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LOHAN chap to launch Raspberry Pi e ye in the sky • The Register

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  • Mike Manes
    Another LOHAN flight out of UK next Saturday: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2013/04/12/pi_camera_launch/ 73 de Mike W5VSI
    Message 1 of 14 , Apr 15 1:36 PM
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      Another LOHAN flight out of UK next Saturday:

      http://www.theregister.co.uk/2013/04/12/pi_camera_launch/

      73 de Mike W5VSI
    • Anthony Stirk
      Happened this weekend Mike, We had the most awesome recovery by the Slovakians, my write up is here : http://ava.upuaut.net/?p=522 , Dave s is here :
      Message 2 of 14 , Apr 15 1:44 PM
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        Happened this weekend Mike,

        We had the most awesome recovery by the Slovakians, my write up is here : http://ava.upuaut.net/?p=522 , Dave's is here : http://www.daveakerman.com/?p=1063

        Both were floaters, sadly the Pi's batteries died about 3am but AVA went on to rise to 38km when the sun came up and burst over Austria. Flew my prototype APRS & 70cms transmitter (http://imgur.com/QgDpXf3) which had a few issues but we should be able to diagnose the faults as we got it back.

        Cheers,

        Anthony M0UPU


        On Mon, Apr 15, 2013 at 9:36 PM, Mike Manes <mrmanes@...> wrote:
        Another LOHAN flight out of UK next Saturday:

        http://www.theregister.co.uk/2013/04/12/pi_camera_launch/

        73 de Mike W5VSI


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      • David Akerman
        That s not a LOHAN flight, and it happened on Saturday - see my write-up at http://www.daveakerman.com/?p=1063 Also, Anthony Stirk had an incredible flight
        Message 3 of 14 , Apr 15 1:50 PM
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          That's not a LOHAN flight, and it happened on Saturday - see my write-up at http://www.daveakerman.com/?p=1063

          Also, Anthony Stirk had an incredible flight from the same launch site.  Despite launching at the same moment that I did, his ended up in Austria whilst mine was last seen over Swizerland.  See http://ava.upuaut.net/?p=522 for the amazing story.

          Dave


          On 15 April 2013 21:36, Mike Manes <mrmanes@...> wrote:
          Another LOHAN flight out of UK next Saturday:

          http://www.theregister.co.uk/2013/04/12/pi_camera_launch/

          73 de Mike W5VSI


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        • L. Paul Verhage
          I purchases a Raspberry Pi to experiment with in this way. It s going to be a big step up from microcontrollers. Paul ... -- Onwards and Upwards, Paul
          Message 4 of 14 , Apr 15 1:51 PM
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            I purchases a Raspberry Pi to experiment with in this way.
             
            It's going to be a big step up from microcontrollers.
             
            Paul


            On Mon, Apr 15, 2013 at 2:44 PM, Anthony Stirk <upuaut@...> wrote:


            Happened this weekend Mike,

            We had the most awesome recovery by the Slovakians, my write up is here : http://ava.upuaut.net/?p=522 , Dave's is here : http://www.daveakerman.com/?p=1063

            Both were floaters, sadly the Pi's batteries died about 3am but AVA went on to rise to 38km when the sun came up and burst over Austria. Flew my prototype APRS & 70cms transmitter (http://imgur.com/QgDpXf3) which had a few issues but we should be able to diagnose the faults as we got it back.

            Cheers,

            Anthony M0UPU


            On Mon, Apr 15, 2013 at 9:36 PM, Mike Manes <mrmanes@...> wrote:
            Another LOHAN flight out of UK next Saturday:

            http://www.theregister.co.uk/2013/04/12/pi_camera_launch/

            73 de Mike W5VSI


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          • wb8elk
            Also a big step up in current drain unless you managed to buy the A model without the Ethernet. - Bill WB8ELK ... From: L. Paul Verhage To:
            Message 5 of 14 , Apr 15 2:36 PM
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              Also a big step up in current drain unless you managed to buy the A model without the Ethernet.
               
              - Bill WB8ELK
               
              -----Original Message-----
              From: L. Paul Verhage <nearsys@...>
              To: GPSL@yahoogroups.com <gpsl@yahoogroups.com>
              Sent: Mon, Apr 15, 2013 3:51 pm
              Subject: Re: [GPSL] LOHAN chap to launch Raspberry Pi eye in the sky • The Register

               
              I purchases a Raspberry Pi to experiment with in this way.
               
              It's going to be a big step up from microcontrollers.
               
              Paul


              On Mon, Apr 15, 2013 at 2:44 PM, Anthony Stirk <upuaut@...> wrote:


              Happened this weekend Mike,

              We had the most awesome recovery by the Slovakians, my write up is here : http://ava.upuaut.net/?p=522 , Dave's is here : http://www.daveakerman.com/?p=1063

              Both were floaters, sadly the Pi's batteries died about 3am but AVA went on to rise to 38km when the sun came up and burst over Austria. Flew my prototype APRS & 70cms transmitter (http://imgur.com/QgDpXf3) which had a few issues but we should be able to diagnose the faults as we got it back.

              Cheers,

              Anthony M0UPU


              On Mon, Apr 15, 2013 at 9:36 PM, Mike Manes <mrmanes@...> wrote:
              Another LOHAN flight out of UK next Saturday:

              http://www.theregister.co.uk/2013/04/12/pi_camera_launch/

              73 de Mike W5VSI


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            • Anthony Stirk
              Yep. 6 AA s in Pi = 21 hours 6 AA s in AVA @ 2 min APRS & constant RTTY = a week Anthony M0UPU Sent from my iPhone ... Yep. 6 AA s in Pi = 21 hours 6 AA s in
              Message 6 of 14 , Apr 15 2:43 PM
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                Yep. 6 AA's in Pi = 21 hours 6 AA's in AVA @ 2 min APRS & constant RTTY = a week 

                Anthony M0UPU

                Sent from my iPhone

                On 15 Apr 2013, at 22:36, wb8elk@... wrote:

                 

                Also a big step up in current drain unless you managed to buy the A model without the Ethernet.
                 
                - Bill WB8ELK
                 
                -----Original Message-----
                From: L. Paul Verhage <nearsys@...>
                To: GPSL@yahoogroups.com <gpsl@yahoogroups.com>
                Sent: Mon, Apr 15, 2013 3:51 pm
                Subject: Re: [GPSL] LOHAN chap to launch Raspberry Pi eye in the sky • The Register

                 
                I purchases a Raspberry Pi to experiment with in this way.
                 
                It's going to be a big step up from microcontrollers.
                 
                Paul


                On Mon, Apr 15, 2013 at 2:44 PM, Anthony Stirk <upuaut@...> wrote:


                Happened this weekend Mike,

                We had the most awesome recovery by the Slovakians, my write up is here : http://ava.upuaut.net/?p=522 , Dave's is here : http://www.daveakerman.com/?p=1063

                Both were floaters, sadly the Pi's batteries died about 3am but AVA went on to rise to 38km when the sun came up and burst over Austria. Flew my prototype APRS & 70cms transmitter (http://imgur.com/QgDpXf3) which had a few issues but we should be able to diagnose the faults as we got it back.

                Cheers,

                Anthony M0UPU


                On Mon, Apr 15, 2013 at 9:36 PM, Mike Manes <mrmanes@...> wrote:
                Another LOHAN flight out of UK next Saturday:

                http://www.theregister.co.uk/2013/04/12/pi_camera_launch/

                73 de Mike W5VSI


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              • wb8elk
                It s very difficult to buy a Raspberry Pi in the US so far...It took weeks of daily watching the online sites to find a distributor who had any stock and then
                Message 7 of 14 , Apr 15 2:43 PM
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                  It's very difficult to buy a Raspberry Pi in the US so far...It took weeks of daily watching the online sites to find a distributor who had any stock and then they were snapped up within hours. After weeks of trying, I finally found one in stock and just got one in my hands which is why I haven't flown one as yet.
                   
                  Newark and briefly SparkFun occasionally carry them but I had the best luck finding one on a site called Adafruit. I have yet to find anyone with stock on the lower power A version which should be a good one for ballooning.
                   
                  If anyone knows of a US source that has the A version in stock, please let us know.
                   
                  - Bill WB8ELK
                   
                   
                   
                  -----Original Message-----
                  From: Mike Manes <mrmanes@...>
                  To: Balloon Sked Reflector <ARHABflights@...>; GPSL Balloon Reflector <GPSL@yahoogroups.com>
                  Sent: Mon, Apr 15, 2013 3:37 pm
                  Subject: [GPSL] LOHAN chap to launch Raspberry Pi eye in the sky • The Register

                  Another LOHAN flight out of UK next Saturday:
                  
                  http://www.theregister.co.uk/2013/04/12/pi_camera_launch/
                  
                  73 de Mike W5VSI
                  
                  
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                • Mike Manes
                  Hi Anthony & Dave, Guess I should have peeked at the 4/12 posting date on the El Reg web page to see that the Saturday referred to was just past. Well done,
                  Message 8 of 14 , Apr 15 3:21 PM
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                    Hi Anthony & Dave,

                    Guess I should have peeked at the 4/12 posting date on the El Reg
                    web page to see that the Saturday referred to was just past.

                    Well done, gents! And nice touch to key up your 70cm beacon once out
                    of UK airspace. Sure would be nice if that silly rule re unmanned
                    balloons were sent to Davy Jones's Locker someday. No souls have been
                    lost in the US or anywhere else on the planet due to QRM from balloon
                    beacons in the ham bands.

                    One tip that you might consider for windy launches: EOSS has used
                    the "Hail Mary" launch technique since it was first taught to us by
                    scientific ballooning veteran, Norm Kjome of U. Wyoming. That's to
                    hold the balloon by the neck and stretch out the flight string directly
                    downwind, with each package supported gently by agile handlers, whose
                    task is to move such their packages are directly beneath the balloon
                    once it lifts the package - this is about the only way defeat gravity.
                    For a long payload line, this can make for a shorter run for "tail
                    end Charlie". Of course, for a calm launch, the handlers can form a
                    circle around the balloon handler.

                    The balloon handler's (aka Balloonmeister) job is far simpler: just
                    verify that all payload handlers are ready and that all beacons are
                    running, then count down from 5 before simply letting go of the neck.

                    FYI, I attended 2nd grade at Milton Road School in 1950 when my dad was
                    stationed with the US Army at Mildenhall. I was saddened to learn that
                    my "alma mater" was replaced by an apartment building a few years ago.
                    Interestingly, that's where I learned long division in mixed number
                    bases (pounds, shillings and pence) before returning to the US where the
                    classes were still doing 2-figure addition :=(.

                    73 de Mike W5VSI

                    On 4/15/13 2:44 PM, Anthony Stirk wrote:
                    > Happened this weekend Mike,
                    >
                    > We had the most awesome recovery by the Slovakians, my write up is here
                    > : http://ava.upuaut.net/?p=522 , Dave's is here :
                    > http://www.daveakerman.com/?p=1063
                    >
                    > Both were floaters, sadly the Pi's batteries died about 3am but AVA went
                    > on to rise to 38km when the sun came up and burst over Austria. Flew my
                    > prototype APRS & 70cms transmitter (http://imgur.com/QgDpXf3) which had
                    > a few issues but we should be able to diagnose the faults as we got it back.
                    >
                    > Cheers,
                    >
                    > Anthony M0UPU
                    >
                    >
                    > On Mon, Apr 15, 2013 at 9:36 PM, Mike Manes <mrmanes@...
                    > <mailto:mrmanes@...>> wrote:
                    >
                    > Another LOHAN flight out of UK next Saturday:
                    >
                    > http://www.theregister.co.uk/2013/04/12/pi_camera_launch/
                    >
                    > 73 de Mike W5VSI
                    >
                  • Anthony Stirk
                    Hi Mike, It just proves what a silly law not being able to use airborne APRS in the UK is as UK stations igated the balloon whilst it was over the Netherlands
                    Message 9 of 14 , Apr 16 3:33 AM
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                      Hi Mike,

                      It just proves what a silly law not being able to use airborne APRS in the UK is as UK stations igated the balloon whilst it was over the Netherlands and Germany. As Phil Heron pointed out physics doesn't adhere to legislation. 

                      It was probably a bit blustery and with the extremely low neck lift ( 300g with a 180g payload) launch was always going to be a little sketchy. We had a few mins of panic as the balloon didn't climb at all for the first 5 mins however it then decided to climb fortunately. All good it the end though , Ras Pi people did a nice write up here : http://www.raspberrypi.org/archives/3704

                      Cheers,

                      Anthony M0UPU


                      On Mon, Apr 15, 2013 at 11:21 PM, Mike Manes <mrmanes@...> wrote:
                      Hi Anthony & Dave,

                      Guess I should have peeked at the 4/12 posting date on the El Reg
                      web page to see that the Saturday referred to was just past.

                      Well done, gents! And nice touch to key up your 70cm beacon once out
                      of UK airspace.  Sure would be nice if that silly rule re unmanned
                      balloons were sent to Davy Jones's Locker someday.  No souls have been
                      lost in the US or anywhere else on the planet due to QRM from balloon
                      beacons in the ham bands.

                      One tip that you might consider for windy launches:  EOSS has used
                      the "Hail Mary" launch technique since it was first taught to us by
                      scientific ballooning veteran, Norm Kjome of U. Wyoming.  That's to
                      hold the balloon by the neck and stretch out the flight string directly
                      downwind, with each package supported gently by agile handlers, whose
                      task is to move such their packages are directly beneath the balloon
                      once it lifts the package - this is about the only way defeat gravity.
                      For a long payload line, this can make for a shorter run for "tail
                      end Charlie".  Of course, for a calm launch, the handlers can form a
                      circle around the balloon handler.

                      The balloon handler's (aka Balloonmeister) job is far simpler: just
                      verify that all payload handlers are ready and that all beacons are
                      running, then count down from 5 before simply letting go of the neck.

                      FYI, I attended 2nd grade at Milton Road School in 1950 when my dad was
                      stationed with the US Army at Mildenhall.  I was saddened to learn that
                      my "alma mater" was replaced by an apartment building a few years ago.
                      Interestingly, that's where I learned long division in mixed number bases (pounds, shillings and pence) before returning to the US where the
                      classes were still doing 2-figure addition :=(.

                      73 de Mike W5VSI


                      On 4/15/13 2:44 PM, Anthony Stirk wrote:
                      Happened this weekend Mike,

                      We had the most awesome recovery by the Slovakians, my write up is here
                      : http://ava.upuaut.net/?p=522 , Dave's is here :
                      http://www.daveakerman.com/?p=1063

                      Both were floaters, sadly the Pi's batteries died about 3am but AVA went
                      on to rise to 38km when the sun came up and burst over Austria. Flew my
                      prototype APRS & 70cms transmitter (http://imgur.com/QgDpXf3) which had
                      a few issues but we should be able to diagnose the faults as we got it back.

                      Cheers,

                      Anthony M0UPU


                      On Mon, Apr 15, 2013 at 9:36 PM, Mike Manes <mrmanes@...
                      <mailto:mrmanes@...>> wrote:

                          Another LOHAN flight out of UK next Saturday:

                          http://www.theregister.co.uk/2013/04/12/pi_camera_launch/

                          73 de Mike W5VSI


                    • Mike Manes
                      Hi Anthony, Well, you have a democracy over there - one far older than what we call ours over here in the colonies. So perhaps you fellow ARHAB chaps, with a
                      Message 10 of 14 , Apr 16 11:21 AM
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                        Hi Anthony,

                        Well, you have a democracy over there - one far older than what we
                        call ours over here in the colonies. So perhaps you fellow ARHAB
                        chaps, with a little help from El Reg, could generate an online
                        petition to your MPs to correct that OFCOM (?) rule through
                        legislation. That process does work fairly well over here.

                        One other caveat re windy launches: there's a nasty phenomenon
                        called "false lift", where the wind blowing across the top of
                        an anchored balloon, which acts like an airfoil, creates lift
                        in excess of that produced by the buoyancy of gas bubble. Since once
                        released, the balloon now drifts with the air mass, that
                        false lift simply disappears.

                        Hot air balloonists know this bit of Murphydom well and try to
                        compensate by running the burners longer before launch.

                        EOSS-2 in 1991 was our first experience with false lift, where there
                        was 10-15 kt wind during fill. We had like 3 payloads oh the string,
                        and the balloon did lift 2 of 'em off the ground OK, but "tail end
                        charlie" was just too much, and it bounced along the ground, across
                        a 4-lane highway and finally got snagged on a greenskeepers shack at
                        a nearby golf course. We did retrieve the flight string, but the
                        balloon got punctured when the wind blew it into the ground.

                        We retrieved the flight string and filled the spare balloon with
                        another 500-600 grams of neck lift, and the flight launched normally.
                        This is the origin of the EOSS Motto, "A little more gas" :=P.

                        For flights where one is trying to minimize excess lift, it's advisable
                        to avoid a windy fill, either by launching near sunrise or inside a
                        shelter or at least in the lee of a tall building.

                        73 de Mike W5VSI

                        On 4/16/13 4:33 AM, Anthony Stirk wrote:
                        > Hi Mike,
                        >
                        > It just proves what a silly law not being able to use airborne APRS in
                        > the UK is as UK stations igated the balloon whilst it was over the
                        > Netherlands and Germany. As Phil Heron pointed out physics doesn't
                        > adhere to legislation.
                        >
                        > It was probably a bit blustery and with the extremely low neck lift (
                        > 300g with a 180g payload) launch was always going to be a little
                        > sketchy. We had a few mins of panic as the balloon didn't climb at all
                        > for the first 5 mins however it then decided to climb fortunately. All
                        > good it the end though , Ras Pi people did a nice write up here :
                        > http://www.raspberrypi.org/archives/3704
                        >
                        > Cheers,
                        >
                        > Anthony M0UPU
                        >
                        >
                        > On Mon, Apr 15, 2013 at 11:21 PM, Mike Manes <mrmanes@...
                        > <mailto:mrmanes@...>> wrote:
                        >
                        > Hi Anthony & Dave,
                        >
                        > Guess I should have peeked at the 4/12 posting date on the El Reg
                        > web page to see that the Saturday referred to was just past.
                        >
                        > Well done, gents! And nice touch to key up your 70cm beacon once out
                        > of UK airspace. Sure would be nice if that silly rule re unmanned
                        > balloons were sent to Davy Jones's Locker someday. No souls have been
                        > lost in the US or anywhere else on the planet due to QRM from balloon
                        > beacons in the ham bands.
                        >
                        > One tip that you might consider for windy launches: EOSS has used
                        > the "Hail Mary" launch technique since it was first taught to us by
                        > scientific ballooning veteran, Norm Kjome of U. Wyoming. That's to
                        > hold the balloon by the neck and stretch out the flight string directly
                        > downwind, with each package supported gently by agile handlers, whose
                        > task is to move such their packages are directly beneath the balloon
                        > once it lifts the package - this is about the only way defeat gravity.
                        > For a long payload line, this can make for a shorter run for "tail
                        > end Charlie". Of course, for a calm launch, the handlers can form a
                        > circle around the balloon handler.
                        >
                        > The balloon handler's (aka Balloonmeister) job is far simpler: just
                        > verify that all payload handlers are ready and that all beacons are
                        > running, then count down from 5 before simply letting go of the neck.
                        >
                        > FYI, I attended 2nd grade at Milton Road School in 1950 when my dad was
                        > stationed with the US Army at Mildenhall. I was saddened to learn that
                        > my "alma mater" was replaced by an apartment building a few years ago.
                        > Interestingly, that's where I learned long division in mixed number
                        > bases (pounds, shillings and pence) before returning to the US where the
                        > classes were still doing 2-figure addition :=(.
                        >
                        > 73 de Mike W5VSI
                        >
                        >
                        > On 4/15/13 2:44 PM, Anthony Stirk wrote:
                        >
                        > Happened this weekend Mike,
                        >
                        > We had the most awesome recovery by the Slovakians, my write up
                        > is here
                        > : http://ava.upuaut.net/?p=522 , Dave's is here :
                        > http://www.daveakerman.com/?p=__1063
                        > <http://www.daveakerman.com/?p=1063>
                        >
                        > Both were floaters, sadly the Pi's batteries died about 3am but
                        > AVA went
                        > on to rise to 38km when the sun came up and burst over Austria.
                        > Flew my
                        > prototype APRS & 70cms transmitter (http://imgur.com/QgDpXf3)
                        > which had
                        > a few issues but we should be able to diagnose the faults as we
                        > got it back.
                        >
                        > Cheers,
                        >
                        > Anthony M0UPU
                        >
                        >
                        > On Mon, Apr 15, 2013 at 9:36 PM, Mike Manes <mrmanes@...
                        > <mailto:mrmanes@...>
                        > <mailto:mrmanes@... <mailto:mrmanes@...>>> wrote:
                        >
                        > Another LOHAN flight out of UK next Saturday:
                        >
                        > http://www.theregister.co.uk/__2013/04/12/pi_camera_launch/
                        > <http://www.theregister.co.uk/2013/04/12/pi_camera_launch/>
                        >
                        > 73 de Mike W5VSI
                        >
                        >
                      • David Akerman
                        Mike, Yes we know that effect quite well. Happened to my second flight resulting in a splashdown 10 miles from the coast. Our equivalent of your little more
                        Message 11 of 14 , Apr 16 11:40 AM
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                          Mike,

                          Yes we know that effect quite well. Happened to my second flight
                          resulting in a splashdown 10 miles from the coast. Our equivalent of
                          your "little more gas" motto is a new SI unit called the "Stirk" (named
                          after Anthony of course), and is a measure of how much gas to add beyond
                          the figure you first thought of. e.g. "That'll need an extra 3 Stirks".

                          On Saturday there were some quiet periods where we could measure the
                          neck lift without it being affected by wind. The issue with Anthony's
                          balloon was that our filler weight was nearly twice the 300g neck lift
                          we wanted, and it's kinda difficult to measure a negative net lift. We
                          ended up taking the balloon off the neck to measure. With only 120g of
                          lift remaining after the payload was taken into account, it didn't need
                          much of an error to affect the ascent rate. His balloon hit a wind
                          ceiling and took a few minutes to break through, during which time it
                          just missed a tree 500 metres from the launch site. Quite a tense time!

                          Dave


                          On 16/04/2013 19:21, Mike Manes wrote:
                          > Hi Anthony,
                          >
                          > Well, you have a democracy over there - one far older than what we
                          > call ours over here in the colonies. So perhaps you fellow ARHAB
                          > chaps, with a little help from El Reg, could generate an online
                          > petition to your MPs to correct that OFCOM (?) rule through
                          > legislation. That process does work fairly well over here.
                          >
                          > One other caveat re windy launches: there's a nasty phenomenon
                          > called "false lift", where the wind blowing across the top of
                          > an anchored balloon, which acts like an airfoil, creates lift
                          > in excess of that produced by the buoyancy of gas bubble. Since once
                          > released, the balloon now drifts with the air mass, that
                          > false lift simply disappears.
                          >
                          > Hot air balloonists know this bit of Murphydom well and try to
                          > compensate by running the burners longer before launch.
                          >
                          > EOSS-2 in 1991 was our first experience with false lift, where there
                          > was 10-15 kt wind during fill. We had like 3 payloads oh the string,
                          > and the balloon did lift 2 of 'em off the ground OK, but "tail end
                          > charlie" was just too much, and it bounced along the ground, across
                          > a 4-lane highway and finally got snagged on a greenskeepers shack at
                          > a nearby golf course. We did retrieve the flight string, but the
                          > balloon got punctured when the wind blew it into the ground.
                          >
                          > We retrieved the flight string and filled the spare balloon with
                          > another 500-600 grams of neck lift, and the flight launched normally.
                          > This is the origin of the EOSS Motto, "A little more gas" :=P.
                          >
                          > For flights where one is trying to minimize excess lift, it's advisable
                          > to avoid a windy fill, either by launching near sunrise or inside a
                          > shelter or at least in the lee of a tall building.
                          >
                          > 73 de Mike W5VSI
                          >
                          > On 4/16/13 4:33 AM, Anthony Stirk wrote:
                          >> Hi Mike,
                          >>
                          >> It just proves what a silly law not being able to use airborne APRS in
                          >> the UK is as UK stations igated the balloon whilst it was over the
                          >> Netherlands and Germany. As Phil Heron pointed out physics doesn't
                          >> adhere to legislation.
                          >>
                          >> It was probably a bit blustery and with the extremely low neck lift (
                          >> 300g with a 180g payload) launch was always going to be a little
                          >> sketchy. We had a few mins of panic as the balloon didn't climb at all
                          >> for the first 5 mins however it then decided to climb fortunately. All
                          >> good it the end though , Ras Pi people did a nice write up here :
                          >> http://www.raspberrypi.org/archives/3704
                          >>
                          >> Cheers,
                          >>
                          >> Anthony M0UPU
                          >>
                          >>
                          >> On Mon, Apr 15, 2013 at 11:21 PM, Mike Manes <mrmanes@...
                          >> <mailto:mrmanes@...>> wrote:
                          >>
                          >> Hi Anthony & Dave,
                          >>
                          >> Guess I should have peeked at the 4/12 posting date on the El Reg
                          >> web page to see that the Saturday referred to was just past.
                          >>
                          >> Well done, gents! And nice touch to key up your 70cm beacon once out
                          >> of UK airspace. Sure would be nice if that silly rule re unmanned
                          >> balloons were sent to Davy Jones's Locker someday. No souls have
                          >> been
                          >> lost in the US or anywhere else on the planet due to QRM from
                          >> balloon
                          >> beacons in the ham bands.
                          >>
                          >> One tip that you might consider for windy launches: EOSS has used
                          >> the "Hail Mary" launch technique since it was first taught to us by
                          >> scientific ballooning veteran, Norm Kjome of U. Wyoming. That's to
                          >> hold the balloon by the neck and stretch out the flight string
                          >> directly
                          >> downwind, with each package supported gently by agile handlers,
                          >> whose
                          >> task is to move such their packages are directly beneath the balloon
                          >> once it lifts the package - this is about the only way defeat
                          >> gravity.
                          >> For a long payload line, this can make for a shorter run for "tail
                          >> end Charlie". Of course, for a calm launch, the handlers can form a
                          >> circle around the balloon handler.
                          >>
                          >> The balloon handler's (aka Balloonmeister) job is far simpler: just
                          >> verify that all payload handlers are ready and that all beacons are
                          >> running, then count down from 5 before simply letting go of the
                          >> neck.
                          >>
                          >> FYI, I attended 2nd grade at Milton Road School in 1950 when my
                          >> dad was
                          >> stationed with the US Army at Mildenhall. I was saddened to
                          >> learn that
                          >> my "alma mater" was replaced by an apartment building a few years
                          >> ago.
                          >> Interestingly, that's where I learned long division in mixed number
                          >> bases (pounds, shillings and pence) before returning to the US
                          >> where the
                          >> classes were still doing 2-figure addition :=(.
                          >>
                          >> 73 de Mike W5VSI
                          >>
                          >>
                          >> On 4/15/13 2:44 PM, Anthony Stirk wrote:
                          >>
                          >> Happened this weekend Mike,
                          >>
                          >> We had the most awesome recovery by the Slovakians, my write up
                          >> is here
                          >> : http://ava.upuaut.net/?p=522 , Dave's is here :
                          >> http://www.daveakerman.com/?p=__1063
                          >> <http://www.daveakerman.com/?p=1063>
                          >>
                          >> Both were floaters, sadly the Pi's batteries died about 3am but
                          >> AVA went
                          >> on to rise to 38km when the sun came up and burst over Austria.
                          >> Flew my
                          >> prototype APRS & 70cms transmitter (http://imgur.com/QgDpXf3)
                          >> which had
                          >> a few issues but we should be able to diagnose the faults as we
                          >> got it back.
                          >>
                          >> Cheers,
                          >>
                          >> Anthony M0UPU
                          >>
                          >>
                          >> On Mon, Apr 15, 2013 at 9:36 PM, Mike Manes <mrmanes@...
                          >> <mailto:mrmanes@...>
                          >> <mailto:mrmanes@... <mailto:mrmanes@...>>> wrote:
                          >>
                          >> Another LOHAN flight out of UK next Saturday:
                          >>
                          >> http://www.theregister.co.uk/__2013/04/12/pi_camera_launch/
                          >> <http://www.theregister.co.uk/2013/04/12/pi_camera_launch/>
                          >>
                          >> 73 de Mike W5VSI
                          >>
                          >>
                          >
                        • Mike Manes
                          Kewl! I guess we could named our unit of a little more gas the Crabtree, after Jack Crabtree W7JLC (ex-AA0P), EOSS s beloved co-founder and charter prez.
                          Message 12 of 14 , Apr 16 1:21 PM
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                            Kewl! I guess we could named our unit of "a little more gas" the
                            Crabtree, after Jack Crabtree W7JLC (ex-AA0P), EOSS's beloved co-founder
                            and charter prez. Legend has it that what he suggested to our then-
                            Balloonmeister, Merle McCaslin K0YUK, during the 2nd fill for EOSS-2.

                            It's tough to judge when there's a moment of calm wind, since there
                            can be a good bit of shear from the grassy surface to the top of the
                            nearly-full envelope, isn't it? Note that Rom K6RPK of dual trans-
                            pond flights, fills inside a garage.

                            Another bit of weirdness is solar heating after fill. We had a 2-fer
                            launch of nearly equal neck loads, and the first balloon was filled
                            a bit before sunrise. Due to some student payload issues, the launch
                            and fill of the 2nd balloon was delayed until about a half hour after
                            a nice bright sunrise. After the 2nd balloon launched, we observed
                            a significantly greater ascent rate on the 1st balloon. Apparently,
                            its fill volume had increased a bit after the fill due to solar heating.
                            Since the 2nd balloon was filled in bright sunlight, its volume was not
                            thus enhanced.

                            So it's perhaps possible that your hand-wringer launch may have caught
                            a bit of heating, enhanced by a drop in convective heat loss once let
                            go. A stretch, yes, but it could happen.

                            73 de Mike W5VSI

                            On 4/16/13 12:40 PM, David Akerman wrote:
                            > Mike,
                            >
                            > Yes we know that effect quite well. Happened to my second flight
                            > resulting in a splashdown 10 miles from the coast. Our equivalent of
                            > your "little more gas" motto is a new SI unit called the "Stirk" (named
                            > after Anthony of course), and is a measure of how much gas to add beyond
                            > the figure you first thought of. e.g. "That'll need an extra 3 Stirks".
                            >
                            > On Saturday there were some quiet periods where we could measure the
                            > neck lift without it being affected by wind. The issue with Anthony's
                            > balloon was that our filler weight was nearly twice the 300g neck lift
                            > we wanted, and it's kinda difficult to measure a negative net lift. We
                            > ended up taking the balloon off the neck to measure. With only 120g of
                            > lift remaining after the payload was taken into account, it didn't need
                            > much of an error to affect the ascent rate. His balloon hit a wind
                            > ceiling and took a few minutes to break through, during which time it
                            > just missed a tree 500 metres from the launch site. Quite a tense time!
                            >
                            > Dave
                            >
                            >
                            > On 16/04/2013 19:21, Mike Manes wrote:
                            >> Hi Anthony,
                            >>
                            >> Well, you have a democracy over there - one far older than what we
                            >> call ours over here in the colonies. So perhaps you fellow ARHAB
                            >> chaps, with a little help from El Reg, could generate an online
                            >> petition to your MPs to correct that OFCOM (?) rule through
                            >> legislation. That process does work fairly well over here.
                            >>
                            >> One other caveat re windy launches: there's a nasty phenomenon
                            >> called "false lift", where the wind blowing across the top of
                            >> an anchored balloon, which acts like an airfoil, creates lift
                            >> in excess of that produced by the buoyancy of gas bubble. Since once
                            >> released, the balloon now drifts with the air mass, that
                            >> false lift simply disappears.
                            >>
                            >> Hot air balloonists know this bit of Murphydom well and try to
                            >> compensate by running the burners longer before launch.
                            >>
                            >> EOSS-2 in 1991 was our first experience with false lift, where there
                            >> was 10-15 kt wind during fill. We had like 3 payloads oh the string,
                            >> and the balloon did lift 2 of 'em off the ground OK, but "tail end
                            >> charlie" was just too much, and it bounced along the ground, across
                            >> a 4-lane highway and finally got snagged on a greenskeepers shack at
                            >> a nearby golf course. We did retrieve the flight string, but the
                            >> balloon got punctured when the wind blew it into the ground.
                            >>
                            >> We retrieved the flight string and filled the spare balloon with
                            >> another 500-600 grams of neck lift, and the flight launched normally.
                            >> This is the origin of the EOSS Motto, "A little more gas" :=P.
                            >>
                            >> For flights where one is trying to minimize excess lift, it's advisable
                            >> to avoid a windy fill, either by launching near sunrise or inside a
                            >> shelter or at least in the lee of a tall building.
                            >>
                            >> 73 de Mike W5VSI
                            >>
                            >> On 4/16/13 4:33 AM, Anthony Stirk wrote:
                            >>> Hi Mike,
                            >>>
                            >>> It just proves what a silly law not being able to use airborne APRS in
                            >>> the UK is as UK stations igated the balloon whilst it was over the
                            >>> Netherlands and Germany. As Phil Heron pointed out physics doesn't
                            >>> adhere to legislation.
                            >>>
                            >>> It was probably a bit blustery and with the extremely low neck lift (
                            >>> 300g with a 180g payload) launch was always going to be a little
                            >>> sketchy. We had a few mins of panic as the balloon didn't climb at all
                            >>> for the first 5 mins however it then decided to climb fortunately. All
                            >>> good it the end though , Ras Pi people did a nice write up here :
                            >>> http://www.raspberrypi.org/archives/3704
                            >>>
                            >>> Cheers,
                            >>>
                            >>> Anthony M0UPU
                            >>>
                            >>>
                            >>> On Mon, Apr 15, 2013 at 11:21 PM, Mike Manes <mrmanes@...
                            >>> <mailto:mrmanes@...>> wrote:
                            >>>
                            >>> Hi Anthony & Dave,
                            >>>
                            >>> Guess I should have peeked at the 4/12 posting date on the El Reg
                            >>> web page to see that the Saturday referred to was just past.
                            >>>
                            >>> Well done, gents! And nice touch to key up your 70cm beacon once out
                            >>> of UK airspace. Sure would be nice if that silly rule re unmanned
                            >>> balloons were sent to Davy Jones's Locker someday. No souls have
                            >>> been
                            >>> lost in the US or anywhere else on the planet due to QRM from
                            >>> balloon
                            >>> beacons in the ham bands.
                            >>>
                            >>> One tip that you might consider for windy launches: EOSS has used
                            >>> the "Hail Mary" launch technique since it was first taught to us by
                            >>> scientific ballooning veteran, Norm Kjome of U. Wyoming. That's to
                            >>> hold the balloon by the neck and stretch out the flight string
                            >>> directly
                            >>> downwind, with each package supported gently by agile handlers,
                            >>> whose
                            >>> task is to move such their packages are directly beneath the balloon
                            >>> once it lifts the package - this is about the only way defeat
                            >>> gravity.
                            >>> For a long payload line, this can make for a shorter run for "tail
                            >>> end Charlie". Of course, for a calm launch, the handlers can form a
                            >>> circle around the balloon handler.
                            >>>
                            >>> The balloon handler's (aka Balloonmeister) job is far simpler: just
                            >>> verify that all payload handlers are ready and that all beacons are
                            >>> running, then count down from 5 before simply letting go of the
                            >>> neck.
                            >>>
                            >>> FYI, I attended 2nd grade at Milton Road School in 1950 when my
                            >>> dad was
                            >>> stationed with the US Army at Mildenhall. I was saddened to
                            >>> learn that
                            >>> my "alma mater" was replaced by an apartment building a few years
                            >>> ago.
                            >>> Interestingly, that's where I learned long division in mixed number
                            >>> bases (pounds, shillings and pence) before returning to the US
                            >>> where the
                            >>> classes were still doing 2-figure addition :=(.
                            >>>
                            >>> 73 de Mike W5VSI
                            >>>
                            >>>
                            >>> On 4/15/13 2:44 PM, Anthony Stirk wrote:
                            >>>
                            >>> Happened this weekend Mike,
                            >>>
                            >>> We had the most awesome recovery by the Slovakians, my write up
                            >>> is here
                            >>> : http://ava.upuaut.net/?p=522 , Dave's is here :
                            >>> http://www.daveakerman.com/?p=__1063
                            >>> <http://www.daveakerman.com/?p=1063>
                            >>>
                            >>> Both were floaters, sadly the Pi's batteries died about 3am but
                            >>> AVA went
                            >>> on to rise to 38km when the sun came up and burst over Austria.
                            >>> Flew my
                            >>> prototype APRS & 70cms transmitter (http://imgur.com/QgDpXf3)
                            >>> which had
                            >>> a few issues but we should be able to diagnose the faults as we
                            >>> got it back.
                            >>>
                            >>> Cheers,
                            >>>
                            >>> Anthony M0UPU
                            >>>
                            >>>
                            >>> On Mon, Apr 15, 2013 at 9:36 PM, Mike Manes <mrmanes@...
                            >>> <mailto:mrmanes@...>
                            >>> <mailto:mrmanes@... <mailto:mrmanes@...>>> wrote:
                            >>>
                            >>> Another LOHAN flight out of UK next Saturday:
                            >>>
                            >>> http://www.theregister.co.uk/__2013/04/12/pi_camera_launch/
                            >>> <http://www.theregister.co.uk/2013/04/12/pi_camera_launch/>
                            >>>
                            >>> 73 de Mike W5VSI
                            >>>
                            >>>
                            >>
                            >
                          • Michael Willett
                            Mike, As an alternative, you capitalize on the female college students present that actually do run for fun and tell them they will need to hit exactly 20 MPH
                            Message 13 of 14 , Apr 16 1:33 PM
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                              Mike, 

                              As an alternative, you capitalize on the female college students present that actually do run for fun and tell them they will need to hit exactly 20 MPH with the entire string to generate the 21.7 jigawatts needed for lift, and find it even works in 31 MPH winds!


                              Very memorable humor from that launch: 

                              Michael: "....and we will need to hit 20 MPH running to launch the balloon"

                              After a short pause, one student replied: "Wait, For Real?"

                              *  *
                              \__/

                              --Michael
                              K5NOT


                              On Apr 16, 2013, at 1:21 PM, Mike Manes <mrmanes@...> wrote:

                              For flights where one is trying to minimize excess lift, it's advisable
                              to avoid a windy fill, either by launching near sunrise or inside a
                              shelter or at least in the lee of a tall building.
                            • Mike Manes
                              Ehehheh. Gets amusing with a 10 - 12 payload string!
                              Message 14 of 14 , Apr 16 2:08 PM
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                                Ehehheh. Gets amusing with a 10 - 12 payload string!

                                On 4/16/13 2:33 PM, Michael Willett wrote:
                                > Mike,
                                >
                                > As an alternative, you capitalize on the female college students present
                                > that actually do run for fun and tell them they will need to hit exactly
                                > 20 MPH with the entire string to generate the 21.7 jigawatts needed for
                                > lift, and find it even works in 31 MPH winds!
                                >
                                > wiald.ae.utexas.edu/ <http://wiald.ae.utexas.edu/>
                                >
                                > Very memorable humor from that launch:
                                >
                                > Michael: "....and we will need to hit 20 MPH running to launch the balloon"
                                >
                                > After a short pause, one student replied: "Wait, For Real?"
                                >
                                > * *
                                > \__/
                                >
                                > --Michael
                                > K5NOT
                                >
                                >
                                > On Apr 16, 2013, at 1:21 PM, Mike Manes <mrmanes@...
                                > <mailto:mrmanes@...>> wrote:
                                >>
                                >> For flights where one is trying to minimize excess lift, it's advisable
                                >> to avoid a windy fill, either by launching near sunrise or inside a
                                >> shelter or at least in the lee of a tall building.
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