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Re: [Kartarpur] Kara case involving a South Wales school - Statement by the Sikh Federation (UK)

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  • Tarlochan S. Nahal
    Dear Jaidev Kohli, If you are not a Sikh and have not taken amrit, you have no experience of Amrit you have no right to decide for the Sikh community whether
    Message 1 of 5 , Jul 31, 2008
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      Dear Jaidev Kohli,
       
      If you are not a Sikh and have not taken amrit, you have no experience of Amrit you have no right to decide for the Sikh community whether Kirpan is an exception or not. By saying that "is was used while recruiting soldiers for Khalsa army" you are suggesting it has no relevance now! The five Ks are here because it is the order of the Guru Gobind Singh.
       
      Please keep your personal half-witted thoughts to yourself and do not interfere in Sikh affairs. Amrit ceremony is a spirtual experience and a spiritual ceremony. Khalsa is first a saint and then a soldier. The Sikh Reht was established by Guru Gobind Singh himself and not dictated by the Jathedars. You better read the Sikh history before making such horrendous, anti-Sikh statements.
       
      Tarlochan Singh 
       
      ----- Original Message -----
      Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2008 4:49 AM
      Subject: Re: [Kartarpur] Kara case involving a South Wales school - Statement by the Sikh Federation (UK)

      Gur Fateh. Wearing Kara or any K's is NOT a matter of faith but a matter of personal choice. One should wear what he or she likes and Govenments or schools have no right to stop them from doing so. Kirpan is an exception, it being a lethal weapon, it can be used to wound or kill some one. Here School or Govt. authorities have right to interfer and ask the individual not to wear kirpan. Amritsation is ceremony to take solemon vow to be faithful and loyal to cause, whatever it be. It was used while recruiting soldiers for Khalsa army and also to initiate some one into Sikh religion. But it is taking a vow, there is nothing spirtual about it. Recite so many paths, eat no meat or drink no alcohol are restrictions put by Jathedars not by Gurbani.
      Warm love and kind regards to all.
                        JaiDev

      --- On Wed, 7/30/08, jagtar singh <jagtarkhalsa@...> wrote:
      From: jagtar singh <jagtarkhalsa@...>
      Subject: [Kartarpur] Kara case involving a South Wales school - Statement by the Sikh Federation (UK)
      To: "sikh agenda 3" <sikhagenda3@yahoogroups.com>
      Received: Wednesday, July 30, 2008, 2:26 PM

      Kara case involving a South Wales school

      Statement by the Sikh Federation (UK)


      The Sikh Federation (UK) has been involved with the Kara case involving a South Wales school when first approached by the family via Guru Nanak Gurdwara, Sedgley Street, Wolverhampton in October 2007.

      The Federation has no regrets whatsoever in helping the family and in re-asserting the legal right of ALL Sikhs (Amritdhari and non-Amritdhari) to practice their faith and not to have any of their articles of faith removed by a school, employer etc. It has been a shame that Sikhs have had to return to the courts 25 years after the historic Mandla v Lee case in the House of Lords in 1983 that afforded Sikhs (and Jews, but not others) this right.

      There is so much that many do not know about what the family has gone through. No family, Sikh or non-Sikh family, should have to experience, the discrimination, verbal and physical attacks etc. they have endured. Anyone calling themselves a Sikh should be prepared to stand up for such families as a matter of principle and if they truly understand the teachings of our Gurus and continue to live their lives as Sikhs.

      We agree 100% that every Sikh should aspire to become an Amritdhari. The courts understand this and it was excellent to hear Sarika in January 2008 outside the Welsh Assembly publicly express her desire to become an Amritdhari to hundreds of Sikhs and the media. She should be given time to learn more about the faith she has chosen and we should all help her in her desire to be blessed with Amrit.

      It is a real shame that some Sikhs posting on discussion forums or speaking publicly on radio are being very narrow minded and believe only Amritdhari Sikhs should have the right to wear the Kara or fight such cases. It is difficult for anyone to argue the Panj kakkars do not have equal status, although some would make a special case for Kesh. However, if we were to accept the argument of those that say 'only Amritdhari Sikhs have the absolute right to any of the kakkars' would they be silent and in agreement if tomorrow all schools and employers in the UK said Sikhs had to remove their Kesh unless they were an Amritdhari if they wanted to go to school or work. We suspect there would be (and rightly so) a huge outcry by Sikhs and non-Sikhs.

      In short those (particularly some Amritdhari Sikhs) that are quick to criticise Sarika or any other Sikh that is aspiring to become an Amritdhari Sikh need to realise their views on this would and do turn people away from Sikhi. How should a younger Sikh go about moving towards Amrit and adopting each of the panj kakkars if Amritdhari Sikhs held such views on an all or nothing approach.

      Many organisations (Sikh and non-Sikh) have been involved in this successful campaign and all should be congratulated and supported in similar endeavours.

      The Sikh Federation (UK) was instrumental in introducing Liberty to the family and advising both along the way. Winning over political support e.g. the local MP Ann Clwyd by using the influence of other politicians, getting the local education authority to withdraw support from the school, organising a successful protest outside the Welsh Assembly that resulted in new guidance being issued to schools the same week and the successful petition by over 200 Sikh Gurdwaras and other organisations that was submitted to 10 Downing Street just before the case was heard in the High Court were just some of the activities where the Sikh Federation (UK) took the lead - despite criticism of the sort we see from a small group of Sikhs, the secular extremists, some other religious groups that believe Sikhs get special treatment and activists from right wing groups.

      Gurjeet Singh
      National Press Secretary
      Sikh Federation (UK)


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    • jshundal@aol.com
      ?AMRIT KIRTAN August 2008 edition is attached. ? The ONLY monthly magazine devoted to Gurmat Sangeet (Kirtan). It has been continously published since 1989. It
      Message 2 of 5 , Aug 1, 2008
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         AMRIT KIRTAN August 2008 edition is attached.
         
        The ONLY monthly magazine devoted to Gurmat Sangeet (Kirtan).
        It has been continously published since 1989.
        It gives information about Ragis, Gurmat Sangeet, Keertan, Books about Kirtan and Gurmabni.
        It is being edited by Dr. Jagir Singh. (Ex Deputy Director, Punjab School Education Board).
        I recommend that you subscribe to and support this monthly dedicated to Keertan (we need more such magazine dedicated to certain aspects of Sikhism).
        This may not meet ALL your expectaions but it is a good start.
      • chattar saini
        Jai Dev, It is not sure which Planet are you descending from, but if SHIV LING can be considered an item of faith for young and unmarried girls (with
        Message 3 of 5 , Aug 3, 2008
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          Jai Dev,
           
          It is not sure which Planet are you descending from, but if SHIV LING can be considered an item of faith for young and unmarried girls (with explanation) than be rest assured the 5 Ks with  their UNIVERSAL  comprehensive and ethical values and which are not only religiously acceptable but also were acceptable under UNESCO's proceedings as the only way(Sikh Way) to save this Planet on which U R NOW !!!!!!!!!
           
          Or hand the SHIV LINGA to the World Body to raise and equip another DEV LOUK Army of Jai Devas, fools  like you.
           
          Wake up!!!!!!!!  

          SAINI, CHATTAR SINGH


          To: Kartarpur@yahoogroups.com
          From: jaidev_kohli@...
          Date: Thu, 31 Jul 2008 04:49:49 -0700
          Subject: Re: [Kartarpur] Kara case involving a South Wales school - Statement by the Sikh Federation (UK)



          Gur Fateh. Wearing Kara or any K's is NOT a matter of faith but a matter of personal choice. One should wear what he or she likes and Govenments or schools have no right to stop them from doing so. Kirpan is an exception, it being a lethal weapon, it can be used to wound or kill some one. Here School or Govt. authorities have right to interfer and ask the individual not to wear kirpan. Amritsation is ceremony to take solemon vow to be faithful and loyal to cause, whatever it be. It was used while recruiting soldiers for Khalsa army and also to initiate some one into Sikh religion. But it is taking a vow, there is nothing spirtual about it. Recite so many paths, eat no meat or drink no alcohol are restrictions put by Jathedars not by Gurbani.
          Warm love and kind regards to all.
                            JaiDev

          --- On Wed, 7/30/08, jagtar singh <jagtarkhalsa@ yahoo.com> wrote:
          From: jagtar singh <jagtarkhalsa@ yahoo.com>
          Subject: [Kartarpur] Kara case involving a South Wales school - Statement by the Sikh Federation (UK)
          To: "sikh agenda 3" <sikhagenda3@ yahoogroups. com>
          Received: Wednesday, July 30, 2008, 2:26 PM

          Kara case involving a South Wales school

          Statement by the Sikh Federation (UK)


          The Sikh Federation (UK) has been involved with the Kara case involving a South Wales school when first approached by the family via Guru Nanak Gurdwara, Sedgley Street, Wolverhampton in October 2007.

          The Federation has no regrets whatsoever in helping the family and in re-asserting the legal right of ALL Sikhs (Amritdhari and non-Amritdhari) to practice their faith and not to have any of their articles of faith removed by a school, employer etc. It has been a shame that Sikhs have had to return to the courts 25 years after the historic Mandla v Lee case in the House of Lords in 1983 that afforded Sikhs (and Jews, but not others) this right.

          There is so much that many do not know about what the family has gone through. No family, Sikh or non-Sikh family, should have to experience, the discrimination, verbal and physical attacks etc. they have endured. Anyone calling themselves a Sikh should be prepared to stand up for such families as a matter of principle and if they truly understand the teachings of our Gurus and continue to live their lives as Sikhs.

          We agree 100% that every Sikh should aspire to become an Amritdhari. The courts understand this and it was excellent to hear Sarika in January 2008 outside the Welsh Assembly publicly express her desire to become an Amritdhari to hundreds of Sikhs and the media. She should be given time to learn more about the faith she has chosen and we should all help her in her desire to be blessed with Amrit.

          It is a real shame that some Sikhs posting on discussion forums or speaking publicly on radio are being very narrow minded and believe only Amritdhari Sikhs should have the right to wear the Kara or fight such cases. It is difficult for anyone to argue the Panj kakkars do not have equal status, although some would make a special case for Kesh. However, if we were to accept the argument of those that say 'only Amritdhari Sikhs have the absolute right to any of the kakkars' would they be silent and in agreement if tomorrow all schools and employers in the UK said Sikhs had to remove their Kesh unless they were an Amritdhari if they wanted to go to school or work. We suspect there would be (and rightly so) a huge outcry by Sikhs and non-Sikhs.

          In short those (particularly some Amritdhari Sikhs) that are quick to criticise Sarika or any other Sikh that is aspiring to become an Amritdhari Sikh need to realise their views on this would and do turn people away from Sikhi. How should a younger Sikh go about moving towards Amrit and adopting each of the panj kakkars if Amritdhari Sikhs held such views on an all or nothing approach.

          Many organisations (Sikh and non-Sikh) have been involved in this successful campaign and all should be congratulated and supported in similar endeavours.

          The Sikh Federation (UK) was instrumental in introducing Liberty to the family and advising both along the way. Winning over political support e.g. the local MP Ann Clwyd by using the influence of other politicians, getting the local education authority to withdraw support from the school, organising a successful protest outside the Welsh Assembly that resulted in new guidance being issued to schools the same week and the successful petition by over 200 Sikh Gurdwaras and other organisations that was submitted to 10 Downing Street just before the case was heard in the High Court were just some of the activities where the Sikh Federation (UK) took the lead - despite criticism of the sort we see from a small group of Sikhs, the secular extremists, some other religious groups that believe Sikhs get special treatment and activists from right wing groups.

          Gurjeet Singh
          National Press Secretary
          Sikh Federation (UK)



          Yahoo! Canada Toolbar : Search from anywhere on the web and bookmark your favourite sites. Download it now!




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