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Re: New group for human-friendly dates. ICU info on the subject

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  • johnmsteele
    ... day and ... calenders, ... 1582 C.E. ... etc. ... UNICODE ... I m not sure I understand how that helps. I view it as a competing alternative that
    Message 1 of 5 , Jan 26, 2004
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      --- In ISO8601@yahoogroups.com, hjwoudenberg@a... wrote:
      > The ICU (International Components for UNICODE) has allows text for
      day and
      > month and Time Zone Abreviation. In addition:
      > They allow for Islamic, Persian, Hebrew, Chinese and Japanese
      calenders,
      > beside the Gregorian and Julian Calendar ( cut over is October 4,
      1582 C.E.
      > ISO is only Gregorian)..
      > Foreign languages including right to left languages. top down
      etc.
      > Time may be 12 hour time (am pm)
      > Did not see any restriction that date must be only YYYY-MM-DD.
      UNICODE
      > objective is to support local languages, local formats?
      >

      I'm not sure I understand how that helps. I view it as a competing
      alternative that eliminates the need for standardization. If a
      standard machine date object is interchanged and then locally
      interpretted to an arbitrary date/time format, everyone can keep on
      using different calendars and formats. I think the point of ISO8601
      is, at least for commerce, everyone uses the Gregorian calendar. If
      we used a standard format for dates and times, they could be
      understand internationally without the need for a computer to convert
      calendar or format classes. If we assume that date object is always
      interchanged between computers and then interpretted, there is no
      need for standardization, except the date object. However, if a
      date/time format is printed out and read by humans, it needs to be
      generally understand, not just by locals.

      ALso, humans can exchange information without the aid of a computer,
      and need to have a common international understanding of date and
      time conventions, which appears to be the point of the second group,
      and again support of a bunch of local standards makes the problem
      worse.
    • Tex Texin
      Hi, Unicode is about representing and interchanging text, it s not really about localization. ICU is a library that provides support for Unicode, but also
      Message 2 of 5 , Jan 26, 2004
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        Hi,

        Unicode is about representing and interchanging text, it's not really
        about localization.

        ICU is a library that provides support for Unicode, but also supports
        internationalization and localization functions that are typically
        needed by programs and require either parsing or generating text. For
        example, converting dates from an internal format to a rendering for
        end-users. These functions go beyond what the Unicode standard talks
        about.

        One other comment, there is more than one cutover date from Julian to
        Gregorian- when the calendar was adopted varies by country and whereas
        the first cuts were in 1582, the most recent occurred in some countries
        in the early 1900s.

        tex


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      • NGUYEN Adam
        This is another reason why computer calendars shouldn t go back further than whenever the last changeover from Julien-Gregorian was. Either that or store each
        Message 3 of 5 , Jan 27, 2004
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          This is another reason why computer calendars shouldn't go back
          further than whenever the last changeover from Julien-Gregorian was. Either
          that or store each changeover date in the OS and apply the changes
          depending on whatever locale the user selects (however, this approach isn't
          the best approach for people like me, who use UK English and just customise
          the number settings to space for a thousands separator, currency settings
          to dollars (negative looks like -1.45 $, positive looks like 1.45 $), Date
          settings to yyyy-MM-dd and yyyy MMMM d '('dddd')', and Time settings to
          HH:mm:ss) no matter where I am).

          Maybe the OS venders should have an 'English (International)'
          setting that has all this stuff already programmed? I wish this was
          possible, as every time my regional settings change, I have to customise
          them all over again... With an 'English (International)', the number,
          currency*, date, time, and measuring systems should all match ISO settings
          and the English version used should be United Kingdom... *I guess the most
          common currency is the USD, so that's what it should be?

          At 2004/01/27 00:01 (UTC-0500), you wrote:

          >[...] there is more than one cutover date from Julian to
          >Gregorian- when the calendar was adopted varies by country and whereas
          >the first cuts were in 1582, the most recent occurred in some countries
          >in the early 1900s. [...]
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