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OT:Anime question

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  • wessyx
    Quote Sounds like a lot of the anime I ve seen. What anime are you referring to? Are there any shown on tv that you can recommend and are the relationship
    Message 1 of 6 , Jun 11, 2004
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      Quote
      "Sounds like a lot of the anime I've seen."


      What anime are you referring to? Are there any shown
      on tv that you can recommend and are the relationship
      obvious or do you have to read between the lines?
      Anyone with any sort of info, please answer.

      W.






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    • lynn_flewelling
      ... The ones I was thinking of for that comment will *never* be shown on most tv stations, at least in the US. Over the past year I went from watching no anime
      Message 2 of 6 , Jun 11, 2004
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        --- In Flewelling@yahoogroups.com, wessyx <wessyx@y...> wrote:
        > Quote
        > "Sounds like a lot of the anime I've seen."
        >
        >
        > What anime are you referring to? Are there any shown
        > on tv that you can recommend and are the relationship
        > obvious or do you have to read between the lines?
        > Anyone with any sort of info, please answer.
        >
        > W.

        The ones I was thinking of for that comment will *never* be shown on most tv
        stations, at least in the US.

        Over the past year I went from watching no anime whatsoever to positively
        immersing myself in it, for a variety of reasons, including some conventions I
        was going to where there was a large fan contingent for anime and all things
        Japanese. I've also been aware over the years of a lot of crossover from that
        fandom to my work, so I thought I better see what the heck it was all about.

        The G to PG-13 rated anime you might see on television that I would
        recommend include the following, You can find more detail online and at
        Amazon, if interested:

        Trigun (the gateway drug my son hooked me on)
        Cowboy Bebop
        Wolf's Rain (currently running on the Cartoon Network late Saturday nights)
        Witch Hunter Robin
        Gundam Wing (One of the earlier great "Boys fighting in giant robotic suits"
        franchises, and surprisingly complex and watchable.)
        Inuyasha
        Mirage of Blaze
        Blue Gender (Not what you think! Tsk Tsk. It's about people fighting giant
        bugs.)


        I watched other shows and have others I'd like to see if I can rent them, but
        these are ones I thought were the strongest. My main complaint with most of
        them, with the possible exception of Trigun, Mirage of Blaze, and Inyasha, are
        that they have some great ideas and could be wonderful story lines, but not
        enough emphasis is given to plot. Sometimse this is because they are based
        on a graphic novel, and are only partial tellings. In other cases, I think the
        writing is just plain weak, or they expect the audience to fill in a heck of a lot
        more detail than I wanted to. Even Bebop, which is quite wonderful at times,
        suffers from this. Bebop, Robin, and Wolf's Rain are done by the same
        companies and have amazing artwork.

        On the other hand, Inuyasha and Mirage both draw heavily on Japanese
        history and myth. I don't know enough about that to tell you if it's well done or
        not, but I found it very interesting. Jo Sherman, who's a professional folklorist
        when she isn't singing show tunes at conventions, is a huge Inuyasha fan for
        that reason. There's another show called Rouoni Kenshin that's supposed to
        be along those lines, but I couldn't get into that one.

        The English voice acting in these shows is good, too. Watch enough of this
        stuff and you begin to recognize voices from one show to another. And then
        your brain melts and runs out your nose.

        Just kidding.

        Mostly.

        I do seem to have an ear for voices and am the only person I know who can
        name more than a handful of voice actors. Hey, we all have to be good at
        something, right?

        The anime I was referring to in the above quoted comment contain "adult
        material", often graphic, and often poorly done or just silly. Much of it is yaoi,
        or gay content, which, as you might guess, was not a problem for me per se,
        but consider yourselves warned regarding overall quality. The opinions that
        follow are just my own and only a matter of personal taste.


        For light sexual content:

        Yami No Matsuei, or The Descendents of Darkness. Silly to the extreme at
        times, but fun, too, and I like the premis-- cute, sharply dressed dead guys
        who work in a bureaucracy, managing the souls of the dead. It's sort of anime
        noir, but with talking chicken librarians. Oi! But the music is great.


        Fake (it's very famous and popular, but I thought it was awful. Poor script, bad
        art, horrible character interaction, terrible voice acting, etc.) The graphic
        novels may be better.

        Mirage of Blaze--the yaoi is subtle but there. Interesting sometimes, but takes
        on a certain Scooby Doo cadence in early episodes. Confusing at times for
        those of us who don't know Japanese history, and features more hard-to-
        pronounce-and-remember names than Traitor's Moon, but still quite
        interesting.

        Weiss Kreuss or trans. Knight Hunters--Promising, but ultimately
        disappointing. Most fans of the genre do not agree with me, but I have this
        thing about plot, remember. Too silly for words.

        Angel Sanctuary. Also a too brief encapsulation of longer print works. This is
        the first of this kind I saw and the artwork and music are pretty impressive.
        There are themes of incest, as well as homosexuality.


        The following are more hardcore, feature "graphic" sex, but in anime terms,
        that becomse a bit surreal. "Private parts" are either not shown at all, or
        rendered as cones of light. Don't ask me why: I have no idea. Oh, and
        women's breasts are exempt, btw. And men usually don't have nipples.
        Fascinating!

        In my defense this was all research into the genre, and things fans had
        recommended or mentioned in comparison to my work. That's my story and
        I'm sticking to it:

        Ai No Kusabi. This one is a legend and I saw a bad VCD copy of it. A three
        episode attempt to encapsulate a multibook series of best selling dark
        Japanese SF novels. The novels are probably good. The anime is confusing
        and the artwork pretty crude. And I hate tragic endings. There, you're warned.

        Boku no Sexual Harassment. Another legend of the genre. This one only just
        got released with an English translation--which I haven't seen, but as I was
        told before watching the all-Japanese version, there's so much sex you really
        don't need a translator. It's a comedy, I think, about a guy sleeping his way to
        the top of some company, but basically it's pretty silly. Better than average
        artwork, though.

        Level C. Another totally implausable reason to get two handsome men
        together, but it's good hearted, at least.




        None of these were particularly memorable, but as I said, I have this thing for
        plot and most anime of any stripe lets me down that way. The attitudes
        toward sex in the more sexually focused ones is rather odd, usually highly
        structured for a simplistic "top/bottom" dynamic, and features a lot of
        interactions that tend to span the spectrum from "not politically correct" to
        downright disturbing.

        Another arugument I have with a lot of anime is the age discrepancy.
        Characters said to be 16 or younger have the life experience or fighting ability
        of seasoned adults. Even characters who look older are said to be very
        young. From an American prespecitive, or maybe an old fart American with
        kids perspective, there is some underage sexuality that sometimes makes me
        squeamish.

        End of yaoi stuff.

        'All that being said, if you want one shining, superfine, Cadillac and caviar
        example of anime at its best, rent "Spirited Away" which is superb. Again, the
        plot won't win any Pulitzers but it's not bad and the visual feast and music
        more than pick up the slack.

        Lynn















        I've watched a lot. Those are the ones I found truly watchable.
      • MichaelDAnders@aol.com
        ... Mirage of Blaze, is wickedly complex and a total of 40 novels, not manga but novels. The yaoi relationship is actually one of the central themes but is
        Message 3 of 6 , Jun 11, 2004
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          ::Pokes out from beneath the lurker rock for half a moment::

          Mirage of Blaze, is wickedly complex and a total of 40 novels, not manga but
          novels. The yaoi relationship is actually one of the central themes but is
          such a tortured relationship that they couldn't tell it in one 13 episode arc
          for the anime so the edit they gave it was actually a relief almost, compared to
          how they could have left viewers hanging.




          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Tatianna G
          Hi everyone, I popped in because we are having a small lull at work, now I m sure we ll be slammed.... The thing with privates is that in Japan it is against
          Message 4 of 6 , Jun 11, 2004
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            Hi everyone, I popped in because we are having a small lull at work, now I'm sure we'll be slammed....

            The thing with privates is that in Japan it is against the law to show pubic hair of any level. That is why most of the anime heroines look twelve. Another thing is that they use the cones of light or the pixalation process because it is also not allowed to show penetration...

            AND...

            If you think our little puritanical nut jobs over here are afraid of anything even remotely homo erotic they have nothing on our Japanese friends. I was explained that by an ex-pat who moved to Miami from Tokyo

            lynn_flewelling <otterdance2@...> wrote:
            --- In Flewelling@yahoogroups.com, wessyx <wessyx@y...> wrote:
            > Quote
            > "Sounds like a lot of the anime I've seen."
            >
            >
            > What anime are you referring to? Are there any shown
            > on tv that you can recommend and are the relationship
            > obvious or do you have to read between the lines?
            > Anyone with any sort of info, please answer.
            >
            > W.

            The ones I was thinking of for that comment will *never* be shown on most tv
            stations, at least in the US.

            Over the past year I went from watching no anime whatsoever to positively
            immersing myself in it, for a variety of reasons, including some conventions I
            was going to where there was a large fan contingent for anime and all things
            Japanese. I've also been aware over the years of a lot of crossover from that
            fandom to my work, so I thought I better see what the heck it was all about.

            The G to PG-13 rated anime you might see on television that I would
            recommend include the following, You can find more detail online and at
            Amazon, if interested:

            Trigun (the gateway drug my son hooked me on)
            Cowboy Bebop
            Wolf's Rain (currently running on the Cartoon Network late Saturday nights)
            Witch Hunter Robin
            Gundam Wing (One of the earlier great "Boys fighting in giant robotic suits"
            franchises, and surprisingly complex and watchable.)
            Inuyasha
            Mirage of Blaze
            Blue Gender (Not what you think! Tsk Tsk. It's about people fighting giant
            bugs.)


            I watched other shows and have others I'd like to see if I can rent them, but
            these are ones I thought were the strongest. My main complaint with most of
            them, with the possible exception of Trigun, Mirage of Blaze, and Inyasha, are
            that they have some great ideas and could be wonderful story lines, but not
            enough emphasis is given to plot. Sometimse this is because they are based
            on a graphic novel, and are only partial tellings. In other cases, I think the
            writing is just plain weak, or they expect the audience to fill in a heck of a lot
            more detail than I wanted to. Even Bebop, which is quite wonderful at times,
            suffers from this. Bebop, Robin, and Wolf's Rain are done by the same
            companies and have amazing artwork.

            On the other hand, Inuyasha and Mirage both draw heavily on Japanese
            history and myth. I don't know enough about that to tell you if it's well done or
            not, but I found it very interesting. Jo Sherman, who's a professional folklorist
            when she isn't singing show tunes at conventions, is a huge Inuyasha fan for
            that reason. There's another show called Rouoni Kenshin that's supposed to
            be along those lines, but I couldn't get into that one.

            The English voice acting in these shows is good, too. Watch enough of this
            stuff and you begin to recognize voices from one show to another. And then
            your brain melts and runs out your nose.

            Just kidding.

            Mostly.

            I do seem to have an ear for voices and am the only person I know who can
            name more than a handful of voice actors. Hey, we all have to be good at
            something, right?

            The anime I was referring to in the above quoted comment contain "adult
            material", often graphic, and often poorly done or just silly. Much of it is yaoi,
            or gay content, which, as you might guess, was not a problem for me per se,
            but consider yourselves warned regarding overall quality. The opinions that
            follow are just my own and only a matter of personal taste.


            For light sexual content:

            Yami No Matsuei, or The Descendents of Darkness. Silly to the extreme at
            times, but fun, too, and I like the premis-- cute, sharply dressed dead guys
            who work in a bureaucracy, managing the souls of the dead. It's sort of anime
            noir, but with talking chicken librarians. Oi! But the music is great.


            Fake (it's very famous and popular, but I thought it was awful. Poor script, bad
            art, horrible character interaction, terrible voice acting, etc.) The graphic
            novels may be better.

            Mirage of Blaze--the yaoi is subtle but there. Interesting sometimes, but takes
            on a certain Scooby Doo cadence in early episodes. Confusing at times for
            those of us who don't know Japanese history, and features more hard-to-
            pronounce-and-remember names than Traitor's Moon, but still quite
            interesting.

            Weiss Kreuss or trans. Knight Hunters--Promising, but ultimately
            disappointing. Most fans of the genre do not agree with me, but I have this
            thing about plot, remember. Too silly for words.

            Angel Sanctuary. Also a too brief encapsulation of longer print works. This is
            the first of this kind I saw and the artwork and music are pretty impressive.
            There are themes of incest, as well as homosexuality.


            The following are more hardcore, feature "graphic" sex, but in anime terms,
            that becomse a bit surreal. "Private parts" are either not shown at all, or
            rendered as cones of light. Don't ask me why: I have no idea. Oh, and
            women's breasts are exempt, btw. And men usually don't have nipples.
            Fascinating!

            In my defense this was all research into the genre, and things fans had
            recommended or mentioned in comparison to my work. That's my story and
            I'm sticking to it:

            Ai No Kusabi. This one is a legend and I saw a bad VCD copy of it. A three
            episode attempt to encapsulate a multibook series of best selling dark
            Japanese SF novels. The novels are probably good. The anime is confusing
            and the artwork pretty crude. And I hate tragic endings. There, you're warned.

            Boku no Sexual Harassment. Another legend of the genre. This one only just
            got released with an English translation--which I haven't seen, but as I was
            told before watching the all-Japanese version, there's so much sex you really
            don't need a translator. It's a comedy, I think, about a guy sleeping his way to
            the top of some company, but basically it's pretty silly. Better than average
            artwork, though.

            Level C. Another totally implausable reason to get two handsome men
            together, but it's good hearted, at least.




            None of these were particularly memorable, but as I said, I have this thing for
            plot and most anime of any stripe lets me down that way. The attitudes
            toward sex in the more sexually focused ones is rather odd, usually highly
            structured for a simplistic "top/bottom" dynamic, and features a lot of
            interactions that tend to span the spectrum from "not politically correct" to
            downright disturbing.

            Another arugument I have with a lot of anime is the age discrepancy.
            Characters said to be 16 or younger have the life experience or fighting ability
            of seasoned adults. Even characters who look older are said to be very
            young. From an American prespecitive, or maybe an old fart American with
            kids perspective, there is some underage sexuality that sometimes makes me
            squeamish.

            End of yaoi stuff.

            'All that being said, if you want one shining, superfine, Cadillac and caviar
            example of anime at its best, rent "Spirited Away" which is superb. Again, the
            plot won't win any Pulitzers but it's not bad and the visual feast and music
            more than pick up the slack.

            Lynn















            I've watched a lot. Those are the ones I found truly watchable.



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          • janet dudley
            My 2cents on the topic of Yaoi. If you re interested in more graphic yaoi, but only want to dip a toe in the water, I recommend looking up scanlations of
            Message 5 of 6 , Jun 12, 2004
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              My 2cents on the topic of Yaoi.

              If you're interested in more graphic yaoi, but only want to dip a toe in the water, I recommend looking up scanlations of original short-story yaoi manga on shi-ran.net . Very graphic, but some artists have very interesting ideas and artwork. I suggest Naono Boura's work.

              Janet Dudley- also Fault.



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              Sluggy.Net: The Sluggy Freelance Community!


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            • Minako
              ... From: lynn_flewelling ... nights) Liked it but the end was less good than expected. ... suits ... OOOOOh try Gundam Seed. I
              Message 6 of 6 , Jun 15, 2004
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                ----- Original Message -----
                From: "lynn_flewelling" <otterdance2@...>

                > Wolf's Rain (currently running on the Cartoon Network late Saturday
                nights)
                Liked it but the end was less good than expected.

                > Gundam Wing (One of the earlier great "Boys fighting in giant robotic
                suits"
                > franchises, and surprisingly complex and watchable.)
                OOOOOh try Gundam Seed. I never liked Gundam series but I´m adicted to
                Seed. We almost held a party at job because in October the 2nd series are
                comming out in Japan. Thought it does contains a huge amount of references
                to the war that americans may or may not apreciate if they notice the
                criticism under it all.

                > Fake (it's very famous and popular, but I thought it was awful. Poor
                script, bad
                > art, horrible character interaction, terrible voice acting, etc.) The
                graphic
                > novels may be better.
                The manga is... hum, acceptable. But I still don´t see what´s so great
                about it. It´s being published in France and bought the 1st book.

                > Angel Sanctuary. Also a too brief encapsulation of longer print works.
                This is
                > the first of this kind I saw and the artwork and music are pretty
                impressive.
                > There are themes of incest, as well as homosexuality.
                I LOOOVE this series. The art is absolutly amazing. It help that many of
                the aesthetics comes from a genre of japanese music a I adore.

                > Ai No Kusabi. This one is a legend and I saw a bad VCD copy of it. A
                three
                > episode attempt to encapsulate a multibook series of best selling dark
                > Japanese SF novels. The novels are probably good. The anime is confusing
                > and the artwork pretty crude. And I hate tragic endings. There, you're
                warned.
                I love this anime. And I´ve been wishing for the novels to be translated
                for years. Somebody started the project but never got past the first pages.
                The whole thing seems to be based in the conflict between the two
                characters. Someone who is a natural leader and fighter forced into
                submission and fighting the relationshipo even if anyone can see he´s as in
                love with Iason as one can get. And then Iason, someone who is supposed to
                be cold and uncaring pushing everything to the limit to have as a slave
                someone not suited to be a slave. He does everything he is not suppoosed to
                do just because he is in love (in his own twisted way). First time I heard
                about it I loved it and once I saw it I was even more in love. I just wish I
                could read the novels... the anime is too short to be able to show anything.

                Similar things happens to ZetsuAi, the Anime is the worse thing ever, the
                story is not great but it´s simmilar to the plot of Ai no Kusabi. Problem?
                You can´t resume 5 books of angst in 45 minutes. Oh and the Author is
                totally crazy, the manga is still going on but it hardly makes sense
                anymore.


                > Boku no Sexual Harassment. Another legend of the genre. This one only just
                >_<; Talk about crude and plainly disgusting. The only anime tape ever
                published in Spain. It´s probably the worse thing I´ve seen. If you haven´t
                seen it try to remain like that, you´ll be a lot happier.

                > None of these were particularly memorable, but as I said, I have this
                thing for
                Yaoi seems to have a massive lack of plot.

                > Another arugument I have with a lot of anime is the age discrepancy.
                Well, I think that´s the japanesse and thei fetish for underaged sex. Uke
                is many times that silly little guy childish in the extreme abused by the
                big evil seme. He may not be underaged but he looks like he is.

                Oh, yes, I forgot the part you said about genitalia. It´s because of the
                censure, Genitalia is forbidden to be showed, so they´ve come to be the
                masters of censuring without reallly censuring. That´s why there are odd
                shafts of lights and things like that.

                > Lynn

                Minako.
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