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Re: [Julian-May-discuss]Lord of the Rings

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  • clarissafarrington
    Hiya Nic I love the Silmarillion but it is a hard read. It is not a story as more a collection of stories that tie together - does that make sense. But it is
    Message 1 of 7 , Feb 7, 2002
      Hiya Nic

      I love the Silmarillion but it is a hard read. It is not a story as
      more a collection of stories that tie together - does that make
      sense. But it is beautiful. Some of the writing is wonderful, dark
      and glorious. The man was a genuis. The sheer scope of his
      imagination defies comprehension.

      Cheers

      --- In Julian-May-discuss@y..., "Nicolette Lewer" <nicolel@i...>
      wrote:
      > Hiya,
      >
      > I don't feel that that JM's books are *exactly* like LOTR
      (certainly in the
      > 'Pliocene Companion' JM makes quite a few references to Wagner's
      works
      > rather than LOTR) but I think Tolkien started the trend of having
      the story
      > 'Companions setting out on a quest to find/destroy the magic Thing
      and kill
      > the Dark Lord' and authors who came after thought 'gee this is a
      good idea'.
      >
      > I think it is annoying as well that every new series is compared to
      LOTR.
      > The SF & fantasy book of quotations 'Ghastly Beyond Belief' points
      this out
      > and says that in marketing jargon it is called 'positioning' -
      making
      > something unknown familar to the consumer by comparing it with
      something
      > known. After all, I think if you asked the average person in the
      street to
      > name a fantasy series they would probably say 'LOTR' (or give a
      blank look).
      >
      > Clarissa, is the 'Simarillion' worth reading? I've only read 'The
      Hobbit' &
      > the 3 LOTR books myself and I've never got around to reading his
      other
      > works...
      >
      > High Thoughts
      > - Nicolette :-)
      >
      > ----- Original Message -----
      > From: "clarissafarrington" <clarissafarrington@b...>
      > To: <Julian-May-discuss@y...>
      > Sent: Tuesday, January 29, 2002 7:03 PM
      > Subject: Re: [Julian-May-discuss]Lord of the Rings
      >
      >
      > > Hi All
      > >
      > > long time no talk. I have reentered the workforce and this has
      > > curtailled my contributions somewhat.
      > >
      > > 1. I am up for the group read - tell me where and when!
      > >
      > > 2. Tolkien is one of my favourite all time authors. I read LOTR
      > > when I was 10 and reread at least once a year. I have read the
      > > Silmarillion and other works too. (loved the movie!)
      > >
      > > Anyway - as Bob says Tolkien kind of started the whole thing -
      > > taking out the folklore basis that most authors use. Most do not
      have
      > > hobbits but most fantasy has:
      > >
      > > The Quest
      > > The Jewel/sword/necklace/ring/etc
      > > Older guide/wizard/mage
      > > Bad guy is close to taking over the world - forces of good are
      > > outnumbered.
      > > Strong hero type who is more noble than he seems.
      > >
      > > and so on. Some move away slightly but that seems to be about it.
      > >
      > > On the critics - you are right BTBG, they do compare everyone to
      > > Tolkien and they did do so with JM. Personally, I do not think
      there
      > > is a hell of a lot similar about them. There are more similar
      works
      > > out there. I think they use the comparison on covers to get
      suckers
      > > like me in!
      > >
      > > Clarissa
      > >
      > >
      > > --- In Julian-May-discuss@y..., "bob" <pallol@b...> wrote:
      > > > The problem is that Tolkien has become so tied to Fantasy that
      it
      > > is almost impossible not to be described as derivative if you so
      much
      > > as venture into the genre. Lets not forget, Tolkien himself drew
      on
      > > the same myths and legends as JM (and others), so some crossover
      is
      > > almost inevitable.
      > > >
      > > > As long as nobody creates another book about chasing a ring or
      > > involving Hobbits, I leave the comparisons alone - only the
      writer's
      > > themselves know where their thoughts originated and as long as the
      > > story brings something fresh and enjoyable to the genre, more
      power
      > > to them.
      > > >
      > > > On a side issue, my own bugbear is the universal phrase dragged
      out
      > > by every hack who calls themselves a critic. 'Destined to rival
      Lord
      > > of the Rings as a fantasy classic.' Words to that effect have been
      > > used to describe:
      > > >
      > > > Stephen Donaldson: Thomas Covenant
      > > > J.K Rowling: Harry Potter
      > > > Stephen King and Peter Straub: Talisman
      > > > Stephen King alone: Dark Tower
      > > > Julian May: Saga of the Exiles...
      > > >
      > > > Sad isn't that the critics can't show a modicum of creativity to
      > > rival the authors they're critical about.
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > > ----- Original Message -----
      > > > From: peta smith
      > > > To: Julian-May-discuss@y...
      > > > Sent: Sunday, January 27, 2002 1:04 PM
      > > > Subject: Re: [Julian-May-discuss]Lord of the Rings
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > > Terry Brooks, Jordan, Feist, Katharine Kerr and Donaldson are
      > > authors who I
      > > > think have been influenced by Tolkien. I have always
      particularly
      > > liked
      > > > Julian May because her works DO NOT seem to draw on his
      > > ideas.
      > > >
      > > > Peta
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > > At 09:20 AM 1/25/02 -0000, you wrote:
      > > > >
      > > > >Last night I saw 'Lord of the Rings' for the second time
      (yes, I
      > > know I
      > > > >should have seen it more than that by now <g> ). It's one of
      the
      > > best
      > > > >fantasy films I have ever seen. I couldn't help thinking how
      the
      > > books
      > > > >themselves have influenced so much fantasy literature (most
      of
      > > it crap) over
      > > > >the years, including JM's books. I'll take the chance to
      start a
      > > new thread
      > > > >by saying how much do you think the Saga of the Exiles has
      been
      > > influenced
      > > > >by Lord of the Rings? I'll make the point that both works
      seem
      > > to dwell on
      > > > >people being obsessed with gold jewellery...
      > > > >
      > > > >Thoughts anyone?
      > > > >
      > > > >High Thoughts
      > > > >
      > > > >- Nicolette :-)
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > >
      > >
      >_____________________________________________________________________
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      > > >
      > >
      >_____________________________________________________________________
      > > ___
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      > > > >
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    • nicoletteb5
      Hiya Clarissa, Hmm...I wouldn t mind reading it. Hopefully the library will have it because the Simarillion is all boxed up in plastic at the bookshops so you
      Message 2 of 7 , Feb 9, 2002
        Hiya Clarissa,

        Hmm...I wouldn't mind reading it. Hopefully the library will have it
        because the Simarillion is all boxed up in plastic at the bookshops so
        you can't have a quick flick through to see what it's like. Not
        surprisingly, some bookshops are devoting whole sections of shelves to
        LoTR books - you need a map to get through it! <g>.

        High Thoughts
        - Nicolette :-)

        --- In Julian-May-discuss@y..., "clarissafarrington"
        <clarissafarrington@b...> wrote:
        > Hiya Nic
        >
        > I love the Silmarillion but it is a hard read. It is not a story as
        > more a collection of stories that tie together - does that make
        > sense. But it is beautiful. Some of the writing is wonderful, dark
        > and glorious. The man was a genuis. The sheer scope of his
        > imagination defies comprehension.
        >
        > Cheers
        >
        > --- In Julian-May-discuss@y..., "Nicolette Lewer" <nicolel@i...>
        > wrote:
        > > Hiya,
        > >
        > > I don't feel that that JM's books are *exactly* like LOTR
        > (certainly in the
        > > 'Pliocene Companion' JM makes quite a few references to Wagner's
        > works
        > > rather than LOTR) but I think Tolkien started the trend of having
        > the story
        > > 'Companions setting out on a quest to find/destroy the magic Thing
        > and kill
        > > the Dark Lord' and authors who came after thought 'gee this is a
        > good idea'.
        > >
        > > I think it is annoying as well that every new series is compared to
        > LOTR.
        > > The SF & fantasy book of quotations 'Ghastly Beyond Belief' points
        > this out
        > > and says that in marketing jargon it is called 'positioning' -
        > making
        > > something unknown familar to the consumer by comparing it with
        > something
        > > known. After all, I think if you asked the average person in the
        > street to
        > > name a fantasy series they would probably say 'LOTR' (or give a
        > blank look).
        > >
        > > Clarissa, is the 'Simarillion' worth reading? I've only read 'The
        > Hobbit' &
        > > the 3 LOTR books myself and I've never got around to reading his
        > other
        > > works...
        > >
        > > High Thoughts
        > > - Nicolette :-)
        > >
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