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New to List Titian's La Bella

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  • maddalex
    I m new to this list. I m wanting to reproduce the gown in Titian s La Bella as accurately as possible. I have been fascinated with this dress for almost 15
    Message 1 of 15 , Aug 2, 2007
      I'm new to this list.

      I'm wanting to reproduce the gown in Titian's La Bella as accurately as
      possible. I have been fascinated with this dress for almost 15 years.
      Does anyone know where I can aquire the embellishment/needlework
      details. I haven't found a usable image so far. Any other useful tips
      will also be appreciated.

      Thanks
      Maddalena Alessandra Godwin
      Kingdom of Gleann Abhann - Barony Small Gray Bear
      mka Malinda Godwin - Little Rock AR
    • archerpren
      http://tinyurl.com/2rqqba heres a link to a picture of it and as for the trims they are very dainty it looks like gold thread embroidery. is that what you are
      Message 2 of 15 , Aug 2, 2007
        http://tinyurl.com/2rqqba
        heres a link to a picture of it and as for the trims they are very
        dainty it looks like gold thread embroidery. is that what you are
        thinking. i bet you could find a book an itialian ren. embroidery
        because i know they make blackwork embroidery books. rosalie

        --- In Italian_Renaissance_Costuming@yahoogroups.com, "maddalex"
        <maddalex@...> wrote:
        >
        > I'm new to this list.
        >
        > I'm wanting to reproduce the gown in Titian's La Bella as
        accurately as
        > possible. I have been fascinated with this dress for almost 15
        years.
        > Does anyone know where I can aquire the embellishment/needlework
        > details. I haven't found a usable image so far. Any other useful
        tips
        > will also be appreciated.
        >
        > Thanks
        > Maddalena Alessandra Godwin
        > Kingdom of Gleann Abhann - Barony Small Gray Bear
        > mka Malinda Godwin - Little Rock AR
        >
      • Adele de Maisieres
        ... This is better-than-average for showing some of the details. http://www.allposters.com/-sp/Portrait-of-a-Noblewoman-or-La-Bella-Posters_i1592526_.htm Might
        Message 3 of 15 , Aug 2, 2007
          "maddalex" wrote:

          > I'm wanting to reproduce the gown in Titian's La Bella as accurately as
          > possible. I have been fascinated with this dress for almost 15 years.
          >
          > Does anyone know where I can aquire the embellishment/needlework
          > details. I haven't found a usable image so far. Any other useful tips
          > will also be appreciated.


          This is better-than-average for showing some of the details.
          http://www.allposters.com/-sp/Portrait-of-a-Noblewoman-or-La-Bella-Posters_i1592526_.htm
          Might even be worth ordering the poster.


          --
          Adele de Maisieres

          -----------------------------
          Habeo metrum - musicamque,
          hominem meam. Expectat alium quid?
          -Georgeus Gershwinus
          -----------------------------
        • Maddalena Alessandra
          Thanks, I ve found many links to various pictures of it, but none of them has enough details to cleanup the embroidery pattern or determine the exact type of
          Message 4 of 15 , Aug 2, 2007
            Thanks,

            I've found many links to various pictures of it, but
            none of them has enough details to cleanup the
            embroidery pattern or determine the exact type of
            embellishment work.

            My first thoughts are it represents work done with
            gold bullion work, or something couched with gold. It
            might also be plain embroidery with gold thread, but I
            don't know the historical references for plain
            embroidery.

            I know that couching with gold thread is proper to
            approxiamately this time and area. I have seen a
            traveling exhibit with an actual dress from Florence
            that was attributted to the De Medici's from about the
            same time frame. I have a copy of the Exhibition book
            (Masterpieces of Florence?) with more details if
            anyone is interested.

            As for being bullion work, I know it was used in
            England. I have no reason to doubt that the
            embellishment work on the series of extant Henry the
            VIII portraits is meant to represent anything else but
            bullion. I doubt it would have been painted the way
            it was otherwise. I have seen one of the actual
            portraits(by Eworth) and the remains of an original
            drawing by Holbein (only the Henry part remains)for
            that famous (Henry the VIII - I am) pose. Details are
            clear when you standing next to the actual item. I
            have a book 'Henry the VIIIth Revealed' I think is the
            title and some pictures of the portrait. If anyone is
            interested further let me know.

            Lots of knowledge bits but nothing solid for this
            particular dress.

            Still looking
            Madd Alex

            --- archerpren <archerpren@...> wrote:

            > http://tinyurl.com/2rqqba
            > heres a link to a picture of it and as for the trims
            > they are very
            > dainty it looks like gold thread embroidery. is that
            > what you are
            > thinking. i bet you could find a book an itialian
            > ren. embroidery
            > because i know they make blackwork embroidery books.
            > rosalie
            >
            > --- In
            > Italian_Renaissance_Costuming@yahoogroups.com,
            > "maddalex"
            > <maddalex@...> wrote:
            > >
            > > I'm new to this list.
            > >
            > > I'm wanting to reproduce the gown in Titian's La
            > Bella as
            > accurately as
            > > possible. I have been fascinated with this dress
            > for almost 15
            > years.
            > > Does anyone know where I can aquire the
            > embellishment/needlework
            > > details. I haven't found a usable image so far.
            > Any other useful
            > tips
            > > will also be appreciated.
            > >
            > > Thanks
            > > Maddalena Alessandra Godwin
            > > Kingdom of Gleann Abhann - Barony Small Gray Bear
            > > mka Malinda Godwin - Little Rock AR
            > >
            >
            >
            >




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          • Susan Farmer
            ... Wikimedia is your friend. http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/ba/Tizian_034.jpg jerusha ... Susan Farmer sfarmer@goldsword.com Abraham Baldwin
            Message 5 of 15 , Aug 2, 2007
              Quoting Maddalena Alessandra <maddalex@...>:

              > Thanks,
              >
              > I've found many links to various pictures of it, but
              > none of them has enough details to cleanup the
              > embroidery pattern or determine the exact type of
              > embellishment work.
              >

              Wikimedia is your friend.

              http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/ba/Tizian_034.jpg

              jerusha
              -----
              Susan Farmer
              sfarmer@...
              Abraham Baldwin Agricultural College
              Division of Science and Math
              http://www.goldsword.com/sfarmer/Trillium/
            • archerpren
              OOHH. that is better. it also looks like the slashed areas like the sleaves are held together with little ribbon bows that might be a sheer ribbon. Pren ...
              Message 6 of 15 , Aug 2, 2007
                OOHH. that is better. it also looks like the slashed areas like the
                sleaves are held together with little ribbon bows that might be a
                sheer ribbon. Pren

                --- In Italian_Renaissance_Costuming@yahoogroups.com, Adele de
                Maisieres <ladyadele@...> wrote:
                >
                > "maddalex" wrote:
                >
                > > I'm wanting to reproduce the gown in Titian's La Bella as
                accurately as
                > > possible. I have been fascinated with this dress for almost 15
                years.
                > >
                > > Does anyone know where I can aquire the embellishment/needlework
                > > details. I haven't found a usable image so far. Any other
                useful tips
                > > will also be appreciated.
                >
                >
                > This is better-than-average for showing some of the details.
                > http://www.allposters.com/-sp/Portrait-of-a-Noblewoman-or-La-Bella-
                Posters_i1592526_.htm
                > Might even be worth ordering the poster.
                >
                >
                > --
                > Adele de Maisieres
                >
                > -----------------------------
                > Habeo metrum - musicamque,
                > hominem meam. Expectat alium quid?
                > -Georgeus Gershwinus
                > -----------------------------
                >
              • Maddalena Alessandra
                I hadn t found this one. I d found the poster one-yes. This one looks very very promising. I think I ll be able to get a pattern from it. Thank you Thank
                Message 7 of 15 , Aug 2, 2007
                  I hadn't found this one. I'd found the poster
                  one-yes. This one looks very very promising. I think
                  I'll be able to get a pattern from it.

                  Thank you Thank You Thank you,
                  Madd
                  --- Susan Farmer <sfarmer@...> wrote:

                  > Quoting Maddalena Alessandra <maddalex@...>:
                  >
                  > > Thanks,
                  > >
                  > > I've found many links to various pictures of it,
                  > but
                  > > none of them has enough details to cleanup the
                  > > embroidery pattern or determine the exact type of
                  > > embellishment work.
                  > >
                  >
                  > Wikimedia is your friend.
                  >
                  >
                  http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/ba/Tizian_034.jpg
                  >
                  > jerusha
                  > -----
                  > Susan Farmer
                  > sfarmer@...
                  > Abraham Baldwin Agricultural College
                  > Division of Science and Math
                  > http://www.goldsword.com/sfarmer/Trillium/
                  >
                  >



                  ____________________________________________________________________________________
                  Luggage? GPS? Comic books?
                  Check out fitting gifts for grads at Yahoo! Search
                  http://search.yahoo.com/search?fr=oni_on_mail&p=graduation+gifts&cs=bz
                • Susan Farmer
                  ... I ve got some scans that I d done -- but I wan t that happy with them, but this one is by far and away the *largest* copy that I have. Tweak it in
                  Message 8 of 15 , Aug 2, 2007
                    Quoting Maddalena Alessandra <maddalex@...>:

                    > I hadn't found this one. I'd found the poster
                    > one-yes. This one looks very very promising. I think
                    > I'll be able to get a pattern from it.

                    I've got some scans that I'd done -- but I wan't that happy with them,
                    but this one is by far and away the *largest* copy that I have. Tweak
                    it in photoshop -- lighten it up some -- you should be fine!

                    >
                    > Thank you Thank You Thank you,

                    You're welcome!

                    jerusha, the painting junkie
                    -----
                    Susan Farmer
                    sfarmer@...
                    Abraham Baldwin Agricultural College
                    Division of Science and Math
                    http://www.goldsword.com/sfarmer/Trillium/
                  • ailith@neo.rr.com
                    The slashes are held together with translucent bows. I got as far as getting the bodice done, but the fabric for the skirt was ruined. So I ve got a stunning
                    Message 9 of 15 , Aug 2, 2007
                      The slashes are held together with translucent bows. I got as far as
                      getting the bodice done, but the fabric for the skirt was ruined. So
                      I've got a stunning bodice with no way to do a skirt. :-(

                      The skirt is also in panels. If you look very closely you can see the
                      same small bows holding the sections together.

                      My gown was to be of amethyst cotton velvet. The slashes on the upper
                      sleeves, the bodice and skirt were made of black cotton sateen. I used
                      at least two types of a metallic gold commercial trim and couched it
                      down. I used 1/4" woven gold ribbon for the bows.

                      It's labor intensive, but gorgeous!

                      BTW - did you know that the original painting is roughly the dimensions
                      of a piece of typing paper?

                      With regards,
                      ailith
                      ----- Original Message -----
                      From: Maddalena Alessandra <maddalex@...>
                      Date: Thursday, August 2, 2007 6:15 pm
                      Subject: Re: [Italian Renaissance Costuming] Re: New to List Titian's
                      La Bella
                      To: Italian_Renaissance_Costuming@yahoogroups.com

                      > I hadn't found this one. I'd found the poster
                      > one-yes. This one looks very very promising. I think
                      > I'll be able to get a pattern from it.
                      >
                      > Thank you Thank You Thank you,
                      > Madd
                      > --- Susan Farmer <sfarmer@...> wrote:
                      >
                      > > Quoting Maddalena Alessandra <maddalex@...>:
                      > >
                      > > > Thanks,
                      > > >
                      > > > I've found many links to various pictures of it,
                      > > but
                      > > > none of them has enough details to cleanup the
                      > > > embroidery pattern or determine the exact type of
                      > > > embellishment work.
                      > > >
                      > >
                      > > Wikimedia is your friend.
                      > >
                      > >
                      > http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/ba/Tizian_034.jpg
                      > >
                      > > jerusha
                      > > -----
                      > > Susan Farmer
                      > > sfarmer@...
                      > > Abraham Baldwin Agricultural College
                      > > Division of Science and Math
                      > > http://www.goldsword.com/sfarmer/Trillium/
                      > >
                      > >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      ____________________________________________________________________________________Luggage?
                      GPS? Comic books?
                      > Check out fitting gifts for grads at Yahoo! Search
                      > http://search.yahoo.com/search?fr=oni_on_mail&p=graduation+gifts&cs=bz
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > Yahoo! Groups Links
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                    • archerpren
                      wow. would you post some pictures of what you have done. id be really interested to see it. also thanks for the factoid about painting size. maybe thats why it
                      Message 10 of 15 , Aug 2, 2007
                        wow. would you post some pictures of what you have done. id be really
                        interested to see it. also thanks for the factoid about painting
                        size. maybe thats why it is harder to discern the details because
                        they were painted so small they probably arent as precise and
                        noticable as they wou;ld have been on a huge portrait. pren


                        --- In Italian_Renaissance_Costuming@yahoogroups.com, ailith@...
                        wrote:
                        >
                        >
                        > The slashes are held together with translucent bows. I got as far as
                        > getting the bodice done, but the fabric for the skirt was ruined. So
                        > I've got a stunning bodice with no way to do a skirt. :-(
                        >
                        > The skirt is also in panels. If you look very closely you can see
                        the
                        > same small bows holding the sections together.
                        >
                        > My gown was to be of amethyst cotton velvet. The slashes on the
                        upper
                        > sleeves, the bodice and skirt were made of black cotton sateen. I
                        used
                        > at least two types of a metallic gold commercial trim and couched it
                        > down. I used 1/4" woven gold ribbon for the bows.
                        >
                        > It's labor intensive, but gorgeous!
                        >
                        > BTW - did you know that the original painting is roughly the
                        dimensions
                        > of a piece of typing paper?
                        >
                        > With regards,
                        > ailith
                        > ----- Original Message -----
                        > From: Maddalena Alessandra <maddalex@...>
                        > Date: Thursday, August 2, 2007 6:15 pm
                        > Subject: Re: [Italian Renaissance Costuming] Re: New to List
                        Titian's
                        > La Bella
                        > To: Italian_Renaissance_Costuming@yahoogroups.com
                        >
                        > > I hadn't found this one. I'd found the poster
                        > > one-yes. This one looks very very promising. I think
                        > > I'll be able to get a pattern from it.
                        > >
                        > > Thank you Thank You Thank you,
                        > > Madd
                        > > --- Susan Farmer <sfarmer@...> wrote:
                        > >
                        > > > Quoting Maddalena Alessandra <maddalex@...>:
                        > > >
                        > > > > Thanks,
                        > > > >
                        > > > > I've found many links to various pictures of it,
                        > > > but
                        > > > > none of them has enough details to cleanup the
                        > > > > embroidery pattern or determine the exact type of
                        > > > > embellishment work.
                        > > > >
                        > > >
                        > > > Wikimedia is your friend.
                        > > >
                        > > >
                        > > http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/ba/Tizian_034.jpg
                        > > >
                        > > > jerusha
                        > > > -----
                        > > > Susan Farmer
                        > > > sfarmer@...
                        > > > Abraham Baldwin Agricultural College
                        > > > Division of Science and Math
                        > > > http://www.goldsword.com/sfarmer/Trillium/
                        > > >
                        > > >
                        > >
                        > >
                        > >
                        > >
                        > >
                        >
                        ______________________________________________________________________
                        ______________Luggage?
                        > GPS? Comic books?
                        > > Check out fitting gifts for grads at Yahoo! Search
                        > > http://search.yahoo.com/search?
                        fr=oni_on_mail&p=graduation+gifts&cs=bz
                        > >
                        > >
                        > >
                        > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                        > >
                        > >
                        > >
                        > >
                        >
                      • Maddalena Alessandra
                        Susan, I have been tweaking. I think I have figured out the whole pattern for the lower front panels. I got the center portion of the top section as well.
                        Message 11 of 15 , Aug 2, 2007
                          Susan,
                          I have been tweaking. I think I have figured out the
                          whole pattern for the lower front panels. I got the
                          center portion of the top section as well. I'll be
                          making some guesses on the sleeves for the pieces I've
                          now got. The main pattern looks very familiar now
                          that I can see it more clearly(can't think where
                          from). It is obviously an acanthus derivative though.
                          --- Susan Farmer <sfarmer@...> wrote:

                          > Quoting Maddalena Alessandra <maddalex@...>:
                          >
                          > > I hadn't found this one. I'd found the poster
                          > > one-yes. This one looks very very promising. I
                          > think
                          > > I'll be able to get a pattern from it.
                          >
                          > I've got some scans that I'd done -- but I wan't
                          > that happy with them,
                          > but this one is by far and away the *largest* copy
                          > that I have. Tweak
                          > it in photoshop -- lighten it up some -- you should
                          > be fine!
                          >
                          > >
                          > > Thank you Thank You Thank you,
                          >
                          > You're welcome!
                          >
                          > jerusha, the painting junkie
                          > -----
                          > Susan Farmer
                          > sfarmer@...
                          > Abraham Baldwin Agricultural College
                          > Division of Science and Math
                          > http://www.goldsword.com/sfarmer/Trillium/
                          >
                          >




                          ____________________________________________________________________________________
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                        • ailith@neo.rr.com
                          Yes, I d be happy to post a picture; I have to find the bodice though. As soon as I do, I ll take a picture and post the url for it. ailith ... From:
                          Message 12 of 15 , Aug 2, 2007
                            Yes, I'd be happy to post a picture; I have to find the bodice though.
                            As soon as I do, I'll take a picture and post the url for it.

                            ailith

                            ----- Original Message -----
                            From: archerpren <archerpren@...>
                            Date: Thursday, August 2, 2007 6:59 pm
                            Subject: [Italian Renaissance Costuming] Re: New to List Titian's La Bella
                            To: Italian_Renaissance_Costuming@yahoogroups.com

                            > wow. would you post some pictures of what you have done. id be
                            > really
                            > interested to see it. also thanks for the factoid about painting
                            > size. maybe thats why it is harder to discern the details because
                            > they were painted so small they probably arent as precise and
                            > noticable as they wou;ld have been on a huge portrait. pren
                            >
                            >
                            > --- In Italian_Renaissance_Costuming@yahoogroups.com, ailith@...
                            > wrote:
                            > >
                            > >
                            > > The slashes are held together with translucent bows. I got as far as
                            > > getting the bodice done, but the fabric for the skirt was ruined. So
                            > > I've got a stunning bodice with no way to do a skirt. :-(
                            > >
                            > > The skirt is also in panels. If you look very closely you can see
                            > the
                            > > same small bows holding the sections together.
                            > >
                            > > My gown was to be of amethyst cotton velvet. The slashes on the
                            > upper
                            > > sleeves, the bodice and skirt were made of black cotton sateen. I
                            > used
                            > > at least two types of a metallic gold commercial trim and couched it
                            > > down. I used 1/4" woven gold ribbon for the bows.
                            > >
                            > > It's labor intensive, but gorgeous!
                            > >
                            > > BTW - did you know that the original painting is roughly the
                            > dimensions
                            > > of a piece of typing paper?
                            > >
                            > > With regards,
                            > > ailith
                            > > ----- Original Message -----
                            > > From: Maddalena Alessandra <maddalex@...>
                            > > Date: Thursday, August 2, 2007 6:15 pm
                            > > Subject: Re: [Italian Renaissance Costuming] Re: New to List
                            > Titian's
                            > > La Bella
                            > > To: Italian_Renaissance_Costuming@yahoogroups.com
                            > >
                            > > > I hadn't found this one. I'd found the poster
                            > > > one-yes. This one looks very very promising. I think
                            > > > I'll be able to get a pattern from it.
                            > > >
                            > > > Thank you Thank You Thank you,
                            > > > Madd
                            > > > --- Susan Farmer <sfarmer@...> wrote:
                            > > >
                            > > > > Quoting Maddalena Alessandra <maddalex@...>:
                            > > > >
                            > > > > > Thanks,
                            > > > > >
                            > > > > > I've found many links to various pictures of it,
                            > > > > but
                            > > > > > none of them has enough details to cleanup the
                            > > > > > embroidery pattern or determine the exact type of
                            > > > > > embellishment work.
                            > > > > >
                            > > > >
                            > > > > Wikimedia is your friend.
                            > > > >
                            > > > >
                            > > > http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/ba/Tizian_034.jpg
                            > > > >
                            > > > > jerusha
                            > > > > -----
                            > > > > Susan Farmer
                            > > > > sfarmer@...
                            > > > > Abraham Baldwin Agricultural College
                            > > > > Division of Science and Math
                            > > > > http://www.goldsword.com/sfarmer/Trillium/
                            > > > >
                            > > > >
                            > > >
                            > > >
                            > > >
                            > > >
                            > > >
                            > >
                            > ______________________________________________________________________
                            > ______________Luggage?
                            > > GPS? Comic books?
                            > > > Check out fitting gifts for grads at Yahoo! Search
                            > > > http://search.yahoo.com/search?
                            > fr=oni_on_mail&p=graduation+gifts&cs=bz
                            > > >
                            > > >
                            > > >
                            > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                            > > >
                            > > >
                            > > >
                            > > >
                            > >
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            > Yahoo! Groups Links
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            >
                          • Maddalena Alessandra
                            Ailith Thanks for pointing that out on the skirt. I ve been so focused on the bodice and with unclear details that I hadn t notice the skirt slashs. I d
                            Message 13 of 15 , Aug 2, 2007
                              Ailith
                              Thanks for pointing that out on the skirt. I've been
                              so focused on the bodice and with unclear details that
                              I hadn't notice the skirt slashs.

                              I'd thought the original was about double that size
                              for some reason.

                              Thanks for the help
                              Madd
                              --- ailith@... wrote:

                              The skirt is also in panels. If you look very
                              > closely you can see the
                              > same small bows holding the sections together.
                              >
                              > BTW - did you know that the original painting is
                              > roughly the dimensions of a piece of typing paper?
                              >
                              > With regards,
                              > ailith
                              >


                              ____________________________________________________________________________________
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                            • Susan Farmer
                              ... That kind of design was popular. You might have seen it in Scholehouse for the needle or one of the pattern books that s available from that U. Arizona
                              Message 14 of 15 , Aug 2, 2007
                                --- In Italian_Renaissance_Costuming@yahoogroups.com, Maddalena
                                Alessandra <maddalex@...> wrote:
                                >
                                > Susan,
                                > I have been tweaking. I think I have figured out the
                                > whole pattern for the lower front panels. I got the
                                > center portion of the top section as well. I'll be
                                > making some guesses on the sleeves for the pieces I've
                                > now got. The main pattern looks very familiar now
                                > that I can see it more clearly(can't think where
                                > from). It is obviously an acanthus derivative though.

                                That kind of design was popular. You might have seen it in
                                "Scholehouse for the needle" or one of the pattern books that's
                                available from that U. Arizona site with all the great PDFs.

                                susan/jerusha
                              • lady_cadhla
                                Hey, Madd Alex! It s wonderful to see you here! If you get this dress done before Gulf Wars, I soooooo want to see it! Kayley (yes, your Clan sister!)
                                Message 15 of 15 , Aug 3, 2007
                                  Hey, Madd Alex! It's wonderful to see you here! If you get this
                                  dress done before Gulf Wars, I soooooo want to see it!

                                  Kayley
                                  (yes, your Clan sister!)


                                  --- In Italian_Renaissance_Costuming@yahoogroups.com, "maddalex"
                                  <maddalex@...> wrote:
                                  >
                                  > I'm new to this list.
                                  >
                                  > I'm wanting to reproduce the gown in Titian's La Bella as accurately as
                                  > possible. I have been fascinated with this dress for almost 15 years.
                                  > Does anyone know where I can aquire the embellishment/needlework
                                  > details. I haven't found a usable image so far. Any other useful tips
                                  > will also be appreciated.
                                  >
                                  > Thanks
                                  > Maddalena Alessandra Godwin
                                  > Kingdom of Gleann Abhann - Barony Small Gray Bear
                                  > mka Malinda Godwin - Little Rock AR
                                  >
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