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Re: trucks for HOn3 cars with pin bolsters

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  • Hart Corbett
    Dave: I have a number of older HOn3 cars which I built years ago from kits (Grandt Line, Rail Line). I also have recently built an E&B Valley stock car kit
    Message 1 of 9 , Apr 24, 2013
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      Dave:

      I have a number of older HOn3 cars which I built years ago from kits (Grandt Line, Rail Line). I also have recently built an E&B Valley stock car kit and a D&RGW long caboose, also an E&B Valley kit. BTW, E&B is long out of business; I don't know who might have ended up swith their dies.

      You already have received some excellent replies regarding how to deal with the pin problem, etc. However, with regard to trucks, in all cases I purchased Blackstone trucks to replace the original trucks on those kits. Blackstone has trucks in black, in "red" (probably Boxcar Red), and their special caboose trucks, also in red. Some of the cars were old enough to still have ancient Kemtron trucks. One short D&RGW caboose was a PFM brass import back in 1961. For this last one, it was easy to used machine screws which matched the original tapped holes in the body bolsters. For the others, I used screw mounting techniques very similar to the ones which already have been described. Sometimes, I use 2-56 metal washers as shims between the truck bolsters and the body bolsters. For thin shims, I use the Kadee fiber washers between the bolsters.

      In all cases (even the brass caboose) I changed the cars' total weights to pretty much match what Blackstone uses for their HOn3 freight rolling stock. . . . 1.6 to 1.8 ounces (U.S.). I do not use the NMRA recommended weights for HOn3 freight rolling stock. I use small pieces of sheet lead to correct the cars' weights. In a direct conversation with Jim Vail last weekend, I learned that he does the same thing with his older cars.

      The old E&B Valley kit cars (a long caboose and and a stock car) match, in appearance and performance, the Blackstone ready to run cars. The E&B stock car, when in a train of Blackstone cars, is almost impossible to identify. Same for the long caboose when next to a Blackstone caboose. The Rail Line box car differs little from the Blackstones. The Grandt Line high side gondolas look much like the Blackstones. Even the 52-year old brass caboose fits right in. All of them, with their Blackstone trucks and coupled among the off-the-shelf Blackstones, have run all over my 3 level layout with no problems whatsoever. Coupler heights match just fine. BTW, all 65 of my turnouts were hand-built by me and about two thirds of all the track is handlaid code 55 ME rail.

      So try the Blackstone trucks, mounted with the screw techniques, and you should be very happy with the result!

      Have fun!

      With best regards, Hart
      _______________________________________________
      <<< trucks for HOn3 cars with pin bolsters
      Posted by: "nkplt" nkplt@... nkplt
      Date: Tue Apr 23, 2013 6:08 pm ((PDT))

      I have acquired some older cars, I think they are Rail Line (not sure) but they have pins for bolsters. I have tried several types of trucks but cannot find any that work good. You have to shim to get them to clear the frame and then there is no room for any type of retaining ring to keep the truck on. Any suggestions would be appreciated.
      Thanks,
      Dave >>>
    • John Stutz
      ... This approach pretty much ensures good running Herb, but it is short on prototype range. I believe Blackstone s trucks are currently limited to: D&RGW
      Message 2 of 9 , Apr 24, 2013
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        On 04/24/2013 10:23 AM, Hart Corbett wrote:
        > Dave:
        >
        > I have a number of older HOn3 cars which I built years ago from kits (Grandt
        > Line, Rail Line). I also have recently built an E&B Valley stock car kit and a
        > D&RGW long caboose, also an E&B Valley kit. BTW, E&B is long out of business; I
        > don't know who might have ended up with their dies.
        >
        > You already have received some excellent replies regarding how to deal with the
        > pin problem, etc. However, with regard to trucks, in all cases I purchased
        > Blackstone trucks to replace the original trucks on those kits. ...

        This approach pretty much ensures good running Herb, but it is short on
        prototype range. I believe Blackstone's trucks are currently limited to:

        D&RGW 5'0" passenger - fairly generic, but some use a 6'0" version
        D&RGW 3'7", 25T freight, in black and red - quite distinctive
        D&RGW 3'7" caboose - quite distinctive
        UTLX 4'8", 30T archbar - moderately generic
        UTLX 4'8", 30T Bettendorf(U) - moderately generic
        EBT ~4', 35T Vulcan - quite distinctive

        Additionally, MicroTrains has comparable RTR trucks:
        C&S 4'8" 25T Bettendorf(T) - also Uintah, SV, WP&Y, possibly other late NG
        UTLX 4'8", 30T archbar - moderately generic

        There is not much here for those of us who do not model the D&RGW/RGS C&S, or
        EBT. PSC has some alternatives, and their Delren versions roll about as well as
        Blackstone trucks. I can recommend the following kits:

        D&RGW 3'7", 25T freight - quite distinctive
        D&RGW 3'7" caboose - quite distinctive
        D&RGW 4'8", 25T archbar - distinctive
        D&RGW 4'8", 25T Andrews(U) - moderately generic
        D&RGW 4'10" 40T Bettendorf(U) - moderately generic
        UTLX 4'8", 30T archbar - moderately generic
        UTLX 4'8", 30T Bettendorf(U) - moderately generic
        C&S 4'0", 25T archbar - quite generic

        These are their more recent designs, most newly made for PSC's HOn3 D&RGW kits.
        There is a considerable range of older trucks including Western NG prototypes,
        some going back to Kemtron. These require more or less effort to assemble into
        free-rolling versions. But virtually any truck with an Acetal(Delrin) side
        frame can be made to roll well. Brass frames can be a bit more work, and do
        require periodic lubrication. Some PSC trucks are provided RTR.

        Rio Grande Models and David Hoffman provide most of the rest of the HOn3 trucks,
        Rio Grande with a wide range of prototypes in pewter, and Hoffman with a range
        of Eastern NG trucks in brass. Judging by the examples that I have, neither
        seems to have put much effort into making their trucks roll freely. It can be
        done, but doing so gets into the model engineering side of the hobby, and won't
        appeal to many. That said, these are the only source for about half the
        available HOn3 truck prototypes.

        John Stutz
      • Jim Vail
        ... The E&B stock cars were designed and the dies made by Bill Gould. The stock cars are now sold by Model Railroad General Store. They are nice because you
        Message 3 of 9 , Apr 24, 2013
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          On 4/24/2013 10:23 AM, Hart Corbett wrote:
          >
          > E&B is long out of business; I don't know who might have ended up
          > swith their dies.
          >
          The E&B stock cars were designed and the dies made by Bill Gould. The
          stock cars are now sold by Model Railroad General Store. They are nice
          because you can build them with any of 4 different prototype side board
          configurations. MRGS sells on ebay.
          >
          >
          > In all cases (even the brass caboose) I changed the cars' total
          > weights to pretty much match what Blackstone uses for their HOn3
          > freight rolling stock. . . . 1.6 to 1.8 ounces (U.S.). I do not use
          > the NMRA recommended weights for HOn3 freight rolling stock. I use
          > small pieces of sheet lead to correct the cars' weights. In a direct
          > conversation with Jim Vail last weekend, I learned that he does the
          > same thing with his older cars.
          >
          I actually attempt to weight all my kit built cars between 1.1 and 1.5
          oz. Some of the ready -to -run cars weigh in to 1.7 or 1.8 oz. - but
          others are down to 1.3 to 1.4 oz.
          >
          >
          > The Grandt Line high side gondolas look much like the Blackstones.
          >
          Grandt Line makes the C&S gondolas (coal cars) similar to the Micro
          Trains ready-to-run (kind of) gondolas. Durango Press (now part of JL
          Innovative) makes the high side gondolas that model the same cars as the
          Blackstone gondolas. These were originally produced by Clear Creek
          Engineering.
          >
          > So try the Blackstone trucks, mounted with the screw techniques, and
          > you should be very happy with the result!
          >
          I like the Blackstone and Micro Trains trucks too but I also run plenty
          of Grandt trucks - they're good too.
          >
          >
          Jim Vail


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        • Jim Vail
          ... Not exactly what you are asking for, but at the moment Micro Mark has a set of small taps and the appropriate tap drills on sale. Jim Vail [Non-text
          Message 4 of 9 , Apr 24, 2013
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            On 4/24/2013 6:32 PM, Ray wrote:
            >
            > John, What's the name of this MicroMark tool. Or the number? I have
            > not been able to find it on their website.
            > Ray
            >
            Not exactly what you are asking for, but at the moment Micro Mark has a
            set of small taps and the appropriate tap drills on sale.

            Jim Vail


            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • Harold Huber
            Hart, E&B Valley is now Model Railroad General Store. Harold [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            Message 5 of 9 , Apr 25, 2013
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              Hart,
              E&B Valley is now Model Railroad General Store.
              Harold

              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • Mark
              ... The point here is that few if any 5500 series stock cars and their 34 foot brothers, the 5900ers, had much similarity between them. The point between
              Message 6 of 9 , Apr 25, 2013
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                > The E&B stock cars were designed and the dies made by Bill Gould. The
                > stock cars are now sold by Model Railroad General Store. They are nice
                > because you can build them with any of 4 different prototype side board
                > configurations.

                The point here is that few if any 5500 series stock cars and their 34 foot brothers, the 5900ers, had much similarity between them. The point between Blackstone cars is that they are all the same irrespective of numbering- in real life the boards move around, especially the number and tare boards!. The MRRGS (former E&B) allow for a variatiom of the theme as indeed the PSC 34 foot kits do in a stock train. Vic Stone, a UK enthusiast (and boy is that an understatement!!) has written a book on the variations. Titled 'Taking Stock'it will get you all the info you need. Being out of print it fetches some serious money.

                Mark K
              • Hart Corbett
                John S. is right. As he says, look in he MicroMark website for for Bulls Eye Drill Jig. MicroMark indicates that it is for repairing sagging couplers on
                Message 7 of 9 , Apr 25, 2013
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                  John S. is right. As he says, look in he MicroMark website for for Bulls Eye Drill Jig. MicroMark indicates that it is for repairing sagging couplers on Athearn cars. It certainly appears that is can be used on almost any car.

                  Coincidentally, there is an article in the May 2013 issue of NMRA Magazine about repairing couplers on Athern cars using this jig, which is manufactured by A-Line. In the same small package with the jig, is a tap for a 2-56 hole. A separately sold package contains just a no. 50 drill. Another separately sold package contains 50 short, black 2-56 x 1/8 screws. And another separately sold package contains 12 metal coupler covers for Athern cars.

                  The only difference between the contents of A-Line's single package that contains just the jig and the 2-56 tap is that the Micro Mark package has just the jig and 6 screws but no tap. Most modelers could scare up a no. 50 drill bit and a 2-56 tap.

                  With best regards, Hart
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