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Re: [FlashLite] Flash lite 1 or 2 for development

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  • leocrawf stewart
    Though it more tedious iam sticking 1.0 until 2.0 starts shipping. ... -- ...men are that they might have joy. Nephi
    Message 1 of 14 , Jan 3, 2006
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      Though it more tedious iam sticking 1.0 until 2.0 starts shipping.

      On 1/3/06, David Williams <dapwilliams83@... > wrote:
      I'm sticking with 1.1 development for that reason. The whole point for me is to sell apps, and 1.1 hasn't even hit the markets yet so there's no point in 2 for at least six months. It seems like forever but hopefully this next six months, maybe after the Nokia comp, we may see some decent numbers of phones with Flash installed.

      On 03/01/06, leocrawf stewart < leocrawf@...> wrote:
      I wanted to know what you all thaught. I know that most of you(if not all) are excited about the flashlite 2 player. Easier development. Better feature set, so forth. But in terms of marketabiliy does it make more sence to  develop for flashlite1. Seeing that the players are just touching the market preinstalled in some phones? Any thoughts?

      --
      "...men are that they might have joy."
      Nephi

      SPONSORED LINKS
      Macromedia flash trainingMacromedia flashMacromedia flash mx
      Macromedia flash tutorialsMacromedia flash mx 2004Learn macromedia flash


      YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS






      --

      David WIlliams
      ....................................................
      http://www.chatebot.blogspot.com
      http://www.mobile.chatebot.com
      http://www.flashlite4mobile.com
      http://www.freegames.media-fix.co.uk


      YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS






      --
      "...men are that they might have joy."
      Nephi
    • Michael Hansen
      Any of you guys wondered why Adobe is consistently refusing to share info. on vendor adoption / deals / release dates? I can think of several scenarios, but
      Message 2 of 14 , Jan 3, 2006
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        Any of you guys wondered why Adobe is consistently refusing to share info. on vendor adoption / deals / release dates? I can think of several scenarios, but none that I like.

        By not sharing this info. Adobe is making starting a company based on their products a _very_ high stake game imo.

        Any thoughts?

        cheers


         -michael






        On 1/3/06, leocrawf stewart <leocrawf@... > wrote:
        Though it more tedious iam sticking 1.0 until 2.0 starts shipping.


        On 1/3/06, David Williams < dapwilliams83@... > wrote:
        I'm sticking with 1.1 development for that reason. The whole point for me is to sell apps, and 1.1 hasn't even hit the markets yet so there's no point in 2 for at least six months. It seems like forever but hopefully this next six months, maybe after the Nokia comp, we may see some decent numbers of phones with Flash installed.

        On 03/01/06, leocrawf stewart < leocrawf@...> wrote:
        I wanted to know what you all thaught. I know that most of you(if not all) are excited about the flashlite 2 player. Easier development. Better feature set, so forth. But in terms of marketabiliy does it make more sence to  develop for flashlite1. Seeing that the players are just touching the market preinstalled in some phones? Any thoughts?

        --
        "...men are that they might have joy."
        Nephi

        SPONSORED LINKS
        Macromedia flash trainingMacromedia flashMacromedia flash mx
        Macromedia flash tutorialsMacromedia flash mx 2004Learn macromedia flash


        YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS






        --

        David WIlliams
        ....................................................
        http://www.chatebot.blogspot.com
        http://www.mobile.chatebot.com
        http://www.flashlite4mobile.com
        http://www.freegames.media-fix.co.uk


        YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS






        --
        "...men are that they might have joy."
        Nephi

        YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS




      • David Williams
        How do you mean, a distribution company for flash lite? The Qualcomm agreement alows them to create some sort of distribution via Brew, and obviously the
        Message 3 of 14 , Jan 3, 2006
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          How do you mean, a distribution company for flash lite? The Qualcomm agreement alows them to create some sort of distribution via Brew, and obviously the competition with Nokia for flash lite is to create a catalogue of the best apps Nokia might want to sell.

          On 03/01/06, Michael Hansen <borendex@...> wrote:
          Any of you guys wondered why Adobe is consistently refusing to share info. on vendor adoption / deals / release dates? I can think of several scenarios, but none that I like.

          By not sharing this info. Adobe is making starting a company based on their products a _very_ high stake game imo.

          Any thoughts?

          cheers


           -michael







          On 1/3/06, leocrawf stewart <leocrawf@... > wrote:
          Though it more tedious iam sticking 1.0 until 2.0 starts shipping.


          On 1/3/06, David Williams < dapwilliams83@... > wrote:
          I'm sticking with 1.1 development for that reason. The whole point for me is to sell apps, and 1.1 hasn't even hit the markets yet so there's no point in 2 for at least six months. It seems like forever but hopefully this next six months, maybe after the Nokia comp, we may see some decent numbers of phones with Flash installed.

          On 03/01/06, leocrawf stewart < leocrawf@... > wrote:
          I wanted to know what you all thaught. I know that most of you(if not all) are excited about the flashlite 2 player. Easier development. Better feature set, so forth. But in terms of marketabiliy does it make more sence to  develop for flashlite1. Seeing that the players are just touching the market preinstalled in some phones? Any thoughts?

          --
          "...men are that they might have joy."
          Nephi

          SPONSORED LINKS
          Macromedia flash training Macromedia flash Macromedia flash mx
          Macromedia flash tutorials Macromedia flash mx 2004 Learn macromedia flash


          YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS






          --

          David WIlliams
          ....................................................
          http://www.chatebot.blogspot.com
          http://www.mobile.chatebot.com
          http://www.flashlite4mobile.com
          http://www.freegames.media-fix.co.uk


          YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS






          --
          "...men are that they might have joy."
          Nephi

          YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS






          SPONSORED LINKS
          Macromedia flash training Macromedia flash Macromedia flash mx
          Macromedia flash tutorials Macromedia flash mx 2004 Learn macromedia flash


          YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS






          --

          David WIlliams
          ....................................................
          http://www.chatebot.blogspot.com
          http://www.mobile.chatebot.com
          http://www.flashlite4mobile.com
          http://www.freegames.media-fix.co.uk
        • Richard Leggett
          Hopefully this helps clear things up a little bit at least: http://www.adobe.com/aboutadobe/pressroom/pressreleases/200601/010306Flash.h tml _____ From:
          Message 4 of 14 , Jan 3, 2006
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            Hopefully this helps clear things up a little bit at least:


            From: FlashLite@yahoogroups.com [mailto:FlashLite@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Michael Hansen
            Sent: 03 January 2006 13:01
            To: FlashLite@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: Re: [FlashLite] Flash lite 1 or 2 for development

            Any of you guys wondered why Adobe is consistently refusing to share info. on vendor adoption / deals / release dates? I can think of several scenarios, but none that I like.

            By not sharing this info. Adobe is making starting a company based on their products a _very_ high stake game imo.

            Any thoughts?

            cheers


             -michael






            On 1/3/06, leocrawf stewart <leocrawf@... > wrote:
            Though it more tedious iam sticking 1.0 until 2.0 starts shipping.


            On 1/3/06, David Williams < dapwilliams83@... > wrote:
            I'm sticking with 1.1 development for that reason. The whole point for me is to sell apps, and 1.1 hasn't even hit the markets yet so there's no point in 2 for at least six months. It seems like forever but hopefully this next six months, maybe after the Nokia comp, we may see some decent numbers of phones with Flash installed.

            On 03/01/06, leocrawf stewart < leocrawf@...> wrote:
            I wanted to know what you all thaught. I know that most of you(if not all) are excited about the flashlite 2 player. Easier development. Better feature set, so forth. But in terms of marketabiliy does it make more sence to  develop for flashlite1. Seeing that the players are just touching the market preinstalled in some phones? Any thoughts?

            --
            "...men are that they might have joy."
            Nephi

            SPONSORED LINKS
            Macromedia flash trainingMacromedia flashMacromedia flash mx
            Macromedia flash tutorialsMacromedia flash mx 2004Learn macromedia flash


            YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS






            --

            David WIlliams
            ....................................................
            http://www.chatebot.blogspot.com
            http://www.mobile.chatebot.com
            http://www.flashlite4mobile.com
            http://www.freegames.media-fix.co.uk


            YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS






            --
            "...men are that they might have joy."
            Nephi

            YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS




          • David Williams
            *Michael , I miss read your post. So ignore last post. I agree it is high risk, and most annoying. Developers seem to be last in line to know anything. I wish
            Message 5 of 14 , Jan 3, 2006
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              Michael , I miss read your post. So ignore last post.
              I agree it is high risk, and most annoying. Developers seem to be last in line to know anything. I wish someone from Adobe would let us know when mobiles of any number will have a player installed. At present it's just a case of sometime in the future Nokia will bring out a phone with the player but they too are keeping news of this a tightly guarded secret.
               
               
              I also wonder about what Adobe(macromedia) plan to do regarding sis or Brew. Obviously Bluesky North have come up with a sis maker, but what if they hadn't. How was Adobe MAcromedia planning to get these apps on phones?


               
              On 03/01/06, David Williams <dapwilliams83@...> wrote:
              How do you mean, a distribution company for flash lite? The Qualcomm agreement alows them to create some sort of distribution via Brew, and obviously the competition with Nokia for flash lite is to create a catalogue of the best apps Nokia might want to sell.


              On 03/01/06, Michael Hansen <borendex@... > wrote:
              Any of you guys wondered why Adobe is consistently refusing to share info. on vendor adoption / deals / release dates? I can think of several scenarios, but none that I like.

              By not sharing this info. Adobe is making starting a company based on their products a _very_ high stake game imo.

              Any thoughts?

              cheers


               -michael







              On 1/3/06, leocrawf stewart <leocrawf@... > wrote:
              Though it more tedious iam sticking 1.0 until 2.0 starts shipping.


              On 1/3/06, David Williams < dapwilliams83@... > wrote:
              I'm sticking with 1.1 development for that reason. The whole point for me is to sell apps, and 1.1 hasn't even hit the markets yet so there's no point in 2 for at least six months. It seems like forever but hopefully this next six months, maybe after the Nokia comp, we may see some decent numbers of phones with Flash installed.

              On 03/01/06, leocrawf stewart < leocrawf@... > wrote:
              I wanted to know what you all thaught. I know that most of you(if not all) are excited about the flashlite 2 player. Easier development. Better feature set, so forth. But in terms of marketabiliy does it make more sence to  develop for flashlite1. Seeing that the players are just touching the market preinstalled in some phones? Any thoughts?

              --
              "...men are that they might have joy."
              Nephi

              SPONSORED LINKS
              Macromedia flash training Macromedia flash Macromedia flash mx
              Macromedia flash tutorials Macromedia flash mx 2004 Learn macromedia flash


              YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS






              --

              David WIlliams
              ....................................................
              http://www.chatebot.blogspot.com
              http://www.mobile.chatebot.com
              http://www.flashlite4mobile.com
              http://www.freegames.media-fix.co.uk


              YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS






              --
              "...men are that they might have joy."
              Nephi

              YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS






              SPONSORED LINKS
              Macromedia flash training Macromedia flash Macromedia flash mx
              Macromedia flash tutorials Macromedia flash mx 2004 Learn macromedia flash


              YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS






              --

              David WIlliams
              ....................................................
              http://www.chatebot.blogspot.com
              http://www.mobile.chatebot.com
              http://www.flashlite4mobile.com
              http://www.freegames.media-fix.co.uk



              --

              David WIlliams
              ....................................................
              http://www.chatebot.blogspot.com
              http://www.mobile.chatebot.com
              http://www.flashlite4mobile.com
              http://www.freegames.media-fix.co.uk
            • David Aaron
              Folks -- I have been doing a bit of background reading into the range of phones and devices that support Flash 1.1 and reviewed the list of phones for the
              Message 6 of 14 , Jan 3, 2006
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                Folks --

                I have been doing a bit of background reading into the range of phones and devices that support Flash 1.1 and reviewed the list of phones for the FlashLite 2.0 development kit. My current interpretation is this this may be an APAC vs. EMEA/Americas thing. I think APAC has an installed base of Flash 1 & 1.1 users with established distribution channels while EMEA and possibly North/South America are later to the game as a market. I think we may be seeing  EMEA/North/South America as the initial entry point for 2.0 while APAC will lag with 1.1  and a slower uptake of 2.0.

                I don't think this is inconsistent with the press release that Richard has cited. My reading of the developer risk is really one of  how many markets do you hope to enter your product into, not which version you want to use. If you want to do APAC as your primary market then I think you develop 1.1 and practice 2.0. If you are interested in EMEA/North/South America you demo now in 1.1 and develop in 2.0. If your market is English speaking you demo now in 1.1 and develop in 2.0.

                One other point worth mentioning, 2.0 is a superset of 1.1 so you could write in detection scripts and load swfs as required for your final product (I think, hope.)

                David

                Richard Leggett wrote:
                Hopefully this helps clear things up a little bit at least:


                From: FlashLite@yahoogroups.com [mailto:FlashLite@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Michael Hansen
                Sent: 03 January 2006 13:01
                To: FlashLite@yahoogroups.com
                Subject: Re: [FlashLite] Flash lite 1 or 2 for development

                Any of you guys wondered why Adobe is consistently refusing to share info. on vendor adoption / deals / release dates? I can think of several scenarios, but none that I like.

                By not sharing this info. Adobe is making starting a company based on their products a _very_ high stake game imo.

                Any thoughts?

                cheers


                 -michael






                On 1/3/06, leocrawf stewart <leocrawf@... > wrote:
                Though it more tedious iam sticking 1.0 until 2.0 starts shipping.


                On 1/3/06, David Williams < dapwilliams83@... > wrote:
                I'm sticking with 1.1 development for that reason. The whole point for me is to sell apps, and 1.1 hasn't even hit the markets yet so there's no point in 2 for at least six months. It seems like forever but hopefully this next six months, maybe after the Nokia comp, we may see some decent numbers of phones with Flash installed.

                On 03/01/06, leocrawf stewart < leocrawf@...> wrote:
                I wanted to know what you all thaught. I know that most of you(if not all) are excited about the flashlite 2 player. Easier development. Better feature set, so forth. But in terms of marketabiliy does it make more sence to  develop for flashlite1. Seeing that the players are just touching the market preinstalled in some phones? Any thoughts?

                --
                "...men are that they might have joy."
                Nephi

                SPONSORED LINKS
                Macromedia flash trainingMacromedia flashMacromedia flash mx
                Macromedia flash tutorialsMacromedia flash mx 2004Learn macromedia flash


                YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS






                --

                David WIlliams
                ....................................................
                http://www.chatebot.blogspot.com
                http://www.mobile.chatebot.com
                http://www.flashlite4mobile.com
                http://www.freegames.media-fix.co.uk


                YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS






                --
                "...men are that they might have joy."
                Nephi

                YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS






                -- 
                David Aaron
                Woofquackmoo.com Ltd
                Planet Zog
                Certified Macromedia Trainer & Developer
                Mobile (44) 7976973451
                Skype name: planetzog
                
              • John Dowdell
                ... I need to check what you re seeking... we can t announce another company s new product cycles... when a vendor does include something and they announce it,
                Message 7 of 14 , Jan 4, 2006
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                  Michael Hansen wrote:
                  > Any of you guys wondered why Adobe is consistently refusing to share info.
                  > on vendor adoption / deals / release dates? I can think of several
                  > scenarios, but none that I like.

                  I need to check what you're seeking... we can't announce another
                  company's new product cycles... when a vendor does include something and
                  they announce it, then it's listed at the Flash Lite site... what is it
                  that you need...?

                  (What David wrote of geographical differences in device evolution is
                  _definitely_ the case, although I think 2006 may be the year when North
                  America catches up with APAC and EMEA.)

                  jd




                  --
                  John Dowdell . Adobe Developer Support . San Francisco CA USA
                  Weblog: http://weblogs.macromedia.com/jd
                  Aggregator: http://weblogs.macromedia.com/mxna
                  Technotes: http://www.macromedia.com/support/
                  Spam killed my private email -- public record is best, thanks.
                • Michael Hansen
                  Thanks for the feedback folks! John, My situation is this: I m doing a start up. We re making a web2.0 product, that utilize RIA (flex2), and the mobile
                  Message 8 of 14 , Jan 4, 2006
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                    Thanks for the feedback folks!

                    John,
                    My situation is this: I'm doing a start up. We're making a web2.0 product, that utilize RIA (flex2), and the mobile platform in some innovative way. Flex2 seems to come along just fine. Impressive stuff!

                    Now my problem is with the mobile part. We have no clue what so ever about potential release dates for e.g. FL2 for different vendors . I think this is vital info. for all those people out there targeting the Adobe platform for a living. Imagine for a second Adobe writing e.g. Photoshop in Java on a promise from Sun that the player would be on all PC "sometime soon". I bet you that management would put a stop to that project pretty damn fast.

                    When I look into the future on this 'issue' I see a big question mark on FL, and that _forces_ me to look for alternatives like e.g. the one Microsoft offers.

                    Now I can appreciate that you can't announce another company's new product cycles, but Adobe could release a listing of expected _device types_ supporting FL1.1 or FL2.0 as a function of time for different regions:

                    Q1-2006 (EMEA)
                    FL1.1: ~2 device types
                    FL2.0: ~0 device types

                    Q2-2006 (EMEA)
                    FL1.1: ~4 device types
                    FL2.0: ~1 device types

                    This will give us an impression of the penetration - something we can work with. Such number will not reveal any confidential information of any company (since they all release devices in a steady stream)

                    I loved Macromedia. I've spoken highly of that company for years, evangelising it to my colleagues, and so forth. I liked the way that Macromedia connected withthe people feeding of their products. Please, help us with some real numbers. I'm looking to fall in love with Adobe also :)

                    cheers

                     -michael


                    On 1/4/06, John Dowdell <jdowdell@...> wrote:
                    Michael Hansen wrote:
                    > Any of you guys wondered why Adobe is consistently refusing to share info.
                    > on vendor adoption / deals / release dates? I can think of several
                    > scenarios, but none that I like.

                    I need to check what you're seeking... we can't announce another
                    company's new product cycles... when a vendor does include something and
                    they announce it, then it's listed at the Flash Lite site... what is it
                    that you need...?

                    (What David wrote of geographical differences in device evolution is
                    _definitely_ the case, although I think 2006 may be the year when North
                    America catches up with APAC and EMEA.)

                    jd




                    --
                    John Dowdell . Adobe Developer Support . San Francisco CA USA
                    Weblog: http://weblogs.macromedia.com/jd
                    Aggregator: http://weblogs.macromedia.com/mxna
                    Technotes: http://www.macromedia.com/support/
                    Spam killed my private email -- public record is best, thanks.



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                  • John Dowdell
                    I was trying to follow Any of you guys wondered why Adobe is consistently refusing to share info, but wound up in something like What s the outlook for Flex
                    Message 9 of 14 , Jan 4, 2006
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                      I was trying to follow "Any of you guys wondered why Adobe is
                      consistently refusing to share info," but wound up in something like
                      "What's the outlook for Flex x.0 on devices?", I think...?

                      If so, then I wouldn't expect to see easy consumer deployment of Flex
                      apps for awhile... to use even old Flex would require new Flash Lite,
                      which was just *released* yesterday, and will take awhile to get
                      embedded. Even then I'm not sure how the component-oriented Flex
                      approach would do on small-memory mobiles. That's a goal, but not a
                      near-term one, if that was the question.

                      (When you speak of Microsoft as competitor, I'd guess you're referring
                      to XAML, which is still a moving target even on the desktop, so I'm not
                      sure....)

                      jd





                      --
                      John Dowdell . Adobe Developer Support . San Francisco CA USA
                      Weblog: http://weblogs.macromedia.com/jd
                      Aggregator: http://weblogs.macromedia.com/mxna
                      Technotes: http://www.macromedia.com/support/
                      Spam killed my private email -- public record is best, thanks.
                    • David Aaron
                      John -- Just a quick question. Wouldn t we need to rewrite all of the classes in Flex 1,1.5 or 2 back to prototype notation if there was any chance for Flex
                      Message 10 of 14 , Jan 4, 2006
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                        John --

                        Just a quick question. Wouldn't we need to rewrite all of the classes in
                        Flex 1,1.5 or 2 back to prototype notation if there was any chance for
                        Flex to work with FlashLite 2.0? I have been trying to thinking about a
                        what a component would be in FlashLite and I don't think we we can even
                        extend UIObject without a major rewrite of UIObject to a mobile edition.
                        Have I missed something?

                        David Aaron

                        John Dowdell wrote:

                        >I was trying to follow "Any of you guys wondered why Adobe is
                        >consistently refusing to share info," but wound up in something like
                        >"What's the outlook for Flex x.0 on devices?", I think...?
                        >
                        >If so, then I wouldn't expect to see easy consumer deployment of Flex
                        >apps for awhile... to use even old Flex would require new Flash Lite,
                        >which was just *released* yesterday, and will take awhile to get
                        >embedded. Even then I'm not sure how the component-oriented Flex
                        >approach would do on small-memory mobiles. That's a goal, but not a
                        >near-term one, if that was the question.
                        >
                        >(When you speak of Microsoft as competitor, I'd guess you're referring
                        >to XAML, which is still a moving target even on the desktop, so I'm not
                        >sure....)
                        >
                        >jd
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >


                        --
                        David Aaron
                        Woofquackmoo.com Ltd
                        Planet Zog
                        Certified Macromedia Trainer & Developer
                        Mobile (44) 7976973451
                        Skype name: planetzog
                      • JesterXL
                        No, ActionScript 2 works in Flash Lite 2. Additionally, prototype works in ActionScript 2 as well, so you can do both. The problem with Flex is the components
                        Message 11 of 14 , Jan 5, 2006
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                          No, ActionScript 2 works in Flash Lite 2. Additionally, prototype works in
                          ActionScript 2 as well, so you can do both.

                          The problem with Flex is the components were not designed to run in such a
                          small memory space. I've managed to get a progress bar from a Flex file to
                          show and run, but cannot load even a button because the LayoutManager,
                          styles, etc. take too much overhead.

                          So, what will have be create is a new component set for Flex that is light
                          enough for mobiles; it has nothing to do with ActionScript 1 or 2.

                          ----- Original Message -----
                          From: "David Aaron" <david.aaron@...>
                          To: <FlashLite@yahoogroups.com>
                          Sent: Thursday, January 05, 2006 2:52 AM
                          Subject: Re: [FlashLite] Flash lite 1 or 2 for development


                          John --

                          Just a quick question. Wouldn't we need to rewrite all of the classes in
                          Flex 1,1.5 or 2 back to prototype notation if there was any chance for
                          Flex to work with FlashLite 2.0? I have been trying to thinking about a
                          what a component would be in FlashLite and I don't think we we can even
                          extend UIObject without a major rewrite of UIObject to a mobile edition.
                          Have I missed something?

                          David Aaron

                          John Dowdell wrote:

                          >I was trying to follow "Any of you guys wondered why Adobe is
                          >consistently refusing to share info," but wound up in something like
                          >"What's the outlook for Flex x.0 on devices?", I think...?
                          >
                          >If so, then I wouldn't expect to see easy consumer deployment of Flex
                          >apps for awhile... to use even old Flex would require new Flash Lite,
                          >which was just *released* yesterday, and will take awhile to get
                          >embedded. Even then I'm not sure how the component-oriented Flex
                          >approach would do on small-memory mobiles. That's a goal, but not a
                          >near-term one, if that was the question.
                          >
                          >(When you speak of Microsoft as competitor, I'd guess you're referring
                          >to XAML, which is still a moving target even on the desktop, so I'm not
                          >sure....)
                          >
                          >jd
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >


                          --
                          David Aaron
                          Woofquackmoo.com Ltd
                          Planet Zog
                          Certified Macromedia Trainer & Developer
                          Mobile (44) 7976973451
                          Skype name: planetzog




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