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Re: Embroidered finish to the cut edge of a camicia or sleeve ruffle...?

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  • borderlands15213
    Not many. This one s in red, and although there is other red work or blackwork in red, if you like, what I m interested in is that finish on the edge of
    Message 1 of 4 , Nov 25, 2008
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      Not many.
      This one's in red, and although there is other 'red work' or
      "blackwork in red," if you like, what I'm interested in is that finish
      on the edge of the neck ruffle and the sleeve ruffles. Just the very
      edge:
      http://www.festiveattyre.com/research/secondflor/secflor33.html


      Look closely: barely visible, but there (yes, I know this is a man's
      portrait):
      http://realmofvenus.renaissanceitaly.net/wardrobe/men/MoroniProsperoAlessandri.jpg
      Same comments apply:
      http://realmofvenus.renaissanceitaly.net/wardrobe/men/MoroniPietroSecco-Suardo.jpg

      First option with illustration of gathered-pleated camicia with
      neckline frill:
      http://realmofvenus.renaissanceitaly.net/library/neckhowto.htm

      I think this is the painting from which the above was taken:
      http://tinyurl.com/5ny8rr
      If not, there is that edge treatment.

      Please understand: I'm not looking for documentation; not looking to
      *prove* this was done; not trying to establish whether it was more, or
      equally, common to men's or women's clothing.
      What I'd like to know is *how* it was done. Just that thin, delicate
      line of finishing. It is buttonhole stitch? Overcasting straight and
      simple? Is the neckline hemmed, or does the colored thread take care
      of the raw edge by enclosing it?
      Bella's page on the finishing of camicie necklines, I just got an
      actual awareness of this morning. Y'know: actually aware of the
      information on it.

      Several people have tried on lists to explain ways of achieving this
      fine edging---and they've got a job getting it through my head, I can
      tell you. A couple of other needleworking friends (SCA, yes) have
      also tried, one of those giving me far more credit for skill at
      embroidering than I think I actually have. They've all been
      encouraging.
      I have no doubt my questions weren't clear and specific enough.

      Your chosen method---in carefully detailed steps and remember you're
      dealing with an embroidery newcomer (not "never at all," but very
      little experience)--- would be...?

      With thanks,
      Yseult the Gentle


      --- In Italian_Renaissance_Costuming@yahoogroups.com,
      sunshine.k.buchler@... wrote:
      >
      > > Has anyone on list had experience (yes, of course, someone on this
      > > list has to have had!) with doing one of those very fine...'outlines'
      > > of the upper edge of the front panel of a camicia? Sometimes
      > > the gathered lower edge of the sleeve (like a ruffle) is also finished
      > > off this way. In black, red, gold, or even in white?
      >
      > Can you point to a picture of the edge finish you're thinking of?
      I'm not
      > sure I'm thinking the same thing you are... :-)
      > -sunny
      >
      >
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    • Annikki%20Raiford
      ... Mmm, that s scrummy. I ve done this on ruffles on men s shirts before, but they weren t very fine linen. Basically, the ruffle is a long strip of linen. I
      Message 2 of 4 , Nov 25, 2008
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        ----- borderlands15213 <borderlands15213@...> wrote:
        > Not many.
        > This one's in red, and although there is other 'red work' or
        > "blackwork in red," if you like, what I'm interested in is that finish
        > on the edge of the neck ruffle and the sleeve ruffles. Just the very
        > edge:
        > http://www.festiveattyre.com/research/secondflor/secflor33.html

        Mmm, that's scrummy.

        I've done this on ruffles on men's shirts before, but they weren't very fine linen. Basically, the ruffle is a long strip of linen.

        I fold it in half, lengthwise, and press it. Then I open it up, and backstitch along the fold with a line of embroidery. When the ruffle is done, the fold finishes the edge and is colored.

        If I were to do this on a more sheer fabric for a camicia, I think I would finish one edge of the ruffle with a hand sewn blind hem, then go around and around the edge with the embroidery thread. I looked online for a good how-to on hand sewn blind hems, but doesn't look like there are any. :( If the fabric held a crease, you could always do a tiny double fold (so the raw edge is hidden), then go around with embroidery floss, forgetting about the actual blind hem.

        Adele Desfontaines
      • borderlands15213
        Thanks. I do like that camicia. Very spiff, but way beyond what I can do embroidery-wise at this stage. The sewing, no problem. The fancy
        Message 3 of 4 , Nov 25, 2008
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          Thanks. I do like that camicia. Very spiff, but 'way beyond what I
          can do embroidery-wise at this stage. The sewing, no problem. The
          fancy needlework...different story.
          So far only one person suggested (and that was to my personal e-mail
          account) that the edge might be managed very neatly without turning
          under a hem. Everyone else has said, "Turn under the raw edge and hem
          it."
          Blind-stitching a hem isn't difficult---really, it isn't---so that
          won't be a problem.
          The one thing I'm just not sure of is that the fabric I'm using, while
          it "seemed like a good idea when I bought it," is heavier than I
          choose today for fine work. And what I'm sort of fretful about is
          hemming it, and then finding after hemming and embroidering is that
          it's *so* "bodiful" (yes, made that up) it won't 'ruffle' so much as
          'sheet metal crimp:' large, sharp, bulky creases and angles instead of
          pretty frills.
          Right now, that neckline is a raw cut edge. Well, it does have a
          shallow machine zig-zag securing the raw edge until I do *something*
          to finish it.
          This is one of those annoying cottons which *creases* or wrinkles but
          doesn't 'hold a crease' the way I'd like for it to do. Starching that
          edge might help...I suppose... Hmmm. <kicks mental gears into slow,
          creaking motion>
          Oh---I should state: this "ruffle" is actually just the gathered top
          edge of the camicia, so the frill is integral to the garment.
          Possibly I've been misleading you all by saying "ruffle."

          Thank you for your suggestions. :D I'm much encouraged.

          --- In Italian_Renaissance_Costuming@yahoogroups.com,
          Annikki%20Raiford <annikki@...> wrote:
          <<<snipped>>>
          > Mmm, that's scrummy.
          >
          > I've done this on ruffles on men's shirts before, but they weren't
          very fine linen. Basically, the ruffle is a long strip of linen.
          >
          > I fold it in half, lengthwise, and press it. Then I open it up, and
          backstitch along the fold with a line of embroidery. When the ruffle
          is done, the fold finishes the edge and is colored.
          >
          > If I were to do this on a more sheer fabric for a camicia, I think I
          would finish one edge of the ruffle with a hand sewn blind hem, then
          go around and around the edge with the embroidery thread. I looked
          online for a good how-to on hand sewn blind hems, but doesn't look
          like there are any. :( If the fabric held a crease, you could always
          do a tiny double fold (so the raw edge is hidden), then go around with
          embroidery floss, forgetting about the actual blind hem.
          >
          > Adele Desfontaines
          >
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