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Re: Seeking more roof drainage info

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  • luminhaus
    We have trees surrounding our house (pine and deciduous) and usually have to sweep off the roof twice a year, because leaves and needles will clog the drain
    Message 1 of 13 , Jul 1, 2009
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      We have trees surrounding our house (pine and deciduous) and usually have to sweep off the roof twice a year, because leaves and needles will clog the drain holes. We don't consider it a problem, just house maintenance. I much rather climb a ladder to the roof and sweep than deal with gutters...
      No drainage problems, otherwise.
      Jennifer

      > We are in the final roof decisions phase and have read the recurring comments here related to water back up and poor drainage with LVs. Flat roofs are not common on homes and, perhaps, drainage/vegatative debris is the big reason. (Lots of commercial, large apartment or condominium buildings have flat roofs, but they are designed with large and multiple drains.)
      >
      > Of those owners who have had problems, what do you think are the causes? Is it roof slope; drains placement or size; drain cover; site conditions you had not anticipated . . .
      >
      > And what solutions have you found? Some one of you may have mentioned the overflow scupper cut out of the faux wall. That is quite interesting to us. Our location does have evergreen and deciduous trees proximate to the building (we took down what was allowed for construction, but are restricted on removing trees outside that perimeter which does leave a fair number of trees that may not topple over and be able to ding us but will shed.)
      >
      > All comments greatly appreciated as we have been round and round among ourselves/with contractor on this.
      >
    • luminhaus
      We also had a Durolast roof membrane installed on our LV Home. Highly recommend it... residential homes get a 15yr. warranty, it comes in three colors,
      Message 2 of 13 , Jul 1, 2009
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        We also had a Durolast roof membrane installed on our LV Home. Highly recommend it... residential homes get a 15yr. warranty, it comes in three colors, including white and lt. grey, which reflects the hot sun in the warm months.
        http://www.durolast.com/

        >   All flat roofs have some " slope ". Flat roofs are quite common on homes , just depends on the part of the country, style, and weather. 2 inches in 30 feet is enough. Whats important is puddling. All roofs have some when there is a shallow slope. What you want is a membrane that will withstand any puddling without leaks , for the long haul.
        >
        >   This is the reason for the Duralast roof. It is one pc. Made in the factory ,for the size intended. No seams , or joints to contend with.Has a patented fasting system , quite simple , but effective. No glue, mastic , tar , or other stuff , that will break down in time ....then you have leaks.  Read my posts on how I did it. I do have an installer that is willing to travel.
        >  A more expensive system is to use fiberglass , mat, resin , and at lest 6 scupper drains in-between the walls. I build this 25 years ago , no leaks , but , the roof did collect water when it rained heavy and the scupper wires were plugged. I used my roof. Had hot tub and rose garden on it. Stairs to the top , so cleaning was easy. The nice thing was , no staining of my ceder walls as the 42" knee wall was like a pool. I even thought of putting a four seasons dome over the whole roof........Sold the house after 18 years , never leaked, and never needed paint , as the gel coat protected the roof like a boat. There were winters when 3 feet of snow was on the roof. ( I did ceder deck it also.) make sure your roof entrance has a high waterproof sill, otherwise , when the standing water gets too deep it will enter the stairwell and flood the house.
        >  If you live in a coastal area where there are lots of fiberglassers that might be a consideration. However , today's costs could be expensive.  My advice , design what you want , how you will use it , and cover with Dura Last.
        >
        > --- On Tue, 6/30/09, lvminime <jdl@...> wrote:
        >
        > From: lvminime <jdl@...>
        > Subject: [LVHomeFans] Seeking more roof drainage info
        > To: LVHomeFans@yahoogroups.com
        > Date: Tuesday, June 30, 2009, 5:42 PM
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > We are in the final roof decisions phase and have read the recurring comments here related to water back up and poor drainage with LVs. Flat roofs are not common on homes and, perhaps, drainage/vegatative debris is the big reason. (Lots of commercial, large apartment or condominium buildings have flat roofs, but they are designed with large and multiple drains.)
        >
        >
        >
        > Of those owners who have had problems, what do you think are the causes? Is it roof slope; drains placement or size; drain cover; site conditions you had not anticipated . . .
        >
        >
        >
        > And what solutions have you found? Some one of you may have mentioned the overflow scupper cut out of the faux wall. That is quite interesting to us. Our location does have evergreen and deciduous trees proximate to the building (we took down what was allowed for construction, but are restricted on removing trees outside that perimeter which does leave a fair number of trees that may not topple over and be able to ding us but will shed.)
        >
        >
        >
        > All comments greatly appreciated as we have been round and round among ourselves/with contractor on this.
        >
      • Dennis Whittle
        In my view, there is an inherent design flaw behind flat roofs with parapets because of the danger of the drains clogging. There absolutely, positively, needs
        Message 3 of 13 , Jul 1, 2009
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          In my view, there is an inherent design flaw behind flat roofs with
          parapets because of the danger of the drains clogging. There
          absolutely, positively, needs to be an emergency overflow. The cost
          of this overflow is low compared to the damage that could be caused by
          roof collapse.

          In our case, we have a weekend home in the woods in WV, and the
          clogging is caused by leaves and those helicopter seeds. We have to
          clean the roof drains many times per year, which exceeds any
          definition of normal maintenance. We have had several episodes of
          leakage through the inside of the external wall into the basement
          because of a failure either of the membrane or the seal around the
          scuppers when the water backs up. We have not been able to pinpoint
          the exact cause. Most recently, we have noticed drywall and paint
          damage on the inside of the house. Of course, the roof guys blame the
          contractor, who blames the designer, and on an on. This is making me
          very unhappy and could easily have been avoided in the design stage.
        • Dar Kuehl
          You did not state what kind of membrane was used. Also , if you read my testimonial , I think 20 plus years with no leaks , and a usable roof speaks for
          Message 4 of 13 , Jul 1, 2009
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            You did not state what kind of membrane was used. Also , if you read my testimonial , I think 20 plus years with no leaks , and a usable roof speaks for itself. My house had 6 scuppers . Even when some were plugged with leaves , some were not , as the ceder deck covered some of the drains. The house was 25' x 30'  55 foot tall with 42" parapets.

             One thing I have noticed so far with the LVL is , the band area around the floor trusses , must be very tight and closed cell foam insulated.My basement floor has been very wet , until I sealed off the above area. The same could apply to the roof trusses unless you use a one pc. membrane. that covers the roof , and the parapet , with a metal cap sloping to the outside. Beside , the truss area is prone to heat loss. Close cell foam will solve the problem.

              My current LVL does not have a rear parapet and has a 2" slope. Still makes the house roof use able , with railing. However , I did what I did , to save costs , and meet snow load requirements in Marquette County. Now , I am faced with a gutter set up on the rear 60'. Not sure what I will " invent" , but , it will not be ordinary ..

            --- On Wed, 7/1/09, Dennis Whittle <dbw001@...> wrote:

            From: Dennis Whittle <dbw001@...>
            Subject: [LVHomeFans] Re:Seeking more roof drainage info
            To: LVHomeFans@yahoogroups.com
            Date: Wednesday, July 1, 2009, 4:03 PM

            In my view, there is an inherent design flaw behind flat roofs with
            parapets because of the danger of the drains clogging. There
            absolutely, positively, needs to be an emergency overflow. The cost
            of this overflow is low compared to the damage that could be caused by
            roof collapse.

            In our case, we have a weekend home in the woods in WV, and the
            clogging is caused by leaves and those helicopter seeds. We have to
            clean the roof drains many times per year, which exceeds any
            definition of normal maintenance. We have had several episodes of
            leakage through the inside of the external wall into the basement
            because of a failure either of the membrane or the seal around the
            scuppers when the water backs up. We have not been able to pinpoint
            the exact cause. Most recently, we have noticed drywall and paint
            damage on the inside of the house. Of course, the roof guys blame the
            contractor, who blames the designer, and on an on. This is making me
            very unhappy and could easily have been avoided in the design stage.

          • Ethan
            Our LVL is complete and our roof does relatively well with 12 basket filters added to the standard scupper design (see earlier post from me with link to image
            Message 5 of 13 , Jul 7, 2009
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              Our LVL is complete and our roof does relatively well with 12" basket filters added to the standard scupper design (see earlier post from me with link to image of custom fab baskets). I'm considering adding overflow scuppers that pass through the parapet walls similar to those I featured here:
              http://www.bbsheetmetal.com/downspout-scuppers/index.html

              These would be placed on the short walls adjacent to the existing in-wall scuppers.

              --- In LVHomeFans@yahoogroups.com, Dar Kuehl <darkuehl@...> wrote:
              >
              > You did not state what kind of membrane was used. Also , if you read my testimonial , I think 20 plus years with no leaks , and a usable roof speaks for itself. My house had 6 scuppers . Even when some were plugged with leaves , some were not , as the ceder deck covered some of the drains. The house was 25' x 30'  55 foot tall with 42" parapets.
              >
              >  One thing I have noticed so far with the LVL is , the band area around the floor trusses , must be very tight and closed cell foam insulated.My basement floor has been very wet , until I sealed off the above area. The same could apply to the roof trusses unless you use a one pc. membrane. that covers the roof , and the parapet , with a metal cap sloping to the outside. Beside , the truss area is prone to heat loss. Close cell foam will solve the problem.
              >
              >   My current LVL does not have a rear parapet and has a 2" slope. Still makes the house roof use able , with railing. However , I did what I did , to save costs , and meet snow load requirements in Marquette County. Now , I am faced with a gutter set up on the rear 60'. Not sure what I will " invent" , but , it will not be ordinary ..
              >
              > --- On Wed, 7/1/09, Dennis Whittle <dbw001@...> wrote:
              >
              > From: Dennis Whittle <dbw001@...>
              > Subject: [LVHomeFans] Re:Seeking more roof drainage info
              > To: LVHomeFans@yahoogroups.com
              > Date: Wednesday, July 1, 2009, 4:03 PM
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > In my view, there is an inherent design flaw behind flat roofs with
              >
              > parapets because of the danger of the drains clogging. There
              >
              > absolutely, positively, needs to be an emergency overflow. The cost
              >
              > of this overflow is low compared to the damage that could be caused by
              >
              > roof collapse.
              >
              >
              >
              > In our case, we have a weekend home in the woods in WV, and the
              >
              > clogging is caused by leaves and those helicopter seeds. We have to
              >
              > clean the roof drains many times per year, which exceeds any
              >
              > definition of normal maintenance. We have had several episodes of
              >
              > leakage through the inside of the external wall into the basement
              >
              > because of a failure either of the membrane or the seal around the
              >
              > scuppers when the water backs up. We have not been able to pinpoint
              >
              > the exact cause. Most recently, we have noticed drywall and paint
              >
              > damage on the inside of the house. Of course, the roof guys blame the
              >
              > contractor, who blames the designer, and on an on. This is making me
              >
              > very unhappy and could easily have been avoided in the design stage.
              >
            • lvminime
              Ethan, thanks so much for the link. I am assuming, but you can confirm, that you will not have a screen or other on the scupper and that it will extend some
              Message 6 of 13 , Jul 8, 2009
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                Ethan, thanks so much for the link. I am assuming, but you can confirm, that you will not have a screen or other on the scupper and that it will extend some dimension beyond the LV to prevent water running down the metal skin or blowing back too easily. How far out do you think you will need to go? Lastly, where do you expect to place the scuppers in relationship to the 12" basket? Just above or elsewhere.

                Also, thank you to those suggesting the Duro. . . product. Luminhaus certainly faces the sort of trees we do (and is just lovely, FYI). Our GC is following up with certified installer in Maine.



                --- In LVHomeFans@yahoogroups.com, "Ethan" <sfh33@...> wrote:
                >
                > Our LVL is complete and our roof does relatively well with 12" basket filters added to the standard scupper design (see earlier post from me with link to image of custom fab baskets). I'm considering adding overflow scuppers that pass through the parapet walls similar to those I featured here:
                > http://www.bbsheetmetal.com/downspout-scuppers/index.html
                >
                > These would be placed on the short walls adjacent to the existing in-wall scuppers.
              • Dar Kuehl
                In general , I think the problems with plugged scuppers is mostly due to there being only 2 of them.  Can you imagine a Boat the size of an LVL with only 2
                Message 7 of 13 , Jul 8, 2009
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                  In general , I think the problems with plugged scuppers is mostly due to there being only 2 of them.  Can you imagine a Boat the size of an LVL with only 2 scuppers ? Again , not rocket science.

                  --- On Wed, 7/8/09, lvminime <jdl@...> wrote:

                  From: lvminime <jdl@...>
                  Subject: [LVHomeFans] Re:Seeking more roof drainage info
                  To: LVHomeFans@yahoogroups.com
                  Date: Wednesday, July 8, 2009, 7:36 AM

                  Ethan, thanks so much for the link. I am assuming, but you can confirm, that you will not have a screen or other on the scupper and that it will extend some dimension beyond the LV to prevent water running down the metal skin or blowing back too easily. How far out do you think you will need to go? Lastly, where do you expect to place the scuppers in relationship to the 12" basket? Just above or elsewhere.

                  Also, thank you to those suggesting the Duro. . . product. Luminhaus certainly faces the sort of trees we do (and is just lovely, FYI). Our GC is following up with certified installer in Maine.

                  --- In LVHomeFans@yahoogro ups.com, "Ethan" <sfh33@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > Our LVL is complete and our roof does relatively well with 12" basket filters added to the standard scupper design (see earlier post from me with link to image of custom fab baskets). I'm considering adding overflow scuppers that pass through the parapet walls similar to those I featured here:
                  > http://www.bbsheetm etal.com/ downspout- scuppers/ index.html
                  >
                  > These would be placed on the short walls adjacent to the existing in-wall scuppers.

                • Steve Rapport
                  Ethan, you used the Fry Reglet reveals, correct? Any comments, suggestions, photos? Thanks, Steve
                  Message 8 of 13 , Jul 8, 2009
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                    Ethan, you used the Fry Reglet reveals, correct? Any comments, suggestions, photos?

                    Thanks,

                    Steve

                    On Jul 7, 2009, at 6:25 PM, Ethan wrote:



                    Our LVL is complete and our roof does relatively well with 12" basket filters added to the standard scupper design (see earlier post from me with link to image of custom fab baskets). I'm considering adding overflow scuppers that pass through the parapet walls similar to those I featured here:
                    http://www.bbsheetm etal.com/ downspout- scuppers/ index.html

                    These would be placed on the short walls adjacent to the existing in-wall scuppers.

                    --- In LVHomeFans@yahoogro ups.com, Dar Kuehl <darkuehl@.. .> wrote:
                    >
                    > You did not state what kind of membrane was used. Also , if you read my testimonial , I think 20 plus years with no leaks , and a usable roof speaks for itself. My house had 6 scuppers . Even when some were plugged with leaves , some were not , as the ceder deck covered some of the drains. The house was 25' x 30'  55 foot tall with 42" parapets.
                    > 
                    >  One thing I have noticed so far with the LVL is , the band area around the floor trusses , must be very tight and closed cell foam insulated.My basement floor has been very wet , until I sealed off the above area. The same could apply to the roof trusses unless you use a one pc. membrane. that covers the roof , and the parapet , with a metal cap sloping to the outside. Beside , the truss area is prone to heat loss. Close cell foam will solve the problem.
                    > 
                    >   My current LVL does not have a rear parapet and has a 2" slope. Still makes the house roof use able , with railing. However , I did what I did , to save costs , and meet snow load requirements in Marquette County. Now , I am faced with a gutter set up on the rear 60'. Not sure what I will " invent" , but , it will not be ordinary ..
                    > 
                    > --- On Wed, 7/1/09, Dennis Whittle <dbw001@...> wrote:
                    > 
                    > From: Dennis Whittle <dbw001@...>
                    > Subject: [LVHomeFans] Re:Seeking more roof drainage info
                    > To: LVHomeFans@yahoogro ups.com
                    > Date: Wednesday, July 1, 2009, 4:03 PM
                    > 
                    > 
                    > 
                    > 
                    > 
                    > 
                    > 
                    > 
                    > 
                    > 
                    > 
                    > 
                    > 
                    > 
                    > 
                    > 
                    > 
                    > In my view, there is an inherent design flaw behind flat roofs with 
                    > 
                    > parapets because of the danger of the drains clogging. There 
                    > 
                    > absolutely, positively, needs to be an emergency overflow. The cost 
                    > 
                    > of this overflow is low compared to the damage that could be caused by 
                    > 
                    > roof collapse.
                    > 
                    > 
                    > 
                    > In our case, we have a weekend home in the woods in WV, and the 
                    > 
                    > clogging is caused by leaves and those helicopter seeds. We have to 
                    > 
                    > clean the roof drains many times per year, which exceeds any 
                    > 
                    > definition of normal maintenance. We have had several episodes of 
                    > 
                    > leakage through the inside of the external wall into the basement 
                    > 
                    > because of a failure either of the membrane or the seal around the 
                    > 
                    > scuppers when the water backs up. We have not been able to pinpoint 
                    > 
                    > the exact cause. Most recently, we have noticed drywall and paint 
                    > 
                    > damage on the inside of the house. Of course, the roof guys blame the 
                    > 
                    > contractor, who blames the designer, and on an on. This is making me 
                    > 
                    > very unhappy and could easily have been avoided in the design stage.
                    >


                  • Ethan
                    We actually went with a combination reveal and baseboard. Because we have younger kids and dogs, I was concerned that the low drywall edge would be too fragile
                    Message 9 of 13 , Jul 10, 2009
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                      We actually went with a combination reveal and baseboard. Because we have younger kids and dogs, I was concerned that the low drywall edge would be too fragile for the occasional bump. As it is, we've had some maintenance on the reveals where furniture or toys have struck the wall--but the baseboard has absorbed a lot of the rough stuff. The baseboard is basically flush with the plane of the sheetrock with a 1/2" reveal gap above it.

                      --- In LVHomeFans@yahoogroups.com, Steve Rapport <steverapport@...> wrote:
                      >
                      > Ethan, you used the Fry Reglet reveals, correct? Any comments,
                      > suggestions, photos?
                      >
                      > Thanks,
                      >
                      > Steve
                      >
                      > On Jul 7, 2009, at 6:25 PM, Ethan wrote:
                      >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > > Our LVL is complete and our roof does relatively well with 12"
                      > > basket filters added to the standard scupper design (see earlier
                      > > post from me with link to image of custom fab baskets). I'm
                      > > considering adding overflow scuppers that pass through the parapet
                      > > walls similar to those I featured here:
                      > > http://www.bbsheetmetal.com/downspout-scuppers/index.html
                      > >
                      > > These would be placed on the short walls adjacent to the existing in-
                      > > wall scuppers.
                      > >
                      > > --- In LVHomeFans@yahoogroups.com, Dar Kuehl <darkuehl@> wrote:
                      > > >
                      > > > You did not state what kind of membrane was used. Also , if you
                      > > read my testimonial , I think 20 plus years with no leaks , and a
                      > > usable roof speaks for itself. My house had 6 scuppers . Even when
                      > > some were plugged with leaves , some were not , as the ceder deck
                      > > covered some of the drains. The house was 25' x 30' 55 foot tall
                      > > with 42" parapets.
                      > > >
                      > > > One thing I have noticed so far with the LVL is , the band area
                      > > around the floor trusses , must be very tight and closed cell foam
                      > > insulated.My basement floor has been very wet , until I sealed off
                      > > the above area. The same could apply to the roof trusses unless you
                      > > use a one pc. membrane. that covers the roof , and the parapet ,
                      > > with a metal cap sloping to the outside. Beside , the truss area is
                      > > prone to heat loss. Close cell foam will solve the problem.
                      > > >
                      > > > My current LVL does not have a rear parapet and has a 2" slope.
                      > > Still makes the house roof use able , with railing. However , I did
                      > > what I did , to save costs , and meet snow load requirements in
                      > > Marquette County. Now , I am faced with a gutter set up on the rear
                      > > 60'. Not sure what I will " invent" , but , it will not be ordinary ..
                      > > >
                      > > > --- On Wed, 7/1/09, Dennis Whittle <dbw001@> wrote:
                      > > >
                      > > > From: Dennis Whittle <dbw001@>
                      > > > Subject: [LVHomeFans] Re:Seeking more roof drainage info
                      > > > To: LVHomeFans@yahoogroups.com
                      > > > Date: Wednesday, July 1, 2009, 4:03 PM
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > In my view, there is an inherent design flaw behind flat roofs with
                      > > >
                      > > > parapets because of the danger of the drains clogging. There
                      > > >
                      > > > absolutely, positively, needs to be an emergency overflow. The cost
                      > > >
                      > > > of this overflow is low compared to the damage that could be
                      > > caused by
                      > > >
                      > > > roof collapse.
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > In our case, we have a weekend home in the woods in WV, and the
                      > > >
                      > > > clogging is caused by leaves and those helicopter seeds. We have to
                      > > >
                      > > > clean the roof drains many times per year, which exceeds any
                      > > >
                      > > > definition of normal maintenance. We have had several episodes of
                      > > >
                      > > > leakage through the inside of the external wall into the basement
                      > > >
                      > > > because of a failure either of the membrane or the seal around the
                      > > >
                      > > > scuppers when the water backs up. We have not been able to pinpoint
                      > > >
                      > > > the exact cause. Most recently, we have noticed drywall and paint
                      > > >
                      > > > damage on the inside of the house. Of course, the roof guys blame
                      > > the
                      > > >
                      > > > contractor, who blames the designer, and on an on. This is making me
                      > > >
                      > > > very unhappy and could easily have been avoided in the design stage.
                      > > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      >
                    • Dar Kuehl
                        In my basement area I am considering using hydronic baseboard as a heat source. The two runs of Pex tubing have an aluminum cover. I made the mistake of
                      Message 10 of 13 , Jul 13, 2009
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                          In my basement area I am considering using " hydronic baseboard " as a heat source. The two runs of Pex tubing have an aluminum cover. I made the mistake of not embedding the tubing in the wet concrete , so... this will be my fix. Anyone out there used this type of product ?

                        --- On Fri, 7/10/09, Ethan <sfh33@...> wrote:

                        From: Ethan <sfh33@...>
                        Subject: [LVHomeFans] Re:Seeking more roof drainage info
                        To: LVHomeFans@yahoogroups.com
                        Date: Friday, July 10, 2009, 11:13 PM

                        We actually went with a combination reveal and baseboard. Because we have younger kids and dogs, I was concerned that the low drywall edge would be too fragile for the occasional bump. As it is, we've had some maintenance on the reveals where furniture or toys have struck the wall--but the baseboard has absorbed a lot of the rough stuff. The baseboard is basically flush with the plane of the sheetrock with a 1/2" reveal gap above it.

                        --- In LVHomeFans@yahoogro ups.com, Steve Rapport <steverapport@ ...> wrote:
                        >
                        > Ethan, you used the Fry Reglet reveals, correct? Any comments,
                        > suggestions, photos?
                        >
                        > Thanks,
                        >
                        > Steve
                        >
                        > On Jul 7, 2009, at 6:25 PM, Ethan wrote:
                        >
                        > >
                        > >
                        > > Our LVL is complete and our roof does relatively well with 12"
                        > > basket filters added to the standard scupper design (see earlier
                        > > post from me with link to image of custom fab baskets). I'm
                        > > considering adding overflow scuppers that pass through the parapet
                        > > walls similar to those I featured here:
                        > > http://www.bbsheetm etal.com/ downspout- scuppers/ index.html
                        > >
                        > > These would be placed on the short walls adjacent to the existing in-
                        > > wall scuppers.
                        > >
                        > > --- In LVHomeFans@yahoogro ups.com, Dar Kuehl <darkuehl@> wrote:
                        > > >
                        > > > You did not state what kind of membrane was used. Also , if you
                        > > read my testimonial , I think 20 plus years with no leaks , and a
                        > > usable roof speaks for itself. My house had 6 scuppers . Even when
                        > > some were plugged with leaves , some were not , as the ceder deck
                        > > covered some of the drains. The house was 25' x 30' 55 foot tall
                        > > with 42" parapets.
                        > > >
                        > > > One thing I have noticed so far with the LVL is , the band area
                        > > around the floor trusses , must be very tight and closed cell foam
                        > > insulated.My basement floor has been very wet , until I sealed off
                        > > the above area. The same could apply to the roof trusses unless you
                        > > use a one pc. membrane. that covers the roof , and the parapet ,
                        > > with a metal cap sloping to the outside. Beside , the truss area is
                        > > prone to heat loss. Close cell foam will solve the problem.
                        > > >
                        > > > My current LVL does not have a rear parapet and has a 2" slope.
                        > > Still makes the house roof use able , with railing. However , I did
                        > > what I did , to save costs , and meet snow load requirements in
                        > > Marquette County. Now , I am faced with a gutter set up on the rear
                        > > 60'. Not sure what I will " invent" , but , it will not be ordinary ..
                        > > >
                        > > > --- On Wed, 7/1/09, Dennis Whittle <dbw001@> wrote:
                        > > >
                        > > > From: Dennis Whittle <dbw001@>
                        > > > Subject: [LVHomeFans] Re:Seeking more roof drainage info
                        > > > To: LVHomeFans@yahoogro ups.com
                        > > > Date: Wednesday, July 1, 2009, 4:03 PM
                        > > >
                        > > >
                        > > >
                        > > >
                        > > >
                        > > >
                        > > >
                        > > >
                        > > >
                        > > >
                        > > >
                        > > >
                        > > >
                        > > >
                        > > >
                        > > >
                        > > >
                        > > > In my view, there is an inherent design flaw behind flat roofs with
                        > > >
                        > > > parapets because of the danger of the drains clogging. There
                        > > >
                        > > > absolutely, positively, needs to be an emergency overflow. The cost
                        > > >
                        > > > of this overflow is low compared to the damage that could be
                        > > caused by
                        > > >
                        > > > roof collapse.
                        > > >
                        > > >
                        > > >
                        > > > In our case, we have a weekend home in the woods in WV, and the
                        > > >
                        > > > clogging is caused by leaves and those helicopter seeds. We have to
                        > > >
                        > > > clean the roof drains many times per year, which exceeds any
                        > > >
                        > > > definition of normal maintenance. We have had several episodes of
                        > > >
                        > > > leakage through the inside of the external wall into the basement
                        > > >
                        > > > because of a failure either of the membrane or the seal around the
                        > > >
                        > > > scuppers when the water backs up. We have not been able to pinpoint
                        > > >
                        > > > the exact cause. Most recently, we have noticed drywall and paint
                        > > >
                        > > > damage on the inside of the house. Of course, the roof guys blame
                        > > the
                        > > >
                        > > > contractor, who blames the designer, and on an on. This is making me
                        > > >
                        > > > very unhappy and could easily have been avoided in the design stage.
                        > > >
                        > >
                        > >
                        > >
                        >

                      • Steve Rapport
                        Thanks, Ethan. Do you have any photos of your baseboard? - Steve
                        Message 11 of 13 , Jul 14, 2009
                        • 0 Attachment
                          Thanks, Ethan. Do you have any photos of your baseboard?

                          - Steve

                          On Jul 10, 2009, at 8:13 PM, Ethan wrote:



                          We actually went with a combination reveal and baseboard. Because we have younger kids and dogs, I was concerned that the low drywall edge would be too fragile for the occasional bump. As it is, we've had some maintenance on the reveals where furniture or toys have struck the wall--but the baseboard has absorbed a lot of the rough stuff. The baseboard is basically flush with the plane of the sheetrock with a 1/2" reveal gap above it.

                          --- In LVHomeFans@yahoogro ups.com, Steve Rapport <steverapport@ ...> wrote:
                          >
                          > Ethan, you used the Fry Reglet reveals, correct? Any comments, 
                          > suggestions, photos?
                          > 
                          > Thanks,
                          > 
                          > Steve
                          > 
                          > On Jul 7, 2009, at 6:25 PM, Ethan wrote:
                          > 
                          > >
                          > >
                          > > Our LVL is complete and our roof does relatively well with 12" 
                          > > basket filters added to the standard scupper design (see earlier 
                          > > post from me with link to image of custom fab baskets). I'm 
                          > > considering adding overflow scuppers that pass through the parapet 
                          > > walls similar to those I featured here:
                          > > http://www.bbsheetm etal.com/ downspout- scuppers/ index.html
                          > >
                          > > These would be placed on the short walls adjacent to the existing in- 
                          > > wall scuppers.
                          > >
                          > > --- In LVHomeFans@yahoogro ups.com, Dar Kuehl <darkuehl@> wrote:
                          > > >
                          > > > You did not state what kind of membrane was used. Also , if you 
                          > > read my testimonial , I think 20 plus years with no leaks , and a 
                          > > usable roof speaks for itself. My house had 6 scuppers . Even when 
                          > > some were plugged with leaves , some were not , as the ceder deck 
                          > > covered some of the drains. The house was 25' x 30' 55 foot tall 
                          > > with 42" parapets.
                          > > >
                          > > > One thing I have noticed so far with the LVL is , the band area 
                          > > around the floor trusses , must be very tight and closed cell foam 
                          > > insulated.My basement floor has been very wet , until I sealed off 
                          > > the above area. The same could apply to the roof trusses unless you 
                          > > use a one pc. membrane. that covers the roof , and the parapet , 
                          > > with a metal cap sloping to the outside. Beside , the truss area is 
                          > > prone to heat loss. Close cell foam will solve the problem.
                          > > >
                          > > > My current LVL does not have a rear parapet and has a 2" slope. 
                          > > Still makes the house roof use able , with railing. However , I did 
                          > > what I did , to save costs , and meet snow load requirements in 
                          > > Marquette County. Now , I am faced with a gutter set up on the rear 
                          > > 60'. Not sure what I will " invent" , but , it will not be ordinary ..
                          > > >
                          > > > --- On Wed, 7/1/09, Dennis Whittle <dbw001@> wrote:
                          > > >
                          > > > From: Dennis Whittle <dbw001@>
                          > > > Subject: [LVHomeFans] Re:Seeking more roof drainage info
                          > > > To: LVHomeFans@yahoogro ups.com
                          > > > Date: Wednesday, July 1, 2009, 4:03 PM
                          > > >
                          > > >
                          > > >
                          > > >
                          > > >
                          > > >
                          > > >
                          > > >
                          > > >
                          > > >
                          > > >
                          > > >
                          > > >
                          > > >
                          > > >
                          > > >
                          > > >
                          > > > In my view, there is an inherent design flaw behind flat roofs with
                          > > >
                          > > > parapets because of the danger of the drains clogging. There
                          > > >
                          > > > absolutely, positively, needs to be an emergency overflow. The cost
                          > > >
                          > > > of this overflow is low compared to the damage that could be 
                          > > caused by
                          > > >
                          > > > roof collapse.
                          > > >
                          > > >
                          > > >
                          > > > In our case, we have a weekend home in the woods in WV, and the
                          > > >
                          > > > clogging is caused by leaves and those helicopter seeds. We have to
                          > > >
                          > > > clean the roof drains many times per year, which exceeds any
                          > > >
                          > > > definition of normal maintenance. We have had several episodes of
                          > > >
                          > > > leakage through the inside of the external wall into the basement
                          > > >
                          > > > because of a failure either of the membrane or the seal around the
                          > > >
                          > > > scuppers when the water backs up. We have not been able to pinpoint
                          > > >
                          > > > the exact cause. Most recently, we have noticed drywall and paint
                          > > >
                          > > > damage on the inside of the house. Of course, the roof guys blame 
                          > > the
                          > > >
                          > > > contractor, who blames the designer, and on an on. This is making me
                          > > >
                          > > > very unhappy and could easily have been avoided in the design stage.
                          > > >
                          > >
                          > >
                          > >
                          >


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