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Re: Ara ararauna mutations

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  • Terry Martin
    Does anyone in this group know of someone who has these mutational Macaws? Terry ... From: Stephane Tintin To: Genetics-Psittacine@yahoogroups.com Sent:
    Message 1 of 23 , Oct 10, 2007
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      Does anyone in this group know of someone who has these mutational Macaws?
       
      Terry
      ----- Original Message -----
      Sent: Sunday, September 16, 2007 4:03 AM
      Subject: RE : [Genetics-Psittacine] Ara ararauna mutations

      Hey Monica, Terry & Every Birdie,
      I agree that the B&G Macaws displaying basically clear (white or yellow), heads, necks, upper-mantles, upper-wing coverts & tail feathers (pictured below) are indeed quite identical to Opaline Bourke's, Budgie & Rosella Parakeets.
       
       
       
      In all of the species listed above, the Opaline mutation greatly reduces eumelanin from the upper-mantle regions where usually body/ground colour is displayed) and these B&G Macaws appear to be showing the exact same trait.
       
      As we know the Opaline mutation features many traits which are shared in all Parrot species ;
       
      1) Sex-Linked-inhertiance
       
      2) eumelanin suppression in chick's down (but w/o psittacin alteration)
       
      3) eumelanin redistribution along with psittacin enhancement
       
      It would be very interesting to know wether these basically 'clear' mantled & 'clear' tailed B&G Macaws also share both the clear down in chicks & SL-inheritance ???
       
      Best regards,
      Stéphane
      (MALE's name french equivalent of Stephen ;-) aka Tintin,
      Ruby Eyes Aviary.

    • Kris Spearman
      I think BirdsInternational http://www.birdsinternational.net/ have these mutations. Terry Martin wrote: Does anyone in this
      Message 2 of 23 , Oct 10, 2007
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        I think BirdsInternational http://www.birdsinternational.net/ have these mutations.

        Terry Martin <sbankvet@...> wrote:
        Does anyone in this group know of someone who has these mutational Macaws?
         
        Terry
        ----- Original Message -----
        Sent: Sunday, September 16, 2007 4:03 AM
        Subject: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

        Hey Monica, Terry & Every Birdie,
        I agree that the B&G Macaws displaying basically clear (white or yellow), heads, necks, upper-mantles, upper-wing coverts & tail feathers (pictured below) are indeed quite identical to Opaline Bourke's, Budgie & Rosella Parakeets.
         
         
         
        In all of the species listed above, the Opaline mutation greatly reduces eumelanin from the upper-mantle regions where usually body/ground colour is displayed) and these B&G Macaws appear to be showing the exact same trait.
         
        As we know the Opaline mutation features many traits which are shared in all Parrot species ;
         
        1) Sex-Linked-inhertia nce
         
        2) eumelanin suppression in chick's down (but w/o psittacin alteration)
         
        3) eumelanin redistribution along with psittacin enhancement
         
        It would be very interesting to know wether these basically 'clear' mantled & 'clear' tailed B&G Macaws also share both the clear down in chicks & SL-inheritance ???
         
        Best regards,
        Stéphane
        (MALE's name french equivalent of Stephen ;-) aka Tintin,
        Ruby Eyes Aviary.



        Yahoo! Answers - Get better answers from someone who knows. Try it now.

      • Monica & Fids
        Sorry everyone, I ve got no news here... I ve been busy and hadn t gotten around to sending out some e-mails until more recently. Still, I have yet to receive
        Message 3 of 23 , Oct 17, 2007
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          Sorry everyone, I've got no news here... I've been busy and hadn't gotten around to sending out some e-mails until more recently. Still, I have yet to receive a response from any one of the e-mails I've sent out.
           
          I have found only one website that mentioned the "yellow" aka "golden" B&G macaw mutation may be an opaline...
          http://www.avianweb.com/blueandgoldmutations.html (contacted Lein Luu and they said the "yellow mutation" is indeed sex-linked, therefore it very well could be opaline!)
           
          Just to be sure I have all the links to the opaline mutations, I'll post them below... so you'll get repeats for any who has seen them before...
          http://www.internationalparrots.com/gallery/mutationpics.html
          http://www.parrot.com.hk/BII/BII.htm
          http://janeczek.com/start_e.php?i=bii
          http://www.papageienpark-bochum.de/pub/index.php?page=aeltere_bilder_und_videos (scroll down - two pics, one same as previous opaline macaw)
          http://www.papageienpark-bochum.de/pub/index.php?page=kontakt
          http://www.papageienpark-bochum.de/pub/index.php?page=paarhaltung
          http://www.papageienpark-bochum.de/pub/index.php?page=innenansicht&pigallery=papabo&pipic=DSC07341.jpg (stunning blue mutation on this page, too!)
          http://www.papageienpark-bochum.de/pub/index.php?page=paarhaltung_komplett (seen on International Parrots)
          http://www.papageienpark-bochum.de/pub/index.php?page=bilder_philipinen_aug_06&pigallery=impres/philipienen_aug_06&pipic=DSC06211.jpg (I'm guessing a blue opaline)
           
          This photo here, I couldn't seem to find the original page... it was something about sending the original photos (within this one) by request...
          http://www.papageienpark-bochum.de/pub/uploads/images/preview_aramuta.jpg
           
           
          Although I've only got one reply by e-mail, saying that yes, this mutation is sex-linked, therefore we should be able to safely call it an opaline, I haven't been able to get any more information about the birds in question....
           
          So maybe someone may have better luck than myself?



          To: Genetics-Psittacine@yahoogroups.com
          From: tintin_montreal1972@...
          Date: Sat, 15 Sep 2007 14:03:22 -0400
          Subject: RE : [Genetics-Psittacine] Ara ararauna mutations

          Hey Monica, Terry & Every Birdie,
          I agree that the B&G Macaws displaying basically clear (white or yellow), heads, necks, upper-mantles, upper-wing coverts & tail feathers (pictured below) are indeed quite identical to Opaline Bourke's, Budgie & Rosella Parakeets.
           
           
           
          In all of the species listed above, the Opaline mutation greatly reduces eumelanin from the upper-mantle regions where usually body/ground colour is displayed) and these B&G Macaws appear to be showing the exact same trait.
           
          As we know the Opaline mutation features many traits which are shared in all Parrot species ;
           
          1) Sex-Linked-inhertia nce
           
          2) eumelanin suppression in chick's down (but w/o psittacin alteration)
           
          3) eumelanin redistribution along with psittacin enhancement
           
          It would be very interesting to know wether these basically 'clear' mantled & 'clear' tailed B&G Macaws also share both the clear down in chicks & SL-inheritance ???
           
          Best regards,
          Stéphane
          (MALE's name french equivalent of Stephen ;-) aka Tintin,
          Ruby Eyes Aviary.

          "You remain responsible, forever, for what you have tamed."
          - Antoine De Saint-Exupéry
           
          Terry, I haven't a clue, really. I'd believe recessive, however I haven't asked any of the people from which the pictures originated (if indeed they originated from a said person... instead of a breeder from an organization) .

          Opaline was simply the closest mutation I could think of that might resemble these macaws. The opaline that is already established in budgies, lovebirds, and rosellas is quite different in each species... however, it seems to me that the description for opaline remains about the same... the spreading of a color over the rest of the body... or rather, in specific locations where that color is not normally there...
           
           
          I used to always think that lutino was always sex-linked mutation, until I read over several discussions which mentioned that in quakers, the ino gene is recessive, and only more frequently possibly sex-linked as well. Thus, it may very well be a unique mutation to the species.
           
           
          In the least, I could certainly try to find out if anyone else knows about these mutations...
           
           

          To: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com
          From: sbankvet@bigpond. com
          Date: Thu, 13 Sep 2007 10:22:41 +1000
          Subject: [Genetics-Psittacin e] Re:Ara Mutation !!!!

          Monica and Fids
           
                  Any idea of the inheritance of this 'Yellow' mutation. It seems quite a few have been bred so someone should have some idea.
           
                  The pattern appears too consistent for a Pied mutation, if sex-linked then Opaline would seem appropriate. Otherwise it might be a unique mutation for this species.
          ----- Original Message -----
          Sent: Wednesday, September 12, 2007 10:09 AM
          Subject: RE: [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara Mutation !!!!

          I've seen similar markings (as far as toes go) in B&G's and Hyacinths. The B&G not only had a couple discolored toes but also 1 yellow tail feather. The hyacinth only had one or two discolored toes, and others mentioned that the toes, in time, would color up like the rest. If they have I'm not sure but I could try and find out.
           
          I agree, most likely a pied mutation.... but speaking of Ara mutations, I'm hoping someone could help me with a couple others?
           
          The first mutation is the "yellow" B&G. I first learned about it from someone who had bought the baby B&G in Japan.... however, I have since seen other B&G's with similar or same markings, thus I've already concluded that this must not be a pied mutation, but you can't necessarily call it "yellow" either, considering that there is still blue on the body, thus it's not a lutino. The closest mutation that I'd know of would be the opaline in budgies...
          http://www.internat ionalparrots. com/images/ 513_untitled_ 7.JPG
           
          Now, the reason why I say we need a better name for the "Yellow" B&G is because this same mutation is also seen in a blue mutation of the B&G.... it doesn't sound appropiate to call the bird a "Yellow Blue", or a "White" for that matter... example of this mutation can be seen in the first 3 pics of the one below...
           
          The next two pics seem to depict another "Yellow" mutation of the B&G, however when compared to the actual "Yellows", there seems to be some slight differences in the markings of the upper portion of the wings as well as in the tail... which leads me to believe that this may be an entirely different mutation...
           
          The bottom two appear to be two different species, however both appear to have horn colored beaks... The one on the left is clearly a blue mutation B&G, but what about the horn coloring of the beak? The one on the right I believe to be a blue mutation (or should I say turqoise?) of the greenwing macaw, however some have argued that it's a hybrid.
           
          (originally from Birds International, Inc I believe)
          http://a347. ac-images. myspacecdn. com/images01/ 57/l_6a77a1ba573 07562e339d267a01 da732.jpg

           
          And, I figured, for a good example, here's a couple other pics of the blue mutation B&G....
          http://www.internat ionalparrots. com/images/ 513_untitled_ 2.JPG
          http://a186. ac-images. myspacecdn. com/images01/ 46/l_37754d25177 da7beef3536d065e 0fe11.jpg
          http://www.janeczek .com/biipictures /BGM2.jpg



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        • Mick Blake [Exotic Parrots & Karmic Aviar
          The Opaline and blue mutation are photos from Birds International in the Philippines and they look like they have cracked the opaline now, and also the Blues,
          Message 4 of 23 , Oct 17, 2007
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            The Opaline and blue mutation are photos from Birds International in the Philippines and they look like they have cracked the opaline now, and also the Blues, and the Opaline look to be Sex linked and the blues are recessive from what I can work out from e-mail from the Philippines. I'm trying to go next year and video them and take photos, here is a photo of one of there large aviaries.
            ----- Original Message -----
            Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 5:16 AM
            Subject: RE: RE : [Genetics-Psittacine] Ara ararauna mutations

            Sorry everyone, I've got no news here... I've been busy and hadn't gotten around to sending out some e-mails until more recently. Still, I have yet to receive a response from any one of the e-mails I've sent out.
             
            I have found only one website that mentioned the "yellow" aka "golden" B&G macaw mutation may be an opaline...
            http://www.avianweb .com/blueandgold mutations. html (contacted Lein Luu and they said the "yellow mutation" is indeed sex-linked, therefore it very well could be opaline!)
             
            Just to be sure I have all the links to the opaline mutations, I'll post them below... so you'll get repeats for any who has seen them before...
            http://www.internat ionalparrots. com/gallery/ mutationpics. html
            http://www.parrot. com.hk/BII/ BII.htm
            http://janeczek. com/start_ e.php?i=bii
            http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= aeltere_bilder_ und_videos (scroll down - two pics, one same as previous opaline macaw)
            http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= kontakt
            http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= paarhaltung
            http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= innenansicht&pigallery=papabo&pipic=DSC07341. jpg (stunning blue mutation on this page, too!)
            http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= paarhaltung_ komplett (seen on International Parrots)
            http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= bilder_philipine n_aug_06&pigallery=impres/ philipienen_ aug_06&pipic=DSC06211. jpg (I'm guessing a blue opaline)
             
            This photo here, I couldn't seem to find the original page... it was something about sending the original photos (within this one) by request...
            http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/uploads/ images/preview_ aramuta.jpg
             
             
            Although I've only got one reply by e-mail, saying that yes, this mutation is sex-linked, therefore we should be able to safely call it an opaline, I haven't been able to get any more information about the birds in question....
             
            So maybe someone may have better luck than myself?



            To: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com
            From: tintin_montreal1972 @...
            Date: Sat, 15 Sep 2007 14:03:22 -0400
            Subject: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

            Hey Monica, Terry & Every Birdie,
            I agree that the B&G Macaws displaying basically clear (white or yellow), heads, necks, upper-mantles, upper-wing coverts & tail feathers (pictured below) are indeed quite identical to Opaline Bourke's, Budgie & Rosella Parakeets.
             
             
             
            In all of the species listed above, the Opaline mutation greatly reduces eumelanin from the upper-mantle regions where usually body/ground colour is displayed) and these B&G Macaws appear to be showing the exact same trait.
             
            As we know the Opaline mutation features many traits which are shared in all Parrot species ;
             
            1) Sex-Linked-inhertia nce
             
            2) eumelanin suppression in chick's down (but w/o psittacin alteration)
             
            3) eumelanin redistribution along with psittacin enhancement
             
            It would be very interesting to know wether these basically 'clear' mantled & 'clear' tailed B&G Macaws also share both the clear down in chicks & SL-inheritance ???
             
            Best regards,
            Stéphane
            (MALE's name french equivalent of Stephen ;-) aka Tintin,
            Ruby Eyes Aviary.

            "You remain responsible, forever, for what you have tamed."
            - Antoine De Saint-Exupéry
             
            Terry, I haven't a clue, really. I'd believe recessive, however I haven't asked any of the people from which the pictures originated (if indeed they originated from a said person... instead of a breeder from an organization) .

            Opaline was simply the closest mutation I could think of that might resemble these macaws. The opaline that is already established in budgies, lovebirds, and rosellas is quite different in each species... however, it seems to me that the description for opaline remains about the same... the spreading of a color over the rest of the body... or rather, in specific locations where that color is not normally there...
             
             
            I used to always think that lutino was always sex-linked mutation, until I read over several discussions which mentioned that in quakers, the ino gene is recessive, and only more frequently possibly sex-linked as well. Thus, it may very well be a unique mutation to the species.
             
             
            In the least, I could certainly try to find out if anyone else knows about these mutations...
             
             

            To: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com
            From: sbankvet@bigpond. com
            Date: Thu, 13 Sep 2007 10:22:41 +1000
            Subject: [Genetics-Psittacin e] Re:Ara Mutation !!!!

            Monica and Fids
             
                    Any idea of the inheritance of this 'Yellow' mutation. It seems quite a few have been bred so someone should have some idea.
             
                    The pattern appears too consistent for a Pied mutation, if sex-linked then Opaline would seem appropriate. Otherwise it might be a unique mutation for this species.
            ----- Original Message -----
            Sent: Wednesday, September 12, 2007 10:09 AM
            Subject: RE: [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara Mutation !!!!

            I've seen similar markings (as far as toes go) in B&G's and Hyacinths. The B&G not only had a couple discolored toes but also 1 yellow tail feather. The hyacinth only had one or two discolored toes, and others mentioned that the toes, in time, would color up like the rest. If they have I'm not sure but I could try and find out.
             
            I agree, most likely a pied mutation.... but speaking of Ara mutations, I'm hoping someone could help me with a couple others?
             
            The first mutation is the "yellow" B&G. I first learned about it from someone who had bought the baby B&G in Japan.... however, I have since seen other B&G's with similar or same markings, thus I've already concluded that this must not be a pied mutation, but you can't necessarily call it "yellow" either, considering that there is still blue on the body, thus it's not a lutino. The closest mutation that I'd know of would be the opaline in budgies...
            http://www.internat ionalparrots. com/images/ 513_untitled_ 7.JPG
             
            Now, the reason why I say we need a better name for the "Yellow" B&G is because this same mutation is also seen in a blue mutation of the B&G.... it doesn't sound appropiate to call the bird a "Yellow Blue", or a "White" for that matter... example of this mutation can be seen in the first 3 pics of the one below...
             
            The next two pics seem to depict another "Yellow" mutation of the B&G, however when compared to the actual "Yellows", there seems to be some slight differences in the markings of the upper portion of the wings as well as in the tail... which leads me to believe that this may be an entirely different mutation...
             
            The bottom two appear to be two different species, however both appear to have horn colored beaks... The one on the left is clearly a blue mutation B&G, but what about the horn coloring of the beak? The one on the right I believe to be a blue mutation (or should I say turqoise?) of the greenwing macaw, however some have argued that it's a hybrid.
             
            (originally from Birds International, Inc I believe)
            http://a347. ac-images. myspacecdn. com/images01/ 57/l_6a77a1ba573 07562e339d267a01 da732.jpg

             
            And, I figured, for a good example, here's a couple other pics of the blue mutation B&G....
            http://www.internat ionalparrots. com/images/ 513_untitled_ 2.JPG
            http://a186. ac-images. myspacecdn. com/images01/ 46/l_37754d25177 da7beef3536d065e 0fe11.jpg
            http://www.janeczek .com/biipictures /BGM2.jpg



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          • Monica & Fids
            It s kind of hard to find where the exact pictures came from... since many sites have pics from other websites... so therefore, a good question is, are all the
            Message 5 of 23 , Oct 17, 2007
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              It's kind of hard to find where the exact pictures came from... since many sites have pics from other websites... so therefore, a good question is, are all the opalines situated in the Philippines? Or are there other opalines out there? I've seen pics of a blue mutation B&G in the UK, so the same questions could be asked about that mutation... I agree though, the blue mutation is most likely recessive, but I'd still like to learn more about the opaline mutation if possible.

              I would enjoy more photos of these birds, as well as other rare mutations!
               
              However, I am still wondering about the last macaw in this picture...
              http://www.parrot.com.hk/BII/bii.jpg

              To: Genetics-Psittacine@yahoogroups.com
              From: Exoticparrots@...
              Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 08:49:34 +1000
              Subject: Re: RE : [Genetics-Psittacine] Ara ararauna mutations

              The Opaline and blue mutation are photos from Birds International in the Philippines and they look like they have cracked the opaline now, and also the Blues, and the Opaline look to be Sex linked and the blues are recessive from what I can work out from e-mail from the Philippines. I'm trying to go next year and video them and take photos, here is a photo of one of there large aviaries.
              ----- Original Message -----
              Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 5:16 AM
              Subject: RE: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

              Sorry everyone, I've got no news here... I've been busy and hadn't gotten around to sending out some e-mails until more recently. Still, I have yet to receive a response from any one of the e-mails I've sent out.
               
              I have found only one website that mentioned the "yellow" aka "golden" B&G macaw mutation may be an opaline...
              http://www.avianweb .com/blueandgold mutations. html (contacted Lein Luu and they said the "yellow mutation" is indeed sex-linked, therefore it very well could be opaline!)
               
              Just to be sure I have all the links to the opaline mutations, I'll post them below... so you'll get repeats for any who has seen them before...
              http://www.internat ionalparrots. com/gallery/ mutationpics. html
              http://www.parrot. com.hk/BII/ BII.htm
              http://janeczek. com/start_ e.php?i=bii
              http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= aeltere_bilder_ und_videos (scroll down - two pics, one same as previous opaline macaw)
              http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= kontakt
              http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= paarhaltung
              http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= innenansicht&pigallery=papabo&pipic=DSC07341. jpg (stunning blue mutation on this page, too!)
              http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= paarhaltung_ komplett (seen on International Parrots)
              http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= bilder_philipine n_aug_06&pigallery=impres/ philipienen_ aug_06&pipic=DSC06211. jpg (I'm guessing a blue opaline)
               
              This photo here, I couldn't seem to find the original page... it was something about sending the original photos (within this one) by request...
              http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/uploads/ images/preview_ aramuta.jpg
               
               
              Although I've only got one reply by e-mail, saying that yes, this mutation is sex-linked, therefore we should be able to safely call it an opaline, I haven't been able to get any more information about the birds in question....
               
              So maybe someone may have better luck than myself?



              To: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com
              From: tintin_montreal1972 @...
              Date: Sat, 15 Sep 2007 14:03:22 -0400
              Subject: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

              Hey Monica, Terry & Every Birdie,
              I agree that the B&G Macaws displaying basically clear (white or yellow), heads, necks, upper-mantles, upper-wing coverts & tail feathers (pictured below) are indeed quite identical to Opaline Bourke's, Budgie & Rosella Parakeets.
               
               
               
              In all of the species listed above, the Opaline mutation greatly reduces eumelanin from the upper-mantle regions where usually body/ground colour is displayed) and these B&G Macaws appear to be showing the exact same trait.
               
              As we know the Opaline mutation features many traits which are shared in all Parrot species ;
               
              1) Sex-Linked-inhertia nce
               
              2) eumelanin suppression in chick's down (but w/o psittacin alteration)
               
              3) eumelanin redistribution along with psittacin enhancement
               
              It would be very interesting to know wether these basically 'clear' mantled & 'clear' tailed B&G Macaws also share both the clear down in chicks & SL-inheritance ???
               
              Best regards,
              Stéphane
              (MALE's name french equivalent of Stephen ;-) aka Tintin,
              Ruby Eyes Aviary.

              "You remain responsible, forever, for what you have tamed."
              - Antoine De Saint-Exupéry
               
              Terry, I haven't a clue, really. I'd believe recessive, however I haven't asked any of the people from which the pictures originated (if indeed they originated from a said person... instead of a breeder from an organization) .

              Opaline was simply the closest mutation I could think of that might resemble these macaws. The opaline that is already established in budgies, lovebirds, and rosellas is quite different in each species... however, it seems to me that the description for opaline remains about the same... the spreading of a color over the rest of the body... or rather, in specific locations where that color is not normally there...
               
               
              I used to always think that lutino was always sex-linked mutation, until I read over several discussions which mentioned that in quakers, the ino gene is recessive, and only more frequently possibly sex-linked as well. Thus, it may very well be a unique mutation to the species.
               
               
              In the least, I could certainly try to find out if anyone else knows about these mutations...
               
               

              To: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com
              From: sbankvet@bigpond. com
              Date: Thu, 13 Sep 2007 10:22:41 +1000
              Subject: [Genetics-Psittacin e] Re:Ara Mutation !!!!

              Monica and Fids
               
                      Any idea of the inheritance of this 'Yellow' mutation. It seems quite a few have been bred so someone should have some idea.
               
                      The pattern appears too consistent for a Pied mutation, if sex-linked then Opaline would seem appropriate. Otherwise it might be a unique mutation for this species.
              ----- Original Message -----
              Sent: Wednesday, September 12, 2007 10:09 AM
              Subject: RE: [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara Mutation !!!!

              I've seen similar markings (as far as toes go) in B&G's and Hyacinths. The B&G not only had a couple discolored toes but also 1 yellow tail feather. The hyacinth only had one or two discolored toes, and others mentioned that the toes, in time, would color up like the rest. If they have I'm not sure but I could try and find out.
               
              I agree, most likely a pied mutation.... but speaking of Ara mutations, I'm hoping someone could help me with a couple others?
               
              The first mutation is the "yellow" B&G. I first learned about it from someone who had bought the baby B&G in Japan.... however, I have since seen other B&G's with similar or same markings, thus I've already concluded that this must not be a pied mutation, but you can't necessarily call it "yellow" either, considering that there is still blue on the body, thus it's not a lutino. The closest mutation that I'd know of would be the opaline in budgies...
              http://www.internat ionalparrots. com/images/ 513_untitled_ 7.JPG
               
              Now, the reason why I say we need a better name for the "Yellow" B&G is because this same mutation is also seen in a blue mutation of the B&G.... it doesn't sound appropiate to call the bird a "Yellow Blue", or a "White" for that matter... example of this mutation can be seen in the first 3 pics of the one below...
               
              The next two pics seem to depict another "Yellow" mutation of the B&G, however when compared to the actual "Yellows", there seems to be some slight differences in the markings of the upper portion of the wings as well as in the tail... which leads me to believe that this may be an entirely different mutation...
               
              The bottom two appear to be two different species, however both appear to have horn colored beaks... The one on the left is clearly a blue mutation B&G, but what about the horn coloring of the beak? The one on the right I believe to be a blue mutation (or should I say turqoise?) of the greenwing macaw, however some have argued that it's a hybrid.
               
              (originally from Birds International, Inc I believe)
              http://a347. ac-images. myspacecdn. com/images01/ 57/l_6a77a1ba573 07562e339d267a01 da732.jpg

               
              And, I figured, for a good example, here's a couple other pics of the blue mutation B&G....
              http://www.internat ionalparrots. com/images/ 513_untitled_ 2.JPG
              http://a186. ac-images. myspacecdn. com/images01/ 46/l_37754d25177 da7beef3536d065e 0fe11.jpg
              http://www.janeczek .com/biipictures /BGM2.jpg



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            • Willy Stobart
              Hi all, I have also been intrigued by these opaline macaws. The top three images are logically opaline blues. The next two opalines. The last two have blue on
              Message 6 of 23 , Oct 17, 2007
              • 0 Attachment

                Hi all,

                 

                I have also been intrigued by these opaline macaws. The top three images are logically opaline blues. The next two opalines. The last two have blue on top of the head which we can see the opalines do not. What they do remind me of is the turquoiseblue IRN because of the green suffusion over the mantle. With the yellow not yellow but possibly cream coloured if not white and the rest of the bird blue with the green suffusion the only mutation which fits is the turquoise or turquoiseblue. Just my thinking. What say?

                 

                Willy

                 


                From: Genetics-Psittacine@yahoogroups.com [mailto: Genetics-Psittacine@yahoogroups.com ] On Behalf Of Monica & Fids
                Sent: Thursday, 18 October 2007 6:57 AM
                To: genetics-psittacine@yahoogroups.com
                Subject: RE: RE : [Genetics-Psittacine] Ara ararauna mutations

                 

                It's kind of hard to find where the exact pictures came from... since many sites have pics from other websites... so therefore, a good question is, are all the opalines situated in the Philippines ? Or are there other opalines out there? I've seen pics of a blue mutation B&G in the UK , so the same questions could be asked about that mutation... I agree though, the blue mutation is most likely recessive, but I'd still like to learn more about the opaline mutation if possible.

                I would enjoy more photos of these birds, as well as other rare mutations!
                 
                However, I am still wondering about the last macaw in this picture...
                http://www.parrot. com.hk/BII/ bii.jpg


                To: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                From: Exoticparrots@ bigpond.com
                Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 08:49:34 +1000
                Subject: Re: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

                The Opaline and blue mutation are photos from Birds International in the Philippines and they look like they have cracked the opaline now, and also the Blues, and the Opaline look to be Sex linked and the blues are recessive from what I can work out from e-mail from the Philippines. I'm trying to go next year and video them and take photos, here is a photo of one of there large aviaries.

                ----- Original Message -----

                Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 5:16 AM

                Subject: RE: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

                 

                Sorry everyone, I've got no news here... I've been busy and hadn't gotten around to sending out some e-mails until more recently. Still, I have yet to receive a response from any one of the e-mails I've sent out.
                 
                I have found only one website that mentioned the "yellow" aka "golden" B&G macaw mutation may be an opaline...
                http://www.avianweb .com/blueandgold mutations. html (contacted Lein Luu and they said the "yellow mutation" is indeed sex-linked, therefore it very well could be opaline!)
                 
                Just to be sure I have all the links to the opaline mutations, I'll post them below... so you'll get repeats for any who has seen them before...
                http://www.internat ionalparrots. com/gallery/ mutationpics. html
                http://www.parrot. com.hk/BII/ BII.htm
                http://janeczek. com/start_ e.php?i=bii
                http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= aeltere_bilder_ und_videos (scroll down - two pics, one same as previous opaline macaw)
                http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= kontakt
                http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= paarhaltung
                http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= innenansicht&pigallery=papabo&pipic=DSC07341. jpg (stunning blue mutation on this page, too!)
                http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= paarhaltung_ komplett (seen on International Parrots)
                http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= bilder_philipine n_aug_06&pigallery=impres/ philipienen_ aug_06&pipic=DSC06211. jpg (I'm guessing a blue opaline)
                 
                This photo here, I couldn't seem to find the original page... it was something about sending the original photos (within this one) by request...
                http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/uploads/ images/preview_ aramuta.jpg
                 
                 
                Although I've only got one reply by e-mail, saying that yes, this mutation is sex-linked, therefore we should be able to safely call it an opaline, I haven't been able to get any more information about the birds in question....
                 
                So maybe someone may have better luck than myself?


                To: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                From: tintin_montreal1972 @...
                Date: Sat, 15 Sep 2007 14:03:22 -0400
                Subject: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

                Hey Monica, Terry & Every Birdie,

                I agree that the B&G Macaws displaying basically clear (white or yellow), heads, necks, upper-mantles, upper-wing coverts & tail feathers (pictured below) are indeed quite identical to Opaline Bourke's, Budgie & Rosella Parakeets.

                 

                 

                 

                In all of the species listed above, the Opaline mutation greatly reduces eumelanin from the upper-mantle regions where usually body/ground colour is displayed) and these B&G Macaws appear to be showing the exact same trait.

                 

                As we know the Opaline mutation features many traits which are shared in all Parrot species ;

                 

                1) Sex-Linked-inhertia nce

                 

                2) eumelanin suppression in chick's down (but w/o psittacin alteration)

                 

                3) eumelanin redistribution along with psittacin enhancement

                 

                It would be very interesting to know wether these basically 'clear' mantled & 'clear' tailed B&G Macaws also share both the clear down in chicks & SL-inheritance ???

                 

                Best regards,
                Stéphane
                (MALE's name french equivalent of Stephen ;-) aka Tintin,
                Ruby Eyes Aviary.

                "You remain responsible, forever, for what you have tamed."
                - Antoine De Saint-Exupéry

                 

                Terry, I haven't a clue, really. I'd believe recessive, however I haven't asked any of the people from which the pictures originated (if indeed they originated from a said person... instead of a breeder from an organization) .

                Opaline was simply the closest mutation I could think of that might resemble these macaws. The opaline that is already established in budgies, lovebirds, and rosellas is quite different in each species... however, it seems to me that the description for opaline remains about the same... the spreading of a color over the rest of the body... or rather, in specific locations where that color is not normally there...
                 
                 
                I used to always think that lutino was always sex-linked mutation, until I read over several discussions which mentioned that in quakers, the ino gene is recessive, and only more frequently possibly sex-linked as well. Thus, it may very well be a unique mutation to the species.
                 
                 
                In the least, I could certainly try to find out if anyone else knows about these mutations...
                 
                 


                To: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                From: sbankvet@bigpond. com
                Date: Thu, 13 Sep 2007 10:22:41 +1000
                Subject: [Genetics-Psittacin e] Re:Ara Mutation !!!!

                Monica and Fids

                 

                        Any idea of the inheritance of this 'Yellow' mutation. It seems quite a few have been bred so someone should have some idea.

                 

                        The pattern appears too consistent for a Pied mutation, if sex-linked then Opaline would seem appropriate. Otherwise it might be a unique mutation for this species.

                ----- Original Message -----

                To:

              • Mick Blake [Exotic Parrots & Karmic Aviar
                The one in the bottom right hand corner look very much like a Hybrid and not a mutation. ... From: Monica & Fids To: genetics-psittacine@yahoogroups.com Sent:
                Message 7 of 23 , Oct 17, 2007
                • 0 Attachment
                  The one in the bottom right hand corner look very much like a Hybrid and not a mutation.
                   
                  ----- Original Message -----
                  Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 8:56 AM
                  Subject: RE: RE : [Genetics-Psittacine] Ara ararauna mutations

                  It's kind of hard to find where the exact pictures came from... since many sites have pics from other websites... so therefore, a good question is, are all the opalines situated in the Philippines? Or are there other opalines out there? I've seen pics of a blue mutation B&G in the UK, so the same questions could be asked about that mutation... I agree though, the blue mutation is most likely recessive, but I'd still like to learn more about the opaline mutation if possible.

                  I would enjoy more photos of these birds, as well as other rare mutations!
                   
                  However, I am still wondering about the last macaw in this picture...
                  http://www.parrot. com.hk/BII/ bii.jpg


                  To: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                  From: Exoticparrots@ bigpond.com
                  Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 08:49:34 +1000
                  Subject: Re: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

                  The Opaline and blue mutation are photos from Birds International in the Philippines and they look like they have cracked the opaline now, and also the Blues, and the Opaline look to be Sex linked and the blues are recessive from what I can work out from e-mail from the Philippines. I'm trying to go next year and video them and take photos, here is a photo of one of there large aviaries.
                  ----- Original Message -----
                  Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 5:16 AM
                  Subject: RE: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

                  Sorry everyone, I've got no news here... I've been busy and hadn't gotten around to sending out some e-mails until more recently. Still, I have yet to receive a response from any one of the e-mails I've sent out.
                   
                  I have found only one website that mentioned the "yellow" aka "golden" B&G macaw mutation may be an opaline...
                  http://www.avianweb .com/blueandgold mutations. html (contacted Lein Luu and they said the "yellow mutation" is indeed sex-linked, therefore it very well could be opaline!)
                   
                  Just to be sure I have all the links to the opaline mutations, I'll post them below... so you'll get repeats for any who has seen them before...
                  http://www.internat ionalparrots. com/gallery/ mutationpics. html
                  http://www.parrot. com.hk/BII/ BII.htm
                  http://janeczek. com/start_ e.php?i=bii
                  http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= aeltere_bilder_ und_videos (scroll down - two pics, one same as previous opaline macaw)
                  http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= kontakt
                  http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= paarhaltung
                  http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= innenansicht&pigallery=papabo&pipic=DSC07341. jpg (stunning blue mutation on this page, too!)
                  http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= paarhaltung_ komplett (seen on International Parrots)
                  http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= bilder_philipine n_aug_06&pigallery=impres/ philipienen_ aug_06&pipic=DSC06211. jpg (I'm guessing a blue opaline)
                   
                  This photo here, I couldn't seem to find the original page... it was something about sending the original photos (within this one) by request...
                  http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/uploads/ images/preview_ aramuta.jpg
                   
                   
                  Although I've only got one reply by e-mail, saying that yes, this mutation is sex-linked, therefore we should be able to safely call it an opaline, I haven't been able to get any more information about the birds in question....
                   
                  So maybe someone may have better luck than myself?



                  To: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                  From: tintin_montreal1972 @...
                  Date: Sat, 15 Sep 2007 14:03:22 -0400
                  Subject: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

                  Hey Monica, Terry & Every Birdie,
                  I agree that the B&G Macaws displaying basically clear (white or yellow), heads, necks, upper-mantles, upper-wing coverts & tail feathers (pictured below) are indeed quite identical to Opaline Bourke's, Budgie & Rosella Parakeets.
                   
                   
                   
                  In all of the species listed above, the Opaline mutation greatly reduces eumelanin from the upper-mantle regions where usually body/ground colour is displayed) and these B&G Macaws appear to be showing the exact same trait.
                   
                  As we know the Opaline mutation features many traits which are shared in all Parrot species ;
                   
                  1) Sex-Linked-inhertia nce
                   
                  2) eumelanin suppression in chick's down (but w/o psittacin alteration)
                   
                  3) eumelanin redistribution along with psittacin enhancement
                   
                  It would be very interesting to know wether these basically 'clear' mantled & 'clear' tailed B&G Macaws also share both the clear down in chicks & SL-inheritance ???
                   
                  Best regards,
                  Stéphane
                  (MALE's name french equivalent of Stephen ;-) aka Tintin,
                  Ruby Eyes Aviary.

                  "You remain responsible, forever, for what you have tamed."
                  - Antoine De Saint-Exupéry
                   
                  Terry, I haven't a clue, really. I'd believe recessive, however I haven't asked any of the people from which the pictures originated (if indeed they originated from a said person... instead of a breeder from an organization) .

                  Opaline was simply the closest mutation I could think of that might resemble these macaws. The opaline that is already established in budgies, lovebirds, and rosellas is quite different in each species... however, it seems to me that the description for opaline remains about the same... the spreading of a color over the rest of the body... or rather, in specific locations where that color is not normally there...
                   
                   
                  I used to always think that lutino was always sex-linked mutation, until I read over several discussions which mentioned that in quakers, the ino gene is recessive, and only more frequently possibly sex-linked as well. Thus, it may very well be a unique mutation to the species.
                   
                   
                  In the least, I could certainly try to find out if anyone else knows about these mutations...
                   
                   

                  To: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                  From: sbankvet@bigpond. com
                  Date: Thu, 13 Sep 2007 10:22:41 +1000
                  Subject: [Genetics-Psittacin e] Re:Ara Mutation !!!!

                  Monica and Fids
                   
                          Any idea of the inheritance of this 'Yellow' mutation. It seems quite a few have been bred so someone should have some idea.
                   
                          The pattern appears too consistent for a Pied mutation, if sex-linked then Opaline would seem appropriate. Otherwise it might be a unique mutation for this species.
                  ----- Original Message -----
                  Sent: Wednesday, September 12, 2007 10:09 AM
                  Subject: RE: [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara Mutation !!!!

                  I've seen similar markings (as far as toes go) in B&G's and Hyacinths. The B&G not only had a couple discolored toes but also 1 yellow tail feather. The hyacinth only had one or two discolored toes, and others mentioned that the toes, in time, would color up like the rest. If they have I'm not sure but I could try and find out.
                   
                  I agree, most likely a pied mutation.... but speaking of Ara mutations, I'm hoping someone could help me with a couple others?
                   
                  The first mutation is the "yellow" B&G. I first learned about it from someone who had bought the baby B&G in Japan.... however, I have since seen other B&G's with similar or same markings, thus I've already concluded that this must not be a pied mutation, but you can't necessarily call it "yellow" either, considering that there is still blue on the body, thus it's not a lutino. The closest mutation that I'd know of would be the opaline in budgies...
                  http://www.internat ionalparrots. com/images/ 513_untitled_ 7.JPG
                   
                  Now, the reason why I say we need a better name for the "Yellow" B&G is because this same mutation is also seen in a blue mutation of the B&G.... it doesn't sound appropiate to call the bird a "Yellow Blue", or a "White" for that matter... example of this mutation can be seen in the first 3 pics of the one below...
                   
                  The next two pics seem to depict another "Yellow" mutation of the B&G, however when compared to the actual "Yellows", there seems to be some slight differences in the markings of the upper portion of the wings as well as in the tail... which leads me to believe that this may be an entirely different mutation...
                   
                  The bottom two appear to be two different species, however both appear to have horn colored beaks... The one on the left is clearly a blue mutation B&G, but what about the horn coloring of the beak? The one on the right I believe to be a blue mutation (or should I say turqoise?) of the greenwing macaw, however some have argued that it's a hybrid.
                   
                  (originally from Birds International, Inc I believe)
                  http://a347. ac-images. myspacecdn. com/images01/ 57/l_6a77a1ba573 07562e339d267a01 da732.jpg

                   
                  And, I figured, for a good example, here's a couple other pics of the blue mutation B&G....
                  http://www.internat ionalparrots. com/images/ 513_untitled_ 2.JPG
                  http://a186. ac-images. myspacecdn. com/images01/ 46/l_37754d25177 da7beef3536d065e 0fe11.jpg
                  http://www.janeczek .com/biipictures /BGM2.jpg



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                • Monica & Fids
                  I d say the top three are an opaline blue. The next two I d say opaline but I can t help but think it could also be a pied or something... since the feather
                  Message 8 of 23 , Oct 17, 2007
                  • 0 Attachment
                    I'd say the top three are an opaline blue. The next two I'd say opaline but I can't help but think it could also be a pied or something... since the feather coloring in the wings seems mottled... the second to last one is a blue mutation B&G.
                     
                    The VERY last one, the one I am questioning, I was thinking the same idea... turquoise or turqoise blue mutation of the Greenwing Macaw (since there is still some amount of red and green on the bird). However, thus far, all the people I have spoken to about that particular macaw all agree it's some sort of hybrid (maybe they never thought of the possibility of a GW mutation?). Some have even said it's probably a hyacinth hybrid...

                     

                    To: Genetics-Psittacine@yahoogroups.com
                    From: wstobart@...
                    Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 07:17:50 +0800
                    Subject: RE: RE : [Genetics-Psittacine] Ara ararauna mutations

                    Hi all,

                     

                    I have also been intrigued by these opaline macaws. The top three images are logically opaline blues. The next two opalines. The last two have blue on top of the head which we can see the opalines do not. What they do remind me of is the turquoiseblue IRN because of the green suffusion over the mantle. With the yellow not yellow but possibly cream coloured if not white and the rest of the bird blue with the green suffusion the only mutation which fits is the turquoise or turquoiseblue. Just my thinking. What say?

                     

                    Willy

                     


                    From: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com [mailto:Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of Monica & Fids
                    Sent: Thursday, 18 October 2007 6:57 AM
                    To: genetics-psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                    Subject: RE: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

                     

                    It's kind of hard to find where the exact pictures came from... since many sites have pics from other websites... so therefore, a good question is, are all the opalines situated in the Philippines? Or are there other opalines out there? I've seen pics of a blue mutation B&G in the UK, so the same questions could be asked about that mutation... I agree though, the blue mutation is most likely recessive, but I'd still like to learn more about the opaline mutation if possible.

                    I would enjoy more photos of these birds, as well as other rare mutations!
                     
                    However, I am still wondering about the last macaw in this picture...
                    http://www.parrot. com.hk/BII/ bii.jpg


                    To: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                    From: Exoticparrots@ bigpond.com
                    Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 08:49:34 +1000
                    Subject: Re: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

                    The Opaline and blue mutation are photos from Birds International in the Philippines and they look like they have cracked the opaline now, and also the Blues, and the Opaline look to be Sex linked and the blues are recessive from what I can work out from e-mail from the Philippines. I'm trying to go next year and video them and take photos, here is a photo of one of there large aviaries.

                    ----- Original Message -----

                    Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 5:16 AM

                    Subject: RE: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

                     

                    Sorry everyone, I've got no news here... I've been busy and hadn't gotten around to sending out some e-mails until more recently. Still, I have yet to receive a response from any one of the e-mails I've sent out.
                     
                    I have found only one website that mentioned the "yellow" aka "golden" B&G macaw mutation may be an opaline...
                    http://www.avianweb .com/blueandgold mutations. html (contacted Lein Luu and they said the "yellow mutation" is indeed sex-linked, therefore it very well could be opaline!)
                     
                    Just to be sure I have all the links to the opaline mutations, I'll post them below... so you'll get repeats for any who has seen them before...
                    http://www.internat ionalparrots. com/gallery/ mutationpics. html
                    http://www.parrot. com.hk/BII/ BII.htm
                    http://janeczek. com/start_ e.php?i=bii
                    http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= aeltere_bilder_ und_videos (scroll down - two pics, one same as previous opaline macaw)
                    http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= kontakt
                    http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= paarhaltung
                    http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= innenansicht&pigallery=papabo&pipic=DSC07341. jpg (stunning blue mutation on this page, too!)
                    http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= paarhaltung_ komplett (seen on International Parrots)
                    http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= bilder_philipine n_aug_06&pigallery=impres/ philipienen_ aug_06&pipic=DSC06211. jpg (I'm guessing a blue opaline)
                     
                    This photo here, I couldn't seem to find the original page... it was something about sending the original photos (within this one) by request...
                    http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/uploads/ images/preview_ aramuta.jpg
                     
                     
                    Although I've only got one reply by e-mail, saying that yes, this mutation is sex-linked, therefore we should be able to safely call it an opaline, I haven't been able to get any more information about the birds in question....
                     
                    So maybe someone may have better luck than myself?



                    To: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                    From: tintin_montreal1972 @...
                    Date: Sat, 15 Sep 2007 14:03:22 -0400
                    Subject: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

                    Hey Monica, Terry & Every Birdie,

                    I agree that the B&G Macaws displaying basically clear (white or yellow), heads, necks, upper-mantles, upper-wing coverts & tail feathers (pictured below) are indeed quite identical to Opaline Bourke's, Budgie & Rosella Parakeets.

                     

                     

                     

                    In all of the species listed above, the Opaline mutation greatly reduces eumelanin from the upper-mantle regions where usually body/ground colour is displayed) and these B&G Macaws appear to be showing the exact same trait.

                     

                    As we know the Opaline mutation features many traits which are shared in all Parrot species ;

                     

                    1) Sex-Linked-inhertia nce

                     

                    2) eumelanin suppression in chick's down (but w/o psittacin alteration)

                     

                    3) eumelanin redistribution along with psittacin enhancement

                     

                    It would be very interesting to know wether these basically 'clear' mantled & 'clear' tailed B&G Macaws also share both the clear down in chicks & SL-inheritance ???

                     

                    Best regards,
                    Stéphane
                    (MALE's name french equivalent of Stephen ;-) aka Tintin,
                    Ruby Eyes Aviary.

                    "You remain responsible, forever, for what you have tamed."
                    - Antoine De Saint-Exupéry

                     

                    Terry, I haven't a clue, really. I'd believe recessive, however I haven't asked any of the people from which the pictures originated (if indeed they originated from a said person... instead of a breeder from an organization) .

                    Opaline was simply the closest mutation I could think of that might resemble these macaws. The opaline that is already established in budgies, lovebirds, and rosellas is quite different in each species... however, it seems to me that the description for opaline remains about the same... the spreading of a color over the rest of the body... or rather, in specific locations where that color is not normally there...
                     
                     
                    I used to always think that lutino was always sex-linked mutation, until I read over several discussions which mentioned that in quakers, the ino gene is recessive, and only more frequently possibly sex-linked as well. Thus, it may very well be a unique mutation to the species.
                     
                     
                    In the least, I could certainly try to find out if anyone else knows about these mutations...
                     
                     


                    To: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                    From: sbankvet@bigpond. com
                    Date: Thu, 13 Sep 2007 10:22:41 +1000
                    Subject: [Genetics-Psittacin e] Re:Ara Mutation !!!!

                    Monica and Fids

                     

                            Any idea of the inheritance of this 'Yellow' mutation. It seems quite a few have been bred so someone should have some idea.

                     

                            The pattern appears too consistent for a Pied mutation, if sex-linked then Opaline would seem appropriate. Otherwise it might be a unique mutation for this species.

                    ----- Original Message -----

                    Sent: Wednesday, September 12, 2007 10:09 AM

                    Subject: RE: [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara Mutation !!!!

                     

                    I've seen similar markings (as far as toes go) in B&G's and Hyacinths. The B&G not only had a couple discolored toes but also 1 yellow tail feather. The hyacinth only had one or two discolored toes, and others mentioned that the toes, in time, would color up like the rest. If they have I'm not sure but I could try and find out.
                     
                    I agree, most likely a pied mutation.... but speaking of Ara mutations, I'm hoping someone could help me with a couple others?
                     
                    The first mutation is the "yellow" B&G. I first learned about it from someone who had bought the baby B&G in Japan.... however, I have since seen other B&G's with similar or same markings, thus I've already concluded that this must not be a pied mutation, but you can't necessarily call it "yellow" either, considering that there is still blue on the body, thus it's not a lutino. The closest mutation that I'd know of would be the opaline in budgies...
                    http://www.internat ionalparrots. com/images/ 513_untitled_ 7.JPG
                     
                    Now, the reason why I say we need a better name for the "Yellow" B&G is because this same mutation is also seen in a blue mutation of the B&G.... it doesn't sound appropiate to call the bird a "Yellow Blue", or a "White" for that matter... example of this mutation can be seen in the first 3 pics of the one below...
                     
                    The next two pics seem to depict another "Yellow" mutation of the B&G, however when compared to the actual "Yellows", there seems to be some slight differences in the markings of the upper portion of the wings as well as in the tail... which leads me to believe that this may be an entirely different mutation...
                     
                    The bottom two appear to be two different species, however both appear to have horn colored beaks... The one on the left is clearly a blue mutation B&G, but what about the horn coloring of the beak? The one on the right I believe to be a blue mutation (or should I say turqoise?) of the greenwing macaw, however some have argued that it's a hybrid.
                     
                    (originally from Birds International, Inc I believe)
                    http://a347. ac-images. myspacecdn. com/images01/ 57/l_6a77a1ba573 07562e339d267a01 da732.jpg

                     
                    And, I figured, for a good example, here's a couple other pics of the blue mutation B&G....
                    http://www.internat ionalparrots. com/images/ 513_untitled_ 2.JPG
                    http://a186. ac-images. myspacecdn. com/images01/ 46/l_37754d25177 da7beef3536d065e 0fe11.jpg
                    http://www.janeczek .com/biipictures /BGM2.jpg

                     

                     


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                  • Mick Blake [Exotic Parrots & Karmic Aviar
                    Hi that what I would say.probably a hyacinth hybrid... ... From: Monica & Fids To: genetics-psittacine@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 9:43 AM
                    Message 9 of 23 , Oct 17, 2007
                    • 0 Attachment
                      Hi
                       
                      that what I would say.probably a hyacinth hybrid...

                      ----- Original Message -----
                      Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 9:43 AM
                      Subject: RE: RE : [Genetics-Psittacine] Ara ararauna mutations

                      I'd say the top three are an opaline blue. The next two I'd say opaline but I can't help but think it could also be a pied or something... since the feather coloring in the wings seems mottled... the second to last one is a blue mutation B&G.
                       
                      The VERY last one, the one I am questioning, I was thinking the same idea... turquoise or turqoise blue mutation of the Greenwing Macaw (since there is still some amount of red and green on the bird). However, thus far, all the people I have spoken to about that particular macaw all agree it's some sort of hybrid (maybe they never thought of the possibility of a GW mutation?). Some have even said it's probably a hyacinth hybrid...

                       


                      To: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                      From: wstobart@iinet. net.au
                      Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 07:17:50 +0800
                      Subject: RE: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

                      Hi all,

                       

                      I have also been intrigued by these opaline macaws. The top three images are logically opaline blues. The next two opalines. The last two have blue on top of the head which we can see the opalines do not. What they do remind me of is the turquoiseblue IRN because of the green suffusion over the mantle. With the yellow not yellow but possibly cream coloured if not white and the rest of the bird blue with the green suffusion the only mutation which fits is the turquoise or turquoiseblue. Just my thinking. What say?

                       

                      Willy

                       


                      From: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com [mailto:Genetics- Psittacine @yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of Monica & Fids
                      Sent: Thursday, 18 October 2007 6:57 AM
                      To: genetics-psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                      Subject: RE: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

                       

                      It's kind of hard to find where the exact pictures came from... since many sites have pics from other websites... so therefore, a good question is, are all the opalines situated in the Philippines? Or are there other opalines out there? I've seen pics of a blue mutation B&G in the UK, so the same questions could be asked about that mutation... I agree though, the blue mutation is most likely recessive, but I'd still like to learn more about the opaline mutation if possible.

                      I would enjoy more photos of these birds, as well as other rare mutations!
                       
                      However, I am still wondering about the last macaw in this picture...
                      http://www.parrot. com.hk/BII/ bii.jpg


                      To: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                      From: Exoticparrots@ bigpond.com
                      Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 08:49:34 +1000
                      Subject: Re: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

                      The Opaline and blue mutation are photos from Birds International in the Philippines and they look like they have cracked the opaline now, and also the Blues, and the Opaline look to be Sex linked and the blues are recessive from what I can work out from e-mail from the Philippines. I'm trying to go next year and video them and take photos, here is a photo of one of there large aviaries.

                      ----- Original Message -----

                      Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 5:16 AM

                      Subject: RE: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

                       

                      Sorry everyone, I've got no news here... I've been busy and hadn't gotten around to sending out some e-mails until more recently. Still, I have yet to receive a response from any one of the e-mails I've sent out.
                       
                      I have found only one website that mentioned the "yellow" aka "golden" B&G macaw mutation may be an opaline...
                      http://www.avianweb .com/blueandgold mutations. html (contacted Lein Luu and they said the "yellow mutation" is indeed sex-linked, therefore it very well could be opaline!)
                       
                      Just to be sure I have all the links to the opaline mutations, I'll post them below... so you'll get repeats for any who has seen them before...
                      http://www.internat ionalparrots. com/gallery/ mutationpics. html
                      http://www.parrot. com.hk/BII/ BII.htm
                      http://janeczek. com/start_ e.php?i=bii
                      http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= aeltere_bilder_ und_videos (scroll down - two pics, one same as previous opaline macaw)
                      http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= kontakt
                      http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= paarhaltung
                      http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= innenansicht&pigallery=papabo&pipic=DSC07341. jpg (stunning blue mutation on this page, too!)
                      http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= paarhaltung_ komplett (seen on International Parrots)
                      http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= bilder_philipine n_aug_06&pigallery=impres/ philipienen_ aug_06&pipic=DSC06211. jpg (I'm guessing a blue opaline)
                       
                      This photo here, I couldn't seem to find the original page... it was something about sending the original photos (within this one) by request...
                      http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/uploads/ images/preview_ aramuta.jpg
                       
                       
                      Although I've only got one reply by e-mail, saying that yes, this mutation is sex-linked, therefore we should be able to safely call it an opaline, I haven't been able to get any more information about the birds in question....
                       
                      So maybe someone may have better luck than myself?



                      To: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                      From: tintin_montreal1972 @...
                      Date: Sat, 15 Sep 2007 14:03:22 -0400
                      Subject: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

                      Hey Monica, Terry & Every Birdie,

                      I agree that the B&G Macaws displaying basically clear (white or yellow), heads, necks, upper-mantles, upper-wing coverts & tail feathers (pictured below) are indeed quite identical to Opaline Bourke's, Budgie & Rosella Parakeets.

                       

                       

                       

                      In all of the species listed above, the Opaline mutation greatly reduces eumelanin from the upper-mantle regions where usually body/ground colour is displayed) and these B&G Macaws appear to be showing the exact same trait.

                       

                      As we know the Opaline mutation features many traits which are shared in all Parrot species ;

                       

                      1) Sex-Linked-inhertia nce

                       

                      2) eumelanin suppression in chick's down (but w/o psittacin alteration)

                       

                      3) eumelanin redistribution along with psittacin enhancement

                       

                      It would be very interesting to know wether these basically 'clear' mantled & 'clear' tailed B&G Macaws also share both the clear down in chicks & SL-inheritance ???

                       

                      Best regards,
                      Stéphane
                      (MALE's name french equivalent of Stephen ;-) aka Tintin,
                      Ruby Eyes Aviary.

                      "You remain responsible, forever, for what you have tamed."
                      - Antoine De Saint-Exupéry

                       

                      Terry, I haven't a clue, really. I'd believe recessive, however I haven't asked any of the people from which the pictures originated (if indeed they originated from a said person... instead of a breeder from an organization) .

                      Opaline was simply the closest mutation I could think of that might resemble these macaws. The opaline that is already established in budgies, lovebirds, and rosellas is quite different in each species... however, it seems to me that the description for opaline remains about the same... the spreading of a color over the rest of the body... or rather, in specific locations where that color is not normally there...
                       
                       
                      I used to always think that lutino was always sex-linked mutation, until I read over several discussions which mentioned that in quakers, the ino gene is recessive, and only more frequently possibly sex-linked as well. Thus, it may very well be a unique mutation to the species.
                       
                       
                      In the least, I could certainly try to find out if anyone else knows about these mutations...
                       
                       


                      To: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                      From: sbankvet@bigpond. com
                      Date: Thu, 13 Sep 2007 10:22:41 +1000
                      Subject: [Genetics-Psittacin e] Re:Ara Mutation !!!!

                      Monica and Fids

                       

                              Any idea of the inheritance of this 'Yellow' mutation. It seems quite a few have been bred so someone should have some idea.

                       

                              The pattern appears too consistent for a Pied mutation, if sex-linked then Opaline would seem appropriate. Otherwise it might be a unique mutation for this species.

                      ----- Original Message -----

                      Sent: Wednesday, September 12, 2007 10:09 AM

                      Subject: RE: [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara Mutation !!!!

                       

                      I've seen similar markings (as far as toes go) in B&G's and Hyacinths. The B&G not only had a couple discolored toes but also 1 yellow tail feather. The hyacinth only had one or two discolored toes, and others mentioned that the toes, in time, would color up like the rest. If they have I'm not sure but I could try and find out.
                       
                      I agree, most likely a pied mutation.... but speaking of Ara mutations, I'm hoping someone could help me with a couple others?
                       
                      The first mutation is the "yellow" B&G. I first learned about it from someone who had bought the baby B&G in Japan.... however, I have since seen other B&G's with similar or same markings, thus I've already concluded that this must not be a pied mutation, but you can't necessarily call it "yellow" either, considering that there is still blue on the body, thus it's not a lutino. The closest mutation that I'd know of would be the opaline in budgies...
                      http://www.internat ionalparrots. com/images/ 513_untitled_ 7.JPG
                       
                      Now, the reason why I say we need a better name for the "Yellow" B&G is because this same mutation is also seen in a blue mutation of the B&G.... it doesn't sound appropiate to call the bird a "Yellow Blue", or a "White" for that matter... example of this mutation can be seen in the first 3 pics of the one below...
                       
                      The next two pics seem to depict another "Yellow" mutation of the B&G, however when compared to the actual "Yellows", there seems to be some slight differences in the markings of the upper portion of the wings as well as in the tail... which leads me to believe that this may be an entirely different mutation...
                       
                      The bottom two appear to be two different species, however both appear to have horn colored beaks... The one on the left is clearly a blue mutation B&G, but what about the horn coloring of the beak? The one on the right I believe to be a blue mutation (or should I say turqoise?) of the greenwing macaw, however some have argued that it's a hybrid.
                       
                      (originally from Birds International, Inc I believe)
                      http://a347. ac-images. myspacecdn. com/images01/ 57/l_6a77a1ba573 07562e339d267a01 da732.jpg

                       
                      And, I figured, for a good example, here's a couple other pics of the blue mutation B&G....
                      http://www.internat ionalparrots. com/images/ 513_untitled_ 2.JPG
                      http://a186. ac-images. myspacecdn. com/images01/ 46/l_37754d25177 da7beef3536d065e 0fe11.jpg
                      http://www.janeczek .com/biipictures /BGM2.jpg

                       

                       


                      Kick back and relax with hot games and cool activities at the Messenger Café. Play now!

                       


                      Obtenez des réponses à vos questions ! Profitez des connaissances et des opinions des internautes sur Yahoo! Questions/Réponses.

                       

                       


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                    • Willy Stobart
                      I agree, the last bird isn’t a B&G from the facial feathering and because of the white tip to the black beak it is a hybrid. A hyacinth/green wing? The
                      Message 10 of 23 , Oct 17, 2007
                      • 0 Attachment

                        I agree, the last bird isn’t a B&G from the facial feathering and because of the white tip to the black beak it is a hybrid. A hyacinth/green wing? The second last bird is a B&G but appears greenish so turquoise or turquoiseblue?

                         

                        Willy

                         


                        From: Genetics-Psittacine@yahoogroups.com [mailto: Genetics-Psittacine@yahoogroups.com ] On Behalf Of Mick Blake [Exotic Parrots & Karmic Aviaries]
                        Sent: Thursday, 18 October 2007 8:01 AM
                        To: Genetics-Psittacine@yahoogroups.com
                        Subject: Re: RE : [Genetics-Psittacine] Ara ararauna mutations

                         

                        Hi

                         

                        that what I would say.probably a hyacinth hybrid...

                        ----- Original Message -----

                        Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 9:43 AM

                        Subject: RE: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

                         

                        I'd say the top three are an opaline blue. The next two I'd say opaline but I can't help but think it could also be a pied or something... since the feather coloring in the wings seems mottled... the second to last one is a blue mutation B&G.
                         
                        The VERY last one, the one I am questioning, I was thinking the same idea... turquoise or turqoise blue mutation of the Greenwing Macaw (since there is still some amount of red and green on the bird). However, thus far, all the people I have spoken to about that particular macaw all agree it's some sort of hybrid (maybe they never thought of the possibility of a GW mutation?). Some have even said it's probably a hyacinth hybrid...

                         


                        To: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                        From: wstobart@iinet. net.au
                        Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 07:17:50 +0800
                        Subject: RE: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

                        Hi all,

                         

                        I have also been intrigued by these opaline macaws. The top three images are logically opaline blues. The next two opalines. The last two have blue on top of the head which we can see the opalines do not. What they do remind me of is the turquoiseblue IRN because of the green suffusion over the mantle. With the yellow not yellow but possibly cream coloured if not white and the rest of the bird blue with the green suffusion the only mutation which fits is the turquoise or turquoiseblue. Just my thinking. What say?

                         

                        Willy

                         


                        From: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com [mailto: Genetics- Psittacine @yahoogroups. com ] On Behalf Of Monica & Fids
                        Sent: Thursday, 18 October 2007 6:57 AM
                        To: genetics-psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                        Subject: RE: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

                         

                        It's kind of hard to find where the exact pictures came from... since many sites have pics from other websites... so therefore, a good question is, are all the opalines situated in the Philippines ? Or are there other opalines out there? I've seen pics of a blue mutation B&G in the UK , so the same questions could be asked about that mutation... I agree though, the blue mutation is most likely recessive, but I'd still like to learn more about the opaline mutation if possible.

                        I would enjoy more photos of these birds, as well as other rare mutations!
                         
                        However, I am still wondering about the last macaw in this picture...
                        http://www.parrot. com.hk/BII/ bii.jpg


                        To: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                        From: Exoticparrots@ bigpond.com
                        Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 08:49:34 +1000
                        Subject: Re: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

                        The Opaline and blue mutation are photos from Birds International in the Philippines and they look like they have cracked the opaline now, and also the Blues, and the Opaline look to be Sex linked and the blues are recessive from what I can work out from e-mail from the Philippines. I'm trying to go next year and video them and take photos, here is a photo of one of there large aviaries.

                        ----- Original Message -----

                        Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 5:16 AM

                        Subject: RE: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

                         

                        Sorry everyone, I've got no news here... I've been busy and hadn't gotten around to sending out some e-mails until more recently. Still, I have yet to receive a response from any one of the e-mails I've sent out.
                         
                        I have found only one website that mentioned the "yellow" aka "golden" B&G macaw mutation may be an opaline...
                        http://www.avianweb .com/blueandgold mutations. html (contacted Lein Luu and they said the "yellow mutation" is indeed sex-linked, therefore it very well could be opaline!)
                         
                        Just to be sure I have all the links to the opaline mutations, I'll post them below... so you'll get repeats for any who has seen them before...
                        http://www.internat ionalparrots. com/gallery/ mutationpics. html
                        http://www.parrot. com.hk/BII/ BII.htm
                        http://janeczek. com/start_ e.php?i=bii
                        http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= aeltere_bilder_ und_videos (scroll down - two pics, one same as previous opaline macaw)
                        http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= kontakt
                        http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= paarhaltung
                        http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= innenansicht&pigallery=papabo&pipic=DSC07341. jpg (stunning blue mutation on this page, too!)
                        http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= paarhaltung_ komplett (seen on International Parrots)
                        http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= bilder_philipine n_aug_06&pigallery=impres/ philipienen_ aug_06&pipic=DSC06211. jpg (I'm guessing a blue opaline)
                         
                        This photo here, I couldn't seem to find the original page... it was something about sending the original photos (within this one) by request...
                        http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/uploads/ images/preview_ aramuta.jpg
                         
                         
                        Although I've only got one reply by e-mail, saying that yes, this mutation is sex-linked, therefore we should be able to safely call it an opaline, I haven't been able to get any more information about the birds in question....
                         
                        So maybe someone may have better luck than myself?


                        To: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                        From: tintin_montreal1972 @...
                        Date: Sat, 15 Sep 2007 14:03:22 -0400
                        Subject: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

                        Hey Monica, Terry & Every Birdie,

                        I agree that the B&G Macaws displaying basically clear (white or yellow), heads, necks, upper-mantles, upper-wing coverts & tail feathers (pictured below) are indeed quite identical to Opaline Bourke's, Budgie & Rosella Parakeets.

                         

                         

                         

                        In all of the species listed above, the Opaline mutation greatly reduces eumelanin from the upper-mantle regions where usually body/ground colour is displayed) and these B&G Macaws appear to be showing the exact same trait.

                         

                        As we know the Opaline mutation features many traits which are shared in all Parrot species ;

                         

                        1) Sex-Linked-inhertia nce

                         

                        2) eumelanin suppression in chick's down (but w/o psittacin alteration)

                         

                        3) eumelanin redistribution along with psittacin enhancement

                         

                        It would be very interesting to know wether these basically 'clear' mantled & 'clear' tailed B&G Macaws also share both the clear down in chicks & SL-inheritance ???

                         

                        Best regards,
                        Stéphane
                        (MALE's name french equivalent of Stephen ;-) aka Tintin,
                        Ruby Eyes Aviary.

                        "You remain responsible, forever, for what you have tamed."
                        - Antoine De Saint-Exupéry

                         

                      • Mick Blake [Exotic Parrots & Karmic Aviar
                        Yes turquoiseblue? by the looks ... From: Willy Stobart To: Genetics-Psittacine@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 10:15 AM Subject: RE: RE :
                        Message 11 of 23 , Oct 17, 2007
                        • 0 Attachment
                          Yes turquoiseblue? by the looks
                          ----- Original Message -----
                          Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 10:15 AM
                          Subject: RE: RE : [Genetics-Psittacine] Ara ararauna mutations

                          I agree, the last bird isn’t a B&G from the facial feathering and because of the white tip to the black beak it is a hybrid. A hyacinth/green wing? The second last bird is a B&G but appears greenish so turquoise or turquoiseblue?

                          Willy


                          From: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com [mailto: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com ] On Behalf Of Mick Blake [Exotic Parrots & Karmic Aviaries]
                          Sent: Thursday, 18 October 2007 8:01 AM
                          To: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                          Subject: Re: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

                          Hi

                          that what I would say.probably a hyacinth hybrid...

                          ----- Original Message -----

                          Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 9:43 AM

                          Subject: RE: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

                          I'd say the top three are an opaline blue. The next two I'd say opaline but I can't help but think it could also be a pied or something... since the feather coloring in the wings seems mottled... the second to last one is a blue mutation B&G.
                           
                          The VERY last one, the one I am questioning, I was thinking the same idea... turquoise or turqoise blue mutation of the Greenwing Macaw (since there is still some amount of red and green on the bird). However, thus far, all the people I have spoken to about that particular macaw all agree it's some sort of hybrid (maybe they never thought of the possibility of a GW mutation?). Some have even said it's probably a hyacinth hybrid...

                           


                          To: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                          From: wstobart@iinet. net.au
                          Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 07:17:50 +0800
                          Subject: RE: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

                          Hi all,

                          I have also been intrigued by these opaline macaws. The top three images are logically opaline blues. The next two opalines. The last two have blue on top of the head which we can see the opalines do not. What they do remind me of is the turquoiseblue IRN because of the green suffusion over the mantle. With the yellow not yellow but possibly cream coloured if not white and the rest of the bird blue with the green suffusion the only mutation which fits is the turquoise or turquoiseblue. Just my thinking. What say?

                          Willy


                          From: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com [mailto: Genetics- Psittacine @yahoogroups. com ] On Behalf Of Monica & Fids
                          Sent: Thursday, 18 October 2007 6:57 AM
                          To: genetics-psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                          Subject: RE: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

                          It's kind of hard to find where the exact pictures came from... since many sites have pics from other websites... so therefore, a good question is, are all the opalines situated in the Philippines ? Or are there other opalines out there? I've seen pics of a blue mutation B&G in the UK , so the same questions could be asked about that mutation... I agree though, the blue mutation is most likely recessive, but I'd still like to learn more about the opaline mutation if possible.

                          I would enjoy more photos of these birds, as well as other rare mutations!
                           
                          However, I am still wondering about the last macaw in this picture...
                          http://www.parrot. com.hk/BII/ bii.jpg


                          To: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                          From: Exoticparrots@ bigpond.com
                          Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 08:49:34 +1000
                          Subject: Re: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

                          The Opaline and blue mutation are photos from Birds International in the Philippines and they look like they have cracked the opaline now, and also the Blues, and the Opaline look to be Sex linked and the blues are recessive from what I can work out from e-mail from the Philippines. I'm trying to go next year and video them and take photos, here is a photo of one of there large aviaries.

                          ----- Original Message -----

                          Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 5:16 AM

                          Subject: RE: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

                          Sorry everyone, I've got no news here... I've been busy and hadn't gotten around to sending out some e-mails until more recently. Still, I have yet to receive a response from any one of the e-mails I've sent out.
                           
                          I have found only one website that mentioned the "yellow" aka "golden" B&G macaw mutation may be an opaline...
                          http://www.avianweb .com/blueandgold mutations. html (contacted Lein Luu and they said the "yellow mutation" is indeed sex-linked, therefore it very well could be opaline!)
                           
                          Just to be sure I have all the links to the opaline mutations, I'll post them below... so you'll get repeats for any who has seen them before...
                          http://www.internat ionalparrots. com/gallery/ mutationpics. html
                          http://www.parrot. com.hk/BII/ BII.htm
                          http://janeczek. com/start_ e.php?i=bii
                          http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= aeltere_bilder_ und_videos (scroll down - two pics, one same as previous opaline macaw)
                          http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= kontakt
                          http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= paarhaltung
                          http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= innenansicht&pigallery=papabo&pipic=DSC07341. jpg (stunning blue mutation on this page, too!)
                          http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= paarhaltung_ komplett (seen on International Parrots)
                          http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= bilder_philipine n_aug_06&pigallery=impres/ philipienen_ aug_06&pipic=DSC06211. jpg (I'm guessing a blue opaline)
                           
                          This photo here, I couldn't seem to find the original page... it was something about sending the original photos (within this one) by request...
                          http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/uploads/ images/preview_ aramuta.jpg
                           
                           
                          Although I've only got one reply by e-mail, saying that yes, this mutation is sex-linked, therefore we should be able to safely call it an opaline, I haven't been able to get any more information about the birds in question....
                           
                          So maybe someone may have better luck than myself?


                          To: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                          From: tintin_montreal1972 @...
                          Date: Sat, 15 Sep 2007 14:03:22 -0400
                          Subject: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

                          Hey Monica, Terry & Every Birdie,

                          I agree that the B&G Macaws displaying basically clear (white or yellow), heads, necks, upper-mantles, upper-wing coverts & tail feathers (pictured below) are indeed quite identical to Opaline Bourke's, Budgie & Rosella Parakeets.

                          In all of the species listed above, the Opaline mutation greatly reduces eumelanin from the upper-mantle regions where usually body/ground colour is displayed) and these B&G Macaws appear to be showing the exact same trait.

                          As we know the Opaline mutation features many traits which are shared in all Parrot species ;

                          1) Sex-Linked-inhertia nce

                          2) eumelanin suppression in chick's down (but w/o psittacin alteration)

                          3) eumelanin redistribution along with psittacin enhancement

                          It would be very interesting to know wether these basically 'clear' mantled & 'clear' tailed B&G Macaws also share both the clear down in chicks & SL-inheritance ???

                          Best regards,
                          Stéphane
                          (MALE's name french equivalent of Stephen ;-) aka Tintin,
                          Ruby Eyes Aviary.

                          "You remain responsible, forever, for what you have tamed."
                          - Antoine De Saint-Exupéry

                          Terry, I haven't a clue, really. I'd believe recessive, however I haven't asked any of the people from which the pictures originated (if indeed they originated from a said person... instead of a breeder from an organization) .

                          Opaline was simply the closest mutation I could think of that might resemble these macaws. The opaline that is already established in budgies, lovebirds, and rosellas is quite different in each species... however, it seems to me that the description for opaline remains about the same... the spreading of a color over the rest of the body... or rather, in specific locations where that color is not normally there...
                           
                           
                          I used to always think that lutino was always sex-linked mutation, until I read over several discussions which mentioned that in quakers, the ino gene is recessive, and only more frequently possibly sex-linked as well. Thus, it may very well be a unique mutation to the species.
                           
                           
                          In the least, I could certainly try to find out if anyone else knows about these mutations...
                           
                           


                          To: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                          From: sbankvet@bigpond. com
                          Date: Thu, 13 Sep 2007 10:22:41 +1000
                          Subject: [Genetics-Psittacin e] Re:Ara Mutation !!!!

                          Monica and Fids

                                  Any idea of the inheritance of this 'Yellow' mutation. It seems quite a few have been bred so someone should have some idea.

                                  The pattern appears too consistent for a Pied mutation, if sex-linked then Opaline would seem appropriate. Otherwise it might be a unique mutation for this species.

                          ----- Original Message -----

                          Sent: Wednesday, September 12, 2007 10:09 AM

                          Subject: RE: [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara Mutation !!!!

                          I've seen similar markings (as far as toes go) in B&G's and Hyacinths. The B&G not only had a couple discolored toes but also 1 yellow tail feather. The hyacinth only had one or two discolored toes, and others mentioned that the toes, in time, would color up like the rest. If they have I'm not sure but I could try and find out.
                           
                          I agree, most likely a pied mutation.... but speaking of Ara mutations, I'm hoping someone could help me with a couple others?
                           
                          The first mutation is the "yellow" B&G. I first learned about it from someone who had bought the baby B&G in Japan.... however, I have since seen other B&G's with similar or same markings, thus I've already concluded that this must not be a pied mutation, but you can't necessarily call it "yellow" either, considering that there is still blue on the body, thus it's not a lutino. The closest mutation that I'd know of would be the opaline in budgies...
                          http://www.internat ionalparrots. com/images/ 513_untitled_ 7.JPG
                           
                          Now, the reason why I say we need a better name for the "Yellow" B&G is because this same mutation is also seen in a blue mutation of the B&G.... it doesn't sound appropiate to call the bird a "Yellow Blue", or a "White" for that matter... example of this mutation can be seen in the first 3 pics of the one below...
                           
                          The next two pics seem to depict another "Yellow" mutation of the B&G, however when compared to the actual "Yellows", there seems to be some slight differences in the markings of the upper portion of the wings as well as in the tail... which leads me to believe that this may be an entirely different mutation...
                           
                          The bottom two appear to be two different species, however both appear to have horn colored beaks... The one on the left is clearly a blue mutation B&G, but what about the horn coloring of the beak? The one on the right I believe to be a blue mutation (or should I say turqoise?) of the greenwing macaw, however some have argued that it's a hybrid.
                           
                          (originally from Birds International, Inc I believe)
                          http://a347. ac-images. myspacecdn. com/images01/ 57/l_6a77a1ba573 07562e339d267a01 da732.jpg

                           
                          And, I figured, for a good example, here's a couple other pics of the blue mutation B&G....
                          http://www.internat ionalparrots. com/images/ 513_untitled_ 2.JPG
                          http://a186. ac-images. myspacecdn. com/images01/ 46/l_37754d25177 da7beef3536d065e 0fe11.jpg
                          http://www.janeczek .com/biipictures /BGM2.jpg


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                        • Monica & Fids
                          Alright, can you then show me the hyacinth features in this macaw? http://www.parrot.com.hk/BII/bii.jpg The beak to me resembles a greenwing macaw... the green
                          Message 12 of 23 , Oct 17, 2007
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                            Alright, can you then show me the hyacinth features in this macaw?
                            http://www.parrot.com.hk/BII/bii.jpg
                            The beak to me resembles a greenwing macaw... the green on the wings looks a little off, but but if it it's say a turquoise color, would they then not be off to begin with? The facial feathers and tail feathers even seem to match...
                            http://image57.webshots.com/757/5/87/41/2154587410029577929MZjnxQ_ph.jpg
                            http://image59.webshots.com/459/1/98/1/2078198010029577929uRRJPP_fs.jpg
                            http://image53.webshots.com/553/2/44/45/2621244450029577929LdzVEs_fs.jpg
                             
                             
                            I can see the hyacinth in these following hybrids...
                             
                            Emerald
                            http://www.gemsofthejungleaviary.com/images/emeralds_posing_034.jpg
                            http://www.gemsofthejungleaviary.com/images/farm_062.jpg
                            http://www.gemsofthejungleaviary.com/images/farm_063.jpg
                            http://www.featherforum.com/media/images/627863c53ea6175f69cfd862bc803d06-1409.jpg
                            Caloshua
                            http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v195/nix_alba/hybg.jpg
                            Millicinth
                            http://animal-world.com/encyclo/birds/macaws/images/MilicinthWBM_Ac95.jpg
                             
                            I guess I just don't see any hyacinth in the bii.jpg pic, therefore am hoping that someone else might see it as a possible greenwing mutation as well? Since clearly it can't be a hybrid between two black beaked birds.... but not being able to see the FRONT of the bird certainly isn't helping any... 


                            To: Genetics-Psittacine@yahoogroups.com
                            From: Exoticparrots@...
                            Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 10:01:26 +1000
                            Subject: Re: RE : [Genetics-Psittacine] Ara ararauna mutations

                            Hi
                             
                            that what I would say.probably a hyacinth hybrid...

                            ----- Original Message -----
                            Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 9:43 AM
                            Subject: RE: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

                            I'd say the top three are an opaline blue. The next two I'd say opaline but I can't help but think it could also be a pied or something... since the feather coloring in the wings seems mottled... the second to last one is a blue mutation B&G.
                             
                            The VERY last one, the one I am questioning, I was thinking the same idea... turquoise or turqoise blue mutation of the Greenwing Macaw (since there is still some amount of red and green on the bird). However, thus far, all the people I have spoken to about that particular macaw all agree it's some sort of hybrid (maybe they never thought of the possibility of a GW mutation?). Some have even said it's probably a hyacinth hybrid...

                             


                            To: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                            From: wstobart@iinet. net.au
                            Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 07:17:50 +0800
                            Subject: RE: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

                            Hi all,

                             

                            I have also been intrigued by these opaline macaws. The top three images are logically opaline blues. The next two opalines. The last two have blue on top of the head which we can see the opalines do not. What they do remind me of is the turquoiseblue IRN because of the green suffusion over the mantle. With the yellow not yellow but possibly cream coloured if not white and the rest of the bird blue with the green suffusion the only mutation which fits is the turquoise or turquoiseblue. Just my thinking. What say?

                             

                            Willy

                             


                            From: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com [mailto:Genetics- Psittacine @yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of Monica & Fids
                            Sent: Thursday, 18 October 2007 6:57 AM
                            To: genetics-psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                            Subject: RE: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

                             

                            It's kind of hard to find where the exact pictures came from... since many sites have pics from other websites... so therefore, a good question is, are all the opalines situated in the Philippines? Or are there other opalines out there? I've seen pics of a blue mutation B&G in the UK, so the same questions could be asked about that mutation... I agree though, the blue mutation is most likely recessive, but I'd still like to learn more about the opaline mutation if possible.

                            I would enjoy more photos of these birds, as well as other rare mutations!
                             
                            However, I am still wondering about the last macaw in this picture...
                            http://www.parrot. com.hk/BII/ bii.jpg


                            To: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                            From: Exoticparrots@ bigpond.com
                            Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 08:49:34 +1000
                            Subject: Re: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

                            The Opaline and blue mutation are photos from Birds International in the Philippines and they look like they have cracked the opaline now, and also the Blues, and the Opaline look to be Sex linked and the blues are recessive from what I can work out from e-mail from the Philippines. I'm trying to go next year and video them and take photos, here is a photo of one of there large aviaries.

                            ----- Original Message -----

                            Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 5:16 AM

                            Subject: RE: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

                             

                            Sorry everyone, I've got no news here... I've been busy and hadn't gotten around to sending out some e-mails until more recently. Still, I have yet to receive a response from any one of the e-mails I've sent out.
                             
                            I have found only one website that mentioned the "yellow" aka "golden" B&G macaw mutation may be an opaline...
                            http://www.avianweb .com/blueandgold mutations. html (contacted Lein Luu and they said the "yellow mutation" is indeed sex-linked, therefore it very well could be opaline!)
                             
                            Just to be sure I have all the links to the opaline mutations, I'll post them below... so you'll get repeats for any who has seen them before...
                            http://www.internat ionalparrots. com/gallery/ mutationpics. html
                            http://www.parrot. com.hk/BII/ BII.htm
                            http://janeczek. com/start_ e.php?i=bii
                            http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= aeltere_bilder_ und_videos (scroll down - two pics, one same as previous opaline macaw)
                            http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= kontakt
                            http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= paarhaltung
                            http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= innenansicht&pigallery=papabo&pipic=DSC07341. jpg (stunning blue mutation on this page, too!)
                            http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= paarhaltung_ komplett (seen on International Parrots)
                            http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= bilder_philipine n_aug_06&pigallery=impres/ philipienen_ aug_06&pipic=DSC06211. jpg (I'm guessing a blue opaline)
                             
                            This photo here, I couldn't seem to find the original page... it was something about sending the original photos (within this one) by request...
                            http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/uploads/ images/preview_ aramuta.jpg
                             
                             
                            Although I've only got one reply by e-mail, saying that yes, this mutation is sex-linked, therefore we should be able to safely call it an opaline, I haven't been able to get any more information about the birds in question....
                             
                            So maybe someone may have better luck than myself?



                            To: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                            From: tintin_montreal1972 @...
                            Date: Sat, 15 Sep 2007 14:03:22 -0400
                            Subject: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

                            Hey Monica, Terry & Every Birdie,

                            I agree that the B&G Macaws displaying basically clear (white or yellow), heads, necks, upper-mantles, upper-wing coverts & tail feathers (pictured below) are indeed quite identical to Opaline Bourke's, Budgie & Rosella Parakeets.

                             

                             

                             

                            In all of the species listed above, the Opaline mutation greatly reduces eumelanin from the upper-mantle regions where usually body/ground colour is displayed) and these B&G Macaws appear to be showing the exact same trait.

                             

                            As we know the Opaline mutation features many traits which are shared in all Parrot species ;

                             

                            1) Sex-Linked-inhertia nce

                             

                            2) eumelanin suppression in chick's down (but w/o psittacin alteration)

                             

                            3) eumelanin redistribution along with psittacin enhancement

                             

                            It would be very interesting to know wether these basically 'clear' mantled & 'clear' tailed B&G Macaws also share both the clear down in chicks & SL-inheritance ???

                             

                            Best regards,
                            Stéphane
                            (MALE's name french equivalent of Stephen ;-) aka Tintin,
                            Ruby Eyes Aviary.

                            "You remain responsible, forever, for what you have tamed."
                            - Antoine De Saint-Exupéry

                             

                            Terry, I haven't a clue, really. I'd believe recessive, however I haven't asked any of the people from which the pictures originated (if indeed they originated from a said person... instead of a breeder from an organization) .

                            Opaline was simply the closest mutation I could think of that might resemble these macaws. The opaline that is already established in budgies, lovebirds, and rosellas is quite different in each species... however, it seems to me that the description for opaline remains about the same... the spreading of a color over the rest of the body... or rather, in specific locations where that color is not normally there...
                             
                             
                            I used to always think that lutino was always sex-linked mutation, until I read over several discussions which mentioned that in quakers, the ino gene is recessive, and only more frequently possibly sex-linked as well. Thus, it may very well be a unique mutation to the species.
                             
                             
                            In the least, I could certainly try to find out if anyone else knows about these mutations...
                             
                             


                            To: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                            From: sbankvet@bigpond. com
                            Date: Thu, 13 Sep 2007 10:22:41 +1000
                            Subject: [Genetics-Psittacin e] Re:Ara Mutation !!!!

                            Monica and Fids

                             

                                    Any idea of the inheritance of this 'Yellow' mutation. It seems quite a few have been bred so someone should have some idea.

                             

                                    The pattern appears too consistent for a Pied mutation, if sex-linked then Opaline would seem appropriate. Otherwise it might be a unique mutation for this species.

                            ----- Original Message -----

                            Sent: Wednesday, September 12, 2007 10:09 AM

                            Subject: RE: [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara Mutation !!!!

                             

                            I've seen similar markings (as far as toes go) in B&G's and Hyacinths. The B&G not only had a couple discolored toes but also 1 yellow tail feather. The hyacinth only had one or two discolored toes, and others mentioned that the toes, in time, would color up like the rest. If they have I'm not sure but I could try and find out.
                             
                            I agree, most likely a pied mutation.... but speaking of Ara mutations, I'm hoping someone could help me with a couple others?
                             
                            The first mutation is the "yellow" B&G. I first learned about it from someone who had bought the baby B&G in Japan.... however, I have since seen other B&G's with similar or same markings, thus I've already concluded that this must not be a pied mutation, but you can't necessarily call it "yellow" either, considering that there is still blue on the body, thus it's not a lutino. The closest mutation that I'd know of would be the opaline in budgies...
                            http://www.internat ionalparrots. com/images/ 513_untitled_ 7.JPG
                             
                            Now, the reason why I say we need a better name for the "Yellow" B&G is because this same mutation is also seen in a blue mutation of the B&G.... it doesn't sound appropiate to call the bird a "Yellow Blue", or a "White" for that matter... example of this mutation can be seen in the first 3 pics of the one below...
                             
                            The next two pics seem to depict another "Yellow" mutation of the B&G, however when compared to the actual "Yellows", there seems to be some slight differences in the markings of the upper portion of the wings as well as in the tail... which leads me to believe that this may be an entirely different mutation...
                             
                            The bottom two appear to be two different species, however both appear to have horn colored beaks... The one on the left is clearly a blue mutation B&G, but what about the horn coloring of the beak? The one on the right I believe to be a blue mutation (or should I say turqoise?) of the greenwing macaw, however some have argued that it's a hybrid.
                             
                            (originally from Birds International, Inc I believe)
                            http://a347. ac-images. myspacecdn. com/images01/ 57/l_6a77a1ba573 07562e339d267a01 da732.jpg

                             
                            And, I figured, for a good example, here's a couple other pics of the blue mutation B&G....
                            http://www.internat ionalparrots. com/images/ 513_untitled_ 2.JPG
                            http://a186. ac-images. myspacecdn. com/images01/ 46/l_37754d25177 da7beef3536d065e 0fe11.jpg
                            http://www.janeczek .com/biipictures /BGM2.jpg

                             

                             


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                          • Willy Stobart
                            I thought hyacinth because of the feathering completely encircling the eye. The beak is a cross between a black beak and a white beak. Greenwing because of the
                            Message 13 of 23 , Oct 17, 2007
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                              I thought hyacinth because of the feathering completely encircling the eye. The beak is a cross between a black beak and a white beak. Greenwing because of the green mantle and the red peaking through.

                               

                              Willy

                               

                              Ps: great pics, that emerald is hyacinth and what? The most stunning green colour I have ever seen in a parrot!!

                               


                              From: Genetics-Psittacine@yahoogroups.com [mailto: Genetics-Psittacine@yahoogroups.com ] On Behalf Of Monica & Fids
                              Sent: Thursday, 18 October 2007 9:19 AM
                              To: genetics-psittacine@yahoogroups.com
                              Subject: RE: RE : [Genetics-Psittacine] Ara ararauna mutations

                               

                              Alright, can you then show me the hyacinth features in this macaw?
                              http://www.parrot. com.hk/BII/ bii.jpg
                              The beak to me resembles a greenwing macaw... the green on the wings looks a little off, but but if it it's say a turquoise color, would they then not be off to begin with? The facial feathers and tail feathers even seem to match...
                              http://image57. webshots. com/757/5/ 87/41/2154587410 029577929MZjnxQ_ ph.jpg
                              http://image59. webshots. com/459/1/ 98/1/20781980100 29577929uRRJPP_ fs.jpg
                              http://image53. webshots. com/553/2/ 44/45/2621244450 029577929LdzVEs_ fs.jpg
                               
                               
                              I can see the hyacinth in these following hybrids...
                               
                              Emerald
                              http://www.gemsofth ejungleaviary. com/images/ emeralds_ posing_034. jpg
                              http://www.gemsofth ejungleaviary. com/images/ farm_062. jpg
                              http://www.gemsofth ejungleaviary. com/images/ farm_063. jpg
                              http://www.featherf orum.com/ media/images/ 627863c53ea6175f 69cfd862bc803d06 -1409.jpg
                              Caloshua
                              http://img.photobuc ket.com/albums/ v195/nix_ alba/hybg. jpg
                              Millicinth
                              http://animal- world.com/ encyclo/birds/ macaws/images/ MilicinthWBM_ Ac95.jpg
                               
                              I guess I just don't see any hyacinth in the bii.jpg pic, therefore am hoping that someone else might see it as a possible greenwing mutation as well? Since clearly it can't be a hybrid between two black beaked birds.... but not being able to see the FRONT of the bird certainly isn't helping any... 


                              To: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                              From: Exoticparrots@ bigpond.com
                              Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 10:01:26 +1000
                              Subject: Re: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

                              Hi

                               

                              that what I would say.probably a hyacinth hybrid...

                              ----- Original Message -----

                              Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 9:43 AM

                              Subject: RE: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

                               

                              I'd say the top three are an opaline blue. The next two I'd say opaline but I can't help but think it could also be a pied or something... since the feather coloring in the wings seems mottled... the second to last one is a blue mutation B&G.
                               
                              The VERY last one, the one I am questioning, I was thinking the same idea... turquoise or turqoise blue mutation of the Greenwing Macaw (since there is still some amount of red and green on the bird). However, thus far, all the people I have spoken to about that particular macaw all agree it's some sort of hybrid (maybe they never thought of the possibility of a GW mutation?). Some have even said it's probably a hyacinth hybrid...

                               


                              To: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                              From: wstobart@iinet. net.au
                              Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 07:17:50 +0800
                              Subject: RE: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

                              Hi all,

                               

                              I have also been intrigued by these opaline macaws. The top three images are logically opaline blues. The next two opalines. The last two have blue on top of the head which we can see the opalines do not. What they do remind me of is the turquoiseblue IRN because of the green suffusion over the mantle. With the yellow not yellow but possibly cream coloured if not white and the rest of the bird blue with the green suffusion the only mutation which fits is the turquoise or turquoiseblue. Just my thinking. What say?

                               

                              Willy

                               


                              From: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com [mailto: Genetics- Psittacine @yahoogroups. com ] On Behalf Of Monica & Fids
                              Sent: Thursday, 18 October 2007 6:57 AM
                              To: genetics-psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                              Subject: RE: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

                               

                              It's kind of hard to find where the exact pictures came from... since many sites have pics from other websites... so therefore, a good question is, are all the opalines situated in the Philippines ? Or are there other opalines out there? I've seen pics of a blue mutation B&G in the UK , so the same questions could be asked about that mutation... I agree though, the blue mutation is most likely recessive, but I'd still like to learn more about the opaline mutation if possible.

                              I would enjoy more photos of these birds, as well as other rare mutations!
                               
                              However, I am still wondering about the last macaw in this picture...
                              http://www.parrot. com.hk/BII/ bii.jpg


                              To: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                              From: Exoticparrots@ bigpond.com
                              Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 08:49:34 +1000
                              Subject: Re: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

                              The Opaline and blue mutation are photos from Birds International in the Philippines and they look like they have cracked the opaline now, and also the Blues, and the Opaline look to be Sex linked and the blues are recessive from what I can work out from e-mail from the Philippines. I'm trying to go next year and video them and take photos, here is a photo of one of there large aviaries.

                              ----- Original Message -----

                              Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 5:16 AM

                              Subject: RE: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

                               

                              Sorry everyone, I've got no news here... I've been busy and hadn't gotten around to sending out some e-mails until more recently. Still, I have yet to receive a response from any one of the e-mails I've sent out.
                               
                              I have found only one website that mentioned the "yellow" aka "golden" B&G macaw mutation may be an opaline...
                              http://www.avianweb .com/blueandgold mutations. html (contacted Lein Luu and they said the "yellow mutation" is indeed sex-linked, therefore it very well could be opaline!)
                               
                              Just to be sure I have all the links to the opaline mutations, I'll post them below... so you'll get repeats for any who has seen them before...
                              http://www.internat ionalparrots. com/gallery/ mutationpics. html
                              http://www.parrot. com.hk/BII/ BII.htm
                              http://janeczek. com/start_ e.php?i=bii
                              http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= aeltere_bilder_ und_videos (scroll down - two pics, one same as previous opaline macaw)
                              http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= kontakt
                              http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= paarhaltung
                              http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= innenansicht&pigallery=papabo&pipic=DSC07341. jpg (stunning blue mutation on this page, too!)
                              http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= paarhaltung_ komplett (seen on International Parrots)
                              http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= bilder_philipine n_aug_06&pigallery=impres/ philipienen_ aug_06&pipic=DSC06211. jpg (I'm guessing a blue opaline)
                               
                              This photo here, I couldn't seem to find the original page... it was something about sending the original photos (within this one) by request...
                              http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/uploads/ images/preview_ aramuta.jpg
                               
                               
                              Although I've only got one reply by e-mail, saying that yes, this mutation is sex-linked, therefore we should be able to safely call it an opaline, I haven't been able to get any more information about the birds in question....
                               
                              So maybe someone may have better luck than myself?


                              To: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                              From: tintin_montreal1972 @...
                              Date: Sat, 15 Sep 2007 14:03:22 -0400
                              Subject: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

                              Hey Monica, Terry & Every Birdie,

                              I agree that the B&G Macaws displaying basically clear (white or yellow), heads, necks, upper-mantles, upper-wing coverts & tail feathers (pictured below) are indeed quite identical to Opaline Bourke's, Budgie & Rosella Parakeets.

                               

                               

                               

                              In all of the species listed above, the Opaline mutation greatly reduces eumelanin from the upper-mantle regions where usually body/ground colour is displayed) and these B&G Macaws appear to be showing the exact same trait.

                               

                              As we know the Opaline mutation features many traits which are shared in all Parrot species ;

                               

                              1) Sex-Linked-inhertia nce

                               

                              2) eumelanin suppression in chick's down (but w/o psittacin alteration)

                               

                              3) eumelanin redistribution along with psittacin enhancement

                               

                              It would be very interesting to know wether these basically 'clear' mantled & 'clear' tailed B&G Macaws also share both the clear down in chicks & SL-inheritance ???

                               


                              (Message over 64 KB, truncated)

                            • Mick Blake [Exotic Parrots & Karmic Aviar
                              Hi Now Military macaws have a large red head frontal band but the Hybrid Hyacinth Macaw and Military Macaw loss this . Hybrid breed is not like colour breeding
                              Message 14 of 23 , Oct 18, 2007
                              • 0 Attachment
                                Hi Now Military macaws have a large red head frontal band but the Hybrid Hyacinth Macaw and Military Macaw loss this . Hybrid breed is not like colour breeding
                                 
                                Same for the Military macaws B&G Hybrid Losses the red on the head
                                 
                                 
                                ----- Original Message -----
                                Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 1:59 PM
                                Subject: RE: RE : [Genetics-Psittacine] Ara ararauna mutations

                                I thought hyacinth because of the feathering completely encircling the eye. The beak is a cross between a black beak and a white beak. Greenwing because of the green mantle and the red peaking through.

                                Willy

                                Ps: great pics, that emerald is hyacinth and what? The most stunning green colour I have ever seen in a parrot!!


                                From: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com [mailto: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com ] On Behalf Of Monica & Fids
                                Sent: Thursday, 18 October 2007 9:19 AM
                                To: genetics-psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                                Subject: RE: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

                                Alright, can you then show me the hyacinth features in this macaw?
                                http://www.parrot. com.hk/BII/ bii.jpg
                                The beak to me resembles a greenwing macaw... the green on the wings looks a little off, but but if it it's say a turquoise color, would they then not be off to begin with? The facial feathers and tail feathers even seem to match...
                                http://image57. webshots. com/757/5/ 87/41/2154587410 029577929MZjnxQ_ ph.jpg
                                http://image59. webshots. com/459/1/ 98/1/20781980100 29577929uRRJPP_ fs.jpg
                                http://image53. webshots. com/553/2/ 44/45/2621244450 029577929LdzVEs_ fs.jpg
                                 
                                 
                                I can see the hyacinth in these following hybrids...
                                 
                                Emerald
                                http://www.gemsofth ejungleaviary. com/images/ emeralds_ posing_034. jpg
                                http://www.gemsofth ejungleaviary. com/images/ farm_062. jpg
                                http://www.gemsofth ejungleaviary. com/images/ farm_063. jpg
                                http://www.featherf orum.com/ media/images/ 627863c53ea6175f 69cfd862bc803d06 -1409.jpg
                                Caloshua
                                http://img.photobuc ket.com/albums/ v195/nix_ alba/hybg. jpg
                                Millicinth
                                http://animal- world.com/ encyclo/birds/ macaws/images/ MilicinthWBM_ Ac95.jpg
                                 
                                I guess I just don't see any hyacinth in the bii.jpg pic, therefore am hoping that someone else might see it as a possible greenwing mutation as well? Since clearly it can't be a hybrid between two black beaked birds.... but not being able to see the FRONT of the bird certainly isn't helping any... 


                                To: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                                From: Exoticparrots@ bigpond.com
                                Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 10:01:26 +1000
                                Subject: Re: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

                                Hi

                                that what I would say.probably a hyacinth hybrid...

                                ----- Original Message -----

                                Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 9:43 AM

                                Subject: RE: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

                                I'd say the top three are an opaline blue. The next two I'd say opaline but I can't help but think it could also be a pied or something... since the feather coloring in the wings seems mottled... the second to last one is a blue mutation B&G.
                                 
                                The VERY last one, the one I am questioning, I was thinking the same idea... turquoise or turqoise blue mutation of the Greenwing Macaw (since there is still some amount of red and green on the bird). However, thus far, all the people I have spoken to about that particular macaw all agree it's some sort of hybrid (maybe they never thought of the possibility of a GW mutation?). Some have even said it's probably a hyacinth hybrid...

                                 


                                To: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                                From: wstobart@iinet. net.au
                                Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 07:17:50 +0800
                                Subject: RE: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

                                Hi all,

                                I have also been intrigued by these opaline macaws. The top three images are logically opaline blues. The next two opalines. The last two have blue on top of the head which we can see the opalines do not. What they do remind me of is the turquoiseblue IRN because of the green suffusion over the mantle. With the yellow not yellow but possibly cream coloured if not white and the rest of the bird blue with the green suffusion the only mutation which fits is the turquoise or turquoiseblue. Just my thinking. What say?

                                Willy


                                From: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com [mailto: Genetics- Psittacine @yahoogroups. com ] On Behalf Of Monica & Fids
                                Sent: Thursday, 18 October 2007 6:57 AM
                                To: genetics-psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                                Subject: RE: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

                                It's kind of hard to find where the exact pictures came from... since many sites have pics from other websites... so therefore, a good question is, are all the opalines situated in the Philippines ? Or are there other opalines out there? I've seen pics of a blue mutation B&G in the UK , so the same questions could be asked about that mutation... I agree though, the blue mutation is most likely recessive, but I'd still like to learn more about the opaline mutation if possible.

                                I would enjoy more photos of these birds, as well as other rare mutations!
                                 
                                However, I am still wondering about the last macaw in this picture...
                                http://www.parrot. com.hk/BII/ bii.jpg


                                To: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                                From: Exoticparrots@ bigpond.com
                                Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 08:49:34 +1000
                                Subject: Re: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

                                The Opaline and blue mutation are photos from Birds International in the Philippines and they look like they have cracked the opaline now, and also the Blues, and the Opaline look to be Sex linked and the blues are recessive from what I can work out from e-mail from the Philippines. I'm trying to go next year and video them and take photos, here is a photo of one of there large aviaries.

                                ----- Original Message -----

                                Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 5:16 AM

                                Subject: RE: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

                                Sorry everyone, I've got no news here... I've been busy and hadn't gotten around to sending out some e-mails until more recently. Still, I have yet to receive a response from any one of the e-mails I've sent out.
                                 
                                I have found only one website that mentioned the "yellow" aka "golden" B&G macaw mutation may be an opaline...
                                http://www.avianweb .com/blueandgold mutations. html (contacted Lein Luu and they said the "yellow mutation" is indeed sex-linked, therefore it very well could be opaline!)
                                 
                                Just to be sure I have all the links to the opaline mutations, I'll post them below... so you'll get repeats for any who has seen them before...
                                http://www.internat ionalparrots. com/gallery/ mutationpics. html
                                http://www.parrot. com.hk/BII/ BII.htm
                                http://janeczek. com/start_ e.php?i=bii
                                http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= aeltere_bilder_ und_videos (scroll down - two pics, one same as previous opaline macaw)
                                http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= kontakt
                                http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= paarhaltung
                                http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= innenansicht&pigallery=papabo&pipic=DSC07341. jpg (stunning blue mutation on this page, too!)
                                http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= paarhaltung_ komplett (seen on International Parrots)
                                http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= bilder_philipine n_aug_06&pigallery=impres/ philipienen_ aug_06&pipic=DSC06211. jpg (I'm guessing a blue opaline)
                                 
                                This photo here, I couldn't seem to find the original page... it was something about sending the original photos (within this one) by request...
                                http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/uploads/ images/preview_ aramuta.jpg
                                 
                                 
                                Although I've only got one reply by e-mail, saying that yes, this mutation is sex-linked, therefore we should be able to safely call it an opaline, I haven't been able to get any more information about the birds in question....
                                 
                                So maybe someone may have better luck than myself?


                                To: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                                From: tintin_montreal1972 @...
                                Date: Sat, 15 Sep 2007 14:03:22 -0400
                                Subject: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

                                Hey Monica, Terry & Every Birdie,

                                I agree that the B&G Macaws displaying basically clear (white or yellow), heads, necks, upper-mantles, upper-wing coverts & tail feathers (pictured below) are indeed quite identical to Opaline Bourke's, Budgie & Rosella Parakeets.

                                In all of the species listed above, the Opaline mutation greatly reduces eumelanin from the upper-mantle regions where usually body/ground colour is displayed) and these B&G Macaws appear to be showing the exact same trait.

                                As we know the Opaline mutation features many traits which are shared in all Parrot species ;

                                1) Sex-Linked-inhertia nce

                                2) eumelanin suppression in chick's down (but w/o psittacin alteration)

                                3) eumelanin redistribution along with psittacin enhancement

                                It would be very interesting to know wether these basically 'clear' mantled & 'clear' tailed B&G Macaws also share both the clear down in chicks & SL-inheritance ???

                                Best regards,
                                Stéphane
                                (MALE's name french equivalent of Stephen ;-) aka Tintin,
                                Ruby Eyes Aviary.

                                "You remain responsible, forever, for what you have tamed."
                                - Antoine De Saint-Exupéry

                                Terry, I haven't a clue, really. I'd believe recessive, however I haven't asked any of the people from which the pictures originated (if indeed they originated from a said person... instead of a breeder from an organization) .

                                Opaline was simply the closest mutation I could think of that might resemble these macaws. The opaline that is already established in budgies, lovebirds, and rosellas is quite different in each species... however, it seems to me that the description for opaline remains about the same... the spreading of a color over the rest of the body... or rather, in specific locations where that color is not normally there...
                                 
                                 
                                I used to always think that lutino was always sex-linked mutation, until I read over several discussions which mentioned that in quakers, the ino gene is recessive, and only more frequently possibly sex-linked as well. Thus, it may very well be a unique mutation to the species.
                                 
                                 
                                In the least, I could certainly try to find out if anyone else knows about these mutations...
                                 
                                 


                                To: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                                From: sbankvet@bigpond. com
                                Date: Thu, 13 Sep 2007 10:22:41 +1000
                                Subject: [Genetics-Psittacin e] Re:Ara Mutation !!!!

                                Monica and Fids

                                        Any idea of the inheritance of this 'Yellow' mutation. It seems quite a few have been bred so someone should have some idea.

                                        The pattern appears too consistent for a Pied mutation, if sex-linked then Opaline would seem appropriate. Otherwise it might be a unique mutation for this species.

                                ----- Original Message -----

                                Sent: Wednesday, September 12, 2007 10:09 AM

                                Subject: RE: [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara Mutation !!!!

                                I've seen similar markings (as far as toes go) in B&G's and Hyacinths. The B&G not only had a couple discolored toes but also 1 yellow tail feather. The hyacinth only had one or two discolored toes, and others mentioned that the toes, in time, would color up like the rest. If they have I'm not sure but I could try and find out.
                                 
                                I agree, most likely a pied mutation.... but speaking of Ara mutations, I'm hoping someone could help me with a couple others?
                                 
                                The first mutation is the "yellow" B&G. I first learned about it from someone who had bought the baby B&G in Japan.... however, I have since seen other B&G's with similar or same markings, thus I've already concluded that this must not be a pied mutation, but you can't necessarily call it "yellow" either, considering that there is still blue on the body, thus it's not a lutino. The closest mutation that I'd know of would be the opaline in budgies...
                                http://www.internat ionalparrots. com/images/ 513_untitled_ 7.JPG
                                 
                                Now, the reason why I say we need a better name for the "Yellow" B&G is because this same mutation is also seen in a blue mutation of the B&G.... it doesn't sound appropiate to call the bird a "Yellow Blue", or a "White" for that matter... example of this mutation can be seen in the first 3 pics of the one below...
                                 
                                The next two pics seem to depict another "Yellow" mutation of the B&G, however when compared to the actual "Yellows", there seems to be some slight differences in the markings of the upper portion of the wings as well as in the tail... which leads me to believe that this may be an entirely different mutation...
                                 
                                The bottom two appear to be two different species, however both appear to have horn colored beaks... The one on the left is clearly a blue mutation B&G, but what about the horn coloring of the beak? The one on the right I believe to be a blue mutation (or should I say turqoise?) of the greenwing macaw, however some have argued that it's a hybrid.
                                 
                                (originally from Birds International, Inc I believe)
                                http://a347. ac-images. myspacecdn. com/images01/ 57/l_6a77a1ba573 07562e339d267a01 da732.jpg

                                 
                                And, I figured, for a good example, here's a couple other pics of the blue mutation B&G....
                                http://www.internat ionalparrots. com/images/ 513_untitled_ 2.JPG
                                http://a186. ac-images. myspacecdn. com/images01/ 46/l_37754d25177 da7beef3536d065e 0fe11.jpg
                                http://www.janeczek .com/biipictures /BGM2.jpg


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                              • Sallie Klink
                                I have a pair of very large Harilquins that look alot like them. I wish there was a front view. Sallie Mick Blake [Exotic Parrots & Karmic Aviaries]
                                Message 15 of 23 , Oct 18, 2007
                                • 0 Attachment
                                  I have a pair of very large Harilquins that look alot like them. I wish there was a front view.
                                  Sallie

                                  "Mick Blake [Exotic Parrots & Karmic Aviaries]" <Exoticparrots@...> wrote:
                                  Hi Now Military macaws have a large red head frontal band but the Hybrid Hyacinth Macaw and Military Macaw loss this . Hybrid breed is not like colour breeding
                                   
                                  Same for the Military macaws B&G Hybrid Losses the red on the head
                                   
                                   
                                  ----- Original Message -----
                                  Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 1:59 PM
                                  Subject: RE: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

                                  I thought hyacinth because of the feathering completely encircling the eye. The beak is a cross between a black beak and a white beak. Greenwing because of the green mantle and the red peaking through.
                                  Willy
                                  Ps: great pics, that emerald is hyacinth and what? The most stunning green colour I have ever seen in a parrot!!

                                  From: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com [mailto: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com ] On Behalf Of Monica & Fids
                                  Sent: Thursday, 18 October 2007 9:19 AM
                                  To: genetics-psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                                  Subject: RE: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations
                                  Alright, can you then show me the hyacinth features in this macaw?
                                  http://www.parrot. com.hk/BII/ bii.jpg
                                  The beak to me resembles a greenwing macaw... the green on the wings looks a little off, but but if it it's say a turquoise color, would they then not be off to begin with? The facial feathers and tail feathers even seem to match...
                                  http://image57. webshots. com/757/5/ 87/41/2154587410 029577929MZjnxQ_ ph.jpg
                                  http://image59. webshots. com/459/1/ 98/1/20781980100 29577929uRRJPP_ fs.jpg
                                  http://image53. webshots. com/553/2/ 44/45/2621244450 029577929LdzVEs_ fs.jpg
                                   
                                   
                                  I can see the hyacinth in these following hybrids...
                                   
                                  Emerald
                                  http://www.gemsofth ejungleaviary. com/images/ emeralds_ posing_034. jpg
                                  http://www.gemsofth ejungleaviary. com/images/ farm_062. jpg
                                  http://www.gemsofth ejungleaviary. com/images/ farm_063. jpg
                                  http://www.featherf orum.com/ media/images/ 627863c53ea6175f 69cfd862bc803d06 -1409.jpg
                                  Caloshua
                                  http://img.photobuc ket.com/albums/ v195/nix_ alba/hybg. jpg
                                  Millicinth
                                  http://animal- world.com/ encyclo/birds/ macaws/images/ MilicinthWBM_ Ac95.jpg
                                   
                                  I guess I just don't see any hyacinth in the bii.jpg pic, therefore am hoping that someone else might see it as a possible greenwing mutation as well? Since clearly it can't be a hybrid between two black beaked birds.... but not being able to see the FRONT of the bird certainly isn't helping any... 

                                  To: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                                  From: Exoticparrots@ bigpond.com
                                  Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 10:01:26 +1000
                                  Subject: Re: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations
                                  Hi
                                  that what I would say.probably a hyacinth hybrid...
                                  ----- Original Message -----
                                  Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 9:43 AM
                                  Subject: RE: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations
                                  I'd say the top three are an opaline blue. The next two I'd say opaline but I can't help but think it could also be a pied or something... since the feather coloring in the wings seems mottled... the second to last one is a blue mutation B&G.
                                   
                                  The VERY last one, the one I am questioning, I was thinking the same idea... turquoise or turqoise blue mutation of the Greenwing Macaw (since there is still some amount of red and green on the bird). However, thus far, all the people I have spoken to about that particular macaw all agree it's some sort of hybrid (maybe they never thought of the possibility of a GW mutation?). Some have even said it's probably a hyacinth hybrid...

                                   

                                  To: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                                  From: wstobart@iinet. net.au
                                  Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 07:17:50 +0800
                                  Subject: RE: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations
                                  Hi all,
                                  I have also been intrigued by these opaline macaws. The top three images are logically opaline blues. The next two opalines. The last two have blue on top of the head which we can see the opalines do not. What they do remind me of is the turquoiseblue IRN because of the green suffusion over the mantle. With the yellow not yellow but possibly cream coloured if not white and the rest of the bird blue with the green suffusion the only mutation which fits is the turquoise or turquoiseblue. Just my thinking. What say?
                                  Willy

                                  From: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com [mailto: Genetics- Psittacine @yahoogroups. com ] On Behalf Of Monica & Fids
                                  Sent: Thursday, 18 October 2007 6:57 AM
                                  To: genetics-psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                                  Subject: RE: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations
                                  It's kind of hard to find where the exact pictures came from... since many sites have pics from other websites... so therefore, a good question is, are all the opalines situated in the Philippines ? Or are there other opalines out there? I've seen pics of a blue mutation B&G in the UK , so the same questions could be asked about that mutation... I agree though, the blue mutation is most likely recessive, but I'd still like to learn more about the opaline mutation if possible.

                                  I would enjoy more photos of these birds, as well as other rare mutations!
                                   
                                  However, I am still wondering about the last macaw in this picture...
                                  http://www.parrot. com.hk/BII/ bii.jpg

                                  To: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                                  From: Exoticparrots@ bigpond.com
                                  Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 08:49:34 +1000
                                  Subject: Re: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations
                                  The Opaline and blue mutation are photos from Birds International in the Philippines and they look like they have cracked the opaline now, and also the Blues, and the Opaline look to be Sex linked and the blues are recessive from what I can work out from e-mail from the Philippines. I'm trying to go next year and video them and take photos, here is a photo of one of there large aviaries.
                                  ----- Original Message -----
                                  Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 5:16 AM
                                  Subject: RE: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations
                                  Sorry everyone, I've got no news here... I've been busy and hadn't gotten around to sending out some e-mails until more recently. Still, I have yet to receive a response from any one of the e-mails I've sent out.
                                   
                                  I have found only one website that mentioned the "yellow" aka "golden" B&G macaw mutation may be an opaline...
                                  http://www.avianweb .com/blueandgold mutations. html (contacted Lein Luu and they said the "yellow mutation" is indeed sex-linked, therefore it very well could be opaline!)
                                   
                                  Just to be sure I have all the links to the opaline mutations, I'll post them below... so you'll get repeats for any who has seen them before...
                                  http://www.internat ionalparrots. com/gallery/ mutationpics. html
                                  http://www.parrot. com.hk/BII/ BII.htm
                                  http://janeczek. com/start_ e.php?i=bii
                                  http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= aeltere_bilder_ und_videos (scroll down - two pics, one same as previous opaline macaw)
                                  http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= kontakt
                                  http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= paarhaltung
                                  http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= innenansicht&pigallery=papabo&pipic=DSC07341. jpg (stunning blue mutation on this page, too!)
                                  http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= paarhaltung_ komplett (seen on International Parrots)
                                  http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= bilder_philipine n_aug_06&pigallery=impres/ philipienen_ aug_06&pipic=DSC06211. jpg (I'm guessing a blue opaline)
                                   
                                  This photo here, I couldn't seem to find the original page... it was something about sending the original photos (within this one) by request...
                                  http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/uploads/ images/preview_ aramuta.jpg
                                   
                                   
                                  Although I've only got one reply by e-mail, saying that yes, this mutation is sex-linked, therefore we should be able to safely call it an opaline, I haven't been able to get any more information about the birds in question....
                                   
                                  So maybe someone may have better luck than myself?


                                  To: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                                  From: tintin_montreal1972 @...
                                  Date: Sat, 15 Sep 2007 14:03:22 -0400
                                  Subject: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations
                                  Hey Monica, Terry & Every Birdie,
                                  I agree that the B&G Macaws displaying basically clear (white or yellow), heads, necks, upper-mantles, upper-wing coverts & tail feathers (pictured below) are indeed quite identical to Opaline Bourke's, Budgie & Rosella Parakeets.
                                  In all of the species listed above, the Opaline mutation greatly reduces eumelanin from the upper-mantle regions where usually body/ground colour is displayed) and these B&G Macaws appear to be showing the exact same trait.
                                  As we know the Opaline mutation features many traits which are shared in all Parrot species ;
                                  1) Sex-Linked-inhertia nce
                                  2) eumelanin suppression in chick's down (but w/o psittacin alteration)
                                  3) eumelanin redistribution along with psittacin enhancement
                                  It would be very interesting to know wether these basically 'clear' mantled & 'clear' tailed B&G Macaws also share both the clear down in chicks & SL-inheritance ???
                                  Best regards,
                                  Stéphane
                                  (MALE's name french equivalent of Stephen ;-) aka Tintin,
                                  Ruby Eyes Aviary.

                                  "You remain responsible, forever, for what you have tamed."
                                  - Antoine De Saint-Exupéry
                                  Terry, I haven't a clue, really. I'd believe recessive, however I haven't asked any of the people from which the pictures originated (if indeed they originated from a said person... instead of a breeder from an organization) .

                                  Opaline was simply the closest mutation I could think of that might resemble these macaws. The opaline that is already established in budgies, lovebirds, and rosellas is quite different in each species... however, it seems to me that the description for opaline remains about the same... the spreading of a color over the rest of the body... or rather, in specific locations where that color is not normally there...
                                   
                                   
                                  I used to always think that lutino was always sex-linked mutation, until I read over several discussions which mentioned that in quakers, the ino gene is recessive, and only more frequently possibly sex-linked as well. Thus, it may very well be a unique mutation to the species.
                                   
                                   
                                  In the least, I could certainly try to find out if anyone else knows about these mutations...
                                   
                                   

                                  To: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                                  From: sbankvet@bigpond. com
                                  Date: Thu, 13 Sep 2007 10:22:41 +1000
                                  Subject: [Genetics-Psittacin e] Re:Ara Mutation !!!!
                                  Monica and Fids
                                          Any idea of the inheritance of this 'Yellow' mutation. It seems quite a few have been bred so someone should have some idea.
                                          The pattern appears too consistent for a Pied mutation, if sex-linked then Opaline would seem appropriate. Otherwise it might be a unique mutation for this species.
                                  ----- Original Message -----
                                  Sent: Wednesday, September 12, 2007 10:09 AM
                                  Subject: RE: [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara Mutation !!!!
                                  I've seen similar markings (as far as toes go) in B&G's and Hyacinths. The B&G not only had a couple discolored toes but also 1 yellow tail feather. The hyacinth only had one or two discolored toes, and others mentioned that the toes, in time, would color up like the rest. If they have I'm not sure but I could try and find out.
                                   
                                  I agree, most likely a pied mutation.... but speaking of Ara mutations, I'm hoping someone could help me with a couple others?
                                   
                                  The first mutation is the "yellow" B&G. I first learned about it from someone who had bought the baby B&G in Japan.... however, I have since seen other B&G's with similar or same markings, thus I've already concluded that this must not be a pied mutation, but you can't necessarily call it "yellow" either, considering that there is still blue on the body, thus it's not a lutino. The closest mutation that I'd know of would be the opaline in budgies...
                                  http://www.internat ionalparrots. com/images/ 513_untitled_ 7.JPG
                                   
                                  Now, the reason why I say we need a better name for the "Yellow" B&G is because this same mutation is also seen in a blue mutation of the B&G.... it doesn't sound appropiate to call the bird a "Yellow Blue", or a "White" for that matter... example of this mutation can be seen in the first 3 pics of the one below...
                                   
                                  The next two pics seem to depict another "Yellow" mutation of the B&G, however when compared to the actual "Yellows", there seems to be some slight differences in the markings of the upper portion of the wings as well as in the tail... which leads me to believe that this may be an entirely different mutation...
                                   
                                  The bottom two appear to be two different species, however both appear to have horn colored beaks... The one on the left is clearly a blue mutation B&G, but what about the horn coloring of the beak? The one on the right I believe to be a blue mutation (or should I say turqoise?) of the greenwing macaw, however some have argued that it's a hybrid.
                                   
                                  (originally from Birds International, Inc I believe)
                                  http://a347. ac-images. myspacecdn. com/images01/ 57/l_6a77a1ba573 07562e339d267a01 da732.jpg

                                   
                                  And, I figured, for a good example, here's a couple other pics of the blue mutation B&G....
                                  http://www.internat ionalparrots. com/images/ 513_untitled_ 2.JPG
                                  http://a186. ac-images. myspacecdn. com/images01/ 46/l_37754d25177 da7beef3536d065e 0fe11.jpg
                                  http://www.janeczek .com/biipictures /BGM2.jpg

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                                  ~Birds of a Feather....Flock Together~ Sallie Klink's Bird Haven, Inc.
                                • Mick Blake [Exotic Parrots & Karmic Aviar
                                  Hi Sallie, Can you send me a pic or two privately Please. karmic@irock.com.au Mick Mick & Karin Blake Owners & Managers of Karmic Aviaries, Avicultural
                                  Message 16 of 23 , Oct 18, 2007
                                  • 0 Attachment
                                    Hi Sallie,
                                     
                                    Can you send me a pic or two  privately Please.
                                     
                                    Mick
                                     
                                    Mick & Karin Blake
                                    Owners & Managers of
                                    Karmic Aviaries,
                                    Avicultural Consultant
                                    38 years breeding Mutations,
                                    One Stack Pottery & Basilisk Gallery
                                    Mt Morgan Queensland
                                    Australia.
                                    www.karmicaviaries.com
                                    ----- Original Message -----
                                    Sent: Friday, October 19, 2007 3:35 AM
                                    Subject: Re: RE : [Genetics-Psittacine] Ara ararauna mutations

                                    I have a pair of very large Harilquins that look alot like them. I wish there was a front view.
                                    Sallie

                                    "Mick Blake [Exotic Parrots & Karmic Aviaries]" <Exoticparrots@ bigpond.com> wrote:
                                    Hi Now Military macaws have a large red head frontal band but the Hybrid Hyacinth Macaw and Military Macaw loss this . Hybrid breed is not like colour breeding
                                     
                                    Same for the Military macaws B&G Hybrid Losses the red on the head
                                     
                                     
                                    ----- Original Message -----
                                    Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 1:59 PM
                                    Subject: RE: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations

                                    I thought hyacinth because of the feathering completely encircling the eye. The beak is a cross between a black beak and a white beak. Greenwing because of the green mantle and the red peaking through.
                                    Willy
                                    Ps: great pics, that emerald is hyacinth and what? The most stunning green colour I have ever seen in a parrot!!

                                    From: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com [mailto: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com ] On Behalf Of Monica & Fids
                                    Sent: Thursday, 18 October 2007 9:19 AM
                                    To: genetics-psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                                    Subject: RE: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations
                                    Alright, can you then show me the hyacinth features in this macaw?
                                    http://www.parrot. com.hk/BII/ bii.jpg
                                    The beak to me resembles a greenwing macaw... the green on the wings looks a little off, but but if it it's say a turquoise color, would they then not be off to begin with? The facial feathers and tail feathers even seem to match...
                                    http://image57. webshots. com/757/5/ 87/41/2154587410 029577929MZjnxQ_ ph.jpg
                                    http://image59. webshots. com/459/1/ 98/1/20781980100 29577929uRRJPP_ fs.jpg
                                    http://image53. webshots. com/553/2/ 44/45/2621244450 029577929LdzVEs_ fs.jpg
                                     
                                     
                                    I can see the hyacinth in these following hybrids...
                                     
                                    Emerald
                                    http://www.gemsofth ejungleaviary. com/images/ emeralds_ posing_034. jpg
                                    http://www.gemsofth ejungleaviary. com/images/ farm_062. jpg
                                    http://www.gemsofth ejungleaviary. com/images/ farm_063. jpg
                                    http://www.featherf orum.com/ media/images/ 627863c53ea6175f 69cfd862bc803d06 -1409.jpg
                                    Caloshua
                                    http://img.photobuc ket.com/albums/ v195/nix_ alba/hybg. jpg
                                    Millicinth
                                    http://animal- world.com/ encclo/birds/ macaws/images/ MilicinthWBM_ Ac95.jpg
                                     
                                    I guess I just don't see any hyacinth in the bii.jpg pic, therefore am hoping that someone else might see it as a possible greenwing mutation as well? Since clearly it can't be a hybrid between two black beaked birds.... but not being able to see the FRONT of the bird certainly isn't helping any... 

                                    To: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                                    From: Exoticparrots@ bigpond.com
                                    Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 10:01:26 +1000
                                    Subject: Re: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations
                                    Hi
                                    that what I would say.probably a hyacinth hybrid...
                                    ----- Original Message -----
                                    Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 9:43 AM
                                    Subject: RE: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations
                                    I'd say the top three are an opaline blue. The next two I'd say opaline but I can't help but think it could also be a pied or something... since the feather coloring in the wings seems mottled... the second to last one is a blue mutation B&G.
                                     
                                    The VERY last one, the one I am questioning, I was thinking the same idea... turquoise or turqoise blue mutation of the Greenwing Macaw (since there is still some amount of red and green on the bird). However, thus far, all the people I have spoken to about that particular macaw all agree it's some sort of hybrid (maybe they never thought of the possibility of a GW mutation?). Some have even said it's probably a hyacinth hybrid...

                                     

                                    To: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                                    From: wstobart@iinet. net.au
                                    Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 07:17:50 +0800
                                    Subject: RE: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations
                                    Hi all,
                                    I have also been intrigued by these opaline macaws. The top three images are logically opaline blues. The next two opalines. The last two have blue on top of the head which we can see the opalines do not. What they do remind me of is the turquoiseblue IRN because of the green suffusion over the mantle. With the yellow not yellow but possibly cream coloured if not white and the rest of the bird blue with the green suffusion the only mutation which fits is the turquoise or turquoiseblue. Just my thinking. What say?
                                    Willy

                                    From: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com [mailto: Genetics- Psittacine @yahoogroups. com ] On Behalf Of Monica & Fids
                                    Sent: Thursday, 18 October 2007 6:57 AM
                                    To: genetics-psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                                    Subject: RE: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations
                                    It's kind of hard to find where the exact pictures came from... since many sites have pics from other websites... so therefore, a good question is, are all the opalines situated in the Philippines ? Or are there other opalines out there? I've seen pics of a blue mutation B&G in the UK , so the same questions could be asked about that mutation... I agree though, the blue mutation is most likely recessive, but I'd still like to learn more about the opaline mutation if possible.

                                    I would enjoy more photos of these birds, as well as other rare mutations!
                                     
                                    However, I am still wondering about the last macaw in this picture...
                                    http://www.parrot. com.hk/BII/ bii.jpg

                                    To: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                                    From: Exoticparrots@ bigpond.com
                                    Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 08:49:34 +1000
                                    Subject: Re: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations
                                    The Opaline and blue mutation are photos from Birds International in the Philippines and they look like they have cracked the opaline now, and also the Blues, and the Opaline look to be Sex linked and the blues are recessive from what I can work out from e-mail from the Philippines. I'm trying to go next year and video them and take photos, here is a photo of one of there large aviaries.
                                    ----- Original Message -----
                                    Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 5:16 AM
                                    Subject: RE: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations
                                    Sorry everyone, I've got no news here... I've been busy and hadn't gotten around to sending out some e-mails until more recently. Still, I have yet to receive a response from any one of the e-mails I've sent out.
                                     
                                    I have found only one website that mentioned the "yellow" aka "golden" B&G macaw mutation may be an opaline...
                                    http://www.avianweb .com/blueandgold mutations. html (contacted Lein Luu and they said the "yellow mutation" is indeed sex-linked, therefore it very well could be opaline!)
                                     
                                    Just to be sure I have all the links to the opaline mutations, I'll post them below... so you'll get repeats for any who has seen them before...
                                    http://www.internat ionalparrots. com/gallery/ mutationpics. html
                                    http://www.parrot. com.hk/BII/ BII.htm
                                    http://janeczek. com/start_ e.php?i=bii
                                    http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= aeltere_bilder_ und_videos (scroll down - two pics, one same as previous opaline macaw)
                                    http://www.papageie npark-bocum. de/pub/index. php?page= kontakt
                                    http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= paarhaltung
                                    http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= innenansicht&pigallery=papabo&pipic=DSC07341. jpg (stunning blue mutation on this page, too!)
                                    http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= paarhaltung_ komplett (seen on International Parrots)
                                    http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/index. php?page= bilder_philipine n_aug_06&pigallery=impres/ philipienen_ aug_06&pipic=DSC06211. jpg (I'm guessing a blue opaline)
                                     
                                    This photo here, I couldn't seem to find the original page... it was something about sending the original photos (within this one) by request...
                                    http://www.papageie npark-bochum. de/pub/uploads/ images/preview_ aramuta.jpg
                                     
                                     
                                    Although I've only got one reply by e-mail, saying that yes, this mutation is sex-linked, therefore we should be able to safely call it an opaline, I haven't been able to get any more information about the birds in question....
                                     
                                    So maybe someone may have better luck than myself?


                                    To: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                                    From: tintin_montreal1972 @...
                                    Date: Sat, 15 Sep 2007 14:03:22 -0400
                                    Subject: RE : [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara ararauna mutations
                                    Hey Monica, Terry & Every Birdie,
                                    I agree that the B&G Macaws displaying basically clear (white or yellow), heads, necks, upper-mantles, upper-wing coverts & tail feathers (pictured below) are indeed quite identical to Opaline Bourke's, Budgie & Rosella Parakeets.
                                    In all of the species listed above, the Opaline mutation grealy reduces eumelanin from the upper-mantle regions where usually body/ground colour is displayed) and these B&G Macaws appear to be showing the exact same trait.
                                    As we know the Opaline mutation features many traits which are shared in all Parrot species ;
                                    1) Sex-Linked-inhertia nce
                                    2) eumelanin suppression in chick's down (but w/o psittacin alteration)
                                    3) eumelanin redistribution along with psittacin enhancement
                                    It would be very interesting to know wether these basically 'clear' mantled & 'clear' tailed B&G Macaws also share both the clear down in chicks & SL-inheritance ???
                                    Best regards,
                                    Stéphane
                                    (MALE's name french equivalent of Stephen ;-) aka Tintin,
                                    Ruby Eyes Aviary.

                                    "You remain responsible, forever, for what you have tamed."
                                    - Antoine De Saint-Exupéry
                                    Terry, I haven't a clue, really. I'd believe recessive, however I haven't asked any of the people from which the pictures originated (if indeed they originated from a said person... instead of a breeder from an organization) .

                                    Opaline was simply the closest mutation I could think of that might resemble these macaws. The opaline that is already established in budgies, lovebirds, and rosellas is quite different in each species... however, it seems to me that the description for opaline remains about the same... the spreading of a color over the rest of the body... or rather, in specific locations where that color is not normally there...
                                     
                                     
                                    I used to always think that lutino was always sex-linked mutation, until I read over several discussions which mentioned that in quakers, the ino gene is recessive, and only more frequently possibly sex-linked as well. Thus, it may very well be a unique mutation to the species.
                                     
                                     
                                    In the least, I could certainly try to find out if anyone else knows about these mutations...
                                     
                                     

                                    To: Genetics-Psittacine @yahoogroups. com
                                    From: sbankvet@bigpond. com
                                    Date: Thu, 13 Sep 2007 10:22:41 +1000
                                    Subject: [Genetics-Psittacin e] Re:Ara Mutation !!!!
                                    Monica and Fids
                                            Any idea of the inheritance of this 'Yellow' mutation. It seems quite a few have been bred so someone should have some idea.
                                            The pattern appears too consistent for a Pied mutation, if sex-linked then Opaline would seem appropriate. Otherwise it might be a unique mutation for this species.
                                    ----- Original Message -----
                                    Sent: Wednesday, September 12, 2007 10:09 AM
                                    Subject: RE: [Genetics-Psittacin e] Ara Mutation !!!!
                                    I've seen similar markings (as far as toes go) in B&G's and Hyacinths. The B&G not only had a couple discolored toes but also 1 yellow tail feather. The hyacinth only had one or two discolored toes, and others mentioned that the toes, in time, would color up like the rest. If they have I'm not sure but I could try and find out.
                                     
                                    I agree, most likely a pied mutation.... but speaking of Ara mutations, I'm hoping someone could help me with a couple others?
                                     
                                    The first mutation is the "yellow" B&G. I first learned about it from someone who had bought the baby B&G in Japan.... however, I have since seen other B&G's with similar or same markings, thus I've already concluded that this must not be a pied mutation, but you can't necessarily call it "yellow" either, considering that there is still blue on the body, thus it's not a lutino. The closest mutation that I'd know of would be the opaline in budgies...
                                    http://www.internat ionalparrots. com/images/ 513_untitled_ 7.JPG
                                     
                                    Now, the reason why I say we need a better name for the "Yellow" B&G is because this same mutation is also seen in a blue mutation of the B&G.... it doesn't sound appropiate to call the bird a "Yellow Blue", or a "White" for that matter... example of this mutation can be seen in the first 3 pics of the one below...
                                     
                                    The next two pics seem to depict another "Yellow" mutation of the B&G, however when compared to the actual "Yellows", there seems to be some slight differences in the markings of the upper portion of the wings as well as in the tail... which leads me to believe that this may be an entirely different mutation...
                                     
                                    The bottom two appear to be two different species, however both appear to have horn colored beaks... The one on the left is clearly a blue mutation B&G, but what about the horn coloring of the beak? The one on the right I believe to be a blue mutation (or should I say turqoise?) of the greenwing macaw, however some have argued that it's a hybrid.
                                     
                                    (originally from Birds International, Inc I believe)
                                    http://a347. ac-images. myspacecdn. com/images01/ 57/l_6a77a1ba573 07562e339d267a01 da732.jpg

                                     
                                    And, I figured, for a good example, here's a couple other pics of the blue mutation B&G....
                                    http://www.internat ionalparrots. com/images/ 513_untitled_ 2.JPG
                                    http://a186. ac-images. myspacecdn. com/images01/ 46/l_37754d25177 da7beef3536d065e 0fe11.jpg
                                    http://www.janeczek .com/biipictures /BGM2.jpg

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                                    Obtenez des réponses à vos questions ! Profitez des connaissances et des opinions des internautes sur Yahoo! Questions/Réponses.

                                    Help yourself to FREE treats served up daily at the Messenger Café. Stop by today!


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                                    Version: 7.5.488 / Virus Database: 269.14.13/1074 - Release Date: 16/10/2007 2:14 PM

                                    Help yourself to FREE treats served up daily at the Messenger Café. Stop by today!

                                    Help yourself to FREE treats served up daily at the Messenger Café. Stop by today!


                                    No virus found in this incoming message.
                                    Checked by AVG Free Edition.
                                    Version: 7.5.488 / Virus Database: 269.15.0/1076 - Release Date: 17/10/2007 7:53 PM

                                    Help yourself to FREE treats served up daily at the Messenger Café. Stop by today!

                                    No virus found in this incoming message.
                                    Checked by AVG Free Edition.
                                    Version: 7.5.488 / Virus Database: 269.15.0/1076 - Release Date: 17/10/2007 7:53 PM



                                    ~Birds of a Feather....Flock Together~ Sallie Klink's Bird Haven, Inc.


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                                    Checked by AVG Free Edition.
                                    Version: 7.5.488 / Virus Database: 269.15.0/1076 - Release Date: 17/10/2007 7:53 PM
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