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Re: [IRAQHistory] IRAQ History E-Newsletter April 2006

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  • Anis Anis
    To Walaa’ Ali and Richard Sullivan, Thank you very much for your critic on my abstract. First of all, I think our team is called (IRAQ History Group) and I
    Message 1 of 17 , May 1, 2006
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      To  Walaa’ Ali and Richard Sullivan,
       
           Thank you very much for your critic on my abstract. First of all, I think our team is called (IRAQ History Group) and I suppose that I am dealing with historian people, who treating with history as a fact, not as they wish, nor with those people who don’t talk with historical way or pretending to be historians. Second,  if you historians, I hope to clarify that I was taking specifically  about Ottoman policy towards Iraqi society, not about something else, as sectarian differences, as you mentioned, and this is a historical reality supported by historical evidences and documents. I didn’t say there is a civil war in past or nowadays IRAQ. If anyone of you has a different historical proof or information as regard Ottoman policy towards Iraqi society I will be happy to get it. I suppose to get feedback from historians only. I hope that you read behind the lines in the future well, and focusing, specifically, on the subject. Don’t talk with emotional way please and keep your laugh for yourselves.
       
       Best regards
       Anees Al-Qaysi
       


      "W. A." <WMS_Al@...> wrote:
      Thank you, Wafaa', for a wonderful issue.  The inclusive of the Arabic pages was very helpful.
       
      Well said, Richard.  I felt the same too reading Anees Al-Qaysi's article.  Some kind of a fashion these days to speak about Sunnis and Shiites. 
       
      If the Ottomans were racists and secterian, and so did the British (after them) and the American-British-Israeli Company is doing now in IRAQ, why have Iraqis been accused of practicing or committing secterianism?  This is a famous recipe for the DIVIDE AND RULE.  And worse yet, the worldwide mainstream media is talking of nothing, but the so-called civil war and of the bombs the "Iraqis are using to kill themselves", supposedly for secterian hatred; what a laughable notion indeed.
       
      People seem to forget that with the support of the USA/UK many militias (before the war in 2003) were trained in Israel, East Europe and Iran to accompany the army and commit their killing and gurella activities the minute Baghdad was defeated! This is aside from the various American and British mercenary companies whose employess are being paid hundreds of dollars (up to $1000) daily to be in IRAQ for the purpose of killing, and killing only! 
       
      I am a Moslem of one sect and my husband is of another.  This is the story of at least 50% of Iraqis, at least!  The majority of Iraqis are secular (including Iraq's governments since its independence), so how will the occupation succeed in creating a civil war between Iraqis?  Unless by killing Iraqis and blaming them for killing each other!  Perhaps in their dreams since the ignorant, racist and secterian industrial west think that Iraq is the same or wishes to see others in the same scope!  Iraq's history had no civil wars!  So let the enemies of Iraq keep dreaming.
       
      The minute the racist and secterian Ottomans and British left Iraq, starting with the Kings and ending with Saddam, Iraqi society was living in peace and nearly all ethnic and religious groups co-existed and worked together in all facets of life.  Most were getting equal share in every aspect (work, health and education) including women and the poor.  Women get equal pay for equal jobs, a matter shamefully the UK and USA have not yet accomplished and in many of the so-called first world/advanced societies! 
       
      During stability and economic prosperity, most Iraqis benefited.  Whenever there were devastation, crises and war, most people got hurt and suffer!  It is as simple as this.
      Even Saddam's harsh dictatorship was not sectarian or sexist!! 
       
      I am aware of the fact that the current situation in Iraq is a subject outside of the scope of this e-newsletter and group, but the article on Ottoman in relation to the Sunnis and Shiites of Iraq opened this can of worms.
       
      I appreciate your hard work, Wafaa', and still think we, the subscribers, should pay annual subscription for this informative e-newsletter and sourceful blog if no Iraqi, Arab or Islamic organization is available and willing to fund it.
       
      Best Regards,
      Walaa' Ali


      VImportant@... wrote:
      Dear Wafaa':
       
      For nearly three weeks, there has not been any activity on the Iraq History Group list,
      and I began to wonder where were you and everybody else!!  Then I received the
      April newsletter and was very impressed.
       
      Some pieces of the puzzles are being solved little by little.  I am speaking, of course,
      in terms of the mysterious deaths and the lies or incorrect details about what
      had happend under certain leaders. I read the newsletter three times, once quickly
      alone and once with my wife and again with my wife and a friend.  Thank you.  It was
      very informative.
       
      I have to relay to you, however, my Palestinian wife's commentary about Anees
      Al-Qaysi's study/summary.  She didn't like the timing of the study/publication.  Its information seemed to come as a proof or a justification for those who have
      been arguing (including Washington's neocons) that the Shiites were being oppressed
      and so it is normal to see atrocities between Sunnis and Shiites and to expect
      a civil war!!!  By the way, my wife is a Christian, but have lived half of her life in
      Arab Islamic countries, and she always laugh when she hears the mainstream media
      speak of the Sunni Triangle or the Shiite South!  I don't blame her.  Having lived
      and taught in Arab and non-Arab Islamic countries and have taught American foriegn
      policy and Middle East history for 30 years, I am well aware about the reality about
      the Arab World especially in Palestine and IRAQ.
       
      Thanks again for the April e-newsletter.  Those who are not part of this group list are
      missing a lot.  
       
      With Appreciation,
      Richard Sullivan
       
       
       
       
       
       
       
       
      Dear subscribers:
       
      Please give me your feedback in case there are errors in the content of the e-newsletter.  I have encountered a variety of Internet technical problems!  Additionally, a couple of paragraphs on the life and poetry of the medieval Iraqi poet al-Mutanabbi is not included with the announcement by the Arab-Swiss Cultural Center because they were saved on an USB unit that was lost.  I will add the information shortly.  I await your corrections if there are any errors to update this issue on the blog with the along with the missing information.
       
      I could not include the text of the e-newsletter in this email because of the Arabic documents I added at the top.
       
      Wishing you all a wonderful spring,
       
      Wafaa' Al-Natheema


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    • VImportant@aol.com
      Dear Anees: It is wonderful to receive someone s email coming from Iraq or any place at war because it is precious. No one was criticizing the facts in your
      Message 2 of 17 , May 1, 2006
      • 0 Attachment
        Dear Anees:
         
         
        It is wonderful to receive someone's email coming from Iraq or any place at
        war because it is precious.
         
        No one was criticizing the facts in your paper.  I think you misuderstood at least
        our (my wife and I) reaction not criticism (and perhaps that of Walaa').  It is the
        reasons behind writing it and especially the timing of the paper..For Iraqi
        Moslems such as Walaa', it has been frustrating to read/hear about this matter continuously.  I can understand.
         
        By the way, our laughing was about the media coverage.   I wrote that my
        wife, ".... always laugh when she hears the mainstream media
        speak of the Sunni Triangle or the Shiite South! ".   These very claims by the American government and worldwide mainstream media are sectarian, exaggerated and laughable because they are nothing, but milicious distortions of reality.  The laughing was not
        about the facts in your paper.
         
        While the historic facts of what the Ottomans did in Iraq were true (no one is
        denying them), the subject matter can be controversial and perhaps better avoided 
        during a time where Iraqis are on the verge of a civil war between Sunnis
        and Shiites.  This goes not just about you writing it, but about its publication
        in the IRAQ History e-newsletter at this critical time!
         
        In Solidarity,
        Richard
         
         
         
         
        In a message dated 5/1/2006 9:38:25 AM Eastern Standard Time, anisalkaysi@... writes:
        To  Walaa’ Ali and Richard Sullivan,
         
             Thank you very much for your critic on my abstract. First of all, I think our team is called (IRAQ History Group) and I suppose that I am dealing with historian people, who treating with history as a fact, not as they wish, nor with those people who don’t talk with historical way or pretending to be historians. Second,  if you historians, I hope to clarify that I was taking specifically  about Ottoman policy towards Iraqi society, not about something else, as sectarian differences, as you mentioned, and this is a historical reality supported by historical evidences and documents. I didn’t say there is a civil war in past or nowadays IRAQ. If anyone of you has a different historical proof or information as regard Ottoman policy towards Iraqi society I will be happy to get it. I suppose to get feedback from historians only. I hope that you read behind the lines in the future well, and focusing, specifically, on the subject. Don’t talk with emotional way please and keep your laugh for yourselves.
         
         Best regards
         Anees Al-Qaysi
         


        "W. A." <WMS_Al@...> wrote:
        Thank you, Wafaa', for a wonderful issue.  The inclusive of the Arabic pages was very helpful.
         
        Well said, Richard.  I felt the same too reading Anees Al-Qaysi's article.  Some kind of a fashion these days to speak about Sunnis and Shiites. 
         
        If the Ottomans were racists and secterian, and so did the British (after them) and the American-British-Israeli Company is doing now in IRAQ, why have Iraqis been accused of practicing or committing secterianism?  This is a famous recipe for the DIVIDE AND RULE.  And worse yet, the worldwide mainstream media is talking of nothing, but the so-called civil war and of the bombs the "Iraqis are using to kill themselves", supposedly for secterian hatred; what a laughable notion indeed.
         
        People seem to forget that with the support of the USA/UK many militias (before the war in 2003) were trained in Israel, East Europe and Iran to accompany the army and commit their killing and gurella activities the minute Baghdad was defeated! This is aside from the various American and British mercenary companies whose employess are being paid hundreds of dollars (up to $1000) daily to be in IRAQ for the purpose of killing, and killing only! 
         
        I am a Moslem of one sect and my husband is of another.  This is the story of at least 50% of Iraqis, at least!  The majority of Iraqis are secular (including Iraq's governments since its independence), so how will the occupation succeed in creating a civil war between Iraqis?  Unless by killing Iraqis and blaming them for killing each other!  Perhaps in their dreams since the ignorant, racist and secterian industrial west think that Iraq is the same or wishes to see others in the same scope!  Iraq's history had no civil wars!  So let the enemies of Iraq keep dreaming.
         
        The minute the racist and secterian Ottomans and British left Iraq, starting with the Kings and ending with Saddam, Iraqi society was living in peace and nearly all ethnic and religious groups co-existed and worked together in all facets of life.  Most were getting equal share in every aspect (work, health and education) including women and the poor.  Women get equal pay for equal jobs, a matter shamefully the UK and USA have not yet accomplished and in many of the so-called first world/advanced societies! 
         
        During stability and economic prosperity, most Iraqis benefited.  Whenever there were devastation, crises and war, most people got hurt and suffer!  It is as simple as this.
        Even Saddam's harsh dictatorship was not sectarian or sexist!! 
         
        I am aware of the fact that the current situation in Iraq is a subject outside of the scope of this e-newsletter and group, but the article on Ottoman in relation to the Sunnis and Shiites of Iraq opened this can of worms.
         
        I appreciate your hard work, Wafaa', and still think we, the subscribers, should pay annual subscription for this informative e-newsletter and sourceful blog if no Iraqi, Arab or Islamic organization is available and willing to fund it.
         
        Best Regards,
        Walaa' Ali


        VImportant@... wrote:
        Dear Wafaa':
         
        For nearly three weeks, there has not been any activity on the Iraq History Group list,
        and I began to wonder where were you and everybody else!!  Then I received the
        April newsletter and was very impressed.
         
        Some pieces of the puzzles are being solved little by little.  I am speaking, of course,
        in terms of the mysterious deaths and the lies or incorrect details about what
        had happend under certain leaders. I read the newsletter three times, once quickly
        alone and once with my wife and again with my wife and a friend.  Thank you.  It was
        very informative.
         
        I have to relay to you, however, my Palestinian wife's commentary about Anees
        Al-Qaysi's study/summary.  She didn't like the timing of the study/publication.  Its information seemed to come as a proof or a justification for those who have
        been arguing (including Washington's neocons) that the Shiites were being oppressed
        and so it is normal to see atrocities between Sunnis and Shiites and to expect
        a civil war!!!  By the way, my wife is a Christian, but have lived half of her life in
        Arab Islamic countries, and she always laugh when she hears the mainstream media
        speak of the Sunni Triangle or the Shiite South!  I don't blame her.  Having lived
        and taught in Arab and non-Arab Islamic countries and have taught American foriegn
        policy and Middle East history for 30 years, I am well aware about the reality about
        the Arab World especially in Palestine and IRAQ.
         
        Thanks again for the April e-newsletter.  Those who are not part of this group list are
        missing a lot.  
         
        With Appreciation,
        Richard Sullivan
         
         
         
         
         
         
         
         
        Dear subscribers:
         
        Please give me your feedback in case there are errors in the content of the e-newsletter.  I have encountered a variety of Internet technical problems!  Additionally, a couple of paragraphs on the life and poetry of the medieval Iraqi poet al-Mutanabbi is not included with the announcement by the Arab-Swiss Cultural Center because they were saved on an USB unit that was lost.  I will add the information shortly.  I await your corrections if there are any errors to update this issue on the blog with the along with the missing information.
         
        I could not include the text of the e-newsletter in this email because of the Arabic documents I added at the top.
         
        Wishing you all a wonderful spring,
         
        Wafaa' Al-Natheema


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      • W. A.
        Dear Anees: Thank you for your response. I think you completely misunderstood my points. Your paper neither mentioned about civil war nor presented wrong facts
        Message 3 of 17 , May 1, 2006
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          Dear Anees:
           
          Thank you for your response.
           
          I think you completely misunderstood my points.
           
          Your paper neither mentioned about civil war nor presented wrong facts reg. what the Ottomans did in IRAQ.  But since that history of favoritism toward the Sunnis may have been perceived as a contributing factor for what is happening today in IRAQ [Which is unture], I argued my points as an extra percaution.  You needed not take it personal.
           
          In fact my paragraph, "If the Ottomans were racists and secterian, and so did the British (after them) and what the American-British-Israeli Company is doing now in IRAQ, why have Iraqis been accused of practicing or committing secterianism?  This is a famous recipe for the DIVIDE AND RULE.  And worse yet, the worldwide mainstream media is talking of nothing, but the so-called civil war and of the bombs the "Iraqis are using to kill themselves", supposedly for secterian hatred; what a laughable notion indeed."  was in agreement with your statement about the conducts of Ottomans.  I am fed up from hearing that Iraqis are secterians when the occupiers are and have harshly enforced secterianism. 
           
          My concern was the timing of the publication and the need to clarify the misconceptions about Iraqis regardless of who is a historian and who is not.
           
           
          Regards
          Walaa' Ali
           


          Wafaa' Al-Natheema <aboutfromiraq@...> wrote:
          Thank you, May, Richard and Walaa' for your thoughtful remarks.  It is rewarding for me to know that you find the
          e-newsletter informative.  Personally, I am not yet as satisfied as you are with it.  But I hope with time, it improves.
           
           
          As for Anees Al-Qaysi's article:  While I understand that its content may feel upsetting or be misunderstood, it is important to put in mind that he had written it while living in violent IRAQ with little electricity daily.  I was so appreciative of him to send his summary/article in both languages (Arabic and English).
           
          With the exception of Dr. Mudhafar Amin, all historians of the writing/editing team live in Iraq and find it very difficult to produce!  Also a couple of them do not read/write in English.  This is why we have added the research/translation team to help translate what is being written by historians to English and to research and compile information that may not be available, known or produced by the historians/writers team.
           
          By stating this, I don't mean to criticize you, Walaa', or Richard's wife at all.  You all have raised valid points.  At the same time, I hope Anees would not take this as a personal criticism and feel discouraged, but rather to mirror the reality of Iraqis and Arabs too (in this case Richard's Palestinian Christian wife and of course many others) who are fed up with the misunderstanding and mislabeling done in the west about who they are and what they can or are entitled to do.
           
          In my earlier email, I had mentioned that the announcement on al-Mutanabbi Festival sponsored by the Arab-Swiss Center in Switzerland was lacking a paragraph about the poet's background and poetry.  I was lucky to find my missing USB unit today in the floor of my car.  So I include the brief information below, which will be posted on the blog as well with the announcement. 
           
          Best Regards,
          Wafaa'
           
           
          Al-Mutanabbi
          (915-965 CE)
           
           
          Abut-Tayyib Ahmed al-Mutanabbi was born in 303 Hijriyya (HJ)/ 915 CE in an area called Kinda in the City of Kufa (in today’s IRAQ).  He had a rare talent in versifying poetry with no competitors in his lifetime!
           
          He was given the family name of al-Mutanabbi because he claimed to be a prophet (Nabiy) while in the Samawa desert. 
           
          Abut-Tayyib traveled to Aleppo, Damascus and various cities in Egypt.  In 350 HJ, he returned to Baghdad.  Then traveled to Arjan and then to Shiraz in Iran, and finally arrived in Baghdad.  In the early month of Shaaban, 350 HJ / 965 CE, he traveled to Kufa.  While he was on the road in Kufa accompanying his son and a friend, a group of men passed by and harassed al-Mutanabbi.  They mocked and challenged him into fighting.  As a result of the fighting, al-Mutanabbi, his friend and son were all killed.
           
          Al-Mutanabbi was the master of the exuberant panegyric, which is impossible to translate into adequate English.  His (Diwan) collected poems are famous for their long-lived qasida.  With a flowery style and changing away from the traditional Arabic qasida, Al-Mutanabbi stands out as the most important representative for the panegyric poetry.
           
          For further reading and sources, visit http://www.poetrymagic.co.uk/poets/almutanabbi.html
           
           


          "W. A." <WMS_Al@...> wrote:
          Thank you, Wafaa', for a wonderful issue.  The inclusive of the Arabic pages was very helpful.
           
          Well said, Richard.  I felt the same too reading Anees Al-Qaysi's article.  Some kind of a fashion these days to speak about Sunnis and Shiites. 
           
          If the Ottomans were racists and secterian, and so did the British (after them) and the American-British-Israeli Company is doing now in IRAQ, why have Iraqis been accused of practicing or committing secterianism?  This is a famous recipe for the DIVIDE AND RULE.  And worse yet, the worldwide mainstream media is talking of nothing, but the so-called civil war and of the bombs the "Iraqis are using to kill themselves", supposedly for secterian hatred; what a laughable notion indeed.
           
          People seem to forget that with the support of the USA/UK many militias (before the war in 2003) were trained in Israel, East Europe and Iran to accompany the army and commit their killing and gurella activities the minute Baghdad was defeated! This is aside from the various American and British mercenary companies whose employess are being paid hundreds of dollars (up to $1000) daily to be in IRAQ for the purpose of killing, and killing only! 
           
          I am a Moslem of one sect and my husband is of another.  This is the story of at least 50% of Iraqis, at least!  The majority of Iraqis are secular (including Iraq's governments since its independence), so how will the occupation succeed in creating a civil war between Iraqis?  Unless by killing Iraqis and blaming them for killing each other!  Perhaps in their dreams since the ignorant, racist and secterian industrial west think that Iraq is the same or wishes to see others in the same scope!  Iraq's history had no civil wars!  So let the enemies of Iraq keep dreaming.
           
          The minute the racist and secterian Ottomans and British left Iraq, starting with the Kings and ending with Saddam, Iraqi society was living in peace and nearly all ethnic and religious groups co-existed and worked together in all facets of life.  Most were getting equal share in every aspect (work, health and education) including women and the poor.  Women get equal pay for equal jobs, a matter shamefully the UK and USA have not yet accomplished and in many of the so-called first world/advanced societies! 
           
          During stability and economic prosperity, most Iraqis benefited.  Whenever there were devastation, crises and war, most people got hurt and suffer!  It is as simple as this.
          Even Saddam's harsh dictatorship was not sectarian or sexist!! 
           
          I am aware of the fact that the current situation in Iraq is a subject outside of the scope of this e-newsletter and group, but the article on Ottoman in relation to the Sunnis and Shiites of Iraq opened this can of worms.
           
          I appreciate your hard work, Wafaa', and still think we, the subscribers, should pay annual subscription for this informative e-newsletter and sourceful blog if no Iraqi, Arab or Islamic organization is available and willing to fund it.
           
          Best Regards,
          Walaa' Ali


          VImportant@... wrote:
          Dear Wafaa':
           
          For nearly three weeks, there has not been any activity on the Iraq History Group list,
          and I began to wonder where were you and everybody else!!  Then I received the
          April newsletter and was very impressed.
           
          Some pieces of the puzzles are being solved little by little.  I am speaking, of course,
          in terms of the mysterious deaths and the lies or incorrect details about what
          had happend under certain leaders. I read the newsletter three times, once quickly
          alone and once with my wife and again with my wife and a friend.  Thank you.  It was
          very informative.
           
          I have to relay to you, however, my Palestinian wife's commentary about Anees
          Al-Qaysi's study/summary.  She didn't like the timing of the study/publication.  Its information seemed to come as a proof or a justification for those who have
          been arguing (including Washington's neocons) that the Shiites were being oppressed
          and so it is normal to see atrocities between Sunnis and Shiites and to expect
          a civil war!!!  By the way, my wife is a Christian, but have lived half of her life in
          Arab Islamic countries, and she always laugh when she hears the mainstream media
          speak of the Sunni Triangle or the Shiite South!  I don't blame her.  Having lived
          and taught in Arab and non-Arab Islamic countries and have taught American foriegn
          policy and Middle East history for 30 years, I am well aware about the reality about
          the Arab World especially in Palestine and IRAQ.
           
          Thanks again for the April e-newsletter.  Those who are not part of this group list are
          missing a lot.  
           
          With Appreciation,
          Richard Sullivan
           
           
           
           
           
           
           
           
          Dear subscribers:
           
          Please give me your feedback in case there are errors in the content of the e-newsletter.  I have encountered a variety of Internet technical problems!  Additionally, a couple of paragraphs on the life and poetry of the medieval Iraqi poet al-Mutanabbi is not included with the announcement by the Arab-Swiss Cultural Center because they were saved on an USB unit that was lost.  I will add the information shortly.  I await your corrections if there are any errors to update this issue on the blog with the along with the missing information.
           
          I could not include the text of the e-newsletter in this email because of the Arabic documents I added at the top.
           
          Wishing you all a wonderful spring,
           
          Wafaa' Al-Natheema


          Love cheap thrills? Enjoy PC-to-Phone calls to 30+ countries for just 2¢/min with Yahoo! Messenger with Voice.


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        • Umm Zannobiya
          I am acknowledging receipt of the Iraq history e-newsletter and the feedback by Anees, May, Richard, Wafaa and Walaa. I tremendously enjoyed reading everything
          Message 4 of 17 , May 2, 2006
          • 0 Attachment
            I am acknowledging receipt of the Iraq history e-newsletter and the feedback by Anees, May, Richard, Wafaa and Walaa.
             
            I tremendously enjoyed reading everything and I (like May Roberts) look forward to reading about other aspects of Iraq's history (the arts, sciences, etc....) not just about the politics of MALES.
             
            I also agree with Walaa that there should be some annual subscription to support this project and encourage further the participation of historians especially those living in IRAQ.  We need to keep their perspective alive and compensate them for their precious research and writing especially in this utterly horrific war and insecurity.  Let Iraq's history documentation not be on a voluntarily bases only because sooner or later this will cease and the enemies of Iraq will continue writing Iraq's history the way it fits their agenda as it has been already happening.
             
            While I understand that some subscribers on this list live in Iraq or Arab countries, which may not be possible or practical to receive their donation in the USA. Those of us who live in the West should be able to donate $15 or $20 to compensate the historians on this list.  I assume the number of those of us who live in the west (America, Australia, Europe) are about 40.  Contributing $15 each will result in a total of $600.  If we are more in number and some donate more than $15, it will be even a larger sum.  For the next four issues left for the year, this is not a bad amount and will enable all those who participated in the 2006 documentation to receive some deserving compensation!
             
            I hope we vote about this matter and decide how to let the compensation reaches Iraqi historians in Iraq!  
             
            U. Z.
             
             


            "W. A." <WMS_Al@...> wrote:
            Dear Anees:
             
            Thank you for your response.
             
            I think you completely misunderstood my points.
             
            Your paper neither mentioned about civil war nor presented wrong facts reg. what the Ottomans did in IRAQ.  But since that history of favoritism toward the Sunnis may have been perceived as a contributing factor for what is happening today in IRAQ [Which is unture], I argued my points as an extra percaution.  You needed not take it personal.
             
            In fact my paragraph, "If the Ottomans were racists and secterian, and so did the British (after them) and what the American-British-Israeli Company is doing now in IRAQ, why have Iraqis been accused of practicing or committing secterianism?  This is a famous recipe for the DIVIDE AND RULE.  And worse yet, the worldwide mainstream media is talking of nothing, but the so-called civil war and of the bombs the "Iraqis are using to kill themselves", supposedly for secterian hatred; what a laughable notion indeed."  was in agreement with your statement about the conducts of Ottomans.  I am fed up from hearing that Iraqis are secterians when the occupiers are and have harshly enforced secterianism. 
             
            My concern was the timing of the publication and the need to clarify the misconceptions about Iraqis regardless of who is a historian and who is not.
             
             
            Regards
            Walaa' Ali
             


            Wafaa' Al-Natheema <aboutfromiraq@...> wrote:
            Thank you, May, Richard and Walaa' for your thoughtful remarks.  It is rewarding for me to know that you find the
            e-newsletter informative.  Personally, I am not yet as satisfied as you are with it.  But I hope with time, it improves.
             
             
            As for Anees Al-Qaysi's article:  While I understand that its content may feel upsetting or be misunderstood, it is important to put in mind that he had written it while living in violent IRAQ with little electricity daily.  I was so appreciative of him to send his summary/article in both languages (Arabic and English).
             
            With the exception of Dr. Mudhafar Amin, all historians of the writing/editing team live in Iraq and find it very difficult to produce!  Also a couple of them do not read/write in English.  This is why we have added the research/translation team to help translate what is being written by historians to English and to research and compile information that may not be available, known or produced by the historians/writers team.
             
            By stating this, I don't mean to criticize you, Walaa', or Richard's wife at all.  You all have raised valid points.  At the same time, I hope Anees would not take this as a personal criticism and feel discouraged, but rather to mirror the reality of Iraqis and Arabs too (in this case Richard's Palestinian Christian wife and of course many others) who are fed up with the misunderstanding and mislabeling done in the west about who they are and what they can or are entitled to do.
             
            In my earlier email, I had mentioned that the announcement on al-Mutanabbi Festival sponsored by the Arab-Swiss Center in Switzerland was lacking a paragraph about the poet's background and poetry.  I was lucky to find my missing USB unit today in the floor of my car.  So I include the brief information below, which will be posted on the blog as well with the announcement. 
             
            Best Regards,
            Wafaa'
             
             
            Al-Mutanabbi
            (915-965 CE)
             
             
            Abut-Tayyib Ahmed al-Mutanabbi was born in 303 Hijriyya (HJ)/ 915 CE in an area called Kinda in the City of Kufa (in today’s IRAQ).  He had a rare talent in versifying poetry with no competitors in his lifetime!
             
            He was given the family name of al-Mutanabbi because he claimed to be a prophet (Nabiy) while in the Samawa desert. 
             
            Abut-Tayyib traveled to Aleppo, Damascus and various cities in Egypt.  In 350 HJ, he returned to Baghdad.  Then traveled to Arjan and then to Shiraz in Iran, and finally arrived in Baghdad.  In the early month of Shaaban, 350 HJ / 965 CE, he traveled to Kufa.  While he was on the road in Kufa accompanying his son and a friend, a group of men passed by and harassed al-Mutanabbi.  They mocked and challenged him into fighting.  As a result of the fighting, al-Mutanabbi, his friend and son were all killed.
             
            Al-Mutanabbi was the master of the exuberant panegyric, which is impossible to translate into adequate English.  His (Diwan) collected poems are famous for their long-lived qasida.  With a flowery style and changing away from the traditional Arabic qasida, Al-Mutanabbi stands out as the most important representative for the panegyric poetry.
             
            For further reading and sources, visit http://www.poetrymagic.co.uk/poets/almutanabbi.html
             
             


            "W. A." <WMS_Al@...> wrote:
            Thank you, Wafaa', for a wonderful issue.  The inclusive of the Arabic pages was very helpful.
             
            Well said, Richard.  I felt the same too reading Anees Al-Qaysi's article.  Some kind of a fashion these days to speak about Sunnis and Shiites. 
             
            If the Ottomans were racists and secterian, and so did the British (after them) and the American-British-Israeli Company is doing now in IRAQ, why have Iraqis been accused of practicing or committing secterianism?  This is a famous recipe for the DIVIDE AND RULE.  And worse yet, the worldwide mainstream media is talking of nothing, but the so-called civil war and of the bombs the "Iraqis are using to kill themselves", supposedly for secterian hatred; what a laughable notion indeed.
             
            People seem to forget that with the support of the USA/UK many militias (before the war in 2003) were trained in Israel, East Europe and Iran to accompany the army and commit their killing and gurella activities the minute Baghdad was defeated! This is aside from the various American and British mercenary companies whose employess are being paid hundreds of dollars (up to $1000) daily to be in IRAQ for the purpose of killing, and killing only! 
             
            I am a Moslem of one sect and my husband is of another.  This is the story of at least 50% of Iraqis, at least!  The majority of Iraqis are secular (including Iraq's governments since its independence), so how will the occupation succeed in creating a civil war between Iraqis?  Unless by killing Iraqis and blaming them for killing each other!  Perhaps in their dreams since the ignorant, racist and secterian industrial west think that Iraq is the same or wishes to see others in the same scope!  Iraq's history had no civil wars!  So let the enemies of Iraq keep dreaming.
             
            The minute the racist and secterian Ottomans and British left Iraq, starting with the Kings and ending with Saddam, Iraqi society was living in peace and nearly all ethnic and religious groups co-existed and worked together in all facets of life.  Most were getting equal share in every aspect (work, health and education) including women and the poor.  Women get equal pay for equal jobs, a matter shamefully the UK and USA have not yet accomplished and in many of the so-called first world/advanced societies! 
             
            During stability and economic prosperity, most Iraqis benefited.  Whenever there were devastation, crises and war, most people got hurt and suffer!  It is as simple as this.
            Even Saddam's harsh dictatorship was not sectarian or sexist!! 
             
            I am aware of the fact that the current situation in Iraq is a subject outside of the scope of this e-newsletter and group, but the article on Ottoman in relation to the Sunnis and Shiites of Iraq opened this can of worms.
             
            I appreciate your hard work, Wafaa', and still think we, the subscribers, should pay annual subscription for this informative e-newsletter and sourceful blog if no Iraqi, Arab or Islamic organization is available and willing to fund it.
             
            Best Regards,
            Walaa' Ali


            VImportant@... wrote:
            Dear Wafaa':
             
            For nearly three weeks, there has not been any activity on the Iraq History Group list,
            and I began to wonder where were you and everybody else!!  Then I received the
            April newsletter and was very impressed.
             
            Some pieces of the puzzles are being solved little by little.  I am speaking, of course,
            in terms of the mysterious deaths and the lies or incorrect details about what
            had happend under certain leaders. I read the newsletter three times, once quickly
            alone and once with my wife and again with my wife and a friend.  Thank you.  It was
            very informative.
             
            I have to relay to you, however, my Palestinian wife's commentary about Anees
            Al-Qaysi's study/summary.  She didn't like the timing of the study/publication.  Its information seemed to come as a proof or a justification for those who have
            been arguing (including Washington's neocons) that the Shiites were being oppressed
            and so it is normal to see atrocities between Sunnis and Shiites and to expect
            a civil war!!!  By the way, my wife is a Christian, but have lived half of her life in
            Arab Islamic countries, and she always laugh when she hears the mainstream media
            speak of the Sunni Triangle or the Shiite South!  I don't blame her.  Having lived
            and taught in Arab and non-Arab Islamic countries and have taught American foriegn
            policy and Middle East history for 30 years, I am well aware about the reality about
            the Arab World especially in Palestine and IRAQ.
             
            Thanks again for the April e-newsletter.  Those who are not part of this group list are
            missing a lot.  
             
            With Appreciation,
            Richard Sullivan
             
             
             
             
             
             
             
             
            Dear subscribers:
             
            Please give me your feedback in case there are errors in the content of the e-newsletter.  I have encountered a variety of Internet technical problems!  Additionally, a couple of paragraphs on the life and poetry of the medieval Iraqi poet al-Mutanabbi is not included with the announcement by the Arab-Swiss Cultural Center because they were saved on an USB unit that was lost.  I will add the information shortly.  I await your corrections if there are any errors to update this issue on the blog with the along with the missing information.
             
            I could not include the text of the e-newsletter in this email because of the Arabic documents I added at the top.
             
            Wishing you all a wonderful spring,
             
            Wafaa' Al-Natheema


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          • W. A.
            I agree. I vote yes and am willing to donate more than $15. Wafaa has been in contact with all the historians and can take the compensation with her if she
            Message 5 of 17 , May 2, 2006
            • 0 Attachment
              I agree.   I vote yes and am willing to donate more than $15.
               
              Wafaa has been in contact with all the historians and can take the compensation with her if she will be going to IRAQ.  If not there is a Western Union-Like services that can transfer money to Iraq.
               
              Regards,
              Walaa Ali


              Umm Zannobiya <ghazalanimir@...> wrote:
              I am acknowledging receipt of the Iraq history e-newsletter and the feedback by Anees, May, Richard, Wafaa and Walaa.
               
              I tremendously enjoyed reading everything and I (like May Roberts) look forward to reading about other aspects of Iraq's history (the arts, sciences, etc....) not just about the politics of MALES.
               
              I also agree with Walaa that there should be some annual subscription to support this project and encourage further the participation of historians especially those living in IRAQ.  We need to keep their perspective alive and compensate them for their precious research and writing especially in this utterly horrific war and insecurity.  Let Iraq's history documentation not be on a voluntarily bases only because sooner or later this will cease and the enemies of Iraq will continue writing Iraq's history the way it fits their agenda as it has been already happening.
               
              While I understand that some subscribers on this list live in Iraq or Arab countries, which may not be possible or practical to receive their donation in the USA. Those of us who live in the West should be able to donate $15 or $20 to compensate the historians on this list.  I assume the number of those of us who live in the west (America, Australia, Europe) are about 40.  Contributing $15 each will result in a total of $600.  If we are more in number and some donate more than $15, it will be even a larger sum.  For the next four issues left for the year, this is not a bad amount and will enable all those who participated in the 2006 documentation to receive some deserving compensation!
               
              I hope we vote about this matter and decide how to let the compensation reaches Iraqi historians in Iraq!  
               
              U. Z.
               
               


              "W. A." <WMS_Al@...> wrote:
              Dear Anees:
               
              Thank you for your response.
               
              I think you completely misunderstood my points.
               
              Your paper neither mentioned about civil war nor presented wrong facts reg. what the Ottomans did in IRAQ.  But since that history of favoritism toward the Sunnis may have been perceived as a contributing factor for what is happening today in IRAQ [Which is unture], I argued my points as an extra percaution.  You needed not take it personal.
               
              In fact my paragraph, "If the Ottomans were racists and secterian, and so did the British (after them) and what the American-British-Israeli Company is doing now in IRAQ, why have Iraqis been accused of practicing or committing secterianism?  This is a famous recipe for the DIVIDE AND RULE.  And worse yet, the worldwide mainstream media is talking of nothing, but the so-called civil war and of the bombs the "Iraqis are using to kill themselves", supposedly for secterian hatred; what a laughable notion indeed."  was in agreement with your statement about the conducts of Ottomans.  I am fed up from hearing that Iraqis are secterians when the occupiers are and have harshly enforced secterianism. 
               
              My concern was the timing of the publication and the need to clarify the misconceptions about Iraqis regardless of who is a historian and who is not.
               
               
              Regards
              Walaa' Ali
               


              Wafaa' Al-Natheema <aboutfromiraq@...> wrote:
              Thank you, May, Richard and Walaa' for your thoughtful remarks.  It is rewarding for me to know that you find the
              e-newsletter informative.  Personally, I am not yet as satisfied as you are with it.  But I hope with time, it improves.
               
               
              As for Anees Al-Qaysi's article:  While I understand that its content may feel upsetting or be misunderstood, it is important to put in mind that he had written it while living in violent IRAQ with little electricity daily.  I was so appreciative of him to send his summary/article in both languages (Arabic and English).
               
              With the exception of Dr. Mudhafar Amin, all historians of the writing/editing team live in Iraq and find it very difficult to produce!  Also a couple of them do not read/write in English.  This is why we have added the research/translation team to help translate what is being written by historians to English and to research and compile information that may not be available, known or produced by the historians/writers team.
               
              By stating this, I don't mean to criticize you, Walaa', or Richard's wife at all.  You all have raised valid points.  At the same time, I hope Anees would not take this as a personal criticism and feel discouraged, but rather to mirror the reality of Iraqis and Arabs too (in this case Richard's Palestinian Christian wife and of course many others) who are fed up with the misunderstanding and mislabeling done in the west about who they are and what they can or are entitled to do.
               
              In my earlier email, I had mentioned that the announcement on al-Mutanabbi Festival sponsored by the Arab-Swiss Center in Switzerland was lacking a paragraph about the poet's background and poetry.  I was lucky to find my missing USB unit today in the floor of my car.  So I include the brief information below, which will be posted on the blog as well with the announcement. 
               
              Best Regards,
              Wafaa'
               
               
              Al-Mutanabbi
              (915-965 CE)
               
               
              Abut-Tayyib Ahmed al-Mutanabbi was born in 303 Hijriyya (HJ)/ 915 CE in an area called Kinda in the City of Kufa (in today’s IRAQ).  He had a rare talent in versifying poetry with no competitors in his lifetime!
               
              He was given the family name of al-Mutanabbi because he claimed to be a prophet (Nabiy) while in the Samawa desert. 
               
              Abut-Tayyib traveled to Aleppo, Damascus and various cities in Egypt.  In 350 HJ, he returned to Baghdad.  Then traveled to Arjan and then to Shiraz in Iran, and finally arrived in Baghdad.  In the early month of Shaaban, 350 HJ / 965 CE, he traveled to Kufa.  While he was on the road in Kufa accompanying his son and a friend, a group of men passed by and harassed al-Mutanabbi.  They mocked and challenged him into fighting.  As a result of the fighting, al-Mutanabbi, his friend and son were all killed.
               
              Al-Mutanabbi was the master of the exuberant panegyric, which is impossible to translate into adequate English.  His (Diwan) collected poems are famous for their long-lived qasida.  With a flowery style and changing away from the traditional Arabic qasida, Al-Mutanabbi stands out as the most important representative for the panegyric poetry.
               
              For further reading and sources, visit http://www.poetrymagic.co.uk/poets/almutanabbi.html
               
               


              "W. A." <WMS_Al@...> wrote:
              Thank you, Wafaa', for a wonderful issue.  The inclusive of the Arabic pages was very helpful.
               
              Well said, Richard.  I felt the same too reading Anees Al-Qaysi's article.  Some kind of a fashion these days to speak about Sunnis and Shiites. 
               
              If the Ottomans were racists and secterian, and so did the British (after them) and the American-British-Israeli Company is doing now in IRAQ, why have Iraqis been accused of practicing or committing secterianism?  This is a famous recipe for the DIVIDE AND RULE.  And worse yet, the worldwide mainstream media is talking of nothing, but the so-called civil war and of the bombs the "Iraqis are using to kill themselves", supposedly for secterian hatred; what a laughable notion indeed.
               
              People seem to forget that with the support of the USA/UK many militias (before the war in 2003) were trained in Israel, East Europe and Iran to accompany the army and commit their killing and gurella activities the minute Baghdad was defeated! This is aside from the various American and British mercenary companies whose employess are being paid hundreds of dollars (up to $1000) daily to be in IRAQ for the purpose of killing, and killing only! 
               
              I am a Moslem of one sect and my husband is of another.  This is the story of at least 50% of Iraqis, at least!  The majority of Iraqis are secular (including Iraq's governments since its independence), so how will the occupation succeed in creating a civil war between Iraqis?  Unless by killing Iraqis and blaming them for killing each other!  Perhaps in their dreams since the ignorant, racist and secterian industrial west think that Iraq is the same or wishes to see others in the same scope!  Iraq's history had no civil wars!  So let the enemies of Iraq keep dreaming.
               
              The minute the racist and secterian Ottomans and British left Iraq, starting with the Kings and ending with Saddam, Iraqi society was living in peace and nearly all ethnic and religious groups co-existed and worked together in all facets of life.  Most were getting equal share in every aspect (work, health and education) including women and the poor.  Women get equal pay for equal jobs, a matter shamefully the UK and USA have not yet accomplished and in many of the so-called first world/advanced societies! 
               
              During stability and economic prosperity, most Iraqis benefited.  Whenever there were devastation, crises and war, most people got hurt and suffer!  It is as simple as this.
              Even Saddam's harsh dictatorship was not sectarian or sexist!! 
               
              I am aware of the fact that the current situation in Iraq is a subject outside of the scope of this e-newsletter and group, but the article on Ottoman in relation to the Sunnis and Shiites of Iraq opened this can of worms.
               
              I appreciate your hard work, Wafaa', and still think we, the subscribers, should pay annual subscription for this informative e-newsletter and sourceful blog if no Iraqi, Arab or Islamic organization is available and willing to fund it.
               
              Best Regards,
              Walaa' Ali


              VImportant@... wrote:
              Dear Wafaa':
               
              For nearly three weeks, there has not been any activity on the Iraq History Group list,
              and I began to wonder where were you and everybody else!!  Then I received the
              April newsletter and was very impressed.
               
              Some pieces of the puzzles are being solved little by little.  I am speaking, of course,
              in terms of the mysterious deaths and the lies or incorrect details about what
              had happend under certain leaders. I read the newsletter three times, once quickly
              alone and once with my wife and again with my wife and a friend.  Thank you.  It was
              very informative.
               
              I have to relay to you, however, my Palestinian wife's commentary about Anees
              Al-Qaysi's study/summary.  She didn't like the timing of the study/publication.  Its information seemed to come as a proof or a justification for those who have
              been arguing (including Washington's neocons) that the Shiites were being oppressed
              and so it is normal to see atrocities between Sunnis and Shiites and to expect
              a civil war!!!  By the way, my wife is a Christian, but have lived half of her life in
              Arab Islamic countries, and she always laugh when she hears the mainstream media
              speak of the Sunni Triangle or the Shiite South!  I don't blame her.  Having lived
              and taught in Arab and non-Arab Islamic countries and have taught American foriegn
              policy and Middle East history for 30 years, I am well aware about the reality about
              the Arab World especially in Palestine and IRAQ.
               
              Thanks again for the April e-newsletter.  Those who are not part of this group list are
              missing a lot.  
               
              With Appreciation,
              Richard Sullivan
               
               
               
               
               
               
               
               
              Dear subscribers:
               
              Please give me your feedback in case there are errors in the content of the e-newsletter.  I have encountered a variety of Internet technical problems!  Additionally, a couple of paragraphs on the life and poetry of the medieval Iraqi poet al-Mutanabbi is not included with the announcement by the Arab-Swiss Cultural Center because they were saved on an USB unit that was lost.  I will add the information shortly.  I await your corrections if there are any errors to update this issue on the blog with the along with the missing information.
               
              I could not include the text of the e-newsletter in this email because of the Arabic documents I added at the top.
               
              Wishing you all a wonderful spring,
               
              Wafaa' Al-Natheema


              Love cheap thrills? Enjoy PC-to-Phone calls to 30+ countries for just 2¢/min with Yahoo! Messenger with Voice.


              Talk is cheap. Use Yahoo! Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls. Great rates starting at 1¢/min.


              Get amazing travel prices for air and hotel in one click on Yahoo! FareChase


              Love cheap thrills? Enjoy PC-to-Phone calls to 30+ countries for just 2¢/min with Yahoo! Messenger with Voice.


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            • VImportant@aol.com
              It will be good to hear Wafaa s thoughts about the matter of the yearly subscription to join this history group before we vote on it. I too would like to see
              Message 6 of 17 , May 2, 2006
              • 0 Attachment
                It will be good to hear Wafaa's thoughts about the matter of the yearly subscription to join this history group before we vote on it.
                 
                I too would like to see this unique work get funded to benefit the Iraqi
                historians.
                 
                Richard Sullivan
                 
                 
                In a message dated 5/2/2006 2:57:46 PM Eastern Standard Time, WMS_Al@... writes:
                I agree.   I vote yes and am willing to donate more than $15.
                 
                Wafaa has been in contact with all the historians and can take the compensation with her if she will be going to IRAQ.  If not there is a Western Union-Like services that can transfer money to Iraq.
                 
                Regards,
                Walaa Ali


                Umm Zannobiya <ghazalanimir@...> wrote:
                I am acknowledging receipt of the Iraq history e-newsletter and the feedback by Anees, May, Richard, Wafaa and Walaa.
                 
                I tremendously enjoyed reading everything and I (like May Roberts) look forward to reading about other aspects of Iraq's history (the arts, sciences, etc....) not just about the politics of MALES.
                 
                I also agree with Walaa that there should be some annual subscription to support this project and encourage further the participation of historians especially those living in IRAQ.  We need to keep their perspective alive and compensate them for their precious research and writing especially in this utterly horrific war and insecurity.  Let Iraq's history documentation not be on a voluntarily bases only because sooner or later this will cease and the enemies of Iraq will continue writing Iraq's history the way it fits their agenda as it has been already happening.
                 
                While I understand that some subscribers on this list live in Iraq or Arab countries, which may not be possible or practical to receive their donation in the USA. Those of us who live in the West should be able to donate $15 or $20 to compensate the historians on this list.  I assume the number of those of us who live in the west (America, Australia, Europe) are about 40.  Contributing $15 each will result in a total of $600.  If we are more in number and some donate more than $15, it will be even a larger sum.  For the next four issues left for the year, this is not a bad amount and will enable all those who participated in the 2006 documentation to receive some deserving compensation!
                 
                I hope we vote about this matter and decide how to let the compensation reaches Iraqi historians in Iraq!  
                 
                U. Z.
                 
                 


                "W. A." <WMS_Al@...> wrote:
                Dear Anees:
                 
                Thank you for your response.
                 
                I think you completely misunderstood my points.
                 
                Your paper neither mentioned about civil war nor presented wrong facts reg. what the Ottomans did in IRAQ.  But since that history of favoritism toward the Sunnis may have been perceived as a contributing factor for what is happening today in IRAQ [Which is unture], I argued my points as an extra percaution.  You needed not take it personal.
                 
                In fact my paragraph, "If the Ottomans were racists and secterian, and so did the British (after them) and what the American-British-Israeli Company is doing now in IRAQ, why have Iraqis been accused of practicing or committing secterianism?  This is a famous recipe for the DIVIDE AND RULE.  And worse yet, the worldwide mainstream media is talking of nothing, but the so-called civil war and of the bombs the "Iraqis are using to kill themselves", supposedly for secterian hatred; what a laughable notion indeed."  was in agreement with your statement about the conducts of Ottomans.  I am fed up from hearing that Iraqis are secterians when the occupiers are and have harshly enforced secterianism. 
                 
                My concern was the timing of the publication and the need to clarify the misconceptions about Iraqis regardless of who is a historian and who is not.
                 
                 
                Regards
                Walaa' Ali
                 


                Wafaa' Al-Natheema <aboutfromiraq@...> wrote:
                Thank you, May, Richard and Walaa' for your thoughtful remarks.  It is rewarding for me to know that you find the
                e-newsletter informative.  Personally, I am not yet as satisfied as you are with it.  But I hope with time, it improves.
                 
                 
                As for Anees Al-Qaysi's article:  While I understand that its content may feel upsetting or be misunderstood, it is important to put in mind that he had written it while living in violent IRAQ with little electricity daily.  I was so appreciative of him to send his summary/article in both languages (Arabic and English).
                 
                With the exception of Dr. Mudhafar Amin, all historians of the writing/editing team live in Iraq and find it very difficult to produce!  Also a couple of them do not read/write in English.  This is why we have added the research/translation team to help translate what is being written by historians to English and to research and compile information that may not be available, known or produced by the historians/writers team.
                 
                By stating this, I don't mean to criticize you, Walaa', or Richard's wife at all.  You all have raised valid points.  At the same time, I hope Anees would not take this as a personal criticism and feel discouraged, but rather to mirror the reality of Iraqis and Arabs too (in this case Richard's Palestinian Christian wife and of course many others) who are fed up with the misunderstanding and mislabeling done in the west about who they are and what they can or are entitled to do.
                 
                In my earlier email, I had mentioned that the announcement on al-Mutanabbi Festival sponsored by the Arab-Swiss Center in Switzerland was lacking a paragraph about the poet's background and poetry.  I was lucky to find my missing USB unit today in the floor of my car.  So I include the brief information below, which will be posted on the blog as well with the announcement. 
                 
                Best Regards,
                Wafaa'
                 
                 
                Al-Mutanabbi
                (915-965 CE)
                 
                 
                Abut-Tayyib Ahmed al-Mutanabbi was born in 303 Hijriyya (HJ)/ 915 CE in an area called Kinda in the City of Kufa (in today’s IRAQ).  He had a rare talent in versifying poetry with no competitors in his lifetime!
                 
                He was given the family name of al-Mutanabbi because he claimed to be a prophet (Nabiy) while in the Samawa desert. 
                 
                Abut-Tayyib traveled to Aleppo, Damascus and various cities in Egypt.  In 350 HJ, he returned to Baghdad.  Then traveled to Arjan and then to Shiraz in Iran, and finally arrived in Baghdad.  In the early month of Shaaban, 350 HJ / 965 CE, he traveled to Kufa.  While he was on the road in Kufa accompanying his son and a friend, a group of men passed by and harassed al-Mutanabbi.  They mocked and challenged him into fighting.  As a result of the fighting, al-Mutanabbi, his friend and son were all killed.
                 
                Al-Mutanabbi was the master of the exuberant panegyric, which is impossible to translate into adequate English.  His (Diwan) collected poems are famous for their long-lived qasida.  With a flowery style and changing away from the traditional Arabic qasida, Al-Mutanabbi stands out as the most important representative for the panegyric poetry.
                 
                For further reading and sources, visit http://www.poetrymagic.co.uk/poets/almutanabbi.html
                 
                 


                "W. A." <WMS_Al@...> wrote:
                Thank you, Wafaa', for a wonderful issue.  The inclusive of the Arabic pages was very helpful.
                 
                Well said, Richard.  I felt the same too reading Anees Al-Qaysi's article.  Some kind of a fashion these days to speak about Sunnis and Shiites. 
                 
                If the Ottomans were racists and secterian, and so did the British (after them) and the American-British-Israeli Company is doing now in IRAQ, why have Iraqis been accused of practicing or committing secterianism?  This is a famous recipe for the DIVIDE AND RULE.  And worse yet, the worldwide mainstream media is talking of nothing, but the so-called civil war and of the bombs the "Iraqis are using to kill themselves", supposedly for secterian hatred; what a laughable notion indeed.
                 
                People seem to forget that with the support of the USA/UK many militias (before the war in 2003) were trained in Israel, East Europe and Iran to accompany the army and commit their killing and gurella activities the minute Baghdad was defeated! This is aside from the various American and British mercenary companies whose employess are being paid hundreds of dollars (up to $1000) daily to be in IRAQ for the purpose of killing, and killing only! 
                 
                I am a Moslem of one sect and my husband is of another.  This is the story of at least 50% of Iraqis, at least!  The majority of Iraqis are secular (including Iraq's governments since its independence), so how will the occupation succeed in creating a civil war between Iraqis?  Unless by killing Iraqis and blaming them for killing each other!  Perhaps in their dreams since the ignorant, racist and secterian industrial west think that Iraq is the same or wishes to see others in the same scope!  Iraq's history had no civil wars!  So let the enemies of Iraq keep dreaming.
                 
                The minute the racist and secterian Ottomans and British left Iraq, starting with the Kings and ending with Saddam, Iraqi society was living in peace and nearly all ethnic and religious groups co-existed and worked together in all facets of life.  Most were getting equal share in every aspect (work, health and education) including women and the poor.  Women get equal pay for equal jobs, a matter shamefully the UK and USA have not yet accomplished and in many of the so-called first world/advanced societies! 
                 
                During stability and economic prosperity, most Iraqis benefited.  Whenever there were devastation, crises and war, most people got hurt and suffer!  It is as simple as this.
                Even Saddam's harsh dictatorship was not sectarian or sexist!! 
                 
                I am aware of the fact that the current situation in Iraq is a subject outside of the scope of this e-newsletter and group, but the article on Ottoman in relation to the Sunnis and Shiites of Iraq opened this can of worms.
                 
                I appreciate your hard work, Wafaa', and still think we, the subscribers, should pay annual subscription for this informative e-newsletter and sourceful blog if no Iraqi, Arab or Islamic organization is available and willing to fund it.
                 
                Best Regards,
                Walaa' Ali


                VImportant@... wrote:
                Dear Wafaa':
                 
                For nearly three weeks, there has not been any activity on the Iraq History Group list,
                and I began to wonder where were you and everybody else!!  Then I received the
                April newsletter and was very impressed.
                 
                Some pieces of the puzzles are being solved little by little.  I am speaking, of course,
                in terms of the mysterious deaths and the lies or incorrect details about what
                had happend under certain leaders. I read the newsletter three times, once quickly
                alone and once with my wife and again with my wife and a friend.  Thank you.  It was
                very informative.
                 
                I have to relay to you, however, my Palestinian wife's commentary about Anees
                Al-Qaysi's study/summary.  She didn't like the timing of the study/publication.  Its information seemed to come as a proof or a justification for those who have
                been arguing (including Washington's neocons) that the Shiites were being oppressed
                and so it is normal to see atrocities between Sunnis and Shiites and to expect
                a civil war!!!  By the way, my wife is a Christian, but have lived half of her life in
                Arab Islamic countries, and she always laugh when she hears the mainstream media
                speak of the Sunni Triangle or the Shiite South!  I don't blame her.  Having lived
                and taught in Arab and non-Arab Islamic countries and have taught American foriegn
                policy and Middle East history for 30 years, I am well aware about the reality about
                the Arab World especially in Palestine and IRAQ.
                 
                Thanks again for the April e-newsletter.  Those who are not part of this group list are
                missing a lot.  
                 
                With Appreciation,
                Richard Sullivan
                 
                 
                 
                 
                 
                 
                 
                 
                Dear subscribers:
                 
                Please give me your feedback in case there are errors in the content of the e-newsletter.  I have encountered a variety of Internet technical problems!  Additionally, a couple of paragraphs on the life and poetry of the medieval Iraqi poet al-Mutanabbi is not included with the announcement by the Arab-Swiss Cultural Center because they were saved on an USB unit that was lost.  I will add the information shortly.  I await your corrections if there are any errors to update this issue on the blog with the along with the missing information.
                 
                I could not include the text of the e-newsletter in this email because of the Arabic documents I added at the top.
                 
                Wishing you all a wonderful spring,
                 
                Wafaa' Al-Natheema


                Love cheap thrills? Enjoy PC-to-Phone calls to 30+ countries for just 2¢/min with Yahoo! Messenger with Voice.


                Talk is cheap. Use Yahoo! Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls. Great rates starting at 1¢/min.


                Get amazing travel prices for air and hotel in one click on Yahoo! FareChase


                Love cheap thrills? Enjoy PC-to-Phone calls to 30+ countries for just 2¢/min with Yahoo! Messenger with Voice.


                Blab-away for as little as 1¢/min. Make PC-to-Phone Calls using Yahoo! Messenger with Voice.

                YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS




                 
              • Wafaa' Al-Natheema
                Greetings to all, Thanks to all the commentary regarding the e-newsletter, the suggestion to compensate the Iraqi historians through annual subscription, and
                Message 7 of 17 , May 3, 2006
                • 0 Attachment
                  Greetings to all,
                   
                  Thanks to all the commentary regarding the e-newsletter, the suggestion to compensate the Iraqi historians through annual subscription, and the discussion about Iraq's history.  I hope other subscribers will continue this discussion and by airing their opinion regarding the subject matter of the subscription.  What do you think?
                   
                  As you may know that the Iraq History e-newsletter became bimonthly.  in February.   This means that the next issue should be in June.
                  However, due to the following reasons, I have decided to publish the next issue in July instead:
                   
                  1.  I will be traveling overseas during the entire month of June
                  2. In part 4 of the series on Presidents and Leaders, Nuri As-Saeed (PM), and prince Adbul-Ilah will be covered.  Since they were killed in July (1958), I prefer to publish the information/study in July in commemoration.  So far, we have published part two about Qassim in
                  February, which coincided with his February 9th killing, and part three about King Ghazi's in April, which also coincided with his death (on
                  April 3rd). 
                  3. I want to commomerate Iraqi Jewish writer Sameer Naqqash who passed away in July 2004.
                   
                  If I find time (knowing I will be traveling and having to write three lengthy studies, all) in May, I will post related information. 
                   
                  I would like to follow up on Richard Sullivan's comment about the inactivity of this list for three weeks by reminding subscribers to utilize this list for information exchange and discussion (in English) about Iraq's history!  It is also important to email this group information about events taken place anywhere in the world specifically about the history of IRAQ or include the subject of Iraq's history and about journals/newsletters/books focusing on Iraq's history.
                   
                  I too like you, May and Umm Zannobiya, wish to cover other aspects of Iraq's history (architecture, sciences, and the arts), but no submission yet on this matter.
                   
                  Also to ensure diversity in the historians (writing/editing) team, I hope you take the announcement requesting women historians (from other religious backgrounds) SERIOUSLY  WITH MANY THANKS. 
                   
                  Looking Forward to Your Feedback,
                   
                  Regards,
                  Wafaa' Al-Natheema


                  VImportant@... wrote:
                  It will be good to hear Wafaa's thoughts about the matter of the yearly subscription to join this history group before we vote on it.
                   
                  I too would like to see this unique work get funded to benefit the Iraqi
                  historians.
                   
                  Richard Sullivan
                   
                   
                  In a message dated 5/2/2006 2:57:46 PM Eastern Standard Time, WMS_Al@... writes:
                  I agree.   I vote yes and am willing to donate more than $15.
                   
                  Wafaa has been in contact with all the historians and can take the compensation with her if she will be going to IRAQ.  If not there is a Western Union-Like services that can transfer money to Iraq.
                   
                  Regards,
                  Walaa Ali


                  Umm Zannobiya <ghazalanimir@...> wrote:
                  I am acknowledging receipt of the Iraq history e-newsletter and the feedback by Anees, May, Richard, Wafaa and Walaa.
                   
                  I tremendously enjoyed reading everything and I (like May Roberts) look forward to reading about other aspects of Iraq's history (the arts, sciences, etc....) not just about the politics of MALES.
                   
                  I also agree with Walaa that there should be some annual subscription to support this project and encourage further the participation of historians especially those living in IRAQ.  We need to keep their perspective alive and compensate them for their precious research and writing especially in this utterly horrific war and insecurity.  Let Iraq's history documentation not be on a voluntarily bases only because sooner or later this will cease and the enemies of Iraq will continue writing Iraq's history the way it fits their agenda as it has been already happening.
                   
                  While I understand that some subscribers on this list live in Iraq or Arab countries, which may not be possible or practical to receive their donation in the USA. Those of us who live in the West should be able to donate $15 or $20 to compensate the historians on this list.  I assume the number of those of us who live in the west (America, Australia, Europe) are about 40.  Contributing $15 each will result in a total of $600.  If we are more in number and some donate more than $15, it will be even a larger sum.  For the next four issues left for the year, this is not a bad amount and will enable all those who participated in the 2006 documentation to receive some deserving compensation!
                   
                  I hope we vote about this matter and decide how to let the compensation reaches Iraqi historians in Iraq!  
                   
                  U. Z.
                   
                   


                  "W. A." <WMS_Al@...> wrote:
                  Dear Anees:
                   
                  Thank you for your response.
                   
                  I think you completely misunderstood my points.
                   
                  Your paper neither mentioned about civil war nor presented wrong facts reg. what the Ottomans did in IRAQ.  But since that history of favoritism toward the Sunnis may have been perceived as a contributing factor for what is happening today in IRAQ [Which is unture], I argued my points as an extra percaution.  You needed not take it personal.
                   
                  In fact my paragraph, "If the Ottomans were racists and secterian, and so did the British (after them) and what the American-British-Israeli Company is doing now in IRAQ, why have Iraqis been accused of practicing or committing secterianism?  This is a famous recipe for the DIVIDE AND RULE.  And worse yet, the worldwide mainstream media is talking of nothing, but the so-called civil war and of the bombs the "Iraqis are using to kill themselves", supposedly for secterian hatred; what a laughable notion indeed."  was in agreement with your statement about the conducts of Ottomans.  I am fed up from hearing that Iraqis are secterians when the occupiers are and have harshly enforced secterianism. 
                   
                  My concern was the timing of the publication and the need to clarify the misconceptions about Iraqis regardless of who is a historian and who is not.
                   
                   
                  Regards
                  Walaa' Ali
                   


                  Wafaa' Al-Natheema <aboutfromiraq@...> wrote:
                  Thank you, May, Richard and Walaa' for your thoughtful remarks.  It is rewarding for me to know that you find the
                  e-newsletter informative.  Personally, I am not yet as satisfied as you are with it.  But I hope with time, it improves.
                   
                   
                  As for Anees Al-Qaysi's article:  While I understand that its content may feel upsetting or be misunderstood, it is important to put in mind that he had written it while living in violent IRAQ with little electricity daily.  I was so appreciative of him to send his summary/article in both languages (Arabic and English).
                   
                  With the exception of Dr. Mudhafar Amin, all historians of the writing/editing team live in Iraq and find it very difficult to produce!  Also a couple of them do not read/write in English.  This is why we have added the research/translation team to help translate what is being written by historians to English and to research and compile information that may not be available, known or produced by the historians/writers team.
                   
                  By stating this, I don't mean to criticize you, Walaa', or Richard's wife at all.  You all have raised valid points.  At the same time, I hope Anees would not take this as a personal criticism and feel discouraged, but rather to mirror the reality of Iraqis and Arabs too (in this case Richard's Palestinian Christian wife and of course many others) who are fed up with the misunderstanding and mislabeling done in the west about who they are and what they can or are entitled to do.
                   
                  In my earlier email, I had mentioned that the announcement on al-Mutanabbi Festival sponsored by the Arab-Swiss Center in Switzerland was lacking a paragraph about the poet's background and poetry.  I was lucky to find my missing USB unit today in the floor of my car.  So I include the brief information below, which will be posted on the blog as well with the announcement. 
                   
                  Best Regards,
                  Wafaa'
                   
                   
                  Al-Mutanabbi
                  (915-965 CE)
                   
                   
                  Abut-Tayyib Ahmed al-Mutanabbi was born in 303 Hijriyya (HJ)/ 915 CE in an area called Kinda in the City of Kufa (in today’s IRAQ).  He had a rare talent in versifying poetry with no competitors in his lifetime!
                   
                  He was given the family name of al-Mutanabbi because he claimed to be a prophet (Nabiy) while in the Samawa desert. 
                   
                  Abut-Tayyib traveled to Aleppo, Damascus and various cities in Egypt.  In 350 HJ, he returned to Baghdad.  Then traveled to Arjan and then to Shiraz in Iran, and finally arrived in Baghdad.  In the early month of Shaaban, 350 HJ / 965 CE, he traveled to Kufa.  While he was on the road in Kufa accompanying his son and a friend, a group of men passed by and harassed al-Mutanabbi.  They mocked and challenged him into fighting.  As a result of the fighting, al-Mutanabbi, his friend and son were all killed.
                   
                  Al-Mutanabbi was the master of the exuberant panegyric, which is impossible to translate into adequate English.  His (Diwan) collected poems are famous for their long-lived qasida.  With a flowery style and changing away from the traditional Arabic qasida, Al-Mutanabbi stands out as the most important representative for the panegyric poetry.
                   
                  For further reading and sources, visit http://www.poetrymagic.co.uk/poets/almutanabbi.html
                   
                   


                  "W. A." <WMS_Al@...> wrote:
                  Thank you, Wafaa', for a wonderful issue.  The inclusive of the Arabic pages was very helpful.
                   
                  Well said, Richard.  I felt the same too reading Anees Al-Qaysi's article.  Some kind of a fashion these days to speak about Sunnis and Shiites. 
                   
                  If the Ottomans were racists and secterian, and so did the British (after them) and the American-British-Israeli Company is doing now in IRAQ, why have Iraqis been accused of practicing or committing secterianism?  This is a famous recipe for the DIVIDE AND RULE.  And worse yet, the worldwide mainstream media is talking of nothing, but the so-called civil war and of the bombs the "Iraqis are using to kill themselves", supposedly for secterian hatred; what a laughable notion indeed.
                   
                  People seem to forget that with the support of the USA/UK many militias (before the war in 2003) were trained in Israel, East Europe and Iran to accompany the army and commit their killing and gurella activities the minute Baghdad was defeated! This is aside from the various American and British mercenary companies whose employess are being paid hundreds of dollars (up to $1000) daily to be in IRAQ for the purpose of killing, and killing only! 
                   
                  I am a Moslem of one sect and my husband is of another.  This is the story of at least 50% of Iraqis, at least!  The majority of Iraqis are secular (including Iraq's governments since its independence), so how will the occupation succeed in creating a civil war between Iraqis?  Unless by killing Iraqis and blaming them for killing each other!  Perhaps in their dreams since the ignorant, racist and secterian industrial west think that Iraq is the same or wishes to see others in the same scope!  Iraq's history had no civil wars!  So let the enemies of Iraq keep dreaming.
                   
                  The minute the racist and secterian Ottomans and British left Iraq, starting with the Kings and ending with Saddam, Iraqi society was living in peace and nearly all ethnic and religious groups co-existed and worked together in all facets of life.  Most were getting equal share in every aspect (work, health and education) including women and the poor.  Women get equal pay for equal jobs, a matter shamefully the UK and USA have not yet accomplished and in many of the so-called first world/advanced societies! 
                   
                  During stability and economic prosperity, most Iraqis benefited.  Whenever there were devastation, crises and war, most people got hurt and suffer!  It is as simple as this.
                  Even Saddam's harsh dictatorship was not sectarian or sexist!! 
                   
                  I am aware of the fact that the current situation in Iraq is a subject outside of the scope of this e-newsletter and group, but the article on Ottoman in relation to the Sunnis and Shiites of Iraq opened this can of worms.
                   
                  I appreciate your hard work, Wafaa', and still think we, the subscribers, should pay annual subscription for this informative e-newsletter and sourceful blog if no Iraqi, Arab or Islamic organization is available and willing to fund it.
                   
                  Best Regards,
                  Walaa' Ali


                  VImportant@... wrote:
                  Dear Wafaa':
                   
                  For nearly three weeks, there has not been any activity on the Iraq History Group list,
                  and I began to wonder where were you and everybody else!!  Then I received the
                  April newsletter and was very impressed.
                   
                  Some pieces of the puzzles are being solved little by little.  I am speaking, of course,
                  in terms of the mysterious deaths and the lies or incorrect details about what
                  had happend under certain leaders. I read the newsletter three times, once quickly
                  alone and once with my wife and again with my wife and a friend.  Thank you.  It was
                  very informative.
                   
                  I have to relay to you, however, my Palestinian wife's commentary about Anees
                  Al-Qaysi's study/summary.  She didn't like the timing of the study/publication.  Its information seemed to come as a proof or a justification for those who have
                  been arguing (including Washington's neocons) that the Shiites were being oppressed
                  and so it is normal to see atrocities between Sunnis and Shiites and to expect
                  a civil war!!!  By the way, my wife is a Christian, but have lived half of her life in
                  Arab Islamic countries, and she always laugh when she hears the mainstream media
                  speak of the Sunni Triangle or the Shiite South!  I don't blame her.  Having lived
                  and taught in Arab and non-Arab Islamic countries and have taught American foriegn
                  policy and Middle East history for 30 years, I am well aware about the reality about
                  the Arab World especially in Palestine and IRAQ.
                   
                  Thanks again for the April e-newsletter.  Those who are not part of this group list are
                  missing a lot.  
                   
                  With Appreciation,
                  Richard Sullivan
                   
                   
                   
                   
                   
                   
                   
                   
                  Dear subscribers:
                   
                  Please give me your feedback in case there are errors in the content of the e-newsletter.  I have encountered a variety of Internet technical problems!  Additionally, a couple of paragraphs on the life and poetry of the medieval Iraqi poet al-Mutanabbi is not included with the announcement by the Arab-Swiss Cultural Center because they were saved on an USB unit that was lost.  I will add the information shortly.  I await your corrections if there are any errors to update this issue on the blog with the along with the missing information.
                   
                  I could not include the text of the e-newsletter in this email because of the Arabic documents I added at the top.
                   
                  Wishing you all a wonderful spring,
                   
                  Wafaa' Al-Natheema


                  Love cheap thrills? Enjoy PC-to-Phone calls to 30+ countries for just 2¢/min with Yahoo! Messenger with Voice.


                  Talk is cheap. Use Yahoo! Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls. Great rates starting at 1¢/min.


                  Get amazing travel prices for air and hotel in one click on Yahoo! FareChase


                  Love cheap thrills? Enjoy PC-to-Phone calls to 30+ countries for just 2¢/min with Yahoo! Messenger with Voice.


                  Blab-away for as little as 1¢/min. Make PC-to-Phone Calls using Yahoo! Messenger with Voice.


                  Get amazing travel prices for air and hotel in one click on Yahoo! FareChase
                • May Roberts
                  I agree with the suggestion to pay annual subscription to compensate the writers/editors! I am willing to donate the yearly amount to be suggested by a vote
                  Message 8 of 17 , May 3, 2006
                  • 0 Attachment
                    I agree with the suggestion to pay annual subscription to compensate the writers/editors!  I am willing to donate the yearly amount to be suggested by a vote from subscribers on this list!
                     
                    Perhaps it shouldn't be mandatory.  If people are willing to donate, great.  If not, it does not mean that they can not subscribe to this group.
                     
                    Regards,
                    May Roberts

                    Wafaa' Al-Natheema <aboutfromiraq@...> wrote:
                    Greetings to all,
                     
                    Thanks to all the commentary regarding the e-newsletter, the suggestion to compensate the Iraqi historians through annual subscription, and the discussion about Iraq's history.  I hope other subscribers will continue this discussion and by airing their opinion regarding the subject matter of the subscription.  What do you think?
                     
                    As you may know that the Iraq History e-newsletter became bimonthly.  in February.   This means that the next issue should be in June.
                    However, due to the following reasons, I have decided to publish the next issue in July instead:
                     
                    1.  I will be traveling overseas during the entire month of June
                    2. In part 4 of the series on Presidents and Leaders, Nuri As-Saeed (PM), and prince Adbul-Ilah will be covered.  Since they were killed in July (1958), I prefer to publish the information/study in July in commemoration.  So far, we have published part two about Qassim in
                    February, which coincided with his February 9th killing, and part three about King Ghazi's in April, which also coincided with his death (on
                    April 3rd). 
                    3. I want to commomerate Iraqi Jewish writer Sameer Naqqash who passed away in July 2004.
                     
                    If I find time (knowing I will be traveling and having to write three lengthy studies, all) in May, I will post related information. 
                     
                    I would like to follow up on Richard Sullivan's comment about the inactivity of this list for three weeks by reminding subscribers to utilize this list for information exchange and discussion (in English) about Iraq's history!  It is also important to email this group information about events taken place anywhere in the world specifically about the history of IRAQ or include the subject of Iraq's history and about journals/newsletters/books focusing on Iraq's history.
                     
                    I too like you, May and Umm Zannobiya, wish to cover other aspects of Iraq's history (architecture, sciences, and the arts), but no submission yet on this matter.
                     
                    Also to ensure diversity in the historians (writing/editing) team, I hope you take the announcement requesting women historians (from other religious backgrounds) SERIOUSLY  WITH MANY THANKS. 
                     
                    Looking Forward to Your Feedback,
                     
                    Regards,
                    Wafaa' Al-Natheema


                    VImportant@... wrote:
                    It will be good to hear Wafaa's thoughts about the matter of the yearly subscription to join this history group before we vote on it.
                     
                    I too would like to see this unique work get funded to benefit the Iraqi
                    historians.
                     
                    Richard Sullivan
                     
                     
                    In a message dated 5/2/2006 2:57:46 PM Eastern Standard Time, WMS_Al@... writes:
                    I agree.   I vote yes and am willing to donate more than $15.
                     
                    Wafaa has been in contact with all the historians and can take the compensation with her if she will be going to IRAQ.  If not there is a Western Union-Like services that can transfer money to Iraq.
                     
                    Regards,
                    Walaa Ali


                    Umm Zannobiya <ghazalanimir@...> wrote:
                    I am acknowledging receipt of the Iraq history e-newsletter and the feedback by Anees, May, Richard, Wafaa and Walaa.
                     
                    I tremendously enjoyed reading everything and I (like May Roberts) look forward to reading about other aspects of Iraq's history (the arts, sciences, etc....) not just about the politics of MALES.
                     
                    I also agree with Walaa that there should be some annual subscription to support this project and encourage further the participation of historians especially those living in IRAQ.  We need to keep their perspective alive and compensate them for their precious research and writing especially in this utterly horrific war and insecurity.  Let Iraq's history documentation not be on a voluntarily bases only because sooner or later this will cease and the enemies of Iraq will continue writing Iraq's history the way it fits their agenda as it has been already happening.
                     
                    While I understand that some subscribers on this list live in Iraq or Arab countries, which may not be possible or practical to receive their donation in the USA. Those of us who live in the West should be able to donate $15 or $20 to compensate the historians on this list.  I assume the number of those of us who live in the west (America, Australia, Europe) are about 40.  Contributing $15 each will result in a total of $600.  If we are more in number and some donate more than $15, it will be even a larger sum.  For the next four issues left for the year, this is not a bad amount and will enable all those who participated in the 2006 documentation to receive some deserving compensation!
                     
                    I hope we vote about this matter and decide how to let the compensation reaches Iraqi historians in Iraq!  
                     
                    U. Z.
                     
                     


                    "W. A." <WMS_Al@...> wrote:
                    Dear Anees:
                     
                    Thank you for your response.
                     
                    I think you completely misunderstood my points.
                     
                    Your paper neither mentioned about civil war nor presented wrong facts reg. what the Ottomans did in IRAQ.  But since that history of favoritism toward the Sunnis may have been perceived as a contributing factor for what is happening today in IRAQ [Which is unture], I argued my points as an extra percaution.  You needed not take it personal.
                     
                    In fact my paragraph, "If the Ottomans were racists and secterian, and so did the British (after them) and what the American-British-Israeli Company is doing now in IRAQ, why have Iraqis been accused of practicing or committing secterianism?  This is a famous recipe for the DIVIDE AND RULE.  And worse yet, the worldwide mainstream media is talking of nothing, but the so-called civil war and of the bombs the "Iraqis are using to kill themselves", supposedly for secterian hatred; what a laughable notion indeed."  was in agreement with your statement about the conducts of Ottomans.  I am fed up from hearing that Iraqis are secterians when the occupiers are and have harshly enforced secterianism. 
                     
                    My concern was the timing of the publication and the need to clarify the misconceptions about Iraqis regardless of who is a historian and who is not.
                     
                     
                    Regards
                    Walaa' Ali
                     


                    Wafaa' Al-Natheema <aboutfromiraq@...> wrote:
                    Thank you, May, Richard and Walaa' for your thoughtful remarks.  It is rewarding for me to know that you find the
                    e-newsletter informative.  Personally, I am not yet as satisfied as you are with it.  But I hope with time, it improves.
                     
                     
                    As for Anees Al-Qaysi's article:  While I understand that its content may feel upsetting or be misunderstood, it is important to put in mind that he had written it while living in violent IRAQ with little electricity daily.  I was so appreciative of him to send his summary/article in both languages (Arabic and English).
                     
                    With the exception of Dr. Mudhafar Amin, all historians of the writing/editing team live in Iraq and find it very difficult to produce!  Also a couple of them do not read/write in English.  This is why we have added the research/translation team to help translate what is being written by historians to English and to research and compile information that may not be available, known or produced by the historians/writers team.
                     
                    By stating this, I don't mean to criticize you, Walaa', or Richard's wife at all.  You all have raised valid points.  At the same time, I hope Anees would not take this as a personal criticism and feel discouraged, but rather to mirror the reality of Iraqis and Arabs too (in this case Richard's Palestinian Christian wife and of course many others) who are fed up with the misunderstanding and mislabeling done in the west about who they are and what they can or are entitled to do.
                     
                    In my earlier email, I had mentioned that the announcement on al-Mutanabbi Festival sponsored by the Arab-Swiss Center in Switzerland was lacking a paragraph about the poet's background and poetry.  I was lucky to find my missing USB unit today in the floor of my car.  So I include the brief information below, which will be posted on the blog as well with the announcement. 
                     
                    Best Regards,
                    Wafaa'
                     
                     
                    Al-Mutanabbi
                    (915-965 CE)
                     
                     
                    Abut-Tayyib Ahmed al-Mutanabbi was born in 303 Hijriyya (HJ)/ 915 CE in an area called Kinda in the City of Kufa (in today’s IRAQ).  He had a rare talent in versifying poetry with no competitors in his lifetime!
                     
                    He was given the family name of al-Mutanabbi because he claimed to be a prophet (Nabiy) while in the Samawa desert. 
                     
                    Abut-Tayyib traveled to Aleppo, Damascus and various cities in Egypt.  In 350 HJ, he returned to Baghdad.  Then traveled to Arjan and then to Shiraz in Iran, and finally arrived in Baghdad.  In the early month of Shaaban, 350 HJ / 965 CE, he traveled to Kufa.  While he was on the road in Kufa accompanying his son and a friend, a group of men passed by and harassed al-Mutanabbi.  They mocked and challenged him into fighting.  As a result of the fighting, al-Mutanabbi, his friend and son were all killed.
                     
                    Al-Mutanabbi was the master of the exuberant panegyric, which is impossible to translate into adequate English.  His (Diwan) collected poems are famous for their long-lived qasida.  With a flowery style and changing away from the traditional Arabic qasida, Al-Mutanabbi stands out as the most important representative for the panegyric poetry.
                     
                    For further reading and sources, visit http://www.poetrymagic.co.uk/poets/almutanabbi.html
                     
                     


                    "W. A." <WMS_Al@...> wrote:
                    Thank you, Wafaa', for a wonderful issue.  The inclusive of the Arabic pages was very helpful.
                     
                    Well said, Richard.  I felt the same too reading Anees Al-Qaysi's article.  Some kind of a fashion these days to speak about Sunnis and Shiites. 
                     
                    If the Ottomans were racists and secterian, and so did the British (after them) and the American-British-Israeli Company is doing now in IRAQ, why have Iraqis been accused of practicing or committing secterianism?  This is a famous recipe for the DIVIDE AND RULE.  And worse yet, the worldwide mainstream media is talking of nothing, but the so-called civil war and of the bombs the "Iraqis are using to kill themselves", supposedly for secterian hatred; what a laughable notion indeed.
                     
                    People seem to forget that with the support of the USA/UK many militias (before the war in 2003) were trained in Israel, East Europe and Iran to accompany the army and commit their killing and gurella activities the minute Baghdad was defeated! This is aside from the various American and British mercenary companies whose employess are being paid hundreds of dollars (up to $1000) daily to be in IRAQ for the purpose of killing, and killing only! 
                     
                    I am a Moslem of one sect and my husband is of another.  This is the story of at least 50% of Iraqis, at least!  The majority of Iraqis are secular (including Iraq's governments since its independence), so how will the occupation succeed in creating a civil war between Iraqis?  Unless by killing Iraqis and blaming them for killing each other!  Perhaps in their dreams since the ignorant, racist and secterian industrial west think that Iraq is the same or wishes to see others in the same scope!  Iraq's history had no civil wars!  So let the enemies of Iraq keep dreaming.
                     
                    The minute the racist and secterian Ottomans and British left Iraq, starting with the Kings and ending with Saddam, Iraqi society was living in peace and nearly all ethnic and religious groups co-existed and worked together in all facets of life.  Most were getting equal share in every aspect (work, health and education) including women and the poor.  Women get equal pay for equal jobs, a matter shamefully the UK and USA have not yet accomplished and in many of the so-called first world/advanced societies! 
                     
                    During stability and economic prosperity, most Iraqis benefited.  Whenever there were devastation, crises and war, most people got hurt and suffer!  It is as simple as this.
                    Even Saddam's harsh dictatorship was not sectarian or sexist!! 
                     
                    I am aware of the fact that the current situation in Iraq is a subject outside of the scope of this e-newsletter and group, but the article on Ottoman in relation to the Sunnis and Shiites of Iraq opened this can of worms.
                     
                    I appreciate your hard work, Wafaa', and still think we, the subscribers, should pay annual subscription for this informative e-newsletter and sourceful blog if no Iraqi, Arab or Islamic organization is available and willing to fund it.
                     
                    Best Regards,
                    Walaa' Ali


                    VImportant@... wrote:
                    Dear Wafaa':
                     
                    For nearly three weeks, there has not been any activity on the Iraq History Group list,
                    and I began to wonder where were you and everybody else!!  Then I received the
                    April newsletter and was very impressed.
                     
                    Some pieces of the puzzles are being solved little by little.  I am speaking, of course,
                    in terms of the mysterious deaths and the lies or incorrect details about what
                    had happend under certain leaders. I read the newsletter three times, once quickly
                    alone and once with my wife and again with my wife and a friend.  Thank you.  It was
                    very informative.
                     
                    I have to relay to you, however, my Palestinian wife's commentary about Anees
                    Al-Qaysi's study/summary.  She didn't like the timing of the study/publication.  Its information seemed to come as a proof or a justification for those who have
                    been arguing (including Washington's neocons) that the Shiites were being oppressed
                    and so it is normal to see atrocities between Sunnis and Shiites and to expect
                    a civil war!!!  By the way, my wife is a Christian, but have lived half of her life in
                    Arab Islamic countries, and she always laugh when she hears the mainstream media
                    speak of the Sunni Triangle or the Shiite South!  I don't blame her.  Having lived
                    and taught in Arab and non-Arab Islamic countries and have taught American foriegn
                    policy and Middle East history for 30 years, I am well aware about the reality about
                    the Arab World especially in Palestine and IRAQ.
                     
                    Thanks again for the April e-newsletter.  Those who are not part of this group list are
                    missing a lot.  
                     
                    With Appreciation,
                    Richard Sullivan
                     
                     
                     
                     
                     
                     
                     
                     
                    Dear subscribers:
                     
                    Please give me your feedback in case there are errors in the content of the e-newsletter.  I have encountered a variety of Internet technical problems!  Additionally, a couple of paragraphs on the life and poetry of the medieval Iraqi poet al-Mutanabbi is not included with the announcement by the Arab-Swiss Cultural Center because they were saved on an USB unit that was lost.  I will add the information shortly.  I await your corrections if there are any errors to update this issue on the blog with the along with the missing information.
                     
                    I could not include the text of the e-newsletter in this email because of the Arabic documents I added at the top.
                     
                    Wishing you all a wonderful spring,
                     
                    Wafaa' Al-Natheema


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                  • Tareq Alsaody
                    Hi Wafaa and Dear friends, Thanks for this and other informative and valuable messages. I do agree with many other friends in ensuing a subscription policy,
                    Message 9 of 17 , May 3, 2006
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                      Hi Wafaa and Dear friends,

                      Thanks for this and other informative and valuable
                      messages.
                      I do agree with many other friends in ensuing a
                      subscription policy, this policy would prove to be
                      useful in helping You at the INEAS and Iraq History
                      Group keep pace with documenting events of our rich
                      though yet irrationally written history where personal
                      views and prejudices are the milestones of such
                      writing.
                      Up till now I can confidently say that Your collective
                      and cummulative efforts have produced a professionally
                      and scietifically-sound litterature and everything
                      points to Your eligibility to go on on the same track.

                      Whilw wishing You all luck and patience, please
                      maintain enriching our memory with sound data and
                      lively discussions,

                      Sincerely

                      Tareq Alsaody

                      --- Wafaa' Al-Natheema <aboutfromiraq@...>
                      wrote:

                      > Greetings to all,
                      >
                      > Thanks to all the commentary regarding the
                      > e-newsletter, the suggestion to compensate the Iraqi
                      > historians through annual subscription, and the
                      > discussion about Iraq's history. I hope other
                      > subscribers will continue this discussion and by
                      > airing their opinion regarding the subject matter of
                      > the subscription. What do you think?
                      >
                      > As you may know that the Iraq History e-newsletter
                      > became bimonthly. in February. This means that
                      > the next issue should be in June.
                      > However, due to the following reasons, I have
                      > decided to publish the next issue in July instead:
                      >
                      > 1. I will be traveling overseas during the entire
                      > month of June
                      > 2. In part 4 of the series on Presidents and
                      > Leaders, Nuri As-Saeed (PM), and prince Adbul-Ilah
                      > will be covered. Since they were killed in July
                      > (1958), I prefer to publish the information/study in
                      > July in commemoration. So far, we have published
                      > part two about Qassim in
                      > February, which coincided with his February 9th
                      > killing, and part three about King Ghazi's in April,
                      > which also coincided with his death (on
                      > April 3rd).
                      > 3. I want to commomerate Iraqi Jewish writer
                      > Sameer Naqqash who passed away in July 2004.
                      >
                      > If I find time (knowing I will be traveling and
                      > having to write three lengthy studies, all) in May,
                      > I will post related information.
                      >
                      > I would like to follow up on Richard Sullivan's
                      > comment about the inactivity of this list for three
                      > weeks by reminding subscribers to utilize this list
                      > for information exchange and discussion (in English)
                      > about Iraq's history! It is also important to email
                      > this group information about events taken place
                      > anywhere in the world specifically about the history
                      > of IRAQ or include the subject of Iraq's history and
                      > about journals/newsletters/books focusing on Iraq's
                      > history.
                      >
                      > I too like you, May and Umm Zannobiya, wish to
                      > cover other aspects of Iraq's history (architecture,
                      > sciences, and the arts), but no submission yet on
                      > this matter.
                      >
                      > Also to ensure diversity in the historians
                      > (writing/editing) team, I hope you take the
                      > announcement requesting women historians (from other
                      > religious backgrounds) SERIOUSLY WITH MANY THANKS.
                      >
                      > Looking Forward to Your Feedback,
                      >
                      > Regards,
                      > Wafaa' Al-Natheema
                      > http://historyofiraq.blogspot.com
                      >
                      >
                      > VImportant@... wrote:
                      > It will be good to hear Wafaa's thoughts
                      > about the matter of the yearly subscription to join
                      > this history group before we vote on it.
                      >
                      > I too would like to see this unique work get
                      > funded to benefit the Iraqi
                      > historians.
                      >
                      > Richard Sullivan
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > In a message dated 5/2/2006 2:57:46 PM Eastern
                      > Standard Time, WMS_Al@... writes:
                      > I agree. I vote yes and am willing to donate
                      > more than $15.
                      >
                      > Wafaa has been in contact with all the historians
                      > and can take the compensation with her if she will
                      > be going to IRAQ. If not there is a Western
                      > Union-Like services that can transfer money to Iraq.
                      >
                      > Regards,
                      > Walaa Ali
                      >
                      >
                      > Umm Zannobiya <ghazalanimir@...> wrote:
                      > I am acknowledging receipt of the Iraq history
                      > e-newsletter and the feedback by Anees, May,
                      > Richard, Wafaa and Walaa.
                      >
                      > I tremendously enjoyed reading everything and I
                      > (like May Roberts) look forward to reading about
                      > other aspects of Iraq's history (the arts, sciences,
                      > etc....) not just about the politics of MALES.
                      >
                      > I also agree with Walaa that there should be some
                      > annual subscription to support this project and
                      > encourage further the participation of historians
                      > especially those living in IRAQ. We need to keep
                      > their perspective alive and compensate them for
                      > their precious research and writing especially in
                      > this utterly horrific war and insecurity. Let
                      > Iraq's history documentation not be on a voluntarily
                      > bases only because sooner or later this will cease
                      > and the enemies of Iraq will continue writing Iraq's
                      > history the way it fits their agenda as it has been
                      > already happening.
                      >
                      > While I understand that some subscribers on this
                      > list live in Iraq or Arab countries, which may not
                      > be possible or practical to receive their donation
                      > in the USA. Those of us who live in the West should
                      > be able to donate $15 or $20 to compensate the
                      > historians on this list. I assume the number of
                      > those of us who live in the west (America,
                      > Australia, Europe) are about 40. Contributing $15
                      > each will result in a total of $600. If we are more
                      > in number and some donate more than $15, it will be
                      > even a larger sum. For the next four issues left
                      > for the year, this is not a bad amount and will
                      > enable all those who participated in the 2006
                      > documentation to receive some deserving
                      > compensation!
                      >
                      > I hope we vote about this matter and decide how to
                      > let the compensation reaches Iraqi historians in
                      > Iraq!
                      >
                      > U. Z.
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > "W. A." <WMS_Al@...> wrote:
                      > Dear Anees:
                      >
                      > Thank you for your response.
                      >
                      > I think you completely misunderstood my points.
                      >
                      > Your paper neither mentioned about civil war nor
                      > presented wrong facts reg. what the Ottomans did in
                      > IRAQ. But since that history of favoritism toward
                      > the Sunnis may have been perceived as a contributing
                      > factor for what is happening today in IRAQ [Which is
                      > unture], I argued my points as an extra percaution.
                      > You needed not take it personal.
                      >
                      > In fact my paragraph, "If the Ottomans were
                      > racists and secterian, and so did the British (after
                      > them) and what the American-British-Israeli Company
                      > is doing now in IRAQ, why have Iraqis been accused
                      > of practicing or committing secterianism? This is a
                      > famous recipe for the DIVIDE AND RULE. And worse
                      > yet, the worldwide mainstream media is talking of
                      > nothing, but the so-called civil war and of the
                      > bombs the "Iraqis are using to kill themselves",
                      > supposedly for secterian hatred; what a laughable
                      > notion indeed." was in agreement with your
                      > statement about the conducts of Ottomans. I am fed
                      > up from hearing that Iraqis are secterians when the
                      > occupiers are and have harshly enforced
                      > secterianism.
                      >
                      > My concern was the timing of the publication and
                      > the need to clarify the misconceptions about Iraqis
                      > regardless of who is a historian and who is not.
                      >
                      >
                      > Regards
                      > Walaa' Ali
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > Wafaa' Al-Natheema <aboutfromiraq@...> wrote:
                      > Thank you, May, Richard and Walaa' for your
                      > thoughtful remarks. It is rewarding for me to know
                      > that you find the
                      > e-newsletter informative. Personally, I am not
                      > yet as satisfied as you are with it. But I hope
                      > with time, it improves.
                      >
                      >
                      > As for Anees Al-Qaysi's article: While I
                      > understand that its content may feel upsetting or be
                      > misunderstood, it is important to put in mind that
                      > he had written it while living in violent IRAQ with
                      > little electricity daily. I was so appreciative of
                      > him to send his summary/article in both languages
                      > (Arabic and English).
                      >
                      > With the exception of Dr. Mudhafar Amin, all
                      > historians of the writing/editing team live in Iraq
                      > and find it very difficult to produce! Also a
                      > couple of them do not read/write in English. This
                      > is why we have added the research/translation team
                      > to
                      === message truncated ===


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                    • VImportant@aol.com
                      In a message dated 5/2/2006 3:34:36 PM Eastern Standard Time, VImportant@aol.com writes: It will be good to hear Wafaa s thoughts about the matter of the
                      Message 10 of 17 , May 10, 2006
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                        In a message dated 5/2/2006 3:34:36 PM Eastern Standard Time, VImportant@... writes:
                        It will be good to hear Wafaa's thoughts about the matter of the yearly subscription to join this history group before we vote on it.
                         
                        I too would like to see this unique work get funded to benefit the Iraqi
                        historians.
                         
                        Richard Sullivan
                         
                        And I am willing to donate or pay annual subscription dues.
                         
                        regards,
                        Richard
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