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RE: [HOn3] Re: How to do the 1916-1921 time period in HOn3

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  • Glenn
    ... got their domes changed from fluted to smooth. Can anyone answer this? Almost all early engines had plenty of fluting, filigree, scroll-work, and
    Message 1 of 23 , May 3, 2010
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      > Just a question: I always wondered when and why so many early D&RG locos
      got their domes changed from fluted to smooth. Can anyone answer this?

      Almost all early engines had plenty of fluting, filigree, scroll-work, and
      adornments. But as railroads became an industry, all this stuff became a
      maintenance nightmare.

      Pride said to keep all the stuff polished and shiny. Everyday nitty-gritty
      work required that more time be spent on keeping locos running.

      Glenn
    • Studedudeus
      I suppose it is my misuse of the word that got this started. I ve always heard the Baldwin domes on D&RG engines (like those seen on 346 now) referred to as
      Message 2 of 23 , May 3, 2010
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        I suppose it is my misuse of the word that got this started. I've always heard the Baldwin domes on D&RG engines (like those seen on 346 now) referred to as Fluted domes. They are very prominent on D&RG Class 56, Class 60 and Class 70 engines from the very beginning when they were constructed. Perhaps they are more properly known as Flanged Domes. The class 60 engines built by Cooke were built with a similar dome, though the center wrapper was taller, and the flanges not so prominent.

        The Round domes, which I'll agree, appear more modern seem to appear first on the Cooke engines. But also on a few Class 70 (later C-17) engines as early as 1890. There are even a few photos of engine 404 with a mixture of domes, and a diamond stack.

        My guess is that, just like with tenders, when an engine arrived for major overhaul, it got stripped down and all the components went out for their individual repars. Cab to the carpenter's shop, tender to whereever, domes, pumps, etc. out for their overhauls. When the boiler/running gear were ready, a group of parts were gathered up to make a whole engine. Since the Rio Grande had a rather large fleet of very similar Consolidations, they didn't really care which domes, cab, tender, pump, etc. they used out of the pile, just put some stuff back on the engine and got her running.

        So what should I be calling those domes?

        Phil

        --- In HOn3@yahoogroups.com, John Stutz <John.C.Stutz@...> wrote:
        >
        > John C. <jcmm3030@...> wrote:
        > >
        > > Just a question: I always wondered when and why so many early D&RG locos
        > > got their domes changed from fluted to smooth. Can anyone answer this?
        >

        >
        > I am not aware of any Colorado narrow gauge engines that had fluted
        > domes. Those had gone out of fashion circa 1860, well before narrow
        > gauge construction began. But I am not very familiar with the earlier
        > engines. Can anyone produce a photograph of an example, or is this
        > just a commonly accepted misuse of the word?
        >
        > John Stutz
        >
      • jcmm3030@aol.com
        John and all-- I guess the question is: if we call the earlier 1860s era domes fluted, what do we call the 1875-1880 era domes found on the C-60s of that
        Message 3 of 23 , May 3, 2010
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          John and all--

          I guess the question is: if we call the earlier 1860s era domes
          fluted, what do we call the 1875-1880 era domes found on the C-60s of that
          time? The Baldwin domes changed to the rounded style quickly in the early
          1880s--so that's the question here. John C.


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        • John Stutz
          http://bowser-trains.com/hoother/calscale/Cal-Scale-Steam-Loco-Parts2.jpg ... John I doubt that even 1860 s era domes should be called fluted. Perhaps some
          Message 4 of 23 , May 3, 2010
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            http://bowser-trains.com/hoother/calscale/Cal-Scale-Steam-Loco-Parts2.jpg


            John C <jcmm3030@...> wrote:
            >
            > I guess the question is: if we call the earlier 1860s era domes
            > fluted, what do we call the 1875-1880 era domes found on the C-60s of that
            > time? The Baldwin domes changed to the rounded style quickly in the early
            > 1880s--so that's the question here.

            John

            I doubt that even 1860's era domes should be called fluted. Perhaps
            some from the 1840's or 50's. Technically, fluting is parallel
            rounded grooving, such as seen on the sides of stainless steel
            passenger cars of the 1940's and 50's, or the vertical parallel
            grooves on classical architectural columns. I have looked for fluted
            domes occasionally, without finding any examples. Perhaps the closest
            is the sand dome of the CalScale #342 dome set, but that has radial
            fluting on the dome cover. See
            http://bowser-trains.com/hoother/calscale/Cal-Scale-Steam-Loco-Parts2.jpg

            As for what to call the domes supplied in the 1870's and early 1880's,
            I prefer ringed and someone just now was calling them flanged.
            Regarding the smoother domes, I have run across modern references to
            helmet style domes, but this may be a modern invention. I was never
            clear if this referred to the 1880's-1900's style, or the single piece
            pressed steel domes that were introduced around 1900.

            I am not aware of any widespread designations in the contemporary
            prototype literature. I do not recall that John White's American
            Locomotives has anything pertinent about dome style designations, but
            his coverage ends in the 1870's, just when things start to get
            interesting. There may be some semi-official designations available
            in the Locomotive Dictionaries, but the earliest I have access to
            dates from 1906, a little on the late side.

            John Stutz
          • Duncan Harvey
            Andy, We ve talked on the phone several times. Your title says something about how to do the 1916-1921 time period in HOn3. I am modeling 1878-1920, or so.
            Message 5 of 23 , May 15, 2010
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              Andy,

              We've talked on the phone several times. Your title says something about how to do the 1916-1921 time period in HOn3. I am modeling 1878-1920, or so. What is it you want to know? I'll help if I can.
              Duncan

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            • Ed Anderson
              Duncan, just got done with a daughters wedding! Actually I think I have most of everything answered for now--thanks! Andy ________________________________
              Message 6 of 23 , May 18, 2010
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                Duncan,
                just got done with a daughters wedding! Actually I think I have most of everything answered for now--thanks!
                Andy




                ________________________________
                From: Duncan Harvey <train3guy@...>
                To: HOn3@yahoogroups.com
                Sent: Sat, May 15, 2010 3:20:06 PM
                Subject: Re: [HOn3] Re: How to do the 1916-1921 time period in HOn3

                 
                Andy,

                 What is it you want to know? I'll help if I can.
                Duncan

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