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RE: [Flewelling] amazon, kindle, and me, a sad tale

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  • Tahra
    That s what I meant. It s ridiculous. I had a pirate copy of Age Of Empires 2, since the game took forever to get here (another mystery to me).... Bought the
    Message 1 of 16 , Apr 4, 2012
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      That's what I meant. It's ridiculous.

      I had a pirate copy of Age Of Empires 2, since the game took forever to get
      here (another mystery to me).... Bought the game when it got here, and
      installed that one instead. Always had to have the darn cd in the drive.
      Took forever to launch. Time later, it started complaining it was the wrong
      cd. To Hades with it. Reinstalled my old copy, no cd, worked like a charm.
      So, people who BUY the thing have LESS value than the ones who just grab it
      off the intertubes. That makes sense... how?

      Regarding dvds, besides the created problems with regions, different
      editions and availability... there's also this:
      http://www.dailyfunnystuff.net/pirate-vs-original-dvds-and-they-wonder-why

      It's BRILLIANT. And so true. Ah, and later dvds come with an ad agaisnt
      "thieves". So, you BOUGHT THE DARN THING and you have to sit through it. As
      ridiculous as in the movies. Or maybe a bit more.


      I wonder if the new book can be found in actual shops in London.. I'll be
      there in the end of may.. would make my return plane trip AWESOME ;)





      _____

      From: Flewelling@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Flewelling@yahoogroups.com] On
      Behalf Of HBrown9628@...
      Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2012 23:54
      To: Flewelling@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: Re: [Flewelling] amazon, kindle, and me, a sad tale




      So basically, honest Brits who just want to purchase the ebooks are
      stuffed, and the only alternative for our lovely digital devices is to hunt
      around for illegal scanned copies, oh joy.

      It is extremely unfair that this is confined to those of us who have our
      own version of Amazon, and the rest of Europe and the world can order freely

      from US Amazon.

      Traditional book publishers need to keep up with the ebook revolution,
      restricting it is wrong and will just lead to book piracy. It seems to be
      part
      of the wider movement to restrict our rights, the games industry is forcing
      more and more extreme restrictions on their customers, to the point that I
      simply refuse to buy from a lot of game companies now, I'm just fed up of
      being treated like a potential criminal by them, and being told what I can
      and can't do with what ive purchased. I haven't bought the last version of
      Settlers because it doesn't work unless you are online and it can
      constantly check with their servers, despite it being primarily an offline
      game.
      Stuff that, I refuse to buy anything that I cant resintall a few years down
      the line if I want to play it again. Otherwise we're paying to rent it not
      own it, and only for as long as the game companies support it, if they go
      out of business or turn off their drm servers then the customers are
      stuffed.
      If Ebooks go the same increasingly restrictive route I won't be a happy
      bunny.


      sorry again for whining, but its pretty frustrating. I just want to give
      them my money lol but they dont appear to want it.

      Helen


      In a message dated 03/04/2012 11:51:56 GMT Daylight Time,
      queentahra@... <mailto:queentahra%40gmail.com> writes:

      Exactly. People who don't like money. They don't allow customers to BUY
      their products, then act surprised and outraged when
      would-be-paying-customers find cheaper (and sometimes better)
      alternatives.

      I'll NEVER understand that.

      _____

      From: _Flewelling@yahoogroups.com <mailto:_Flewelling%40yahoogroups.com> _
      (mailto:Flewelling@yahoogroups.com <mailto:Flewelling%40yahoogroups.com> )
      [mailto:_Flewelling@yahoogroups.com <mailto:_Flewelling%40yahoogroups.com> _
      (mailto:Flewelling@yahoogroups.com <mailto:Flewelling%40yahoogroups.com> ) ]
      On
      Behalf Of Paula Lieberman
      Sent: Monday, April 02, 2012 21:29
      To: _Flewelling@yahoogroups.com <mailto:_Flewelling%40yahoogroups.com> _
      (mailto:Flewelling@yahoogroups.com <mailto:Flewelling%40yahoogroups.com> )
      Subject: Re: [Flewelling] amazon, kindle, and me, a sad tale

      It's got to do with who's got the distribution rights for what country,
      it's

      the equivalent of DVD zone limiting...

      The print publications distribution system is paranoid and stuck back in
      1850 maybe, if that advanced, and viewed epublication as -Humongous
      Threat!- -- this despite the fact that the unauthorized distribution of
      stories on the Internet, including works which the unauthorized
      distributors

      got via someone without authorizing taking a print edition and scanning it
      page by page into an electronic document and uploadinh the electronic
      document, for distribution.... This of course is all benefitting the
      people
      who are not authorized distributors, some of them are charging money, but
      they aren't paying anything to the authors or licensed distributors and
      the
      retailers buying authorized editions for resale...

      -----Original Message-----
      From: _HBrown9628@... <mailto:_HBrown9628%40aol.com> _
      (mailto:HBrown9628@... <mailto:HBrown9628%40aol.com> )
      <mailto:HBrown9628%40aol.com>
      Sent: Monday, April 02, 2012 2:08 PM
      To: _flewelling@yahoogroups.com <mailto:_flewelling%40yahoogroups.com> _
      (mailto:flewelling@yahoogroups.com <mailto:flewelling%40yahoogroups.com> )
      <mailto:flewelling%40yahoogroups.com>
      Subject: [Flewelling] amazon, kindle, and me, a sad tale

      Sniff, well my year long love affair with my beloved Kindle, complete with
      hot pink leather cover, it looks very fetching in that I must say, is going
      through a rough patch sniff.

      It all started when I mistakenly thought it might be the answer to my
      problem with getting Lynn's books from Amazon UK somewhere near release
      date.
      The last two despite my pre ordering months in advance never arrived and I
      got an apologetic note saying theyd run out of stock.. run out of stock
      bah, surely they can count the number of pre orders and stock the
      appropriate
      number of books, but apparently not. So two books running I had to rush
      round trying to get a copy from somewhere to keep up with you lot ;-).

      Sadly the Kindle proved even worse. Suspicions should have been raised by
      the fact every time I typed Lynn's name into Amazon UK's kindle page it
      just
      showed Glimpses, and the three Tamir books in German. I want to put all
      the Nightrunner books on my Kindle. I went to Amazon.com and found all the
      Nightrunner books in Kindle versions sniff, and the pre order for Casket of
      Souls. Order them though, forget it, it just points out that I'm a nasty
      foreigner, well Brit and should head back to Amazon UK's kindle pages to
      order. Grrrrr. I tried the forums there, some people a couple of years
      ago
      had tried resetting their Kindles to US and then back again, it did work if
      they already had a .com account but doesn't now as you have to input a US
      address. And to be honest I don't really want to risk account switching
      between the two as it migrates your books back and forth and I dont want
      to
      risk
      in anyway losing my expensive digital book collection.

      This isnt it turns out an excusively Kindle problem. ITunes does pretty
      much the same thing. Attempts to purchase Casket of Souls there results
      exactly the same in Itunes telling you to bugger off where you came from
      lol.

      I have no idea why this stupid distinction exists. Is it publisher lead,
      ebook company lead, whatever it is, it needs sorting out and quickly. I can
      buy real books no problem from anywhere in the world, I really don't
      appreciate being penned in to purchasing digital books in the UK only in
      this day
      and age. Especially when there aren't any, if I cant purchase Casket of
      Souls from US Amazon and indeed the rest of the Nightrunner books to keep
      some
      of my favourites on my Kindle, then I cant purchase the ebooks at all as
      they aren't available on Amazon and Itunes UK and show no signs of being
      available for a long long time.

      Mutters a lot. Oh well will have to order my paper copy which yes I do
      love, but becoming increasingly harder to get anywhere near release date
      to.

      Helen

      ps to counteract the whining lol.. I am really looking forward to the new
      book :-).

      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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    • Paula Lieberman
      There are some other considerations buried in the issue--currency exchange rates make items produced in one country too expensive for those in another country
      Message 2 of 16 , Apr 4, 2012
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        There are some other considerations buried in the issue--currency exchange
        rates make items produced in one country too expensive for those in another
        country to afford, or too low-priced in the former country for porudction
        when made in the latter countr (Chinese workers getting paid $2 an hour at
        the official exchange rate, turn out products which sell for less than the
        raw materials would cost in the USA. A $26.00 US dollar hardcover novel,
        costs most of two days' work in China, before taxes, as opposed to rather
        less than a day in the USA. The same CD priced in rupees, is a fraction
        of the price priced in US dollars when priced according to the official
        exchange rate....

        Currency rate imbalances and other exchange rate differentials, cause "gray
        markets."

        Another factor is censorshop and control, the reason why copyright went to
        life plus 70 years--two and a third generations--is because Disney
        greediness and German determination for Mein Kampf to NEVER be legally
        available in German in Germany, coincided.

        John Scalzi at Boskone on copyright, "My greatgrandchildren need to get a
        job. [They shouldn't live off royalties from my books.]"

        -----Original Message-----
        From: HBrown9628@...
        Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2012 4:47 AM
        To: Flewelling@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: Re: [Flewelling] amazon, kindle, and me, a sad tale

        Ok now Im getting increasingly cross, the discussion on amazon uk's forums
        seems to suggest its because digital books are classified as software
        rather than books, hence of course us being taxed on ebooks when books are
        vat
        free etc. And that we are region locked as ITunes is, now what I need to
        know is can people from countries outside the US who dont have publisher
        deals
        for Lynn's books, Germany does so have to exclude them from this, anyway
        can people who this applies to purchase ebooks from countries other than
        their own or not?

        Helen

        In a message dated 04/04/2012 08:09:30 GMT Daylight Time,
        HBrown9628@... writes:

        Well it used to be possible to switch back and forth but only if you
        already had a .com account previously, if you try now you have to enter a
        new US
        address instead of your UK one and I don't want to do that as I'm ordering
        from Amazon UK all the time for little things.

        And don't worry I'm not tempted to go the dark and dodgy route, to honest
        for my own good, but it is ironic that that's the only way apparently to
        get
        the ebooks here.

        Oh well, I just have to hope that amazon get casket of souls with enough
        stock to send me a copy near release date this year.

        Oh well I shall continue my whining with amazon on their website, and
        maybe
        someone will get off their backside and sort this out for us :-).



        Helen

        In a message dated 04/04/2012 04:54:52 GMT Daylight Time,
        _x0x0x.mana.matin.mignon@..._
        (mailto:x0x0x.mana.matin.mignon@...) writes:

        Yup, that's pretty much it.

        Is it that much of an issue if you move your account to amazon.com (does
        that option even exists) and leave it there? Because at this point it's
        the only paying option I see (never pay anyone for unofficial stuff,
        chances are your money will go to fund other much worse illegal
        activities).
      • Alexandra
        No way to test for me. When I bought that kindle book in .com they weren´t selling kindles in europe. And the account is now migrated to .es and it always
        Message 3 of 16 , Apr 4, 2012
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          No way to test for me. When I bought that kindle book in .com they weren�t
          selling kindles in europe. And the account is now migrated to .es and it
          always redirects me there because all my amazon accounts use the same email.

          About taxes for books, in Spain are considered culture, so they get a 4%
          VAT. But ebooks were apparently not books, and they were taxed 16% (now
          that would be 18%).

          But I just read that the EU decided to set VAT for ebooks to same as normal
          books. So it should be 4% (not sure it is).
          UK is not in the union under the same regime as most other contries. So, no
          idea. But it would be crazy if you still were paying normal taxes and that
          was what is preventing you from getting the books from USA AND EU.

          About exchange rate, that has no effect. Amazon charges your card in the
          coin you buy it. And it's up to you, your bank and the credit card company
          to calculate what they'll charge you.

          On Wed, Apr 4, 2012 at 10:47 AM, <HBrown9628@...> wrote:

          > **
          >
          >
          > Ok now Im getting increasingly cross, the discussion on amazon uk's forums
          > seems to suggest its because digital books are classified as software
          > rather than books, hence of course us being taxed on ebooks when books are
          > vat
          > free etc. And that we are region locked as ITunes is, now what I need to
          > know is can people from countries outside the US who dont have publisher
          > deals
          > for Lynn's books, Germany does so have to exclude them from this, anyway
          > can people who this applies to purchase ebooks from countries other than
          > their own or not?
          >
          > Helen
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > In a message dated 04/04/2012 08:09:30 GMT Daylight Time,
          > HBrown9628@... writes:
          >
          > Well it used to be possible to switch back and forth but only if you
          > already had a .com account previously, if you try now you have to enter a
          > new US
          > address instead of your UK one and I don't want to do that as I'm ordering
          > from Amazon UK all the time for little things.
          >
          > And don't worry I'm not tempted to go the dark and dodgy route, to honest
          > for my own good, but it is ironic that that's the only way apparently to
          > get
          > the ebooks here.
          >
          > Oh well, I just have to hope that amazon get casket of souls with enough
          > stock to send me a copy near release date this year.
          >
          > Oh well I shall continue my whining with amazon on their website, and
          > maybe
          > someone will get off their backside and sort this out for us :-).
          >
          > Helen
          >
          > In a message dated 04/04/2012 04:54:52 GMT Daylight Time,
          > _x0x0x.mana.matin.mignon@..._
          > (mailto:x0x0x.mana.matin.mignon@...) writes:
          >
          > Yup, that's pretty much it.
          >
          > Is it that much of an issue if you move your account to amazon.com (does
          > that option even exists) and leave it there? Because at this point it's
          > the only paying option I see (never pay anyone for unofficial stuff,
          > chances are your money will go to fund other much worse illegal
          > activities).
          >
          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          >
          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          >
          >
          >



          --
          Alexandra.


          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • HBrown9628@aol.com
          vat is 0% on books here, but 20% ouch on everything else, so ebooks take a big hit. If vat on ebooks is going to be equalized hopefully that will apply to the
          Message 4 of 16 , Apr 4, 2012
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            vat is 0% on books here, but 20% ouch on everything else, so ebooks take a
            big hit. If vat on ebooks is going to be equalized hopefully that will
            apply to the UK to, you never know lol with this lot we have in Government at
            the moment.

            Anyway I found something to do with the money I had sitting in the bank to
            buy Lynn's Kindle editions... Im so sorry Lynn :-(, but I really want
            these as well for my Kindle and they're available :-(. The Harry Potter ebooks
            are on Pottermore at £38 for the set. Now I'm not entirely sure this is
            fair on the online retailers, let alone the paper bookstores but they have
            implemented the idea very well. Purchase price includes epub edition, Kindle
            edition, can dl them up to 8 times on different devices and you can link
            the books to your normal book cloud service, so I can back mine up on Amazon.
            It works on Nook backup to and a few others. That was one thing I was
            worried about but they have it covered. Obviously vast quantities of money and
            clout with people means this region locking nonsense can be got round :-(.

            Helen




            In a message dated 04/04/2012 10:53:58 GMT Daylight Time,
            x0x0x.mana.matin.mignon@... writes:

            No way to test for me. When I bought that kindle book in .com they weren´t
            selling kindles in europe. And the account is now migrated to .es and it
            always redirects me there because all my amazon accounts use the same
            email.

            About taxes for books, in Spain are considered culture, so they get a 4%
            VAT. But ebooks were apparently not books, and they were taxed 16% (now
            that would be 18%).

            But I just read that the EU decided to set VAT for ebooks to same as normal
            books. So it should be 4% (not sure it is).
            UK is not in the union under the same regime as most other contries. So, no
            idea. But it would be crazy if you still were paying normal taxes and that
            was what is preventing you from getting the books from USA AND EU.

            About exchange rate, that has no effect. Amazon charges your card in the
            coin you buy it. And it's up to you, your bank and the credit card company
            to calculate what they'll charge you.




            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • Paula Lieberman
            Publishers don t want someone buying the $1.00 edition from low-wages country instead of the $15.00 edition from the high wages country... the publisher gets a
            Message 5 of 16 , Apr 4, 2012
            • 0 Attachment
              Publishers don't want someone buying the $1.00 edition from low-wages
              country instead of the $15.00 edition from the high wages country... the
              publisher gets a LOT less money.

              -----Original Message-----
              From: Alexandra
              Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2012 5:53 AM
              To: Flewelling@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: Re: [Flewelling] amazon, kindle, and me, a sad tale

              No way to test for me. When I bought that kindle book in .com they weren´t
              selling kindles in europe. And the account is now migrated to .es and it
              always redirects me there because all my amazon accounts use the same email.

              About taxes for books, in Spain are considered culture, so they get a 4%
              VAT. But ebooks were apparently not books, and they were taxed 16% (now
              that would be 18%).

              But I just read that the EU decided to set VAT for ebooks to same as normal
              books. So it should be 4% (not sure it is).
              UK is not in the union under the same regime as most other contries. So, no
              idea. But it would be crazy if you still were paying normal taxes and that
              was what is preventing you from getting the books from USA AND EU.

              About exchange rate, that has no effect. Amazon charges your card in the
              coin you buy it. And it's up to you, your bank and the credit card company
              to calculate what they'll charge you.

              On Wed, Apr 4, 2012 at 10:47 AM, <HBrown9628@...> wrote:

              > **
              >
              >
              > Ok now Im getting increasingly cross, the discussion on amazon uk's forums
              > seems to suggest its because digital books are classified as software
              > rather than books, hence of course us being taxed on ebooks when books are
              > vat
              > free etc. And that we are region locked as ITunes is, now what I need to
              > know is can people from countries outside the US who dont have publisher
              > deals
              > for Lynn's books, Germany does so have to exclude them from this, anyway
              > can people who this applies to purchase ebooks from countries other than
              > their own or not?
              >
              > Helen
              >
              > In a message dated 04/04/2012 08:09:30 GMT Daylight Time,
              > HBrown9628@... writes:
              >
              > Well it used to be possible to switch back and forth but only if you
              > already had a .com account previously, if you try now you have to enter a
              > new US
              > address instead of your UK one and I don't want to do that as I'm ordering
              > from Amazon UK all the time for little things.
              >
              > And don't worry I'm not tempted to go the dark and dodgy route, to honest
              > for my own good, but it is ironic that that's the only way apparently to
              > get
              > the ebooks here.
              >
              > Oh well, I just have to hope that amazon get casket of souls with enough
              > stock to send me a copy near release date this year.
              >
              > Oh well I shall continue my whining with amazon on their website, and
              > maybe
              > someone will get off their backside and sort this out for us :-).
              >
              > Helen
              >
              > In a message dated 04/04/2012 04:54:52 GMT Daylight Time,
              > _x0x0x.mana.matin.mignon@..._
              > (mailto:x0x0x.mana.matin.mignon@...) writes:
              >
              > Yup, that's pretty much it.
              >
              > Is it that much of an issue if you move your account to amazon.com (does
              > that option even exists) and leave it there? Because at this point it's
              > the only paying option I see (never pay anyone for unofficial stuff,
              > chances are your money will go to fund other much worse illegal
              > activities).
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