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6574Re: Brainless, shameless, moralising rubbish from GLW Paramatta

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  • lordludd66
    May 27, 2004
      Hi Bob,
      Thanks for the valuable free legal advice - I suppose that
      is one good thing about the A.L.P. these days - plenty of lawyers.
      You'll be relieved to know that I don't own a house (and like most
      never will) so your concern about me having to sell up,while
      appreciated,is misplaced.
      Perhaps if Nolan really is only masqeurading as an A.L.P. member
      you should sue HIM (is that possible?) - it's certainly the
      impression he gives -

      "Regime Change for Saddam

      by Jim Nolan

      Disclosure: I am a Sydney barrister and labor lawyer who first
      joined the ALP in the mid sixties and was active in the anti-Vietnam
      movement and anti-Springbok South Africa movement in Brisbane. For
      the last fourteen years I've been a barrister appearing mainly for
      trade unions."

      http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2003/01/17/1042520770007.html

      What he says is important - the anti-Vietnam,anti-Springbok
      campaigns were important - but we are in a different era where left
      posturing is no longer enough and the "leftists" of the
      60s/70s,having cut themselves a nice comfortable career niche,are
      using these "credentials" to back so-called "humanitarian wars"
      a.k.a. a new (and particularly brutal) Imperialism.
      There's a similar movement in Britain where the leading spokesman
      put up by the Blairite New Labour Party for their wars is Peter
      Hain - an anti-appartheid "hero".There though they expel anti-war
      members - like George Galloway - the A.L.P. might have more
      credibility if they were to similarly expel Nolan ( or are they
      afraid he might sue?).
      I'll leave you to the spat with the D.S.P. and look forward to
      reading the piece you get published in The Age refuting Nolan,
      Comradely

      BiLL
      --- In GreenLeft_discussion@yahoogroups.com, "ozleft" <ozleft@y...>
      wrote:
      > By Bob Gould
      >
      > Most of the comments on my post of last night are deliberately
      > insulting and show up in bold relief the underlying political
      outlook
      > of the DSP leadership.
      >
      > Lordludd deliberately insults me by asserting that I'm trying to
      get
      > the right-winger, Nolan, to sue him. How stupid can you get? I was
      > simply trying to help Brother Ludd by pointing out the danger,
      both to
      > himself and the Green Left list, of recklessly throwing around
      > thoughtless rhetoric about scabs, particularly against an
      industrial
      > lawyer.
      >
      > In this context, my concern for the interests of the Green Left
      list,
      > which from time to time I find a useful platform, and even for the
      > dopey Lordludd, is genuine.
      >
      > A leftist of my acquaintance once had to pull up stakes and move
      > states to escape a libel writ from a right wing union official who
      he
      > had rather unwisely called a scab. A rank and file leftist
      ironworkers
      > union leader in Newcastle, with whom I was acquainted, had to sell
      his
      > house when he lost a libel case against a right-wing union
      official.
      >
      > In the overheated, politically hysterical, atmosphere generated by
      the
      > DSP leadership in the DSP ranks these considerations don't seem to
      > rate at all. Despite the obvious political disagreements I have
      with
      > the DSP leadership I'm genuinely shaken by how little attention
      they
      > seem to pay to these kinds of questions, in pursuit of their
      mistaken,
      > sectarian political line.
      >
      > At the very least, the moderator of the list should declare a
      > moratorium on language about scabs, applied to living individuals.
      I
      > have no intention of drawing Mr Nolan's attention to this
      craziness on
      > the GLW list, but if he's a normal, opinionated pundit, as he
      seems to
      > be, he's likely to Google his own name from time to time to see
      what
      > people say about him.
      >
      > Lordludd, GLParamatta and others are behaving very recklessly
      indeed,
      > and my purpose in raising the question is to draw attention to how
      > reckless this rhetoric is to the other 300-odd participants in
      this list.
      >
      > All concerned should knock off crazy rhetoric about scabs.
      >
      > My other purpose, obviously, is to raise very sharply the vicious
      > sectarianism towards the ranks of the labour movement displayed in
      > GLParamatta's header, and the lack of a sense of proportion and
      > judgment. The attempt is made, and continued by Lordludd and Simon
      > Butler, to associate Laborites in general with the reactionary
      views
      > of Nolan, in pursuit of the DSP's bankrupt schema about Labor being
      > one of the two capitalist parties, ignoring the social location and
      > social base of the ALP.
      >
      > GLParamatta's timing is unfortunate, from his point of view.
      Today's
      > Sydney Morning Herald polls seems to show a rather substantial
      > electoral swing to Labor, and the pollsters, in trying to explain
      it,
      > associate the swing with Labor's opposition to the Iraq war.
      >
      > The polls show that 88 per cent of Greens and Democrats oppose the
      > war, but 80 per cent of Labor voters are opposed as well. Only a
      > minority of Liberal voters are opposed, although the number of
      antiwar
      > Liberals has increased.
      >
      > I'm struck forcibly by the fact that no-one on the GLW list has
      even
      > mentioned today's poll. DSP leadership supporters are usually very
      > quick to draw attention to polls showing increased opposition to
      the
      > Iraq war, but it seems this poll, which shows the overwhelming
      > correlation between voting Labor and opposing the war, is to be
      > ignored -- because it might sow illusions in Laborism, perhaps.
      >
      > This poll underlines the class and political division between the
      Tory
      > right and the Labor-Green left in Australian society.
      >
      > The DSP leadership can't cope with this phenomenon, because it
      doesn't
      > fit their schema, and they're driven to exactly the same device as
      the
      > right-wing Murdoch newspapers, of holding up an isolated right-
      winger,
      > called Nolan, as somehow representative of Laborism, despite all
      > evidence to the contrary, in things like the statements of Labor
      > leaders against the Iraq war and today's polls.
      >
      > Duncan Meerding insults the Laborites who bought Moore's books at
      the
      > ALP state conference, saying they probably didn't read them. What a
      > dope this man is! In my experience as a bookseller everybody who
      buys
      > Michael Moore reads him, including Laborites, because he's so funny
      > and effective.
      >
      > The ruling classes of the US and Australia are positively
      apopleptic
      > about Michael Moore, witness P.P. McGuiness's similar assault to
      Nolan
      > on him this morning in the Sydney Morning Herald. (McGuiness's
      attack
      > doesn't rate a mention on the Green Left list, but then McGuiness
      > can't be as easily fitted into Laborism as Nolan. Incidentally, GLW
      > website participants only have the Australian's word for it about
      > Nolan's Labor Party membership. Nolan may be trading on past
      > associations, and may not even be a current ALP member, but none of
      > that's of any interest on the GLW list. Anything goes if you want
      to
      > kick the Laborites.)
      >
      > From a socialist point of view, this DSP leadership sectarianism is
      > monumentally stupid. There is a very substantial polarisation in
      > Australian society building as the federal elections approach. The
      > hopes of the Labor-Green left side of Australian society are now
      > heavily invested in the prospect of the Labor-Green side defeating
      the
      > Liberals electorally, with the inevitable prospect of a Green
      balance
      > of power in the Senate.
      >
      > The possibility of defeating the Liberals is the central axis of
      > current Australian politics, and even in a secondary way of world
      > politics. The election of a Labor government that withdraws
      Australian
      > troops from Iraq will be a very major blow to imperialism. Even the
      > dopiest political observers can see this, and that's driving the
      > reactionary side of Australian politics off its tree. In this
      > situation, all the DSP leadership can think to do is grasp at
      straws,
      > in this instance Mr Nolan, to try to create an impression that
      > Laborites in general support the Iraq war.
      >
      > The DSP leadership is the only group of people in Australian
      society
      > who hold this eccentric view, and the ruthless, reckless and
      > inaccurate way their prosecute this view tends to cut them off from
      > the whole left of Australian society, which has other things on its
      > mind, in particular defeating the Liberals in the elections.
      >
      > If there's a material crisis in the DSP, which is now pretty
      public,
      > it has everything to do with the DSP leadership's dead-end
      sectarian
      > political line towards the workers movement and the coming federal
      > elections.
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