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Re: Titus chap1: Verse 15

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  • moto_bl
    This is talking about consciences. To put this verse into context, three verses back it was written that the first-century inhabitants of Crete were known for
    Message 1 of 4 , Jul 30, 2009

      This is talking about consciences.

      To put this verse into context, three verses back it was written that the first-century inhabitants of Crete were known for being "liars, injurious wild beasts, unemployed gluttons." (Titus 1:12)

      Like everybody else, the Cretans had inborn consciences but they had allowed them to become insensitive. This prompted Paul to write the following to Titus in Crete: "All things are clean to clean persons. But to persons defiled and faithless nothing is clean, but both their minds and their consciences are defiled." (Titus 1:15)

      Because most Cretans had defiled consciences that were not helping them to do what was moral or clean, nothing became clean to them. In this sense, they viewed every situation as a chance to do bad.

      On the other hand, generally the more a person learns of God's laws and principles, the more they develop a more sensitive conscience. The more we increase in knowledge of Jehovah and His will, the more we grow in appreciation of Him.  "All things are clean to clean persons." (Titus 1:15)

       

       


       

       

      --- In JWquestions-and_answers@yahoogroups.com, Catherine Gillan <catherine.gillan@...> wrote:
      >
      > Can somebody please explain this scriptue to me?...Thankyou Catherine...
      >

    • Marcus Ampe & Belgian Christadelphians
      ... Can it not be that it is about a Jewish fable that everything is defiled? If we look at things we see at first glance those things which are working in our
      Message 2 of 4 , Aug 18, 2009
        Catherine Gillan wrote:
         
        Can somebody please explain this scriptue (Titus 1: 15) to me?... Catherine...
        Can it not be that it is about a Jewish fable that everything is defiled? If we look at things we see at first glance those things which are working in our heart and mind. Therefore filthiness is in our head. Menace comes from within us.
        To the pure everything shall look pure ; but, to the defiled and faithless, nothing is pure, but rather both their mind and conscience have been defiled. The badness is seen first, while for the others shall see the good things at first and by further examination shall notice also the other things, which are not so good.   Nothing is unclean of itself. What is unclean is what is accounted so by someone. (Romans 14:14)
        Some of the Jews believed in eating everything, while others said we should only eat vegetables. In God’s eye every kind of food is clean but it can harm the person who eats by putting a stumbling-block in the way. (Ro 14:20; Ro 14:2)

        If we want to eat something and we do not find anything wrong with it we can eat it. For example if people want to eat pork meat they are allowed by God to eat it. But if they do not find it all right, they better keep their hands of it. so if they find it improper to eat pork meat, or if they are allergic to it, they better do not touch it.So for the man in whose opinion it is unclean, for him it is unclean.

        Paul wrote: Because I am aware – and fully convinced in unity with the Master Jesus – that nothing is unclean in itself. Rather, what is unclean is what is accounted so by someone.(Romans14:14) meaning, or bringing to the point that nothing is unclean in itself: Or, RHM: profane; ABU: defiled; WEY: impure; PME: intrinsically unholy. Paul’s context has been food and drink. Jews by the Law of Moses viewed a list of foods and drink unclean ceremonially. What is unclean is what is accounted so by someone: Or, KJV: to him it is unclean; CON: whatever a man thinks unclean is unclean to him; MON: any food is unclean for one who consider it unclean. but you also could think the other way around. so if you take it as being clear, pure or clean, you may treat it as clean.

        Everything is pure to the pure; but, to the defiled and faithless, nothing is pure: Or, KJV: unto the pure all things are pure; TCNT: everything is pure to the pure-minded; TAY: a person who is pure of heart sees goodness and purity in everything; RHM: polluted and faithless; GDS: evil-minded and unbelieving; NEB: nothing is pure to the tainted minds of disbelievers; TAY: finds evil in everything.

        Both their mind and conscience have been defiled: Or, MON: minds and consciences are tainted; TAY: for his dirty mind and rebellious heart colour all he sees and hears. This may allude to some of the ideas these Cretan teachers were spreading. The “weak” conscience is defiled. [1Corinthians 8:7; 1Timothy 1:5]


      • Marcus Ampe & Belgian Christadelphians
        ... Good point. ... This last part connection is not clear to me.
        Message 3 of 4 , Aug 18, 2009
          moto_bl wrote:
           


          Because most Cretans had defiled consciences that were not helping them to do what was moral or clean, nothing became clean to them. In this sense, they viewed every situation as a chance to do bad.

          Good point.

          On the other hand, generally the more a person learns of God's laws and principles, the more they develop a more sensitive conscience. The more we increase in knowledge of Jehovah and His will, the more we grow in appreciation of Him.  "All things are clean to clean persons." (Titus 1:15)

           

          This last part connection is not clear to me.
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