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RE: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Poles or Czechs not listened to, because do not speak Russian?

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  • Barry Turner (Journalism)
    Lenarda This was not meant to be insulting to Poles and I am aware of the great contribution to culture that the Poles have made...especially Copernicus. I
    Message 1 of 22 , Dec 13, 2012
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      Lenarda

      This was not meant to be insulting to Poles and I am aware of the great contribution to culture that the Poles have made...especially Copernicus. I have extensively studied the history of Eastern Europe and the Slavs and a the spectacular contribution to culture, art and music that has come from that part of the world.
      It is very sad also that there is still a great deal of animosity between those who speak Slavic languages and much of this pre-dates, by many years the Soviet domination of Eastern Europe

      I assumed at the time that my Russian teacher had some sort of problem with Poland, as some Russians still do. Sadly many languages are now shadow of their former existences and in Britain we are used to hearing the worst kind of Polish almost everyday, where every other word is a swear word.
      By far the majority of Poles in the UK are younger generation who have arrived since Poland joined the EU. Most of the WW2 veterans are now dead and the younger generation have no interest in their forbears or for that matter Polish history.

      Barry


      -----Original Message-----
      From: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com on behalf of LenardaSzymczak
      Sent: Wed 12/12/2012 23:20
      To: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Poles or Czechs not listened to, because do not speak Russian?

      Barry, I personally find this insulting as I feel that Russian and Czech,
      being Slavic languages are but a shadow on the original and now existent
      Polish people and their language. We were the teachers of culture and
      education throughout Europe.

      Lenarda,

      Sydney, Australia

      From: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com]
      On Behalf Of Barry Turner (Journalism)
      Sent: Thursday, 13 December, 2012 10:03 AM
      To: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com; Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: RE: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Poland and Borderlands from 10 - 15th
      Century until WWII.





      Dear Each

      I have just been explaining to my new colleagues how important it was in
      training school to pronounce our Russian correctly. My tutor told me that if
      we incorrectly pronounced words or placed the stresses incorrectly that we
      would be mistaken for Poles or Czechs and not listened to.

      Does anyone have any experiences that support this view?

      Wah Geordies Man!

      Barry




      _,_._,___
    • LenardaSzymczak
      Dear Barry, I personally have no animosity towards the Russian people and respect them as they respect us and every other race on this earth, but I do not
      Message 2 of 22 , Dec 13, 2012
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        Dear Barry,

        I personally have no animosity towards the Russian people and respect them
        as they respect us and every other race on this earth, but I do not believe
        that any nationality should be put down and belittled. But what happened
        before WWII and after as a direct result of Soviet Repression/Oppression.
        This I will never forget or forgive, as so many innocents suffered, not only
        the Polish People but many others from different countries. My immediate
        family suffered under the hands of the Soviets, so I can comment with all
        truth on this subject.

        I live in Australia and as far as swearing goes, this is common to all
        nationalities, including persons of English decent. Blame the television
        and movies which made it fashionable.

        My mothers is 88 years old, very much Polish Blood and a survivor and
        veteran of WWII and believe me, the younger generation do have interest in
        what their families endured and there is a rebirth of Polish History, now
        especially after Poland regained its freedom and shed the puppet government,
        but even before this the exiles outside of Poland always had interest and
        pride in their heritage. I do not think that you understand the Polish
        Spirit?

        You are sending posts through KS group and do not see this, that the entire
        reason KS Group exists is because of the interest of the younger generation.
        Please take off your blindfold and open your eyes or perhaps you are looking
        in the wrong places.

        I ask you, as you have access to KS Group and records, that you go back and
        read all the posts and see how real and genuine is the interest of veterans,
        first generation, second generation and others forthcoming, before you make
        such open comments. It appears that your education is lacking.

        My apologies for being so blunt, but truly your journey of learning has only
        begun and I cannot and will not comment any further as this is a research
        you personally must undertake. Good luck.

        Lenarda,
        Sydney, Australia




        -----Original Message-----
        From: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com]
        On Behalf Of Barry Turner (Journalism)
        Sent: Thursday, 13 December, 2012 7:54 PM
        To: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: RE: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Poles or Czechs not listened to,
        because do not speak Russian?

        Lenarda

        This was not meant to be insulting to Poles and I am aware of the great
        contribution to culture that the Poles have made...especially Copernicus. I
        have extensively studied the history of Eastern Europe and the Slavs and a
        the spectacular contribution to culture, art and music that has come from
        that part of the world.
        It is very sad also that there is still a great deal of animosity between
        those who speak Slavic languages and much of this pre-dates, by many years
        the Soviet domination of Eastern Europe

        I assumed at the time that my Russian teacher had some sort of problem with
        Poland, as some Russians still do. Sadly many languages are now shadow of
        their former existences and in Britain we are used to hearing the worst kind
        of Polish almost everyday, where every other word is a swear word.
        By far the majority of Poles in the UK are younger generation who have
        arrived since Poland joined the EU. Most of the WW2 veterans are now dead
        and the younger generation have no interest in their forbears or for that
        matter Polish history.

        Barry


        -----Original Message-----
        From: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com on behalf of LenardaSzymczak
        Sent: Wed 12/12/2012 23:20
        To: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Poles or Czechs not listened to, because do
        not speak Russian?

        Barry, I personally find this insulting as I feel that Russian and Czech,
        being Slavic languages are but a shadow on the original and now existent
        Polish people and their language. We were the teachers of culture and
        education throughout Europe.

        Lenarda,

        Sydney, Australia

        From: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com]
        On Behalf Of Barry Turner (Journalism)
        Sent: Thursday, 13 December, 2012 10:03 AM
        To: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com; Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: RE: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Poland and Borderlands from 10 - 15th
        Century until WWII.





        Dear Each

        I have just been explaining to my new colleagues how important it was in
        training school to pronounce our Russian correctly. My tutor told me that if
        we incorrectly pronounced words or placed the stresses incorrectly that we
        would be mistaken for Poles or Czechs and not listened to.

        Does anyone have any experiences that support this view?

        Wah Geordies Man!

        Barry




        _,_._,___
      • Stanislaw Zwierzynski
        Dear Barry! Topic you raised is very interesting, but dangerous. Poor relations between Poland and Russia, unfortunately, reflected on cultural and
        Message 3 of 22 , Dec 13, 2012
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          Dear Barry!

          Topic you raised is very interesting, but dangerous.
          Poor relations between Poland and Russia, unfortunately, reflected on cultural and philological cooperation.

          For example, Moscow is almost impossible to learn Polish language - no courses. Those Polish language courses that exist at the Уmbassy - this is blasphemy.
          There are not taught, and bullied.

          Those who read these lines, can not believe me.
          But here's my little story.

          5-7 years ago, when was Poland President russophobe Kaczynski, my 15 year old daughter, realizing his Polish roots and having language skills (she was a good student in a specialized English school and knows English language), decided to go to Polish language courses
          at the Polish Embassy in Moscow.

          Hardly wrote there, and what she saw it there.
          All those, indiscriminately in age, prior knowledge, abilities, etc. crashed (batch) into groups.
          She was in group of people aged between 15 and 60 years, someone wanted to learn to say, someone has been focused on business, someone did Polish Charter, etc. - they all had a purpose.
          Then began to teach in group, based on the best. Those who do not have time to understand, teacher call unable, even bullied, what are Russian (with Polish roots) so stupid.
          For example, saying that all right Poles already live in Poland (Lenarda, you're not real in terms of their point of view).
          It was even said, - why do you go on the course?!?!

          And that people, I'm sorry, imbeciles, worked at the Embassy.
          From this point of view, all people who want to learn Russian language - foreign or Russian spies.

          In general, those 4 months that passed daughter Christina on those courses, persuaded her to think that living in Poland are enemies of Russian, or deep detractors.
          She said that she would never learn Polish, it told her nasty.
          I only hope that after some years hot words will be forgotten and she will ever do it what I could not.

          Now you understand why (in particular), I hate politics. It kills not only soul, but also a living language.
          Without language there is no country.

          Stan from M.
          From: Barry Turner (Journalism) <bturner@...>
          To: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com
          Sent: Thursday, December 13, 2012 11:54 AM
          Subject: RE: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Poles or Czechs not listened to, because do not speak Russian?
           
          Lenarda

          This was not meant to be insulting to Poles and I am aware of the great contribution to culture that the Poles have made...especially Copernicus. I have extensively studied the history of Eastern Europe and the Slavs and a the spectacular contribution to culture, art and music that has come from that part of the world.
          It is very sad also that there is still a great deal of animosity between those who speak Slavic languages and much of this pre-dates, by many years the Soviet domination of Eastern Europe

          I assumed at the time that my Russian teacher had some sort of problem with Poland, as some Russians still do. Sadly many languages are now shadow of their former existences and in Britain we are used to hearing the worst kind of Polish almost everyday, where every other word is a swear word.
          By far the majority of Poles in the UK are younger generation who have arrived since Poland joined the EU. Most of the WW2 veterans are now dead and the younger generation have no interest in their forbears or for that matter Polish history.

          Barry
        • Barry Turner (Journalism)
          Dear Stan I agree with you absolutely about politics! Someone once said that the Human race is work in progress and animosity between people based on
          Message 4 of 22 , Dec 13, 2012
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            Dear Stan

            I agree with you absolutely about politics! Someone once said that the Human race is 'work in progress' and animosity between people based on differences in culture will take many more generations to defeat. You are quite right that language is the essence of any culture and all despots and tyrants try to suppress it. The British did this in many of the countries it invaded and oppressed and all nationalities have at some time in their history attacked cultures through their language. Even within nationalities and cultural groups language is used to belittle and oppress sub-groups within them. I have often heard elderly Polish people decry the language spoken by younger generations and the younger generations laugh at what they think is an antiquated form of the language spoken by their elderly fellow countrymen who have been in England nearly 70 years.

            England has a very large number of Polish people living and working here and some of the older people who came here during WW2 often refer to them in insulting terms. I have even heard one elderly Polish man telling young Polish people to clear off back to Poland.

            I am an optimist however, We will all live in harmony and in my home town when walking around the streets it is common to hear Polish and Russian being spoken along with many other languages. I think this is wonderful and one day this foolish animosity based on nationality will be over.

            I am continuing to learn Russian (very slowly) To speak another language is to possess another soul as they say!

            Barry


            -----Original Message-----
            From: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com on behalf of Stanislaw Zwierzynski
            Sent: Thu 13/12/2012 10:09
            To: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: Re: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Poles or Czechs not listened to, because do not speak Russian?




            Dear Barry!

            Topic you raised is very interesting, but dangerous. Poor relations between Poland and Russia, unfortunately, reflected on cultural and philological cooperation.

            For example, Moscow is almost impossible to learn Polish language - no courses. Those Polish language courses that exist at the ?mbassy - this is blasphemy. There are not taught, and bullied.

            Those who read these lines, can not believe me. But here's my little story.

            5-7 years ago, when was Poland President russophobe Kaczynski, my 15 year old daughter, realizing his Polish roots and having language skills (she was a good student in a specialized English school and knows English language), decided to go to Polish language courses at the Polish Embassy in Moscow.

            Hardly wrote there, and what she saw it there.
            All those, indiscriminately in age, prior knowledge, abilities, etc. crashed (batch) into groups. She was in group of people aged between 15 and 60 years, someone wanted to learn to say, someone has been focused on business, someone did Polish Charter, etc. - they all had a purpose.
            Then began to teach in group, based on the best. Those who do not have time to understand, teacher call unable, even bullied, what are Russian (with Polish roots) so stupid. For example, saying that all right Poles already live in Poland (Lenarda, you're not real in terms of their point of view).
            It was even said, - why do you go on the course?!?!

            And that people, I'm sorry, imbeciles, worked at the Embassy. From this point of view, all people who want to learn Russian language - foreign or Russian spies.

            In general, those 4 months that passed daughter Christina on those courses, persuaded her to think that living in Poland are enemies of Russian, or deep detractors. She said that she would never learn Polish, it told her nasty.
            I only hope that after some years hot words will be forgotten and she will ever do it what I could not.

            Now you understand why (in particular), I hate politics. It kills not only soul, but also a living language. Without language there is no country.

            Stan from M. From: Barry Turner (Journalism) <bturner@...>
            To: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com
            Sent: Thursday, December 13, 2012 11:54 AM
            Subject: RE: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Poles or Czechs not listened to, because do not speak Russian?

             
            Lenarda

            This was not meant to be insulting to Poles and I am aware of the great contribution to culture that the Poles have made...especially Copernicus. I have extensively studied the history of Eastern Europe and the Slavs and a the spectacular contribution to culture, art and music that has come from that part of the world.
            It is very sad also that there is still a great deal of animosity between those who speak Slavic languages and much of this pre-dates, by many years the Soviet domination of Eastern Europe

            I assumed at the time that my Russian teacher had some sort of problem with Poland, as some Russians still do. Sadly many languages are now shadow of their former existences and in Britain we are used to hearing the worst kind of Polish almost everyday, where every other word is a swear word.
            By far the majority of Poles in the UK are younger generation who have arrived since Poland joined the EU. Most of the WW2 veterans are now dead and the younger generation have no interest in their forbears or for that matter Polish history.

            Barry


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          • Frances
            Lenarda I do believe that you respond to posts in our group in a knee jerk way without fully understanding where the writer is coming from. If you had read
            Message 5 of 22 , Dec 13, 2012
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              Lenarda

              I do believe that you respond to posts in our group in a 'knee jerk' way without fully understanding where the writer is coming from.

              If you had read earlier posts you would have known how much involvement Barry has had in the Polish community in Britain and in Eastern Bloc countries. His postings are to do with current language issues in Britain, where Poles are the second largest migrant group, after Indians (according to today's Sydney Morning Herald).

              There is nothing wrong with being 'blunt'(your word) but I think sometimes you are over-reacting and too defensive.

              Frances
              Australia




              --- In Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com, "LenardaSzymczak" <szymczak01@...> wrote:
              >
              > Dear Barry,
              >
              > I personally have no animosity towards the Russian people and respect them
              > as they respect us and every other race on this earth, but I do not believe
              > that any nationality should be put down and belittled. But what happened
              > before WWII and after as a direct result of Soviet Repression/Oppression.
              > This I will never forget or forgive, as so many innocents suffered, not only
              > the Polish People but many others from different countries. My immediate
              > family suffered under the hands of the Soviets, so I can comment with all
              > truth on this subject.
              >
              > I live in Australia and as far as swearing goes, this is common to all
              > nationalities, including persons of English decent. Blame the television
              > and movies which made it fashionable.
              >
              > My mothers is 88 years old, very much Polish Blood and a survivor and
              > veteran of WWII and believe me, the younger generation do have interest in
              > what their families endured and there is a rebirth of Polish History, now
              > especially after Poland regained its freedom and shed the puppet government,
              > but even before this the exiles outside of Poland always had interest and
              > pride in their heritage. I do not think that you understand the Polish
              > Spirit?
              >
              > You are sending posts through KS group and do not see this, that the entire
              > reason KS Group exists is because of the interest of the younger generation.
              > Please take off your blindfold and open your eyes or perhaps you are looking
              > in the wrong places.
              >
              > I ask you, as you have access to KS Group and records, that you go back and
              > read all the posts and see how real and genuine is the interest of veterans,
              > first generation, second generation and others forthcoming, before you make
              > such open comments. It appears that your education is lacking.
              >
              > My apologies for being so blunt, but truly your journey of learning has only
              > begun and I cannot and will not comment any further as this is a research
              > you personally must undertake. Good luck.
              >
              > Lenarda,
              > Sydney, Australia
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > -----Original Message-----
              > From: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com]
              > On Behalf Of Barry Turner (Journalism)
              > Sent: Thursday, 13 December, 2012 7:54 PM
              > To: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com
              > Subject: RE: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Poles or Czechs not listened to,
              > because do not speak Russian?
              >
              > Lenarda
              >
              > This was not meant to be insulting to Poles and I am aware of the great
              > contribution to culture that the Poles have made...especially Copernicus. I
              > have extensively studied the history of Eastern Europe and the Slavs and a
              > the spectacular contribution to culture, art and music that has come from
              > that part of the world.
              > It is very sad also that there is still a great deal of animosity between
              > those who speak Slavic languages and much of this pre-dates, by many years
              > the Soviet domination of Eastern Europe
              >
              > I assumed at the time that my Russian teacher had some sort of problem with
              > Poland, as some Russians still do. Sadly many languages are now shadow of
              > their former existences and in Britain we are used to hearing the worst kind
              > of Polish almost everyday, where every other word is a swear word.
              > By far the majority of Poles in the UK are younger generation who have
              > arrived since Poland joined the EU. Most of the WW2 veterans are now dead
              > and the younger generation have no interest in their forbears or for that
              > matter Polish history.
              >
              > Barry
              >
              >
              > -----Original Message-----
              > From: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com on behalf of LenardaSzymczak
              > Sent: Wed 12/12/2012 23:20
              > To: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com
              > Subject: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Poles or Czechs not listened to, because do
              > not speak Russian?
              >
              > Barry, I personally find this insulting as I feel that Russian and Czech,
              > being Slavic languages are but a shadow on the original and now existent
              > Polish people and their language. We were the teachers of culture and
              > education throughout Europe.
              >
              > Lenarda,
              >
              > Sydney, Australia
              >
              > From: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com]
              > On Behalf Of Barry Turner (Journalism)
              > Sent: Thursday, 13 December, 2012 10:03 AM
              > To: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com; Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com
              > Subject: RE: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Poland and Borderlands from 10 - 15th
              > Century until WWII.
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > Dear Each
              >
              > I have just been explaining to my new colleagues how important it was in
              > training school to pronounce our Russian correctly. My tutor told me that if
              > we incorrectly pronounced words or placed the stresses incorrectly that we
              > would be mistaken for Poles or Czechs and not listened to.
              >
              > Does anyone have any experiences that support this view?
              >
              > Wah Geordies Man!
              >
              > Barry
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > _,_._,___
              >
            • antoni530
              Frances, I agree with your, Barrys and Stans views and comments as I feel that some of our members respond in a way they think that they know it all forcing
              Message 6 of 22 , Dec 13, 2012
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                Frances,

                I agree with your, Barrys and Stans views and comments as I feel that some of our members respond in a way they think 'that they know it all' forcing the issues of their own as if it were 'the gospel truth'and not considering another point of view. In my view the contributor can be from any country, but what is important to me is what they contribute to our cause of research and understanding. Some members seem to introduce political issues into a group devoted to research in our history; that should not be as other forums are avilable to discus such matters.
                antoni530
                (PS I am actually against stating openly where we are residing)



                --- In Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com, "Frances" <frncsgts@...> wrote:
                >
                > Lenarda
                >
                > I do believe that you respond to posts in our group in a 'knee jerk' way without fully understanding where the writer is coming from.
                >
                > If you had read earlier posts you would have known how much involvement Barry has had in the Polish community in Britain and in Eastern Bloc countries. His postings are to do with current language issues in Britain, where Poles are the second largest migrant group, after Indians (according to today's Sydney Morning Herald).
                >
                > There is nothing wrong with being 'blunt'(your word) but I think sometimes you are over-reacting and too defensive.
                >
                > Frances
                > Australia
                >
                >
                >
                >
                > --- In Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com, "LenardaSzymczak" <szymczak01@> wrote:
                > >
                > > Dear Barry,
                > >
                > > I personally have no animosity towards the Russian people and respect them
                > > as they respect us and every other race on this earth, but I do not believe
                > > that any nationality should be put down and belittled. But what happened
                > > before WWII and after as a direct result of Soviet Repression/Oppression.
                > > This I will never forget or forgive, as so many innocents suffered, not only
                > > the Polish People but many others from different countries. My immediate
                > > family suffered under the hands of the Soviets, so I can comment with all
                > > truth on this subject.
                > >
                > > I live in Australia and as far as swearing goes, this is common to all
                > > nationalities, including persons of English decent. Blame the television
                > > and movies which made it fashionable.
                > >
                > > My mothers is 88 years old, very much Polish Blood and a survivor and
                > > veteran of WWII and believe me, the younger generation do have interest in
                > > what their families endured and there is a rebirth of Polish History, now
                > > especially after Poland regained its freedom and shed the puppet government,
                > > but even before this the exiles outside of Poland always had interest and
                > > pride in their heritage. I do not think that you understand the Polish
                > > Spirit?
                > >
                > > You are sending posts through KS group and do not see this, that the entire
                > > reason KS Group exists is because of the interest of the younger generation.
                > > Please take off your blindfold and open your eyes or perhaps you are looking
                > > in the wrong places.
                > >
                > > I ask you, as you have access to KS Group and records, that you go back and
                > > read all the posts and see how real and genuine is the interest of veterans,
                > > first generation, second generation and others forthcoming, before you make
                > > such open comments. It appears that your education is lacking.
                > >
                > > My apologies for being so blunt, but truly your journey of learning has only
                > > begun and I cannot and will not comment any further as this is a research
                > > you personally must undertake. Good luck.
                > >
                > > Lenarda,
                > > Sydney, Australia
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > > -----Original Message-----
                > > From: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com]
                > > On Behalf Of Barry Turner (Journalism)
                > > Sent: Thursday, 13 December, 2012 7:54 PM
                > > To: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com
                > > Subject: RE: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Poles or Czechs not listened to,
                > > because do not speak Russian?
                > >
                > > Lenarda
                > >
                > > This was not meant to be insulting to Poles and I am aware of the great
                > > contribution to culture that the Poles have made...especially Copernicus. I
                > > have extensively studied the history of Eastern Europe and the Slavs and a
                > > the spectacular contribution to culture, art and music that has come from
                > > that part of the world.
                > > It is very sad also that there is still a great deal of animosity between
                > > those who speak Slavic languages and much of this pre-dates, by many years
                > > the Soviet domination of Eastern Europe
                > >
                > > I assumed at the time that my Russian teacher had some sort of problem with
                > > Poland, as some Russians still do. Sadly many languages are now shadow of
                > > their former existences and in Britain we are used to hearing the worst kind
                > > of Polish almost everyday, where every other word is a swear word.
                > > By far the majority of Poles in the UK are younger generation who have
                > > arrived since Poland joined the EU. Most of the WW2 veterans are now dead
                > > and the younger generation have no interest in their forbears or for that
                > > matter Polish history.
                > >
                > > Barry
                > >
                > >
                > > -----Original Message-----
                > > From: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com on behalf of LenardaSzymczak
                > > Sent: Wed 12/12/2012 23:20
                > > To: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com
                > > Subject: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Poles or Czechs not listened to, because do
                > > not speak Russian?
                > >
                > > Barry, I personally find this insulting as I feel that Russian and Czech,
                > > being Slavic languages are but a shadow on the original and now existent
                > > Polish people and their language. We were the teachers of culture and
                > > education throughout Europe.
                > >
                > > Lenarda,
                > >
                > > Sydney, Australia
                > >
                > > From: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com]
                > > On Behalf Of Barry Turner (Journalism)
                > > Sent: Thursday, 13 December, 2012 10:03 AM
                > > To: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com; Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com
                > > Subject: RE: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Poland and Borderlands from 10 - 15th
                > > Century until WWII.
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > > Dear Each
                > >
                > > I have just been explaining to my new colleagues how important it was in
                > > training school to pronounce our Russian correctly. My tutor told me that if
                > > we incorrectly pronounced words or placed the stresses incorrectly that we
                > > would be mistaken for Poles or Czechs and not listened to.
                > >
                > > Does anyone have any experiences that support this view?
                > >
                > > Wah Geordies Man!
                > >
                > > Barry
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > > _,_._,___
                > >
                >
              • terry polewski
                Lenarda,   all this because Barry simply asked the first question about similar experiences learning russian? Asking him taking off his blindfold, open his
                Message 7 of 22 , Dec 13, 2012
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                • 0 Attachment
                  Lenarda,
                   
                  all this because Barry simply asked the first question about similar experiences learning russian?
                  Asking him taking off his blindfold, open his eyes and apparent lack of education when making comments?
                  Who is it that must review the journey of learning (and tolerance)?
                   
                  Terry Polewski
                   
                   

                  From: LenardaSzymczak <szymczak01@...>
                   
                  Dear Barry, 


                  I do not think that you understand the Polish
                  Spirit?

                  You are sending posts through KS group and do not see this, that the entire
                  reason KS Group exists is because of the interest of the younger generation.
                  Please take off your blindfold and open your eyes or perhaps you are looking
                  in the wrong places.


                  I ask you, as you have access to KS Group and records, that you go back and
                  read all the posts and see how real and genuine is the interest of veterans,
                  first generation, second generation and others forthcoming, before you make
                  such open comments. It appears that your education is lacking.

                  My apologies for being so blunt, but truly your journey of learning has only
                  begun and I cannot and will not comment any further as this is a research
                  you personally must undertake.
                  Good luck.

                  Lenarda,
                  Sydney, Australia

                  -----Original Message-----
                  From: mailto:Kresy-Siberia%40yahoogroups.com [mailto:mailto:Kresy-Siberia%40yahoogroups.com]
                  On Behalf Of Barry Turner (Journalism)
                  Sent: Thursday, 13 December, 2012 7:54 PM
                  To: mailto:Kresy-Siberia%40yahoogroups.com
                  Subject: RE: [http://www.kresy-siberia.org/] Poles or Czechs not listened to,
                  because do not speak Russian?

                  Lenarda

                  This was not meant to be insulting to Poles and I am aware of the great
                  contribution to culture that the Poles have made...especially Copernicus. I
                  have extensively studied the history of Eastern Europe and the Slavs and a
                  the spectacular contribution to culture, art and music that has come from
                  that part of the world.
                  It is very sad also that there is still a great deal of animosity between
                  those who speak Slavic languages and much of this pre-dates, by many years
                  the Soviet domination of Eastern Europe

                  I assumed at the time that my Russian teacher had some sort of problem with
                  Poland, as some Russians still do. Sadly many languages are now shadow of
                  their former existences and in Britain we are used to hearing the worst kind
                  of Polish almost everyday, where every other word is a swear word.
                  By far the majority of Poles in the UK are younger generation who have
                  arrived since Poland joined the EU. Most of the WW2 veterans are now dead
                  and the younger generation have no interest in their forbears or for that
                  matter Polish history.

                  Barry


                  -----Original Message-----
                  From: mailto:Kresy-Siberia%40yahoogroups.com on behalf of LenardaSzymczak
                  Sent: Wed 12/12/2012 23:20
                  To: mailto:Kresy-Siberia%40yahoogroups.com
                  Subject: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Poles or Czechs not listened to, because do
                  not speak Russian?

                  Barry, I personally find this insulting as I feel that Russian and Czech,
                  being Slavic languages are but a shadow on the original and now existent
                  Polish people and their language. We were the teachers of culture and
                  education throughout Europe.

                  Lenarda,

                  Sydney, Australia

                  From: mailto:Kresy-Siberia%40yahoogroups.com [mailto:mailto:Kresy-Siberia%40yahoogroups.com]
                  On Behalf Of Barry Turner (Journalism)
                  Sent: Thursday, 13 December, 2012 10:03 AM
                  To: mailto:Kresy-Siberia%40yahoogroups.com; mailto:Kresy-Siberia%40yahoogroups.com
                  Subject: RE: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Poland and Borderlands from 10 - 15th
                  Century until WWII.

                  Dear Each

                  I have just been explaining to my new colleagues how important it was in
                  training school to pronounce our Russian correctly. My tutor told me that if
                  we incorrectly pronounced words or placed the stresses incorrectly that we
                  would be mistaken for Poles or Czechs and not listened to.

                  Does anyone have any experiences that support this view?

                  Wah Geordies Man!

                  Barry

                  _,_._,___

                • LenardaSzymczak
                  Dear group I have read your comments, your views are taken on board and I do remember in our group that we have one great gift, freedom of speech with the
                  Message 8 of 22 , Dec 13, 2012
                  View Source
                  • 0 Attachment

                    Dear group

                     

                    I have read your comments, your views are taken on board and I do remember in our group that we have one great gift, freedom of speech with the uniqueness, individuality, eccentricity, strong debates from all our members, but at the same time we are forgiving and understanding.  Not all of us are academics but the group has accepted us, with our stumbling, respecting us all.

                     

                    I spoke as an individual, used the words “personally” for a reason, as in no way did I refer that the rest of the group was thinking as I did.  I have also read posts from the past where we tolerated individual member’s outbursts of passion.

                     

                    The subject was closed last night, but I do commend you on your working together as a team, even to berate me, as this proves the strength and the bond which exists within this special group for research, please do not worry, I will take a back seat so not to offend group again

                     

                    My comments about blindfold were not appropriate, for this I apologise to Barry and the group, but it also brought forward a wonderful discussion about what Barry’s involvement is with the Polish Community, from which I now have a greater respect and have learned much, without this, I as many new people, would never have known this information and from my side this is greatly appreciated. 

                     

                    My apologies for offending the group and feel that Barry and I came to an understanding, where I did misunderstand him and he me.  Thus through this encounter, I have also learned, especially from his comments on research.

                     

                    Regards

                    Lenarda, Australia

                     

                     

                    From: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of terry polewski
                    Sent: Friday, 14 December, 2012 1:56 AM
                    To: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com
                    Subject: Re: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Poles or Czechs not listened to, because do not speak Russian?

                     

                     

                    Lenarda,

                     

                    all this because Barry simply asked the first question about similar experiences learning russian?

                    Asking him taking off his blindfold, open his eyes and apparent lack of education when making comments?

                    Who is it that must review the journey of learning (and tolerance)?

                     

                    Terry Polewski

                     

                     

                     

                    From: LenardaSzymczak <szymczak01@...>

                     

                    Dear Barry, 


                    I do not think that you understand the Polish
                    Spirit?

                    You are sending posts through KS group and do not see this, that the entire
                    reason KS Group exists is because of the interest of the younger generation.
                    Please take off your blindfold and open your eyes or perhaps you are looking
                    in the wrong places.


                    I ask you, as you have access to KS Group and records, that you go back and
                    read all the posts and see how real and genuine is the interest of veterans,
                    first generation, second generation and others forthcoming, before you make
                    such open comments. It appears that your education is lacking.

                    My apologies for being so blunt, but truly your journey of learning has only
                    begun and I cannot and will not comment any further as this is a research
                    you personally must undertake.
                    Good luck.

                    Lenarda,
                    Sydney, Australia

                    -----Original Message-----
                    From: mailto:Kresy-Siberia%40yahoogroups.com [mailto:mailto:Kresy-Siberia%40yahoogroups.com]
                    On Behalf Of Barry Turner (Journalism)
                    Sent: Thursday, 13 December, 2012 7:54 PM
                    To: mailto:Kresy-Siberia%40yahoogroups.com
                    Subject: RE: [http://www.kresy-siberia.org/] Poles or Czechs not listened to,
                    because do not speak Russian?

                    Lenarda

                    This was not meant to be insulting to Poles and I am aware of the great
                    contribution to culture that the Poles have made...especially Copernicus. I
                    have extensively studied the history of Eastern Europe and the Slavs and a
                    the spectacular contribution to culture, art and music that has come from
                    that part of the world.
                    It is very sad also that there is still a great deal of animosity between
                    those who speak Slavic languages and much of this pre-dates, by many years
                    the Soviet domination of Eastern Europe

                    I assumed at the time that my Russian teacher had some sort of problem with
                    Poland, as some Russians still do. Sadly many languages are now shadow of
                    their former existences and in Britain we are used to hearing the worst kind
                    of Polish almost everyday, where every other word is a swear word.
                    By far the majority of Poles in the UK are younger generation who have
                    arrived since Poland joined the EU. Most of the WW2 veterans are now dead
                    and the younger generation have no interest in their forbears or for that
                    matter Polish history.

                    Barry


                    -----Original Message-----
                    From: mailto:Kresy-Siberia%40yahoogroups.com on behalf of LenardaSzymczak
                    Sent: Wed 12/12/2012 23:20
                    To: mailto:Kresy-Siberia%40yahoogroups.com
                    Subject: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Poles or Czechs not listened to, because do
                    not speak Russian?

                    Barry, I personally find this insulting as I feel that Russian and Czech,
                    being Slavic languages are but a shadow on the original and now existent
                    Polish people and their language. We were the teachers of culture and
                    education throughout Europe.

                    Lenarda,

                    Sydney, Australia

                    From: mailto:Kresy-Siberia%40yahoogroups.com [mailto:mailto:Kresy-Siberia%40yahoogroups.com]
                    On Behalf Of Barry Turner (Journalism)
                    Sent: Thursday, 13 December, 2012 10:03 AM
                    To: mailto:Kresy-Siberia%40yahoogroups.com; mailto:Kresy-Siberia%40yahoogroups.com
                    Subject: RE: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Poland and Borderlands from 10 - 15th
                    Century until WWII.

                    Dear Each

                    I have just been explaining to my new colleagues how important it was in
                    training school to pronounce our Russian correctly. My tutor told me that if
                    we incorrectly pronounced words or placed the stresses incorrectly that we
                    would be mistaken for Poles or Czechs and not listened to.

                    Does anyone have any experiences that support this view?

                    Wah Geordies Man!

                    Barry

                    _,_._,___

                  • Barry Turner (Journalism)
                    Lenarda I was certainly not offended and no apology is necessary. Barry ... From: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com on behalf of LenardaSzymczak Sent: Thu
                    Message 9 of 22 , Dec 13, 2012
                    View Source
                    • 0 Attachment
                      Lenarda

                      I was certainly not offended and no apology is necessary.

                      Barry


                      -----Original Message-----
                      From: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com on behalf of LenardaSzymczak
                      Sent: Thu 13/12/2012 19:34
                      To: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com
                      Subject: RE: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Poles or Czechs not listened to, because do not speak Russian?

                      Dear group



                      I have read your comments, your views are taken on board and I do remember in our group that we have one great gift, freedom of speech with the uniqueness, individuality, eccentricity, strong debates from all our members, but at the same time we are forgiving and understanding. Not all of us are academics but the group has accepted us, with our stumbling, respecting us all.



                      I spoke as an individual, used the words "personally" for a reason, as in no way did I refer that the rest of the group was thinking as I did. I have also read posts from the past where we tolerated individual member's outbursts of passion.



                      The subject was closed last night, but I do commend you on your working together as a team, even to berate me, as this proves the strength and the bond which exists within this special group for research, please do not worry, I will take a back seat so not to offend group again



                      My comments about blindfold were not appropriate, for this I apologise to Barry and the group, but it also brought forward a wonderful discussion about what Barry's involvement is with the Polish Community, from which I now have a greater respect and have learned much, without this, I as many new people, would never have known this information and from my side this is greatly appreciated.



                      My apologies for offending the group and feel that Barry and I came to an understanding, where I did misunderstand him and he me. Thus through this encounter, I have also learned, especially from his comments on research.



                      Regards

                      Lenarda, Australia





                      From: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of terry polewski
                      Sent: Friday, 14 December, 2012 1:56 AM
                      To: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com
                      Subject: Re: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Poles or Czechs not listened to, because do not speak Russian?





                      Lenarda,



                      all this because Barry simply asked the first question about similar experiences learning russian?

                      Asking him taking off his blindfold, open his eyes and apparent lack of education when making comments?

                      Who is it that must review the journey of learning (and tolerance)?



                      Terry Polewski







                      From: LenardaSzymczak <szymczak01@...>



                      Dear Barry,


                      I do not think that you understand the Polish
                      Spirit?

                      You are sending posts through KS group and do not see this, that the entire
                      reason KS Group exists is because of the interest of the younger generation.
                      Please take off your blindfold and open your eyes or perhaps you are looking
                      in the wrong places.

                      I ask you, as you have access to KS Group and records, that you go back and
                      read all the posts and see how real and genuine is the interest of veterans,
                      first generation, second generation and others forthcoming, before you make
                      such open comments. It appears that your education is lacking.

                      My apologies for being so blunt, but truly your journey of learning has only
                      begun and I cannot and will not comment any further as this is a research
                      you personally must undertake. Good luck.

                      Lenarda,
                      Sydney, Australia

                      -----Original Message-----
                      From: mailto:Kresy-Siberia%40yahoogroups.com [mailto:mailto:Kresy-Siberia%40yahoogroups.com]
                      On Behalf Of Barry Turner (Journalism)
                      Sent: Thursday, 13 December, 2012 7:54 PM
                      To: mailto:Kresy-Siberia%40yahoogroups.com
                      Subject: RE: [http://www.kresy-siberia.org/%5d Poles or Czechs not listened to,
                      because do not speak Russian?

                      Lenarda

                      This was not meant to be insulting to Poles and I am aware of the great
                      contribution to culture that the Poles have made...especially Copernicus. I
                      have extensively studied the history of Eastern Europe and the Slavs and a
                      the spectacular contribution to culture, art and music that has come from
                      that part of the world.
                      It is very sad also that there is still a great deal of animosity between
                      those who speak Slavic languages and much of this pre-dates, by many years
                      the Soviet domination of Eastern Europe

                      I assumed at the time that my Russian teacher had some sort of problem with
                      Poland, as some Russians still do. Sadly many languages are now shadow of
                      their former existences and in Britain we are used to hearing the worst kind
                      of Polish almost everyday, where every other word is a swear word.
                      By far the majority of Poles in the UK are younger generation who have
                      arrived since Poland joined the EU. Most of the WW2 veterans are now dead
                      and the younger generation have no interest in their forbears or for that
                      matter Polish history.

                      Barry


                      -----Original Message-----
                      From: mailto:Kresy-Siberia%40yahoogroups.com on behalf of LenardaSzymczak
                      Sent: Wed 12/12/2012 23:20
                      To: mailto:Kresy-Siberia%40yahoogroups.com
                      Subject: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Poles or Czechs not listened to, because do
                      not speak Russian?

                      Barry, I personally find this insulting as I feel that Russian and Czech,
                      being Slavic languages are but a shadow on the original and now existent
                      Polish people and their language. We were the teachers of culture and
                      education throughout Europe.

                      Lenarda,

                      Sydney, Australia

                      From: mailto:Kresy-Siberia%40yahoogroups.com [mailto:mailto:Kresy-Siberia%40yahoogroups.com]
                      On Behalf Of Barry Turner (Journalism)
                      Sent: Thursday, 13 December, 2012 10:03 AM
                      To: mailto:Kresy-Siberia%40yahoogroups.com; mailto:Kresy-Siberia%40yahoogroups.com
                      Subject: RE: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Poland and Borderlands from 10 - 15th
                      Century until WWII.

                      Dear Each

                      I have just been explaining to my new colleagues how important it was in
                      training school to pronounce our Russian correctly. My tutor told me that if
                      we incorrectly pronounced words or placed the stresses incorrectly that we
                      would be mistaken for Poles or Czechs and not listened to.

                      Does anyone have any experiences that support this view?

                      Wah Geordies Man!

                      Barry

                      _,_._,___





                      The University of Lincoln - a top performer in student satisfaction, enjoying an unrivalled ascent through the University league tables, set in a dynamic, research rich and vibrant campus in the heart of a great historic student-friendly city.

                      The information in this e-mail and any attachments may be confidential. If you have received this email in error please notify the sender immediately and remove it from your system. Do not disclose the contents to another person or take copies.

                      Email is not secure and may contain viruses. The University of Lincoln makes every effort to ensure email is sent without viruses, but cannot guarantee this and recommends recipients take appropriate precautions.

                      The University may monitor email traffic data and content in accordance with its policies and English law. Further information can be found at: http://www.lincoln.ac.uk/legal.
                    • LenardaSzymczak
                      Barry, thank you. Lenarda, Australia ... From: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Barry Turner (Journalism)
                      Message 10 of 22 , Dec 13, 2012
                      View Source
                      • 0 Attachment
                        Barry, thank you.
                        Lenarda, Australia

                        -----Original Message-----
                        From: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com]
                        On Behalf Of Barry Turner (Journalism)
                        Sent: Friday, 14 December, 2012 6:36 AM
                        To: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com
                        Subject: RE: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Poles or Czechs not listened to,
                        because do not speak Russian?

                        Lenarda

                        I was certainly not offended and no apology is necessary.

                        Barry


                        -----Original Message-----
                        From: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com on behalf of LenardaSzymczak
                        Sent: Thu 13/12/2012 19:34
                        To: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com
                        Subject: RE: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Poles or Czechs not listened to,
                        because do not speak Russian?

                        Dear group



                        I have read your comments, your views are taken on board and I do remember
                        in our group that we have one great gift, freedom of speech with the
                        uniqueness, individuality, eccentricity, strong debates from all our
                        members, but at the same time we are forgiving and understanding. Not all
                        of us are academics but the group has accepted us, with our stumbling,
                        respecting us all.



                        I spoke as an individual, used the words "personally" for a reason, as in no
                        way did I refer that the rest of the group was thinking as I did. I have
                        also read posts from the past where we tolerated individual member's
                        outbursts of passion.



                        The subject was closed last night, but I do commend you on your working
                        together as a team, even to berate me, as this proves the strength and the
                        bond which exists within this special group for research, please do not
                        worry, I will take a back seat so not to offend group again



                        My comments about blindfold were not appropriate, for this I apologise to
                        Barry and the group, but it also brought forward a wonderful discussion
                        about what Barry's involvement is with the Polish Community, from which I
                        now have a greater respect and have learned much, without this, I as many
                        new people, would never have known this information and from my side this is
                        greatly appreciated.



                        My apologies for offending the group and feel that Barry and I came to an
                        understanding, where I did misunderstand him and he me. Thus through this
                        encounter, I have also learned, especially from his comments on research.



                        Regards

                        Lenarda, Australia





                        From: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com]
                        On Behalf Of terry polewski
                        Sent: Friday, 14 December, 2012 1:56 AM
                        To: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com
                        Subject: Re: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Poles or Czechs not listened to,
                        because do not speak Russian?





                        Lenarda,



                        all this because Barry simply asked the first question about similar
                        experiences learning russian?

                        Asking him taking off his blindfold, open his eyes and apparent lack of
                        education when making comments?

                        Who is it that must review the journey of learning (and tolerance)?



                        Terry Polewski







                        From: LenardaSzymczak <szymczak01@...>



                        Dear Barry,


                        I do not think that you understand the Polish Spirit?

                        You are sending posts through KS group and do not see this, that the entire
                        reason KS Group exists is because of the interest of the younger generation.
                        Please take off your blindfold and open your eyes or perhaps you are looking
                        in the wrong places.

                        I ask you, as you have access to KS Group and records, that you go back and
                        read all the posts and see how real and genuine is the interest of veterans,
                        first generation, second generation and others forthcoming, before you make
                        such open comments. It appears that your education is lacking.

                        My apologies for being so blunt, but truly your journey of learning has only
                        begun and I cannot and will not comment any further as this is a research
                        you personally must undertake. Good luck.

                        Lenarda,
                        Sydney, Australia

                        -----Original Message-----
                        From: mailto:Kresy-Siberia%40yahoogroups.com
                        [mailto:mailto:Kresy-Siberia%40yahoogroups.com]
                        On Behalf Of Barry Turner (Journalism)
                        Sent: Thursday, 13 December, 2012 7:54 PM
                        To: mailto:Kresy-Siberia%40yahoogroups.com
                        Subject: RE: [http://www.kresy-siberia.org/%5d Poles or Czechs not listened
                        to, because do not speak Russian?

                        Lenarda

                        This was not meant to be insulting to Poles and I am aware of the great
                        contribution to culture that the Poles have made...especially Copernicus. I
                        have extensively studied the history of Eastern Europe and the Slavs and a
                        the spectacular contribution to culture, art and music that has come from
                        that part of the world.
                        It is very sad also that there is still a great deal of animosity between
                        those who speak Slavic languages and much of this pre-dates, by many years
                        the Soviet domination of Eastern Europe

                        I assumed at the time that my Russian teacher had some sort of problem with
                        Poland, as some Russians still do. Sadly many languages are now shadow of
                        their former existences and in Britain we are used to hearing the worst kind
                        of Polish almost everyday, where every other word is a swear word.
                        By far the majority of Poles in the UK are younger generation who have
                        arrived since Poland joined the EU. Most of the WW2 veterans are now dead
                        and the younger generation have no interest in their forbears or for that
                        matter Polish history.

                        Barry


                        -----Original Message-----
                        From: mailto:Kresy-Siberia%40yahoogroups.com on behalf of LenardaSzymczak
                        Sent: Wed 12/12/2012 23:20
                        To: mailto:Kresy-Siberia%40yahoogroups.com
                        Subject: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Poles or Czechs not listened to, because do
                        not speak Russian?

                        Barry, I personally find this insulting as I feel that Russian and Czech,
                        being Slavic languages are but a shadow on the original and now existent
                        Polish people and their language. We were the teachers of culture and
                        education throughout Europe.

                        Lenarda,

                        Sydney, Australia

                        From: mailto:Kresy-Siberia%40yahoogroups.com
                        [mailto:mailto:Kresy-Siberia%40yahoogroups.com]
                        On Behalf Of Barry Turner (Journalism)
                        Sent: Thursday, 13 December, 2012 10:03 AM
                        To: mailto:Kresy-Siberia%40yahoogroups.com;
                        mailto:Kresy-Siberia%40yahoogroups.com
                        Subject: RE: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Poland and Borderlands from 10 - 15th
                        Century until WWII.

                        Dear Each

                        I have just been explaining to my new colleagues how important it was in
                        training school to pronounce our Russian correctly. My tutor told me that if
                        we incorrectly pronounced words or placed the stresses incorrectly that we
                        would be mistaken for Poles or Czechs and not listened to.

                        Does anyone have any experiences that support this view?

                        Wah Geordies Man!

                        Barry

                        _,_._,___




                        The University of Lincoln - a top performer in student satisfaction,
                        enjoying an unrivalled ascent through the University league tables, set in a
                        dynamic, research rich and vibrant campus in the heart of a great historic
                        student-friendly city.The information in this e-mail and any attachments may
                        be confidential. If you have received this email in error please notify the
                        sender immediately and remove it from your system. Do not disclose the
                        contents to another person or take copies. Email is not secure and may
                        contain viruses. The University of Lincoln makes every effort to ensure
                        email is sent without viruses, but cannot guarantee this and recommends
                        recipients take appropriate precautions. The University may monitor email
                        traffic data and content in accordance with its policies and English law.
                        Further information can be found at: http://www.lincoln.ac.uk/legal. The
                        University of Lincoln - a top performer in student satisfaction, enjoying an
                        unrivalled ascent through the University league tables, set in a dynamic,
                        research rich and vibrant campus in the heart of a great historic
                        student-friendly city.

                        The information in this e-mail and any attachments may be confidential. If
                        you have received this email in error please notify the sender immediately
                        and remove it from your system. Do not disclose the contents to another
                        person or take copies.

                        Email is not secure and may contain viruses. The University of Lincoln makes
                        every effort to ensure email is sent without viruses, but cannot guarantee
                        this and recommends recipients take appropriate precautions.

                        The University may monitor email traffic data and content in accordance with
                        its policies and English law. Further information can be found at:
                        http://www.lincoln.ac.uk/legal.
                      • Mark and Oyun
                        Dear Barry, I remember that when I was studying Russian during the cold war, my English colleagues were always told that we would be mistaken as someone iz
                        Message 11 of 22 , Dec 15, 2012
                        View Source
                        • 0 Attachment

                          Dear Barry,

                          I remember that when I was studying Russian during the cold war, my English colleagues were always told that we would be mistaken as someone iz pribaltikye someone from one of the three Baltic Soviet Republics, but I sounded like a Pole. Having been born in England I didn't know I had a Polish accent, but apparently I do when I speak foreign languages. My French girlfriend told me the same when I spoke French to her. Who knew!?

                          Regards, Mark

                          Yay… University of Surrey Linguistics Department!!!

                           

                        • Stanislaw Zwierzynski
                          Dear Mark! Since the cold war, you were  in USSR? Or preparing to seize the Soviet Union? I understand from all writing, that to learn Polish - only in
                          Message 12 of 22 , Dec 15, 2012
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                            Dear Mark!

                            Since the cold war, you were  in USSR? Or preparing to seize the Soviet Union?

                            I understand from all writing, that to learn Polish - only in Poland. By analogy, I can say that Russian language can be studied only in Russia.
                            There was a fascinating country in history - Krésy. Only there you can learn at the same time Polish and Russian (and Ukrainian and Belarusian as languages ​​of the second level).
                            Who knows, maybe this wonderful country will appear in the history. I would not mind.

                            Stan from M.


                            From: Mark and Oyun <mark_oyun@...>
                            To: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com
                            Sent: Saturday, December 15, 2012 2:33 PM
                            Subject: Re: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Poland and Borderlands from 10 - 15th Century until WWII.
                             
                            Dear Barry,
                            I remember that when I was studying Russian during the cold war, my English colleagues were always told that we would be mistaken as someone iz pribaltikye someone from one of the three Baltic Soviet Republics, but I sounded like a Pole. Having been born in England I didn't know I had a Polish accent, but apparently I do when I speak foreign languages. My French girlfriend told me the same when I spoke French to her. Who knew!?
                            Regards, Mark
                            Yay… University of Surrey Linguistics Department!!!
                             
                          • Mark and Oyun
                            Dear Stan, FYI, I studied Russian and International Relations at the University of Surrey. Part of our course was to study in the USSR. I spent 3 month
                            Message 13 of 22 , Dec 15, 2012
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                              Dear Stan,

                              FYI, I studied Russian and International Relations at the University of Surrey. Part of our course was to study in the USSR. I spent 3 month studying at the Kiev Pedagogical Institute (1985... the year before the Chernobyl disaster)and 3 months in the [what was then] Zhdanov Leningrad State University (1987) It was at that time I made my first visits to both Lwow amd Wilno. As to seizing the Soviet Union; my career path went on a sharp tangent when the Berlin Wall came down a year after I graduated! Again... who knew!?

                              Regards, Mark

                              --- In Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com, Stanislaw Zwierzynski <zwierzinski1957@...> wrote:
                              >
                              > Dear Mark!
                              >
                              > Since the cold war, you were  in USSR? Or preparing to seize the Soviet Union?
                              >
                              > I understand from all writing, that to learn Polish - only in Poland. By analogy, I can say that Russian language can be studied only in Russia.
                              >
                              > There was a fascinating country in history - Krésy. Only there you can learn at the same time Polish and Russian (and Ukrainian and Belarusian as languages ​​of the second level).
                              > Who knows, maybe this wonderful country will appear in the history. I would not mind.
                              >
                              > Stan from M.
                              >
                              >
                              > From: Mark and Oyun <mark_oyun@...>
                              > To: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com
                              > Sent: Saturday, December 15, 2012 2:33 PM
                              > Subject: Re: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Poland and Borderlands from 10 - 15th Century until WWII.
                              >
                              >  
                              > Dear Barry,
                              > I remember that when I was studying Russian during the cold war, my English colleagues were always told that we would be mistaken as someone iz pribaltikye someone from one of the three Baltic Soviet Republics, but I sounded like a Pole. Having been born in England I didn't know I had a Polish accent, but apparently I do when I speak foreign languages. My French girlfriend told me the same when I spoke French to her. Who knew!?
                              > Regards, Mark
                              > Yay… University of Surrey Linguistics Department!!!
                              >  
                              >
                            • Barry Turner (Journalism)
                              Mark I also took a sharp tangent when the Berlin wall came down. I was in East Germany at the time and fulfilled a long held ambition to climb over it. Barry
                              Message 14 of 22 , Dec 15, 2012
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                                Mark

                                I also took a sharp tangent when the Berlin wall came down. I was in East Germany at the time and fulfilled a long held ambition to climb over it.

                                Barry


                                -----Original Message-----
                                From: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com on behalf of Mark and Oyun
                                Sent: Sat 15/12/2012 11:29
                                To: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com
                                Subject: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Re: Poland and Borderlands from 10 - 15th Century until WWII.

                                Dear Stan,

                                FYI, I studied Russian and International Relations at the University of Surrey. Part of our course was to study in the USSR. I spent 3 month studying at the Kiev Pedagogical Institute (1985... the year before the Chernobyl disaster)and 3 months in the [what was then] Zhdanov Leningrad State University (1987) It was at that time I made my first visits to both Lwow amd Wilno. As to seizing the Soviet Union; my career path went on a sharp tangent when the Berlin Wall came down a year after I graduated! Again... who knew!?

                                Regards, Mark

                                --- In Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com, Stanislaw Zwierzynski <zwierzinski1957@...> wrote:
                                >
                                > Dear Mark!
                                >
                                > Since the cold war, you were  in USSR? Or preparing to seize the Soviet Union?
                                >
                                > I understand from all writing, that to learn Polish - only in Poland. By analogy, I can say that Russian language can be studied only in Russia.
                                >
                                > There was a fascinating country in history - Krésy. Only there you can learn at the same time Polish and Russian (and Ukrainian and Belarusian as languages â?<â?<of the second level).
                                > Who knows, maybe this wonderful country will appear in the history. I would not mind.
                                >
                                > Stan from M.
                                >
                                >
                                > From: Mark and Oyun <mark_oyun@...>
                                > To: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com
                                > Sent: Saturday, December 15, 2012 2:33 PM
                                > Subject: Re: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Poland and Borderlands from 10 - 15th Century until WWII.
                                >
                                >  
                                > Dear Barry,
                                > I remember that when I was studying Russian during the cold war, my English colleagues were always told that we would be mistaken as someone iz pribaltikye someone from one of the three Baltic Soviet Republics, but I sounded like a Pole. Having been born in England I didn't know I had a Polish accent, but apparently I do when I speak foreign languages. My French girlfriend told me the same when I spoke French to her. Who knew!?
                                > Regards, Mark
                                > Yayâ?¦ University of Surrey Linguistics Department!!!
                                >  
                                >
                              • Dan Ford
                                I often wondered what happened to all the Sovietologists in 1991.... - Dan Ford US
                                Message 15 of 22 , Dec 15, 2012
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                                  I often wondered what happened to all the Sovietologists in 1991....

                                  - Dan Ford US

                                  On 12/15/2012 6:29 AM, Mark and Oyun wrote:
                                  > As to seizing the Soviet Union; my career path went on a sharp tangent
                                  > when the Berlin Wall came down a year after I graduated!
                                • Mark and Oyun
                                  Ah yes, we poor Sovietologists... I had the good fortune to go through Checkpoint Charlie in 1988. That was quite an interesting experience, but I had always
                                  Message 16 of 22 , Dec 15, 2012
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                                    Ah yes, we poor Sovietologists...

                                    I had the good fortune to go through Checkpoint Charlie in 1988. That was quite an interesting experience, but I had always imagined myself going over it or under it in a sort of MI5/MI6 James Bondian sort of way... sadly it was not to be. Some of the people I trained with ended up as spooks, others of us retrained... 9/11 opened up a whole new world to explore. Even Condaleezza Rice was a little out of her depth when push came to shove; the Cold War realities were much easier to read than the present ones.

                                    Regards, Mark



                                    --- In Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com, Dan Ford <cub06h@...> wrote:
                                    >
                                    > I often wondered what happened to all the Sovietologists in 1991....
                                    >
                                    > - Dan Ford US
                                    >
                                    > On 12/15/2012 6:29 AM, Mark and Oyun wrote:
                                    > > As to seizing the Soviet Union; my career path went on a sharp tangent
                                    > > when the Berlin Wall came down a year after I graduated!
                                    >
                                  • Barry Turner (Journalism)
                                    I was a Sovietologist between 1979 and 1989, although I did not realise it at the time. I had some great experiences of Checkpoint Charlie and Checkpoint
                                    Message 17 of 22 , Dec 15, 2012
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                                      I was a 'Sovietologist' between 1979 and 1989, although I did not realise it at the time. I had some great experiences of Checkpoint Charlie and Checkpoint Alpha and Bravo. Usually in the middle of the night with border guards who were young men who appeared a bloody sight more frightened than I was, after all I could always go home if I did not like it there. I enjoyed the attention of the Stasi when I might otherwise have been lonely in the more remote parts of the GDR and I sat in railway carriages with Soviet soldiers who could not begin to imagine why they were there. Isn't wonderful that those days are GONE!

                                      If anything should be learned from the experiences of those who lived the eastern part of Poland when the deportations took place it is that old men will always find reasons why young men should fight each other for their benefit.



                                      -----Original Message-----
                                      From: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com on behalf of Mark and Oyun
                                      Sent: Sat 15/12/2012 18:11
                                      To: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com
                                      Subject: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Re: Poland and Borderlands from 10 - 15th Century until WWII.


                                      Ah yes, we poor Sovietologists...

                                      I had the good fortune to go through Checkpoint Charlie in 1988. That was quite an interesting experience, but I had always imagined myself going over it or under it in a sort of MI5/MI6 James Bondian sort of way... sadly it was not to be. Some of the people I trained with ended up as spooks, others of us retrained... 9/11 opened up a whole new world to explore. Even Condaleezza Rice was a little out of her depth when push came to shove; the Cold War realities were much easier to read than the present ones.

                                      Regards, Mark



                                      --- In Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com, Dan Ford <cub06h@...> wrote:
                                      >
                                      > I often wondered what happened to all the Sovietologists in 1991....
                                      >
                                      > - Dan Ford US
                                      >
                                      > On 12/15/2012 6:29 AM, Mark and Oyun wrote:
                                      > > As to seizing the Soviet Union; my career path went on a sharp tangent
                                      > > when the Berlin Wall came down a year after I graduated!
                                      >
                                    • Stanislaw Zwierzynski
                                      Dear Barry and Mark! Returning now from guests, I am ready to continue our interesting discussion and open to you, dear Sovietologists some secret Russian
                                      Message 18 of 22 , Dec 15, 2012
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                                        Dear Barry and Mark!

                                        Returning now from guests, I am ready to continue our interesting discussion and open to you, dear Sovietologists some secret Russian existence. It is especially nice to do before Christmas. I want to tell you a little anecdote, I hope that Barry does not offend and accept everything as a Christmas joke.

                                        CIA 15 years preparing superspy Barry, threw him to the Soviet Union, he hid parachute and came to first Russian village and in perfect Russian asked for the first available Russian woman "Please Give water to drink." But she answered him: "I am not fed water to a spy." Barry was scared, ran away into woods, walking, walking, went to train station, went to window and speaks perfect Russian "Sell please ticket to Moscow." But cashier says " We do not sell tickets to American spies " Barry was scared, ran away. Went-went on Russia,  and he was recognized everywhere as a spy. Finally, do not resist, come the KGB and asked them what was the secret of why all Russian people got him (superspy) to core. Old KGB-man says "And if you look in mirror at your face?" To which Barry replies, "but what's there I see new?". A KGB - man to him: "So look! You're a nigger!"

                                        I understand that anecdote is not politically correct, and I understand that some members of our group of U.S. and Canadian condemn me, but I live in Russia and is not yet invented other appropriate word for essence of "Negro" .

                                        In Russia there is one paradigm, which, as I understand it, is not available to Western rational thinking. Sometimes it is expressed in these paradoxical words "The worse, the better." In the Western mentality is probably reads "The worse, the worse."
                                        There are many anecdots on this topic. The task of the USSR was that drive Soviet man in a barrel with filth, and then left who would be  alive, get him - and he had to thank Comrade Stalin for it.
                                        There was even a joke "spring came out, summer came out - thank party (Stalin) for it".

                                        This paradox is based on many intricacies of Russian, including so-called Russian (Soviet) heroism. You see, the Soviet man (as opposed to Western) did not have nearly no property, - nothing to lose ... When  perestroika began -  appear some property, the spirit of "
                                        Soviets" was evaporated until it disappeared.

                                        It is a pity, that now lives in Russia, as elsewhere in world, emasculated, simplified, we are alike.

                                        But that's another story.
                                         Stan.

                                        From: Barry Turner (Journalism) <bturner@...>
                                        To: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com
                                        Sent: Saturday, December 15, 2012 11:25 PM
                                        Subject: RE: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Re: Poland and Borderlands from 10 - 15th Century until WWII.
                                         

                                      • Barry Turner (Journalism)
                                        Stan & Mark It is excellent that we can speak without fear of political correctness and I am not offended by words that we would not say in polite
                                        Message 19 of 22 , Dec 15, 2012
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                                          Stan & Mark

                                          It is excellent that we can speak without fear of political correctness and I am not offended by words that we would not say in polite conversation. No rational person would really think that black people were inferior to us.

                                          I can fully understand how in Russia that racism is still alive and well. My friend who studied for a PhD at Moscow University is from Nigeria and was used to being called a monkey when he bought his ticket for the Metro.

                                          I never qualified for the KGB and the Ministerium fur Staatssicherheitsdienst never quite got the kudos, in spite of he stylish uniform


                                          -----Original Message-----
                                          From: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com on behalf of Stanislaw Zwierzynski
                                          Sent: Sat 15/12/2012 22:46
                                          To: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com
                                          Subject: Re: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Re: Poland and Borderlands from 10 - 15th Century until WWII.

                                          Dear Barry and Mark!

                                          Returning now from guests, I am ready to continue our interesting discussion and open to you, dear Sovietologists some secret Russian existence. It is especially nice to do before Christmas. I want to tell you a little anecdote, I hope that Barry does not offend and accept everything as a Christmas joke.

                                          CIA 15 years preparing superspy Barry, threw him to the Soviet Union, he hid parachute and came to first Russian village and in perfect Russian asked for the first available Russian woman "Please Give water to drink." Butshe answered him: "I am not fed water to a spy." Barry was scared, ran away into woods, walking, walking, went to train station, went to window and speaks perfect Russian "Sell please ticket to Moscow." But cashier says " We do not sell tickets to American spies " Barry was scared, ran away. Went-went on Russia,  and he was recognized everywhere as a spy. Finally, do not resist, come the KGB and asked them what was the secret of why all Russian people got him (superspy) to core. Old KGB-man says "And if you look in mirror at your face?" To which Barry replies, "but what's there I see new?". A KGB - man to him: "So look! You're a nigger!"

                                          I understand that anecdote is not politically correct, and I understand that some members of our group of U.S. and Canadian condemn me, but I live in Russia and is not yet invented other appropriate word for essence of "Negro" .

                                          In Russia there is one paradigm, which, as I understand it, is not available to Western rational thinking. Sometimes it is expressed in these paradoxical words "The worse, the better." In the Western mentality is probably reads "The worse, the worse."
                                          There are many anecdots on thistopic. The task of the USSR was that drive Soviet man in a barrel with filth, and then left who would be  alive, get him - and he had to thank Comrade Stalin for it.
                                          There was even a joke "spring came out, summer came out - thank party (Stalin) for it".

                                          This paradox is based on many intricacies of Russian, including so-called Russian (Soviet) heroism. You see, the Soviet man (as opposed to Western) did not have nearly no property, - nothing to lose ... When  perestroika began -  appear some property, the spirit of "Soviets" was evaporated until it disappeared.

                                          It is a pity, that now lives in Russia, as elsewhere in world, emasculated, simplified, we are alike.

                                          But that's another story.
                                           Stan.



                                          ________________________________
                                          From: Barry Turner (Journalism) <bturner@...>
                                          To: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com
                                          Sent: Saturday, December 15, 2012 11:25 PM
                                          Subject: RE: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Re: Poland and Borderlands from 10 - 15th Century until WWII.


                                           
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