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Re: [GIWorld-Hepatitis] Pigeons

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  • Tatezi
    Interesting how our wildlife affects our opinions of them depending where we live. I ve stopped feeding the squirrels....the would dig up my pots continually
    Message 1 of 25 , May 2, 2004
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      Interesting how our wildlife affects our opinions of them depending where we live. I've stopped feeding the squirrels....the would dig up my pots continually in the spring and I'd have a terrible time getting my garden to survive. When I was young, my parents had a squirrel problem in the attic. My dad got some humane traps and would trap them and take them down by the river to release them...but they always seemed to show back up. He finally started driving them across the river before releasing them. Apparently squirrels are relatively intelligent...seems that removing the shingles first would be evidence of that.

      Pigeons, I didn't know they would peck through a roof. They roost, don't build nests unless it's time to lay eggs. And even then their nests are just a small pile of twigs and sticks where ever they are roosting. And I honestly didn't know that they lived outside of cities...I sure don't remember ever seeing pigeons when I've not been in the city. In Chicago I think the biggest complaint about pigeons is that they shit every where...there are piles of it under the EL tracks where most city pigeons live. I wash my back porch down regularly with a push broom so don't have that problem.

      People say they are dirty which is far from the truth. I use a litter box for my bird bath and they get down in there, splash water und their wings, duck their heads under the water and shake themselves dry. It's quite a thing to watch.

      And pecking through your roof...that's surprising to me because they roost versus nest. And I would think I would have holes in my porch after all these years of living here with the pigeons.

      But like I said, I don't have other options in my wildlife. I'm sure if I didn't live along the el tracks and had grass and trees, I would feel differently about the creatures I cultivated...although I've come to appreciate the life style of pigeons...

      Tatezi


      . My biggest beef with them is that they and the squirrels have the irritating habit of making holes in one's roof. The pidgeons peck them right through solid 1 inch pine board. The squirrels are bright enough to pull the shingles off first. At any rate, I did not appreciate having either squirrels or pidgeons in my attic. Now, this was with two perfectly good trees, a sycamore with knots and a monstrous magnolia, to build nests in. I did not poison them......beyond that I will not
      go. :-). Anne


      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



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    • GWhel@aol.com
      I live in the Midwest. We have birds that return every year to have babies, which I enjoy a lot. My biggest problem is rabbits. I have a hundred and some
      Message 2 of 25 , May 2, 2004
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        I live in the Midwest. We have birds that return every year to have babies,
        which I enjoy a lot.

        My biggest problem is rabbits. I have a hundred and some perennials they love
        to chew on each Spring. I have a lot of labor and money invested and tend to
        get a little irritated a those furry creatures.

        I purchased a Havahart live trap last fall. I've transported 15 rabbits to a
        nice park and lake about 12 miles outside of town. As soon as I return home
        with the empty trap to reset it, there are three more rabbits in the back yard
        running off in a scamper.

        I've resorted this year for the first time putting poultry wire around the
        plants till they get some growth. It's wonderful seeing blooms and knowing
        they'll still be there tomorrow, but it looks tacky.

        I'd agree to plant a carrot garden just for the rabbits if they's agree to
        just eat out of their garden. Can't reason with them, though.

        Gene


        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • AVansi7465@aol.com
        In a message dated 5/2/2004 12:52:30 PM Eastern Daylight Time, tatezi@sbcglobal.net writes: ...seems that removing the shingles first would be evidence of
        Message 3 of 25 , May 2, 2004
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          In a message dated 5/2/2004 12:52:30 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
          tatezi@... writes:
          ...seems that removing the shingles first would be evidence of that.
          Wouldn't it though.......:-). Certainly, brighter than we would have
          preferred.


          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • AVansi7465@aol.com
          In a message dated 5/2/2004 2:13:55 PM Eastern Daylight Time, GWhel@aol.com writes: I live in the Midwest. We have birds that return every year to have babies,
          Message 4 of 25 , May 2, 2004
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            In a message dated 5/2/2004 2:13:55 PM Eastern Daylight Time, GWhel@...
            writes:
            I live in the Midwest. We have birds that return every year to have babies,
            which I enjoy a lot.

            My biggest problem is rabbits. I have a hundred and some perennials they love
            to chew on each Spring. I have a lot of labor and money invested and tend to
            get a little irritated a those furry creatures.

            I purchased a Havahart live trap last fall. I've transported 15 rabbits to a
            nice park and lake about 12 miles outside of town. As soon as I return home
            with the empty trap to reset it, there are three more rabbits in the back
            yard
            running off in a scamper.

            I've resorted this year for the first time putting poultry wire around the
            plants till they get some growth. It's wonderful seeing blooms and knowing
            they'll still be there tomorrow, but it looks tacky.

            I'd agree to plant a carrot garden just for the rabbits if they's agree to
            just eat out of their garden. Can't reason with them, though.

            Gene
            Quick suggestion. Plant alternating catnip and mint around your flowers.
            That will solve your problem. While the above are getting a little size on
            them, you can put tomato cages around them. That looks tacky, too, but they don't
            have to stay there long. One word of caution. Mint tends to take over after
            it gets going, so unless you like mint in your ice tea, or drink mint julips
            (:-), don't be afraid to thin it next year. Both are perrenials down here,
            but in the midwest, you may have to replant every year. This will not reduce the
            vole or mole population one whit. David just netted the first drowned rat
            (vole) of the season. No love lost for those varmints, either.
            Anne


            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • land
            HI.Please send your rabbits to Holland because here they become extinct,some virus,not mycimatosis but a very aggressive new virus,it kills them off within
            Message 5 of 25 , May 3, 2004
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              HI.Please send your rabbits to Holland because here they become extinct,some virus,not mycimatosis but a very aggressive new virus,it kills them off within 24hrs.willem.
              ----- Original Message -----
              From: GWhel@...
              To: GIWorld-Hepatitis@yahoogroups.com
              Sent: Sunday, May 02, 2004 8:12 PM
              Subject: Re: [GIWorld-Hepatitis] Pigeons


              I live in the Midwest. We have birds that return every year to have babies,
              which I enjoy a lot.

              My biggest problem is rabbits. I have a hundred and some perennials they love
              to chew on each Spring. I have a lot of labor and money invested and tend to
              get a little irritated a those furry creatures.

              I purchased a Havahart live trap last fall. I've transported 15 rabbits to a
              nice park and lake about 12 miles outside of town. As soon as I return home
              with the empty trap to reset it, there are three more rabbits in the back yard
              running off in a scamper.

              I've resorted this year for the first time putting poultry wire around the
              plants till they get some growth. It's wonderful seeing blooms and knowing
              they'll still be there tomorrow, but it looks tacky.

              I'd agree to plant a carrot garden just for the rabbits if they's agree to
              just eat out of their garden. Can't reason with them, though.

              Gene


              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



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              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • Gail Samples
              ... From: Tatezi [mailto:tatezi@sbcglobal.net] Interesting how our wildlife affects our opinions of them depending where we live. I ve stopped feeding the
              Message 6 of 25 , May 3, 2004
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                -----Original Message-----
                From: Tatezi [mailto:tatezi@...]

                Interesting how our wildlife affects our opinions of them depending where we
                live. I've stopped feeding the squirrels....the would dig up my pots
                continually in the spring and I'd have a terrible time getting my garden to
                survive.

                Tatezi-

                I have the same problem with squirrels digging up the potted plants,
                sprinkling a cheap brand of black pepper in the pots will take care of the
                problem. But you have to do it several times every year until the new batch
                of youngsters (and forgetful oldsters) learns that digging in the pots isn't
                very pleasant.

                gail
              • Gail Samples
                ... From: GWhel@aol.com [mailto:GWhel@aol.com] My biggest problem is rabbits. I have a hundred and some perennials they love to chew on each Spring. Gene-
                Message 7 of 25 , May 3, 2004
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                  -----Original Message-----
                  From: GWhel@... [mailto:GWhel@...]

                  My biggest problem is rabbits. I have a hundred and some perennials they
                  love
                  to chew on each Spring.

                  Gene-

                  Perhaps little garden of walking iris would satisfy them. They seem to love
                  them and have wiped all mine out except for a couple of plants, and I used
                  to have a whole bed of them!

                  gail
                • cable mom
                  Tatezi, Your comment about not knowing that pigeons lived out of the cities made me think of Leonard Cohen s book Beautiful Losers which we were passing
                  Message 8 of 25 , May 5, 2004
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                    Tatezi,
                    Your comment about not knowing that pigeons lived out of the cities made me
                    think of Leonard Cohen's book "Beautiful Losers" which we were passing
                    around in the '60s (along with viruses). One of the things I remember is
                    several descriptions of huge flocks of pigeons, maybe passenger pigeons,
                    which are extinct now. They lived in the forests of this beautiful country
                    before the Europeans moved in and cut them down. Native Americans included
                    them in a diet of wild game!

                    Maybe the cities are the reservations for the pigeons.

                    Pam in Maine









                    >From: AVansi7465@...
                    >Reply-To: GIWorld-Hepatitis@yahoogroups.com
                    >To: GIWorld-Hepatitis@yahoogroups.com
                    >Subject: Re: [GIWorld-Hepatitis] Pigeons
                    >Date: Sun, 2 May 2004 21:29:57 EDT
                    >
                    >In a message dated 5/2/2004 12:52:30 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
                    >tatezi@... writes:
                    >...seems that removing the shingles first would be evidence of that.
                    >Wouldn't it though.......:-). Certainly, brighter than we would have
                    >preferred.
                    >
                    >
                    >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    >

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                  • Tatezi
                    Maybe cities are refuges for pigeons, but I sorta remember reading that it was the europeans who brought the rock dove (which is what a pigeon really is) to
                    Message 9 of 25 , May 5, 2004
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                      Maybe cities are refuges for pigeons, but I sorta remember reading that it was the europeans who brought the rock dove (which is what a pigeon really is) to this country.

                      I also remember in more recent times (but haven't heard of it recently through my animal protection organizations) that the Boy Scout organization would trap pigeons in city and every year would take them to PA (don't remember where in PA) and release them and have a pigeon shoot...and it was the kids who did the shooting.

                      No one seems to care about the pigeons and it continues to baffle me. They were homing pigeons during the wars delivering messages to our side. And they can teach us much. They are survivors, they are excellent parents and mate for life, if you ever notice a bunch of pigeons sitting out on wires or edges of buildings they are always separated by enough space that they can turn around without invading their neighbor's space, etc.

                      Oh well, humyns will not change...the general humyn species considers itself to be superior to all other creatures which is why we have so many extinct and endangered creatures.
                      Tatezi,
                      Your comment about not knowing that pigeons lived out of the cities made me think of Leonard Cohen's book "Beautiful Losers" which we were passing around in the '60s (along with viruses). One of the things I remember is several descriptions of huge flocks of pigeons, maybe passenger pigeons, which are extinct now. They lived in the forests of this beautiful country before the Europeans moved in and cut them down. Native Americans included them in a diet of wild game!
                      Maybe the cities are the reservations for the pigeons.

                      Pam in Maine



                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    • Dawnbeliever@aol.com
                      YES . pigeons live in the country.. LOL.. they love barns.. we had a barnful of them as i grew up... that and swallows and sparrows.. love farm life , i
                      Message 10 of 25 , May 5, 2004
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                        YES>. pigeons live in the country.. LOL.. they love barns.. we had a barnful
                        of them as i grew up... that and swallows and sparrows.. love farm life , i
                        believe.. i want to study birds more in the after life.. He he.. when i have
                        more time , i mean.. he he...
                        Squirrels and rabbits here where i live now, in a city.. silly creatures..
                        where my folks live .. have beautiful deer that come into the backyard.. fox ..
                        coyote... umm quail.. pheasant, etc... anyway.. i am a country gal ...

                        like all the wildlife talk..
                        Dawn


                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      • Dawnbeliever@aol.com
                        Hey , Gene, But the midwest is good.. right? .. would you ever consider moving.. what part of the midwest.. may i ask... curious, Dawn [Non-text portions of
                        Message 11 of 25 , May 5, 2004
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                          Hey , Gene,
                          But the midwest is good.. right? .. would you ever consider moving.. what
                          part of the midwest.. may i ask...

                          curious,
                          Dawn


                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        • Dawnbeliever@aol.com
                          No no no.. pigeons .. are abundant in farming country too... i can testify .. to the ummm droppings.. in the barns.. LOL still laughing, Dawn [Non-text
                          Message 12 of 25 , May 5, 2004
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                            No no no.. pigeons .. are abundant in farming country too... i can testify ..
                            to the ummm droppings.. in the barns.. LOL

                            still laughing,
                            Dawn


                            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          • Tatezi
                            Speaking of barns (wow, my typeface is huge on my end even though it s set to 12 point...let me know how it comes through there because even your typing is
                            Message 13 of 25 , May 5, 2004
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                              Speaking of barns (wow, my typeface is huge on my end even though it's set to 12 point...let me know how it comes through there because even your typing is huge...this happened once before and it ended up being a patch I'd downloaded from MS)

                              Anyway, speaking of barns, did you know that a family of barn owls will eat approximate 1500 mice in a week. Thought that was an interesting tidbit...learned it when I attended some seminars with a wild bird sanctuary. And when they fly they are completely silent...they have little hairs like eyelashes on the edges of their wings to break the wind so there is no sound when they fly. They flew them in the room at this seminar and you couldn't hear a thing but felt the air move as they flew over your head.

                              Just one of those probably worthless tidbits of info we sometimes store in our heads <g>
                              ----- Original Message -----
                              From: Dawnbeliever@...
                              To: GIWorld-Hepatitis@yahoogroups.com
                              Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2004 12:54 AM
                              Subject: Re: [GIWorld-Hepatitis] Pigeons


                              No no no.. pigeons .. are abundant in farming country too... i can testify ..
                              to the ummm droppings.. in the barns.. LOL

                              still laughing,
                              Dawn


                              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                            • jtwagers7@aol.com
                              WOW on the 1500 mice in a week!! hoo hoo hoo hoooooo ! ! I just LOVE owls! And yes -- they are remarkable (and highly accurate). I don t know
                              Message 14 of 25 , May 6, 2004
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                                WOW on the 1500 mice in a week!! hoo hoo hoo hoooooo ! ! I just LOVE
                                owls! And yes -- they are remarkable (and highly accurate). I don't know
                                they're accuracy rate, but I can bet it's almost 100% with what they're equipped
                                with to hunt. You guys are just killing me (in a good good way) talking
                                about birds, animals, cats, dogs, wildlife, etc. (I'm huge fan of all of them
                                and in fact I consider them my "antidepressants" - lol - (I think as Dawn put
                                it). The Barn owl, though (dummy Julie) doesn't "hoot". lol. We have,
                                among many other kinds of owls, the Barred owl here, and this time of year
                                (mating season) they sound like a bunch of howling monkeys in a jungle talking
                                back and forth. The sound (if one has never heard them "chime up") can sound
                                scary. My Aunt came for a visit this Spring, and when she heard them "doing
                                their thing" (they were just about right over our heads) her eyes got real
                                big, her mouth dropped opened, and she exclaimed "what in the H*** is that!".


                                LOL -- Good way to begin my day (talking about wildlife). It's refreshing to
                                get my mind off Hep C and its problems, so.... y'all excuse me if I get a bit
                                "enthusiastic" over this OT (off topic).

                                Hope everyone has good day. :) .

                                Julie



                                In a message dated 5/6/2004 2:49:08 AM Eastern Standard Time,
                                tatezi@... writes:


                                > Speaking of barns (wow, my typeface is huge on my end even though it's set
                                > to 12 point...let me know how it comes through there because even your typing
                                > is huge...this happened once before and it ended up being a patch I'd
                                > downloaded from MS)
                                >
                                > Anyway, speaking of barns, did you know that a family of barn owls will eat
                                > approximate 1500 mice in a week. Thought that was an interesting
                                > tidbit...learned it when I attended some seminars with a wild bird sanctuary. And when
                                > they fly they are completely silent...they have little hairs like eyelashes on
                                > the edges of their wings to break the wind so there is no sound when they
                                > fly. They flew them in the room at this seminar and you couldn't hear a thing
                                > but felt the air move as they flew over your head.
                                >
                                > Just one of those probably worthless tidbits of info we sometimes store in
                                > our heads <g>
                                >



                                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                              • Tatezi
                                It s nice that even though we are all fighting this dragon, that we can find pleasure in our 4 legged, winged ones, etc. brothers and sisters. And just because
                                Message 15 of 25 , May 6, 2004
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                                  It's nice that even though we are all fighting this dragon, that we can find pleasure in our 4 legged, winged ones, etc. brothers and sisters.

                                  And just because we are all here to help support one another through living with HCV, doesn't mean that we can't talk about other things...just because we have this dragon in common, our lives and the things that give us pleasure are a part of our lives.

                                  We just need to always remember to use a subject line so those who don't care to participate in sharing the other side of our lives, know to hit the delete key...and I try (sometimes I forget...imagine that <g>) to always delete as much of the previous message as we can while leaving enough of the thread so we know what we are talking about. I remember being on dial up...and the times I've been on digest the challenge of going through long threads in one message.

                                  And barn owls eyes can rotate almost a full 360 degrees which accounts for it's accuracy. I learned some wonderful things at the wild bird sanctuary sessions. I didn't know that the barn own didn't hoot though.

                                  Tatezi
                                  ----- Original Message -----
                                  From: jtwagers7@...
                                  To: GIWorld-Hepatitis@yahoogroups.com
                                  Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2004 7:49 AM
                                  Subject: Re: [GIWorld-Hepatitis] Pigeons


                                  they are remarkable (and highly accurate). I don't know they're accuracy rate, but I can bet it's almost 100% with what they're equipped with to hunt. The Barn owl, though (dummy Julie) doesn't "hoot". lol.

                                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                • jtwagers7@aol.com
                                  I think they make a sound that s more of a screech ...... not like the hoo hoo hoo of a great horned or barred owl. And thoroughbreds? I grew up with
                                  Message 16 of 25 , May 6, 2004
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                                    I think they make a sound that's more of a screech ...... not like the "hoo
                                    hoo hoo" of a great horned or barred owl. And thoroughbreds? I grew up
                                    with horses, and finally -- (my love for them was so intense), I went to KY
                                    when I was 17 and worked as an exercise rider. Up at 3 a.m., off by 7 a.m.
                                    lol. Hard hard work. Worked at The Kentucky Horse Park and Keenland, too.
                                    I miss "My Old Kentucky Home". Smarty Jones is a good-looking horse, and
                                    I hope we have a triple crown winner this year. It's about time!

                                    Julie


                                    In a message dated 5/6/2004 6:14:01 PM Eastern Standard Time,
                                    tatezi@... writes:


                                    > And barn owls eyes can rotate almost a full 360 degrees which accounts for
                                    > it's accuracy. I learned some wonderful things at the wild bird sanctuary
                                    > sessions. I didn't know that the barn own didn't hoot though.
                                    >



                                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                  • AVansi7465@aol.com
                                    In a message dated 5/6/2004 2:49:07 AM Eastern Daylight Time, tatezi@sbcglobal.net writes: Anyway, speaking of barns, did you know that a family of barn owls
                                    Message 17 of 25 , May 6, 2004
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                                      In a message dated 5/6/2004 2:49:07 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
                                      tatezi@... writes:
                                      Anyway, speaking of barns, did you know that a family of barn owls will eat
                                      approximate 1500 mice in a week. Thought that was an interesting
                                      tidbit...learned it when I attended some seminars with a wild bird sanctuary. And when they
                                      fly they are completely silent...they have little hairs like eyelashes on the
                                      edges of their wings to break the wind so there is no sound when they fly.
                                      They flew them in the room at this seminar and you couldn't hear a thing but felt
                                      the air move as they flew over your head.

                                      Just one of those probably worthless tidbits of info we sometimes store in
                                      our heads <g>
                                      Another tidbit on the same order. Martins eat 10 times their weight in
                                      mosquitoes daily. Good enough reason to invest in a martin house. Bats do the
                                      same thing, however, I prefer the martins :-). Anne


                                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                    • AVansi7465@aol.com
                                      In a message dated 5/6/2004 8:53:21 AM Eastern Daylight Time, jtwagers7@aol.com writes: LOL -- Good way to begin my day (talking about wildlife). It s
                                      Message 18 of 25 , May 6, 2004
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                                        In a message dated 5/6/2004 8:53:21 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
                                        jtwagers7@... writes:
                                        LOL -- Good way to begin my day (talking about wildlife). It's refreshing to
                                        get my mind off Hep C and its problems, so.... y'all excuse me if I get a bit
                                        "enthusiastic" over this OT (off topic).
                                        We all need a break from HCV sometimes. That's what keeps the endorphins
                                        going. Laughter really is the best medicine.


                                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                      • Tatezi
                                        My friends who live a few blocks from me in a real neighborhood...grass, trees, etc. had bats flying around the street light in the alley one year. So they
                                        Message 19 of 25 , May 6, 2004
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                                          My friends who live a few blocks from me in a real neighborhood...grass, trees, etc. had bats flying around the street light in the alley one year. So they went out and bought a bat house...10 years later and no one moved in. Same with their purple martin house...no one moved in. But they get an incredible variety of birds and critters. And in the city we have a fair amount of kestrels and peregrines....they introduced them to the city for pigeon control. Someone didn't do their research too well because kestrels (sparrow hawks) are too small for pigeons although you can often see them snatching up sparrows. But the peregrines have made it...and they do feed on the pigeons.
                                          Just one of those probably worthless tidbits of info we sometimes store in our heads <g>Another tidbit on the same order. Martins eat 10 times their weight in
                                          mosquitoes daily. Good enough reason to invest in a martin house. Bats do the same thing, however, I prefer the martins :-). Anne



                                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                        • Dawnbeliever@aol.com
                                          Julie.. I dont consider it off topic.. LOL... as what ever stimulates ya... stress is the evil one.. we all have to fight against.. and what the heck.. love
                                          Message 20 of 25 , May 6, 2004
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                                            Julie..
                                            I dont consider it off topic.. LOL... as what ever stimulates ya... stress is
                                            the evil one.. we all have to fight against.. and what the heck.. love
                                            animals and plants.. altho.. I DO not have a green thumb.. LOL .. my ex once gave
                                            away a poinsetta i won.. somehow.. cuz he knew i would kill it..

                                            night all,.
                                            DAwn


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                                          • AVansi7465@aol.com
                                            In a message dated 5/6/2004 8:38:54 PM Eastern Daylight Time, tatezi@sbcglobal.net writes: 10 years later and no one moved in. Same with their purple martin
                                            Message 21 of 25 , May 7, 2004
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                                              In a message dated 5/6/2004 8:38:54 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
                                              tatezi@... writes:
                                              10 years later and no one moved in. Same with their purple martin house...no
                                              one moved in.
                                              Tell them not to give up hope. It took a few years for the birds to find our
                                              bird house.


                                              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                            • Tatezi
                                              They ve been waiting for years...and they ve given up hope... Tell them not to give up hope. It took a few years for the birds to find our bird house.
                                              Message 22 of 25 , May 7, 2004
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                                                They've been waiting for years...and they've given up hope...

                                                Tell them not to give up hope. It took a few years for the birds to find our
                                                bird house.



                                                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                              • cable mom
                                                I didn t know piegeons also mated for life. They turn up in the darndest places. Truly survivors. I went under a narrow underpass in Watervile ME and one
                                                Message 23 of 25 , May 8, 2004
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                                                  I didn't know piegeons also mated for life. They turn up in the darndest
                                                  places. Truly survivors. I went under a narrow underpass in Watervile ME
                                                  and one flew into my side window. Bad timing for him. I turned around to
                                                  go back & see if he was alright. Since he was gone I guess he was, but it
                                                  was clear that under the bridge was a whole pigeon colony, including a
                                                  graveyard. Just driving by you had no idea they were there.

                                                  Dawn, I've suffered from depression most of my life. For about 10 years I
                                                  wasn't diagnosed. Just thought it was me being a schmuck. I wish I had
                                                  some good advice - I don't. I've tried different anti-depressants, gained
                                                  weight because of it and still have trouble understanding exactly what part
                                                  is depression and what isn't. Talking does help. I guess all I can say is
                                                  we are listening and understand.

                                                  Pam in Maine









                                                  >From: "Tatezi" <tatezi@...>
                                                  >Reply-To: GIWorld-Hepatitis@yahoogroups.com
                                                  >To: <GIWorld-Hepatitis@yahoogroups.com>
                                                  >Subject: Re: [GIWorld-Hepatitis] Pigeons
                                                  >Date: Wed, 5 May 2004 19:09:55 -0500
                                                  >
                                                  >Maybe cities are refuges for pigeons, but I sorta remember reading that it
                                                  >was the europeans who brought the rock dove (which is what a pigeon really
                                                  >is) to this country.
                                                  >
                                                  >I also remember in more recent times (but haven't heard of it recently
                                                  >through my animal protection organizations) that the Boy Scout organization
                                                  >would trap pigeons in city and every year would take them to PA (don't
                                                  >remember where in PA) and release them and have a pigeon shoot...and it was
                                                  >the kids who did the shooting.
                                                  >
                                                  >No one seems to care about the pigeons and it continues to baffle me. They
                                                  >were homing pigeons during the wars delivering messages to our side. And
                                                  >they can teach us much. They are survivors, they are excellent parents and
                                                  >mate for life, if you ever notice a bunch of pigeons sitting out on wires
                                                  >or edges of buildings they are always separated by enough space that they
                                                  >can turn around without invading their neighbor's space, etc.
                                                  >
                                                  >Oh well, humyns will not change...the general humyn species considers
                                                  >itself to be superior to all other creatures which is why we have so many
                                                  >extinct and endangered creatures.
                                                  > Tatezi,
                                                  > Your comment about not knowing that pigeons lived out of the cities made
                                                  >me think of Leonard Cohen's book "Beautiful Losers" which we were passing
                                                  >around in the '60s (along with viruses). One of the things I remember is
                                                  >several descriptions of huge flocks of pigeons, maybe passenger pigeons,
                                                  >which are extinct now. They lived in the forests of this beautiful country
                                                  >before the Europeans moved in and cut them down. Native Americans included
                                                  >them in a diet of wild game!
                                                  > Maybe the cities are the reservations for the pigeons.
                                                  >
                                                  > Pam in Maine
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                                  >

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                                                • Dawnbeliever@aol.com
                                                  In a message dated 5/8/2004 8:36:06 AM Central Daylight Time, ... thanks, Pam.... I have the ups and downs with depression.. funny.. i was never depressed all
                                                  Message 24 of 25 , May 15, 2004
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                                                    In a message dated 5/8/2004 8:36:06 AM Central Daylight Time,
                                                    parend53@... writes:

                                                    > Dawn, I've suffered from depression most of my life. For about 10 years I
                                                    > wasn't diagnosed. Just thought it was me being a schmuck. I wish I had
                                                    > some good advice - I don't. I've tried different anti-depressants, gained
                                                    > weight because of it and still have trouble understanding exactly what part
                                                    > is depression and what isn't. Talking does help. I guess all I can say is
                                                    > we are listening and understand.
                                                    >
                                                    > Pam in Maine
                                                    >
                                                    >

                                                    thanks, Pam.... I have the ups and downs with depression.. funny.. i was
                                                    never depressed all my life til this came.. when i was diagnosed .. docs said I
                                                    had probably had it for about 20 years.... so at the beginning of my marriage..
                                                    think maybe came at the birth of my first child.... very dirty rural hosp...
                                                    had infection in my stitches even and had to have minor surgery on them..
                                                    couldnt sit for some weeks.. LOL... loved that donut thing for the bath... called
                                                    it a sits bath then.. LOL... memories.. do a lot of remembering of late ..
                                                    comes with age i guess.. fought idea that i am older for some time but.. is
                                                    finally sneaking in .. when it takes me a few minutes to get up from sitting..
                                                    LOL...Yes, Pam, talking is so good.. and esp on here and at my support group..
                                                    altho better here cuz most in my support group dont seem to have problems i do..
                                                    as yet.. no one with cirrhosis.. sorry .. running at the mouth.. been a long
                                                    week... and going to sleep in tmr.. or should say this morning... later all..

                                                    not so down this week,
                                                    Dawn


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                                                  • Alleypat
                                                    Well at least you know it didn t come from the infection from your stitches :) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                                    Message 25 of 25 , May 15, 2004
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                                                      Well at least you know it didn't come from the infection from your stitches :)

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