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RE: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member

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  • Jeff Gibbon
    GRC009349 PAGES00019 G- ChrY:20087688..20087688 GRC009349 PAGES00025 G- ChrY:20104521..20104521 GRC009349 PAGES00026 A+ ChrY:20105584..20105584 GRC009349
    Message 1 of 24 , Jun 29, 2013

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      That is interesting since I tested WTY back in 2007 and was negative for that one, but positive for PAGES00026

       

      My terminal SNP is L126/L137

       

      But maybe I am not following the conversation properly

       

      Jeffery W. Gibbon

       

       

      From: I-M223@yahoogroups.com [mailto:I-M223@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Wayne Roberts
      Sent: Thursday, June 27, 2013 9:40 PM
      To: I-M223 List
      Subject: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member

       




      Some good news from a Geno 2.0 test at last for the Isles Scots sector with a new SNP found derived yesterday for Taggart kit number N53563.

       

      He sent his Geno 2.0 raw data file through to Project administrators and on checking and comparison with some previous Isles Scots Geno 2.0 raw data files, he was found to be positive for the SNP - PAGES00052. The other Isles Scots members for which we have Geno 2.0 raw data, are all ancestral for PAGES00052 as are those from other M223 sectors for which we have Geno raw data.

       

      This highlights the importance of sending Administrators your Geno 2.0 raw data files to check if or when you have completed Geno 2.0 test results back.

       

      Please do not rush to order PAGES00052 as it is likely to only split off a small new branch from the rest of the L126+/L137+/L369+ Isles groups given that Bradford, Hemphill, Hokstad, McAllister, McCullough and Nesbitt are or appear to be negative for it. Those with a close Y-DNA match to Taggart are more likely to be positive. Taggart has a distinctive DYS395a-b = 14-15 in the 38 to 67 marker set. Gunning shares this same distinctive marker reading while some other close matches have only tested to 37 markers so their DYS395 is unknown. Whether this marker will tag those that are PAGES00052+ is uncertain at present.

       

      We will probably call for a few volunteers from Isles Scots, Irish and Limbo groups to test for PAGES00052 first to gauge the extent of this new branch. PAGES00052 is already in the FTDNA SNP order catalog so we do not have to wait for it to be listed.

       

      Please notify us first before you order.

       

      I-M223 Project team

       

       




    • Dora Smith
      Gee, Wayne, I’m tempted to order it just to prove I don’t need permission, but I’m really not flush at the moment, and I won’t be interested in it
      Message 2 of 24 , Jun 29, 2013
        Gee, Wayne, I’m tempted to order it just to prove I don’t need permission, but I’m really not flush at the moment, and I won’t be interested in it unless it proves to be something my McKinstrys are likely to carry, which at this moment it looks unlikely that they are.
         
        Does this Taggart guy have any idea exactly where in Galloway, or even if in Galloway, his ancestors lived?  I mean, like, my brother in law’s people must have lived within 20 miles of the Cree River throughout time.   His closest matches have weird names, like McArtor, McNeight, that kind of thing.  
         
        Dora
         
         
        Sent: Thursday, June 27, 2013 8:40 PM
        Subject: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member
         
         

        Some good news from a Geno 2.0 test at last for the Isles Scots sector with a new SNP found derived yesterday for Taggart kit number N53563.
         
        He sent his Geno 2.0 raw data file through to Project administrators and on checking and comparison with some previous Isles Scots Geno 2.0 raw data files, he was found to be positive for the SNP - PAGES00052. The other Isles Scots members for which we have Geno 2.0 raw data, are all ancestral for PAGES00052 as are those from other M223 sectors for which we have Geno raw data.
         
        This highlights the importance of sending Administrators your Geno 2.0 raw data files to check if or when you have completed Geno 2.0 test results back.
         
        Please do not rush to order PAGES00052 as it is likely to only split off a small new branch from the rest of the L126+/L137+/L369+ Isles groups given that Bradford, Hemphill, Hokstad, McAllister, McCullough and Nesbitt are or appear to be negative for it. Those with a close Y-DNA match to Taggart are more likely to be positive. Taggart has a distinctive DYS395a-b = 14-15 in the 38 to 67 marker set. Gunning shares this same distinctive marker reading while some other close matches have only tested to 37 markers so their DYS395 is unknown. Whether this marker will tag those that are PAGES00052+ is uncertain at present.
         
        We will probably call for a few volunteers from Isles Scots, Irish and Limbo groups to test for PAGES00052 first to gauge the extent of this new branch. PAGES00052 is already in the FTDNA SNP order catalog so we do not have to wait for it to be listed.
         
        Please notify us first before you order.
         
        I-M223 Project team
         
         
      • Dora Smith
        Oh. Thanks for explaining! That does make sense of why the SNP is in the Geno 2 test. I would however be far more likely to order the test given a
        Message 3 of 24 , Jun 29, 2013
          Oh.  Thanks for explaining!  That does make sense of why the SNP is in the Geno 2 test.  
           
          I would however be far more likely to order the test given a straightforward list of what they do test for.   And also if their choices were logical; for instance, they don’t test for M284, which is a major I-M223 clade .  
           
          Yours,
          Dora Smith
           
          Sent: Friday, June 28, 2013 9:22 PM
          Subject: Re: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member
           
           

          Dora,
           
          You know as much as I did when this SNP was found yesterday in Taggart's Geno 2.0. I went and looked for the following information at FTDNA's Y-tree and ISOGG.
           
          PAGES00052 also know as PAGE52 is T ancestral and G derived.
           
          FTDNA has it listed in their SNP order catalog under "Order an Advance Test". There are actually three listed there: PAGES00052, PAGES00052.1 and PAGES00052.2.
          From what I can gather S00052 is T to G and was possibly found in a Haplogroup G person. S00052.1 is T to G and was found in Haplogroup A-P262 WTY participant. S00052.2 is T to G and was found in Haplogroup J-L222.2 WTY participant. It possibly has an equivalent, PF3228 which is also T --> G found in Sardinian Study in 1000 Genomes Project. There is also another variant, L1035 which has T to delete found in a Haplogroup A-L896 WTY participant. They may all be singletons, I'm not sure on this.
           
          ISOGG has PAGE52.1, PAGE52.2 and PAGE52.3, all under investigation. They list their RS number as rs3440262. On ISOGG, PAGE52.1 is approx. Haplogroup G, PAGE52.2 is approx. Haplogroup J while PAGE52.3 is approx. Haplogroup A. I would therefore assume that should we find some other Isles members positive, ISOGG would list our PAGES00052 as PAGE52.4 in Haplogroup I-M223 or in I-L126.
           
          F1296 which all L126+ Geno 2.0 participants have as a No Call is ancestral G to derived C and was found previously derived in a single Haplogroup O3 person. We need to get this SNP into the catalog so it can be investigated further and FTDNA look in it's vicinity for a positive SNP that is causing the No Call result. F1296 is ancestral G in all other M223 Geno 2.0 participants.
           
          Previously Geno 2.0 results have only favoured Continental L701/L702 and Continental Z161 sectors, leaving Roots L1229, Isles M284, Cont L1228 and basic M223 out in the cold. To find PAGES00052, even if a private SNP in Isles is an advancement. Perhaps if FTDNA investigated more of the No Call SNPs we might find some interesting positive SNPs for individuals and M223 sectors.
           
          Wayne
           
           
          ----- Original Message -----
          Sent: Saturday, June 29, 2013 5:11 AM
          Subject: Re: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member
           
           

          Umm, Genographic is giving out way too little information about what it tests and why for me to be comfortable with ordering the test.
           
          Where did this SNP come from and why did the Genographic Project test for it if it isn’t already attached to a clade?
           
          If I don’t get a clear straightforward answer to that sort of question, I won’t order this test nor order it for someone else, and I definitely won’t be asking this list for permission before I order whatever.   I’m leaning toward a complete Y sequence myself.  
           
          Dora
           
           
          Sent: Friday, June 28, 2013 1:20 PM
          Subject: Re: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member
           
           

          That is the way we find new SNPs. It may be a private SNP, it may be defining a larger group. As wayne states it is only relevant for a few subjects. Hence one should ask in this group before doing the test. Still I think it is exciting when a new SNP in the I tree is found. It is a rare bird

          Sendt fra min iPad

          Den 28/06/2013 kl. 19.05 skrev "Dora Smith" <tiggernut24@...>:

          Trying to translate this into English, that means that one person alone out of a whole bunch of Isles Scottish people who tested negative for it, have tested positive for this mystery SNP that noone but Genographic knows what this SNP is, where they got it or why it’s in the test.
           
          Yours,
          Dora Smith
           
          Sent: Friday, June 28, 2013 2:28 AM
          Subject: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member
           
           
          Some good news from a Geno 2.0 test at last for the Isles Scots sector with a new SNP found derived yesterday for Taggart kit number N53563.
           
          He sent his Geno 2.0 raw data file through to Project administrators and on checking and comparison with some previous Isles Scots Geno 2.0 raw data files, he was found to be positive for the SNP - PAGES00052. The other Isles Scots members for which we have Geno 2.0 raw data, are all ancestral for PAGES00052 as are those from other M223 sectors for which we have Geno raw data.
           
          This highlights the importance of sending Administrators your Geno 2.0 raw data files to check if or when you have completed Geno 2.0 test results back.
           
          Please do not rush to order PAGES00052 as it is likely to only split off a small new branch from the rest of the L126+/L137+/L369+ Isles groups given that Bradford, Hemphill, Hokstad, McAllister, McCullough and Nesbitt are or appear to be negative for it. Those with a close Y-DNA match to Taggart are more likely to be positive. Taggart has a distinctive DYS395a-b = 14-15 in the 38 to 67 marker set. Gunning shares this same distinctive marker reading while some other close matches have only tested to 37 markers so their DYS395 is unknown. Whether this marker will tag those that are PAGES00052+ is uncertain at present.
           
          We will probably call for a few volunteers from Isles Scots, Irish and Limbo groups to test for PAGES00052 first to gauge the extent of this new branch. PAGES00052 is already in the FTDNA SNP order catalog so we do not have to wait for it to be listed.
           
          Please notify us first before you order.
           
          I-M223 Project team
           
           

        • Wayne Roberts
          Hello Jeff, Thanks for your message. Because I was a somewhat late comer to the I-M223 Project, I am not aware of everyone that has done a WTY test or what
          Message 4 of 24 , Jun 29, 2013
            Hello Jeff,
             
            Thanks for your message. Because I was a somewhat late comer to the I-M223 Project, I am not aware of everyone that has done a WTY test or what their results were.
             
            I have checked up on PAGES00026 and everyone in I-M223 is positive for it so it is one of those positive SNPs that our Haplogroup has inherited.
             
            Jeff, you, like those Isles Scots members that have done Geno 2.0 and sent through their raw data to FTDNA and/or Project administrators, are PAGES00052 negative with the exception of Taggart of course.
             
            Gunning, a close Y-DNA match to Taggart, also did WTY but PAGES00052 was not tested or picked up. He has agreed to test for it and has since ordered PAGES00052. Thanks Bruce.
             
            This is probably a small branch off L126 which is why I asked L126+ members to notify us if they want to order it. It is not to give permission as Dora put it, but we do not want members wasting money on an SNP that will come back negative for them. We will be looking for candidates that have the best probability of a positive result. We require at least three positives to have it listed with ISOGG. Of course Dora is free as anyone else is to go ahead and order PAGES00052 to prove some sort of point.
             
            Thanks for everyone's interest.
             
            Wayne
             
            ----- Original Message -----
            Sent: Sunday, June 30, 2013 3:40 AM
            Subject: RE: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member

             

            GRC009349

            PAGES00019

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            ChrY:20087688..20087688

            GRC009349

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            G-

            ChrY:20104521..20104521

            GRC009349

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            A+

            ChrY:20105584..20105584

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            PAGES00027

            T-

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            GRC009349

            PAGES00052

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            1

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            That is interesting since I tested WTY back in 2007 and was negative for that one, but positive for PAGES00026

            My terminal SNP is L126/L137

            But maybe I am not following the conversation properly

            Jeffery W. Gibbon

            From: I-M223@yahoogroups.com [mailto:I-M223@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Wayne Roberts
            Sent: Thursday, June 27, 2013 9:40 PM
            To: I-M223 List
            Subject: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member




            Some good news from a Geno 2.0 test at last for the Isles Scots sector with a new SNP found derived yesterday for Taggart kit number N53563.

            He sent his Geno 2.0 raw data file through to Project administrators and on checking and comparison with some previous Isles Scots Geno 2.0 raw data files, he was found to be positive for the SNP - PAGES00052. The other Isles Scots members for which we have Geno 2.0 raw data, are all ancestral for PAGES00052 as are those from other M223 sectors for which we have Geno raw data.

            This highlights the importance of sending Administrators your Geno 2.0 raw data files to check if or when you have completed Geno 2.0 test results back.

            Please do not rush to order PAGES00052 as it is likely to only split off a small new branch from the rest of the L126+/L137+/L369+ Isles groups given that Bradford, Hemphill, Hokstad, McAllister, McCullough and Nesbitt are or appear to be negative for it. Those with a close Y-DNA match to Taggart are more likely to be positive. Taggart has a distinctive DYS395a-b = 14-15 in the 38 to 67 marker set. Gunning shares this same distinctive marker reading while some other close matches have only tested to 37 markers so their DYS395 is unknown. Whether this marker will tag those that are PAGES00052+ is uncertain at present.

            We will probably call for a few volunteers from Isles Scots, Irish and Limbo groups to test for PAGES00052 first to gauge the extent of this new branch. PAGES00052 is already in the FTDNA SNP order catalog so we do not have to wait for it to be listed.

            Please notify us first before you order.

            I-M223 Project team




          • paleti20
            Hello Wayne In position ChrY:2770309..2770309 (PAGES00052) there is SNP L1035 insert (+ins) or not (-ins). Is that the same? Limbo E10220 is for that SNP
            Message 5 of 24 , Jun 30, 2013
              Hello Wayne

              In position ChrY:2770309..2770309 (PAGES00052)
              there is SNP L1035 insert (+ins) or not (-ins).

              Is that the same?

              Limbo E10220 is for that SNP negative (-ins).

              regards
              Mani



              --- In I-M223@yahoogroups.com, "Wayne Roberts" <wayne_r_roberts@...> wrote:
              >
              > Hello Jeff,
              >
              > Thanks for your message. Because I was a somewhat late comer to the I-M223 Project, I am not aware of everyone that has done a WTY test or what their results were.
              >
              > I have checked up on PAGES00026 and everyone in I-M223 is positive for it so it is one of those positive SNPs that our Haplogroup has inherited.
              >
              > Jeff, you, like those Isles Scots members that have done Geno 2.0 and sent through their raw data to FTDNA and/or Project administrators, are PAGES00052 negative with the exception of Taggart of course.
              >
              > Gunning, a close Y-DNA match to Taggart, also did WTY but PAGES00052 was not tested or picked up. He has agreed to test for it and has since ordered PAGES00052. Thanks Bruce.
              >
              > This is probably a small branch off L126 which is why I asked L126+ members to notify us if they want to order it. It is not to give permission as Dora put it, but we do not want members wasting money on an SNP that will come back negative for them. We will be looking for candidates that have the best probability of a positive result. We require at least three positives to have it listed with ISOGG. Of course Dora is free as anyone else is to go ahead and order PAGES00052 to prove some sort of point.
              >
              > Thanks for everyone's interest.
              >
              > Wayne
              >
              > ----- Original Message -----
              > From: Jeff Gibbon
              > To: I-M223@yahoogroups.com
              > Sent: Sunday, June 30, 2013 3:40 AM
              > Subject: RE: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > GRC009349
              > PAGES00019
              > G-
              > ChrY:20087688..20087688
              >
              > GRC009349
              > PAGES00025
              > G-
              > ChrY:20104521..20104521
              >
              > GRC009349
              > PAGES00026
              > A+
              > ChrY:20105584..20105584
              >
              > GRC009349
              > PAGES00027
              > T-
              > ChrY:20106063..20106063
              >
              > GRC009349
              > PAGES00052
              > T-
              > ChrY:2770309..2770309
              >
              > GRC009349
              > PAGES00059
              > C-
              > ChrY:20329311..20329311
              >
              > GRC009349
              > PAGES00068
              > C-
              > ChrY:16170772..16170772
              >
              > GRC009349
              > PAGES00076
              > A-
              > ChrY:6998665..6998665
              >
              > GRC009349
              > PAGES00083
              > A-
              > ChrY:13407488..13407488
              >
              > GRC009349
              > PAGES00093
              > G-
              > ChrY:13990829..13990829
              >
              > GRC009349
              > PAGES00104
              > A-
              > ChrY:21160725..21160725
              >
              > GRC009349
              > PAGES00106
              > C-
              > ChrY:20106098..20106098
              >
              > GRC009349
              > PAGES00107
              > T-
              > ChrY:20105838..20105838
              >
              > GRC009349
              > PAGES00116
              > C-
              > ChrY:20353252..20353252
              >
              > GRC009349
              > PAGES00117
              > T-
              > ChrY:20342318..20342318
              >
              > GRC009349
              > PAGES00119
              > T-
              > ChrY:20329316..20329316
              >
              > GRC009349
              > PAGES00121
              > G-
              > ChrY:16170780..16170780
              >
              > GRC009349
              > PAGES00123
              > G-
              > ChrY:13407777..13407777
              >
              > GRC009349
              > PK2
              > T-
              > ChrY:21078608..21078608
              >
              > GRC009349
              > PK3
              > T-
              > ChrY:21078913..21078913
              >
              > GRC009349
              > PK4
              > A-
              > ChrY:19745350..19745350
              >
              > GRC009349
              > SRY10831.1
              > C+
              > ChrY:2717176..2717176
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > GRC009349
              > L124
              > T-
              > ChrY:16276156..16276156
              > 1
              >
              > GRC009349
              > L125
              > T-
              > ChrY:17269063..17269063
              > 1
              >
              > GRC009349
              > L126
              > T+
              > ChrY:13411027..13411027
              > 1
              >
              > GRC009349
              > L127
              > G-
              > ChrY:12798981..12798981
              > 1
              >
              > GRC009349
              > L128
              > T-
              > ChrY:13134262..13134262
              > 1
              >
              > GRC009349
              > L13
              > C-
              > ChrY:13208948..13208948
              > 1
              >
              > GRC009349
              > L130
              > G-
              > ChrY:6813503..6813503
              > 1
              >
              > GRC009349
              > L131
              > C-
              > ChrY:17882202..17882202
              > 1
              >
              > GRC009349
              > L132
              > C-
              > ChrY:15973591..15973591
              > 1
              >
              > GRC009349
              > L134
              > C-
              > ChrY:13360329..13360329
              > 1
              >
              > GRC009349
              > L135
              > C-
              > ChrY:13638642..13638642
              > 1
              >
              > GRC009349
              > L136
              > ins-
              > ChrY:7630823..7630823
              > 1
              >
              > GRC009349
              > L137
              > A+
              > ChrY:10401250..10401250
              > 1
              >
              > GRC009349
              > L138
              > A-
              > ChrY:2902214..2902214
              > 1
              >
              > GRC009349
              > L139
              > G-
              > ChrY:13981304..13981304
              > 1
              >
              > GRC009349
              > L14
              > C-
              > ChrY:21327383..21327383
              > 1
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > That is interesting since I tested WTY back in 2007 and was negative for that one, but positive for PAGES00026
              >
              >
              >
              > My terminal SNP is L126/L137
              >
              >
              >
              > But maybe I am not following the conversation properly
              >
              >
              >
              > Jeffery W. Gibbon
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > From: I-M223@yahoogroups.com [mailto:I-M223@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Wayne Roberts
              > Sent: Thursday, June 27, 2013 9:40 PM
              > To: I-M223 List
              > Subject: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > Some good news from a Geno 2.0 test at last for the Isles Scots sector with a new SNP found derived yesterday for Taggart kit number N53563.
              >
              >
              >
              > He sent his Geno 2.0 raw data file through to Project administrators and on checking and comparison with some previous Isles Scots Geno 2.0 raw data files, he was found to be positive for the SNP - PAGES00052. The other Isles Scots members for which we have Geno 2.0 raw data, are all ancestral for PAGES00052 as are those from other M223 sectors for which we have Geno raw data.
              >
              >
              >
              > This highlights the importance of sending Administrators your Geno 2.0 raw data files to check if or when you have completed Geno 2.0 test results back.
              >
              >
              >
              > Please do not rush to order PAGES00052 as it is likely to only split off a small new branch from the rest of the L126+/L137+/L369+ Isles groups given that Bradford, Hemphill, Hokstad, McAllister, McCullough and Nesbitt are or appear to be negative for it. Those with a close Y-DNA match to Taggart are more likely to be positive. Taggart has a distinctive DYS395a-b = 14-15 in the 38 to 67 marker set. Gunning shares this same distinctive marker reading while some other close matches have only tested to 37 markers so their DYS395 is unknown. Whether this marker will tag those that are PAGES00052+ is uncertain at present.
              >
              >
              >
              > We will probably call for a few volunteers from Isles Scots, Irish and Limbo groups to test for PAGES00052 first to gauge the extent of this new branch. PAGES00052 is already in the FTDNA SNP order catalog so we do not have to wait for it to be listed.
              >
              >
              >
              > Please notify us first before you order.
              >
              >
              >
              > I-M223 Project team
              >
            • Jørgen K. Kanters
              No one needs permission. Everybody can order what he/she wants too. Seen from an experts viewpoint it may not be wise. Thats why wayne offers his help to give
              Message 6 of 24 , Jun 30, 2013
                No one needs permission. Everybody can order what he/she wants too. Seen from an experts viewpoint it may not be wise. Thats why wayne offers his help to give people his best advice to save their money. Sometimes there could be a conflict since the interest ofvthe group is not the same of the interest of the individual. 

                Geno 2.0 is a good example. For the individual the chance is very low that something comes out of it, but when a lot of people do it, we find some interesting mutations which help us to come further. 

                So thanks to Aaron and Wayne for helping us and for all their work of effort to help us 223's to get further

                Jorgen

                Sendt fra min iPad

                Den 29/06/2013 kl. 22.59 skrev "Dora Smith" <tiggernut24@...>:

                Gee, Wayne, I’m tempted to order it just to prove I don’t need permission, but I’m really not flush at the moment, and I won’t be interested in it unless it proves to be something my McKinstrys are likely to carry, which at this moment it looks unlikely that they are.
                 
                Does this Taggart guy have any idea exactly where in Galloway, or even if in Galloway, his ancestors lived?  I mean, like, my brother in law’s people must have lived within 20 miles of the Cree River throughout time.   His closest matches have weird names, like McArtor, McNeight, that kind of thing.  
                 
                Dora
                 
                 
                Sent: Thursday, June 27, 2013 8:40 PM
                Subject: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member
                 
                 

                Some good news from a Geno 2.0 test at last for the Isles Scots sector with a new SNP found derived yesterday for Taggart kit number N53563.
                 
                He sent his Geno 2.0 raw data file through to Project administrators and on checking and comparison with some previous Isles Scots Geno 2.0 raw data files, he was found to be positive for the SNP - PAGES00052. The other Isles Scots members for which we have Geno 2.0 raw data, are all ancestral for PAGES00052 as are those from other M223 sectors for which we have Geno raw data.
                 
                This highlights the importance of sending Administrators your Geno 2.0 raw data files to check if or when you have completed Geno 2.0 test results back.
                 
                Please do not rush to order PAGES00052 as it is likely to only split off a small new branch from the rest of the L126+/L137+/L369+ Isles groups given that Bradford, Hemphill, Hokstad, McAllister, McCullough and Nesbitt are or appear to be negative for it. Those with a close Y-DNA match to Taggart are more likely to be positive. Taggart has a distinctive DYS395a-b = 14-15 in the 38 to 67 marker set. Gunning shares this same distinctive marker reading while some other close matches have only tested to 37 markers so their DYS395 is unknown. Whether this marker will tag those that are PAGES00052+ is uncertain at present.
                 
                We will probably call for a few volunteers from Isles Scots, Irish and Limbo groups to test for PAGES00052 first to gauge the extent of this new branch. PAGES00052 is already in the FTDNA SNP order catalog so we do not have to wait for it to be listed.
                 
                Please notify us first before you order.
                 
                I-M223 Project team
                 
                 

              • Wayne Roberts
                Hi Mani, It would appear FTDNA reports L1035 insertion as negative and deletion as positive. However I did find lots of references to PAGES00052 in your WTY
                Message 7 of 24 , Jun 30, 2013
                  Hi Mani,
                   
                  It would appear FTDNA reports L1035 insertion as negative and deletion as positive. However I did find lots of references to PAGES00052 in your WTY for other SNPs all of which were reported as negative, except P305 which was G+. I do not know enough about these but will have a look and report back.
                   
                  Wayne
                   
                  ----- Original Message -----
                  From: paleti20
                  Sent: Sunday, June 30, 2013 8:53 PM
                  Subject: [I-M223] Re: New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member

                   

                  Hello Wayne

                  In position ChrY:2770309..2770309 (PAGES00052)
                  there is SNP L1035 insert (+ins) or not (-ins).

                  Is that the same?

                  Limbo E10220 is for that SNP negative (-ins).

                  regards
                  Mani

                  --- In I-M223@yahoogroups.com, "Wayne Roberts" <wayne_r_roberts@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > Hello Jeff,
                  >
                  > Thanks for your message. Because I was a somewhat late comer to the I-M223 Project, I am not aware of everyone that has done a WTY test or what their results were.
                  >
                  > I have checked up on PAGES00026 and everyone in I-M223 is positive for it so it is one of those positive SNPs that our Haplogroup has inherited.
                  >
                  > Jeff, you, like those Isles Scots members that have done Geno 2.0 and sent through their raw data to FTDNA and/or Project administrators, are PAGES00052 negative with the exception of Taggart of course.
                  >
                  > Gunning, a close Y-DNA match to Taggart, also did WTY but PAGES00052 was not tested or picked up. He has agreed to test for it and has since ordered PAGES00052. Thanks Bruce.
                  >
                  > This is probably a small branch off L126 which is why I asked L126+ members to notify us if they want to order it. It is not to give permission as Dora put it, but we do not want members wasting money on an SNP that will come back negative for them. We will be looking for candidates that have the best probability of a positive result. We require at least three positives to have it listed with ISOGG. Of course Dora is free as anyone else is to go ahead and order PAGES00052 to prove some sort of point.
                  >
                  > Thanks for everyone's interest.
                  >
                  > Wayne
                  >
                  > ----- Original Message -----
                  > From: Jeff Gibbon
                  > To: I-M223@yahoogroups.com
                  > Sent: Sunday, June 30, 2013 3:40 AM
                  > Subject: RE: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > GRC009349
                  > PAGES00019
                  > G-
                  > ChrY:20087688..20087688
                  >
                  > GRC009349
                  > PAGES00025
                  > G-
                  > ChrY:20104521..20104521
                  >
                  > GRC009349
                  > PAGES00026
                  > A+
                  > ChrY:20105584..20105584
                  >
                  > GRC009349
                  > PAGES00027
                  > T-
                  > ChrY:20106063..20106063
                  >
                  > GRC009349
                  > PAGES00052
                  > T-
                  > ChrY:2770309..2770309
                  >
                  > GRC009349
                  > PAGES00059
                  > C-
                  > ChrY:20329311..20329311
                  >
                  > GRC009349
                  > PAGES00068
                  > C-
                  > ChrY:16170772..16170772
                  >
                  > GRC009349
                  > PAGES00076
                  > A-
                  > ChrY:6998665..6998665
                  >
                  > GRC009349
                  > PAGES00083
                  > A-
                  > ChrY:13407488..13407488
                  >
                  > GRC009349
                  > PAGES00093
                  > G-
                  > ChrY:13990829..13990829
                  >
                  > GRC009349
                  > PAGES00104
                  > A-
                  > ChrY:21160725..21160725
                  >
                  > GRC009349
                  > PAGES00106
                  > C-
                  > ChrY:20106098..20106098
                  >
                  > GRC009349
                  > PAGES00107
                  > T-
                  > ChrY:20105838..20105838
                  >
                  > GRC009349
                  > PAGES00116
                  > C-
                  > ChrY:20353252..20353252
                  >
                  > GRC009349
                  > PAGES00117
                  > T-
                  > ChrY:20342318..20342318
                  >
                  > GRC009349
                  > PAGES00119
                  > T-
                  > ChrY:20329316..20329316
                  >
                  > GRC009349
                  > PAGES00121
                  > G-
                  > ChrY:16170780..16170780
                  >
                  > GRC009349
                  > PAGES00123
                  > G-
                  > ChrY:13407777..13407777
                  >
                  > GRC009349
                  > PK2
                  > T-
                  > ChrY:21078608..21078608
                  >
                  > GRC009349
                  > PK3
                  > T-
                  > ChrY:21078913..21078913
                  >
                  > GRC009349
                  > PK4
                  > A-
                  > ChrY:19745350..19745350
                  >
                  > GRC009349
                  > SRY10831.1
                  > C+
                  > ChrY:2717176..2717176
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > GRC009349
                  > L124
                  > T-
                  > ChrY:16276156..16276156
                  > 1
                  >
                  > GRC009349
                  > L125
                  > T-
                  > ChrY:17269063..17269063
                  > 1
                  >
                  > GRC009349
                  > L126
                  > T+
                  > ChrY:13411027..13411027
                  > 1
                  >
                  > GRC009349
                  > L127
                  > G-
                  > ChrY:12798981..12798981
                  > 1
                  >
                  > GRC009349
                  > L128
                  > T-
                  > ChrY:13134262..13134262
                  > 1
                  >
                  > GRC009349
                  > L13
                  > C-
                  > ChrY:13208948..13208948
                  > 1
                  >
                  > GRC009349
                  > L130
                  > G-
                  > ChrY:6813503..6813503
                  > 1
                  >
                  > GRC009349
                  > L131
                  > C-
                  > ChrY:17882202..17882202
                  > 1
                  >
                  > GRC009349
                  > L132
                  > C-
                  > ChrY:15973591..15973591
                  > 1
                  >
                  > GRC009349
                  > L134
                  > C-
                  > ChrY:13360329..13360329
                  > 1
                  >
                  > GRC009349
                  > L135
                  > C-
                  > ChrY:13638642..13638642
                  > 1
                  >
                  > GRC009349
                  > L136
                  > ins-
                  > ChrY:7630823..7630823
                  > 1
                  >
                  > GRC009349
                  > L137
                  > A+
                  > ChrY:10401250..10401250
                  > 1
                  >
                  > GRC009349
                  > L138
                  > A-
                  > ChrY:2902214..2902214
                  > 1
                  >
                  > GRC009349
                  > L139
                  > G-
                  > ChrY:13981304..13981304
                  > 1
                  >
                  > GRC009349
                  > L14
                  > C-
                  > ChrY:21327383..21327383
                  > 1
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > That is interesting since I tested WTY back in 2007 and was negative for that one, but positive for PAGES00026
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > My terminal SNP is L126/L137
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > But maybe I am not following the conversation properly
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > Jeffery W. Gibbon
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > From: I-M223@yahoogroups.com [mailto:I-M223@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Wayne Roberts
                  > Sent: Thursday, June 27, 2013 9:40 PM
                  > To: I-M223 List
                  > Subject: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > Some good news from a Geno 2.0 test at last for the Isles Scots sector with a new SNP found derived yesterday for Taggart kit number N53563.
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > He sent his Geno 2.0 raw data file through to Project administrators and on checking and comparison with some previous Isles Scots Geno 2.0 raw data files, he was found to be positive for the SNP - PAGES00052. The other Isles Scots members for which we have Geno 2.0 raw data, are all ancestral for PAGES00052 as are those from other M223 sectors for which we have Geno raw data.
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > This highlights the importance of sending Administrators your Geno 2.0 raw data files to check if or when you have completed Geno 2.0 test results back.
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > Please do not rush to order PAGES00052 as it is likely to only split off a small new branch from the rest of the L126+/L137+/L369+ Isles groups given that Bradford, Hemphill, Hokstad, McAllister, McCullough and Nesbitt are or appear to be negative for it. Those with a close Y-DNA match to Taggart are more likely to be positive. Taggart has a distinctive DYS395a-b = 14-15 in the 38 to 67 marker set. Gunning shares this same distinctive marker reading while some other close matches have only tested to 37 markers so their DYS395 is unknown. Whether this marker will tag those that are PAGES00052+ is uncertain at present.
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > We will probably call for a few volunteers from Isles Scots, Irish and Limbo groups to test for PAGES00052 first to gauge the extent of this new branch. PAGES00052 is already in the FTDNA SNP order catalog so we do not have to wait for it to be listed.
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > Please notify us first before you order.
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > I-M223 Project team
                  >

                • Wayne Roberts
                  FTDNA Ymap reports P305 as: Name: P305 Type: snp Description: Source: PS Position: ChrY:2770154..2770154 (+ strand) Length: 1 ISOGG_haplogroup: A0
                  Message 8 of 24 , Jun 30, 2013
                    FTDNA Ymap reports P305 as:
                     
                    Name:P305
                    Type:snp
                    Description:
                    Source:PS
                    Position:ChrY:2770154..2770154 (+ strand)
                    Length:1
                    ISOGG_haplogroup:A0
                    Mutation:A to G
                    YCC_haplogroup:Approx. hg: A1a-T
                    allele_anc:A
                    allele_der:G
                    count_derived:347
                    count_tested:354
                    primer_f:PAGES00052-f
                    primer_r:PAGES00052-r
                    primary_id:41398
                    gbrowse_dbid:ymap:database
                     
                    I really do not know what this means for you or for I-M223. Perhaps it is another SNP all of I-M223 has inherited and thus positive for everyone.
                     
                    I'll keep digging.
                     
                    Wayne
                     
                    ----- Original Message -----
                    From: paleti20
                    Sent: Sunday, June 30, 2013 8:53 PM
                    Subject: [I-M223] Re: New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member

                     

                    Hello Wayne

                    In position ChrY:2770309..2770309 (PAGES00052)
                    there is SNP L1035 insert (+ins) or not (-ins).

                    Is that the same?

                    Limbo E10220 is for that SNP negative (-ins).

                    regards
                    Mani

                    --- In I-M223@yahoogroups.com, "Wayne Roberts" <wayne_r_roberts@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > Hello Jeff,
                    >
                    > Thanks for your message. Because I was a somewhat late comer to the I-M223 Project, I am not aware of everyone that has done a WTY test or what their results were.
                    >
                    > I have checked up on PAGES00026 and everyone in I-M223 is positive for it so it is one of those positive SNPs that our Haplogroup has inherited.
                    >
                    > Jeff, you, like those Isles Scots members that have done Geno 2.0 and sent through their raw data to FTDNA and/or Project administrators, are PAGES00052 negative with the exception of Taggart of course.
                    >
                    > Gunning, a close Y-DNA match to Taggart, also did WTY but PAGES00052 was not tested or picked up. He has agreed to test for it and has since ordered PAGES00052. Thanks Bruce.
                    >
                    > This is probably a small branch off L126 which is why I asked L126+ members to notify us if they want to order it. It is not to give permission as Dora put it, but we do not want members wasting money on an SNP that will come back negative for them. We will be looking for candidates that have the best probability of a positive result. We require at least three positives to have it listed with ISOGG. Of course Dora is free as anyone else is to go ahead and order PAGES00052 to prove some sort of point.
                    >
                    > Thanks for everyone's interest.
                    >
                    > Wayne
                    >
                    > ----- Original Message -----
                    > From: Jeff Gibbon
                    > To: I-M223@yahoogroups.com
                    > Sent: Sunday, June 30, 2013 3:40 AM
                    > Subject: RE: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > GRC009349
                    > PAGES00019
                    > G-
                    > ChrY:20087688..20087688
                    >
                    > GRC009349
                    > PAGES00025
                    > G-
                    > ChrY:20104521..20104521
                    >
                    > GRC009349
                    > PAGES00026
                    > A+
                    > ChrY:20105584..20105584
                    >
                    > GRC009349
                    > PAGES00027
                    > T-
                    > ChrY:20106063..20106063
                    >
                    > GRC009349
                    > PAGES00052
                    > T-
                    > ChrY:2770309..2770309
                    >
                    > GRC009349
                    > PAGES00059
                    > C-
                    > ChrY:20329311..20329311
                    >
                    > GRC009349
                    > PAGES00068
                    > C-
                    > ChrY:16170772..16170772
                    >
                    > GRC009349
                    > PAGES00076
                    > A-
                    > ChrY:6998665..6998665
                    >
                    > GRC009349
                    > PAGES00083
                    > A-
                    > ChrY:13407488..13407488
                    >
                    > GRC009349
                    > PAGES00093
                    > G-
                    > ChrY:13990829..13990829
                    >
                    > GRC009349
                    > PAGES00104
                    > A-
                    > ChrY:21160725..21160725
                    >
                    > GRC009349
                    > PAGES00106
                    > C-
                    > ChrY:20106098..20106098
                    >
                    > GRC009349
                    > PAGES00107
                    > T-
                    > ChrY:20105838..20105838
                    >
                    > GRC009349
                    > PAGES00116
                    > C-
                    > ChrY:20353252..20353252
                    >
                    > GRC009349
                    > PAGES00117
                    > T-
                    > ChrY:20342318..20342318
                    >
                    > GRC009349
                    > PAGES00119
                    > T-
                    > ChrY:20329316..20329316
                    >
                    > GRC009349
                    > PAGES00121
                    > G-
                    > ChrY:16170780..16170780
                    >
                    > GRC009349
                    > PAGES00123
                    > G-
                    > ChrY:13407777..13407777
                    >
                    > GRC009349
                    > PK2
                    > T-
                    > ChrY:21078608..21078608
                    >
                    > GRC009349
                    > PK3
                    > T-
                    > ChrY:21078913..21078913
                    >
                    > GRC009349
                    > PK4
                    > A-
                    > ChrY:19745350..19745350
                    >
                    > GRC009349
                    > SRY10831.1
                    > C+
                    > ChrY:2717176..2717176
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > GRC009349
                    > L124
                    > T-
                    > ChrY:16276156..16276156
                    > 1
                    >
                    > GRC009349
                    > L125
                    > T-
                    > ChrY:17269063..17269063
                    > 1
                    >
                    > GRC009349
                    > L126
                    > T+
                    > ChrY:13411027..13411027
                    > 1
                    >
                    > GRC009349
                    > L127
                    > G-
                    > ChrY:12798981..12798981
                    > 1
                    >
                    > GRC009349
                    > L128
                    > T-
                    > ChrY:13134262..13134262
                    > 1
                    >
                    > GRC009349
                    > L13
                    > C-
                    > ChrY:13208948..13208948
                    > 1
                    >
                    > GRC009349
                    > L130
                    > G-
                    > ChrY:6813503..6813503
                    > 1
                    >
                    > GRC009349
                    > L131
                    > C-
                    > ChrY:17882202..17882202
                    > 1
                    >
                    > GRC009349
                    > L132
                    > C-
                    > ChrY:15973591..15973591
                    > 1
                    >
                    > GRC009349
                    > L134
                    > C-
                    > ChrY:13360329..13360329
                    > 1
                    >
                    > GRC009349
                    > L135
                    > C-
                    > ChrY:13638642..13638642
                    > 1
                    >
                    > GRC009349
                    > L136
                    > ins-
                    > ChrY:7630823..7630823
                    > 1
                    >
                    > GRC009349
                    > L137
                    > A+
                    > ChrY:10401250..10401250
                    > 1
                    >
                    > GRC009349
                    > L138
                    > A-
                    > ChrY:2902214..2902214
                    > 1
                    >
                    > GRC009349
                    > L139
                    > G-
                    > ChrY:13981304..13981304
                    > 1
                    >
                    > GRC009349
                    > L14
                    > C-
                    > ChrY:21327383..21327383
                    > 1
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > That is interesting since I tested WTY back in 2007 and was negative for that one, but positive for PAGES00026
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > My terminal SNP is L126/L137
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > But maybe I am not following the conversation properly
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > Jeffery W. Gibbon
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > From: I-M223@yahoogroups.com [mailto:I-M223@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Wayne Roberts
                    > Sent: Thursday, June 27, 2013 9:40 PM
                    > To: I-M223 List
                    > Subject: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > Some good news from a Geno 2.0 test at last for the Isles Scots sector with a new SNP found derived yesterday for Taggart kit number N53563.
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > He sent his Geno 2.0 raw data file through to Project administrators and on checking and comparison with some previous Isles Scots Geno 2.0 raw data files, he was found to be positive for the SNP - PAGES00052. The other Isles Scots members for which we have Geno 2.0 raw data, are all ancestral for PAGES00052 as are those from other M223 sectors for which we have Geno raw data.
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > This highlights the importance of sending Administrators your Geno 2.0 raw data files to check if or when you have completed Geno 2.0 test results back.
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > Please do not rush to order PAGES00052 as it is likely to only split off a small new branch from the rest of the L126+/L137+/L369+ Isles groups given that Bradford, Hemphill, Hokstad, McAllister, McCullough and Nesbitt are or appear to be negative for it. Those with a close Y-DNA match to Taggart are more likely to be positive. Taggart has a distinctive DYS395a-b = 14-15 in the 38 to 67 marker set. Gunning shares this same distinctive marker reading while some other close matches have only tested to 37 markers so their DYS395 is unknown. Whether this marker will tag those that are PAGES00052+ is uncertain at present.
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > We will probably call for a few volunteers from Isles Scots, Irish and Limbo groups to test for PAGES00052 first to gauge the extent of this new branch. PAGES00052 is already in the FTDNA SNP order catalog so we do not have to wait for it to be listed.
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > Please notify us first before you order.
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > I-M223 Project team
                    >

                  • paleti20
                    P305 is not interesting. On the FTDNA-Tree we can also see that it is a SNP positive for everyone. Mani
                    Message 9 of 24 , Jun 30, 2013
                      P305 is not interesting. On the FTDNA-Tree we can also see that it is a SNP positive for everyone.

                      Mani



                      --- In I-M223@yahoogroups.com, "Wayne Roberts" <wayne_r_roberts@...> wrote:
                      >
                      > FTDNA Ymap reports P305 as:
                      >
                      > Name: P305
                      > Type: snp
                      > Description:
                      > Source: PS
                      > Position: ChrY:2770154..2770154 (+ strand)
                      > Length: 1
                      > ISOGG_haplogroup: A0
                      > Mutation: A to G
                      > YCC_haplogroup: Approx. hg: A1a-T
                      > allele_anc: A
                      > allele_der: G
                      > count_derived: 347
                      > count_tested: 354
                      > primer_f: PAGES00052-f
                      > primer_r: PAGES00052-r
                      > primary_id: 41398
                      > gbrowse_dbid: ymap:database
                      >
                      >
                      > I really do not know what this means for you or for I-M223. Perhaps it is another SNP all of I-M223 has inherited and thus positive for everyone.
                      >
                      > I'll keep digging.
                      >
                      > Wayne
                      >
                      > ----- Original Message -----
                      > From: paleti20
                      > To: I-M223@yahoogroups.com
                      > Sent: Sunday, June 30, 2013 8:53 PM
                      > Subject: [I-M223] Re: New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > Hello Wayne
                      >
                      > In position ChrY:2770309..2770309 (PAGES00052)
                      > there is SNP L1035 insert (+ins) or not (-ins).
                      >
                      > Is that the same?
                      >
                      > Limbo E10220 is for that SNP negative (-ins).
                      >
                      > regards
                      > Mani
                      >
                      > --- In I-M223@yahoogroups.com, "Wayne Roberts" <wayne_r_roberts@> wrote:
                      > >
                      > > Hello Jeff,
                      > >
                      > > Thanks for your message. Because I was a somewhat late comer to the I-M223 Project, I am not aware of everyone that has done a WTY test or what their results were.
                      > >
                      > > I have checked up on PAGES00026 and everyone in I-M223 is positive for it so it is one of those positive SNPs that our Haplogroup has inherited.
                      > >
                      > > Jeff, you, like those Isles Scots members that have done Geno 2.0 and sent through their raw data to FTDNA and/or Project administrators, are PAGES00052 negative with the exception of Taggart of course.
                      > >
                      > > Gunning, a close Y-DNA match to Taggart, also did WTY but PAGES00052 was not tested or picked up. He has agreed to test for it and has since ordered PAGES00052. Thanks Bruce.
                      > >
                      > > This is probably a small branch off L126 which is why I asked L126+ members to notify us if they want to order it. It is not to give permission as Dora put it, but we do not want members wasting money on an SNP that will come back negative for them. We will be looking for candidates that have the best probability of a positive result. We require at least three positives to have it listed with ISOGG. Of course Dora is free as anyone else is to go ahead and order PAGES00052 to prove some sort of point.
                      > >
                      > > Thanks for everyone's interest.
                      > >
                      > > Wayne
                      > >
                      > > ----- Original Message -----
                      > > From: Jeff Gibbon
                      > > To: I-M223@yahoogroups.com
                      > > Sent: Sunday, June 30, 2013 3:40 AM
                      > > Subject: RE: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > > GRC009349
                      > > PAGES00019
                      > > G-
                      > > ChrY:20087688..20087688
                      > >
                      > > GRC009349
                      > > PAGES00025
                      > > G-
                      > > ChrY:20104521..20104521
                      > >
                      > > GRC009349
                      > > PAGES00026
                      > > A+
                      > > ChrY:20105584..20105584
                      > >
                      > > GRC009349
                      > > PAGES00027
                      > > T-
                      > > ChrY:20106063..20106063
                      > >
                      > > GRC009349
                      > > PAGES00052
                      > > T-
                      > > ChrY:2770309..2770309
                      > >
                      > > GRC009349
                      > > PAGES00059
                      > > C-
                      > > ChrY:20329311..20329311
                      > >
                      > > GRC009349
                      > > PAGES00068
                      > > C-
                      > > ChrY:16170772..16170772
                      > >
                      > > GRC009349
                      > > PAGES00076
                      > > A-
                      > > ChrY:6998665..6998665
                      > >
                      > > GRC009349
                      > > PAGES00083
                      > > A-
                      > > ChrY:13407488..13407488
                      > >
                      > > GRC009349
                      > > PAGES00093
                      > > G-
                      > > ChrY:13990829..13990829
                      > >
                      > > GRC009349
                      > > PAGES00104
                      > > A-
                      > > ChrY:21160725..21160725
                      > >
                      > > GRC009349
                      > > PAGES00106
                      > > C-
                      > > ChrY:20106098..20106098
                      > >
                      > > GRC009349
                      > > PAGES00107
                      > > T-
                      > > ChrY:20105838..20105838
                      > >
                      > > GRC009349
                      > > PAGES00116
                      > > C-
                      > > ChrY:20353252..20353252
                      > >
                      > > GRC009349
                      > > PAGES00117
                      > > T-
                      > > ChrY:20342318..20342318
                      > >
                      > > GRC009349
                      > > PAGES00119
                      > > T-
                      > > ChrY:20329316..20329316
                      > >
                      > > GRC009349
                      > > PAGES00121
                      > > G-
                      > > ChrY:16170780..16170780
                      > >
                      > > GRC009349
                      > > PAGES00123
                      > > G-
                      > > ChrY:13407777..13407777
                      > >
                      > > GRC009349
                      > > PK2
                      > > T-
                      > > ChrY:21078608..21078608
                      > >
                      > > GRC009349
                      > > PK3
                      > > T-
                      > > ChrY:21078913..21078913
                      > >
                      > > GRC009349
                      > > PK4
                      > > A-
                      > > ChrY:19745350..19745350
                      > >
                      > > GRC009349
                      > > SRY10831.1
                      > > C+
                      > > ChrY:2717176..2717176
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > > GRC009349
                      > > L124
                      > > T-
                      > > ChrY:16276156..16276156
                      > > 1
                      > >
                      > > GRC009349
                      > > L125
                      > > T-
                      > > ChrY:17269063..17269063
                      > > 1
                      > >
                      > > GRC009349
                      > > L126
                      > > T+
                      > > ChrY:13411027..13411027
                      > > 1
                      > >
                      > > GRC009349
                      > > L127
                      > > G-
                      > > ChrY:12798981..12798981
                      > > 1
                      > >
                      > > GRC009349
                      > > L128
                      > > T-
                      > > ChrY:13134262..13134262
                      > > 1
                      > >
                      > > GRC009349
                      > > L13
                      > > C-
                      > > ChrY:13208948..13208948
                      > > 1
                      > >
                      > > GRC009349
                      > > L130
                      > > G-
                      > > ChrY:6813503..6813503
                      > > 1
                      > >
                      > > GRC009349
                      > > L131
                      > > C-
                      > > ChrY:17882202..17882202
                      > > 1
                      > >
                      > > GRC009349
                      > > L132
                      > > C-
                      > > ChrY:15973591..15973591
                      > > 1
                      > >
                      > > GRC009349
                      > > L134
                      > > C-
                      > > ChrY:13360329..13360329
                      > > 1
                      > >
                      > > GRC009349
                      > > L135
                      > > C-
                      > > ChrY:13638642..13638642
                      > > 1
                      > >
                      > > GRC009349
                      > > L136
                      > > ins-
                      > > ChrY:7630823..7630823
                      > > 1
                      > >
                      > > GRC009349
                      > > L137
                      > > A+
                      > > ChrY:10401250..10401250
                      > > 1
                      > >
                      > > GRC009349
                      > > L138
                      > > A-
                      > > ChrY:2902214..2902214
                      > > 1
                      > >
                      > > GRC009349
                      > > L139
                      > > G-
                      > > ChrY:13981304..13981304
                      > > 1
                      > >
                      > > GRC009349
                      > > L14
                      > > C-
                      > > ChrY:21327383..21327383
                      > > 1
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > > That is interesting since I tested WTY back in 2007 and was negative for that one, but positive for PAGES00026
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > > My terminal SNP is L126/L137
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > > But maybe I am not following the conversation properly
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > > Jeffery W. Gibbon
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > > From: I-M223@yahoogroups.com [mailto:I-M223@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Wayne Roberts
                      > > Sent: Thursday, June 27, 2013 9:40 PM
                      > > To: I-M223 List
                      > > Subject: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > > Some good news from a Geno 2.0 test at last for the Isles Scots sector with a new SNP found derived yesterday for Taggart kit number N53563.
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > > He sent his Geno 2.0 raw data file through to Project administrators and on checking and comparison with some previous Isles Scots Geno 2.0 raw data files, he was found to be positive for the SNP - PAGES00052. The other Isles Scots members for which we have Geno 2.0 raw data, are all ancestral for PAGES00052 as are those from other M223 sectors for which we have Geno raw data.
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > > This highlights the importance of sending Administrators your Geno 2.0 raw data files to check if or when you have completed Geno 2.0 test results back.
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > > Please do not rush to order PAGES00052 as it is likely to only split off a small new branch from the rest of the L126+/L137+/L369+ Isles groups given that Bradford, Hemphill, Hokstad, McAllister, McCullough and Nesbitt are or appear to be negative for it. Those with a close Y-DNA match to Taggart are more likely to be positive. Taggart has a distinctive DYS395a-b = 14-15 in the 38 to 67 marker set. Gunning shares this same distinctive marker reading while some other close matches have only tested to 37 markers so their DYS395 is unknown. Whether this marker will tag those that are PAGES00052+ is uncertain at present.
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > > We will probably call for a few volunteers from Isles Scots, Irish and Limbo groups to test for PAGES00052 first to gauge the extent of this new branch. PAGES00052 is already in the FTDNA SNP order catalog so we do not have to wait for it to be listed.
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > > Please notify us first before you order.
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > > I-M223 Project team
                      > >
                      >
                    • Dora Smith
                      I appreciate their help too – just sometimes it seems to get too authoritarian and too up there. Dora From: Jørgen K. Kanters Sent: Sunday, June 30, 2013
                      Message 10 of 24 , Jun 30, 2013
                        I appreciate their help too – just sometimes it seems to get too authoritarian and too up there.
                         
                        Dora
                         
                         
                        Sent: Sunday, June 30, 2013 6:07 AM
                        Subject: Re: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member
                         
                         

                        No one needs permission. Everybody can order what he/she wants too. Seen from an experts viewpoint it may not be wise. Thats why wayne offers his help to give people his best advice to save their money. Sometimes there could be a conflict since the interest ofvthe group is not the same of the interest of the individual.
                         
                        Geno 2.0 is a good example. For the individual the chance is very low that something comes out of it, but when a lot of people do it, we find some interesting mutations which help us to come further.
                         
                        So thanks to Aaron and Wayne for helping us and for all their work of effort to help us 223's to get further
                         
                        Jorgen

                        Sendt fra min iPad

                        Den 29/06/2013 kl. 22.59 skrev "Dora Smith" <tiggernut24@...>:

                        Gee, Wayne, I’m tempted to order it just to prove I don’t need permission, but I’m really not flush at the moment, and I won’t be interested in it unless it proves to be something my McKinstrys are likely to carry, which at this moment it looks unlikely that they are.
                         
                        Does this Taggart guy have any idea exactly where in Galloway, or even if in Galloway, his ancestors lived?  I mean, like, my brother in law’s people must have lived within 20 miles of the Cree River throughout time.   His closest matches have weird names, like McArtor, McNeight, that kind of thing.  
                         
                        Dora
                         
                         
                        Sent: Thursday, June 27, 2013 8:40 PM
                        Subject: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member
                         
                         
                        Some good news from a Geno 2.0 test at last for the Isles Scots sector with a new SNP found derived yesterday for Taggart kit number N53563.
                         
                        He sent his Geno 2.0 raw data file through to Project administrators and on checking and comparison with some previous Isles Scots Geno 2.0 raw data files, he was found to be positive for the SNP - PAGES00052. The other Isles Scots members for which we have Geno 2.0 raw data, are all ancestral for PAGES00052 as are those from other M223 sectors for which we have Geno raw data.
                         
                        This highlights the importance of sending Administrators your Geno 2.0 raw data files to check if or when you have completed Geno 2.0 test results back.
                         
                        Please do not rush to order PAGES00052 as it is likely to only split off a small new branch from the rest of the L126+/L137+/L369+ Isles groups given that Bradford, Hemphill, Hokstad, McAllister, McCullough and Nesbitt are or appear to be negative for it. Those with a close Y-DNA match to Taggart are more likely to be positive. Taggart has a distinctive DYS395a-b = 14-15 in the 38 to 67 marker set. Gunning shares this same distinctive marker reading while some other close matches have only tested to 37 markers so their DYS395 is unknown. Whether this marker will tag those that are PAGES00052+ is uncertain at present.
                         
                        We will probably call for a few volunteers from Isles Scots, Irish and Limbo groups to test for PAGES00052 first to gauge the extent of this new branch. PAGES00052 is already in the FTDNA SNP order catalog so we do not have to wait for it to be listed.
                         
                        Please notify us first before you order.
                         
                        I-M223 Project team
                         
                         

                      • Jeff Gibbon
                        Hi Wayne, I have not done the Geno 2.0 and did not see any value in doing it since I did the WTY with FTDNA. I am not sure it would benefit me or uncover
                        Message 11 of 24 , Jul 1, 2013

                          Hi Wayne,

                           

                          I have not done the Geno 2.0 and did not see any value in doing it since I did the WTY with FTDNA.

                           

                          I am not sure it would benefit me or uncover anything not found with the WTY test, let me know if the two test different areas of the SNP tree,

                           

                          Jeff

                           

                          From: I-M223@yahoogroups.com [mailto:I-M223@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Wayne Roberts
                          Sent: Sunday, June 30, 2013 12:24 AM
                          To: I-M223@yahoogroups.com
                          Subject: Re: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member

                           




                          Hello Jeff,

                           

                          Thanks for your message. Because I was a somewhat late comer to the I-M223 Project, I am not aware of everyone that has done a WTY test or what their results were.

                           

                          I have checked up on PAGES00026 and everyone in I-M223 is positive for it so it is one of those positive SNPs that our Haplogroup has inherited.

                           

                          Jeff, you, like those Isles Scots members that have done Geno 2.0 and sent through their raw data to FTDNA and/or Project administrators, are PAGES00052 negative with the exception of Taggart of course.

                           

                          Gunning, a close Y-DNA match to Taggart, also did WTY but PAGES00052 was not tested or picked up. He has agreed to test for it and has since ordered PAGES00052. Thanks Bruce.

                           

                          This is probably a small branch off L126 which is why I asked L126+ members to notify us if they want to order it. It is not to give permission as Dora put it, but we do not want members wasting money on an SNP that will come back negative for them. We will be looking for candidates that have the best probability of a positive result. We require at least three positives to have it listed with ISOGG. Of course Dora is free as anyone else is to go ahead and order PAGES00052 to prove some sort of point.

                           

                          Thanks for everyone's interest.

                           

                          Wayne

                           

                          ----- Original Message -----

                          Sent: Sunday, June 30, 2013 3:40 AM

                          Subject: RE: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member

                           

                           

                          GRC009349

                          PAGES00019

                          G-

                          ChrY:20087688..20087688

                          GRC009349

                          PAGES00025

                          G-

                          ChrY:20104521..20104521

                          GRC009349

                          PAGES00026

                          A+

                          ChrY:20105584..20105584

                          GRC009349

                          PAGES00027

                          T-

                          ChrY:20106063..20106063

                          GRC009349

                          PAGES00052

                          T-

                          ChrY:2770309..2770309

                          GRC009349

                          PAGES00059

                          C-

                          ChrY:20329311..20329311

                          GRC009349

                          PAGES00068

                          C-

                          ChrY:16170772..16170772

                          GRC009349

                          PAGES00076

                          A-

                          ChrY:6998665..6998665

                          GRC009349

                          PAGES00083

                          A-

                          ChrY:13407488..13407488

                          GRC009349

                          PAGES00093

                          G-

                          ChrY:13990829..13990829

                          GRC009349

                          PAGES00104

                          A-

                          ChrY:21160725..21160725

                          GRC009349

                          PAGES00106

                          C-

                          ChrY:20106098..20106098

                          GRC009349

                          PAGES00107

                          T-

                          ChrY:20105838..20105838

                          GRC009349

                          PAGES00116

                          C-

                          ChrY:20353252..20353252

                          GRC009349

                          PAGES00117

                          T-

                          ChrY:20342318..20342318

                          GRC009349

                          PAGES00119

                          T-

                          ChrY:20329316..20329316

                          GRC009349

                          PAGES00121

                          G-

                          ChrY:16170780..16170780

                          GRC009349

                          PAGES00123

                          G-

                          ChrY:13407777..13407777

                          GRC009349

                          PK2

                          T-

                          ChrY:21078608..21078608

                          GRC009349

                          PK3

                          T-

                          ChrY:21078913..21078913

                          GRC009349

                          PK4

                          A-

                          ChrY:19745350..19745350

                          GRC009349

                          SRY10831.1

                          C+

                          ChrY:2717176..2717176

                           

                          GRC009349

                          L124

                          T-

                          ChrY:16276156..16276156

                          1

                          GRC009349

                          L125

                          T-

                          ChrY:17269063..17269063

                          1

                          GRC009349

                          L126

                          T+

                          ChrY:13411027..13411027

                          1

                          GRC009349

                          L127

                          G-

                          ChrY:12798981..12798981

                          1

                          GRC009349

                          L128

                          T-

                          ChrY:13134262..13134262

                          1

                          GRC009349

                          L13

                          C-

                          ChrY:13208948..13208948

                          1

                          GRC009349

                          L130

                          G-

                          ChrY:6813503..6813503

                          1

                          GRC009349

                          L131

                          C-

                          ChrY:17882202..17882202

                          1

                          GRC009349

                          L132

                          C-

                          ChrY:15973591..15973591

                          1

                          GRC009349

                          L134

                          C-

                          ChrY:13360329..13360329

                          1

                          GRC009349

                          L135

                          C-

                          ChrY:13638642..13638642

                          1

                          GRC009349

                          L136

                          ins-

                          ChrY:7630823..7630823

                          1

                          GRC009349

                          L137

                          A+

                          ChrY:10401250..10401250

                          1

                          GRC009349

                          L138

                          A-

                          ChrY:2902214..2902214

                          1

                          GRC009349

                          L139

                          G-

                          ChrY:13981304..13981304

                          1

                          GRC009349

                          L14

                          C-

                          ChrY:21327383..21327383

                          1

                          That is interesting since I tested WTY back in 2007 and was negative for that one, but positive for PAGES00026

                          My terminal SNP is L126/L137

                          But maybe I am not following the conversation properly

                          Jeffery W. Gibbon

                          From: I-M223@yahoogroups.com [mailto:I-M223@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Wayne Roberts
                          Sent: Thursday, June 27, 2013 9:40 PM
                          To: I-M223 List
                          Subject: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member





                          Some good news from a Geno 2.0 test at last for the Isles Scots sector with a new SNP found derived yesterday for Taggart kit number N53563.

                          He sent his Geno 2.0 raw data file through to Project administrators and on checking and comparison with some previous Isles Scots Geno 2.0 raw data files, he was found to be positive for the SNP - PAGES00052. The other Isles Scots members for which we have Geno 2.0 raw data, are all ancestral for PAGES00052 as are those from other M223 sectors for which we have Geno raw data.

                          This highlights the importance of sending Administrators your Geno 2.0 raw data files to check if or when you have completed Geno 2.0 test results back.

                          Please do not rush to order PAGES00052 as it is likely to only split off a small new branch from the rest of the L126+/L137+/L369+ Isles groups given that Bradford, Hemphill, Hokstad, McAllister, McCullough and Nesbitt are or appear to be negative for it. Those with a close Y-DNA match to Taggart are more likely to be positive. Taggart has a distinctive DYS395a-b = 14-15 in the 38 to 67 marker set. Gunning shares this same distinctive marker reading while some other close matches have only tested to 37 markers so their DYS395 is unknown. Whether this marker will tag those that are PAGES00052+ is uncertain at present.

                          We will probably call for a few volunteers from Isles Scots, Irish and Limbo groups to test for PAGES00052 first to gauge the extent of this new branch. PAGES00052 is already in the FTDNA SNP order catalog so we do not have to wait for it to be listed.

                          Please notify us first before you order.

                          I-M223 Project team








                        • Dora Smith
                          I’m not sure whether it would find anything not found in Walk the Y, either. However just so you know, Walk the Y covers a very small portion of the Y
                          Message 12 of 24 , Jul 1, 2013
                            I’m not sure whether it would find anything not found in Walk the Y, either.  However just so you know, Walk the Y covers a very small portion of the Y chromosome, even the new version which probably covers far more, and a different part of the chromosome, then what you previously did.
                             
                            I’m thinking get a complete sequence from a company that does them, myself. 
                             
                            Dora
                             
                            Sent: Monday, July 01, 2013 1:04 PM
                            Subject: RE: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member
                             
                             

                            Hi Wayne,

                            I have not done the Geno 2.0 and did not see any value in doing it since I did the WTY with FTDNA.

                            I am not sure it would benefit me or uncover anything not found with the WTY test, let me know if the two test different areas of the SNP tree,

                            Jeff

                            From: I-M223@yahoogroups.com [mailto:I-M223@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Wayne Roberts
                            Sent: Sunday, June 30, 2013 12:24 AM
                            To: I-M223@yahoogroups.com
                            Subject: Re: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member




                            Hello Jeff,

                            Thanks for your message. Because I was a somewhat late comer to the I-M223 Project, I am not aware of everyone that has done a WTY test or what their results were.

                            I have checked up on PAGES00026 and everyone in I-M223 is positive for it so it is one of those positive SNPs that our Haplogroup has inherited.

                            Jeff, you, like those Isles Scots members that have done Geno 2.0 and sent through their raw data to FTDNA and/or Project administrators, are PAGES00052 negative with the exception of Taggart of course.

                            Gunning, a close Y-DNA match to Taggart, also did WTY but PAGES00052 was not tested or picked up. He has agreed to test for it and has since ordered PAGES00052. Thanks Bruce.

                            This is probably a small branch off L126 which is why I asked L126+ members to notify us if they want to order it. It is not to give permission as Dora put it, but we do not want members wasting money on an SNP that will come back negative for them. We will be looking for candidates that have the best probability of a positive result. We require at least three positives to have it listed with ISOGG. Of course Dora is free as anyone else is to go ahead and order PAGES00052 to prove some sort of point.

                            Thanks for everyone's interest.

                            Wayne

                            ----- Original Message -----

                            Sent: Sunday, June 30, 2013 3:40 AM

                            Subject: RE: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member

                             

                            GRC009349

                            PAGES00019

                            G-

                            ChrY:20087688..20087688

                            GRC009349

                            PAGES00025

                            G-

                            ChrY:20104521..20104521

                            GRC009349

                            PAGES00026

                            A+

                            ChrY:20105584..20105584

                            GRC009349

                            PAGES00027

                            T-

                            ChrY:20106063..20106063

                            GRC009349

                            PAGES00052

                            T-

                            ChrY:2770309..2770309

                            GRC009349

                            PAGES00059

                            C-

                            ChrY:20329311..20329311

                            GRC009349

                            PAGES00068

                            C-

                            ChrY:16170772..16170772

                            GRC009349

                            PAGES00076

                            A-

                            ChrY:6998665..6998665

                            GRC009349

                            PAGES00083

                            A-

                            ChrY:13407488..13407488

                            GRC009349

                            PAGES00093

                            G-

                            ChrY:13990829..13990829

                            GRC009349

                            PAGES00104

                            A-

                            ChrY:21160725..21160725

                            GRC009349

                            PAGES00106

                            C-

                            ChrY:20106098..20106098

                            GRC009349

                            PAGES00107

                            T-

                            ChrY:20105838..20105838

                            GRC009349

                            PAGES00116

                            C-

                            ChrY:20353252..20353252

                            GRC009349

                            PAGES00117

                            T-

                            ChrY:20342318..20342318

                            GRC009349

                            PAGES00119

                            T-

                            ChrY:20329316..20329316

                            GRC009349

                            PAGES00121

                            G-

                            ChrY:16170780..16170780

                            GRC009349

                            PAGES00123

                            G-

                            ChrY:13407777..13407777

                            GRC009349

                            PK2

                            T-

                            ChrY:21078608..21078608

                            GRC009349

                            PK3

                            T-

                            ChrY:21078913..21078913

                            GRC009349

                            PK4

                            A-

                            ChrY:19745350..19745350

                            GRC009349

                            SRY10831.1

                            C+

                            ChrY:2717176..2717176

                            GRC009349

                            L124

                            T-

                            ChrY:16276156..16276156

                            1

                            GRC009349

                            L125

                            T-

                            ChrY:17269063..17269063

                            1

                            GRC009349

                            L126

                            T+

                            ChrY:13411027..13411027

                            1

                            GRC009349

                            L127

                            G-

                            ChrY:12798981..12798981

                            1

                            GRC009349

                            L128

                            T-

                            ChrY:13134262..13134262

                            1

                            GRC009349

                            L13

                            C-

                            ChrY:13208948..13208948

                            1

                            GRC009349

                            L130

                            G-

                            ChrY:6813503..6813503

                            1

                            GRC009349

                            L131

                            C-

                            ChrY:17882202..17882202

                            1

                            GRC009349

                            L132

                            C-

                            ChrY:15973591..15973591

                            1

                            GRC009349

                            L134

                            C-

                            ChrY:13360329..13360329

                            1

                            GRC009349

                            L135

                            C-

                            ChrY:13638642..13638642

                            1

                            GRC009349

                            L136

                            ins-

                            ChrY:7630823..7630823

                            1

                            GRC009349

                            L137

                            A+

                            ChrY:10401250..10401250

                            1

                            GRC009349

                            L138

                            A-

                            ChrY:2902214..2902214

                            1

                            GRC009349

                            L139

                            G-

                            ChrY:13981304..13981304

                            1

                            GRC009349

                            L14

                            C-

                            ChrY:21327383..21327383

                            1

                            That is interesting since I tested WTY back in 2007 and was negative for that one, but positive for PAGES00026

                            My terminal SNP is L126/L137

                            But maybe I am not following the conversation properly

                            Jeffery W. Gibbon

                            From: I-M223@yahoogroups.com [mailto:I-M223@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Wayne Roberts
                            Sent: Thursday, June 27, 2013 9:40 PM
                            To: I-M223 List
                            Subject: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member





                            Some good news from a Geno 2.0 test at last for the Isles Scots sector with a new SNP found derived yesterday for Taggart kit number N53563.

                            He sent his Geno 2.0 raw data file through to Project administrators and on checking and comparison with some previous Isles Scots Geno 2.0 raw data files, he was found to be positive for the SNP - PAGES00052. The other Isles Scots members for which we have Geno 2.0 raw data, are all ancestral for PAGES00052 as are those from other M223 sectors for which we have Geno raw data.

                            This highlights the importance of sending Administrators your Geno 2.0 raw data files to check if or when you have completed Geno 2.0 test results back.

                            Please do not rush to order PAGES00052 as it is likely to only split off a small new branch from the rest of the L126+/L137+/L369+ Isles groups given that Bradford, Hemphill, Hokstad, McAllister, McCullough and Nesbitt are or appear to be negative for it. Those with a close Y-DNA match to Taggart are more likely to be positive. Taggart has a distinctive DYS395a-b = 14-15 in the 38 to 67 marker set. Gunning shares this same distinctive marker reading while some other close matches have only tested to 37 markers so their DYS395 is unknown. Whether this marker will tag those that are PAGES00052+ is uncertain at present.

                            We will probably call for a few volunteers from Isles Scots, Irish and Limbo groups to test for PAGES00052 first to gauge the extent of this new branch. PAGES00052 is already in the FTDNA SNP order catalog so we do not have to wait for it to be listed.

                            Please notify us first before you order.

                            I-M223 Project team








                          • Wayne Roberts
                            Hello Jeff, Like Dora said, Geno 2.0 would have given little value to you in your Y-DNA. As I have said before, Geno 2.0 leaves Roots, Isles, L1228 and basic
                            Message 13 of 24 , Jul 1, 2013
                              Hello Jeff,
                               
                              Like Dora said, Geno 2.0 would have given little value to you in your Y-DNA. As I have said before, Geno 2.0 leaves Roots, Isles, L1228 and basic M223 sectors out in the cold. Taggart is a rare exception. It has been good for some of the Continental sectors. I chose to not do Geno 2.0 and did WTY. That did not even find my already known Z2054 to Z2102 group positives. I have chosen to do the full Y genome now and just waiting on a kit to arrive.
                               
                              Wayne
                               
                              ----- Original Message -----
                              Sent: Tuesday, July 02, 2013 4:04 AM
                              Subject: RE: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member

                               

                              Hi Wayne,

                              I have not done the Geno 2.0 and did not see any value in doing it since I did the WTY with FTDNA.

                              I am not sure it would benefit me or uncover anything not found with the WTY test, let me know if the two test different areas of the SNP tree,

                              Jeff

                              From: I-M223@yahoogroups.com [mailto:I-M223@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Wayne Roberts
                              Sent: Sunday, June 30, 2013 12:24 AM
                              To: I-M223@yahoogroups.com
                              Subject: Re: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member




                              Hello Jeff,

                              Thanks for your message. Because I was a somewhat late comer to the I-M223 Project, I am not aware of everyone that has done a WTY test or what their results were.

                              I have checked up on PAGES00026 and everyone in I-M223 is positive for it so it is one of those positive SNPs that our Haplogroup has inherited.

                              Jeff, you, like those Isles Scots members that have done Geno 2.0 and sent through their raw data to FTDNA and/or Project administrators, are PAGES00052 negative with the exception of Taggart of course.

                              Gunning, a close Y-DNA match to Taggart, also did WTY but PAGES00052 was not tested or picked up. He has agreed to test for it and has since ordered PAGES00052. Thanks Bruce.

                              This is probably a small branch off L126 which is why I asked L126+ members to notify us if they want to order it. It is not to give permission as Dora put it, but we do not want members wasting money on an SNP that will come back negative for them. We will be looking for candidates that have the best probability of a positive result. We require at least three positives to have it listed with ISOGG. Of course Dora is free as anyone else is to go ahead and order PAGES00052 to prove some sort of point.

                              Thanks for everyone's interest.

                              Wayne

                              ----- Original Message -----

                              Sent: Sunday, June 30, 2013 3:40 AM

                              Subject: RE: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member

                               

                              GRC009349

                              PAGES00019

                              G-

                              ChrY:20087688..20087688

                              GRC009349

                              PAGES00025

                              G-

                              ChrY:20104521..20104521

                              GRC009349

                              PAGES00026

                              A+

                              ChrY:20105584..20105584

                              GRC009349

                              PAGES00027

                              T-

                              ChrY:20106063..20106063

                              GRC009349

                              PAGES00052

                              T-

                              ChrY:2770309..2770309

                              GRC009349

                              PAGES00059

                              C-

                              ChrY:20329311..20329311

                              GRC009349

                              PAGES00068

                              C-

                              ChrY:16170772..16170772

                              GRC009349

                              PAGES00076

                              A-

                              ChrY:6998665..6998665

                              GRC009349

                              PAGES00083

                              A-

                              ChrY:13407488..13407488

                              GRC009349

                              PAGES00093

                              G-

                              ChrY:13990829..13990829

                              GRC009349

                              PAGES00104

                              A-

                              ChrY:21160725..21160725

                              GRC009349

                              PAGES00106

                              C-

                              ChrY:20106098..20106098

                              GRC009349

                              PAGES00107

                              T-

                              ChrY:20105838..20105838

                              GRC009349

                              PAGES00116

                              C-

                              ChrY:20353252..20353252

                              GRC009349

                              PAGES00117

                              T-

                              ChrY:20342318..20342318

                              GRC009349

                              PAGES00119

                              T-

                              ChrY:20329316..20329316

                              GRC009349

                              PAGES00121

                              G-

                              ChrY:16170780..16170780

                              GRC009349

                              PAGES00123

                              G-

                              ChrY:13407777..13407777

                              GRC009349

                              PK2

                              T-

                              ChrY:21078608..21078608

                              GRC009349

                              PK3

                              T-

                              ChrY:21078913..21078913

                              GRC009349

                              PK4

                              A-

                              ChrY:19745350..19745350

                              GRC009349

                              SRY10831.1

                              C+

                              ChrY:2717176..2717176

                              GRC009349

                              L124

                              T-

                              ChrY:16276156..16276156

                              1

                              GRC009349

                              L125

                              T-

                              ChrY:17269063..17269063

                              1

                              GRC009349

                              L126

                              T+

                              ChrY:13411027..13411027

                              1

                              GRC009349

                              L127

                              G-

                              ChrY:12798981..12798981

                              1

                              GRC009349

                              L128

                              T-

                              ChrY:13134262..13134262

                              1

                              GRC009349

                              L13

                              C-

                              ChrY:13208948..13208948

                              1

                              GRC009349

                              L130

                              G-

                              ChrY:6813503..6813503

                              1

                              GRC009349

                              L131

                              C-

                              ChrY:17882202..17882202

                              1

                              GRC009349

                              L132

                              C-

                              ChrY:15973591..15973591

                              1

                              GRC009349

                              L134

                              C-

                              ChrY:13360329..13360329

                              1

                              GRC009349

                              L135

                              C-

                              ChrY:13638642..13638642

                              1

                              GRC009349

                              L136

                              ins-

                              ChrY:7630823..7630823

                              1

                              GRC009349

                              L137

                              A+

                              ChrY:10401250..10401250

                              1

                              GRC009349

                              L138

                              A-

                              ChrY:2902214..2902214

                              1

                              GRC009349

                              L139

                              G-

                              ChrY:13981304..13981304

                              1

                              GRC009349

                              L14

                              C-

                              ChrY:21327383..21327383

                              1

                              That is interesting since I tested WTY back in 2007 and was negative for that one, but positive for PAGES00026

                              My terminal SNP is L126/L137

                              But maybe I am not following the conversation properly

                              Jeffery W. Gibbon

                              From: I-M223@yahoogroups.com [mailto:I-M223@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Wayne Roberts
                              Sent: Thursday, June 27, 2013 9:40 PM
                              To: I-M223 List
                              Subject: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member





                              Some good news from a Geno 2.0 test at last for the Isles Scots sector with a new SNP found derived yesterday for Taggart kit number N53563.

                              He sent his Geno 2.0 raw data file through to Project administrators and on checking and comparison with some previous Isles Scots Geno 2.0 raw data files, he was found to be positive for the SNP - PAGES00052. The other Isles Scots members for which we have Geno 2.0 raw data, are all ancestral for PAGES00052 as are those from other M223 sectors for which we have Geno raw data.

                              This highlights the importance of sending Administrators your Geno 2.0 raw data files to check if or when you have completed Geno 2.0 test results back.

                              Please do not rush to order PAGES00052 as it is likely to only split off a small new branch from the rest of the L126+/L137+/L369+ Isles groups given that Bradford, Hemphill, Hokstad, McAllister, McCullough and Nesbitt are or appear to be negative for it. Those with a close Y-DNA match to Taggart are more likely to be positive. Taggart has a distinctive DYS395a-b = 14-15 in the 38 to 67 marker set. Gunning shares this same distinctive marker reading while some other close matches have only tested to 37 markers so their DYS395 is unknown. Whether this marker will tag those that are PAGES00052+ is uncertain at present.

                              We will probably call for a few volunteers from Isles Scots, Irish and Limbo groups to test for PAGES00052 first to gauge the extent of this new branch. PAGES00052 is already in the FTDNA SNP order catalog so we do not have to wait for it to be listed.

                              Please notify us first before you order.

                              I-M223 Project team








                            • Jeff Gibbon
                              Thanks Dora, Is there any company that does a complete sequencing? Seems to me it is more profitable for them to do a little here and a little there and then
                              Message 14 of 24 , Jul 1, 2013

                                Thanks Dora,

                                 

                                Is there any company that does a complete sequencing? Seems to me it is more profitable for them to do a little here and a little there and then change it to get you to pay more.

                                 

                                Jeff

                                 

                                 

                                From: I-M223@yahoogroups.com [mailto:I-M223@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Dora Smith
                                Sent: Monday, July 01, 2013 7:13 PM
                                To: I-M223@yahoogroups.com
                                Subject: Re: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member

                                 




                                I’m not sure whether it would find anything not found in Walk the Y, either.  However just so you know, Walk the Y covers a very small portion of the Y chromosome, even the new version which probably covers far more, and a different part of the chromosome, then what you previously did.

                                 

                                I’m thinking get a complete sequence from a company that does them, myself. 

                                 

                                Dora

                                 

                                Sent: Monday, July 01, 2013 1:04 PM

                                Subject: RE: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member

                                 

                                 

                                Hi Wayne,

                                I have not done the Geno 2.0 and did not see any value in doing it since I did the WTY with FTDNA.

                                I am not sure it would benefit me or uncover anything not found with the WTY test, let me know if the two test different areas of the SNP tree,

                                Jeff

                                From: I-M223@yahoogroups.com [mailto:I-M223@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Wayne Roberts
                                Sent: Sunday, June 30, 2013 12:24 AM
                                To: I-M223@yahoogroups.com
                                Subject: Re: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member





                                Hello Jeff,

                                Thanks for your message. Because I was a somewhat late comer to the I-M223 Project, I am not aware of everyone that has done a WTY test or what their results were.

                                I have checked up on PAGES00026 and everyone in I-M223 is positive for it so it is one of those positive SNPs that our Haplogroup has inherited.

                                Jeff, you, like those Isles Scots members that have done Geno 2.0 and sent through their raw data to FTDNA and/or Project administrators, are PAGES00052 negative with the exception of Taggart of course.

                                Gunning, a close Y-DNA match to Taggart, also did WTY but PAGES00052 was not tested or picked up. He has agreed to test for it and has since ordered PAGES00052. Thanks Bruce.

                                This is probably a small branch off L126 which is why I asked L126+ members to notify us if they want to order it. It is not to give permission as Dora put it, but we do not want members wasting money on an SNP that will come back negative for them. We will be looking for candidates that have the best probability of a positive result. We require at least three positives to have it listed with ISOGG. Of course Dora is free as anyone else is to go ahead and order PAGES00052 to prove some sort of point.

                                Thanks for everyone's interest.

                                Wayne

                                ----- Original Message -----

                                Sent: Sunday, June 30, 2013 3:40 AM

                                Subject: RE: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member

                                 

                                GRC009349

                                PAGES00019

                                G-

                                ChrY:20087688..20087688

                                GRC009349

                                PAGES00025

                                G-

                                ChrY:20104521..20104521

                                GRC009349

                                PAGES00026

                                A+

                                ChrY:20105584..20105584

                                GRC009349

                                PAGES00027

                                T-

                                ChrY:20106063..20106063

                                GRC009349

                                PAGES00052

                                T-

                                ChrY:2770309..2770309

                                GRC009349

                                PAGES00059

                                C-

                                ChrY:20329311..20329311

                                GRC009349

                                PAGES00068

                                C-

                                ChrY:16170772..16170772

                                GRC009349

                                PAGES00076

                                A-

                                ChrY:6998665..6998665

                                GRC009349

                                PAGES00083

                                A-

                                ChrY:13407488..13407488

                                GRC009349

                                PAGES00093

                                G-

                                ChrY:13990829..13990829

                                GRC009349

                                PAGES00104

                                A-

                                ChrY:21160725..21160725

                                GRC009349

                                PAGES00106

                                C-

                                ChrY:20106098..20106098

                                GRC009349

                                PAGES00107

                                T-

                                ChrY:20105838..20105838

                                GRC009349

                                PAGES00116

                                C-

                                ChrY:20353252..20353252

                                GRC009349

                                PAGES00117

                                T-

                                ChrY:20342318..20342318

                                GRC009349

                                PAGES00119

                                T-

                                ChrY:20329316..20329316

                                GRC009349

                                PAGES00121

                                G-

                                ChrY:16170780..16170780

                                GRC009349

                                PAGES00123

                                G-

                                ChrY:13407777..13407777

                                GRC009349

                                PK2

                                T-

                                ChrY:21078608..21078608

                                GRC009349

                                PK3

                                T-

                                ChrY:21078913..21078913

                                GRC009349

                                PK4

                                A-

                                ChrY:19745350..19745350

                                GRC009349

                                SRY10831.1

                                C+

                                ChrY:2717176..2717176

                                 

                                GRC009349

                                L124

                                T-

                                ChrY:16276156..16276156

                                1

                                GRC009349

                                L125

                                T-

                                ChrY:17269063..17269063

                                1

                                GRC009349

                                L126

                                T+

                                ChrY:13411027..13411027

                                1

                                GRC009349

                                L127

                                G-

                                ChrY:12798981..12798981

                                1

                                GRC009349

                                L128

                                T-

                                ChrY:13134262..13134262

                                1

                                GRC009349

                                L13

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                                ins-

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                                (Message over 64 KB, truncated)
                              • Dora Smith
                                Yes, there’s one, but it’s new, and the people running it seem to specialize more in startup than anything else, so I myself am waiting ot see. I
                                Message 15 of 24 , Jul 1, 2013
                                  Yes, there’s one, but it’s new, and the people running it seem to specialize more in startup than anything else, so I myself am waiting ot see.    I thought there were others but I can’t find them offhand.
                                   
                                  Dora
                                   
                                   
                                  Sent: Monday, July 01, 2013 7:15 PM
                                  Subject: RE: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member
                                   
                                   

                                  Thanks Dora,

                                  Is there any company that does a complete sequencing? Seems to me it is more profitable for them to do a little here and a little there and then change it to get you to pay more.

                                  Jeff

                                  From: I-M223@yahoogroups.com [mailto:I-M223@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Dora Smith
                                  Sent: Monday, July 01, 2013 7:13 PM
                                  To: I-M223@yahoogroups.com
                                  Subject: Re: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member




                                  I’m not sure whether it would find anything not found in Walk the Y, either.  However just so you know, Walk the Y covers a very small portion of the Y chromosome, even the new version which probably covers far more, and a different part of the chromosome, then what you previously did.

                                  I’m thinking get a complete sequence from a company that does them, myself. 

                                  Dora

                                  Sent: Monday, July 01, 2013 1:04 PM

                                  Subject: RE: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member

                                   

                                  Hi Wayne,

                                  I have not done the Geno 2.0 and did not see any value in doing it since I did the WTY with FTDNA.

                                  I am not sure it would benefit me or uncover anything not found with the WTY test, let me know if the two test different areas of the SNP tree,

                                  Jeff

                                  From: I-M223@yahoogroups.com [mailto:I-M223@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Wayne Roberts
                                  Sent: Sunday, June 30, 2013 12:24 AM
                                  To: I-M223@yahoogroups.com
                                  Subject: Re: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member





                                  Hello Jeff,

                                  Thanks for your message. Because I was a somewhat late comer to the I-M223 Project, I am not aware of everyone that has done a WTY test or what their results were.

                                  I have checked up on PAGES00026 and everyone in I-M223 is positive for it so it is one of those positive SNPs that our Haplogroup has inherited.

                                  Jeff, you, like those Isles Scots members that have done Geno 2.0 and sent through their raw data to FTDNA and/or Project administrators, are PAGES00052 negative with the exception of Taggart of course.

                                  Gunning, a close Y-DNA match to Taggart, also did WTY but PAGES00052 was not tested or picked up. He has agreed to test for it and has since ordered PAGES00052. Thanks Bruce.

                                  This is probably a small branch off L126 which is why I asked L126+ members to notify us if they want to order it. It is not to give permission as Dora put it, but we do not want members wasting money on an SNP that will come back negative for them. We will be looking for candidates that have the best probability of a positive result. We require at least three positives to have it listed with ISOGG. Of course Dora is free as anyone else is to go ahead and order PAGES00052 to prove some sort of point.

                                  Thanks for everyone's interest.

                                  Wayne

                                  ----- Original Message -----

                                  Sent: Sunday, June 30, 2013 3:40 AM

                                  Subject: RE: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member

                                   

                                  GRC009349

                                  PAGES00019

                                  G-

                                  ChrY:20087688..20087688

                                  GRC009349

                                  PAGES00025

                                  G-

                                  ChrY:20104521..20104521

                                  GRC009349

                                  PAGES00026

                                  A+

                                  ChrY:20105584..20105584

                                  GRC009349

                                  PAGES00027

                                  T-

                                  ChrY:20106063..20106063

                                  GRC009349

                                  PAGES00052

                                  T-

                                  ChrY:2770309..2770309

                                  GRC009349

                                  PAGES00059

                                  C-

                                  ChrY:20329311..20329311

                                  GRC009349

                                  PAGES00068

                                  C-

                                  ChrY:16170772..16170772

                                  GRC009349

                                  PAGES00076

                                  A-

                                  ChrY:6998665..6998665

                                  GRC009349

                                  PAGES00083

                                  A-

                                  ChrY:13407488..13407488

                                  GRC009349

                                  PAGES00093

                                  G-

                                  ChrY:13990829..13990829

                                  GRC009349

                                  PAGES00104

                                  A-

                                  ChrY:21160725..21160725

                                  GRC009349

                                  PAGES00106

                                  C-

                                  ChrY:20106098..20106098

                                  GRC009349

                                  PAGES00107

                                  T-

                                  ChrY:20105838..20105838

                                  GRC009349

                                  PAGES00116

                                  C-

                                  ChrY:20353252..20353252

                                  GRC009349

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                                  T-

                                  ChrY:20342318..20342318

                                  GRC009349

                                  PAGES00119

                                  T-

                                  ChrY:20329316..20329316

                                  GRC009349

                                  PAGES00121

                                  G-

                                  ChrY:16170780..16170780

                                  GRC009349

                                  PAGES00123

                                  G-

                                  ChrY:13407777..13407777

                                  GRC009349

                                  PK2

                                  T-

                                  ChrY:21078608..21078608

                                  GRC009349

                                  PK3

                                  T-

                                  ChrY:21078913..21078913

                                  GRC009349

                                  PK4

                                  A-

                                  ChrY:19745350..19745350

                                  GRC009349

                                  SRY10831.1

                                  C+

                                  ChrY:2717176..2717176

                                  GRC009349

                                  L124

                                  T-

                                  ChrY:16276156..16276156

                                  1

                                  GRC009349

                                  L125

                                  T-

                                  ChrY:17269063..17269063

                                  1

                                  GRC009349

                                  L126

                                  T+

                                  ChrY:13411027..13411027

                                  1

                                  GRC009349

                                  L127

                                  G-

                                  ChrY:12798981..12798981

                                  1

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                                  T-

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                                  1

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                                  ins-

                                  ChrY:7630823..7630823

                                  1

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                                  A+

                                  ChrY:10401250..10401250

                                  1

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                                  1

                                  That is interesting since I tested WTY back in 2007 and was negative for that one, but positive for PAGES00026

                                  My terminal SNP is L126/L137

                                  But maybe I am not following the conversation properly

                                  Jeffery W. Gibbon

                                  From: I-M223@yahoogroups.com [mailto:I-M223@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Wayne Roberts
                                  Sent: Thursday, June 27, 2013 9:40 PM
                                  To: I-M223 List
                                  Subject: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member






                                  Some good news from a Geno 2.0 test at last for the Isles Scots sector with a new SNP found derived yesterday for Taggart kit number N53563.

                                  He sent his Geno 2.0 raw data file through to Project administrators and on checking and comparison with some previous Isles Scots Geno 2.0 raw data files, he was found to be positive for the SNP - PAGES00052. The other Isles Scots members for which we have Geno 2.0 raw data, are all ancestral for PAGES00052 as are those from other M223 sectors for which we have Geno raw data.

                                  This highlights the importance of sending Administrators your Geno 2.0 raw data files to check if or when you have completed Geno 2.0 test results back.

                                  Please do not rush to order PAGES00052 as it is likely to only split off a small new branch from the rest of the L126+/L137+/L369+ Isles groups given that Bradford, Hemphill, Hokstad, McAllister, McCullough and Nesbitt are or appear to be negative for it. Those with a close Y-DNA match to Taggart are more likely to be positive. Taggart has a distinctive DYS395a-b = 14-15 in the 38 to 67 marker set. Gunning shares this same distinctive marker reading while some other close matches have only tested to 37 markers so their DYS395 is unknown. Whether this marker will tag those that are PAGES00052+ is uncertain at present.

                                  We will probably call for a few volunteers from Isles Scots, Irish and Limbo groups to test for PAGES00052 first to gauge the extent of this new branch. PAGES00052 is already in the FTDNA SNP order catalog so we do not have to wait for it to be listed.

                                  Please notify us first before you order.

                                  I-M223 Project team













                                • Dora Smith
                                  Wayne doesn’t say and I can’t recall the name offhand, but I bet he’s dealing with that new company I mentioned. The timing is right – a bunch of
                                  Message 16 of 24 , Jul 1, 2013
                                    Wayne doesn’t say and I can’t recall the name offhand, but I bet he’s dealing with that new company I mentioned.  The timing is right – a bunch of people have ordered tests from them.
                                     
                                    Dora
                                     
                                     
                                    Sent: Monday, July 01, 2013 6:53 PM
                                    Subject: Re: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member
                                     
                                     

                                    Hello Jeff,
                                     
                                    Like Dora said, Geno 2.0 would have given little value to you in your Y-DNA. As I have said before, Geno 2.0 leaves Roots, Isles, L1228 and basic M223 sectors out in the cold. Taggart is a rare exception. It has been good for some of the Continental sectors. I chose to not do Geno 2.0 and did WTY. That did not even find my already known Z2054 to Z2102 group positives. I have chosen to do the full Y genome now and just waiting on a kit to arrive.
                                     
                                    Wayne
                                     
                                    ----- Original Message -----
                                    Sent: Tuesday, July 02, 2013 4:04 AM
                                    Subject: RE: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member
                                     
                                     

                                    Hi Wayne,

                                    I have not done the Geno 2.0 and did not see any value in doing it since I did the WTY with FTDNA.

                                    I am not sure it would benefit me or uncover anything not found with the WTY test, let me know if the two test different areas of the SNP tree,

                                    Jeff

                                    From: I-M223@yahoogroups.com [mailto:I-M223@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Wayne Roberts
                                    Sent: Sunday, June 30, 2013 12:24 AM
                                    To: I-M223@yahoogroups.com
                                    Subject: Re: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member




                                    Hello Jeff,

                                    Thanks for your message. Because I was a somewhat late comer to the I-M223 Project, I am not aware of everyone that has done a WTY test or what their results were.

                                    I have checked up on PAGES00026 and everyone in I-M223 is positive for it so it is one of those positive SNPs that our Haplogroup has inherited.

                                    Jeff, you, like those Isles Scots members that have done Geno 2.0 and sent through their raw data to FTDNA and/or Project administrators, are PAGES00052 negative with the exception of Taggart of course.

                                    Gunning, a close Y-DNA match to Taggart, also did WTY but PAGES00052 was not tested or picked up. He has agreed to test for it and has since ordered PAGES00052. Thanks Bruce.

                                    This is probably a small branch off L126 which is why I asked L126+ members to notify us if they want to order it. It is not to give permission as Dora put it, but we do not want members wasting money on an SNP that will come back negative for them. We will be looking for candidates that have the best probability of a positive result. We require at least three positives to have it listed with ISOGG. Of course Dora is free as anyone else is to go ahead and order PAGES00052 to prove some sort of point.

                                    Thanks for everyone's interest.

                                    Wayne

                                    ----- Original Message -----

                                    Sent: Sunday, June 30, 2013 3:40 AM

                                    Subject: RE: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member

                                     

                                    GRC009349

                                    PAGES00019

                                    G-

                                    ChrY:20087688..20087688

                                    GRC009349

                                    PAGES00025

                                    G-

                                    ChrY:20104521..20104521

                                    GRC009349

                                    PAGES00026

                                    A+

                                    ChrY:20105584..20105584

                                    GRC009349

                                    PAGES00027

                                    T-

                                    ChrY:20106063..20106063

                                    GRC009349

                                    PAGES00052

                                    T-

                                    ChrY:2770309..2770309

                                    GRC009349

                                    PAGES00059

                                    C-

                                    ChrY:20329311..20329311

                                    GRC009349

                                    PAGES00068

                                    C-

                                    ChrY:16170772..16170772

                                    GRC009349

                                    PAGES00076

                                    A-

                                    ChrY:6998665..6998665

                                    GRC009349

                                    PAGES00083

                                    A-

                                    ChrY:13407488..13407488

                                    GRC009349

                                    PAGES00093

                                    G-

                                    ChrY:13990829..13990829

                                    GRC009349

                                    PAGES00104

                                    A-

                                    ChrY:21160725..21160725

                                    GRC009349

                                    PAGES00106

                                    C-

                                    ChrY:20106098..20106098

                                    GRC009349

                                    PAGES00107

                                    T-

                                    ChrY:20105838..20105838

                                    GRC009349

                                    PAGES00116

                                    C-

                                    ChrY:20353252..20353252

                                    GRC009349

                                    PAGES00117

                                    T-

                                    ChrY:20342318..20342318

                                    GRC009349

                                    PAGES00119

                                    T-

                                    ChrY:20329316..20329316

                                    GRC009349

                                    PAGES00121

                                    G-

                                    ChrY:16170780..16170780

                                    GRC009349

                                    PAGES00123

                                    G-

                                    ChrY:13407777..13407777

                                    GRC009349

                                    PK2

                                    T-

                                    ChrY:21078608..21078608

                                    GRC009349

                                    PK3

                                    T-

                                    ChrY:21078913..21078913

                                    GRC009349

                                    PK4

                                    A-

                                    ChrY:19745350..19745350

                                    GRC009349

                                    SRY10831.1

                                    C+

                                    ChrY:2717176..2717176

                                    GRC009349

                                    L124

                                    T-

                                    ChrY:16276156..16276156

                                    1

                                    GRC009349

                                    L125

                                    T-

                                    ChrY:17269063..17269063

                                    1

                                    GRC009349

                                    L126

                                    T+

                                    ChrY:13411027..13411027

                                    1

                                    GRC009349

                                    L127

                                    G-

                                    ChrY:12798981..12798981

                                    1

                                    GRC009349

                                    L128

                                    T-

                                    ChrY:13134262..13134262

                                    1

                                    GRC009349

                                    L13

                                    C-

                                    ChrY:13208948..13208948

                                    1

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                                    G-

                                    ChrY:6813503..6813503

                                    1

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                                    C-

                                    ChrY:17882202..17882202

                                    1

                                    GRC009349

                                    L132

                                    C-

                                    ChrY:15973591..15973591

                                    1

                                    GRC009349

                                    L134

                                    C-

                                    ChrY:13360329..13360329

                                    1

                                    GRC009349

                                    L135

                                    C-

                                    ChrY:13638642..13638642

                                    1

                                    GRC009349

                                    L136

                                    ins-

                                    ChrY:7630823..7630823

                                    1

                                    GRC009349

                                    L137

                                    A+

                                    ChrY:10401250..10401250

                                    1

                                    GRC009349

                                    L138

                                    A-

                                    ChrY:2902214..2902214

                                    1

                                    GRC009349

                                    L139

                                    G-

                                    ChrY:13981304..13981304

                                    1

                                    GRC009349

                                    L14

                                    C-

                                    ChrY:21327383..21327383

                                    1

                                    That is interesting since I tested WTY back in 2007 and was negative for that one, but positive for PAGES00026

                                    My terminal SNP is L126/L137

                                    But maybe I am not following the conversation properly

                                    Jeffery W. Gibbon

                                    From: I-M223@yahoogroups.com [mailto:I-M223@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Wayne Roberts
                                    Sent: Thursday, June 27, 2013 9:40 PM
                                    To: I-M223 List
                                    Subject: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member





                                    Some good news from a Geno 2.0 test at last for the Isles Scots sector with a new SNP found derived yesterday for Taggart kit number N53563.

                                    He sent his Geno 2.0 raw data file through to Project administrators and on checking and comparison with some previous Isles Scots Geno 2.0 raw data files, he was found to be positive for the SNP - PAGES00052. The other Isles Scots members for which we have Geno 2.0 raw data, are all ancestral for PAGES00052 as are those from other M223 sectors for which we have Geno raw data.

                                    This highlights the importance of sending Administrators your Geno 2.0 raw data files to check if or when you have completed Geno 2.0 test results back.

                                    Please do not rush to order PAGES00052 as it is likely to only split off a small new branch from the rest of the L126+/L137+/L369+ Isles groups given that Bradford, Hemphill, Hokstad, McAllister, McCullough and Nesbitt are or appear to be negative for it. Those with a close Y-DNA match to Taggart are more likely to be positive. Taggart has a distinctive DYS395a-b = 14-15 in the 38 to 67 marker set. Gunning shares this same distinctive marker reading while some other close matches have only tested to 37 markers so their DYS395 is unknown. Whether this marker will tag those that are PAGES00052+ is uncertain at present.

                                    We will probably call for a few volunteers from Isles Scots, Irish and Limbo groups to test for PAGES00052 first to gauge the extent of this new branch. PAGES00052 is already in the FTDNA SNP order catalog so we do not have to wait for it to be listed.

                                    Please notify us first before you order.

                                    I-M223 Project team








                                  • Rossa Mullen
                                    There is a company called Full Genomes Inc, they test for over 400 STR s. ... From: Dora Smith Subject: Re: [I-M223] New SNP found in
                                    Message 17 of 24 , Jul 1, 2013
                                      There is a company called Full Genomes Inc, they test for over 400 STR's.

                                      --- On Mon, 7/1/13, Dora Smith <tiggernut24@...> wrote:

                                      From: Dora Smith <tiggernut24@...>
                                      Subject: Re: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member
                                      To: I-M223@yahoogroups.com
                                      Date: Monday, July 1, 2013, 5:26 PM

                                       

                                      Yes, there’s one, but it’s new, and the people running it seem to specialize more in startup than anything else, so I myself am waiting ot see.    I thought there were others but I can’t find them offhand.
                                       
                                      Dora
                                       
                                       
                                      Sent: Monday, July 01, 2013 7:15 PM
                                      Subject: RE: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member
                                       
                                       

                                      Thanks Dora,

                                      Is there any company that does a complete sequencing? Seems to me it is more profitable for them to do a little here and a little there and then change it to get you to pay more.

                                      Jeff

                                      From: I-M223@yahoogroups.com [mailto:I-M223@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Dora Smith
                                      Sent: Monday, July 01, 2013 7:13 PM
                                      To: I-M223@yahoogroups.com
                                      Subject: Re: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member




                                      I’m not sure whether it would find anything not found in Walk the Y, either.  However just so you know, Walk the Y covers a very small portion of the Y chromosome, even the new version which probably covers far more, and a different part of the chromosome, then what you previously did.

                                      I’m thinking get a complete sequence from a company that does them, myself. 

                                      Dora

                                      Sent: Monday, July 01, 2013 1:04 PM

                                      Subject: RE: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member

                                       

                                      Hi Wayne,

                                      I have not done the Geno 2.0 and did not see any value in doing it since I did the WTY with FTDNA.

                                      I am not sure it would benefit me or uncover anything not found with the WTY test, let me know if the two test different areas of the SNP tree,

                                      Jeff

                                      From: I-M223@yahoogroups.com [mailto:I-M223@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Wayne Roberts
                                      Sent: Sunday, June 30, 2013 12:24 AM
                                      To: I-M223@yahoogroups.com
                                      Subject: Re: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member





                                      Hello Jeff,

                                      Thanks for your message. Because I was a somewhat late comer to the I-M223 Project, I am not aware of everyone that has done a WTY test or what their results were.

                                      I have checked up on PAGES00026 and everyone in I-M223 is positive for it so it is one of those positive SNPs that our Haplogroup has inherited.

                                      Jeff, you, like those Isles Scots members that have done Geno 2.0 and sent through their raw data to FTDNA and/or Project administrators, are PAGES00052 negative with the exception of Taggart of course.

                                      Gunning, a close Y-DNA match to Taggart, also did WTY but PAGES00052 was not tested or picked up. He has agreed to test for it and has since ordered PAGES00052. Thanks Bruce.

                                      This is probably a small branch off L126 which is why I asked L126+ members to notify us if they want to order it. It is not to give permission as Dora put it, but we do not want members wasting money on an SNP that will come back negative for them. We will be looking for candidates that have the best probability of a positive result. We require at least three positives to have it listed with ISOGG. Of course Dora is free as anyone else is to go ahead and order PAGES00052 to prove some sort of point.

                                      Thanks for everyone's interest.

                                      Wayne

                                      ----- Original Message -----

                                      Sent: Sunday, June 30, 2013 3:40 AM

                                      Subject: RE: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member

                                       

                                      GRC009349

                                      PAGES00019

                                      G-

                                      ChrY:20087688..20087688

                                      GRC009349

                                      PAGES00025

                                      G-

                                      ChrY:20104521..20104521

                                      GRC009349

                                      PAGES00026

                                      A+

                                      ChrY:20105584..20105584

                                      GRC009349

                                      PAGES00027

                                      T-

                                      ChrY:20106063..20106063

                                      GRC009349

                                      PAGES00052

                                      T-

                                      ChrY:2770309..2770309

                                      GRC009349

                                      PAGES00059

                                      C-

                                      ChrY:20329311..20329311

                                      GRC009349

                                      PAGES00068

                                      C-

                                      ChrY:16170772..16170772

                                      GRC009349

                                      PAGES00076

                                      A-

                                      ChrY:6998665..6998665

                                      GRC009349

                                      PAGES00083

                                      A-

                                      ChrY:13407488..13407488

                                      GRC009349

                                      PAGES00093

                                      G-

                                      ChrY:13990829..13990829

                                      GRC009349

                                      PAGES00104

                                      A-

                                      ChrY:21160725..21160725

                                      GRC009349

                                      PAGES00106

                                      C-

                                      ChrY:20106098..20106098

                                      GRC009349

                                      PAGES00107

                                      T-

                                      ChrY:20105838..20105838

                                      GRC009349

                                      PAGES00116

                                      C-

                                      ChrY:20353252..20353252

                                      GRC009349

                                      PAGES00117

                                      T-

                                      ChrY:20342318..20342318

                                      GRC009349

                                      PAGES00119

                                      T-

                                      ChrY:20329316..20329316

                                      GRC009349

                                      PAGES00121

                                      G-

                                      ChrY:16170780..16170780

                                      GRC009349

                                      PAGES00123

                                      G-

                                      ChrY:13407777..13407777

                                      GRC009349

                                      PK2

                                      T-

                                      ChrY:21078608..21078608

                                      GRC009349

                                      PK3

                                      T-

                                      ChrY:21078913..21078913

                                      GRC009349

                                      PK4

                                      A-

                                      ChrY:19745350..19745350

                                      GRC009349

                                      SRY10831.1

                                      C+

                                      ChrY:2717176..2717176

                                      GRC009349

                                      L124

                                      T-

                                      ChrY:16276156..16276156

                                      1

                                      GRC009349

                                      L125

                                      T-

                                      ChrY:17269063..17269063

                                      1

                                      GRC009349

                                      L126

                                      T+

                                      ChrY:13411027..13411027

                                      1

                                      GRC009349

                                      L127

                                      G-

                                      ChrY:12798981..12798981

                                      1

                                      GRC009349

                                      L128

                                      T-

                                      ChrY:13134262..13134262

                                      1

                                      GRC009349

                                      L13

                                      C-

                                      ChrY:13208948..13208948

                                      1

                                      GRC009349

                                      L130

                                      G-

                                      ChrY:6813503..6813503

                                      1

                                      GRC009349

                                      L131

                                      C-

                                      ChrY:17882202..17882202

                                      1

                                      GRC009349

                                      L132

                                      C-

                                      ChrY:15973591..15973591

                                      1

                                      GRC009349

                                      L134

                                      C-

                                      ChrY:13360329..13360329

                                      1

                                      GRC009349

                                      L135

                                      C-

                                      ChrY:13638642..13638642

                                      1

                                      GRC009349

                                      L136

                                      ins-

                                      ChrY:7630823..7630823

                                      1

                                      GRC009349

                                      L137

                                      A+

                                      ChrY:10401250..10401250

                                      1

                                      GRC009349

                                      L138

                                      A-

                                      ChrY:2902214..2902214

                                      1

                                      GRC009349

                                      L139

                                      G-

                                      ChrY:13981304..13981304

                                      1

                                      GRC009349

                                      L14

                                      C-

                                      ChrY:21327383..21327383

                                      1

                                      That is interesting since I tested WTY back in 2007 and was negative for that one, but positive for PAGES00026

                                      My terminal SNP is L126/L137

                                      But maybe I am not following the conversation properly

                                      Jeffery W. Gibbon

                                      From: I-M223@yahoogroups.com [mailto:I-M223@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Wayne Roberts
                                      Sent: Thursday, June 27, 2013 9:40 PM
                                      To: I-M223 List
                                      Subject: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member






                                      Some good news from a Geno 2.0 test at last for the Isles Scots sector with a new SNP found derived yesterday for Taggart kit number N53563.

                                      He sent his Geno 2.0 raw data file through to Project administrators and on checking and comparison with some previous Isles Scots Geno 2.0 raw data files, he was found to be positive for the SNP - PAGES00052. The other Isles Scots members for which we have Geno 2.0 raw data, are all ancestral for PAGES00052 as are those from other M223 sectors for which we have Geno raw data.

                                      This highlights the importance of sending Administrators your Geno 2.0 raw data files to check if or when you have completed Geno 2.0 test results back.

                                      Please do not rush to order PAGES00052 as it is likely to only split off a small new branch from the rest of the L126+/L137+/L369+ Isles groups given that Bradford, Hemphill, Hokstad, McAllister, McCullough and Nesbitt are or appear to be negative for it. Those with a close Y-DNA match to Taggart are more likely to be positive. Taggart has a distinctive DYS395a-b = 14-15 in the 38 to 67 marker set. Gunning shares this same distinctive marker reading while some other close matches have only tested to 37 markers so their DYS395 is unknown. Whether this marker will tag those that are PAGES00052+ is uncertain at present.

                                      We will probably call for a few volunteers from Isles Scots, Irish and Limbo groups to test for PAGES00052 first to gauge the extent of this new branch. PAGES00052 is already in the FTDNA SNP order catalog so we do not have to wait for it to be listed.

                                      Please notify us first before you order.

                                      I-M223 Project team













                                    • Jeff Gibbon
                                      Thanks for the info, Jeff From: I-M223@yahoogroups.com [mailto:I-M223@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Dora Smith Sent: Monday, July 01, 2013 8:27 PM To:
                                      Message 18 of 24 , Jul 1, 2013

                                        Thanks for the info,

                                         

                                        Jeff

                                         

                                        From: I-M223@yahoogroups.com [mailto:I-M223@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Dora Smith
                                        Sent: Monday, July 01, 2013 8:27 PM
                                        To: I-M223@yahoogroups.com
                                        Subject: Re: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member

                                         




                                        Wayne doesn’t say and I can’t recall the name offhand, but I bet he’s dealing with that new company I mentioned.  The timing is right – a bunch of people have ordered tests from them.

                                         

                                        Dora

                                         

                                         

                                        Sent: Monday, July 01, 2013 6:53 PM

                                        Subject: Re: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member

                                         

                                         

                                        Hello Jeff,

                                         

                                        Like Dora said, Geno 2.0 would have given little value to you in your Y-DNA. As I have said before, Geno 2.0 leaves Roots, Isles, L1228 and basic M223 sectors out in the cold. Taggart is a rare exception. It has been good for some of the Continental sectors. I chose to not do Geno 2.0 and did WTY. That did not even find my already known Z2054 to Z2102 group positives. I have chosen to do the full Y genome now and just waiting on a kit to arrive.

                                         

                                        Wayne

                                         

                                        ----- Original Message -----

                                        Sent: Tuesday, July 02, 2013 4:04 AM

                                        Subject: RE: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member

                                         

                                         

                                        Hi Wayne,

                                        I have not done the Geno 2.0 and did not see any value in doing it since I did the WTY with FTDNA.

                                        I am not sure it would benefit me or uncover anything not found with the WTY test, let me know if the two test different areas of the SNP tree,

                                        Jeff

                                        From: I-M223@yahoogroups.com [mailto:I-M223@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Wayne Roberts
                                        Sent: Sunday, June 30, 2013 12:24 AM
                                        To: I-M223@yahoogroups.com
                                        Subject: Re: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member





                                        Hello Jeff,

                                        Thanks for your message. Because I was a somewhat late comer to the I-M223 Project, I am not aware of everyone that has done a WTY test or what their results were.

                                        I have checked up on PAGES00026 and everyone in I-M223 is positive for it so it is one of those positive SNPs that our Haplogroup has inherited.

                                        Jeff, you, like those Isles Scots members that have done Geno 2.0 and sent through their raw data to FTDNA and/or Project administrators, are PAGES00052 negative with the exception of Taggart of course.

                                        Gunning, a close Y-DNA match to Taggart, also did WTY but PAGES00052 was not tested or picked up. He has agreed to test for it and has since ordered PAGES00052. Thanks Bruce.

                                        This is probably a small branch off L126 which is why I asked L126+ members to notify us if they want to order it. It is not to give permission as Dora put it, but we do not want members wasting money on an SNP that will come back negative for them. We will be looking for candidates that have the best probability of a positive result. We require at least three positives to have it listed with ISOGG. Of course Dora is free as anyone else is to go ahead and order PAGES00052 to prove some sort of point.

                                        Thanks for everyone's interest.

                                        Wayne

                                        ----- Original Message -----

                                        Sent: Sunday, June 30, 2013 3:40 AM

                                        Subject: RE: [I-M223] New SNP found in Geno 2.0 results of Isles Scots member

                                         

                                        GRC009349

                                        PAGES00019

                                        G-

                                        ChrY:20087688..20087688

                                        GRC009349

                                        PAGES00025

                                        G-

                                        ChrY:20104521..20104521

                                        GRC009349

                                        PAGES00026

                                        A+

                                        ChrY:20105584..20105584

                                        GRC009349

                                        PAGES00027

                                        T-

                                        ChrY:20106063..20106063

                                        GRC009349

                                        PAGES00052

                                        T-

                                        ChrY:2770309..2770309

                                        GRC009349

                                        PAGES00059

                                        C-

                                        ChrY:20329311..20329311

                                        GRC009349

                                        PAGES00068

                                        C-

                                        ChrY:16170772..16170772

                                        GRC009349

                                        PAGES00076

                                        A-

                                        ChrY:6998665..6998665

                                        GRC009349

                                        PAGES00083

                                        A-

                                        ChrY:13407488..13407488

                                        GRC009349

                                        PAGES00093

                                        G-

                                        ChrY:13990829..13990829

                                        GRC009349

                                        PAGES00104

                                        A-

                                        ChrY:21160725..21160725

                                        GRC009349

                                        PAGES00106

                                        C-

                                        ChrY:20106098..20106098

                                        GRC009349

                                        PAGES00107

                                        T-

                                        ChrY:20105838..20105838

                                        GRC009349

                                        PAGES00116

                                        C-

                                        ChrY:20353252..20353252

                                        GRC009349

                                        PAGES00117

                                        T-

                                        ChrY:20342318..20342318

                                        GRC009349

                                        PAGES00119

                                        T-

                                        ChrY:20329316..20329316

                                        GRC009349

                                        PAGES00121

                                        G-

                                        ChrY:16170780..16170780

                                        GRC009349

                                        PAGES00123

                                        G-

                                        ChrY:13407777..13407777

                                        GRC009349

                                        PK2

                                        T-

                                        ChrY:21078608..21078608

                                        GRC009349

                                        PK3

                                        T-

                                        ChrY:21078913..21078913

                                        GRC009349

                                        PK4

                                        A-

                                        ChrY:19745350..19745350

                                        GRC009349

                                        SRY10831.1

                                        C+

                                        ChrY:2717176..2717176

                                         

                                        GRC009349

                                        L124

                                        T-

                                        ChrY:16276156..16276156

                                        1

                                        GRC009349

                                        L125

                                        T-

                                        ChrY:17269063..17269063

                                        1

                                        GRC009349

                                        L126

                                        T+

                                        ChrY:13411027..13411027

                                        1

                                        GRC009349

                                        L127

                                        G-

                                        ChrY:12798981..12798981

                                        1

                                        GRC009349

                                        L128

                                        T-

                                        ChrY:13134262..13134262

                                        1

                                        GRC009349

                                        L13

                                        C-

                                        ChrY:13208948..13208948

                                        1

                                        GRC009349

                                        L130

                                        G-

                                        ChrY:6813503..6813503

                                        1

                                        GRC009349

                                        L131

                                        C-

                                        ChrY:17882202..17882202

                                        1

                                        GRC009349

                                        L132

                                        C-

                                        ChrY:15973591..15973591

                                        1

                                        GRC009349

                                        L134

                                        C-

                                        ChrY:13360329..13360329

                                        1

                                        GRC009349

                                        L135

                                        C-

                                        ChrY:13638642..13638642

                                        1

                                        GRC009349

                                        L136

                                        ins-

                                        ChrY:7630823..7630823

                                        1

                                        GRC009349

                                        L137

                                        A+

                                        ChrY:10401250..10401250

                                        1

                                        GRC009349

                                        L138

                                        A-

                                        ChrY:2902214..2902214

                                        1

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