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Re: Timeworks

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  • RPG Reviews & Columns
    Nothing? Timeworks, a supplement by MARK DIAZ TRUMAN and part of the Kickstarter. No opinions?
    Message 1 of 18 , Jun 12, 2013
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      Nothing? Timeworks, a supplement by MARK DIAZ TRUMAN and part of the Kickstarter. No opinions?

      --- In FateRPG@yahoogroups.com, "RPG Reviews & Columns" <grumpyrpgreviews@...> wrote:
      >
      > Does anyone have any information on "Timeworks" the setting/expansion for FATE? What are your thoughts on the work?
      >
    • gremlin1384
      Brief thoughts: setting felt limiting, but its simplicity could appeal to many. Time travel mechanics were a good way to implement the consequence system in an
      Message 2 of 18 , Jun 12, 2013
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        Brief thoughts: setting felt limiting, but its simplicity could appeal to many. Time travel mechanics were a good way to implement the consequence system in an unusual way, and make "making a change in the timeline" feel appropriately important and mechanically sound. A worthy project, better than Court-Ship or the Ellis Affair, less innovative than No Exit or Wild Blue.

        --- In FateRPG@yahoogroups.com, "RPG Reviews & Columns" <grumpyrpgreviews@...> wrote:
        >
        > Nothing? Timeworks, a supplement by MARK DIAZ TRUMAN and part of the Kickstarter. No opinions?
        >
        > --- In FateRPG@yahoogroups.com, "RPG Reviews & Columns" <grumpyrpgreviews@> wrote:
        > >
        > > Does anyone have any information on "Timeworks" the setting/expansion for FATE? What are your thoughts on the work?
        > >
        >
      • RPG Reviews & Columns
        I not found a copy - can someone provide a link? Thanks.
        Message 3 of 18 , Jun 13, 2013
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          I not found a copy - can someone provide a link? Thanks.

          --- In FateRPG@yahoogroups.com, "gremlin1384" <gremlin1384@...> wrote:
          >
          > Brief thoughts: setting felt limiting, but its simplicity could appeal to many. Time travel mechanics were a good way to implement the consequence system in an unusual way, and make "making a change in the timeline" feel appropriately important and mechanically sound. A worthy project, better than Court-Ship or the Ellis Affair, less innovative than No Exit or Wild Blue.
          >
          > --- In FateRPG@yahoogroups.com, "RPG Reviews & Columns" <grumpyrpgreviews@> wrote:
          > >
          > > Nothing? Timeworks, a supplement by MARK DIAZ TRUMAN and part of the Kickstarter. No opinions?
          > >
          > > --- In FateRPG@yahoogroups.com, "RPG Reviews & Columns" <grumpyrpgreviews@> wrote:
          > > >
          > > > Does anyone have any information on "Timeworks" the setting/expansion for FATE? What are your thoughts on the work?
          > > >
          > >
          >
        • Fred Hicks
          It s part of the Fate Worlds stretch goals from the Kickstarter. It ll be collected in the Fate Worlds two-volume set to be published later this year. On Thu,
          Message 4 of 18 , Jun 13, 2013
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            It's part of the Fate Worlds stretch goals from the Kickstarter. It'll be collected in the Fate Worlds two-volume set to be published later this year.


            On Thu, Jun 13, 2013 at 6:23 PM, RPG Reviews & Columns <grumpyrpgreviews@...> wrote:
            I not found a copy - can someone provide a link? Thanks.

            --- In FateRPG@yahoogroups.com, "gremlin1384" <gremlin1384@...> wrote:
            >
            > Brief thoughts: setting felt limiting, but its simplicity could appeal to many. Time travel mechanics were a good way to implement the consequence system in an unusual way, and make "making a change in the timeline" feel appropriately important and mechanically sound. A worthy project, better than Court-Ship or the Ellis Affair, less innovative than No Exit or Wild Blue.
            >
            > --- In FateRPG@yahoogroups.com, "RPG Reviews & Columns" <grumpyrpgreviews@> wrote:
            > >
            > > Nothing? Timeworks, a supplement by MARK DIAZ TRUMAN and part of the Kickstarter. No opinions?
            > >
            > > --- In FateRPG@yahoogroups.com, "RPG Reviews & Columns" <grumpyrpgreviews@> wrote:
            > > >
            > > > Does anyone have any information on "Timeworks" the setting/expansion for FATE? What are your thoughts on the work?
            > > >
            > >
            >




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          • David Dunham
            I m hoping to start a FATE game (in Philadelphia) soon, and Timeworks seems like a good setting for a campaign that may have sporadic players. I want to start
            Message 5 of 18 , Aug 30, 2013
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              I'm hoping to start a FATE game (in Philadelphia) soon, and Timeworks seems like a good setting for a campaign that may have sporadic players.

              I want to start this as early as next week, so in the interests of saving some thought: what is the default adventure? (In D&D it's the dungeon crawl; in Cthulhu games it's some sort of investigation; in Spirit of the Century it's gorilla ninjas bursting in.) The chapter has a lot of story seeds, but I'm wondering about the best way to structure a session. (Probably the first one is something already researched by the company, but that still leaves a lot open.)

              David Dunham
              Glorantha/HQ/RQ page: www.pensee.com/dunham/glorantha.html
            • afategm
              Going from memory, The basic premise is that timeworks is a company that invented a time machine & gets paid big big bucks to nudge past events in the
              Message 6 of 18 , Aug 30, 2013
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                Going from memory,  The basic premise is that timeworks is a company that invented a time machine & gets paid big big bucks to nudge past events in the customer's favor to retroactively change the timeline while avoiding group of someone/something better equipped & more advanced frowns on that sort of thing from time to time.  The writeup had more details though



                --- In faterpg@yahoogroups.com, <alakoring@...> wrote:

                I'm hoping to start a FATE game (in Philadelphia) soon, and Timeworks seems like a good setting for a campaign that may have sporadic players.

                I want to start this as early as next week, so in the interests of saving some thought: what is the default adventure? (In D&D it's the dungeon crawl; in Cthulhu games it's some sort of investigation; in Spirit of the Century it's gorilla ninjas bursting in.) The chapter has a lot of story seeds, but I'm wondering about the best way to structure a session. (Probably the first one is something already researched by the company, but that still leaves a lot open.)

                David Dunham
                Glorantha/HQ/RQ page: www.pensee.com/dunham/glorantha.html
              • uncledark
                David, What occurs to me is to treat it like a caper film. Remember, the essential plotline of a caper film is: Team of Experts research a target, come up with
                Message 7 of 18 , Aug 31, 2013
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                  David,

                  What occurs to me is to treat it like a caper film. Remember, the essential plotline of a caper film is: Team of Experts research a target, come up with The Perfect Plan, and everything goes perfectly Until Something Goes Wrong. Then the plan is off the rails, and the Team of Experts have to improvise to complete the mission.

                  The administrator at Timeworks gives the PCs an assignment. Let's say, they're assigned to go back and prevent the capture and execution of one of the conspiritors of the Lincoln assassination.

                  You, the GM, do a little research on the assassination. Wikipedia level research is good enough, really. Pick a conspirator, say, Dr. Mudd. make a quick outline of what happened in reality, and give it to the players.

                  Then the characters Do Research. What they players are doing, of course, is Creating Advantages, and giving themselves boosts that they'll use back in history. They're also creating scenario aspects that you, the GM will gleefully use to complicate the mission. Keep track of blown rolls during research, these are the problems they've created for you to use to make things interesting.

                  So they go back in time, and you create scenes around the scenario aspects generated during research. You compel those aspects in unforseen ways.

                  Then, you compel scenario and character aspects in a combination that screws the plan entirely. And sit back and watch the players scramble to save themselves, complete the mission, and not destroy the time-space continuum.

                  Lon Sarver

                   



                  --- In faterpg@yahoogroups.com, <alakoring@...> wrote:

                  I'm hoping to start a FATE game (in Philadelphia) soon, and Timeworks seems like a good setting for a campaign that may have sporadic players.

                  I want to start this as early as next week, so in the interests of saving some thought: what is the default adventure? (In D&D it's the dungeon crawl; in Cthulhu games it's some sort of investigation; in Spirit of the Century it's gorilla ninjas bursting in.) The chapter has a lot of story seeds, but I'm wondering about the best way to structure a session. (Probably the first one is something already researched by the company, but that still leaves a lot open.)

                  David Dunham
                  Glorantha/HQ/RQ page: www.pensee.com/dunham/glorantha.html
                • Jim Montgomery
                  For some reason I think I would go a different direction than traditional time travel stories... For Timeworks, I would consider a couple possible options: -
                  Message 8 of 18 , Aug 31, 2013
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                    For some reason I think I would go a different direction than traditional time travel stories... For Timeworks, I would consider a couple possible options:

                    - Start the characters out in present day, with some key piece of history altered. They remember the original timeline, and HQ sends them back to fix it (Why does HQ want it back? mystery.) Once they get back, they fix it, but pick up enough clues to realize another team of Timeworks agents did the damage... Why did they do it? Mystery.

                    - A client has hired Timeworks (for vast sums of cash) to make some trivial change to the timeline to set themselves up in a much better position in the present. "If only my great grandmother has never fallen down the stairs and become paralyzed..." "If only I knew where my great great great uncle hid the family jewels..." "The missing notes of Dr Katzberger contained the answers I need to complete my research..." The characters go back in time, and either A) encounter Shadow Men who -really- don't want this change to go through, or B) find out that altering this event will have terrible consequences, hopefully with personal meaning. "The maid pushed granny down the stairs because she was a monster about to do something terrible to her kids... only her paralysis kept her from hurting others." "The family jewels were hidden because if they weren't, their existence would start a war." "The notes of Dr Katzberger are related to time travel, what are the ramifications of -that-??"

                    Jim


                    On Sat, Aug 31, 2013 at 2:52 PM, <uncledark@...> wrote:
                     

                    David,

                    What occurs to me is to treat it like a caper film. Remember, the essential plotline of a caper film is: Team of Experts research a target, come up with The Perfect Plan, and everything goes perfectly Until Something Goes Wrong. Then the plan is off the rails, and the Team of Experts have to improvise to complete the mission.

                    The administrator at Timeworks gives the PCs an assignment. Let's say, they're assigned to go back and prevent the capture and execution of one of the conspiritors of the Lincoln assassination.

                    You, the GM, do a little research on the assassination. Wikipedia level research is good enough, really. Pick a conspirator, say, Dr. Mudd. make a quick outline of what happened in reality, and give it to the players.

                    Then the characters Do Research. What they players are doing, of course, is Creating Advantages, and giving themselves boosts that they'll use back in history. They're also creating scenario aspects that you, the GM will gleefully use to complicate the mission. Keep track of blown rolls during research, these are the problems they've created for you to use to make things interesting.

                    So they go back in time, and you create scenes around the scenario aspects generated during research. You compel those aspects in unforseen ways.

                    Then, you compel scenario and character aspects in a combination that screws the plan entirely. And sit back and watch the players scramble to save themselves, complete the mission, and not destroy the time-space continuum.

                    Lon Sarver

                     



                    --- In faterpg@yahoogroups.com, <alakoring@...> wrote:

                    I'm hoping to start a FATE game (in Philadelphia) soon, and Timeworks seems like a good setting for a campaign that may have sporadic players.

                    I want to start this as early as next week, so in the interests of saving some thought: what is the default adventure? (In D&D it's the dungeon crawl; in Cthulhu games it's some sort of investigation; in Spirit of the Century it's gorilla ninjas bursting in.) The chapter has a lot of story seeds, but I'm wondering about the best way to structure a session. (Probably the first one is something already researched by the company, but that still leaves a lot open.)

                    David Dunham
                    Glorantha/HQ/RQ page: www.pensee.com/dunham/glorantha.html


                  • Jonathan Lang
                    That brings up a good point: is Timeworks itself dealigned? Or at least the time machine? That is, is it possible for an agent to get stuck in an alternate
                    Message 9 of 18 , Aug 31, 2013
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                      That brings up a good point: is Timeworks itself dealigned?  Or at least the time machine?  That is, is it possible for an agent to get stuck in an alternate history where Timeworks is either hostile to him or, worse yet, doesn't exist at all?  The premise behind dealignment is that the agent is rendered immune to feedback loops; but since some Aspects can represent where the character fits into the setting, change the setting and you change those Aspects.  For instance, an agent who goes back in time, bets on a long-shot that he knows will pay off, and invests the winnings in a Swiss Bank Account can come back to the present a billionaire.  His personal timeline hasn't changed; but that Swiss Bank Account isn't part of his personal timeline.  

                      On Aug 31, 2013, at 5:06 PM, Jim Montgomery <frontendchaos@...> wrote:

                       

                      For some reason I think I would go a different direction than traditional time travel stories... For Timeworks, I would consider a couple possible options:

                      - Start the characters out in present day, with some key piece of history altered. They remember the original timeline, and HQ sends them back to fix it (Why does HQ want it back? mystery.) Once they get back, they fix it, but pick up enough clues to realize another team of Timeworks agents did the damage... Why did they do it? Mystery.

                      - A client has hired Timeworks (for vast sums of cash) to make some trivial change to the timeline to set themselves up in a much better position in the present. "If only my great grandmother has never fallen down the stairs and become paralyzed..." "If only I knew where my great great great uncle hid the family jewels..." "The missing notes of Dr Katzberger contained the answers I need to complete my research..." The characters go back in time, and either A) encounter Shadow Men who -really- don't want this change to go through, or B) find out that altering this event will have terrible consequences, hopefully with personal meaning. "The maid pushed granny down the stairs because she was a monster about to do something terrible to her kids... only her paralysis kept her from hurting others." "The family jewels were hidden because if they weren't, their existence would start a war." "The notes of Dr Katzberger are related to time travel, what are the ramifications of -that-??"
                    • Alex Tallon
                      I think I had a bit of a breakthrough in how compels worked and wanted to know if other GMs read it the same way. Basically a PC could be going through their
                      Message 10 of 18 , Aug 31, 2013
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                        I think I had a bit of a breakthrough in how compels worked and wanted to know if other GMs read it the same way. Basically a PC could be going through their ordinary life and if they aren't presented with any situations that cause trouble, that present complications (i.e., Compels), then they'd have a completely ordinary, boring day. But if presented with a situation that causes their own aspect to be compelled, or an aspect on an NPC to be compelled, or an aspect on the situation to be compelled, then they have an eventful, complicated day. In other words, compels can be used as plot hooks.
                         
                        Thoughts?
                      • Alex Tallon
                        Expand on this with an old school example.   A group of adventurers are sitting at a table in a tavern. A man in a cloak walks in, looks around and then
                        Message 11 of 18 , Aug 31, 2013
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                          Expand on this with an old school example.
                           
                          A group of adventurers are sitting at a table in a tavern. A man in a cloak walks in, looks around and then approaches their table. He has the aspect on him- I need help and I'm willing to pay. This is a compel that's going to get your characters to go into the dungeon. The PCs can accept the compel and get drawn into the adventure. Or pay it off, tell him to find help somewhere else and enjoy their drinks, having an uneventful day.

                          From: Alex Tallon <arikel1974@...>
                          To: "FateRPG@yahoogroups.com" <FateRPG@yahoogroups.com>
                          Sent: Sunday, September 1, 2013 12:29 AM
                          Subject: Compels

                          I think I had a bit of a breakthrough in how compels worked and wanted to know if other GMs read it the same way. Basically a PC could be going through their ordinary life and if they aren't presented with any situations that cause trouble, that present complications (i.e., Compels), then they'd have a completely ordinary, boring day. But if presented with a situation that causes their own aspect to be compelled, or an aspect on an NPC to be compelled, or an aspect on the situation to be compelled, then they have an eventful, complicated day. In other words, compels can be used as plot hooks.
                           
                          Thoughts?


                        • David Dunham
                          Externally, Mark Diaz Truman told me ... The emphasis on both is interesting, I had figured the second part was a much longer-term thing. And this makes me
                          Message 12 of 18 , Sep 1, 2013
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                            Externally, Mark Diaz Truman told me

                            > The default scenario for Timeworks is “travel back in time to commit crimes while figuring out that your organization is probably up to no good.”


                            The emphasis on both is interesting, I had figured the second part was a much longer-term thing.

                            And this makes me waffle on removing Resources from the skill list — it has no value during time travel, but if you end up needing to act against Timeworks during the present, might be useful.

                            Lon

                            > What occurs to me is to treat it like a caper film.

                            The proximity to CrimeWorld certainly suggests that. And I like your process of having the players make scenario aspects. I guess I was planning on doing this after the first scenario (going with the idea that Timeworks archivists provide a roadmap, per p. 63).

                            Jim, I'm sure the typical scenario always does involve some pivotal problem, and I will probably use some of your suggestions.

                            Jonathan, my take on Timeworks is that the setting tries to avoid all the head-hurting parts of time travel. So the typical scenario can avoid that sort of stuff (which makes it much easier to improvise, for one thing!). That said, in a long enough campaign I think you could work in more paradox ideas. (A no-Timeworks alternate history sounds like a campaign-ender, but might be fun in a one-shot. Or I suppose, if players are trying to achieve it. Though I'm not sure the "up to no good" is quite that nefarious.)

                            David Dunham
                            Glorantha/HQ/RQ page: www.pensee.com/dunham/glorantha.html
                          • Bryce Perry
                            Absolutely. This is why Troubles are almost always compelled, it s what draws your character into the adventure.
                            Message 13 of 18 , Sep 1, 2013
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                              Absolutely. This is why Troubles are almost always compelled, it's what draws your character into the adventure.

                              On Sep 1, 2013 9:13 AM, "Alex Tallon" <arikel1974@...> wrote:
                               

                              I think I had a bit of a breakthrough in how compels worked and wanted to know if other GMs read it the same way. Basically a PC could be going through their ordinary life and if they aren't presented with any situations that cause trouble, that present complications (i.e., Compels), then they'd have a completely ordinary, boring day. But if presented with a situation that causes their own aspect to be compelled, or an aspect on an NPC to be compelled, or an aspect on the situation to be compelled, then they have an eventful, complicated day. In other words, compels can be used as plot hooks.
                               
                              Thoughts?
                            • James Malaspino
                              No timeworks doesn t necessarily mean that there isn t an entirely different company that pulls you back forward. ... From: David Dunham
                              Message 14 of 18 , Sep 1, 2013
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                                No timeworks doesn't necessarily mean that there isn't an entirely different company that pulls you back forward.

                                From: David Dunham
                                Sent: ‎9/‎1/‎2013 10:25
                                To: FateRPG@yahoogroups.com
                                Subject: [FateRPG] Re: Timeworks

                                Externally, Mark Diaz Truman told me

                                > The default scenario for Timeworks is “travel back in time to commit crimes while figuring out that your organization is probably up to no good.”


                                The emphasis on both is interesting, I had figured the second part was a much longer-term thing.

                                And this makes me waffle on removing Resources from the skill list — it has no value during time travel, but if you end up needing to act against Timeworks during the present, might be useful.

                                Lon

                                > What occurs to me is to treat it like a caper film.

                                The proximity to CrimeWorld certainly suggests that. And I like your process of having the players make scenario aspects. I guess I was planning on doing this after the first scenario (going with the idea that Timeworks archivists provide a roadmap, per p. 63).

                                Jim, I'm sure the typical scenario always does involve some pivotal problem, and I will probably use some of your suggestions.

                                Jonathan, my take on Timeworks is that the setting tries to avoid all the head-hurting parts of time travel. So the typical scenario can avoid that sort of stuff (which makes it much easier to improvise, for one thing!). That said, in a long enough campaign I think you could work in more paradox ideas. (A no-Timeworks alternate history sounds like a campaign-ender, but might be fun in a one-shot. Or I suppose, if players are trying to achieve it. Though I'm not sure the "up to no good" is quite that nefarious.)

                                David Dunham  
                                Glorantha/HQ/RQ page: www.pensee.com/dunham/glorantha.html



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                              • Chester Mealer
                                I m going to reverse that on you and say all plot hooks are compels either on a trouble, a setting issue, or on another aspect. Last time I ran a game I used a
                                Message 15 of 18 , Sep 1, 2013
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                                  I'm going to reverse that on you and say all plot hooks are compels either on a trouble, a setting issue, or on another aspect. Last time I ran a game I used a character's trouble as the hook for my B plot. 

                                  Chester Mealer


                                  On Sun, Sep 1, 2013 at 9:31 AM, Bryce Perry <sandchigger@...> wrote:
                                   

                                  Absolutely. This is why Troubles are almost always compelled, it's what draws your character into the adventure.

                                  On Sep 1, 2013 9:13 AM, "Alex Tallon" <arikel1974@...> wrote:
                                   

                                  I think I had a bit of a breakthrough in how compels worked and wanted to know if other GMs read it the same way. Basically a PC could be going through their ordinary life and if they aren't presented with any situations that cause trouble, that present complications (i.e., Compels), then they'd have a completely ordinary, boring day. But if presented with a situation that causes their own aspect to be compelled, or an aspect on an NPC to be compelled, or an aspect on the situation to be compelled, then they have an eventful, complicated day. In other words, compels can be used as plot hooks.
                                   
                                  Thoughts?


                                • David Dunham
                                  Alex ... This example seems backwards to me. Ignoring the fact that adventurers shouldn t need much to go adventuring, *they* are the ones who get compelled.
                                  Message 16 of 18 , Sep 1, 2013
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                                    Alex

                                    > A group of adventurers are sitting at a table in a tavern. A man in a cloak walks in, looks around and then approaches their table. He has the aspect on him- I need help and I'm willing to pay. This is a compel that's going to get your characters to go into the dungeon. The PCs can accept the compel and get drawn into the adventure. Or pay it off, tell him to find help somewhere else and enjoy their drinks, having an uneventful day.

                                    This example seems backwards to me. Ignoring the fact that adventurers shouldn't need much to go adventuring, *they* are the ones who get compelled. (Remember, the subject of a compel gets a Fate Point for having their life complicated.)

                                    "I know something about Black Hralf the Weasel" -> compels the character's "Black Hralf killed my father" aspect

                                    "Nice sword you've got there. Are you woman enough to use it?" compels the character's "Blood Drinker" aspect

                                    But yes, compelling an aspect can definitely spark a scenario (the upcoming Fate System Toolkit has a section on this, p. 45). Ideally in a way that gives them a complication more serious than not having a second round:

                                    Black Hralf knows you're coming

                                    The Ant Men technically don't have blood, so the sword is going to need to drink something

                                    David Dunham
                                    Glorantha/HQ/RQ page: www.pensee.com/dunham/glorantha.html
                                  • Fred Hicks
                                    ... Yeah, that sequence was my choice, and not accidental. :) Fred -- Fred Hicks Co-President, Evil Hat Productions, LLC - www.evilhat.com Freelance Layoutist
                                    Message 17 of 18 , Sep 3, 2013
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                                      On Sun, Sep 1, 2013 at 10:25 AM, David Dunham <alakoring@...> wrote:
                                      > What occurs to me is to treat it like a caper film.

                                      The proximity to CrimeWorld certainly suggests that.

                                      Yeah, that sequence was my choice, and not accidental. :)

                                      Fred


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                                      Freelance Layoutist * Game Publishing Blogger - www.deadlyfredly.com
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