • James Ronald
                        ... From: pennhavn To: Sent: Saturday, November 26, 2005 3:01 PM Subject: [LinkStation_General]
                        Message 11 of 13 , Nov 26, 2005
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                          ----- Original Message -----
                          From: "pennhavn" <pennhaven@...>
                          To: <LinkStation_General@yahoogroups.com>
                          Sent: Saturday, November 26, 2005 3:01 PM
                          Subject: [LinkStation_General] Re: Norton Ghost - NTFS drive image from ext3
                          partition to new drive?


                          > --- In LinkStation_General@yahoogroups.com, "haberschnasel"
                          > <haberschnasel@y...> wrote:
                          >>
                          >> --- In LinkStation_General@yahoogroups.com, "pennhavn"
                          >> <pennhaven@t...> wrote:
                          >> > Thanks much, that pretty well confirms what I had suspected. Fearing
                          >> > this, a switch to TrueImage already had been my "Plan B". However,
                          >> > before I go this route I need to confirm that the TrueImage Linux boot
                          >> > CD can not only read ext3 but also restore an NTFS partition.
                          >>
                          >> I am shure it does. I boot with the Acronis linux CD to backup my XP
                          >> partition to an external drive and I can (at least it is offered to
                          >> me, but 'till now there was no need to try it out) restore this
                          >> partition, of course.
                          >>
                          >> But you may want to check the documentation and/or download the free
                          >> trial:
                          >> http://www.acronis.com/homecomputing/products/trueimage/features.html
                          >>
                          >> Best,
                          >> h.
                          >
                          > Thanks much H.
                          >
                          > Here are some findings, in case anyone else wants to use their
                          > LinkStation for PC partition backup images.
                          >
                          > I downloaded the latest True Image 9 to do some testing. From what I
                          > have seen it appears to work as you reported. Generally I was
                          > impressed with True Image since it has a much more intuitive user
                          > interface than Ghost 9. This is especially true for the recovery boot CD.
                          >
                          > Unfortunately I also found TI 9 still has some bugs that need to be
                          > worked out before I will purchase it. While it seems to work fine for
                          > creating a backup image of a complete partition, it freezes up tight
                          > when I try to use it's folder / file imaging feature. Too bad, as that
                          > would be a great way to back up only data folders. My backup strategy
                          > is to back up my data files frequently, but only create a backup of
                          > the primary partition image every week or after major software
                          > installations.
                          >
                          > I still do not know, one way or the other, whether the Ghost recovery
                          > disk will read an ext3 drive that is attached directly to the PC, but
                          > I plan to find out eventually. In the mean time I have a work around.
                          > After some testing it is clear that the Ghost recovery disk can read
                          > an image from the LinkStation over the network. (This requires running
                          > a utility on the recovery disk to map the LinkStation drive, while
                          > True Image's much slicker recovery disk performs the local network
                          > mapping transparently.) Since Ghost can access the LinkStation it
                          > should also be able to read a USB drive attached to the LinkStation.
                          >
                          > So I plan to attach my USB drive to the LinkStation, let the LS
                          > reformat it as ext3 and back up the LinkStation to the USB drive. This
                          > way I will have backup images of my PC's primary partition on both the
                          > LinkStation and the USB drive. As long as the LinkStation is operable
                          > I should be able to restore from either drive. Once I have this set up
                          > I will test Ghost with the USB drive connected directly to the PC. If
                          > this does not work, when I get ambitious I may go so far as to remove
                          > the drive from the USB enclosure and connect it to the EIDE interface
                          > in the computer, and test it this way, as it would be nice to know
                          > that I can restore directly from the ext3 drive without using the
                          > LinkStation.
                          >
                          The Ghost recovery disks are DOS based at least as of Ghost 2003. There are
                          DOS drivers that can mount an ext2 partition but I don't think that there is
                          one for ext3. I would start by finding and testing a DOS ext2/3 driver as
                          that's going to be your show stopper.
                        • haberschnasel
                          ... I never used this feature. I keep all my data files on the LS and back them up via RSYNC to an attached USB drive each night. So maybe the TI bug you
                          Message 12 of 13 , Nov 26, 2005
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                            --- In LinkStation_General@yahoogroups.com, "pennhavn"
                            <pennhaven@t...> wrote:

                            > Unfortunately I also found TI 9 still has some bugs that need to be
                            > worked out before I will purchase it. While it seems to work fine for
                            > creating a backup image of a complete partition, it freezes up tight
                            > when I try to use it's folder / file imaging feature. Too bad, as that
                            > would be a great way to back up only data folders. My backup strategy
                            > is to back up my data files frequently, but only create a backup of
                            > the primary partition image every week or after major software
                            > installations.

                            I never used this feature. I keep all my data files on the LS and back
                            them up via RSYNC to an attached USB drive each night. So maybe the TI
                            bug you mentioned went unnoticed.
                          • pennhavn
                            ... There are ... there is ... driver as ... Appreciate your effort to be helpful. Unfortunately at least as of Ghost 2003 is the important qualifier. It
                            Message 13 of 13 , Nov 27, 2005
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                              --- In LinkStation_General@yahoogroups.com, "James Ronald"
                              <jronald@c...> wrote:
                              >
                              > The Ghost recovery disks are DOS based at least as of Ghost 2003.
                              There are
                              > DOS drivers that can mount an ext2 partition but I don't think that
                              there is
                              > one for ext3. I would start by finding and testing a DOS ext2/3
                              driver as
                              > that's going to be your show stopper.

                              Appreciate your effort to be helpful. Unfortunately "at least as of
                              Ghost 2003" is the important qualifier. It seems that the Ghost
                              "engine" was replaced after 2003. This is one reason why the
                              documentation on Symantec's "support" site is so unhelpful, as nearly
                              all of it seems to refer to the earlier versions.

                              From an informative article:
                              http://www.softpanorama.org/Articles/a_slightly_skeptical_view_on_norton_ghost.shtml

                              "Norton Ghost 9 (which is actually rebranded [Power Quest] Drive
                              Image, a different product from the original Norton Ghost) ha[s a] so
                              called Symantec Recovery Disk...

                              Norton Ghost 9.0 also offers increased driver and interface support
                              for USB, USB2 and FireWire removable storage devices in comparison
                              with Ghost 2003. That provides the possibility of restoring the image
                              from USB2 or FireWire disk...

                              This version of Ghost also supports Linux EXT2 file system apart from
                              FAT16, FAT32, and NTFS..."

                              The bottom line is that this is a very confusing topic, and (based on
                              my search efforts anyway) it is very difficult to find definitive answers.
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