Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

Re: Polish Army locations in USSR

Expand Messages
  • antoni530
    John, there is a lot of mystery about the dates of departures; I am not sure when the 8th div under the control of Col. Bronislaw Rakowski?? moved, but in any
    Message 1 of 65 , Dec 3, 2012
    View Source
    • 0 Attachment
      John,
      there is a lot of mystery about the dates of departures; I am not sure when the 8th div under the control of Col. Bronislaw Rakowski?? moved, but in any case it did not survive in its original complement and many soldiers were re-allocated to other divisions later on in its life. As I recollect; more research is needed.
      antoni530 in UK.



      --- In Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com, John Halucha <john.halucha@...> wrote:
      >
      > This is superb detail, Pan Antoni.
      > Some memoirs talk about boarding ships at Krasnovodsk on March 23 and say the first ships departed March 24, with the last ships of the first exodus landing in Pahlevi April 6 (or I have also seen it given as late as April 10). The 8th Division (or at least part of it, including my father) made the crossing in that period, so I am curious to know when the 8th Division left Chokpak, boarded the ship(s) and / or landed in Pahlevi.
      > It would also be interesting to know on what dates other military units made the Krasnovodsk-Pahlevi crossing.
      > John Halucha
      >
      > Sault Ste Marie, Canada
      >
      >
      >
      > ________________________________
      > From: antoni530 <askazimierski@...>
      > To: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com
      > Sent: Sunday, December 2, 2012 11:06:00 AM
      > Subject: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Re: Polish Army locations in USSR [was List of Polish Evacuees from the USSR to Iran 1942]
      >
      >
      >  
      > Dear John,
      >
      > I am pleased to hear from you; yes, as you say 8ma dywizja and dywizja drogowa as well as sanitarna on 23rd March were at Chok Pack, but I am not sure where they were on the 30th March, but I suspect as it was just a week forward it is likely they might have been at the same place. Julian Siedlecki does not mention of any movement of forces in his book.
      >
      > Pozdrowienia,
      > Antoni in UK
      >
      > --- In Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com, John Halucha <john.halucha@> wrote:
      > >
      > > Dear Antoni,
      > > Do your maps indicate where the 8th Division was on March 30, 1942? Or might you have some other resource in your vast library that says where the 8th Division was on that date? It was earlier at Chok-Pak
      > > (Chokpak) at 42° 37' 0" North, 70° 34' 0" East, but I suspect it had moved by the end of March.
      > >
      > > March 30 is the date my father, the late Jan Hałucha, is recorded as enrolling in the Division just days before joining the exodus to Persia.
      > > Thank you very much for your precious contributions to knowledge and understanding in this forum.
      > > John Halucha
      > > Sault Ste Marie, Canada
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > > ________________________________
      > > From: antoni530 <askazimierski@>
      > > To: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com
      > > Sent: Sunday, December 2, 2012 9:28:57 AM
      > > Subject: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Re: List of Polish Evacuees from the USSR to Iran 1942
      > >
      > >
      > >  
      > > Panie Tadeuszu,
      > >
      > > At Guzar it was a depot of 5ta Dywizja piechoty i PSK recruitment centre; according to the maps I have (Rozmieszczenie Polskich Sil Zbrojnych w obszarze srodkowo-azjackim data 23 ci marzec 1942r)
      > > antoni530 in UK
      > >
      >
    • antoni530
      John, yes, sorry as I thought I sent you the contact to redakcja Tygodnika Polskiego here in UK. It is redakcja@tygodnikpolski.co.uk As you know you open
      Message 65 of 65 , Dec 11, 2012
      View Source
      • 0 Attachment
        John,
        yes, sorry as I thought I sent you the contact to redakcja Tygodnika Polskiego here in UK.
        It is redakcja@...

        As you know you open the Tygodnik and then turn the pages by pressing rt hand bottom corner to go forward or the lh botton corner to open to the beginning; all tygodniki below 133 are via the redakcja.

        Please let us know what you find.
        antoni in UK


        --- In Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com, John Halucha <john.halucha@...> wrote:
        >
        > Thank you very much for the link and the background on the publisher, Janusz.
        > Using the archive it is easy to find issues 45(123) through 9(137) [Nov. 13, 2010 through March 5, 2011] containing parts 23 to 37 (last installment) of this memoir found in an attic.
        > However, I can't get my hands on issues earlier than Nov. 13, 2010 to get the first 22 parts. I already have part 14 thanks to Antoni, and am most interested in part 15 - which probably has dates and details of the 8th Infantry Division boarding ship in Krasnovodsk and landing in Pahlavi.
        > I would be most grateful if you or anyone else can guide me to part 15 and others.
        >
        > Part 23, the earliest I can find, picks up at Qassasin on June 12, 1946.
        >
        > John Halucha
        > Sault Ste Marie, Canada
        >
        >
        >
        > ________________________________
        > From: JanZ <janz@...>
        > To: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com
        > Sent: Monday, December 10, 2012 6:06:46 PM
        > Subject: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Re: 8th Division, Andrew Lopianowski journal
        >
        >
        >  
        > 
        > John,
        >  
        > The Tygodnik Polski is published by Pan Mleczko, who owns a
        > chain of Polish delicatessens in West London.
        >  
        > Pan Mleczko was a deportee, and his father was an Osadnik. The
        > magazine usually includes an article about the experiences of the
        > deported.
        >  
        > You can see the back issues here http://tygodnikpolski.co.uk/archiwum-2/
        >  
        > Janusz
        >  
        >  
        > >----- Original Message -----
        > >From: John Halucha
        > >To: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com
        > >Sent: Thursday, December 06, 2012 12:17 AM
        > >Subject: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Re: 8th Division, Andrew Lopianowski journal
        > >
        > > 
        > >This is a tantalizing article, Pan Antoni. As I understand it, the 8th Division started travelling to Guzar from Chok Pak on March 23. The journey is only about 315 km "as the crow flies" but probably farther by train through the mountains between. But even if it arrived on March 24, the article says: "It was not until the fourth day we were in Guzar that we were provisioned..." which indicates they were probably still at Guzar on March 27 or so.
        > >When did the Division embark for Krasnovodsk, 1,720 kilometres to the west?
        > >When did it arrive at Krasnovodsk, and when did it cross the Caspian Sea to Pahlevi? I know that my father was in the first exodus in March-April 1942, so it had to be around this time.
        > >Since this information comes from Part 14 of the journal, these questions and more might be answered in following issues of Mleczko tygodnik polski. This one is Nr 36(114) 11.09.2010.
        > >
        > >Could you explain how to find later editions to see if they have more of the journal? I can't even figure out how you found this one - that is some very impressive access to resources.
        > >This may indeed be the journal to which Andrew Lopianowski was referring. I am still hoping to see Andrew's journal just in case it is different and has yet more information.
        > >Thanks very much for sharing this link, Pan Antoni. It has opened a whole new path for detective work that may finally answer where my father was on March 30 when he is officially documented as having joined the 8th Infantry Division.
        > >
        > >
        > >John Halucha
        > >Sault Ste Marie, Canada
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >________________________________
        > > From: antoni530 <askazimierski@...>
        > >To: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com
        > >Sent: Tuesday, December 4, 2012 10:26:28 AM
        > >Subject: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Re: 8th Division, Andrew Lopianowski journal [was Polish Army locations in USSR]
        > >
        > >
        > > 
        > >Hello John,
        > >
        > >I am wondering if this is the journal you are
        > referring to in your note;
        > >
        > >http://content.yudu.com/Library/A1p4iy/tygodnikPolski114/resources/10.htm
        > >I
        > am not sure where this extract comes from, but it is in reference to the date
        > you mentioned, namely 23rd March 1942.
        > >Please check it out.
        > >Antoni
        > K
        > >
        > >--- In Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com, John Halucha <john.halucha@> wrote:
        > >>
        > >> Thank you Antoni,
        > Stephen and others for contributing to this exploration of the 8th Infantry
        > Division.
        > >> Seven years ago Andrew Lopianowski posted about a journal
        > his grandfather had, which may have included information and a map about the
        > 8th (messages from 17337 to 17687).
        > >> Andrew, if you see this, can you
        > reply here or contact me personally at
        > >>
        > john.halucha[at]yahoo.com
        > >> Romuald Lipinski and Zbigniew (Styrna?)
        > offered help with translation, and Elzunia Olsson had an interesting exchange
        > about a map that is with the journal.
        > >> However, I can't find the
        > journal or map posted anywhere, nor can I find anything else posted about it
        > since that time. Can anyone point me in the right direction?
        > >> I tried
        > to send an email to Andrew at his 2005-6 address
        > <alopia[at]attglobal.net> but it just now bounced back as undeliverable.
        > If anyone can provide a new link for Andrew, I will be happy to try
        > again.
        > >> John Halucha
        > >> Sault Ste Marie, Canada
        > >>
        > >>
        > >>
        > >> ________________________________
        > >> From: antoni530
        > <askazimierski@>
        > >> To: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com
        > >> Sent: Monday, December 3, 2012 6:31:39 AM
        > >> Subject:
        > [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Re: Polish Army locations in USSR
        > >>
        > >>
        > >>  
        > >> John,
        > >>
        > >> If you look at http://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/8_Dywizja_Piechoty_(PSZ)
        > >>
        > it suggests that the 8 division evacuated between 24th March and 4th April
        > 1942. On arrival into Persia was not re-established in that format. In October
        > that year about 5,000 of its soldiers arrived in Scotland as part of the
        > Polish Forces in UK.
        > >>
        > >> --- In Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com, STEPHEN STELMASZUK <stephen.stelmaszuk@> wrote:
        > >> >
        > >>
        > > John dad's record say's he enlisted 1/3/42 and was posted to the 8th
        > also.Say's he came under British command in Iran 1/4/42after evacuation.No
        > mention of where from.Stephen.
        > >> >
        > >> >
        > >> >
        > ________________________________
        > >> > From: antoni530
        > <askazimierski@>
        > >> > To: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com
        > >> > Sent: Monday, 3 December 2012, 10:18
        > >> > Subject:
        > [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Re: Polish Army locations in USSR
        > >> >
        > >> >
        > >> > ÃÆ'‚ 
        > >> >
        > >> >
        > John,
        > >> > there is a lot of mystery about the dates of departures; I
        > am not sure when the 8th div under the control of Col. Bronislaw Rakowski??
        > moved, but in any case it did not survive in its original complement and many
        > soldiers were re-allocated to other divisions later on in its life. As I
        > recollect; more research is needed.
        > >> > antoni530 in UK.
        > >> >
        > >> > --- In Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com, John Halucha <john.halucha@> wrote:
        > >> > >
        > >> > >
        > This is superb detail, Pan Antoni.
        > >> > > Some memoirs talk about
        > boarding ships at Krasnovodsk on March 23 and say the first ships departed
        > March 24, with the last ships of the first exodus landing in Pahlevi April 6
        > (or I have also seen it given as late as April 10). The 8th Division (or at
        > least part of it, including my father) made the crossing in that period, so I
        > am curious to know when the 8th Division left Chokpak, boarded the ship(s) and
        > / or landed in Pahlevi.
        > >> > > It would also be interesting to know
        > on what dates other military units made the Krasnovodsk-Pahlevi
        > crossing.
        > >> > > John Halucha
        > >> > >
        > >> > >
        > Sault Ste Marie, Canada
        > >> > >
        > >> > >
        > >> >
        > >
        > >> > > ________________________________
        > >> > >
        > From: antoni530 <askazimierski@>
        > >> > > To: Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com
        > >> > > Sent: Sunday, December 2, 2012 11:06:00 AM
        > >> >
        > > Subject: [www.Kresy-Siberia.org] Re: Polish Army locations in USSR [was
        > List of Polish Evacuees from the USSR to Iran 1942]
        > >> > >
        > >>
        > > >
        > >> > > ÃÆ'ƒâ€šÃÆ'‚ 
        > >> > > Dear
        > John,
        > >> > >
        > >> > > I am pleased to hear from you; yes,
        > as you say 8ma dywizja and dywizja drogowa as well as sanitarna on 23rd March
        > were at Chok Pack, but I am not sure where they were on the 30th March, but I
        > suspect as it was just a week forward it is likely they might have been at the
        > same place. Julian Siedlecki does not mention of any movement of forces in his
        > book.
        > >> > >
        > >> > > Pozdrowienia,
        > >> > >
        > Antoni in UK
        > >> > >
        > >> > > --- In Kresy-Siberia@yahoogroups.com, John Halucha <john.halucha@> wrote:
        > >> > > >
        > >> >
        > > > Dear Antoni,
        > >> > > > Do your maps indicate where the
        > 8th Division was on March 30, 1942? Or might you have some other resource in
        > your vast library that says where the 8th Division was on that date? It was
        > earlier at Chok-Pak
        > >> > > > (Chokpak) at 42ÃÆ'Į'ÃÆ'¢â‚¬Å¡ÃÆ'ƒâ€šÃÆ'‚°
        > 37' 0" North, 70ÃÆ'Į'ÃÆ'¢â‚¬Å¡ÃÆ'ƒâ€šÃÆ'‚° 34' 0" East, but I suspect it had moved
        > by the end of March.
        > >> > > >
        > >> > > > March 30
        > is the date my father, the late Jan HaÃÆ'Į'ÃÆ'¢â‚¬Â¦ÃÆ'ƒÂ¢ÃÆ'¢â€šÂ¬ÃÆ'…¡ucha, is
        > recorded as enrolling in the Division just days before joining the exodus to
        > Persia.
        > >> > > > Thank you very much for your precious
        > contributions to knowledge and understanding in this forum.
        > >> > >
        > > John Halucha
        > >> > > > Sault Ste Marie,
        > Canada
        > >>
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        >
      Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.