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RE: [KL] PC88mx Amplifier/Monitor Recommendation

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  • Laurence Payne
    Good day all. I have an old PC88mx and a child that will soon use it to take piano lessons. I m not a musician - nor do I have any meaningful knowledge about
    Message 1 of 10 , Jul 1, 2012
      Good day all. I have an old PC88mx and a child that will soon use it to take
      piano lessons. I'm not a musician - nor do I have any meaningful knowledge
      about musical equipment. I'm a little confused as to whether I should be
      buying a keyboard amplifier (IE: Behringer ULTRATONE KT108) or a pair of
      speakers (IE: Behringer MS16). Any suggestions/input from you pro's would be
      very valuable to me - thanks!


      >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

      Both will make noise. Both are under-sized and under-powered for the very
      demanding dynamic range of a piano sound - i.e. at even moderate volumes you
      will be in danger of distortion on a note's attack.

      The other reply was good advice. Run it into your hi-fi (any analogue input
      EXCEPT "phono" will be good) and get a feeling for what size speakers make
      what size sound! The headphones for practice idea is also excellent.
    • Roger J
      Headphones. ... [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      Message 2 of 10 , Jul 1, 2012
        Headphones.




        >________________________________
        > From: glenn_butkerait <glenn@...>
        >To: KurzList@yahoogroups.com
        >Sent: Saturday, June 30, 2012 5:27 PM
        >Subject: [KL] PC88mx Amplifier/Monitor Recommendation
        >
        >

        >Good day all. I have an old PC88mx and a child that will soon use it to take piano lessons. I'm not a musician - nor do I have any meaningful knowledge about musical equipment. I'm a little confused as to whether I should be buying a keyboard amplifier (IE: Behringer ULTRATONE KT108) or a pair of speakers (IE: Behringer MS16). Any suggestions/input from you pro's would be very valuable to me - thanks!
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >

        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Dave Halliday
        A student working with a teacher? Practice definitely!!! Dave
        Message 3 of 10 , Jul 2, 2012
          A student working with a teacher?

          Practice definitely!!!

          Dave


          > -----Original Message-----
          > From: KurzList@yahoogroups.com
          > [mailto:KurzList@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Roger J
          > Sent: Sunday, July 01, 2012 23:53
          > To: KurzList@yahoogroups.com
          > Subject: Re: [KL] PC88mx Amplifier/Monitor Recommendation
          >
          > Headphones.
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > >________________________________
          > > From: glenn_butkerait <glenn@...>
          > >To: KurzList@yahoogroups.com
          > >Sent: Saturday, June 30, 2012 5:27 PM
          > >Subject: [KL] PC88mx Amplifier/Monitor Recommendation
          > >
          > >
          > > 
          > >Good day all. I have an old PC88mx and a child that will
          > soon use it to take piano lessons. I'm not a musician - nor
          > do I have any meaningful knowledge about musical equipment.
          > I'm a little confused as to whether I should be buying a
          > keyboard amplifier (IE: Behringer ULTRATONE KT108) or a pair
          > of speakers (IE: Behringer MS16). Any suggestions/input from
          > you pro's would be very valuable to me - thanks!
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          >
          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          >
          >
          >
          > ------------------------------------
          >
          > To QUIT KurzList, send a *blank* message to
          > kurzlist-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
          > It will take from 24 to 48 hours for Yahoo!Groups to cancel
          > you.Yahoo! Groups Links
          >
          >
          >
        • voxdestrukt
          You will need both an amplifier and speakers if you want to hear the audio out loud with your child. The amplifier drives the speakers. You can buy powered
          Message 4 of 10 , Jul 2, 2012
            You will need both an amplifier and speakers if you want to hear the audio out loud with your child. The amplifier drives the speakers.

            You can buy powered studio monitors that already have the amp built into the speakers. I would recommend this option. Behringer B2031A Truth's are pretty great for the price. They are heavy for their size (35lbs. per speaker!). There's a ton of studio monitors to choose from. try ebay.

            You will also need audio cables to go from your keyboard into the amplifier (or monitors), and cables to go from your amplifier to the speakers.

            Here's the simple example:

            Kurzweil Stereo Out (L and R) to Amplifier: One 1/4" TRS cable for left to amp, and another 1/4" TRS cable for right to amp.

            Amplifier to Speakers (L and R): One 1/4" TRS cable for left to speaker, and another 1/4" TRS cable for right to speaker.

            So that's 4 cables total, the amplifier, and the speakers. This is commonly known as a PA system and can be used for anything from keyboards to home stereo, dj, etc. As you can see, these components add up to a good bit of cash. So, since you may be investing that way, you may want to consider the quality of speaker and amplifier at that point. There are plenty to choose from at different price points and quality.

            If cost is an issue, then yes, headphones will work fine for a single user. If you need headphones for both you and the child for simultaneous listening, then you will also need a headphone amplifier with more than one headphone output (Behringer makes those too), and another set of headphones, of course. Don't try and split the headphones from the single headphone out as it can't drive two pair of headphones like that very well. There are also plenty of headphones to choose from at different price points. I deal with a lot of audio, so I have studio monitors and a couple different kinds of headphones in the $100 to $200 price range. One pair has comfortable ear cups for prolonged listening and sound good too, but are digital and will clip sometimes at higher volumes. Then I have Pioneer HDJ-1000's. They are loud! they sound great too. But, are not suited for prolonged use because they will start to hurt your ears with both the volume capacity and the feel of the ear cups. The are made for use with DJ'ing, but are perfectly suited as studio grade headphones.

            Of course, you could alwways just buy a pair of $15 cheapo headphones at Walmart. It just depends on your budget and interest in the quality of sound.

            Good luck to you.



            --- In KurzList@yahoogroups.com, "Dave Halliday" <dh@...> wrote:
            >
            > A student working with a teacher?
            >
            > Practice definitely!!!
            >
            > Dave
            >
            >
            > > -----Original Message-----
            > > From: KurzList@yahoogroups.com
            > > [mailto:KurzList@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Roger J
            > > Sent: Sunday, July 01, 2012 23:53
            > > To: KurzList@yahoogroups.com
            > > Subject: Re: [KL] PC88mx Amplifier/Monitor Recommendation
            > >
            > > Headphones.
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > > >________________________________
            > > > From: glenn_butkerait <glenn@...>
            > > >To: KurzList@yahoogroups.com
            > > >Sent: Saturday, June 30, 2012 5:27 PM
            > > >Subject: [KL] PC88mx Amplifier/Monitor Recommendation
            > > >
            > > >
            > > > 
            > > >Good day all. I have an old PC88mx and a child that will
            > > soon use it to take piano lessons. I'm not a musician - nor
            > > do I have any meaningful knowledge about musical equipment.
            > > I'm a little confused as to whether I should be buying a
            > > keyboard amplifier (IE: Behringer ULTRATONE KT108) or a pair
            > > of speakers (IE: Behringer MS16). Any suggestions/input from
            > > you pro's would be very valuable to me - thanks!
            > > >
            > > >
            > > >
            > > >
            > > >
            > >
            > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > > ------------------------------------
            > >
            > > To QUIT KurzList, send a *blank* message to
            > > kurzlist-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
            > > It will take from 24 to 48 hours for Yahoo!Groups to cancel
            > > you.Yahoo! Groups Links
            > >
            > >
            > >
            >
          • Daniel Forró
            ... Standard mono cables are enough, not necessary to use TRS jacks. Of course only in the case amp has jack inputs which is not always so - home systems have
            Message 5 of 10 , Jul 2, 2012
              On Jul 2, 2012, at 5:28 PM, voxdestrukt wrote:

              > Kurzweil Stereo Out (L and R) to Amplifier: One 1/4" TRS cable for
              > left to amp, and another 1/4" TRS cable for right to amp.

              Standard mono cables are enough, not necessary to use TRS jacks. Of
              course only in the case amp has jack inputs which is not always so -
              home systems have often RCA connectors, then use jack/RCA cables, or
              jack female/RCA male reduction.
              >
              > Amplifier to Speakers (L and R): One 1/4" TRS cable for left to
              > speaker, and another 1/4" TRS cable for right to speaker.

              Again - not always the case, there's more possibilities what's on amp
              output to speakers...

              Daniel Forro
            • Laurence Payne
              ... Standard mono cables are enough, not necessary to use TRS jacks. Of course only in the case amp has jack inputs which is not always so - home systems have
              Message 6 of 10 , Jul 2, 2012
                > Kurzweil Stereo Out (L and R) to Amplifier: One 1/4" TRS cable for
                > left to amp, and another 1/4" TRS cable for right to amp.

                Standard mono cables are enough, not necessary to use TRS jacks. Of course
                only in the case amp has jack inputs which is not always so - home systems
                have often RCA connectors, then use jack/RCA cables, or jack female/RCA male
                reduction.
                >
                > Amplifier to Speakers (L and R): One 1/4" TRS cable for left to
                > speaker, and another 1/4" TRS cable for right to speaker.

                >>>>>>>>>>>>>>

                Yes, I'm afraid there was quite a lot of misinformation in voxdestrukt's
                reply! (sorry) There's the headphone advice as well. No point in slating a
                pair for being too loud - what's stopping you turning them down? Some
                devices will run two sets of headphones perfectly well through a simple
                splitter (though it's a good idea to use similar models of headphone). And
                what is a "digital" headphone?

                One point that doesn't seem to have been made is that the Behringer
                ULTRATONE KT108 mentioned (an amp/speaker combo) is mono. One of the factors
                that makes listening to an electronic instrument tolerable is the
                quasi-stereo effect from running the L & R outputs to two speakers.
                an
                TRS cables are unnecessary for an amplifier-speaker connection. But my
                experience of the Kurzweil PC2 and PC3 models is that the volume from an
                unbalanced connection is MUCH lower than when using a TRS into a balanced
                input. I don't know if this is also a quirk of the PC88mx. It doesn't
                apply to any of my non-Kurzweil keyboards. But if your amp HAS a balanced
                input, it's worth trying a TRS cable from a Kurzweil!
              • voxdestrukt
                Whatever Larry. The information I provided is correct and valid to the requester. There is nothing misinforming about it. They are simply looking for options
                Message 7 of 10 , Jul 2, 2012
                  Whatever Larry. The information I provided is correct and valid to the requester. There is nothing misinforming about it. They are simply looking for options for listening to music with their child. You added some additional points in regards to balanced or unbalanced and plug types. Fine, that info may be helpful when deciding the components and their use. But, in fact, 1/4" TRS cables will work in both balanced and unbalanced 1/4" systems just fine. So, what is the 'misinformation' I am spreading that you are referring to? Or, is that just some a$$ remark, because you're just cool like that?

                  I'm not slating the headphones I use. I obviously bought them for their output rating and quality. I am saying in my post that there are several types of phones to choose from that range in quality and price, and that the requester should decide based on their budget or interest in making music with their kid.

                  Digital Headphones... Google it!

                  Now, apologize for yourself. What an ass.



                  --- In KurzList@yahoogroups.com, "Laurence Payne" <lp@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > > Kurzweil Stereo Out (L and R) to Amplifier: One 1/4" TRS cable for
                  > > left to amp, and another 1/4" TRS cable for right to amp.
                  >
                  > Standard mono cables are enough, not necessary to use TRS jacks. Of course
                  > only in the case amp has jack inputs which is not always so - home systems
                  > have often RCA connectors, then use jack/RCA cables, or jack female/RCA male
                  > reduction.
                  > >
                  > > Amplifier to Speakers (L and R): One 1/4" TRS cable for left to
                  > > speaker, and another 1/4" TRS cable for right to speaker.
                  >
                  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
                  >
                  > Yes, I'm afraid there was quite a lot of misinformation in voxdestrukt's
                  > reply! (sorry) There's the headphone advice as well. No point in slating a
                  > pair for being too loud - what's stopping you turning them down? Some
                  > devices will run two sets of headphones perfectly well through a simple
                  > splitter (though it's a good idea to use similar models of headphone). And
                  > what is a "digital" headphone?
                  >
                  > One point that doesn't seem to have been made is that the Behringer
                  > ULTRATONE KT108 mentioned (an amp/speaker combo) is mono. One of the factors
                  > that makes listening to an electronic instrument tolerable is the
                  > quasi-stereo effect from running the L & R outputs to two speakers.
                  > an
                  > TRS cables are unnecessary for an amplifier-speaker connection. But my
                  > experience of the Kurzweil PC2 and PC3 models is that the volume from an
                  > unbalanced connection is MUCH lower than when using a TRS into a balanced
                  > input. I don't know if this is also a quirk of the PC88mx. It doesn't
                  > apply to any of my non-Kurzweil keyboards. But if your amp HAS a balanced
                  > input, it's worth trying a TRS cable from a Kurzweil!
                  >
                • Laurence Payne
                  Digital Headphones... Google it! ... Yes, lots of (analogue) equipment, at all price levels, is labelled Digital . Sometimes you even get a gold-plated plug!
                  Message 8 of 10 , Jul 2, 2012
                    Digital Headphones... Google it!

                    >>>>>>>>>>>>>>

                    Yes, lots of (analogue) equipment, at all price levels, is labelled
                    "Digital". Sometimes you even get a gold-plated plug! Can you tell me what
                    it means?
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