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RE: [HOn3] Sunset C-16 idler gear.

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  • ufffam
    Why not use the Remotor package from Bellaire Roundhouse and get a better motor in addition to gearing benefits? Bill Uffelman ... From: robert foley
    Message 1 of 11 , Nov 5, 2001
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      Why not use the Remotor package from Bellaire Roundhouse and get a better
      motor in addition to gearing benefits?


      Bill Uffelman

      -----Original Message-----
      From: robert foley [SMTP:foles1@...]
      Sent: Monday, November 05, 2001 9:57 AM
      To: HOn3@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: [HOn3] Sunset C-16 idler gear.

      'rwsnyder' wrote about a problem idler gear in his Sunset C-16. Of the two
      I have, one definitely has the same thing. If you find a suitable
      replacement, please pass it on......I will need two of them. Fix it once
      and for all. Thanks.
      Bob


      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



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    • RoundBell@aol.com
      In a message dated 11/5/01 12:07:55 PM Central Standard Time, ufffam@cox.rr.com writes:
      Message 2 of 11 , Nov 6, 2001
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        In a message dated 11/5/01 12:07:55 PM Central Standard Time,
        ufffam@... writes: <<
        Why not use the Remotor package from Bellaire Roundhouse and get a better
        motor in addition to gearing benefits? >>
        The Roundbell remotor kit is for the Westside C-16 only. The Westside
        has 3.5 mod gearing and the Sunset 2.5 mod gearing. The Roundbell K-1 kit
        only contains a worm to mesh with the existing Westside idler gear, thats why
        it only takes 3 hours to install and requires no precise machining.
        Roundbell Hobby Products
        See
        http://roundbell.com/roundbellmotorkitshon3.html
        http://roundbell.com/hon3conversions.html
      • Steffen
        The problem on the SS C 16 is that the axle gear could slip out of the mesh to the idler gear. SS once provided new bottom plates with a small raised part
        Message 3 of 11 , Nov 7, 2001
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          The problem on the SS C 16 is that the axle gear could slip out of
          the mesh to the idler gear. SS once provided new bottom plates with a
          small raised part neaneth the driver so that this axle moves a bit up
          to mesh the idler gear. Coulöd be corrected by yourself by soldering
          some small 0.3 mm brass strips in place where the geared axle sits on
          the bottom plate. Performance is still horrible due to the straight 3
          pole can motor. Check out my remotirng kit (Faulhaber 1319 + fylwheel
          @ www. stonercreek.de esay drop in kit (30 miniures built in time)

          There is also a a pic of the mounted kit shown


          Steffen


          --- In HOn3@y..., "robert foley" <foles1@m...> wrote:
          > 'rwsnyder' wrote about a problem idler gear in his Sunset C-16. Of
          the two I have, one definitely has the same thing. If you find a
          suitable replacement, please pass it on......I will need two of
          them. Fix it once and for all. Thanks.
          > Bob
          >
          >
          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • h0n3bob@aol.com
          Steffen, I could not access your site via the supplied E-Mail address. Thanks, Bob B.
          Message 4 of 11 , Nov 7, 2001
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            Steffen,

            I could not access your site via the supplied E-Mail address.

            Thanks,
            Bob B.
          • Rick White
            Bob : The correct addy is http://www.stonercreek.de/ Rick NSW Oz
            Message 5 of 11 , Nov 7, 2001
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              Bob :

              The correct addy is http://www.stonercreek.de/

              Rick
              NSW Oz


              --- In HOn3@y..., h0n3bob@a... wrote:
              > Steffen,
              >
              > I could not access your site via the supplied E-Mail address.
              >
              > Thanks,
              > Bob B.
            • RoundBell@aol.com
              In a message dated 11/7/01 7:26:55 AM Central Standard Time, hobosteve@yahoo.com writes:
              Message 6 of 11 , Nov 7, 2001
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                In a message dated 11/7/01 7:26:55 AM Central Standard Time,
                hobosteve@... writes:

                << Performance is still horrible due to the straight 3
                pole can motor. Model had a very good 5 pole Mashima 1224, problem was
                idler gear which was mounted on a shaft that was soldered in the frame (which
                sometimes melted gear), some wheel siderod problems and a very wimpy motor
                mounting bracket that could bend and allow worm to loose mesh with idler gear
                when under load. Loco Doc
              • Steffen
                Sorry, had some broad fingers today it is www.stonercreek.de Sfeffen
                Message 7 of 11 , Nov 7, 2001
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                  Sorry, had some "broad fingers" today

                  it is www.stonercreek.de


                  Sfeffen

                  --- In HOn3@y..., h0n3bob@a... wrote:
                  > Steffen,
                  >
                  > I could not access your site via the supplied E-Mail address.
                  >
                  > Thanks,
                  > Bob B.
                • Steffen
                  Sorry Wayne, the Mashima 1224 is not a good motor exspecially when used with an low reduction gearbox. The building of an single Masihma motor costs about 1- 2
                  Message 8 of 11 , Nov 7, 2001
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                    Sorry Wayne, the Mashima 1224 is not a good motor exspecially when
                    used with an low reduction gearbox. The building of an single Masihma
                    motor costs about 1- 2 $ (nice profit for the company), The material
                    and work costs on coreless motors are much higher about 15 - 35 $.
                    The gaps between the poles of the armature on the MAshima 1224 cause
                    a stepping at slow speed without fylwheel the performance is odd. So
                    with a corless drive and fywheel you have no stepping at all (no gaps
                    between the poles). On all SS C 16 have seen tuntil now (remotored
                    about 30) the idler gear axle was made of steel and was pressed into
                    the frame. The gear was running "loose" on it. Have 3 engines on my
                    layout, all with new bottom plate and coreless drives and all run
                    prfect.

                    Steffen
                    Stoner Creek Miniatures

                    --- In HOn3@y..., RoundBell@a... wrote:
                    > In a message dated 11/7/01 7:26:55 AM Central Standard Time,
                    > hobosteve@y... writes:
                    >
                    > << Performance is still horrible due to the straight 3
                    > pole can motor. Model had a very good 5 pole Mashima 1224,
                    problem was
                    > idler gear which was mounted on a shaft that was soldered in the
                    frame (which
                    > sometimes melted gear), some wheel siderod problems and a very
                    wimpy motor
                    > mounting bracket that could bend and allow worm to loose mesh with
                    idler gear
                    > when under load. Loco Doc
                  • RoundBell@aol.com
                    In a message dated 11/7/01 11:07:46 AM Central Standard Time, hobosteve@yahoo.com writes:
                    Message 9 of 11 , Nov 8, 2001
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                      In a message dated 11/7/01 11:07:46 AM Central Standard Time,
                      hobosteve@... writes:

                      << So
                      with a corless drive and fywheel you have no stepping at all (no gaps
                      between the poles). >>
                      Agreed a coreless motor is better but the Mashima 1224 is a very "good"
                      motor and a 5 pole motor, not 3 as you said. If you get the mechanical
                      problems out of the SS C-16 it will be 75 % as good as when you add a very
                      expensive Faulhaber at no additional motor cost.
                      When I worked on those C-16s I also found they had bent frames, most
                      sat on only the left front and right rear driver, when you twisted the frame
                      to get it to sit flat on the track you then had to modify the threads that
                      supported the body so the tightening the screws didn't re skew the frame. By
                      the time I got all the mechanical parts running right I was so happy with the
                      performance of the Mashima 1224 I didn't go any further. Loco Doc
                    • Steffen
                      Wayne, could be that the Mashima 1224 will work well, but customers in Europe are very picky on performance and with the use of non MRC- powerpacks a
                      Message 10 of 11 , Nov 9, 2001
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                        Wayne,
                        could be that the Mashima 1224 will work well, but customers in
                        Europe are very "picky" on performance and with the use of non MRC-
                        powerpacks a Faulhaber is a must. I would not like to miss the
                        feeling of "moving a mass" like a real C 16 when I rum my tiny SS one.

                        Steffen

                        --- In HOn3@y..., RoundBell@a... wrote:
                        > In a message dated 11/7/01 11:07:46 AM Central Standard Time,
                        > hobosteve@y... writes:
                        >
                        > << So
                        > with a corless drive and fywheel you have no stepping at all (no
                        gaps
                        > between the poles). >>
                        > Agreed a coreless motor is better but the Mashima 1224 is a
                        very "good"
                        > motor and a 5 pole motor, not 3 as you said. If you get the
                        mechanical
                        > problems out of the SS C-16 it will be 75 % as good as when you add
                        a very
                        > expensive Faulhaber at no additional motor cost.
                        > When I worked on those C-16s I also found they had bent
                        frames, most
                        > sat on only the left front and right rear driver, when you twisted
                        the frame
                        > to get it to sit flat on the track you then had to modify the
                        threads that
                        > supported the body so the tightening the screws didn't re skew the
                        frame. By
                        > the time I got all the mechanical parts running right I was so
                        happy with the
                        > performance of the Mashima 1224 I didn't go any further. Loco
                        Doc
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