Re: [LINUX_Newbies] Top posting controversy - again?!!
- Ok, the camels back has been broken. I am completely sick of elitist
behavior, and unfortunately the Linux community seems to be made up of
predominantly elitists. So with that, bye-bye.
> On Sat, Aug 01, 2009 at 02:19:04AM -0000, Gary wrote:
> > People in the "stop servies via telnet" thread have been getting
> unacceptably rude to each other, and certain adherents of the
> no-top-posting "rule" are taking the lack of action by any mods as
> tacit approval for their bad attitudes. Consider, people, how d*mn few
> mods (and fewer ACTIVE mods) this Y!Group actually has -- and how
> hands-off they usually are. Because we are *usually* civilized to each
> other. Statements like "I'm right because the mod hasn't intervened"
> serve no purpose but making one look like a total fool.
> Hrrm. Ok, for the record, this group only has one moderator, with
> limited powers. That's all there is, and it isn't me.
> I really don't care how people post--I answer questions if I know the
> answer, or feel I can send them to a reasonable solution. When I do, I
> usually tell them that it's better to not top post.
> Can I scroll down? Sure. If you are asking me a question, should I
> have to be bothered? No.
> Really folks, you can all do what you want--there aren't any rules on
> this list. As I said, when the Linux@yahoo list was brought up, folks
> who don't follow what is accepted netiquette are simply ignored, and
> their posts don't appear. Actually, that's not the best way, but
> moderators have lives and don't get paid.
> Had I realized that my reply would start a whole new round of things, I
> would have simply ignored the OP's post. Whether my answer helped them
> or not, I don't know, as that's another thing one tends to see on this
> list, most people only come back when the answer didn't help them, and
> sometimes they feel it's impolite to say that they got no help, so we
> don't even hear from them then.
> > To those who want to claim they're just standing up for "The Rules"?
> Look at the phrasing of the netiquette text in our Files section, it
> only says this is how "most" forums do it, never specifying (except
> through implication by its very presence) that it is The Rule for THIS
> Actually, no one claimed that. People who spoke in favor of proper
> posting said it is the accepted way to do it. This list seems to only
> get active when a bikeshed discussion (see
> <http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en/books/faq/misc.html#BIKESHED-PAINTING> )
> like this begins.
> So, folks, I'm out of this discussion. I would strongly suggest though,
> that if you folks do move on to more technical lists, you take the time
> to read http://linuxmafia.com/faq/Essays/smart-questions.html
> <http://linuxmafia.com/faq/Essays/smart-questions.html> titled how
> to ask questions the smart way.
> So folks, do what you want. If you want the more experienced people to
> look at your questions, you are better off following my our
> recommendations about posting in line, looking at the list faq's
> netiquette section and looking at some of the other links there as well.
> Or don't. It's really no problem for me if you don't.
> It's really one of those, "Whatever," type things. This isn't my list,
> I don't rule it. Judging from the questions I see on this list, I do
> suspect I have more knowledge and experience than most of the folks
> asking questions, but perhaps I flatter myself.
> Scott Robbins
> PGP keyID EB3467D6
> ( 1B48 077D 66F6 9DB0 FDC2 A409 FA54 EB34 67D6 )
> gpg --keyserver pgp.mit.edu --recv-keys EB3467D6
> Gunn: Fair Cordelia. You still savin' my life?
> Cordelia: Every minute.
> Gunn: How's that workin' out?
> Cordelia: You're alive aren't you?
- "I must be right because the mods haven't stopped me?" What kind of ridiculousness is this?
Those of you arguing about such pettiness--don't you have anything better to do?
Personally, I use Linux fairly constantly, but not often in a terribly technical mode. I read the list sporadically, and if there is a question I actually may know something about, I respond. I may also from time to time ask a question.
However, I have far too many better things to do than to engage in trivial pursuits such as this.
I have been a list owner or moderator for many years--presently down to moderating only two. A list I started and owned for four years had 18,000 members and at one time during my tenure it had between two and four hundred posts per day. The more active list I moderate now has only about 25 to 30 posts on an average day...so I have had at least some experience with all this many times.
That means I simply don't care for the pettiness and name calling over inconsequential crap. Life is just too short.
If the goal of you folks who just can't restrain yourselves from this childishness is to run many people off the list, continue doing what you've been doing.
If your goal is to actually try to build a useful community, then for God's sake stop the juvenile behavior and act like adults for a change.
- Personally, for me it depends on the situation, and the original
message has been replied to, and I have been part of the conversation,
I tend to top post. The gist of the converstation has been read and
reread several times. How many times does one need to read a message
to understand it? In those cases a reader can scroll down to get the
original content if they need it. The rule is an archaic one from the
days before scroll rollers, and slider bars. Much like some mailing
lists that one want straight text, because someone is using a 20 year
old mail reader that can't handle hyper text.
If a person prefers one or the other, great. Do it that way. What is
important to me is your insight and knowledge. Not where you put it.
If you prefer to bottom post, I'll probably scroll down and find it.
Put it in the middle, that's fine. Whatever, but I'm not going to
have a screaming hissy-fit meltdown over it.
On Fri, Jul 31, 2009 at 9:19 PM, Gary<xheralt@...> wrote:
> People in the "stop servies via telnet" thread have been getting
> unacceptably rude to each other, and certain adherents of the no-top-posting
> "rule" are taking the lack of action by any mods as tacit approval for their
> bad attitudes. Consider, people, how d*mn few mods (and fewer ACTIVE mods)
> this Y!Group actually has -- and how hands-off they usually are. Because we
> are *usually* civilized to each other. Statements like "I'm right because
> the mod hasn't intervened" serve no purpose but making one look like a total
> To those who want to claim they're just standing up for "The Rules"? Look at
> the phrasing of the netiquette text in our Files section, it only says this
> is how "most" forums do it, never specifying (except through implication by
> its very presence) that it is The Rule for THIS forum.
> Besides, it's a stupid and petty rule anyway. I feel sorry for anyone who
> feels it's beneath them to actually use scrolling controls on their screens.
> This Y!Group sucks for general use, because of the primitiveness of the
> default editing controls, and the inconsistency of the "advanced" rich-text
> editing available in the web interface. If someone takes the path of least
> resistance and top-posts, it's NOT the end of the frakkin' world, and people
> need to realize that!
Oh look, I top posted... I feel so... so... so... FREE!
For those of you with the OCD, you know whom you are, as you really
want to flame the top posting here. (Or did you not get this far
because you assume I only top posted... :-)
You really should see someone about that. Your life, and your
internet experience, will be happier.