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Re: Sturmey archer question

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  • Rich Wood
    Brandon; Rohloff, Shimano, Sturmey Archer and SRAM all now have some hub versions that can have brake discs mounted per their web sites. Disc brake calipers
    Message 1 of 20 , Oct 12, 2008
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      Brandon;

      Rohloff, Shimano, Sturmey Archer and SRAM all now have some hub
      versions that can have brake discs mounted per their web sites.
      Disc brake calipers still need special caliper mounting provisions
      on the frame and front forks however.

      Disc brakes are much better working than rim brakes in wet weather.
      This is particularly true of rim brakes and the old steel rims, a
      bad combination in the wet with most caliper brake pad materials.

      Heavier than caliper brakes but no rim wear or worries about tires
      overheating in long downhill descents. Disc brakes are becoming
      commoner on commuter and city bikes in the U.S. due to their better
      wet weather performance. Also very common on better mountain bikes.

      If you take a look at the Sturmey Archer web site they still list 3,
      5 and 8 speed hubs in quite a variety. No idea of availability down
      under however. Here is a link to the hubs on the current SA web
      site.

      http://www.sturmey-archer.com/hubs.php

      Rohloff does have an Aussie branch. Here is a link to it.

      http://www.rohloff.com.au/

      Not nearly as complete as the Rohloff main site as some links seem
      to be not functional on the Aussie site. If you are truly
      interested in Rohloff hubs go to the main site and download the
      manual in PDF format, a total of about 132 pages. It is in 3 parts
      in PDF format. Here is a link to their downloads page. If nothing
      else it is an interesting read if you are a technofreak.

      http://www.rohloff.de/en/download/description/index.html#c1453

      Rich Wood


      --- In Geared_hub_bikes@yahoogroups.com, "brandon"
      <rogersbrandon96@...> wrote:
      >
      > My town is ballina i used to live in lismore and wow i didn't know
      > they used disc brakes on inner geared hubs.
      >
      > The rohloff hub is pretty nice i can see why you like it a very
      > amazing bit of machinery i wouldn't mind one myself.
      >
      > My hub didn't have wing nuts when i got it because it didn't have
      any
      > nuts on it so it could have had wing nuts it is made in England
      and is
      > genuine.
      >
      > I have a couple of sturmey archers i will put one on here have a
      look
      > in my Sturmey archer folder.
      >
      > Surfers paradise is a great place to ride i can drive there on the
      > pacific highway and it takes about 1 hour but ballina is one very
      nice
      > place to ride with plenty of bike paths and is flat and best of
      all it
      > is next to the beach.
      >
      > i also collect vintage bicycles i have a 1969 SA S5 hub with two
      > cables one one side is the classic indicator chain and on the left
      > side is a shimano type push rod changer it pushes a thin rod into
      the
      > hub to change gears i have completely rebuilt it and it is a
      extremely
      > good hub.
      >
      > Brandon.
      >
      >
    • brandon
      Disc brakes are expensive but effective on mountain bikes and yes i would prefer to have disc brakes on my bike in the wet also have you heard of the old S5
      Message 2 of 20 , Oct 12, 2008
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        Disc brakes are expensive but effective on mountain bikes and yes i
        would prefer to have disc brakes on my bike in the wet also have you
        heard of the old S5 rich?, its a interesting hub used on 1970s
        dragsters and touring bikes.
        I would like a rohloff but they are from a bike review site $850!
        probably worth it but with the same money i could buy a brand new
        giant road bike and have a shimano nexus hub installed on it.

        Brandon.



        --- In Geared_hub_bikes@yahoogroups.com, "Rich Wood"
        <astronut1001@...> wrote:
        >
        > Brandon;
        >
        > Rohloff, Shimano, Sturmey Archer and SRAM all now have some hub
        > versions that can have brake discs mounted per their web sites.
        > Disc brake calipers still need special caliper mounting provisions
        > on the frame and front forks however.
        >
        > Disc brakes are much better working than rim brakes in wet weather.
        > This is particularly true of rim brakes and the old steel rims, a
        > bad combination in the wet with most caliper brake pad materials.
        >
        > Heavier than caliper brakes but no rim wear or worries about tires
        > overheating in long downhill descents. Disc brakes are becoming
        > commoner on commuter and city bikes in the U.S. due to their better
        > wet weather performance. Also very common on better mountain bikes.
        >
        > If you take a look at the Sturmey Archer web site they still list 3,
        > 5 and 8 speed hubs in quite a variety. No idea of availability down
        > under however. Here is a link to the hubs on the current SA web
        > site.
        >
        > http://www.sturmey-archer.com/hubs.php
        >
        > Rohloff does have an Aussie branch. Here is a link to it.
        >
        > http://www.rohloff.com.au/
        >
        > Not nearly as complete as the Rohloff main site as some links seem
        > to be not functional on the Aussie site. If you are truly
        > interested in Rohloff hubs go to the main site and download the
        > manual in PDF format, a total of about 132 pages. It is in 3 parts
        > in PDF format. Here is a link to their downloads page. If nothing
        > else it is an interesting read if you are a technofreak.
        >
        > http://www.rohloff.de/en/download/description/index.html#c1453
        >
        > Rich Wood
        >
        >
        > --- In Geared_hub_bikes@yahoogroups.com, "brandon"
        > <rogersbrandon96@> wrote:
        > >
        > > My town is ballina i used to live in lismore and wow i didn't know
        > > they used disc brakes on inner geared hubs.
        > >
        > > The rohloff hub is pretty nice i can see why you like it a very
        > > amazing bit of machinery i wouldn't mind one myself.
        > >
        > > My hub didn't have wing nuts when i got it because it didn't have
        > any
        > > nuts on it so it could have had wing nuts it is made in England
        > and is
        > > genuine.
        > >
        > > I have a couple of sturmey archers i will put one on here have a
        > look
        > > in my Sturmey archer folder.
        > >
        > > Surfers paradise is a great place to ride i can drive there on the
        > > pacific highway and it takes about 1 hour but ballina is one very
        > nice
        > > place to ride with plenty of bike paths and is flat and best of
        > all it
        > > is next to the beach.
        > >
        > > i also collect vintage bicycles i have a 1969 SA S5 hub with two
        > > cables one one side is the classic indicator chain and on the left
        > > side is a shimano type push rod changer it pushes a thin rod into
        > the
        > > hub to change gears i have completely rebuilt it and it is a
        > extremely
        > > good hub.
        > >
        > > Brandon.
        > >
        > >
        >
      • Rich Wood
        Brandon; Not sure if it is the same unit but the Sturmey Archer web site still lists an S5 model gear hub. Probably not as it looks like the current S5 has a
        Message 3 of 20 , Oct 13, 2008
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          Brandon;

          Not sure if it is the same unit but the Sturmey Archer web site
          still lists an S5 model gear hub. Probably not as it looks like the
          current S5 has a single cable control. Heard of it but I have never
          seen one.

          With the weak U.S. dollar the Rohloff hub is now in the $1200 to
          $1500 range here depending on configuration.

          Basically I consider it to be the Campy Record or Shimano Dura Ace
          hub equivalent or maybe, considering it's gear range, the Shimano
          XTR of hubs. By reputation more durable than any of the above
          however. According to a PDF on the Thorn bikes web site about use
          of the hub, one owner has reportedly covered 190,000 Km on his
          Rohloff hub without failure, not counting cables and output
          sprockets I would presume. Not sure how many derailleurs, casettes
          and chainrings you would go through in that distance but I suspect a
          lot.

          When you look at the top end Shimano and Campy derailleur setups
          with derailleurs, combined brake and shifter levers along with rear
          hub and casette the Rohloff price does not appear too bad. A recent
          price check I did showed the Campy Record rear derailleur at over
          $400 and the brifters at about $600 U.S.

          I am thinking of getting the SRAM 5 speed hub and building a wheel
          for my fixed gear bike frame. I currently have the fixed gear wheel
          and a older Sachs 3 speed wheel for it. The SRAM unit is available
          with the proper width to fit the narrow frame dropouts well.

          Rich Wood


          --- In Geared_hub_bikes@yahoogroups.com, "brandon"
          <rogersbrandon96@...> wrote:
          >
          > Disc brakes are expensive but effective on mountain bikes and yes i
          > would prefer to have disc brakes on my bike in the wet also have
          you
          > heard of the old S5 rich?, its a interesting hub used on 1970s
          > dragsters and touring bikes.
          > I would like a rohloff but they are from a bike review site $850!
          > probably worth it but with the same money i could buy a brand new
          > giant road bike and have a shimano nexus hub installed on it.
          >
          > Brandon.
          >
          >
          >
          > --- In Geared_hub_bikes@yahoogroups.com, "Rich Wood"
          > <astronut1001@> wrote:
          > >
          > > Brandon;
          > >
          > > Rohloff, Shimano, Sturmey Archer and SRAM all now have some hub
          > > versions that can have brake discs mounted per their web sites.
          > > Disc brake calipers still need special caliper mounting
          provisions
          > > on the frame and front forks however.
          > >
          > > Disc brakes are much better working than rim brakes in wet
          weather.
          > > This is particularly true of rim brakes and the old steel rims,
          a
          > > bad combination in the wet with most caliper brake pad
          materials.
          > >
          > > Heavier than caliper brakes but no rim wear or worries about
          tires
          > > overheating in long downhill descents. Disc brakes are becoming
          > > commoner on commuter and city bikes in the U.S. due to their
          better
          > > wet weather performance. Also very common on better mountain
          bikes.
          > >
          > > If you take a look at the Sturmey Archer web site they still
          list 3,
          > > 5 and 8 speed hubs in quite a variety. No idea of availability
          down
          > > under however. Here is a link to the hubs on the current SA web
          > > site.
          > >
          > > http://www.sturmey-archer.com/hubs.php
          > >
          > > Rohloff does have an Aussie branch. Here is a link to it.
          > >
          > > http://www.rohloff.com.au/
          > >
          > > Not nearly as complete as the Rohloff main site as some links
          seem
          > > to be not functional on the Aussie site. If you are truly
          > > interested in Rohloff hubs go to the main site and download the
          > > manual in PDF format, a total of about 132 pages. It is in 3
          parts
          > > in PDF format. Here is a link to their downloads page. If
          nothing
          > > else it is an interesting read if you are a technofreak.
          > >
          > > http://www.rohloff.de/en/download/description/index.html#c1453
          > >
          > > Rich Wood
          > >
          > >
          > > --- In Geared_hub_bikes@yahoogroups.com, "brandon"
          > > <rogersbrandon96@> wrote:
          > > >
          > > > My town is ballina i used to live in lismore and wow i didn't
          know
          > > > they used disc brakes on inner geared hubs.
          > > >
          > > > The rohloff hub is pretty nice i can see why you like it a very
          > > > amazing bit of machinery i wouldn't mind one myself.
          > > >
          > > > My hub didn't have wing nuts when i got it because it didn't
          have
          > > any
          > > > nuts on it so it could have had wing nuts it is made in
          England
          > > and is
          > > > genuine.
          > > >
          > > > I have a couple of sturmey archers i will put one on here have
          a
          > > look
          > > > in my Sturmey archer folder.
          > > >
          > > > Surfers paradise is a great place to ride i can drive there on
          the
          > > > pacific highway and it takes about 1 hour but ballina is one
          very
          > > nice
          > > > place to ride with plenty of bike paths and is flat and best
          of
          > > all it
          > > > is next to the beach.
          > > >
          > > > i also collect vintage bicycles i have a 1969 SA S5 hub with
          two
          > > > cables one one side is the classic indicator chain and on the
          left
          > > > side is a shimano type push rod changer it pushes a thin rod
          into
          > > the
          > > > hub to change gears i have completely rebuilt it and it is a
          > > extremely
          > > > good hub.
          > > >
          > > > Brandon.
          > > >
          > > >
          > >
          >
        • brandon
          I am putting a picture of my S5 on here. Brandon.
          Message 4 of 20 , Oct 13, 2008
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            I am putting a picture of my S5 on here.

            Brandon.
            --- In Geared_hub_bikes@yahoogroups.com, "Rich Wood"
            <astronut1001@...> wrote:
            >
            > Brandon;
            >
            > Not sure if it is the same unit but the Sturmey Archer web site
            > still lists an S5 model gear hub. Probably not as it looks like the
            > current S5 has a single cable control. Heard of it but I have never
            > seen one.
            >
            > With the weak U.S. dollar the Rohloff hub is now in the $1200 to
            > $1500 range here depending on configuration.
            >
            > Basically I consider it to be the Campy Record or Shimano Dura Ace
            > hub equivalent or maybe, considering it's gear range, the Shimano
            > XTR of hubs. By reputation more durable than any of the above
            > however. According to a PDF on the Thorn bikes web site about use
            > of the hub, one owner has reportedly covered 190,000 Km on his
            > Rohloff hub without failure, not counting cables and output
            > sprockets I would presume. Not sure how many derailleurs, casettes
            > and chainrings you would go through in that distance but I suspect a
            > lot.
            >
            > When you look at the top end Shimano and Campy derailleur setups
            > with derailleurs, combined brake and shifter levers along with rear
            > hub and casette the Rohloff price does not appear too bad. A recent
            > price check I did showed the Campy Record rear derailleur at over
            > $400 and the brifters at about $600 U.S.
            >
            > I am thinking of getting the SRAM 5 speed hub and building a wheel
            > for my fixed gear bike frame. I currently have the fixed gear wheel
            > and a older Sachs 3 speed wheel for it. The SRAM unit is available
            > with the proper width to fit the narrow frame dropouts well.
            >
            > Rich Wood
            >
            >
            > --- In Geared_hub_bikes@yahoogroups.com, "brandon"
            > <rogersbrandon96@> wrote:
            > >
            > > Disc brakes are expensive but effective on mountain bikes and yes i
            > > would prefer to have disc brakes on my bike in the wet also have
            > you
            > > heard of the old S5 rich?, its a interesting hub used on 1970s
            > > dragsters and touring bikes.
            > > I would like a rohloff but they are from a bike review site $850!
            > > probably worth it but with the same money i could buy a brand new
            > > giant road bike and have a shimano nexus hub installed on it.
            > >
            > > Brandon.
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > > --- In Geared_hub_bikes@yahoogroups.com, "Rich Wood"
            > > <astronut1001@> wrote:
            > > >
            > > > Brandon;
            > > >
            > > > Rohloff, Shimano, Sturmey Archer and SRAM all now have some hub
            > > > versions that can have brake discs mounted per their web sites.
            > > > Disc brake calipers still need special caliper mounting
            > provisions
            > > > on the frame and front forks however.
            > > >
            > > > Disc brakes are much better working than rim brakes in wet
            > weather.
            > > > This is particularly true of rim brakes and the old steel rims,
            > a
            > > > bad combination in the wet with most caliper brake pad
            > materials.
            > > >
            > > > Heavier than caliper brakes but no rim wear or worries about
            > tires
            > > > overheating in long downhill descents. Disc brakes are becoming
            > > > commoner on commuter and city bikes in the U.S. due to their
            > better
            > > > wet weather performance. Also very common on better mountain
            > bikes.
            > > >
            > > > If you take a look at the Sturmey Archer web site they still
            > list 3,
            > > > 5 and 8 speed hubs in quite a variety. No idea of availability
            > down
            > > > under however. Here is a link to the hubs on the current SA web
            > > > site.
            > > >
            > > > http://www.sturmey-archer.com/hubs.php
            > > >
            > > > Rohloff does have an Aussie branch. Here is a link to it.
            > > >
            > > > http://www.rohloff.com.au/
            > > >
            > > > Not nearly as complete as the Rohloff main site as some links
            > seem
            > > > to be not functional on the Aussie site. If you are truly
            > > > interested in Rohloff hubs go to the main site and download the
            > > > manual in PDF format, a total of about 132 pages. It is in 3
            > parts
            > > > in PDF format. Here is a link to their downloads page. If
            > nothing
            > > > else it is an interesting read if you are a technofreak.
            > > >
            > > > http://www.rohloff.de/en/download/description/index.html#c1453
            > > >
            > > > Rich Wood
            > > >
            > > >
            > > > --- In Geared_hub_bikes@yahoogroups.com, "brandon"
            > > > <rogersbrandon96@> wrote:
            > > > >
            > > > > My town is ballina i used to live in lismore and wow i didn't
            > know
            > > > > they used disc brakes on inner geared hubs.
            > > > >
            > > > > The rohloff hub is pretty nice i can see why you like it a very
            > > > > amazing bit of machinery i wouldn't mind one myself.
            > > > >
            > > > > My hub didn't have wing nuts when i got it because it didn't
            > have
            > > > any
            > > > > nuts on it so it could have had wing nuts it is made in
            > England
            > > > and is
            > > > > genuine.
            > > > >
            > > > > I have a couple of sturmey archers i will put one on here have
            > a
            > > > look
            > > > > in my Sturmey archer folder.
            > > > >
            > > > > Surfers paradise is a great place to ride i can drive there on
            > the
            > > > > pacific highway and it takes about 1 hour but ballina is one
            > very
            > > > nice
            > > > > place to ride with plenty of bike paths and is flat and best
            > of
            > > > all it
            > > > > is next to the beach.
            > > > >
            > > > > i also collect vintage bicycles i have a 1969 SA S5 hub with
            > two
            > > > > cables one one side is the classic indicator chain and on the
            > left
            > > > > side is a shimano type push rod changer it pushes a thin rod
            > into
            > > > the
            > > > > hub to change gears i have completely rebuilt it and it is a
            > > > extremely
            > > > > good hub.
            > > > >
            > > > > Brandon.
            > > > >
            > > > >
            > > >
            > >
            >
          • Mark Stonich
            ... While I m sure some were raced, the AM was intended for the non-competitive sporting rider. The AC and earlier AR had much closer ratios and were better
            Message 5 of 20 , Nov 21, 2008
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              --- In Geared_hub_bikes@yahoogroups.com, "Rich Wood"
              > Based on the info I have seen what you have is a pretty rare Sturmey
              > Archer hub. Originally it was designed for sports use. Almost all
              > British road competition at the time was time trials held on
              > relatively flat courses and the AM looks to be designed for just
              > such use with it's narrow range of gearing.

              While I'm sure some were raced, the AM was intended for the
              non-competitive sporting rider. The AC and earlier AR had much closer
              ratios and were better suited for TTs.

              Looking at the exploded views on Hadland's site The AM appears to be
              much more robust. Much the same design as the FW & S5. One of the
              guys on our Saturday rides uses an AM, even when we go off-road. And
              we've had a few on the Lake Pepin event.
            • Mike Bullis
              I ve been inside my AM once or twice and I would have guessed I was looking at the guts of an FW or S5, except for the lack of a secondary sun gear. Got
              Message 6 of 20 , Nov 21, 2008
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                I've been inside my AM once or twice and I would have guessed I was looking at the guts of an FW or S5, except for the lack of a secondary sun gear. Got lucky recently when I bought a box of parts and there were a few AM and few FW shift rods in it.

                --- On Fri, 11/21/08, Mark Stonich <mark@...> wrote:
                From: Mark Stonich <mark@...>
                Subject: [Geared_hub_bikes] Re: Sturmey archer question
                To: Geared_hub_bikes@yahoogroups.com
                Date: Friday, November 21, 2008, 7:39 PM

                --- In Geared_hub_bikes@ yahoogroups. com, "Rich Wood"
                > Based on the info I have seen what you have is a pretty rare Sturmey
                > Archer hub. Originally it was designed for sports use. Almost all
                > British road competition at the time was time trials held on
                > relatively flat courses and the AM looks to be designed for just
                > such use with it's narrow range of gearing.

                While I'm sure some were raced, the AM was intended for the
                non-competitive sporting rider. The AC and earlier AR had much closer
                ratios and were better suited for TTs.

                Looking at the exploded views on Hadland's site The AM appears to be
                much more robust. Much the same design as the FW & S5. One of the
                guys on our Saturday rides uses an AM, even when we go off-road. And
                we've had a few on the Lake Pepin event.


              • Rich Wood
                Mark; Were virtually all British TTs reasonably flat? I remember a TDF TT that was held on Alp d Huez as I recall. ;-) Rich Wood ... Sturmey ... all ...
                Message 7 of 20 , Nov 22, 2008
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                  Mark;

                  Were virtually all British TTs reasonably flat? I remember a TDF TT
                  that was held on Alp d'Huez as I recall. ;-)

                  Rich Wood


                  --- In Geared_hub_bikes@yahoogroups.com, "Mark Stonich" <mark@...>
                  wrote:
                  >
                  > --- In Geared_hub_bikes@yahoogroups.com, "Rich Wood"
                  > > Based on the info I have seen what you have is a pretty rare
                  Sturmey
                  > > Archer hub. Originally it was designed for sports use. Almost
                  all
                  > > British road competition at the time was time trials held on
                  > > relatively flat courses and the AM looks to be designed for just
                  > > such use with it's narrow range of gearing.
                  >
                  > While I'm sure some were raced, the AM was intended for the
                  > non-competitive sporting rider. The AC and earlier AR had much
                  closer
                  > ratios and were better suited for TTs.
                  >
                  > Looking at the exploded views on Hadland's site The AM appears to
                  be
                  > much more robust. Much the same design as the FW & S5. One of the
                  > guys on our Saturday rides uses an AM, even when we go off-road.
                  And
                  > we've had a few on the Lake Pepin event.
                  >
                • Mark Stonich
                  ... I don t know about virtually all but there was a tendency to design courses that would produce fast times. Such as using the shoulders of busy motorways
                  Message 8 of 20 , Nov 25, 2008
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                    At 11:59 AM 11/22/2008, you wrote:
                    >Were virtually all British TTs reasonably flat?

                    I don't know about "virtually all" but there was a tendency to design
                    courses that would produce fast times. Such as using the shoulders
                    of busy motorways to take advantage of the "Tailwind" created by
                    passing cars. I do know that John Woodburn used ACs and FCs for his
                    attempts at the Cardiff to London record which he finally got. 162
                    miles and not particularly flat. Hill climbs were basically uphill
                    TTs and usually done on a single speed bike.

                    >I remember a TDF TT that was held on Alp d'Huez as I recall. ;-)

                    Refresh my memory, is that in Surry or Kent?


                    Mark Stonich;
                    BikeSmith Design & Fabrication
                    5349 Elliot Ave S. - Minneapolis. MN 55417
                    Ph. (612) 824-2372 http://bikesmithdesign.com
                    http://mnhpva.org
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