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Re: VS PLANETS USELESS

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  • wbmac
    Laura Tyson is (or was) Roland s VS specialist and she re-wrote the manual for the VS1680. Maybe she did something similar for your machine. I have been a
    Message 1 of 23 , Jun 1, 2007
      Laura Tyson is (or was) Roland's VS specialist and she re-wrote the
      manual for the VS1680. Maybe she did something similar for your
      machine. I have been a frustrated user for many years and have recently
      given up and went to the dark (PC) side --- sooo much easier, now my
      life is complete. For a fraction of the cost of my VS I got an RME
      Hammerfall system, used, on Ebay and use Adobe Audition and will never
      look back. Now I'm sure that's not what you wanted to hear but if you
      have a specific question about the VS contact me off list. Hopefully
      it's similar enough to the VS1680 so I could be of some help.

      Have you gone to the Roland site? www.rolandus.com


      Bill
      wbmacatyahoodotcom
    • Steve Meiers
      I agree with Bill, I to went over to the darkside but for me it was in around 96. I ve bought a lot of other nice studio gear with my MacMoney I ve saved over
      Message 2 of 23 , Jun 3, 2007
        I agree with Bill, I to went over to the darkside but for me it was in around 96. I've bought a lot of other nice studio gear with my MacMoney I've saved over the years. I don't prefer one OS over the other, I just was tired of the elitist MacPricing. Lately I've been testing Linux OS to dump the other elitist part of my PC. Linux has evolved a lot and is almost ready for "me", LOL.

        steve m



        ---------------------------------
        Take the Internet to Go: Yahoo!Go puts the Internet in your pocket: mail, news, photos & more.

        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Knox Bronson
        I was re-recording some guitar parts for my cd. Wasn t liking the guitar sounds (or synth sounds) for a couple pieces ... so i just did a direct line out from
        Message 3 of 23 , Jun 4, 2007
          I was re-recording some guitar parts for my cd. Wasn't liking the
          guitar sounds (or synth sounds) for a couple pieces ... so i just did
          a direct line out from the 1/4" jack into the mixer.

          I couldn't believe how much better the pure guitar sound was,
          compared to what comes out from the gr-33 ... anyone else notice this?

          do you run direct out for natural strings sound and mix in synth
          parts from gr-30/33?

          that's what i'm thinking of doing from here on out.

          thoughts anyone?

          kb
        • Rowan Smales
          Yeah, i started taking separate line out from synth and guitar for live apps on the recommendation of someone on the GR33 forum. I agree theres a huge
          Message 4 of 23 , Jun 4, 2007
            Yeah, i started taking separate line out from synth and guitar for live
            apps on the recommendation of someone on the GR33 forum. I agree theres a
            huge difference. I wondered if it was just the GK2 systems, but apparently
            not if you're having troubles!

            --
            (\__/)
            (='.'=) This is Bunny. Put him in your signature and help
            (")_(") him on his way to world domination.


            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • All Jazz DVDs
            Always done that really ... I know some people claim the sound that comes out from the unit, which is carried through the 13 pin cable, is the same but to me
            Message 5 of 23 , Jun 4, 2007
              Always done that really ... I know some people claim the sound that
              comes out from the unit, which is carried through the 13 pin cable, is
              the same but to me it REALLY isn't.

              Simple logic though ... the more the signal has to travel through, the
              more signal is going to be lost.
            • gsmith
              hi knox not only did i find the sound better direct out of my multiac jazz (i am using a gr30) but i run everything (synth and guitar) through tube pre amps
              Message 6 of 23 , Jun 4, 2007
                hi knox
                not only did i find the sound better direct out of my multiac jazz (i
                am using a gr30)
                but i run everything (synth and guitar) through tube pre amps before my
                input for recording
                the difference is night and day
                geoff

                On 4-Jun-07, at 4:51 AM, Knox Bronson wrote:

                > I was re-recording some guitar parts for my cd. Wasn't liking the
                > guitar sounds (or synth sounds) for a couple pieces ... so i just did
                > a direct line out from the 1/4" jack into the mixer.
                >
                > I couldn't believe how much better the pure guitar sound was,
                > compared to what comes out from the gr-33 ... anyone else notice this?
                >
                > do you run direct out for natural strings sound and mix in synth
                > parts from gr-30/33?
                >
                > that's what i'm thinking of doing from here on out.
                >
                > thoughts anyone?
                >
                > kb
                >
                Go here to see main page
                http://members.soundclick.com/godinjazz

                Go here to listen and or purchase songs
                http://www.soundclick.com/bands/pagemusic.cfm?bandID=693579




                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • Scott Mayer
                When I first started using the GR synths in the early 90 s, I took my cues from the pros. Both Jerry Garcia and Eric Johnson used seperate cables for the
                Message 7 of 23 , Jun 4, 2007
                  When I first started using the GR synths in the early 90's, I took my cues
                  from the pros. Both Jerry Garcia and Eric Johnson used seperate cables for
                  the synth and their guitar outputs. If they were doing this live, I figured
                  it was pretty important to do it too. I used the output on the gr33 for
                  awhile after I bought it, and one day had the same realization as you.

                  As for making the whole thing easier... Using electrical tape and zip ties,
                  I attached a 1/4" monster cable and the 15pin together.

                  Best,

                  Scott


                  >From: Knox Bronson <atombee@...>
                  >Reply-To: GR-30@yahoogroups.com
                  >To: GR-30@yahoogroups.com
                  >Subject: [GR-30] direct out on godin multiac nylon string
                  >Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2007 00:51:55 -0700
                  >
                  >I was re-recording some guitar parts for my cd. Wasn't liking the
                  >guitar sounds (or synth sounds) for a couple pieces ... so i just did
                  >a direct line out from the 1/4" jack into the mixer.
                  >
                  >I couldn't believe how much better the pure guitar sound was,
                  >compared to what comes out from the gr-33 ... anyone else notice this?
                  >
                  >do you run direct out for natural strings sound and mix in synth
                  >parts from gr-30/33?
                  >
                  >that's what i'm thinking of doing from here on out.
                  >
                  >thoughts anyone?
                  >
                  >kb
                • unlunf
                  Scott, ... That s what I did, except that I didn t like the little nubbin from the zip tie, so I switched to using homemade Velco straps instead. Much
                  Message 8 of 23 , Jun 4, 2007
                    Scott,

                    > As for making the whole thing easier... Using electrical tape and zip ties,
                    > I attached a 1/4" monster cable and the 15pin together.

                    That's what I did, except that I didn't like the little "nubbin" from the
                    zip tie, so I switched to using homemade Velco straps instead. Much smoother
                    on the hands, and lays just a bit flatter in the cable box. <g>

                    Stage tip: Never use any kind of tape to bind up two or more cables (except
                    in an emergency, of course). The adhesive will foul up everything when you
                    go to remove the tape, which occurs as you change your needs, or even just to
                    replace a bad cable. OTOH, this means that you need to carry a pair of small
                    diagonal cutters for the cable ties, but you should have one of those anyway. <g>
                    But Velcro doesn't need any tools, leaves no sticky residue, can be re-positioned
                    as needed, and not to mention it's ultimate benefit, it's re-uable. <g>

                    HTH


                    unlunf


                    --- In GR-30@yahoogroups.com, "Scott Mayer" <spackletheband@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > When I first started using the GR synths in the early 90's, I took my cues
                    > from the pros. Both Jerry Garcia and Eric Johnson used seperate cables for
                    > the synth and their guitar outputs. If they were doing this live, I figured
                    > it was pretty important to do it too. I used the output on the gr33 for
                    > awhile after I bought it, and one day had the same realization as you.
                    >
                    > As for making the whole thing easier... Using electrical tape and zip ties,
                    > I attached a 1/4" monster cable and the 15pin together.
                    >
                    > Best,
                    >
                    > Scott
                    >
                  • Rowan Smales
                    . Both Jerry Garcia and Eric Johnson used seperate cables for ... ... EJ uses a synth?? i never knew. As in cliffs of dover EJ?? -- ( __/) (= . =) This is
                    Message 9 of 23 , Jun 5, 2007
                      .>Both Jerry Garcia and Eric Johnson used seperate cables for
                      >the synth and their guitar outputs
                      ... EJ uses a synth?? i never knew. As in cliffs of dover EJ??

                      --
                      (\__/)
                      (='.'=) This is Bunny. Put him in your signature and help
                      (")_(") him on his way to world domination.


                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    • bassetrox
                      ... **didn t know** before Ms. Truss and grammar bullies get me ;)
                      Message 10 of 23 , Jun 5, 2007
                        > .>Both Jerry Garcia and Eric Johnson used seperate cables for
                        > >the synth and their guitar outputs
                        > ... EJ uses a synth?? i never knew. As in cliffs of dover EJ??


                        **didn't know** before Ms. Truss and grammar bullies get me ;)
                      • Steve Meiers
                        There s a really simple way to verify the levels of the guitar out direct, after the GR, etc. Just set up a recorder, it can be a DAW, an old cassette unit or
                        Message 11 of 23 , Jun 5, 2007
                          There's a really simple way to verify the levels of the guitar out direct, after the GR, etc.

                          Just set up a recorder, it can be a DAW, an old cassette unit or almost anything in between that has a VU meter, I like the ones in recording software because you can set the hold time.

                          Just press RECORD and WATCH the levels. Now switch input configs (GR inline or bypass, etc) and do it again, and WATCH the levels. Ears can be deceiving because they are connected to our brains (preferences, pre-conceptions), etc and eyes, etc. Try to play a the same (hand, pick & pressure, etc) level and compare the results.

                          If you do see different levels, try to isolate the cause and remedy it, for example by tweaking the GR output level or the guitar FX unit levels, etc..

                          I do this also to set the levels on my GR and guitar patches, so that when I change patches, the volumes are not radically different.

                          Studios of old had VU meters as stand alone hardware for standard test equipment to help them set levels. With everything digitized and flashy, it's easy to overlook the simple solutions. Visualize your audio signals. A recorded wave file shows simply a VU reading over time.

                          A good VU meter (or wave file) is truly a musician's friend and less vulnerable to opinions, preferences, etc, than the human ear/brain. With DAW software (even the free Audacity), you can even line up the waveforms over and under to compare them in detail.

                          Example:
                          Track 1: Guitar with cord into the record input (mixer/pc/recorder/etc)
                          Track 2" Guitar with cord thru the GR & FX, then into the record input
                          Track 3: Tweak or change something and record again (note what was tweaked)
                          Track 4: Lather, rinse and repeat various combinations, settings, etc
                          Track 5 to 5000: more of the same.

                          BTW, even if you NEVER play straight GAC (guitar, amp, cord) it's still good to know what the pickup output levels look like for comparison to after FX or GR, etc, for knowing when and where problems are popping up. I've even tested a few cables this way that were suspect.

                          Ultimately, if you spend some time doing this, you will have a much better understanding of your gear. Then, when problems pop up live, you will know better where they might be and resolve them quicker - even when no meter is available.

                          This is not something to do at rehearsal, the band will hate you. This is R&D and needs to be done without the pressure of performance, so on your own time.

                          Good luck and happy grouse hunting.

                          Steve M.



                          ---------------------------------
                          You snooze, you lose. Get messages ASAP with AutoCheck
                          in the all-new Yahoo! Mail Beta.

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                        • MoonCaine
                          From working with video shooters, I find they use the coolest cable ties. Check out video supply stores for cool cable tie options. My latest fave is the one
                          Message 12 of 23 , Jun 5, 2007
                            From working with video shooters, I find they use the coolest cable
                            ties. Check out video supply stores for cool cable tie options. My
                            latest fave is the one they are using at work now, involving a strip
                            of velcro that already has both kinds of velcro, facing the right
                            ways so that you can slap & wrap without looking or thinking about
                            it. If you want, you can attach the velcro to the cable firmly with
                            really tiny zip ties that come with 'em in the bag.

                            I've learned that color-coding cables and cable ties helps a lot when
                            the cable count starts to climb past 4 or so. I snag a few cable ties
                            from work in each new color I see, and it's helping me keep all the
                            cables in place and organized for my mad science rig based on Ableton
                            Live and about 4 floor pedals, including my GR-33.

                            The shooters also taught me how to coil my guitar cables so they'll
                            last longer and stay neatly coiled. I made a video about that but I
                            don't recall the link right now.

                            --moonie

                            On Jun 4, 2007, at 8:33 PM, unlunf wrote:

                            > Scott,
                            >
                            >> As for making the whole thing easier... Using electrical tape and
                            >> zip ties,
                            >> I attached a 1/4" monster cable and the 15pin together.
                            >
                            > That's what I did, except that I didn't like the little "nubbin"
                            > from the
                            > zip tie, so I switched to using homemade Velco straps instead.
                            > Much smoother
                            > on the hands, and lays just a bit flatter in the cable box. <g>
                            >
                            > Stage tip: Never use any kind of tape to bind up two or more
                            > cables (except
                            > in an emergency, of course). The adhesive will foul up everything
                            > when you
                            > go to remove the tape, which occurs as you change your needs, or
                            > even just to
                            > replace a bad cable. OTOH, this means that you need to carry a
                            > pair of small
                            > diagonal cutters for the cable ties, but you should have one of
                            > those anyway. <g>
                            > But Velcro doesn't need any tools, leaves no sticky residue, can be
                            > re-positioned
                            > as needed, and not to mention it's ultimate benefit, it's re-uable.
                            > <g>
                            >
                            > HTH
                            >
                            >
                            > unlunf
                            >
                            >
                            > --- In GR-30@yahoogroups.com, "Scott Mayer" <spackletheband@...>
                            > wrote:
                            >>
                            >> When I first started using the GR synths in the early 90's, I took
                            >> my cues
                            >> from the pros. Both Jerry Garcia and Eric Johnson used seperate
                            >> cables for
                            >> the synth and their guitar outputs. If they were doing this live,
                            >> I figured
                            >> it was pretty important to do it too. I used the output on the
                            >> gr33 for
                            >> awhile after I bought it, and one day had the same realization as
                            >> you.
                            >>
                            >> As for making the whole thing easier... Using electrical tape and
                            >> zip ties,
                            >> I attached a 1/4" monster cable and the 15pin together.
                            >>
                            >> Best,
                            >>
                            >> Scott
                            >>
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            > The GR-30 mailing list is maintained by Joey Aguilera -
                            > tentacle_joe@...
                            >
                            > for info: gr-30-owner@yahoogroups.com
                            > to post: gr-30@yahoogroups.com
                            > to unsubscribe GR-30-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                            > to set digest GR-30-digest@yahoogroups.com
                            > to set normal GR-30-normal@yahoogroups.com
                            > Yahoo! Groups Links
                            >
                            >
                            >

                            -- -- -- -- -- --
                            To me, the Roland Virtual Guitar VG-88 is the ultimate instrument,
                            and I hope never to be without one. It's like having the history of
                            guitar music at your disposal in one instrument.
                            -- MoonCaine
                          • aaron rowan
                            If you remember that link, please do send our way! ... Aaron G. Rowan(760)828-0976www.Twentyonerest.com
                            Message 13 of 23 , Jun 5, 2007
                              If you remember that link, please do send our way!
                              --- MoonCaine <mooncaine@...> wrote:

                              > From working with video shooters, I find they use
                              > the coolest cable
                              > ties. Check out video supply stores for cool cable
                              > tie options. My
                              > latest fave is the one they are using at work now,
                              > involving a strip
                              > of velcro that already has both kinds of velcro,
                              > facing the right
                              > ways so that you can slap & wrap without looking or
                              > thinking about
                              > it. If you want, you can attach the velcro to the
                              > cable firmly with
                              > really tiny zip ties that come with 'em in the bag.
                              >
                              > I've learned that color-coding cables and cable ties
                              > helps a lot when
                              > the cable count starts to climb past 4 or so. I snag
                              > a few cable ties
                              > from work in each new color I see, and it's helping
                              > me keep all the
                              > cables in place and organized for my mad science rig
                              > based on Ableton
                              > Live and about 4 floor pedals, including my GR-33.
                              >
                              > The shooters also taught me how to coil my guitar
                              > cables so they'll
                              > last longer and stay neatly coiled. I made a video
                              > about that but I
                              > don't recall the link right now.
                              >
                              > --moonie
                              >
                              > On Jun 4, 2007, at 8:33 PM, unlunf wrote:
                              >
                              > > Scott,
                              > >
                              > >> As for making the whole thing easier... Using
                              > electrical tape and
                              > >> zip ties,
                              > >> I attached a 1/4" monster cable and the 15pin
                              > together.
                              > >
                              > > That's what I did, except that I didn't like the
                              > little "nubbin"
                              > > from the
                              > > zip tie, so I switched to using homemade Velco
                              > straps instead.
                              > > Much smoother
                              > > on the hands, and lays just a bit flatter in the
                              > cable box. <g>
                              > >
                              > > Stage tip: Never use any kind of tape to bind up
                              > two or more
                              > > cables (except
                              > > in an emergency, of course). The adhesive will
                              > foul up everything
                              > > when you
                              > > go to remove the tape, which occurs as you change
                              > your needs, or
                              > > even just to
                              > > replace a bad cable. OTOH, this means that you
                              > need to carry a
                              > > pair of small
                              > > diagonal cutters for the cable ties, but you
                              > should have one of
                              > > those anyway. <g>
                              > > But Velcro doesn't need any tools, leaves no
                              > sticky residue, can be
                              > > re-positioned
                              > > as needed, and not to mention it's ultimate
                              > benefit, it's re-uable.
                              > > <g>
                              > >
                              > > HTH
                              > >
                              > >
                              > > unlunf
                              > >
                              > >
                              > > --- In GR-30@yahoogroups.com, "Scott Mayer"
                              > <spackletheband@...>
                              > > wrote:
                              > >>
                              > >> When I first started using the GR synths in the
                              > early 90's, I took
                              > >> my cues
                              > >> from the pros. Both Jerry Garcia and Eric
                              > Johnson used seperate
                              > >> cables for
                              > >> the synth and their guitar outputs. If they were
                              > doing this live,
                              > >> I figured
                              > >> it was pretty important to do it too. I used the
                              > output on the
                              > >> gr33 for
                              > >> awhile after I bought it, and one day had the
                              > same realization as
                              > >> you.
                              > >>
                              > >> As for making the whole thing easier... Using
                              > electrical tape and
                              > >> zip ties,
                              > >> I attached a 1/4" monster cable and the 15pin
                              > together.
                              > >>
                              > >> Best,
                              > >>
                              > >> Scott
                              > >>
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > > The GR-30 mailing list is maintained by Joey
                              > Aguilera -
                              > > tentacle_joe@...
                              > >
                              > > for info: gr-30-owner@yahoogroups.com
                              > > to post: gr-30@yahoogroups.com
                              > > to unsubscribe GR-30-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                              > > to set digest GR-30-digest@yahoogroups.com
                              > > to set normal GR-30-normal@yahoogroups.com
                              > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              >
                              > -- -- -- -- -- --
                              > To me, the Roland Virtual Guitar VG-88 is the
                              > ultimate instrument,
                              > and I hope never to be without one. It's like having
                              > the history of
                              > guitar music at your disposal in one instrument.
                              > -- MoonCaine
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >


                              Aaron G. Rowan(760)828-0976www.Twentyonerest.com



                              ____________________________________________________________________________________
                              Boardwalk for $500? In 2007? Ha! Play Monopoly Here and Now (it's updated for today's economy) at Yahoo! Games.
                              http://get.games.yahoo.com/proddesc?gamekey=monopolyherenow
                            • lightningslim
                              I use some double sided velcro cable ties that have a a built in loop that keeps them on the cable when unfastened. Unfortunately the web site that I got them
                              Message 14 of 23 , Jun 6, 2007
                                I use some double sided velcro cable ties that have a a built in loop
                                that keeps them on the cable when unfastened. Unfortunately the web site
                                that I got them from doesn't seem to have them anymore.
                                I found them here...

                                http://lextec.com/ven_polygon.html

                                I've also used the bulk double sided velcro for cable management (also
                                on this page) the cheapest I've found it was in after Christmas sales
                                where they've been selling it as an aid to Christmas decorations!

                                Here's another site...

                                http://www.anixtercomponents.com/news.asp?newsid=182&sub=news2&name=news&language=2

                                hope that helps

                                Mike
                              • Scott Mayer
                                Yes, Eric Johnson uses a synth, he even did some ads for the Roland GR1 in the early 90 s
                                Message 15 of 23 , Jun 6, 2007
                                  Yes,

                                  Eric Johnson uses a synth, he even did some ads for the Roland GR1 in the
                                  early 90's


                                  >From: "bassetrox" <bassetrox@...>
                                  >Reply-To: GR-30@yahoogroups.com
                                  >To: GR-30@yahoogroups.com
                                  >Subject: [GR-30] Re: direct out on godin multiac nylon string
                                  >Date: Tue, 05 Jun 2007 10:38:32 -0000
                                  >
                                  > > .>Both Jerry Garcia and Eric Johnson used seperate cables for
                                  > > >the synth and their guitar outputs
                                  > > ... EJ uses a synth?? i never knew. As in cliffs of dover EJ??
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >**didn't know** before Ms. Truss and grammar bullies get me ;)
                                  >
                                • Cliff Lang
                                  ... From: MoonCaine To: GR-30@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, June 05, 2007 2:16 PM Subject: Re: [GR-30] video guys have some great cable ties & tricks ... last
                                  Message 16 of 23 , Jun 6, 2007
                                    ----- Original Message -----
                                    From: MoonCaine
                                    To: GR-30@yahoogroups.com
                                    Sent: Tuesday, June 05, 2007 2:16 PM
                                    Subject: Re: [GR-30] video guys have some great cable ties & tricks

                                    >>> The shooters also taught me how to coil my guitar cables so they'll
                                    last longer and stay neatly coiled.

                                    There's an easy method I learned from Lou Gottlieb, the standup bass player
                                    in the 60s folk group The Limelighters: using your thumb and two fingers,
                                    you just keep gently twisting the cable, oh I'd say maybe a half turn, one
                                    twist with each coil as you wind the cable up. I tend to switch directions
                                    each time I put stuff away, coiling leftwards one time and to the right the
                                    other. But that's just me.

                                    Which direction you twist depends of course on the direction in which you're
                                    coiling. Trial and error will quickly show which is correct. After all,
                                    you've got a 50-50 chance of getting it right.

                                    When done correctly the coiled cable will uncoil easily with no tangles.

                                    Cliff Lang
                                    Santa Rosa CA
                                  • MoonCaine
                                    Thanks, Mike. I bookmarked those for work.... preciate it. --moonie ... ... even though I must concede greatness has eluded me, I d still miss the world.
                                    Message 17 of 23 , Jun 6, 2007
                                      Thanks, Mike. I bookmarked those for work.... 'preciate it.

                                      --moonie

                                      On Jun 6, 2007, at 6:20 AM, lightningslim wrote:

                                      > I use some double sided velcro cable ties that have a a built in loop
                                      > that keeps them on the cable when unfastened. Unfortunately the web
                                      > site
                                      > that I got them from doesn't seem to have them anymore.
                                      > I found them here...
                                      >
                                      > http://lextec.com/ven_polygon.html
                                      >
                                      > I've also used the bulk double sided velcro for cable management (also
                                      > on this page) the cheapest I've found it was in after Christmas sales
                                      > where they've been selling it as an aid to Christmas decorations!
                                      >
                                      > Here's another site...
                                      >
                                      > http://www.anixtercomponents.com/news.asp?
                                      > newsid=182&sub=news2&name=news&language=2
                                      >
                                      > hope that helps
                                      >
                                      > Mike
                                      >
                                      >
                                      > The GR-30 mailing list is maintained by Joey Aguilera -
                                      > tentacle_joe@...
                                      >
                                      > for info: gr-30-owner@yahoogroups.com
                                      > to post: gr-30@yahoogroups.com
                                      > to unsubscribe GR-30-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                                      > to set digest GR-30-digest@yahoogroups.com
                                      > to set normal GR-30-normal@yahoogroups.com
                                      > Yahoo! Groups Links
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >

                                      ---------
                                      ... even though I must concede
                                      greatness has eluded me,
                                      I'd still
                                      miss the world.
                                      ["Fly", Adrian Belew]
                                    • MoonCaine
                                      BTW, Mike, we ve got both of those you linked, down at our studio, and I think the one you describe first sounds like some others. One of our shooters buys
                                      Message 18 of 23 , Jun 6, 2007
                                        BTW, Mike, we've got both of those you linked, down at our studio,
                                        and I think the one you describe first sounds like some others. One
                                        of our shooters buys various kinds and keeps us stocked with groovy
                                        cable ties.

                                        Another shooter taught me about coiling cables, and here's the link
                                        to my short video about that:

                                        http://www.mooncaine.net/videos/How-to-coil-guitar-cables.mov

                                        It's pretty much like Cliff Lang described, except we don't bother
                                        with twisting one way, then next time the other way. Instead, as Roy
                                        put it when he taught me: "the cable came to you coiled up, and it
                                        wants to coil up, you just gotta let it coil up the way it truly
                                        wants to, and here's how...." Roy said to pinch it and draw it
                                        through your pinched fingers, to make it untwist, and then gently lay
                                        it across your hand. You'll be able to feel & see which way the cable
                                        is coiled. When you're done, as I show in the video, you should be
                                        able to release your grip, and the cable will remain coiled neatly.

                                        The point of all this was to avoid twisting and kinking the cable,
                                        because that can cause it to fail sooner than if you coil it neatly.

                                        --moonie


                                        On Jun 6, 2007, at 6:20 AM, lightningslim wrote:

                                        > I use some double sided velcro cable ties that have a a built in loop
                                        > that keeps them on the cable when unfastened. Unfortunately the web
                                        > site
                                        > that I got them from doesn't seem to have them anymore.
                                        > I found them here...
                                        >
                                        > http://lextec.com/ven_polygon.html
                                        >
                                        > I've also used the bulk double sided velcro for cable management (also
                                        > on this page) the cheapest I've found it was in after Christmas sales
                                        > where they've been selling it as an aid to Christmas decorations!
                                        >
                                        > Here's another site...
                                        >
                                        > http://www.anixtercomponents.com/news.asp?
                                        > newsid=182&sub=news2&name=news&language=2
                                        >
                                        > hope that helps
                                        >
                                        > Mike
                                      • lightningslim
                                        Ha ha, I learned that for coiling ropes in Boy Scouts! :o) But it works well for cables too! Mike Sniped: It s pretty much like Cliff Lang described, except
                                        Message 19 of 23 , Jun 7, 2007
                                          Ha ha, I learned that for coiling ropes in Boy Scouts! :o)
                                          But it works well for cables too!

                                          Mike

                                          Sniped:
                                          It's pretty much like Cliff Lang described, except we don't bother
                                          > with twisting one way, then next time the other way. Instead, as Roy
                                          > put it when he taught me: "the cable came to you coiled up, and it
                                          > wants to coil up, you just gotta let it coil up the way it truly
                                          > wants to, and here's how...." Roy said to pinch it and draw it
                                          > through your pinched fingers, to make it untwist, and then gently lay
                                          > it across your hand. You'll be able to feel & see which way the cable
                                          > is coiled. When you're done, as I show in the video, you should be
                                          > able to release your grip, and the cable will remain coiled neatly.
                                          >
                                        • Steve Meiers
                                          Hey Cable Winders, Since this theme keeps popping up, maybe we need a new Yahoo! Group just for cable winding. It should be bigger than just a GR players
                                          Message 20 of 23 , Jun 7, 2007
                                            Hey Cable Winders,

                                            Since this theme keeps popping up, maybe we need a new Yahoo! Group just for cable winding. It should be bigger than just a GR players group. :::|8^D

                                            Didn't I read on a GAC group that perfect distortion is achieved only through a divinely and frequently improperly wound guitar cord with years of winding-stress maliciously inflicted and then carefully duct-taped to the stage floor with trip-loops strategically mounted in the air for night-vision impaired stage hands and waitresses?

                                            As some of my cables are nearing 20 years of age and some have been repaired numerous times, I probably should start taking this topic more seriously, too.

                                            In my limited experience, more cables are destroyed by people stepping on plugs of floor unit inserted cables than anything else, then comes tripping over or yanking cables, duct tape removal, case-lid creases, and the ever popular wiggle-here-to-see-which-one test, etc. Basically I think that gorilla idiot strong-arm tactics have damaged more of my cables than suburban assault winding or anything else. Fortunately my GR cables have held up well so far against my rolling office chair in the studio. Maybe the shag carpet helps. BTW, I highly recommend shag carpet to protect your GR and other cables.

                                            But I guess some additional cable stress is to be expected with saloon players verses jazz, church and other kinder-and-gentler venue frequenting stylists. Maybe my cables are just suffering from "Cheap-Bar-Band-Syndrome", like their owner. I guess I've been fortunate that more drunks have walked on my cables than have walked on me so far. I hope that trend continues.

                                            Off-topic, but doesn't anyone create or post patches or mods to these GR groups? It seams like the real benefit of such a group would be swapping sounds and more technical stuff. I don't see much of it though.

                                            And here's a cable question:
                                            Anybody seen a combination USB and audio cable? Links?

                                            Good chatter here folks. Thanks for reading and writing.

                                            Steve M
                                            Master Cheap Garden Hose Winder
                                            attempting Novice Cable Winder status



                                            ---------------------------------
                                            Looking for a deal? Find great prices on flights and hotels with Yahoo! FareChase.

                                            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                          • Cliff Lang
                                            You are one funny dude. Great post. Cliff Lang ... From: Steve Meiers To: GR-30@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, June 07, 2007 1:54 PM Subject: [GR-30] Re:
                                            Message 21 of 23 , Jun 8, 2007
                                              You are one funny dude. Great post.

                                              Cliff Lang
                                              ----- Original Message -----
                                              From: Steve Meiers
                                              To: GR-30@yahoogroups.com
                                              Sent: Thursday, June 07, 2007 1:54 PM
                                              Subject: [GR-30] Re: video guys have some great cable ties & tricks


                                              Hey Cable Winders,

                                              Since this theme keeps popping up, maybe we need a new Yahoo! Group just for cable winding. It should be bigger than just a GR players group. :::|8^D

                                              Didn't I read on a GAC group that perfect distortion is achieved only through a divinely and frequently improperly wound guitar cord with years of winding-stress maliciously inflicted and then carefully duct-taped to the stage floor with trip-loops strategically mounted in the air for night-vision impaired stage hands and waitresses?

                                              As some of my cables are nearing 20 years of age and some have been repaired numerous times, I probably should start taking this topic more seriously, too.

                                              In my limited experience, more cables are destroyed by people stepping on plugs of floor unit inserted cables than anything else, then comes tripping over or yanking cables, duct tape removal, case-lid creases, and the ever popular wiggle-here-to-see-which-one test, etc. Basically I think that gorilla idiot strong-arm tactics have damaged more of my cables than suburban assault winding or anything else. Fortunately my GR cables have held up well so far against my rolling office chair in the studio. Maybe the shag carpet helps. BTW, I highly recommend shag carpet to protect your GR and other cables.

                                              But I guess some additional cable stress is to be expected with saloon players verses jazz, church and other kinder-and-gentler venue frequenting stylists. Maybe my cables are just suffering from "Cheap-Bar-Band-Syndrome", like their owner. I guess I've been fortunate that more drunks have walked on my cables than have walked on me so far. I hope that trend continues.

                                              Off-topic, but doesn't anyone create or post patches or mods to these GR groups? It seams like the real benefit of such a group would be swapping sounds and more technical stuff. I don't see much of it though.

                                              And here's a cable question:
                                              Anybody seen a combination USB and audio cable? Links?

                                              Good chatter here folks. Thanks for reading and writing.

                                              Steve M
                                              Master Cheap Garden Hose Winder
                                              attempting Novice Cable Winder status

                                              ---------------------------------
                                              Looking for a deal? Find great prices on flights and hotels with Yahoo! FareChase.

                                              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





                                              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                            • unlunf
                                              I m not sure what the fuss is all about......... All things coiled, whether they be rope, a garden hose, or a cable, they all take a set soon after being
                                              Message 22 of 23 , Jun 9, 2007
                                                I'm not sure what the fuss is all about.........

                                                All things coiled, whether they be rope, a garden hose, or a cable,
                                                they all take a "set" soon after being coiled up. When you go to
                                                rewind one of these, you merely let it return to the "set" that it
                                                previously took, and all will be well. How you do that is up to
                                                you, but when I think about it (on one of those rare occasions when
                                                I do think), I doing pretty much what moonie said - I just perforce
                                                twist the cable with my right thumb and forefinger such that the
                                                next loop lays in my left palm without resistance. If there's any
                                                resistance at all, then the loop will try to "buck the trend" and
                                                twist away from the previous loops - it'll be very obvious.

                                                When you remove a coil of cable from your gig bag or box, you should
                                                be able do hold on to one end, and drop the remaining coil to the
                                                ground. When it hits, you should then be able to walk away, dragging
                                                the cable as it uncoils, with no tangling. As noted in a long-ago
                                                post, you DON'T throw the coil across the stage to unfurl it. I saw
                                                this done once, with a 50' mic cable, and it beaned a guy whose back
                                                wsa turned. When he fell, he dropped the Les Paul he'd been taking
                                                out of its case, and put a very ugly ding in it. Needless to say,
                                                fisticuffs ensued, and it wasn't a pretty sight.

                                                And finally, your daughter makes a pony tail with her hair, right?
                                                She uses a hair pull that's a loop of elastic string with a pair of
                                                plastic balls, right? That's the best tie for holding a cable,
                                                hands down! It goes right on, and it comes right back off, as needed.
                                                With a bit of experience, you can manipulate it with one hand. And
                                                they're dirt cheap! I get a package of 20 for 2 bucks at the local
                                                variety store. They're even color coded, making it easy in pre-gig
                                                stage lighting to distinguish which cable is what.

                                                HTH


                                                unlunf
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