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Re: [GIWorld-Hepatitis] Re: Procrit

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  • Tatezi
    A second or third voice on eating meat for low RBC...don t do it. The anemia that is induced by tx is not an iron deficiency related anemia. Claudine can
    Message 1 of 9 , Feb 13, 2002
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      A second or third voice on eating meat for low RBC...don't do it. The
      anemia that is induced by tx is not an iron deficiency related anemia.
      Claudine can explain this much better than I can....but eating a lot of
      meat will do more harm then good. Iron is so bad for us and we need to
      stay away from it.

      Try folic acid...it helps the body produce red blood cells and has
      nothing to do with iron.

      Tatezi


      > >>As much as I hate to say this, eat MEAT!!!!!!!!! <<
      >
      > To the best of my understanding, the ribavarin
      > induced anemia is not iron deficiency related,


      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Patricia Jean
      Wierd, my gastro told me not to take Vitamin E on treatment and gave me a prescription for folic acid. Man sometimes I wish these guys would make up their
      Message 2 of 9 , Feb 13, 2002
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        Wierd, my gastro told me not to take Vitamin E on treatment and gave me a
        prescription for folic acid. Man sometimes I wish these guys would make up
        their collective minds!

        alley
      • Constance Dickson
        I was told not to take Vitamin E also. How are you, Pat? Connie ... __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Send FREE Valentine
        Message 3 of 9 , Feb 13, 2002
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          I was told not to take Vitamin E also. How are you,
          Pat?
          Connie
          --- Patricia Jean <patriciajean@...> wrote:
          > Wierd, my gastro told me not to take Vitamin E on
          > treatment and gave me a
          > prescription for folic acid. Man sometimes I wish
          > these guys would make up
          > their collective minds!
          >
          > alley
          >
          >


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        • martine
          yes it happened to me, i have been on tx for 8 wks. and I am loosing to much weight, 20,lbs,in 8 weeks, so the DR. told me to go and eat a hamburger once
          Message 4 of 9 , Feb 13, 2002
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            yes it happened to me, i have been on tx for 8 wks. and I am loosing to much weight, 20,lbs,in 8 weeks, so the DR. told me to go and eat a hamburger once inwhile, I ALMOST PASSED OUT..lol good luck
            martine
            ----- Original Message -----
            From: Go Friend
            To: Hepatitis One List
            Sent: Wednesday, February 13, 2002 7:46 AM
            Subject: [GIWorld-Hepatitis] Re: Procrit


            >>As much as I hate to say this, eat MEAT!!!!!!!!! <<

            To the best of my understanding, the ribavarin
            induced anemia is not iron deficiency related, but
            has a different cause, so assuming that iron levels
            are normal then eating meat will not help.

            High iron levels are a known negative for HCV, so
            increasing them may not be a good thing, unless
            someone already had the iron deficiency anemia
            unrelated to the treatment. The other thing was there
            is some preliminery evidence that vit E may slow the
            onset of ribavarin induced anemia.

            From: Highlights in Liver Disease: News Service
            10/7/99

            Anti-Oxidant Vitamins Delay Ribavirin-Related
            Anemia in Patients on Combination
            Therapy

            Patients on combination therapy who took the
            antioxidant vitamins C and E delayed
            the onset of anemia. Hemolytic anemia is a serious
            side effect of combination
            therapy, attributable to the ribavirin component in
            the combination. This complication
            necessitates a reduction in the ribavirin dose for
            about 15% of all patients, according
            to Edward Piken, M.D., Director of Research at
            South Bay Gastroenterology in
            Torrance, California.

            "Patients become anemic: they feel short of breath,
            become weaker, are unable to
            do their normal workload," Dr. Piken says. One
            hypothesis is that ribavirin
            accumulates in red blood cells. "The red cells,
            because of the medications, are under
            what's called an oxidative stress, and the red
            cells break down at an earlier point in
            their life cycle."

            To investigate a solution to this problem, Dr.
            Piken enrolled 12 previously untreated
            HCV patients in a study to look at the effects of
            antioxidant vitamins on anemia.
            Patients received 1,200 milligrams of ribavirin
            daily along with 3 million units of
            interferon alfa-2b three times a week. They also
            took two common over the counter
            vitamins daily-1000 milligrams of vitamin C and 800
            IU(internatinal nits) of vitamin E.
            "We chose them because they have essentially no
            side effects, and many people are
            already taking them," Dr. Piken says. Results were
            compared to a control group of 14
            relapse patients who received combo therapy without
            any antioxidants.

            According to Dr. Piken, patients receiving the
            antioxidants show an initial benefit
            from the vitamins but that benefit declined by the
            end of three months of treatment.
            The antioxidants "appear to delay the onset and
            severity of the anemia, and
            patients receiving antioxidants do not require
            (ribavirin) dose reductions, compared
            to 22% of the people in the control group," he
            says.

            Dr. Piken says the results merit further research.
            "We plan to run a larger study and
            also are currently making a decision on which type
            of antioxidant to use," he says.
            "We would like to use more bio-available and
            perhaps stronger antioxidants. The
            forms of the vitamins, particularly C, could be
            improved to a more bio-avaiable
            vitamin C.



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          • Patricia Jean
            Hey Connie :) I m great! Will restart the high does interferon next monday ick! I keep telling myself, it s only a month I can do it. The 3 shots a week I give
            Message 5 of 9 , Feb 13, 2002
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              Hey Connie :)

              I'm great! Will restart the high does interferon next monday ick! I keep
              telling myself, it's only a month I can do it. The 3 shots a week I give
              myself will be half the IV dose, the IV dose is 20mu, so surely it will be
              easier then. I hope :)

              I'm still miffed that the onc I'm using said he never had anyone on high
              dose interferon complain of side effects. I just wanted to slap him silly. I
              see him next Monday before tx. oy.

              Still dealing with the itching. Allergist gave me Clarinex and a cream with
              a steriod and cortisone in it. We'll see.

              Will let yall know what happens! Stay warm :)

              alley
            • AVansi7465@aol.com
              In a message dated 2/13/2002 2:00:40 PM Eastern Standard Time, ... Okay, my doc said take the Vitamin E, and the folic acid and EAT meat. However, I have a
              Message 6 of 9 , Feb 13, 2002
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                In a message dated 2/13/2002 2:00:40 PM Eastern Standard Time,
                patriciajean@... writes:


                > Wierd, my gastro told me not to take Vitamin E on treatment and gave me a
                > prescription for folic acid. Man sometimes I wish these guys would make up
                > their collective minds!
                >

                Okay, my doc said take the Vitamin E, and the folic acid and EAT meat.
                However, I have a tendency towards iron deficiency anemia. So maybe you
                shouldn't eat meat. I followed the "can I eat it and have it stay in my body
                long enough to do any good" diet. David grew me a garden that summer and I
                ate vegetables galore. But I can say, that I felt MUCH worse when I ate no
                meat. This includes energy level, too.
                Also Doc may have told me that because I was losing weight so rapidly, that
                he would have been happy if I'd eaten his desk.
                They can't be consistent, Alley, they don't know a lot more about this
                disease than we do. We are the OJT bunch. Oops.
                LOL,
                Anne


                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • claudine intexas
                The anemia caused by the ribavirin is hemolytic anemia, which is when red blood cells are being distroyed. It is not related to an iron deficiency at all, and
                Message 7 of 9 , Feb 13, 2002
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                  The anemia caused by the ribavirin is hemolytic anemia, which is when
                  red blood cells are being distroyed. It is not related to an iron
                  deficiency at all, and all the iron in the world will not help with
                  this type of anemia. (It is possible, especially in women who are
                  still menstruating, to also have iron deficiency anemia too, but it's
                  not caused by the medications.) However, it is usually not necessary
                  to avoid NATURALLY occurring iron in foods, just artificial
                  supplements, like in vitamins or cereals. The naturally occurring
                  iron in foods is not usually easily assimilated, and you can take
                  calcium with meals to help prevent absorption of iron. (Avoid C with
                  meals because it increases the bodies ability to absorb iron.) While
                  you don't want to overdo the red meats (they usually are high in
                  fat), they are a good source of protein and B vitamins, which are
                  necessary for the rebuilding of blood and tissues. Chicken, turkey,
                  fish - these are all good sources. If you are a vegetarian you need
                  to watch your protein sources carefully, and combine the incomplete
                  proteins found in beans and such with things like corn, rice, etc.,
                  to make complete proteins, and you may need to supplement B-12, which
                  is found mostly in meats. There is no magic cure for hemolytic
                  anemia, other than removing the cause, which in this case is
                  ribavirin, and that you don't want to do! Reducing the dose of
                  ribavirin slightly or using Procrit or Epogen is your best bet.
                  Claudine


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                • claudine intexas
                  ... Make sure your doctor is checking your thyroid function! That can be a cause of excessive, fast weight gain. Especially is you are eating and eating, and
                  Message 8 of 9 , Feb 13, 2002
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                    --- martine <photoart@...> wrote:
                    > yes it happened to me, i have been on tx for 8 wks. and I am
                    > loosing to much weight, 20,lbs,in 8 weeks, so the DR. told me to go
                    > and eat a hamburger once inwhile, I ALMOST PASSED OUT..lol good
                    > luck

                    Make sure your doctor is checking your thyroid function! That can be
                    a cause of excessive, fast weight gain. Especially is you are eating
                    and eating, and STILL are loosing weight.
                    Good luck!
                    Claudine


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