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Help with y-DNA analysis

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  • Thomas
    Hi everyone, I was curious if anyone can comment on some y-DNA results from my DNA project (Reference:
    Message 1 of 5 , Mar 13, 2013
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      Hi everyone,

      I was curious if anyone can comment on some y-DNA results from my DNA project (Reference: http://www.familytreedna.com/public/weingart/default.aspx?section=yresults )

      I recently received y-DNA results back from my 5th cousin. According to our respective family trees, we trace back to the same 4th great-grandfather. Below are differences we have:

      For the first 12 markers we match 12 for 12.
      At the 25 marker level everything matches except for

      DYS459
      my Kit 40543: 9-10
      my cousin's Kit 269385: 9-9

      DYS464
      my Kit 40543: 11-12-14-15-16
      my cousin's Kit 269385: 11-12-12-14-14-15-15-16

      At the 37 marker level there is a difference at

      DYS-CDY
      my Kit 40543: 35-41
      my cousin's Kit 269385: 34-35

      The difference at DYS459 is not extraordinary.

      However, I don't know how I should interpret the differences at DYS464 and DYS-CDY. If the paper trail that my cousin and I have is correct, would such diverse differences occur?

      When the next sale occurs, I think I should upgrade to the 67 marker or the 111 marker level.

      Thanks for any insight – I appreciate it very much.

      - Tom Weingart
    • Bob Mclaren
      Tom, First the DYS#464 results. I suspect that your 464 results are not correct. DYS #464 is a very difficult one to read. So, I suspect what happened is
      Message 2 of 5 , Mar 13, 2013
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        Tom,

         

        First the DYS#464 results.  I suspect that your 464 results are not correct.  DYS #464 is a very difficult one to read.  So, I suspect what happened is that they had some trouble reading yours and misjudged the peaks.

         

        CDYa/b is highly unusual.  This is a marker with a very high mutation rate, so differences between relatives is not unusual.  However, the amount of difference in your case is unusual.

         

        I would contact FTDNA and ask them to reexamine 464 and CDY for you and your cousin.  Is there is still a difference at 464, I would do a 646x test on both of you.  This will read the correct number of duplicates.

         

        Yours aye,

         

        Bob McLaren

         

        From: GenGen-NV@yahoogroups.com [mailto:GenGen-NV@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Thomas
        Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 12:07 AM
        To: GenGen-NV@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: [GenGen-NV] Help with y-DNA analysis

         

          Hi everyone,

        I was curious if anyone can comment on some y-DNA results from my DNA project (Reference: http://www.familytreedna.com/public/weingart/default.aspx?section=yresults )

        I recently received y-DNA results back from my 5th cousin. According to our respective family trees, we trace back to the same 4th great-grandfather. Below are differences we have:

        For the first 12 markers we match 12 for 12.
        At the 25 marker level everything matches except for

        DYS459
        my Kit 40543: 9-10
        my cousin's Kit 269385: 9-9

        DYS464
        my Kit 40543: 11-12-14-15-16
        my cousin's Kit 269385: 11-12-12-14-14-15-15-16

        At the 37 marker level there is a difference at

        DYS-CDY
        my Kit 40543: 35-41
        my cousin's Kit 269385: 34-35

        The difference at DYS459 is not extraordinary.

        However, I don't know how I should interpret the differences at DYS464 and DYS-CDY. If the paper trail that my cousin and I have is correct, would such diverse differences occur?

        When the next sale occurs, I think I should upgrade to the 67 marker or the 111 marker level.

        Thanks for any insight – I appreciate it very much.

        - Tom Weingart

      • Thomas
        Hi everyone, Looking at FTDNA s website, I believe I should use the infinite allele comparison method to interpret the results. (Reference:
        Message 3 of 5 , Mar 14, 2013
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          Hi everyone,

          Looking at FTDNA's website, I believe I should use the infinite allele comparison method to interpret the results.
          (Reference: http://www.familytreedna.com/faq/answers/default.aspx?faqid=9#939 )

          Thus, DYS459 would be considered a mismatch and would be interpreted as a Genetic Distance of 1. Is this correct?

          The DYS464 differences would be considered a palindromic copy number change where one kit is DYS464abcde and the other kit is DYS464abcdefgh. This would be interpreted as a Genetic Distance of 3. Is this correct?

          DYS-CDY would be also be considered a mismatch and would be interpreted as a Genetic Distance of 1. Is this correct?

          Thus, the total Genetic Distance between the two kits would be 5. Is this correct?

          Does this indicate that my cousin and I are descended from the same male ancestor?

          Thanks for any insight?

          -Tom Weingart








          --- In GenGen-NV@yahoogroups.com, "Bob Mclaren" <bobmclaren@...> wrote:
          >
          > Tom,
          >
          >
          >
          > First the DYS#464 results. I suspect that your 464 results are not correct.
          > DYS #464 is a very difficult one to read. So, I suspect what happened is
          > that they had some trouble reading yours and misjudged the peaks.
          >
          >
          >
          > CDYa/b is highly unusual. This is a marker with a very high mutation rate,
          > so differences between relatives is not unusual. However, the amount of
          > difference in your case is unusual.
          >
          >
          >
          > I would contact FTDNA and ask them to reexamine 464 and CDY for you and your
          > cousin. Is there is still a difference at 464, I would do a 646x test on
          > both of you. This will read the correct number of duplicates.
          >
          >
          >
          > Yours aye,
          >
          >
          >
          > Bob McLaren
          >
          >
          >
          > From: GenGen-NV@yahoogroups.com [mailto:GenGen-NV@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
          > Of Thomas
          > Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 12:07 AM
          > To: GenGen-NV@yahoogroups.com
          > Subject: [GenGen-NV] Help with y-DNA analysis
          >
          >
          >
          > Hi everyone,
          >
          > I was curious if anyone can comment on some y-DNA results from my DNA
          > project (Reference:
          > http://www.familytreedna.com/public/weingart/default.aspx?section=yresults )
          >
          >
          > I recently received y-DNA results back from my 5th cousin. According to our
          > respective family trees, we trace back to the same 4th great-grandfather.
          > Below are differences we have:
          >
          > For the first 12 markers we match 12 for 12.
          > At the 25 marker level everything matches except for
          >
          > DYS459
          > my Kit 40543: 9-10
          > my cousin's Kit 269385: 9-9
          >
          > DYS464
          > my Kit 40543: 11-12-14-15-16
          > my cousin's Kit 269385: 11-12-12-14-14-15-15-16
          >
          > At the 37 marker level there is a difference at
          >
          > DYS-CDY
          > my Kit 40543: 35-41
          > my cousin's Kit 269385: 34-35
          >
          > The difference at DYS459 is not extraordinary.
          >
          > However, I don't know how I should interpret the differences at DYS464 and
          > DYS-CDY. If the paper trail that my cousin and I have is correct, would such
          > diverse differences occur?
          >
          > When the next sale occurs, I think I should upgrade to the 67 marker or the
          > 111 marker level.
          >
          > Thanks for any insight - I appreciate it very much.
          >
          > - Tom Weingart
          >
        • sidneysachs@juno.com
          Tom, For 5th cousins, about 20% of the times, one would get with 3 markers off. What I found with your value on 464 is that you have an odd number of copies.
          Message 4 of 5 , Mar 14, 2013
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            Tom,
             
            For 5th cousins, about 20% of the times, one would get with 3 markers off.  What I found with your value on 464 is that you have an odd number of copies.  I think  I never saw that before. 
             
            About updating to more markers, I do not think that is what I would do.  I think checking your cousin on the SNP M458 that defined you as R1a1a1g may be the better way of getting  your answer.

            Sidney Sachs

            ---------- Original Message ----------
            From: "Thomas" <tweingart@...>
            To: GenGen-NV@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: [GenGen-NV] Help with y-DNA analysis
            Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 04:06:54 -0000

             

            Hi everyone,

            I was curious if anyone can comment on some y-DNA results from my DNA project (Reference: http://www.familytreedna.com/public/weingart/default.aspx?section=yresults )

            I recently received y-DNA results back from my 5th cousin. According to our respective family trees, we trace back to the same 4th great-grandfather. Below are differences we have:

            For the first 12 markers we match 12 for 12.
            At the 25 marker level everything matches except for

            DYS459
            my Kit 40543: 9-10
            my cousin's Kit 269385: 9-9

            DYS464
            my Kit 40543: 11-12-14-15-16
            my cousin's Kit 269385: 11-12-12-14-14-15-15-16

            At the 37 marker level there is a difference at

            DYS-CDY
            my Kit 40543: 35-41
            my cousin's Kit 269385: 34-35

            The difference at DYS459 is not extraordinary.

            However, I don't know how I should interpret the differences at DYS464 and DYS-CDY. If the paper trail that my cousin and I have is correct, would such diverse differences occur?

            When the next sale occurs, I think I should upgrade to the 67 marker or the 111 marker level.

            Thanks for any insight � I appreciate it very much.

            - Tom Weingart

             



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          • Thomas
            Bob, Thanks for the advice. After I posted the message here, I sent a message to the FTDNA s helpdesk addressing the issue and asked for their advice. - Tom
            Message 5 of 5 , Mar 14, 2013
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              Bob,

              Thanks for the advice. After I posted the message here, I sent a message to the FTDNA's helpdesk addressing the issue and asked for their advice.

              - Tom

              --- In GenGen-NV@yahoogroups.com, "Bob Mclaren" <bobmclaren@...> wrote:
              >
              > Tom,
              >
              >
              >
              > First the DYS#464 results. I suspect that your 464 results are not correct.
              > DYS #464 is a very difficult one to read. So, I suspect what happened is
              > that they had some trouble reading yours and misjudged the peaks.
              >
              >
              >
              > CDYa/b is highly unusual. This is a marker with a very high mutation rate,
              > so differences between relatives is not unusual. However, the amount of
              > difference in your case is unusual.
              >
              >
              >
              > I would contact FTDNA and ask them to reexamine 464 and CDY for you and your
              > cousin. Is there is still a difference at 464, I would do a 646x test on
              > both of you. This will read the correct number of duplicates.
              >
              >
              >
              > Yours aye,
              >
              >
              >
              > Bob McLaren
              >
              >
              >
              > From: GenGen-NV@yahoogroups.com [mailto:GenGen-NV@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
              > Of Thomas
              > Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 12:07 AM
              > To: GenGen-NV@yahoogroups.com
              > Subject: [GenGen-NV] Help with y-DNA analysis
              >
              >
              >
              > Hi everyone,
              >
              > I was curious if anyone can comment on some y-DNA results from my DNA
              > project (Reference:
              > http://www.familytreedna.com/public/weingart/default.aspx?section=yresults )
              >
              >
              > I recently received y-DNA results back from my 5th cousin. According to our
              > respective family trees, we trace back to the same 4th great-grandfather.
              > Below are differences we have:
              >
              > For the first 12 markers we match 12 for 12.
              > At the 25 marker level everything matches except for
              >
              > DYS459
              > my Kit 40543: 9-10
              > my cousin's Kit 269385: 9-9
              >
              > DYS464
              > my Kit 40543: 11-12-14-15-16
              > my cousin's Kit 269385: 11-12-12-14-14-15-15-16
              >
              > At the 37 marker level there is a difference at
              >
              > DYS-CDY
              > my Kit 40543: 35-41
              > my cousin's Kit 269385: 34-35
              >
              > The difference at DYS459 is not extraordinary.
              >
              > However, I don't know how I should interpret the differences at DYS464 and
              > DYS-CDY. If the paper trail that my cousin and I have is correct, would such
              > diverse differences occur?
              >
              > When the next sale occurs, I think I should upgrade to the 67 marker or the
              > 111 marker level.
              >
              > Thanks for any insight - I appreciate it very much.
              >
              > - Tom Weingart
              >
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