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Re: [GAdetection] Review: Final Proof or The Value of Evidence (1898) by Rodrigues Ottolengui

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  • Ronald Smyth
    Great review. Another author I keep meaning to try.   Ron Smyth ________________________________ From: Mary Reed To:
    Message 1 of 20 , Jun 7, 2012
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      Great review. Another author I keep meaning to try.
       
      Ron Smyth


      ________________________________
      From: Mary Reed <maywrite@...>
      To: GAdetection@yahoogroups.com
      Sent: Wednesday, June 6, 2012 11:02:25 AM
      Subject: [GAdetection] Review: Final Proof or The Value of Evidence (1898) by Rodrigues Ottolengui

      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Last Century Detective
      Welcome Olga! I have to make my obligatory recommendation for THE FRIGHTENED STIFF by Kelley Roos, reprinted by the Rue Morgue Press, and echo the ones made in
      Message 2 of 20 , Jun 7, 2012
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        Welcome Olga!

        I have to make my obligatory recommendation for THE FRIGHTENED STIFF by Kelley Roos, reprinted by the Rue Morgue Press, and echo the ones made in favor of John Dickson Carr, Rex Stout, Nicholas Blake and Gladys Mitchell.

        You might also want to take a look at Patrick Quentin/Q. Patrick (DEATH AND THE MAIDEN and BLACK WIDOW), Christianna Brand (GREEN FOR DANGER, LONDON PARTICULAR and DEATH OF JEZEBEL), Craig Rice (HOME SWEET HOMICIDE), Anthony Berkeley (JUMPING JENNY, TRIAL AND ERROR and THE POISONED CHOCOLATES CASE), Elspeth Huxley (MURDER ON SAFARI), Pat McGerr (PICK YOUR VICTIM and THE SEVEN DEADLY SISTERS) and I could go on, and on, like that.


        --- In GAdetection@yahoogroups.com, luis molina <lrmolina47@...> wrote:
        >
        > And Ellery Queen !
        >
        > --- On Thu, 6/7/12, Allan Griffith <dfordoom@...> wrote:
        >
        >
        > From: Allan Griffith <dfordoom@...>
        > Subject: Re: [GAdetection] Re: Hello! Any Reccomendations?
        > To: GAdetection@yahoogroups.com
        > Date: Thursday, June 7, 2012, 5:00 AM
        >
        >
        >
        >  
        >
        >
        >
        > On 7 June 2012 21:56, Les <LesBlatt@...> wrote:
        > > I'd suggest that you try one or two books by each of the authors you see us talking about, to see if that author is right for you. I agree completely about the names you're getting here: Dorothy L. Sayers, Ngaio Marsh, Edmund Crispin. If you like those, you might also try Michael Innes and Nicholas Blake. A lot of us enjoy Gladys Mitchell, but she can be fairly quirky - you need to really enjoy English eccentrics! John Dickson Carr/Carter Dickson is my favorite, because I love locked room/impossible crime mysteries. And don't forget Rex Stout's marvelous Nero Wolfe books - I suspect you will love Wolfe and his assistant (and narrator) Archie Goodwin.
        >
        > I'll second the recommendation for Nicholas Blake (who was actually
        > the Poet Laureate Cecil Day-Lewis) - an unfairly neglected golden age
        > detective writer.
        >
        > And I'll second the recommendation for the Nero Wolfe books.
        >
        > There's also S. S. Van Dine's Philo Vance mysteries - not everybody
        > loves Philo Vance (who's a bit like an American Lord Peter Wimsey only
        > more so) but I love these books,
        >
        > Al
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        >
      • luis molina
        A pettigrew mystery by Ciril Hume ... From: Last Century Detective Subject: [GAdetection] Re: Hello! Any Reccomendations? To:
        Message 3 of 20 , Jun 7, 2012
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          A pettigrew mystery by Ciril Hume


          --- On Thu, 6/7/12, Last Century Detective <lastcenturydetective@...> wrote:


          From: Last Century Detective <lastcenturydetective@...>
          Subject: [GAdetection] Re: Hello! Any Reccomendations?
          To: GAdetection@yahoogroups.com
          Date: Thursday, June 7, 2012, 8:38 AM



           



          Welcome Olga!

          I have to make my obligatory recommendation for THE FRIGHTENED STIFF by Kelley Roos, reprinted by the Rue Morgue Press, and echo the ones made in favor of John Dickson Carr, Rex Stout, Nicholas Blake and Gladys Mitchell.

          You might also want to take a look at Patrick Quentin/Q. Patrick (DEATH AND THE MAIDEN and BLACK WIDOW), Christianna Brand (GREEN FOR DANGER, LONDON PARTICULAR and DEATH OF JEZEBEL), Craig Rice (HOME SWEET HOMICIDE), Anthony Berkeley (JUMPING JENNY, TRIAL AND ERROR and THE POISONED CHOCOLATES CASE), Elspeth Huxley (MURDER ON SAFARI), Pat McGerr (PICK YOUR VICTIM and THE SEVEN DEADLY SISTERS) and I could go on, and on, like that.

          --- In GAdetection@yahoogroups.com, luis molina <lrmolina47@...> wrote:
          >
          > And Ellery Queen !
          >
          > --- On Thu, 6/7/12, Allan Griffith <dfordoom@...> wrote:
          >
          >
          > From: Allan Griffith <dfordoom@...>
          > Subject: Re: [GAdetection] Re: Hello! Any Reccomendations?
          > To: GAdetection@yahoogroups.com
          > Date: Thursday, June 7, 2012, 5:00 AM
          >
          >
          >
          >  
          >
          >
          >
          > On 7 June 2012 21:56, Les <LesBlatt@...> wrote:
          > > I'd suggest that you try one or two books by each of the authors you see us talking about, to see if that author is right for you. I agree completely about the names you're getting here: Dorothy L. Sayers, Ngaio Marsh, Edmund Crispin. If you like those, you might also try Michael Innes and Nicholas Blake. A lot of us enjoy Gladys Mitchell, but she can be fairly quirky - you need to really enjoy English eccentrics! John Dickson Carr/Carter Dickson is my favorite, because I love locked room/impossible crime mysteries. And don't forget Rex Stout's marvelous Nero Wolfe books - I suspect you will love Wolfe and his assistant (and narrator) Archie Goodwin.
          >
          > I'll second the recommendation for Nicholas Blake (who was actually
          > the Poet Laureate Cecil Day-Lewis) - an unfairly neglected golden age
          > detective writer.
          >
          > And I'll second the recommendation for the Nero Wolfe books.
          >
          > There's also S. S. Van Dine's Philo Vance mysteries - not everybody
          > loves Philo Vance (who's a bit like an American Lord Peter Wimsey only
          > more so) but I love these books,
          >
          > Al
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          >








          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Mr Molesack
          Peter Lovesey is a modern writer, but he produces stuff that is very much in the spirit of the the Golden Age. He started off back in the 70s with a series of
          Message 4 of 20 , Jun 7, 2012
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            Peter Lovesey is a modern writer, but he produces stuff that is very much in the spirit of the the Golden Age. He started off back in the 70s with a series of books about Detective Sergeant Cribb, a Scotland Yard detective in the Victorian era. He went on to do a series of one-off novels such as ROUGH CIDER, KEYSTONE, and the marvellously clever THE FALSE INSPECTOR DEW. He did a short series (three books!) about 'Bertie' the future King Edward VII, acting as a detective. Since 1991 he has concentrated on the Peter Diamond series, which are contemporary stories about a murder squad detective in the beautiful English city of Bath. On the face of it, these look like police procedurals, but in fact they are old fashioned detective stories in a modern disguise (one of the stories, BLOODHOUNDS, is very much a tribute to John Dickson Carr). If you are interested, Lovesey has his own website,which will tell you more about the books.



            --- In GAdetection@yahoogroups.com, luis molina <lrmolina47@...> wrote:
            >
            > A pettigrew mystery by Ciril Hume
            >
            >
            > --- On Thu, 6/7/12, Last Century Detective <lastcenturydetective@...> wrote:
            >
            >
            > From: Last Century Detective <lastcenturydetective@...>
            > Subject: [GAdetection] Re: Hello! Any Reccomendations?
            > To: GAdetection@yahoogroups.com
            > Date: Thursday, June 7, 2012, 8:38 AM
            >
            >
            >
            >  
            >
            >
            >
            > Welcome Olga!
            >
            > I have to make my obligatory recommendation for THE FRIGHTENED STIFF by Kelley Roos, reprinted by the Rue Morgue Press, and echo the ones made in favor of John Dickson Carr, Rex Stout, Nicholas Blake and Gladys Mitchell.
            >
            > You might also want to take a look at Patrick Quentin/Q. Patrick (DEATH AND THE MAIDEN and BLACK WIDOW), Christianna Brand (GREEN FOR DANGER, LONDON PARTICULAR and DEATH OF JEZEBEL), Craig Rice (HOME SWEET HOMICIDE), Anthony Berkeley (JUMPING JENNY, TRIAL AND ERROR and THE POISONED CHOCOLATES CASE), Elspeth Huxley (MURDER ON SAFARI), Pat McGerr (PICK YOUR VICTIM and THE SEVEN DEADLY SISTERS) and I could go on, and on, like that.
            >
            > --- In GAdetection@yahoogroups.com, luis molina <lrmolina47@> wrote:
            > >
            > > And Ellery Queen !
            > >
            > > --- On Thu, 6/7/12, Allan Griffith <dfordoom@> wrote:
            > >
            > >
            > > From: Allan Griffith <dfordoom@>
            > > Subject: Re: [GAdetection] Re: Hello! Any Reccomendations?
            > > To: GAdetection@yahoogroups.com
            > > Date: Thursday, June 7, 2012, 5:00 AM
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >  
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > > On 7 June 2012 21:56, Les <LesBlatt@> wrote:
            > > > I'd suggest that you try one or two books by each of the authors you see us talking about, to see if that author is right for you. I agree completely about the names you're getting here: Dorothy L. Sayers, Ngaio Marsh, Edmund Crispin. If you like those, you might also try Michael Innes and Nicholas Blake. A lot of us enjoy Gladys Mitchell, but she can be fairly quirky - you need to really enjoy English eccentrics! John Dickson Carr/Carter Dickson is my favorite, because I love locked room/impossible crime mysteries. And don't forget Rex Stout's marvelous Nero Wolfe books - I suspect you will love Wolfe and his assistant (and narrator) Archie Goodwin.
            > >
            > > I'll second the recommendation for Nicholas Blake (who was actually
            > > the Poet Laureate Cecil Day-Lewis) - an unfairly neglected golden age
            > > detective writer.
            > >
            > > And I'll second the recommendation for the Nero Wolfe books.
            > >
            > > There's also S. S. Van Dine's Philo Vance mysteries - not everybody
            > > loves Philo Vance (who's a bit like an American Lord Peter Wimsey only
            > > more so) but I love these books,
            > >
            > > Al
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            > >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            >
          • **Olga**
              wow, trhanks for thant. I have downloaded some from gutenberg but I hate read on the computer so Im going to my library today when I go out!   Thank you
            Message 5 of 20 , Jun 7, 2012
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              wow, trhanks for thant. I have downloaded some from gutenberg but I hate read on the computer so Im going to my library today when I go out!
               
              Thank you All!
               
              Olga
               
              From: Mr Molesack <mr.molesack@...>
              To: GAdetection@yahoogroups.com
              Sent: Friday, 8 June 2012 4:24 AM
              Subject: [GAdetection] Re: Hello! Any Reccomendations?



               
              Peter Lovesey is a modern writer, but he produces stuff that is very much in the spirit of the the Golden Age. He started off back in the 70s with a series of books about Detective Sergeant Cribb, a Scotland Yard detective in the Victorian era. He went on to do a series of one-off novels such as ROUGH CIDER, KEYSTONE, and the marvellously clever THE FALSE INSPECTOR DEW. He did a short series (three books!) about 'Bertie' the future King Edward VII, acting as a detective. Since 1991 he has concentrated on the Peter Diamond series, which are contemporary stories about a murder squad detective in the beautiful English city of Bath. On the face of it, these look like police procedurals, but in fact they are old fashioned detective stories in a modern disguise (one of the stories, BLOODHOUNDS, is very much a tribute to John Dickson Carr). If you are interested, Lovesey has his own website,which will tell you more about the books.

              --- In GAdetection@yahoogroups.com, luis molina <lrmolina47@...> wrote:
              >
              > A pettigrew mystery by Ciril Hume
              >
              >
              > --- On Thu, 6/7/12, Last Century Detective <lastcenturydetective@...> wrote:
              >
              >
              > From: Last Century Detective <lastcenturydetective@...>
              > Subject: [GAdetection] Re: Hello! Any Reccomendations?
              > To: GAdetection@yahoogroups.com
              > Date: Thursday, June 7, 2012, 8:38 AM
              >
              >
              >
              >  
              >
              >
              >
              > Welcome Olga!
              >
              > I have to make my obligatory recommendation for THE FRIGHTENED STIFF by Kelley Roos, reprinted by the Rue Morgue Press, and echo the ones made in favor of John Dickson Carr, Rex Stout, Nicholas Blake and Gladys Mitchell.
              >
              > You might also want to take a look at Patrick Quentin/Q. Patrick (DEATH AND THE MAIDEN and BLACK WIDOW), Christianna Brand (GREEN FOR DANGER, LONDON PARTICULAR and DEATH OF JEZEBEL), Craig Rice (HOME SWEET HOMICIDE), Anthony Berkeley (JUMPING JENNY, TRIAL AND ERROR and THE POISONED CHOCOLATES CASE), Elspeth Huxley (MURDER ON SAFARI), Pat McGerr (PICK YOUR VICTIM and THE SEVEN DEADLY SISTERS) and I could go on, and on, like that.
              >
              > --- In GAdetection@yahoogroups.com, luis molina <lrmolina47@> wrote:
              > >
              > > And Ellery Queen !
              > >
              > > --- On Thu, 6/7/12, Allan Griffith <dfordoom@> wrote:
              > >
              > >
              > > From: Allan Griffith <dfordoom@>
              > > Subject: Re: [GAdetection] Re: Hello! Any Reccomendations?
              > > To: GAdetection@yahoogroups.com
              > > Date: Thursday, June 7, 2012, 5:00 AM
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >  
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > > On 7 June 2012 21:56, Les <LesBlatt@> wrote:
              > > > I'd suggest that you try one or two books by each of the authors you see us talking about, to see if that author is right for you. I agree completely about the names you're getting here: Dorothy L. Sayers, Ngaio Marsh, Edmund Crispin. If you like those, you might also try Michael Innes and Nicholas Blake. A lot of us enjoy Gladys Mitchell, but she can be fairly quirky - you need to really enjoy English eccentrics! John Dickson Carr/Carter Dickson is my favorite, because I love locked room/impossible crime mysteries. And don't forget Rex Stout's marvelous Nero Wolfe books - I suspect you will love Wolfe and his assistant (and narrator) Archie Goodwin.
              > >
              > > I'll second the recommendation for Nicholas Blake (who was actually
              > > the Poet Laureate Cecil Day-Lewis) - an unfairly neglected golden age
              > > detective writer.
              > >
              > > And I'll second the recommendation for the Nero Wolfe books.
              > >
              > > There's also S. S. Van Dine's Philo Vance mysteries - not everybody
              > > loves Philo Vance (who's a bit like an American Lord Peter Wimsey only
              > > more so) but I love these books,
              > >
              > > Al
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              > >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              >




              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • Douglas G.
              I edited a book for George Vanderburgh s Battered Silicon Dispatch Box Press which contains the 6 short stories by Rodrigues Ottolengui which were previously
              Message 6 of 20 , Jun 8, 2012
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                I edited a book for George Vanderburgh's Battered Silicon Dispatch Box Press which contains the 6 short stories by Rodrigues Ottolengui which were previously uncollected. In assembling the book, entitled "Before the Fact," I found informative material about the author, which I included in my introduction.

                The book is available from Battered Silcon's website, but in light of this thread, I attach the introduction below.

                Doug


                Frederic Dannay (the bibliographic half of the cousins who were "Ellery Queen") chose Rodrigues Ottolengui's Final Proof; or The Value of Evidence (Putnam's, 1898) for Queen's Quorum, an annotated description of the most important detective short-story collections. Yet, wrote Dannay, Ottolengui is "one of the most neglected authors in the entire history of the detective story." Dannay said that Ottolengui was unappreciated in his own time," but his four novels and his single short story collection were reprinted on several occasions, and were translated into several languages, including French, German, Danish, and Polish.
                Benjamin Adolph Rodrigues Ottolengui (known as "Rod' to family and friends) was born in Charleston, South Carolina, on March 15, 1861, of a Sephardic Jewish family. Before the arrival of Ashkenazi in the 1830's, Charleston had the largest Jewish population in the United States, and in 1861 it was still a center of Jewish life and culture. How the Civil War affected the Ottolengui family, I do not know. Rodrigues' grandfather, Benjamin, was one of the first dentists in the area, and his father, Daniel, was a newspaperman. Sherman's invasion almost leveled Charles, but Rodrigues was able to attend The College of Charleston. In 1877, at the age of 16, he traveled to New York City to become apprenticed to a dentist, and in 1885 he received the degree of Master of Dental Surgery.
                He was a man of many interests and accomplishments. He was one of the first to use x-rays in dentistry, and he pioneered methods of filling teeth, especially root canals. He also developed methods to restore cleft pallets. His book, Methods of Filling Teeth (1892) was a standard textbooks for several decades, and for thirty-five years he edited and wrote for a dental journal, Dental Items of Interest, resulting in a collection, Table Talks on Dentistry. He may have been one of the first in fiction to use the patterns of dental fillings as a way to identify a corpse.
                Ottolengui's hobbies included taxidermy (which plays a role in some of his fiction), entomology, and photography. He was especially interested in the Plusiide moths, writing a number of articles about them beginning in 1893. He was Vice President of the New York Entomological Society. As a photographer, he contributed articles with such titles as "New York With a Camera," "Feats of a Camera," and "Afield with a Camera."
                In 1893, Ottolengui added to his manifold activities the writing of a detective novel, An Artist in Crime, featuring two sometimes cooperating, sometimes competing sleuths -- Jack Barnes (a professional private detective) and Robert Leroy Mitchel (a wealthy amateur). Why Ottolengui turned toward fiction is not known; three years earlier he had written a novel, Conya: A Romance of the Buddhas, which was serialized in a Charleston newspaper. Perhaps, like Dr. Conan Doyle, he needed to occupy his time while waiting for patients. His first novel was followed by A Conflict of Evidence (1893), A Modern Wizard (1894), and The Crime of the Century (1896). These four books included various forms of 1890's sensationalism, and they have enough fantasy and science fiction to be discussed in E. F. Bleiler's Science Fiction: The Early Years. Ottolengui combined Holmesian-style deductions with drugs, hypnosis, glandular experiments and a lost Aztec temple under New York City. It is little wonder that (according to the preface to The Crime of the Century) a friend complained to him about his "stupid soaring into the realm of the impossible . . . your stories are not within human probability." Ottolengui replied that fiction should be "something a little different from the realm of daily experience," and challenged his friend to find anything in his books that was not borrowed from life. He didn't say how his ideas about Aztecs under New York could have been found in daily life.
                In 1895, Ottolengui began writing a series of short stories about Barnes and Mitchel. At least four of them were published in Jerome K. Jerome's London magazine, The Idler, and another appeared in the US magazine The Black Cat. They were collected in the 1898 volume Final Proof – and that book seemed to conclude the cases of Mitchel and Barnes, as Ottolengui returned to dentistry – "He gave up the sleuth," Anthony Boucher wrote, "for the tooth." Ottolengui received several honorary doctorates in his later years, before dying in New York City in 1937, at the age 76.
                A recent discovery, however, has shown that Ottolengui did not desert the detection field in 1898. In 1901, Ainslee's Magazine published six additional stories under the general title "Before the Fact," based on Mitchel's claim that he could detect crimes before they took place. (Ottolengui did not consistently use this conceit throughout the six stories.) Like the novels and earlier stories, the 1901 series varies in quality, but it contains some of Ottolengui's best writing. "A Problem in Smuggling," though it has a mystery which even the dullest policeman should have been able to unravel, includes an evocative description of the Maine woods – where Ottolengui himself spent time fishing. The final two stories, "The Art of Forgery" and "The Whirlpool of Society," are especially strong in genuine detection.
                Frederic Dannay who reveled in discovering lost stories that he could reprint in early issues of Ellery Queen's Mystery Magazine, never knew about six stories in "Before the Fact." But we are fortunate enough to be able to read them in this handsome edition.
              • Jon Jermey
                ... I recently read Constance Dunlap by Arthur Reeve. Constance is a sort of female criminal counterpart to his scientific hero Craig Kennedy. She embarks on
                Message 7 of 20 , Jun 9, 2012
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                  On 07/06/12 01:02, Mary Reed wrote:
                  >

                  > A Novel Forgery
                  > Forged cheques are being drawn on a businessman's account. I was
                  > intrigued to learn at one time the amount of a cheque was also punched
                  > into it, and even then it was sometimes possible to alter it!

                  I recently read Constance Dunlap by Arthur Reeve. Constance is a sort of
                  female criminal counterpart to his scientific hero Craig Kennedy. She
                  embarks on her criminal career by carefully forging cheques to save her
                  husband from disgrace -- and yes, this involves getting the necessary
                  punches, and filling in the holes in the cheque with
                  appropriately-shaped chards.

                  Jon.
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