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Re: [Italian Renaissance Costuming] RE: Odd "fabric"

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  • mc cadieux
    It makes sense ! MC http://pages.infinit.net/cadieux3 * Soliditas, fides et magnum in omnem vitam ex aeternitate negotium suscipère * ... From: Holly Frantz
    Message 1 of 25 , Jul 13, 2004
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      It makes sense !

      MC
      http://pages.infinit.net/cadieux3

      * Soliditas, fides et magnum in omnem vitam ex aeternitate negotium
      suscipère *



      ----- Original Message -----
      From: "Holly Frantz" <hefrantz@...>
      To: <Italian_Rennaissance_Costuming@yahoogroups.com>
      Sent: Tuesday, July 13, 2004 9:02 AM
      Subject: Re: [Italian Renaissance Costuming] RE: Odd "fabric"


      Actually, that dress and chemise is German. I'm in the middle of making a
      German renn for a friend and the dress is of a type that appears frequently
      in Germany. I believe the date on the alterpiece is c. 1510, which makes
      the dress right for the German states but too late for that style in Italy.

      The chemise is goldwork and smocking, with cord couched down on top of the
      smocking. It's more elaborate but I think it's similar to the chemise in
      Holbein's portrait of Dorothea Meyer.

      http://www.artprints-on-demand.co.uk/noframes/holbein/portrait_dorothea_meye
      r.htm

      I've got the materials to make the chemise and dress, now I'm just waiting
      for the time.

      Niccola

      mc cadieux <thecostumer@...> wrote:
      There's also Joos Van Cleeve's Alterpiece of the Lamentation of Christ
      http://cgfa.sunsite.dk/c/p-cleve2.htm The painting is dutch but it's
      believed to be an italian woman... I just love that row of tassels

      MC
      http://pages.infinit.net/cadieux3

      * Soliditas, fides et magnum in omnem vitam ex aeternitate negotium
      suscipère *



      ----- Original Message -----
      From: robin
      To: Italian_Rennaissance_Costuming@yahoogroups.com
      Sent: Monday, July 12, 2004 5:02 PM
      Subject: Re: [Italian Renaissance Costuming] RE: Odd "fabric"


      At 01:47 07/12/2004 -0400, Susan Farmer wrote:

      >If you look at the belt on the Agnes Sorel Madonna by Fouquet
      >http://gallery.euroweb.hu/art/f/fouquet/madonna.jpg
      >it looks like it could be macrame too.

      It sure does. I have stared at that picture a long time, so intent on
      figuring out what becomes of the princess seam that I never noticed her
      belt.
      Any guesses what kind of cord would have been used... the pattern looks
      like a Josephine knot using two ends of doubled cord followed by an
      overhand knot of all the ends together, repeated "until it is enough" ;-)

      If that's what it is, it is simple enough to teach as a beginners' or kids'
      make-it-take-it class.

      Links to two other paintings with tassels and/or possible macramé:

      http://www.museothyssen.org/museovirtual/fichas/obraampliada.asp?codigo=500
      I've found this attributed to both Jacopo Pontormo and Pier Francesco
      Foschi; the notes in English from the museum's site, "A little known
      painter for a long time until Longhi vindicated his importance within the
      art of Florence of the XVIth century, in which city he lived permanently.
      He was the disciple of Andrea del Sarto and his style responds fully to
      courtly Mannerism, with stylized forms and cold distancing with influence
      from Bronzino and, above all, Pontormo, to whose hand were attributed many
      of the works today considered to be by Foschi."

      http://www.artrenewal.org/asp/database/art.asp?aid=510&page=3
      Scroll down to the "lady with a puppy" and check out the tassel on her
      rosary-like item. (click the image for a big picture).
      NB: This is usually considered to be the work of Agnolo Bronzino, though I
      have also seen it attributed to Pontormo, who was one of Bronzino's
      teachers.
      At first I thought it was an ordinary tassel with a tubular beaded net
      using small round and "oat" shaped beads but the more I look at it, the
      more it looks like macramé with beads. I have no idea what the tassel might
      have for an armature -- I've no experience making "fancy" tassels, just
      garden-variety yarn ones.

      miriel verdy
      (debatable lands)




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    • Kiara
      I used to ahve this pic on my website, but I can t find it anymore. When I first posted it for discussion (about 7-8 years ago), I believe on SCA-Garb, it was
      Message 2 of 25 , Jul 14, 2004
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        I used to ahve this pic on my website, but I can't find it anymore.

        When I first posted it for discussion (about 7-8 years ago), I believe on SCA-Garb, it was hypothesized that it could be an early form of macrame. I dont remember all of the conversations though.

        --Kiara


        Susan Farmer <sfarmer@...> wrote:

        Here's the painting (love to find it in color ...)
        http://www.goldsword.com/sfarmer/SCA/Paintings/conti_ProfileLady.jpg

        so is that an oddly patterned fabric or does she just have rows and rows
        (and rows ...) of tassels on her clothes?

        Jerusha

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      • Kiara
        oh wow! Thats awesome! even more interestng in color. So the trim is woven with the tassels. Very interesting. Thanks for finding this --Kiara otsisto
        Message 3 of 25 , Jul 14, 2004
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          oh wow! Thats awesome! even more interestng in color. So the trim is woven with the tassels. Very interesting.

          Thanks for finding this

          --Kiara


          otsisto <otsisto@...> wrote:

          I knew I saw this portrait in color on line.
          http://www.shopping4posters.com/Portrait_of_a_Lady_831987.html

          Arian
          -----Original Message-----
          Similar decoration of dress,
          http://www.kfki.hu/~arthp/html/s/solari/cristofo/effigy.html

          -----Original Message-----
          Here's the painting (love to find it in color ...)
          http://www.goldsword.com/sfarmer/SCA/Paintings/conti_ProfileLady.jpg

          Jerusha







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