Re: [JaneAusten] S&S
- In a message dated 4/1/00 12:33:53 AM Eastern Standard Time,
<< Well, I believe that Marianne fell in love with Willoughby because, like
he admired the picturesque. His favorite poetry, songs, etc. were also her
But were they his favorites? Reading the novel made me wonder, but watching
the movie really did. I sometimes think that he knew what type of person she
was and centered his ideas and beliefs around them. I don't know where it is
in the book (I let someone borrow mine for the moment so I cannot look it
up), but Elinor makes a comment like - she cannot talk to W. on any subject
because he is a lover. Something like that. I wonder if catering his ideas
and tastes around every pretty lady is the usual for him. Most people know
nothing about his tastes other than hunting - and that is what most men seem
to do in the novel.
- In a message dated 4/2/00 7:18:49 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
<< I think a feeling that come in an instant often leave in an
instant too (easy to get - easy to lose, easy come - easy go)
but sometimes they can be their to stay for the rest of your life.
But to love somebody is not the same as that person is fit for
living with you so learning to know each other is important anyway.
>>Hi Anders -
I agree with your comments here 100%. You can love someone who is not a
proper choice for you (for whatever reason).
Does that mean you love them less because you logically know it can not work
out? I don't think so. In some cases, it may make a situation seem MORE
romantic knowing it can never be ... but that is not the case for Maryanne.
I think Maryanne found W. to be her "soulmate" in every sense, quite
similarly to any young girl you speak with today who is searching for her
"soulmate". We have all experienced different kinds of love and not everyone
believes in one perfect partner - the "soulmate". I didn't believe in it
myself until I met him. For a variety of reasons, it did not work out.
Four years later, I am not sure that I could ever love someone else in quite
that way, with that intensity.
So, I believe Maryanne would be capable of loving the Colonel but the love
would be quite different. I don't think that invalidates her feelings for
Willouby or minimizes them, however. Her heart and her spirit were quite
broken by W.'s betrayal but I think she realized you can still have a
valuable relationship with a man and can love him, get married, have
children, and be happy with your life and your relationship. I think mutual
respect is the key for a successful marriage. Maryanne respected Willouby
until he betrayed her. His betrayal, I think, helped her see the Colonel's
When you are young and in love, you want to know EVERYTHING about the other
person. The more Maryanne learned of Willouby, the more she reinforced the
idea to herself that they were perfect for each other. She never took the
time to even notice any of the Colonel's interests, etc. until she began to
recover from her illness.
Willouby was an equal to Maryanne's mind and sensibilities. After his
betrayal, she changed. She realized she had been self-indulgent and she
decided she would not be so weak anymore. The Colonel helped her open her
mind to new interests and I believe he would be the type of man who would
welcome her opinions, even if they differed from his. Willouby was so much
like Maryanne that I don't believe they differed in opinion on any subject.
The naive girl that she was may have been satisfied with that indefinately.
Do you think, under the Colonel's tutoring, Maryanne would grow to think
independently from him? Or would she mirror the Colonel's ideas about the
>ADolegowski@... writes:If you look in the book closely, Willoughby never gives his opinion until
><< Well, I believe that Marianne fell in love with Willoughby because,
>like her, he admired the picturesque. His favorite poetry, songs, etc.
>were also her favorites. >>
>But were they his favorites? Reading the novel made me wonder, but
>watching the movie really did. I sometimes think that he knew what type of
>person she was and centered his ideas and beliefs around them. I don't
>know where it is in the book (I let someone borrow mine for the moment so
>I cannot look it up), but Elinor makes a comment like - she cannot talk to
>W. on any subject because he is a lover. Something like that. I wonder if
>catering his ideas and tastes around every pretty lady is the usual for
>him. Most people know nothing about his tastes other than hunting - and
>that is what most men seem to do in the novel.
Marianne does, and then he echoes what she says. So he creates an image
Marianne would like and Marianne falls in love with this image. The movie
is a bad guide at this point because it makes it look like their tastes are
really the same, they add that scene where Willoughby has a pocket version
of the book Marianne so admires and he carries it around all the time.
There is no such thing in the book. Willoughby is a liar and scoundrel and
Marianne never knew who he was. So it was attraction more than love.
"It is a truth universally acknowledged that a single man in possession of
a good fortune must be in want of a wife."
- i personally can never decide what i think of
marianne. sometimes she seems so innocent, othertimes
so worldly. will she just take up the opinions of the
Colonel? i don't know, i don't know. marianne somewhat
reminds of my high-school peers (some my very good
friends) who make themselves over for each new
boyfriend. yet marianne overall has a level of
understanding that would seem to take her beyond that.
i think the problem is her romanticism. she is so
convinced of the need for a soulmate (witness the
romantic tales and poems she reads)(and think of
today's women obsessed with weight and sex and men and
their fashion magazines) that she will create one for
herself. a soulmate, that person most suited to you in
all respects, that you are "destined" for. i myself
see no validity in soulmates; i feel that there are
probably millions of people the average person could
be comfortable, even enthralled with, in a married
relationship. yet most of these people might feel as
if they were soulmates. each person would meet in the
middle on their views and blow out of proportion the
coincidence of the views they already shared.
therefore, we create our own soulmates. so i think
marianne in this context could consider both of her
lovers to be soulmates and take up some of their views
without losing too much validity or personal appeal.
anything, no matter what, to get rid of the thinking. . .
Do You Yahoo!?
Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.