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RE: [JewishKeidan] Mogel Family

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  • Linda Dubins
    Does anyone know anything about my great grand father Nasaniel Aron Dubinsky? To: JewishKeidan@yahoogroups.comFrom: w2lap@verizon.netDate: Fri, 9 Mar 2007
    Message 1 of 14 , Mar 10, 2007
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      Does anyone know anything about my great grand father Nasaniel Aron Dubinsky?


    • Linda Dubins
      There is also a Keidan section of a cemetery in Queens, NY. To: JewishKeidan@yahoogroups.comFrom: w2lap@verizon.netDate: Fri, 9 Mar 2007 12:33:29 -0500Subject:
      Message 2 of 14 , Mar 10, 2007
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        There is also a Keidan section of a cemetery in Queens, NY.




        To: JewishKeidan@yahoogroups.com
        From: w2lap@...
        Date: Fri, 9 Mar 2007 12:33:29 -0500
        Subject: Re: [JewishKeidan] Mogel Family

        I see where you got an answer from Ada Green, who really knows her Keiden history. She is the one to carry on. Indeed, she mentioned where Dora's family came from (not Keidan). I took the liberty of contacting Mt. Carmel for you. No Mogel is interred there.
         
        If you wish to contact Washington Cemetery (NOT Mt. Washington, I erred) the address is Washington Cemetery, 5400 Bay Parkway, Brooklyn, NY 11230.
         
        Listen to Ada, she is a champ on this.
         
        Gus.
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      • belinda.kaye
        Dear Ada Thank you so much for such a detailed reply. Obviously living in London I had no idea about the confusion over the different society Plots. However
        Message 3 of 14 , Mar 11, 2007
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          Dear Ada

          Thank you so much for such a detailed reply. Obviously living in
          London I had no idea about the confusion over the different society
          Plots. However if you don't understand what went on at the cemetery
          I'm not even going to try to figure it out from here.

          I will take your advice and who knows I may even find the origins to
          Dvora and Yitzhak - my Great Great Grandparents.

          On a more personal note I wish to take this opportunity to thank you
          for your fantastic work and extensive research. I had no previous
          knowledge of Max Mogel which in turn lead me to Dvora and her other
          children in the USA.

          Once again thank you so much.

          Belinda Kaye
          Researching Mogel Aaronosky Kravitz - Lithuania
        • Belinda Kaye
          Dear Gus Thanks so much for contacting the cemetery. I will now write to Washington Cemetery to see whether she is buried there. I hope to go to New York
          Message 4 of 14 , Mar 11, 2007
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            Dear Gus
             
            Thanks so much for contacting the cemetery.  I will now write to Washington Cemetery to see whether she is buried there.
             
            I hope to go to New York later this year and now I know my Great Great Grandmother is buried in the City I hope to be able to locate and visit her.
             
            I greatly appreciate your help.
             
            Belinda Kaye

          • Belinda Kaye
            Many thanks - I m from London and not really up on all the different societies but going by the advice given I think my best bet would be to look for Kovner
            Message 5 of 14 , Mar 11, 2007
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              Many thanks - I'm from London and not really up on all the different societies but going by the advice given I think my best bet would be to look for Kovner Burial Societies.
               
               
               
              Belinda Kaye

              Linda Dubins <lindadubins@...> wrote:
              There is also a Keidan section of a cemetery in Queens, NY.




              To: JewishKeidan@ yahoogroups. com
              From: w2lap@verizon. net
              Date: Fri, 9 Mar 2007 12:33:29 -0500
              Subject: Re: [JewishKeidan] Mogel Family

              I see where you got an answer from Ada Green, who really knows her Keiden history. She is the one to carry on. Indeed, she mentioned where Dora's family came from (not Keidan). I took the liberty of contacting Mt. Carmel for you. No Mogel is interred there.
               
              If you wish to contact Washington Cemetery (NOT Mt. Washington, I erred) the address is Washington Cemetery, 5400 Bay Parkway, Brooklyn, NY 11230.
               
              Listen to Ada, she is a champ on this.
               
              Gus.
              ----- Original Message -----
              To:



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            • Ada Green
              Thanks very much, Gus and Belinda, for such nice compliments about my research work on Keidaners buried in US Keidaner burial society plots and glad it was
              Message 6 of 14 , Mar 11, 2007
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                Thanks very much, Gus and Belinda, for such nice compliments about my
                research work on Keidaners buried in US Keidaner burial society plots and
                glad it was helpful to both of you.

                To those of you who aren't aware, not only did I catalog the burials in the
                Keidaner plot at Mt. Hebron Cemetery in Flushing, Queens, NY (which is the
                smallest of the Keidaner plots), but also the ones in the all the other
                Keidaner plots known to be in existence (3 at Washington Cemetery in
                Brooklyn, one at Montefiore Cemetery in St. Albans, Queens, and the Kadaner
                Unt. Verein at Waldheim Cemetery in Chicago).

                I have also cataloged the burials in the landsmanshaftn plots in the New
                York metropolitan area for all towns in the entire Kaunas uyezd that have
                them, including Kaunas (Kovno), Vilijampole (Slobodka), Ariogala (Rogale),
                Krakes (Krok), Babtai (Bobt), Jonava, Seredzius (Szrednik) and Vilkija
                (Vilki). For all of these particular landsmanshaftn plots, with the
                exception of Babtai, Jonava, and Seredzius/Vilkija, I have looked up the
                New York City death certificate for each pre-1949 burial that has one on
                file and added the information to the database (see the next paragraph as
                to which database I am referring). That's how I knew that Dora MOGEL's
                maiden name was ARONOFSKY because that information is not found on her
                gravestone. [Kaunas uyezd towns in the vicinity of Keidan that
                unfortunately have no landsmanshaftn plots are Josvainiai, Dotnuva,
                Grinkiskis, Cekiske, Labunava, Vandziogala, Veliuona, and Zeimiai.]

                These burials can be searched in the JewishGen Online Worldwide Burial
                Registry (JOWBR) at http://www.jewishgen.org/databases/cemetery/ . The
                Keidaner burials are also listed on Andy Cassel's "A Hole In the Heart"
                Keidan website at http://www.keidan.net/ , although the information on them
                gleaned from the New York City death certificates can be found only in the
                JOWBR.

                Belinda, your gggm Dora MOGEL, who died in Brooklyn on 4 January 1922 at
                the age of 75, is not buried in any of the aforementioned landsmanshaftn
                plots -- neither for Keidan, nor Kovno, nor for any of the other shtetls in
                Kaunas uyezd. Please don't assume that just because someone was from a
                certain town that they were buried in the landsmanshaftn plot for that
                town. Not only could Jewish immigrants have been buried in a
                landsmanshaftn plot that wasn't from the town or even the country that they
                hailed from, but they could have been buried in a synagogue plot or some
                other type of organizational plot (occupational, labor, fraternal,
                etc.). My gf's sister, Lena GREENBLATT RICEMAN, and her husband Max
                RICEMAN, who were both from Seta (Shat), Lithuania (near Keidan), are for
                unknown reason buried in a plot for Chomsk, Belarus in Chicago's Waldheim
                Cemetery.

                So for your own sake please don't spin any more wheels looking for Dora
                MOGEL in either Keidan or Kovno plots. And no need to write Washington
                Cemetery in Brooklyn. I will try to call them on the first day that I will
                be home this week during their regular business hours and see if Dora MOGEL
                is buried elsewhere in their cemetery. Gus is correct that she is not
                buried in New Mt. Carmel Cemetery. A search of the Mt. Carmel/New Mt.
                Carmel online interment database at
                http://www.mountcarmelcemetery.com/search.asp just for the first name Dora
                in the year 1922 (regardless of surname) shows only 2 people by that
                name. This is assuming that their database is complete, of course. I have
                no reason to doubt that their database is not complete because out of the 8
                burial societies that I have cataloged in Mt. Carmel and New Mt. Carmel
                Cemeteries, all the burials are in their online database.

                The next time I go to Mt. Hebron Cemetery I will ask the office if they can
                show me a plot map for Chevra Bnei Israel Anshe Keidan to see whether it
                can shed any further light as to why 22 of the 49 burials in the plot,
                including Max MOGEL, are considered part of the adjacent Kovner Unt.
                Verein. Perhaps there's a pattern that I'm not aware of, such as only
                those buried in the back row. Although I don't have any immediate plans to
                go to Mt. Hebron in the near future, when I do I will report back here if I
                discover the answer to the mystery that I related here several days ago.

                Ada Green
              • Gus Levy
                ADA - - - you are a champion! Gus
                Message 7 of 14 , Mar 11, 2007
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                  ADA - - - you are a champion!
                  Gus
                  ----- Original Message -----
                • Belinda Kaye
                  Dear Ada Thank you so much for such an interesting and informative reply. I thought Dora was buried in New Mt Carmel as it is written on her Death
                  Message 8 of 14 , Mar 13, 2007
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                    Dear Ada
                     
                    Thank you so much for such an interesting and informative reply.  I thought Dora was buried in New Mt Carmel as it is written on her Death Certificate.  As for me in London its very confusing with regard to burials in the USA with regard to the societies etc. However you have explained it brilliantly.
                     
                    I will now widen my search on the Lithuanian databases!
                     
                    As you probably can tell I am quite new to this and am astonished at how kind and helpful people are. If I can be of help to anyone from here in London I will be delighted to help.
                     
                    Once again my thanks to you.
                     
                    Belinda Kaye
                     
                     
                     
                     
                     
                     
                     





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                  • GERRICA@aol.com
                    I saw your letter on the digest. I don t suppose that your surname was Kaminsky before it was Kaye, was it? Rica B Goldberg Manchester, UK Still
                    Message 9 of 14 , Mar 13, 2007
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                      I saw your letter on the digest. 
                       
                       I don't suppose that your surname was Kaminsky before it was Kaye, was it?
                       
                      Rica B Goldberg
                      Manchester, UK
                       
                      Still researching:- ESTRY from somewhere in Poland; BERLINSKIE from Charlottenburg in Berlin; KAMENSHCHIK from Zeimia and Jonova in Lithuania; DIAMOND from Kovno Gubernia; FRANK from Garliava in Lithuania; LEVI & LESCZINSKIJ from Sompolno in Poland; PETEROFSKIE from Poland, SHELENGER/SHLESINGER (or SHLUZITEL)  from Vabalninkas in Lithuania.
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