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Re: [Julian-May-discuss]Lord of the Rings

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  • clarissafarrington
    Hiya Nic I love the Silmarillion but it is a hard read. It is not a story as more a collection of stories that tie together - does that make sense. But it is
    Message 1 of 7 , Feb 7, 2002
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      Hiya Nic

      I love the Silmarillion but it is a hard read. It is not a story as
      more a collection of stories that tie together - does that make
      sense. But it is beautiful. Some of the writing is wonderful, dark
      and glorious. The man was a genuis. The sheer scope of his
      imagination defies comprehension.

      Cheers

      --- In Julian-May-discuss@y..., "Nicolette Lewer" <nicolel@i...>
      wrote:
      > Hiya,
      >
      > I don't feel that that JM's books are *exactly* like LOTR
      (certainly in the
      > 'Pliocene Companion' JM makes quite a few references to Wagner's
      works
      > rather than LOTR) but I think Tolkien started the trend of having
      the story
      > 'Companions setting out on a quest to find/destroy the magic Thing
      and kill
      > the Dark Lord' and authors who came after thought 'gee this is a
      good idea'.
      >
      > I think it is annoying as well that every new series is compared to
      LOTR.
      > The SF & fantasy book of quotations 'Ghastly Beyond Belief' points
      this out
      > and says that in marketing jargon it is called 'positioning' -
      making
      > something unknown familar to the consumer by comparing it with
      something
      > known. After all, I think if you asked the average person in the
      street to
      > name a fantasy series they would probably say 'LOTR' (or give a
      blank look).
      >
      > Clarissa, is the 'Simarillion' worth reading? I've only read 'The
      Hobbit' &
      > the 3 LOTR books myself and I've never got around to reading his
      other
      > works...
      >
      > High Thoughts
      > - Nicolette :-)
      >
      > ----- Original Message -----
      > From: "clarissafarrington" <clarissafarrington@b...>
      > To: <Julian-May-discuss@y...>
      > Sent: Tuesday, January 29, 2002 7:03 PM
      > Subject: Re: [Julian-May-discuss]Lord of the Rings
      >
      >
      > > Hi All
      > >
      > > long time no talk. I have reentered the workforce and this has
      > > curtailled my contributions somewhat.
      > >
      > > 1. I am up for the group read - tell me where and when!
      > >
      > > 2. Tolkien is one of my favourite all time authors. I read LOTR
      > > when I was 10 and reread at least once a year. I have read the
      > > Silmarillion and other works too. (loved the movie!)
      > >
      > > Anyway - as Bob says Tolkien kind of started the whole thing -
      > > taking out the folklore basis that most authors use. Most do not
      have
      > > hobbits but most fantasy has:
      > >
      > > The Quest
      > > The Jewel/sword/necklace/ring/etc
      > > Older guide/wizard/mage
      > > Bad guy is close to taking over the world - forces of good are
      > > outnumbered.
      > > Strong hero type who is more noble than he seems.
      > >
      > > and so on. Some move away slightly but that seems to be about it.
      > >
      > > On the critics - you are right BTBG, they do compare everyone to
      > > Tolkien and they did do so with JM. Personally, I do not think
      there
      > > is a hell of a lot similar about them. There are more similar
      works
      > > out there. I think they use the comparison on covers to get
      suckers
      > > like me in!
      > >
      > > Clarissa
      > >
      > >
      > > --- In Julian-May-discuss@y..., "bob" <pallol@b...> wrote:
      > > > The problem is that Tolkien has become so tied to Fantasy that
      it
      > > is almost impossible not to be described as derivative if you so
      much
      > > as venture into the genre. Lets not forget, Tolkien himself drew
      on
      > > the same myths and legends as JM (and others), so some crossover
      is
      > > almost inevitable.
      > > >
      > > > As long as nobody creates another book about chasing a ring or
      > > involving Hobbits, I leave the comparisons alone - only the
      writer's
      > > themselves know where their thoughts originated and as long as the
      > > story brings something fresh and enjoyable to the genre, more
      power
      > > to them.
      > > >
      > > > On a side issue, my own bugbear is the universal phrase dragged
      out
      > > by every hack who calls themselves a critic. 'Destined to rival
      Lord
      > > of the Rings as a fantasy classic.' Words to that effect have been
      > > used to describe:
      > > >
      > > > Stephen Donaldson: Thomas Covenant
      > > > J.K Rowling: Harry Potter
      > > > Stephen King and Peter Straub: Talisman
      > > > Stephen King alone: Dark Tower
      > > > Julian May: Saga of the Exiles...
      > > >
      > > > Sad isn't that the critics can't show a modicum of creativity to
      > > rival the authors they're critical about.
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > > ----- Original Message -----
      > > > From: peta smith
      > > > To: Julian-May-discuss@y...
      > > > Sent: Sunday, January 27, 2002 1:04 PM
      > > > Subject: Re: [Julian-May-discuss]Lord of the Rings
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > > Terry Brooks, Jordan, Feist, Katharine Kerr and Donaldson are
      > > authors who I
      > > > think have been influenced by Tolkien. I have always
      particularly
      > > liked
      > > > Julian May because her works DO NOT seem to draw on his
      > > ideas.
      > > >
      > > > Peta
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > > At 09:20 AM 1/25/02 -0000, you wrote:
      > > > >
      > > > >Last night I saw 'Lord of the Rings' for the second time
      (yes, I
      > > know I
      > > > >should have seen it more than that by now <g> ). It's one of
      the
      > > best
      > > > >fantasy films I have ever seen. I couldn't help thinking how
      the
      > > books
      > > > >themselves have influenced so much fantasy literature (most
      of
      > > it crap) over
      > > > >the years, including JM's books. I'll take the chance to
      start a
      > > new thread
      > > > >by saying how much do you think the Saga of the Exiles has
      been
      > > influenced
      > > > >by Lord of the Rings? I'll make the point that both works
      seem
      > > to dwell on
      > > > >people being obsessed with gold jewellery...
      > > > >
      > > > >Thoughts anyone?
      > > > >
      > > > >High Thoughts
      > > > >
      > > > >- Nicolette :-)
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > >
      > >
      >_____________________________________________________________________
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      > > >
      > >
      >_____________________________________________________________________
      > > ___
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      > > > >
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    • nicoletteb5
      Hiya Clarissa, Hmm...I wouldn t mind reading it. Hopefully the library will have it because the Simarillion is all boxed up in plastic at the bookshops so you
      Message 2 of 7 , Feb 9, 2002
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        Hiya Clarissa,

        Hmm...I wouldn't mind reading it. Hopefully the library will have it
        because the Simarillion is all boxed up in plastic at the bookshops so
        you can't have a quick flick through to see what it's like. Not
        surprisingly, some bookshops are devoting whole sections of shelves to
        LoTR books - you need a map to get through it! <g>.

        High Thoughts
        - Nicolette :-)

        --- In Julian-May-discuss@y..., "clarissafarrington"
        <clarissafarrington@b...> wrote:
        > Hiya Nic
        >
        > I love the Silmarillion but it is a hard read. It is not a story as
        > more a collection of stories that tie together - does that make
        > sense. But it is beautiful. Some of the writing is wonderful, dark
        > and glorious. The man was a genuis. The sheer scope of his
        > imagination defies comprehension.
        >
        > Cheers
        >
        > --- In Julian-May-discuss@y..., "Nicolette Lewer" <nicolel@i...>
        > wrote:
        > > Hiya,
        > >
        > > I don't feel that that JM's books are *exactly* like LOTR
        > (certainly in the
        > > 'Pliocene Companion' JM makes quite a few references to Wagner's
        > works
        > > rather than LOTR) but I think Tolkien started the trend of having
        > the story
        > > 'Companions setting out on a quest to find/destroy the magic Thing
        > and kill
        > > the Dark Lord' and authors who came after thought 'gee this is a
        > good idea'.
        > >
        > > I think it is annoying as well that every new series is compared to
        > LOTR.
        > > The SF & fantasy book of quotations 'Ghastly Beyond Belief' points
        > this out
        > > and says that in marketing jargon it is called 'positioning' -
        > making
        > > something unknown familar to the consumer by comparing it with
        > something
        > > known. After all, I think if you asked the average person in the
        > street to
        > > name a fantasy series they would probably say 'LOTR' (or give a
        > blank look).
        > >
        > > Clarissa, is the 'Simarillion' worth reading? I've only read 'The
        > Hobbit' &
        > > the 3 LOTR books myself and I've never got around to reading his
        > other
        > > works...
        > >
        > > High Thoughts
        > > - Nicolette :-)
        > >
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