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Re: [Indo-Eurasia] Re: Size: IC population and IC bricks

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  • Dagmar Riedel
    Perhaps not a Ph.D. in Vedic Astrolology but how about one in applied statistics? I do wonder (1) what is our knowledge about standardized brick sizes (before
    Message 1 of 41 , Jun 1, 2005
      Perhaps not a Ph.D. in Vedic Astrolology but how about one in
      applied statistics?
      I do wonder
      (1) what is our knowledge about standardized brick sizes (before
      industrial production techniques) in other cultures, from
      pre-industrial manufacture control to necessary requirement for
      certain building structures?
      Perhaps a comparison would provide some clues.
      (2) what is the oldest culture with a standardized brick size, which
      has been proven beyond reasonable doubt? (and it would be
      interesting to know how the standardization has been documented and
      argued)
      (3) somehow the question of standardized bricks, since
      pre-inductrial bricks are a handmade product, reminded me of
      handmade bagels...
      there is the idea of a perfect bagel (ratio between size and prize
      etc.) since bagels are only made within a certain range, but would
      that idea justify talking about standardized bagel size on the
      American East or West coast for that matter?
      The point of this somewhat facetious question is to push the
      envelope with regard to differences in degree because of different
      functions:
      standardization of weights etc. seems to point to economic processes
      (and value matters for all sorts of value transport and monetary
      exchange), but why would a standardization of weights make a
      standardization of brick size more plausible?

      Best,
      Dagmar Riedel



      ________________

      Dagmar A. Riedel
      Center for Iranian Studies
      Columbia University
    • STAAL, Frits
      Dear George, I see this gulfstream of ignorant papers on bricks, dhisnyas etc. when I come to the internetcafe in Chiang Mai, once a week or less, from my home
      Message 41 of 41 , Jun 5, 2005
        Dear George,

        I see this gulfstream of ignorant papers on bricks, dhisnyas etc. when I come to the internetcafe
        in Chiang Mai, once a week or less, from my home in the woods which has no phone or E-mail. And
        then there is, now and then, a refreshing message from YOU who sheds light and provides all these
        nice references to my work where all these questions (as far as I have been able to make out) are
        dealt with...

        THANKS!

        I am working on different things but shall soon send you something - and the VEDA booklet which is
        also progressing slowly, what between the beginning of the monsoon and the planting of one hundred
        bamboos...

        Wish you could come and visit one day,

        all the best,

        Frits

        On Wed, 1 Jun 2005 13:02:27 -0400
        "George Thompson" <gthomgt@...> wrote:
        > Hello Dagmar,
        >
        > I am unable to answer your questions, but perhaps it would help you to know
        > the context of this List's interest in bricks. Bricks have an enormous
        > significance in later Vedic ritual, for example in the agnicayana = the
        > building up of a huge bird-shaped fire altar requiring the use of a thousand
        > bricks. Out of such ritual and ritual structures comes what is called Vedic
        > mathematics.
        >
        > There is a desire on the part of some nativist researchers to correlate
        > Indus Valley bricks with these Vedic bricks. If there is no evidence for
        > the standardization of IVC bricks, then the desired correlation can not be
        > established.
        >
        > Steve's point has been to suggest that the so-called standardization of IVC
        > bricks is a myth invented to fortify a weak correlation between the two
        > cultures.
        >
        > He is right about this. I think that brick technology and the vocabulary
        > for bricks in Indo-Iranian are both borrowings from a Central Asian source,
        > possibly BMAC.
        >
        > See for example Frits Staal: "Greek and Vedic Geometry" in Journal of Indian
        > Philosophy, no. 27.1/2, Feb./Apr. 1999.
        >
        > I hope that helps.
        >
        > George
        > -----Original Message-----
        > From: Indo-Eurasian_research@yahoogroups.com
        > [mailto:Indo-Eurasian_research@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Dagmar Riedel
        > Sent: Wednesday, June 01, 2005 11:23 AM
        > To: Indo-Eurasian_research@yahoogroups.com
        > Subject: Re: [Indo-Eurasia] Re: Size: IC population and IC bricks
        >
        >
        >
        > Perhaps not a Ph.D. in Vedic Astrolology but how about one in
        > applied statistics?
        > I do wonder
        > (1) what is our knowledge about standardized brick sizes (before
        > industrial production techniques) in other cultures, from
        > pre-industrial manufacture control to necessary requirement for
        > certain building structures?
        > Perhaps a comparison would provide some clues.
        > (2) what is the oldest culture with a standardized brick size, which
        > has been proven beyond reasonable doubt? (and it would be
        > interesting to know how the standardization has been documented and
        > argued)
        > (3) somehow the question of standardized bricks, since
        > pre-inductrial bricks are a handmade product, reminded me of
        > handmade bagels...
        > there is the idea of a perfect bagel (ratio between size and prize
        > etc.) since bagels are only made within a certain range, but would
        > that idea justify talking about standardized bagel size on the
        > American East or West coast for that matter?
        > The point of this somewhat facetious question is to push the
        > envelope with regard to differences in degree because of different
        > functions:
        > standardization of weights etc. seems to point to economic processes
        > (and value matters for all sorts of value transport and monetary
        > exchange), but why would a standardization of weights make a
        > standardization of brick size more plausible?
        >
        > Best,
        > Dagmar Riedel
        >
        >
        >
        > ________________
        >
        > Dagmar A. Riedel
        > Center for Iranian Studies
        > Columbia University
        >
        >
        >
        >
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        Frits Staal

        http://philosophy.berkeley.edu/staal
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