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Re: Jan Jans & Marijke Theunis

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  • Ross
    PS The information regarding Marijke s parents is interesting... Being that she was born around 1729 I d rule out Teunis Hendricks and Maria Harmens - but
    Message 1 of 12 , Dec 8, 2010
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      PS The information regarding Marijke's parents is interesting...
      Being that she was born around 1729 I'd rule out Teunis Hendricks and Maria Harmens - but Teunis Hendriks from Wyckel and Geertuyd Jans Slijchuys might be a match. I also think that Teunis Hendricks and Femmetie Wessels could indeed be the parents as well but am unsure where you found Teunis Femmes afkomstig van Wyckel and Tjem Martens afkomstig van Nijemirdum...

      Thanks again :)



      --- In Friesland-genealogy@yahoogroups.com, Nynke van den Hooven <nynkevandenhooven@...> wrote:
      >
      > Hi Tanya,
      >
      >
      >
      > The marriage cert Kevin Kooiker found mentions the fact that Marijke Theunes
      > is present at the marriage, giving consent for her son's marriage. That
      > would imply she died after 30 May 1811 (the marriage date of her son Anne)
      > and so there should be a death cert. At the time of her son's marriage she's
      > living in Mirns&Bakhuizen.
      >
      >
      >
      > But the only cert I find is the following:
      >
      > Death cert Gaasterland, 1811
      >
      > Registration date 13 december 1811, page nr. 26
      >
      > Marijke Theunes, died 12 december 1811, 50 years, female
      >
      > Widow
      >
      >
      >
      > It's quite unlikely that "your" Marijke Theunis could have been 50 years old
      > when she died…., that would have made her a very young mother of Anne… Did
      > the informants give incorrect information or did the registering clerk make
      > a mistake?
      >
      >
      >
      > The reporters of her death stated the following:
      >
      > "….died on 12 December 1811 at 11 pm Marijke Theunes, 50 years old, living
      > in Mirns&Bakhuizen, widow of Aarnt Hendriks, daughter of the late Theunes
      > Hendriks and of Marijke (which is crossed out) named Femmetie Wessels. …."
      >
      >
      >
      > This is the corresponding marriage:
      >
      > Gaasterland, huwelijken 1774
      >
      > Vermelding: Bevestiging huwelijk op 26 januari 1774 in Harich
      >
      > Man : Arend Hendricks afkomstig van Harich
      >
      > Vrouw : Marike Theunis afkomstig van Harich
      >
      >
      >
      > I found the baptism of a daughter from this marriage: Harmke, born 13 May
      > 1777 in Harich, baptised there on 1 June 1777.
      >
      >
      >
      > Marijke could have been a widow marrying for the second time:
      >
      > Gaasterland, huwelijken 1759
      >
      > Vermelding: Bevestiging huwelijk op 29 maart 1759 in Harich
      >
      > Man : Jan Jans afkomstig van Harich
      >
      > Vrouw : Marijke Theunis afkomstig van Harich
      >
      >
      >
      > I this is indeed "your" Marijke Theunis she must have been at least 18 when
      > she got married, in which case the informers of her death were app 20 years
      > off regarding her age… In which case they may have not exactly known the
      > proper patronyms of Marijke's parents and/or her mother's first name.
      >
      > This then seems like a nice couple to be Marijke's parents:
      >
      > Gaasterland, huwelijken 1715
      >
      > Vermelding: Eerste proclamatie op 20 oktober 1715 in Wyckel
      >
      > Man : Teunis Femmes afkomstig van Wyckel
      >
      > Vrouw : Tjem Martens afkomstig van Nijemirdum
      >
      >
      >
      > And the marriage:
      >
      > Gaasterland, huwelijken 1716
      >
      > Vermelding: Bevestiging huwelijk op 19 april 1716
      >
      > Man : Teunis Femmes afkomstig van Sondel of Wyckel
      >
      > Vrouw : Tjem Martens
      >
      > I found one child baptised in Oudemirdum in 1722, born in Nijemirdum.
      >
      >
      >
      > But there was also a Teunis Hendriks from Wyckel who married Geertuyd Jans
      > Slijchuys in 1725 en probably married for the second time in 1729 to Maria
      > Harmens (the Marijke that was crossed out in Marijke Theunes' death
      > cert….?). And last but not least there was a Teunis Hendriks from Harich,
      > who married Lijsbeth Althus in 1740.
      >
      >
      >
      > Marijke's son Anne Jans had the family name "van de Boer" registered in
      > 1811. He was living in Bakhuizen at the time. One Theunes Jans, living in
      > Harich, also had the name "de Boer" registered.
      >
      > According to Theunes Jans' death cert he was a son of Jan Jans de Boer and
      > Marijke Theunis, born 1762.
      >
      > And so was Anne Jans de Boer, according to his 1826 death cert. He was born
      > appr 1771.
      >
      > Trui Jans however has the name Haarsma registered in 1811. Her father-in-law
      > Jacob Lefferts Leffertma has the name Leffertsma registered for her three
      > daughters with Leffert Jacobs.
      >
      >
      >
      > Well, this doens't lead anywhere, I think….
      >
      >
      >
      > Kind regards,
      >
      > Nynke van den Hooven
      >
      >
      >
      > _____
      >
      > Van: Friesland-genealogy@yahoogroups.com
      > [mailto:Friesland-genealogy@yahoogroups.com] Namens Ross
      > Verzonden: vrijdag 3 december 2010 10:51
      > Aan: Friesland-genealogy@yahoogroups.com
      > Onderwerp: [Friesland-genealogy] Jan Jans & Marijke Theunis
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > I'm trying to find more information on two of my ancestors named Jan Jans
      > and Marijke Theunis. I understand they were farmers in Harich, Friesland,
      > Netherlands and have traced my family lineage up to them through their
      > daughter Truike (Trui) Jans Haarsma.
      >
      > It would be great if anyone has any further information on them to share -
      > any further children or especially Jans and Marijke's parent's names.
      >
      > Many thanks! Tanya
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      >
    • Nynke van den Hooven
      Hi Tanya, You re welcome! The informants of Marijke s death stated that her parents were Teunis Hendricks and Femmetie Wessels. These informants were Sybren
      Message 2 of 12 , Dec 8, 2010
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        Hi Tanya,



        You're welcome!

        The informants of Marijke's death stated that her parents were Teunis
        Hendricks and Femmetie Wessels. These informants were Sybren Jans, laborer
        and Durk Jans van Dijk, carpenter, both living in Mirns & Bakhuizen.
        Unfortunately the certificate doens't say how old they were and what their
        relationship to the deceased was. But since Marijke died at a high age, it's
        quite possible that they didn't know the exact names of Marijke's parents,
        but just had some faint idea. Which could result in incorrect combinations
        of correct names :-). It's certain her dad was a Teunis, but was his wife's
        name Femmetie, or did the informants mix up his patronym and made that the
        name of his wife? There's no child with that name, but then again, that
        child could have died before 1811..



        But you're right, judging by the names of Marijke's children it's quite
        possible that her parents were Theunis Hendriks and Geertruyd Jans (Trui or
        Truike is short for Geertruyd.) But then where would the name Femmetie
        Wessels have sprung from..? Maybe the informants just didn't have a clue
        about Marijke's mom and just mentioned a name.?



        I found the marriage of Teunis Femmes and Tjem Martens in the pre 1811
        database on www.Tresoar.nl <http://www.tresoar.nl/> .

        It's listed on the following webpage (among other very nice stuff):

        http://www.tresoar.nl/mmtresoar/main/content_pagina_volledig_teaser_rechts.j
        sp?lang=en
        <http://www.tresoar.nl/mmtresoar/main/content_pagina_volledig_teaser_rechts.
        jsp?lang=en&pagina=3313&stylesheet=onderzoek.css>
        &pagina=3313&stylesheet=onderzoek.css



        Kind regards

        Nynke van den Hooven



        _____

        Van: Friesland-genealogy@yahoogroups.com
        [mailto:Friesland-genealogy@yahoogroups.com] Namens Ross
        Verzonden: woensdag 8 december 2010 21:54
        Aan: Friesland-genealogy@yahoogroups.com
        Onderwerp: [Friesland-genealogy] Re: Jan Jans & Marijke Theunis


        PS The information regarding Marijke's parents is interesting...
        Being that she was born around 1729 I'd rule out Teunis Hendricks and Maria
        Harmens - but Teunis Hendriks from Wyckel and Geertuyd Jans Slijchuys might
        be a match. I also think that Teunis Hendricks and Femmetie Wessels could
        indeed be the parents as well but am unsure where you found Teunis Femmes
        afkomstig van Wyckel and Tjem Martens afkomstig van Nijemirdum...

        Thanks again :)
        <snip>





        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Jim Van Dyk
        I have been following the exchange of emails re. Jan Jans and Marijke Theunis with interest. Nynke you mentioned a Jan Durks van Dijk and a Truike Haarsma.
        Message 3 of 12 , Dec 9, 2010
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          I have been following the exchange of emails re. Jan Jans and Marijke Theunis with interest. Nynke you mentioned a Jan Durks van Dijk and a Truike Haarsma. They are both in my direct line of descent. My notes indicate that he indeed was a carpenter, but in 1811 he was also the "dorpsrechter." That might explain his involvement? Thanks to all for your research!
           
          Jim Van Dyk


           
          James Y. Van Dyk
          5329 Silverstone Dr. NE
          Comstock Park
          Michigan, USA  49321
           

           

          --- On Wed, 12/8/10, Nynke van den Hooven <nynkevandenhooven@...> wrote:


          From: Nynke van den Hooven <nynkevandenhooven@...>
          Subject: RE: [Friesland-genealogy] Re: Jan Jans & Marijke Theunis
          To: Friesland-genealogy@yahoogroups.com
          Date: Wednesday, December 8, 2010, 4:48 PM


           



          Hi Tanya,

          You're welcome!

          The informants of Marijke's death stated that her parents were Teunis
          Hendricks and Femmetie Wessels. These informants were Sybren Jans, laborer
          and Durk Jans van Dijk, carpenter, both living in Mirns & Bakhuizen.
          Unfortunately the certificate doens't say how old they were and what their
          relationship to the deceased was. But since Marijke died at a high age, it's
          quite possible that they didn't know the exact names of Marijke's parents,
          but just had some faint idea. Which could result in incorrect combinations
          of correct names :-). It's certain her dad was a Teunis, but was his wife's
          name Femmetie, or did the informants mix up his patronym and made that the
          name of his wife? There's no child with that name, but then again, that
          child could have died before 1811..

          But you're right, judging by the names of Marijke's children it's quite
          possible that her parents were Theunis Hendriks and Geertruyd Jans (Trui or
          Truike is short for Geertruyd.) But then where would the name Femmetie
          Wessels have sprung from..? Maybe the informants just didn't have a clue
          about Marijke's mom and just mentioned a name.?

          I found the marriage of Teunis Femmes and Tjem Martens in the pre 1811
          database on www.Tresoar.nl <http://www.tresoar.nl/> .

          It's listed on the following webpage (among other very nice stuff):

          http://www.tresoar.nl/mmtresoar/main/content_pagina_volledig_teaser_rechts.j
          sp?lang=en
          <http://www.tresoar.nl/mmtresoar/main/content_pagina_volledig_teaser_rechts.
          jsp?lang=en&pagina=3313&stylesheet=onderzoek.css>
          &pagina=3313&stylesheet=onderzoek.css

          Kind regards

          Nynke van den Hooven

          _____

          Van: Friesland-genealogy@yahoogroups.com
          [mailto:Friesland-genealogy@yahoogroups.com] Namens Ross
          Verzonden: woensdag 8 december 2010 21:54
          Aan: Friesland-genealogy@yahoogroups.com
          Onderwerp: [Friesland-genealogy] Re: Jan Jans & Marijke Theunis

          PS The information regarding Marijke's parents is interesting...
          Being that she was born around 1729 I'd rule out Teunis Hendricks and Maria
          Harmens - but Teunis Hendriks from Wyckel and Geertuyd Jans Slijchuys might
          be a match. I also think that Teunis Hendricks and Femmetie Wessels could
          indeed be the parents as well but am unsure where you found Teunis Femmes
          afkomstig van Wyckel and Tjem Martens afkomstig van Nijemirdum...

          Thanks again :)
          <snip>

          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]








          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • reyacta
          Hi, I have re-read the Tresoar discussion, and this is what we found: GAA C27, folio 184 vso, 31 jan 1788. Authorisatie van Wouter Cornelis, wonend onder
          Message 4 of 12 , Dec 10, 2010
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            Hi,

            I have re-read the Tresoar discussion, and this is what we found:

            GAA C27, folio 184 vso, 31 jan 1788. Authorisatie van Wouter Cornelis, wonend onder Harich, tot curator over Hendrik Teunis, oud in het 22e jaar, zoon van wijlen Teunis Hendriks en Fintje Wessels, echtelieden te Wijckel. Wegens een tweede huwelijk van Fintje met Johannes Krijn, te Wijckel.

            GAA S13, folio 101, 1 apr 1772. Minne Jelles, huisman te Wijckel, bbc op de koop van een zate en landen, bestaande uit een huisinge, schuire, hovinge, bomen en plantagie, cum annexis, met een fenne weidland (uitgebreid omschreven). Gekocht van Teunis Hendrix, huisman te Sondel, voor de ene helft, van de kinderen van Maria … voor de andere helft. Deze kinderen staan genoemd onder de acte: Hendrik Teunis, Johannes Teunis, Harmen Teunis, Hendrik Rommerts, Jan Jans.

            Dit bezit moet door de genoemde echtelieden, Teunis Hendriks en Marijke Harmens zijn aangekocht, te oordelen naar de verdeling bij de verkoop.
            Maar het blijkt nu dan wel wie de kinderen uit het eerste huwelijk zijn:
            een Hendrik, Johannes, Harmen, Antje (x Hendrik Rommerts) en Marijke (x Jan Jans).
            De belangrijkste conclusies: Marijke is toch uit het eerste huwelijk (anders had ze absoluut geen moederlijk part gekregen),
            en er zijn twee Hendrik Teunis: één uit het eerste huwelijk (in 1772 al meerderjarig),
            en één uit het huwelijk met Femmetje Wessels (geboren in 1766, zoals we al tijden geleden hadden vastgesteld).

            Somewhat translation:
            The couple Teunis Hendriks and Fintje/Femmetje Wessels existed,
            though we cannot find their marriage.

            Marijke has to be from the marriage with Marijke Harmens,
            (not from the first with Geertruy or from the third with Fintje/Femmetie)
            otherwise she absolutely would not have gotten a maternal part.
            And there are 2 Hendrik Teunis, one from each marriage.

            I now think it's possible in the death-certificate they named the stephmother -
            she was better known then the real mother who died long ago, and her name is probably mentioned more often and therefore better remembered.

            And - maybe Teunus named his first wife Geertrui/Trui in the second marriage,
            so Marijke named a sister rather than a mother?

            greetings Margreet
            NB. Fintjes/Femmetie's second marriage is this one:
            Gaasterland, huwelijken 1788
            Vermelding: Proclamatie op 6 januari 1788 in Wyckel
            Man : Johannes Krin afkomstig van Nassau Dillenburg
            Vrouw : Trijntjen Wessels afkomstig van Wyckel

            NB2 - in english one cannot mis-hear seventy-five for fifty,
            but in dutch it can.
            They either mumbled or spoke too quick, or the listener was a bit deaf:
            vijf(mompel/mumble: en zeven)tig.



            --- In Friesland-genealogy@yahoogroups.com, Nynke van den Hooven <nynkevandenhooven@...> wrote:
            >
            > Hi Tanya,
            >
            >
            >
            > You're welcome!
            >
            > The informants of Marijke's death stated that her parents were Teunis
            > Hendricks and Femmetie Wessels. These informants were Sybren Jans, laborer
            > and Durk Jans van Dijk, carpenter, both living in Mirns & Bakhuizen.
            > Unfortunately the certificate doens't say how old they were and what their
            > relationship to the deceased was. But since Marijke died at a high age, it's
            > quite possible that they didn't know the exact names of Marijke's parents,
            > but just had some faint idea. Which could result in incorrect combinations
            > of correct names :-). It's certain her dad was a Teunis, but was his wife's
            > name Femmetie, or did the informants mix up his patronym and made that the
            > name of his wife? There's no child with that name, but then again, that
            > child could have died before 1811..
            >
            >
            >
            > But you're right, judging by the names of Marijke's children it's quite
            > possible that her parents were Theunis Hendriks and Geertruyd Jans (Trui or
            > Truike is short for Geertruyd.) But then where would the name Femmetie
            > Wessels have sprung from..? Maybe the informants just didn't have a clue
            > about Marijke's mom and just mentioned a name.?
            >
            >
            >
            > I found the marriage of Teunis Femmes and Tjem Martens in the pre 1811
            > database on www.Tresoar.nl <http://www.tresoar.nl/> .
            >
            > It's listed on the following webpage (among other very nice stuff):
            >
            > http://www.tresoar.nl/mmtresoar/main/content_pagina_volledig_teaser_rechts.j
            > sp?lang=en
            > <http://www.tresoar.nl/mmtresoar/main/content_pagina_volledig_teaser_rechts.
            > jsp?lang=en&pagina=3313&stylesheet=onderzoek.css>
            > &pagina=3313&stylesheet=onderzoek.css
            >
            >
            >
            > Kind regards
            >
            > Nynke van den Hooven
            >
            >
            >
            > _____
            >
            > Van: Friesland-genealogy@yahoogroups.com
            > [mailto:Friesland-genealogy@yahoogroups.com] Namens Ross
            > Verzonden: woensdag 8 december 2010 21:54
            > Aan: Friesland-genealogy@yahoogroups.com
            > Onderwerp: [Friesland-genealogy] Re: Jan Jans & Marijke Theunis
            >
            >
            > PS The information regarding Marijke's parents is interesting...
            > Being that she was born around 1729 I'd rule out Teunis Hendricks and Maria
            > Harmens - but Teunis Hendriks from Wyckel and Geertuyd Jans Slijchuys might
            > be a match. I also think that Teunis Hendricks and Femmetie Wessels could
            > indeed be the parents as well but am unsure where you found Teunis Femmes
            > afkomstig van Wyckel and Tjem Martens afkomstig van Nijemirdum...
            >
            > Thanks again :)
            > <snip>
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            >
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