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Mattityahu

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  • Alexander Pollayil
    Hello Rev. Dn. Aju Mathews, Greetings! for the New Year. I just want to response couple of things Rev. Aju Mathews explanation. Pardon me if you did not like
    Message 1 of 1 , Jan 2, 2001
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      Hello Rev. Dn. Aju Mathews, Greetings! for the New Year. I just want to response couple of things Rev. Aju Mathews explanation. Pardon me if you did not like the way I put it. I am only an ordinary person does not have much formal education in the theology and Literature. I would like to write more but Time and my typing speed does not permit me.

      "1. We must understand that since Jesus Himself didn't write, no writing
      about Him or His life is exactly pure and unbiased. Alex said that we
      must refer to Matthew and John for more valid accounts. However, Biblical
      scholars all agree that Matthew was not written by the Apostle Matthew,
      but rather by a Jewish rabbi, a follower of Christ. His Gospel is baised
      in the sense that it play to the Jewish audience, having numerous
      references to the Davidic line of Kingship  in  Jesus, and well as Jesus
      fulfilling the prophecies of the OT prophets. St. John, is the last of
      the Gospels to be written (c. 90-100 AD). Since our Lord ascended in
      approx. 27-30 AD, he writes 60 years apart from Christ's life. Also John
      was in the last days of his life, so he may have beena little senile,due
      to his long exile in Patmos."

      The Name Matthew was actually a Jewish name "Mattit'yahu" which means gift from God.
      He was addressing Jews. He was chosen by Yeshua the Messiah. It is True that he wrote
      those gospel in his old days (I know that when Gabrielle Malakha appeared to Mariam, he was not
      there to write the notes. Neither when Yeshua was crucifying he was watching). May be as old as
      Our Barnabas Thirumeni when he wrote the Gospel.
      But I challenge Achan's and the so called scholars statements saying
      that it may not be written by Mattit'yahu (Matthew). Same about Yochanan (John) too.
      Even though he has some Platonic taste or Accent.

      Yochanan was Zebedi's youngest sun. Zebedis were rich family (Millionaires of today's in the US)
      they had many fishing boats which used to rent to fishermen. Sheemon Pethros and his Brother
      was working for these Zebedis.

      When Yochanan was young, one of his leg was not proper and he could not walk or stand right.
      Father Zebedi was very sad about this. Yochanan leg was healed by Yeshua.
      Since then he was with Yeshua.  And there were well to do families to take care of Yeshua's
      travel (which was appointed by Yeshua)  and was accompanied be many people too.
      (Yochanan was so affectionate to Yeshua, there was a reason for that.
      note Yakobs 11th Son Yoseph who was sold to Ishmaelis by the elder son Yahuda. here there
      is a hidden reference of Yuda Iskarioth too.)

      All the 12 disciples were Jews and It was very natural that They were addressing the Jews. And
      most of the followers of Yeshua those were Jews lived and practiced the Jews way of Life. There
      were no Conversion as Christians from Jews, only followers. Those were the Jews who believed
      Yeshua was really the Messiah and many Arabs and other Local community people was also there.
      There are Genuine writings in Hebru and Aramaic which makes it not necessary to look in to Greek
      or Latin books. Also Egyptian Anciant Coptic writings. The Greeks and Romans were Big people
      but did not Know the Culture and religious understandings of Palestine people or the Jews.
      There were Secret Brother Hood people who Carefully Wrote all those things.

      It was interesting to note that Yeshua's Brother (Mariams 2nd Son) Yakoob the Head Priest (Bishop?)
      was the one Designed the first Liturgy which Syrian Malayalee Orthodox church was following. Which
      has lot of relation with Jews way of Worship. Which means first few Decades Jews was the Immediate
      Followers of Yeshua. And the Christmas was not on December 24th.

      During 6th Century BCE when Nebuchandezer attacked Jerusalem Most of the Tribes of Israel was scattered
      away. During that time some of them came to India too. In kerala Matanchery Jewish history goes Back to
      King Solomon's time. (Early Trade Rout and Silk Road). The tribes left in the Palestine Area was BenJamin's
      (Ben+Amin =Sun of Amin, Amin =Truth in most high) and Yahuda's only. Bethlehem was from Benjamin's tribe
      which is King Davidic line of Kingship. When it was said Rachels Children, You may note that Only Joseph and
      BenJamin was Rachels Children. That is why Yakoob was in much in affection to Yoseph and BenJamin
      the rest of the other Ten Children was from Rachel's elder Sisters which Yakoob got married previously for the
      purpose of getting married with Rachel.

      Jews had adopted lot from other Cultures which would make their Culture and Religion Strong. It starts from Abraham.
      Abraham was the first one stopped his parent's Tradition of Idol worship and sacrifice of first child. (There was reason for those beliefs in those days)

      We have almost all the parallels in Syrian, Malabar, Malankara orthodox tradition. There was lot of Learned Rabbis. All of them were Independent learned ones. Jews gave very Importance for Education which made them very Important people even
      though many of them are arrogant and pride. There are many Scientists from Jews community which we know today.

      In India Early Orthodox christians also followed these things. They accepted the good qualities from the Local
      culture and so on. Also they gave Very Important for Education too. There are many Malayalies known
      Internationally from the Malayalee Orthodox Community. Recent many Decades I see that the Leaders of this
      church is not giving enough Importance for these things. Instead the Orthodox church leaders behave like
      the Roman church. More interested in Materiel ruling and Constitutional Importance and Public Acceptance.
      They fail to Educate the Achans and the Laymen the Importance and meanings of rituals We practice.
      The Direction of the East, meanings and Importance of words and How words are Powerful..
      Now I know many Jews who are believers of Yeshua the Messiah. Their tradition goes back to the anciant
      time. They Call the name Yakoob, like the original name. In our community the names are more modified so that
      it will fit to the Western (English) and the meaning of the WORD (Logos) is lost..  Now many people does not know Yeshua or Yeshua, They know only Jesus. Many of them say these are all some type of polishing way of solving the problem of
      Identity crisis. ( I believe that, all those rituals and words have very Important meanings)

      I do not have any problem for having good friendly connection with Anglican or Roman Church. Forgive does not mean that
      forget and approve the way. ( I have more respect to the muslims in that manner. The early bishops came with the Arabs to Malabar
      in their "Pathemaaries" (small ships)

      At least the Clergies should know what is the major differences of the different churches. I also would like to mention that Early Orthodox Church (even 50 years ago)  did not taught that Yeshu Mashekha is the God. They taught he is the Son of God.

      6. The Orthodox chruch does not teach the concept of Original Sin,that
      man was born with sin. This is a teaching of teh Roman Catholic Church
      created by Augustine. Rather, we teach that all mankind are subject to
      death because of Adam's fall, but not to sin. we have the Choice to Sin.
      that is the gift given to us by God.
      It is interesting that some one from our church even quoted me the Psalm of David saying
      that "in sin my mother conceived me"  Any way it is Clear that our church does not teach
      the concept of" we are born sinners" thanks.

      I felt that Adam's fall was "Falling in Love" which is normal now a days. I also thought about
      why people say falling in Love instead of become in love with. One of my teachers (late) told me
      many years ago the "Falling in Love concept" Came from Adam. If he did not Fell in Love
      with Eva there would not be any problem of the sin today (it was a Joke). Now a days people Manage to fall  in Love.

      8. If anyone wants to read original texts, it is better toread the
      original Greek and Hebrew texts and understand them within its cultural
      contexts, rather than trhough, english, Malayalam or other translated
      languages. They take on a new and lively meanin

      Early days in Malayalam, the name was not changed and there are lot of words came from Hebru,
      Arabic and Aramaic in Malayalam. It that manner I think  malayalam can express better than English
      in the Bible materials.

      Original texts of Bible was in Aramaic and Hebru. Greeks was the first one who translated
      those to their Language. Those were the problem of translation errors. Aramaic was
      the language of those land which was called "Padhan Aaram"

      We must remember taht our goal as Christians is to imitate the lifeof
      Christ, as teh perfect man-perfect God. WE can onyl dothat trhough God's
      grace and the Holy Spirit. Many times, we try to do it onour own, but we
      fail to see tht the Body of Christ the Church, was inspired by the Holy
      spirit,adn still is to guide to the perfect light. that light is the Word
      of God,the Logos, the Christ.

      The Word Christ is derived from the  Greek word Cristos meaning Messiah.
      Original Word is Mshee-khaa means the anointed one.(Mishkhaa = oil which was used
      for anointing the selected one, our Malayalam word "Mashee" came from the same word.)
      If one Carefully Read the Gospel of Yochanan, and Mattit'yahu, can read very clearly what
      Yeshua explains who is the Supreme Deity of God (Khudha) the Name God in English was
      came from the Middle east "Khudh" Same is used in Urdu too. Khudha, Rooha Kudha,
      the Supreme Deity Accordingly to the Eastern Orthodox Church is "Aaloho" or Alaha.
      In the Original Hebru books the Supreme deities name never Pronounced. It was said
      Adonai Malik which may be translated to "Lord the Most High"
      Jesus Claimed he is the perfect Man and all men should follow him.
      That means he is a Molecule of the supreme deity but he is not the Supreme deity.
      by following him men will also become one of those molecule of the supreme.

      Thank you for reading this. I also has the problem of time. now it is 12 midnight
      I have to go to work in the morning about 8 AM. I am writing this because I believe
      these things are Important to know those who are Orthodox Malayalees. I would be
      happy to write again if people are interested on this type of discussions. Otherwise this is the last one.

      I appreciate all the charity work which is done by every one, either Our church or any church or any one.
      I have lot to say about that too.

      May Lord  keep all you safe and happy in your Journey.
      alexander
       
       
       
       
       
       
       
       

      deaconaju@... wrote:

      Dear Alexander and my friends,

      First, let me apologize for not being moer vocal in his group. I have not
      been finding time to do so. In any case, I have been follwoing this
      gentlemanly debate between Alexander and Sujit. Just curiou, Alexander,
      have you had any seminary training. It seems as though you may have had
      some. There were a kit if things duscussed, and I don't have the time to
      comment oneverything, but I would just like to shed some light on some of
      the things discussed.

      1. We must understand that since Jesus Himself didn't write, no writing
      about Him or His life is exactly pure and unbiased. Alex said that we
      must refer to Matthew and John for more valid accounts. However, Biblical
      scholars all agree that Matthew was not written by the Apostle Matthew,
      but rather by a Jewish rabbi, a follower of Christ. His Gospel is baised
      in the sense that it play to the Jewish audience, having numerous
      references to the Davidic line of Kingship  in  Jesus, and well as Jesus
      fulfilling the prophecies of the OT prophets. St. John, is the last of
      the Gospels to be written (c. 90-100 AD). Since our Lord ascended in
      approx. 27-30 AD, he writes 60 years apart from Christ's life. Also John
      was in the last days of his life, so he may have beena little senile,due
      to his long exile in Patmos. Also, it is important to note that these
      Gospels along with various others floated around teh Empire in different
      versions,and editing styles, with numerous authors til St. Irenaeus wrote
      down the first Canon of the New testament in the 3rd century. So, we must
      accept that the Gospels are God-inspired but are not are pure as we would
      like them to be,adn the they are not the only sources of info on Christ's
      life. His apostles knew Him the best, so you have John saying that not
      everything the Lord did was recorded in his Gospel,and that in Acts, you
      read that teh early Church, spent time in prayer, fellowships, breaking
      of bread, and the APOSTLES' TEACHINGS. This continuation of apostolic
      teaching is only continued in the Orthodox Chruches, and very loosely in
      the Roman Church.

      2. I don't  think that any scholar would agree that Saul andJesus
      actually knew each other, but there is no facts to prove either way.
      However, speculations can lead us down the wrong paths. Also, we don't
      knwof ro sure about Paul's married life. Timothy was not his son, and
      Markand Luke are not part of the 12. these are also not endorsed by the
      Church.

      3. The organizational idea of teh Church was not started at Nicea in 325
      , but rather from the very get go. The Lord commissioned the Apostles as
      equals who are one with Him. In 49 AD, according to the book of Acts, the
      Apostles when faced with the issue of Gentile conversion to Christianity,
      met togetherin Jerusalem for the Apostolic Council of Jerusalem. St.
      James presided, being the Brother of our Lord, and Peter and Paul argues
      their cases. The Council unanimously decided that Circumcisoion was not
      neccesary for Baptism. Also, when the various apostles established
      chruches, they remained teh "father" of that Church, always checking up
      onthose parishes. That was teh success of Paul's missions. He always did
      checks on all his parishes. We also read that Deacons, or "servants" were
      ordained toserve the Greek speaking people and widows. In each parish
      (community), and elder (presbyteroi from which we get the word priest)
      was left incharge. When the Apostles died, they also left behind
      successors, who were called episkopoi, who maintained the large
      jurisdictions. In early manuscripts, there are records saying that
      certain areas were under the jurisdiction of a particular Apostle. So,
      the Churc naturally developed into a formal organization later on, but
      the seeds were planted in teh beginning.

      4. As far as the putfits of teh various clergy go, Bishops maintain a lot
      of the vestments of the early empirical garb, but this is more so inthe
      West than inthe east. After the 5th century, bishops took on the garb of
      the monks as celibacy was made mandatory by the Council for Bishops. As
      for priests, our vestments aer identical to that of teh priestood of the
      Jews. What the Lord has ordainmed for us to come closer to HIm, has not
      been destroyed by Christ,but rather fulfilled. Christ has shown us, that
      it is humanly possible to Love God and to Love others in various ways:
      service, worship, miracles, etc. When Christ said "Listentothem because
      tehy sit on teh seat of Moses, but do not follow them, because they do
      not follow what they teach", he was referring to Pharisees and the like,
      who had the honor of Moses' seat,but did not fulfill it. He said not to
      be like those people who do not practice what they preach. He did not
      altogether condemn the priesthood. Also, Pharisees are not priests. they
      are merely teachers of theLaw.
              We cannot say that our relationship to Jesus does not  go through the
      priests and teh saints. Salvation for the Jews and early church, was a
      communal thing. One person alone does not receive salvation (see Abraham
      pleading for Sodom and Gomorrah). Also, we are taught by the scriptures
      that intercession through saints and the priesthood is valid and is
      helpful. (see story of Miriam's sickness and Moses' intercession; see
      story of Wedding of Cana adn Mary's intercession).

      5. Oneis to grow within the Church and always be the fruit of the Church.
      Never to grow outside of it. The analogy is not right. We are not
      individuals trees in teh Church, but rather are fruits and flowers of teh
      same tree, that is based onthe Root of Jesse, our Lord Jesus Christ.  Our
      growth depends upon the growth of teh whole Church, and one bad apple
      spoils the bunch, but never spoils the tree. This the story of our
      Church. Sujit was right when he said that a few people, misguided, make
      silyl ocmments or do sillythings,and then everyone blames the Church.
      Alex is right, that our priests should be trained,and should reflect the
      teacher, but are we human, or superhuman, just because we learn about
      Christ or go through seminary. In my experience, ihave learned that we
      come face to face with our own extreme humanness. If Judas was a member
      of the 12, and he was a the betrayer, does this not mean taht all those
      Apostles should have been betrayers? Or does this not mean, that Jesus
      did not do His job well? Not at all. rather, Man has the choice to sin.
      And the mjority of thetime, we do not have the strength to not sin.

      6. The Orthodox chruch does not teach the concept of Original Sin,that
      man was born with sin. This is a teaching of teh Roman Catholic Church
      created by Augustine. Rather, we teach that all mankind are subject to
      death because of Adam's fall, but not to sin. we have the Choice to Sin.
      that is the gift given to us by God.

      7. About the critical reviewing of Christianity in the light of other
      faiths: it cannot be unbiased. You cannot learn about Christ through a
      Hindu philosopher, nor throughMalayalam originals. If one wants to learn
      about Christ, read teh writings of teh Desert Fathers or the early
      Doctors of the Church. For people of other faiths, Christ is nothing more
      than a Guru. For us, Christ is God. Christ is not one form of God, but
      God. IF I wanted to learn about Biology, would I go learn it trhough a
      Physics teacher? No, because what I am learning is separate from the
      original. One can never understand Christ and God trhough human
      philiosphy and human knowledge. that is the greatest setback of mankind.
      The trinity is not a map of the Trimurthi in Hinduism. Though similar,
      the differences are distinctly opposed to Christianity. (Brahma, Vishnu,
      and shiva, have distinct roles,and are three different gods, who together
      control life. One control,s Life, one sustains it, and the other destroys
      it. In the Trinity, all three are one essence, but three hypostasis,
      where allthree partake in allof life, together without confusion, without
      conflict, in harmony. In the trimurthi, one god can override thedecision
      of the other god). The four vedas and the four gospels may be coincidence
      if anything. There is nothing similar about them. Now, I also have heard
      that there are writings about Jesus inthe Hinu philiosophy. I have not
      read them, but i stress again my point, that only the Church can teach me
      about Christ, not Hindu scripture. I have studied basic Hinduism as well
      as Buddhism, Islam, Judiasm, and other eastern Religions. But never have
      a tired to judge Christianity by the other faiths. there is something
      non-commonsensical about that. I respect allfaiths and i believe "to each
      his own", but my respect doesn't turn into faith of those deities.

      8. If anyone wants to read original texts, it is better toread the
      original Greek and Hebrew texts and understand them within its cultural
      contexts, rather than trhough, english, Malayalam or other translated
      languages. They take on a new and lively meaning...

      You also talk about a lot of other things, that I do not have the time to
      write upon. You all must excuse that. I enjoy reading all your ideas. We
      must remember taht our goal as Christians is to imitate the lifeof
      Christ, as teh perfect man-perfect God. WE can onyl dothat trhough God's
      grace and the Holy Spirit. Many times, we try to do it onour own, but we
      fail to see tht the Body of Christ the Church, was inspired by the Holy
      spirit,adn still is to guide to the perfect light. that light is the Word
      of God,the Logos, the Christ.

      Merry Xmas to all,and a prosperous Ne w year.
                                         +++++ Rev. Dn. Aju Mathews +++++
                 St. George Malankara Orthodox Church of Staten Island, New
      York
                               PHONE: (732) 938 7365/ CELL: (732) 586 3223
                 "The secret of the Lord is with those who fear Him." - Psalms
      25:14

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