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Re: Armored Battalion TO&E

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  • Bob Smart
    ... your ... yours. Thanks for the comments - I know at least one site on the web has some pretty good pictures of the vehicles at Aberdeen. I ll dig up the
    Message 1 of 28 , Aug 1, 2001
      --- In G104@y..., bobskat@a... wrote:


      > If you have a couple of them in your park, I would appreciate
      your
      > comments regarding them...armor, guns, power plant, etc.
      > Sorry I can't help...and, I sure wish I could take that tour of
      yours.

      Thanks for the comments - I know at least one site on the web has some
      pretty good pictures of the vehicles at Aberdeen. I'll dig up the URL
      and let you know.

      When I'm giving the tour the Japanese Medium tank comes up a few spots
      after the Italian. My comment about the Italian tank is that it
      solidly firmed up Italy's last place standing in the WWII tank
      sweepstakes. My comment about the Japanese tank is that the only
      thing keeping Japan out of last place is that the Italians tried so
      hard to hold onto it.

      The Japanese Medium is small compared to the Sherman. It is closer in
      size to an American Stuart light tank. It has a 47mm gun that may be
      better than our 37mm but not in the class of the American 57mm A/T gun
      or the 75mm in the Sherman. The hull is of riveted construction (with
      all the problems of rivet heads shearing off inside and bouncing
      around) and is not very thick. It was definitely outclassed by 1942.

      If you ever get east let me know.

      Bob Smart (bsmart@...)
      >
      > Bob
      > Eight Dollar Mountain,
      > Southern Oregon
    • AMPSOne@aol.com
      Tanks are relative to what they are being designed and used for. I have pitched this professionally for a number of years, as too many modelers have this idea
      Message 2 of 28 , Aug 1, 2001
        Tanks are relative to what they are being designed and used for. I have
        pitched this professionally for a number of years, as too many modelers have
        this idea that tanks are only designed to fight other tanks. Most of them
        were designed for infantry support missions, and Japanese and Italian tanks
        were no different.

        Their problem was that when faced with either bigger and better designs (e.g.
        the Sherman) or tanks better prepared to both defend (the Matilda) and attack
        (Cruiser series) they were ill prepared to compete. Most of the Japanese
        tanks could be knocked out by a US .50 M2HB (less the Type 97 and perhaps the
        Type 89 series) so were even unprepared to deal with supporting vehicles like
        AMTRACs.

        Just keep in mind that you don't need much of a tank to go peasant bashing.

        Cookie Sewell
        AMPS


        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Peter Allton
        ... One thing to remember about Japanese and Italian tanks is that when they were designed they were the best in the world however this was in the 1930 s and
        Message 3 of 28 , Aug 1, 2001
          At 14:39 01/08/01 -0000, you wrote:
          >--- In G104@y..., bobskat@a... wrote:
          >
          >
          >
          >When I'm giving the tour the Japanese Medium tank comes up a few spots
          >after the Italian. My comment about the Italian tank is that it
          >solidly firmed up Italy's last place standing in the WWII tank
          >sweepstakes. My comment about the Japanese tank is that the only
          >thing keeping Japan out of last place is that the Italians tried so
          >hard to hold onto it.
          >
          One thing to remember about Japanese and Italian tanks is that when they
          were designed they were the best in the world however this was in the 1930's
          and limited funds means limited development.
          The following website is probably the best for Japanese armour.
          http://members.nifty.ne.jp/takixxx/

          Pete A
          "Qui s'y frotte,s'y brule"
          9RTR/3rdDiv(fr)
        • bobskat@aol.com
          Hi Bob... Thanks for the info re; the Japanese (and Italian) tanks. Their 47 mm gun deserves a lot of respect but, as you say, not in the same class without he
          Message 4 of 28 , Aug 1, 2001
            Hi Bob...
            Thanks for the info re; the Japanese (and Italian) tanks. Their 47 mm gun
            deserves a lot of respect but, as you say, not in the same class without he
            others.
            I doubt I'll ever get east of the Oregon state line, but if I do, I've got
            you on my list.
            Thanks, again...

            Bob & Linda May
            Eight Dollar Mountain,
            Southern Oregon
          • bobskat@aol.com
            Pete... You incorrectly attributed that quote to me, but that s OK. Thanks for the Japanese tank web site...will check it out. Bob 763rd Tank Bn. WW2 Bob &
            Message 5 of 28 , Aug 1, 2001
              Pete...
              You incorrectly attributed that quote to me, but that's OK.
              Thanks for the Japanese tank web site...will check it out.
              Bob
              763rd Tank Bn. WW2

              Bob & Linda May
              Eight Dollar Mountain,
              Southern Oregon
            • Peter Allton
              ... Sorry,got my Bob s mixed up :-) Pete A Qui s y frotte,s y brule 9RTR/3rdDiv(fr)
              Message 6 of 28 , Aug 1, 2001
                At 20:19 01/08/01 EDT, you wrote:
                >Pete...
                > You incorrectly attributed that quote to me, but that's OK.

                Sorry,got my Bob's mixed up :-)

                Pete A
                "Qui s'y frotte,s'y brule"
                9RTR/3rdDiv(fr)
              • Bob Smart
                ... spots ... they ... the 1930 s ... I ll check the site out. The big problem I have with Japanese tank design is that they had some of the best early
                Message 7 of 28 , Aug 2, 2001
                  --- In G104@y..., Peter Allton <p.allton@b...> wrote:
                  > At 14:39 01/08/01 -0000, you wrote:
                  > >--- In G104@y..., bobskat@a... wrote:
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >When I'm giving the tour the Japanese Medium tank comes up a few
                  spots
                  > >after the Italian. My comment about the Italian tank is that it
                  > >solidly firmed up Italy's last place standing in the WWII tank
                  > >sweepstakes. My comment about the Japanese tank is that the only
                  > >thing keeping Japan out of last place is that the Italians tried so
                  > >hard to hold onto it.
                  > >
                  > One thing to remember about Japanese and Italian tanks is that when
                  they
                  > were designed they were the best in the world however this was in
                  the 1930's
                  > and limited funds means limited development.
                  > The following website is probably the best for Japanese armour.
                  > http://members.nifty.ne.jp/takixxx/

                  I'll check the site out. The big problem I have with Japanese tank
                  design is that they had some of the best early experience in armored
                  warfare in the Border incidents (Khalkin-Gol) with the Soviets. They
                  faced BT-7s ( the predecessor to the T-34). I fault them because they
                  didn't learn from those incidents in 1938-39 and make corrections. If
                  they had started working on a new medium tank at that time they could
                  have had a competitive design. And the Japanese army wasn't just
                  worried about an island hopping campaign. Throughout the war they were
                  constantly preparing for another round on the Soviet border so they
                  had a need for a competent armor force. I think the Japanes problem
                  was twofold. first the Navy got priority for heavy industry. Second
                  the Japanese military philosophy was very oriented towards the
                  individual and the idea that the 'warrier spirit' could overcome all
                  obsticles. This meant that the technical services were seen as less
                  desirable assignments. I know we are wandering a ways from the focuse
                  of the list :-)

                  Bob Smart (bsmart@...)
                  >
                  > Pete A
                  > "Qui s'y frotte,s'y brule"
                  > 9RTR/3rdDiv(fr)
                • Abet Anido
                  Hello all. As the 763rd Tank Bn. of the U.S. Army served in the Philippines, I was wondering if anyone has photos of their M4 Composite Hull Shermans in the
                  Message 8 of 28 , Aug 2, 2001
                    Hello all.

                    As the 763rd Tank Bn. of the U.S. Army served in the Philippines, I was
                    wondering if anyone has photos of their M4 Composite Hull Shermans in the
                    Philippines with their unique individual tank names. I saw a photo of their
                    M4 with a bulldozer blade mounted, with the name Corsair on the port front
                    applique armor.

                    Also, does anyone have plans for the wading gear/trunks used on M4A3
                    Shermans? These were used by the 716th Tank Bn. and would like to
                    scratchbuild one for my 1/35 Tamiya kit.

                    Thanks in advance for all your help.

                    Cheers,

                    Albert
                    IPMS Philippines
                    At 08:19 PM 8/1/01 -0400, you wrote:
                    >Pete...
                    > You incorrectly attributed that quote to me, but that's OK.
                    >Thanks for the Japanese tank web site...will check it out.
                    >Bob
                    >763rd Tank Bn. WW2
                    >
                    >Bob & Linda May
                    >Eight Dollar Mountain,
                    >Southern Oregon
                  • Mike Canaday
                    I think these achives photos are the 763rd. http://mmcalc.tripod.com/Shermans/Composites.html Mike Canaday [Non-text portions of this message have been
                    Message 9 of 28 , Aug 2, 2001
                      I think these achives photos are the 763rd.
                      http://mmcalc.tripod.com/Shermans/Composites.html

                      Mike Canaday



                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    • bobskat@aol.com
                      Hi Albert... Re; the individual tanks names, our battalion required that those names start with the same letter of the alphabet as our Company. Example; a tank
                      Message 10 of 28 , Aug 2, 2001
                        Hi Albert...
                        Re; the individual tanks names, our battalion required that those names
                        start with the same letter of the alphabet as our Company. Example; a tank in
                        A Co. might be named "Adam"...or most any other name that started with an "A".
                        My company was C company, and I named our tank, (number 60) "Come 'N Get
                        It"...and painted a big 'IT" on the 75mm gun barrel.
                        Right after we named our tanks according to the company we were in, D company
                        drove by us one day...Their 1st. platoon tanks were named as follows;
                        DINAH

                        DINAH MITE

                        DINAH COULD

                        DINAH WOULD

                        DINAH DID


                        Bob
                        Eight Dollar Mountain,
                        Southern Oregon
                      • bobskat@aol.com
                        Albert... Ps...MAHBUHY Bob Eight Dollar Mountain, Southern Oregon
                        Message 11 of 28 , Aug 2, 2001
                          Albert...
                          Ps...MAHBUHY

                          Bob
                          Eight Dollar Mountain,
                          Southern Oregon
                        • bobskat@aol.com
                          Hi Mike... Looks like some of the tanks in those photos MIGHT be 763rd...but, I see little things that don t quite make it. For example, our tanks had those
                          Message 12 of 28 , Aug 2, 2001
                            Hi Mike...
                            Looks like some of the tanks in those photos MIGHT be 763rd...but, I see
                            little things that don't quite make it.
                            For example, our tanks had those track extensions on the outside edge of
                            the tracks...we called them "duckbills". I didn't notice any in the pictures.
                            Also, on the left rear end of the hull we had a metal box approximately 4 or
                            5 inches thick, about 10 or 11 inches wide, and about 8 inches high (as best
                            as I can remember). The box had a hinged lid, was waterproof, and inside was
                            a handset, or phone, that connected to the interior of the tank. Inside, the
                            phone was mounted between the driver and the bow gunner..had a red light that
                            could be actuated by the person outside who wanted to talk with us. The
                            infantry used this quite a bit for target designation, stuff like that.
                            One day we were sitting on a road, waiting for the next move, and an
                            infantryman flashed the light. I picked up the phone and we had a nice chat.
                            In a little while, some mortar shells began landing nearby. I asked him if
                            they were "theirs" or ours. He said they are Japanese. I told him not to
                            stand directly in back of the tank...I might have to back up in a hurry. He
                            said OK. About that time some "stuff" landed very close and my commander told
                            me to back up. I did, and as we backed, I saw the G.I. in a ditch alongside
                            the road, holding up the phone...we had cut the coiled handset cord when we
                            backed up. He had a big grin on his face. He also had our phone!

                            Bob
                            Eight Dollar Mountain,
                            Southern Oregon
                          • printeral@webtv.net
                            HI bob Dick We did have one Super tank, I trained on it when Tank commander French Was training Infrantry in support of tanks. On a Northern most Island off
                            Message 13 of 28 , Aug 3, 2001
                              HI bob Dick
                              We did have one Super tank, I trained on it when Tank commander French
                              Was training Infrantry in support of tanks. On a Northern most Island
                              off Leyte. I arrived with a Hawaian Shirt and Jap Tennis shoes. French
                              went home on points. The Lt. said: he didn't know what army we were in!
                              Sent us to the supply Sgt.
                              for GI clothes!!!!
                              The tank had a manual breech 75 mm The ammo wouldn't fit in the storage
                              tubes. It was WW! with no windsheields Which made you un comfortable .
                              You talked about the mud paddles they were called Grousers. Great in mud
                              broke-off on coral.
                              The tank had cold-rolled
                              Battleship steel. 8-inches in front. Ford v8 enigens.
                              Couch, Merford Oregon.
                            • Abet Anido
                              Hello Bob. Mabuhay to you too, and thanks for helping liberate my country! Of course, what you guys did is very much appreciated! Thanks too for the individual
                              Message 14 of 28 , Aug 3, 2001
                                Hello Bob.

                                Mabuhay to you too, and thanks for helping liberate my country! Of course,
                                what you guys did is very much appreciated!

                                Thanks too for the individual M4 tank names you sent, I have printed the
                                list for my files. Would you have photos of your tank and of the others?
                                Also, were you a tank commander?

                                Will also check out the link Mike C. sent on the 763rd later.

                                Best regards,

                                Albert
                                IPMS Philippines
                                At 02:02 AM 8/3/01 -0400, you wrote:
                                >Hi Albert...
                                > Re; the individual tanks names, our battalion required that those names
                                >start with the same letter of the alphabet as our Company. Example; a tank in
                                >A Co. might be named "Adam"...or most any other name that started with an "A".
                                > My company was C company, and I named our tank, (number 60) "Come 'N Get
                                >It"...and painted a big 'IT" on the 75mm gun barrel.
                                >Right after we named our tanks according to the company we were in, D company
                                >drove by us one day...Their 1st. platoon tanks were named as follows;
                                >DINAH
                                >
                                >DINAH MITE
                                >
                                >DINAH COULD
                                >
                                >DINAH WOULD
                                >
                                >DINAH DID
                                >
                                >
                                > Bob
                                >Eight Dollar Mountain,
                                >Southern Oregon
                              • Abet Anido
                                Hello All. Mike, thanks for the link on the PTO M4 Composites. Based on the Squadron Signal M4 Sherman and Concord s Tank Battles of the Pacific War books,
                                Message 15 of 28 , Aug 3, 2001
                                  Hello All.

                                  Mike, thanks for the link on the PTO M4 Composites. Based on the Squadron
                                  Signal M4 Sherman and Concord's Tank Battles of the Pacific War books, here
                                  is what I gathered:

                                  pic. 1 - tank nos. 751 and 758 - Co. C, 706th Tank Bn. - Guam Aug. 1944
                                  pic. 2 - Bushmaster - Co. B, 763rd Tank Bn. - Leyte, Philippines Nov. 1944
                                  pic. 3 - Blooper - Co. B, 763rd Tank Bn. - Palau Is. Sept. 1944
                                  pic. 4 - M4 Blow Torch - 713th Flamethrower Tank Bn. - Okinawa 1945
                                  pic. 5 - knocked out M4 - unknown unit Okinawa, June 1945
                                  pic. 6 - 713th Flamethrower Tank Bn. - probably Okinawa May 1945
                                  pic. 7 - ? first time I saw this photo
                                  pic. 8 - M4 with knocked out Japanese truck - 775th Tank Bn. Philippines
                                  June 1945 - these tanks were later used by the Phil. Army's 10th BCT, still
                                  retaining the mount for the spare road wheel on the glacis, as well as the
                                  mounts for spare track links on the turret sides
                                  pic. 9 - M4 with thrown track - probably 763rd Tank Bn. Leyte, Philippines

                                  Cheers,

                                  Albert
                                  IPMS Philippines
                                  At 08:39 PM 8/2/01 -0400, you wrote:
                                  >I think these achives photos are the 763rd.
                                  >http://mmcalc.tripod.com/Shermans/Composites.html
                                  >
                                  >Mike Canaday
                                • bobskat@aol.com
                                  Albert... I was a driver through the Leyte campaign, and also a driver on Okinawa. We lost so many people on Okinawa that in sheer desperation the captain made
                                  Message 16 of 28 , Aug 3, 2001
                                    Albert...
                                    I was a driver through the Leyte campaign, and also a driver on Okinawa. We
                                    lost so many people on Okinawa that in sheer desperation the captain made me
                                    a commander. I lasted only a very short time until I was mistakenly shot by a
                                    Japanese soldier and ended up back at the beach in the hospital.
                                    I'm pretty sure that it was a mistake...I didn't know the guy personally
                                    and I'm sure he meant me no ill will.....I don't think (smile).
                                    Mabuhy
                                    Bob
                                    Eight Dollar Mountain,
                                    Southern Oregon
                                  • Abet Anido
                                    Hello Bob. Thanks for the info, glad you made it back home. Did your unit ever have a unit patch? Was it ever worn on the tanker coveralls? Also, was a unit
                                    Message 17 of 28 , Aug 4, 2001
                                      Hello Bob.

                                      Thanks for the info, glad you made it back home. Did your unit ever have a
                                      unit patch? Was it ever worn on the tanker coveralls? Also, was a unit
                                      history book ever published?

                                      Cheers,

                                      Albert
                                      IPMS Philippines
                                      At 08:51 PM 8/3/01 -0400, you wrote:
                                      >Albert...
                                      > I was a driver through the Leyte campaign, and also a driver on
                                      > Okinawa. We
                                      >lost so many people on Okinawa that in sheer desperation the captain made me
                                      >a commander. I lasted only a very short time until I was mistakenly shot by a
                                      >Japanese soldier and ended up back at the beach in the hospital.
                                      > I'm pretty sure that it was a mistake...I didn't know the guy personally
                                      >and I'm sure he meant me no ill will.....I don't think (smile).
                                      >Mabuhy
                                      >Bob
                                    • Peter Allton
                                      ... URL is wrong should be http://member.nifty.ne.jp/takixxx/ Pete A
                                      Message 18 of 28 , Aug 5, 2001
                                        At 21:52 01/08/01 +0100, you wrote:
                                        >The following website is probably the best for Japanese armour.
                                        >http://members.nifty.ne.jp/takixxx/
                                        >
                                        URL is wrong should be http://member.nifty.ne.jp/takixxx/

                                        Pete A
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